December 15, 2017

"When asked if Mueller has a conflict of interest 'as the former head of the FBI and a friend of James Comey,' 54 percent responded..."

"... that the 'relationship' between the two amounts to a conflict of interest, including 70 percent of Republicans, 53 percent of independents and 40 percent of Democrats," The Hill reports.

Shouldn't this have come up back when he was appointed? Yes, but the problem now is perception, and...
“The special counsel has serious perception issues as a clear majority now see him as having a conflict of interest,” said Mark Penn, co-director of the Harvard CAPS-Harris survey.

148 comments:

rhhardin said...

A conflict of interest is the pulley on which good character is hoist into public view, Coleridge wrote in an op-ed around 1800.

Mueller's problem is the lack of good character, not the conflict of interest.

Tommy Duncan said...

The "perception problem" is that Americans now perceive the reality of the situation despite the efforts of the media.

Henry said...

Perception is important.

Politics is horseshoes and hand grenades, not heart surgery.

Oso Negro said...

The entire FBI seemingly has a conflict of interest. For my part, I am interested in a good explanation of that "insurance policy."

Fabi said...

Phase 1: Collect underpants
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Impeachment!

Charles said...

They do not have a perception issue they have a conflict issue. The Republican Party is indeed the Party of Stupid to even allow this crap. There is nothing thee to find. just like int Wisconsin's John Doe crap. The process is the punishment and at least at the Federal level the republicans fall for it every time.

Browndog said...

In his new column, Mark Stein lays it out nicely:

If they indict Trump, one half will regard it as a coup by Deep Staters in the bag for Hillary. If they exonerate Trump, the other half of the country will blame Trump for discrediting these fine upstanding career public servants.

So Mueller and his team have made things worse. Thanks a lot, corruptocrats.


As they say, read the whole thing..

Matthew Sablan said...

It did come up. We were told it was a stupid concern by our so called betters.

Rusty said...

Eric Holder is working his corrupt piehole as well.

tim in vermont said...

The "Idiot" strikes back.

Hagar said...

What we have now is essentially the FBI "investigating" itself, so, yeah, there is indeed a "conflict of interest."
And it is a marvel that they did not see this coming, but put Mueller and themselves in this position!

Hagar said...

They have no mirrors in Washington, DC?

SDaly said...

What Matthew Sablan said. Mueller's friendship with Comey and the problems it would cause was all over conservative media at the time Mueller was appointed. It was swept under the rug, though, until now, when Mueller's position is becoming untenable.

Rusty said...

Here ya go.
"
Eric Holder
✔ @EricHolder


Speaking on behalf of the vast majority of the American people, Republicans in Congress be forewarned:any attempt to remove Bob Mueller will not be tolerated.These are BS attacks on him/his staff that are blatantly political-designed to hide the real wrongdoing. Country not party"

Most corrupt DOJ ever.

SDaly said...

So "Russian" meddling was intended to divide Americans by pushing issues like Black Lives Matter on facebook. And the "deep state" initiated this witch-hunt that 1/2 of the country will view as illegitimate, no matter what the outcome. Who, exactly is working for the "Russians"?

Qwinn said...

Any result from this that does not also include Eric Holder himself in prison for life is a sham. We already have more than enough evidence to convict in the public record, and it shouldn't take much to uncover several more mountains of evidence to assuage any genuine doubters. The problem is what to do with the "doubters" who don't doubt anything but are wholly complicit.

tim in vermont said...

"Country not party" - Eric Holder

The same Eric Holder who organized the Marc Rich pardon. Since when does he speak for the "vast majority" anyway? Can't he read the polls?

Here is my suggestion to the TDSers who want to keep this story going: Say Putin has a mole in the investigation that is feeding this dirt to Trump. You never needed any evidence before.

buwaya said...

Any institution, like the FBI, thats been run so long by such compromised people is terminal. The hierarchy all came up in such a system, so its unlikely to have many in a leadership position there that are untainted.

Since there is no cadre to build on, its not possible to reform it. The whole of it must go.

tim in vermont said...

Not really sure how, if more than half of independents think that the whole thing is a sham. this is going to translate into the wave that Democrats are counting on.

They have two wins, one depended on Charlottesville, and they did slightly better than Clinton did in that state, and the other, without Lolitagate would have been a blowout against them. Now the whole Russia probe is turning to ashes in their mouths. It's because their candidate and leader was a delusional idiot, plain to all, but they followed her anyway.

I am almost beginning to think that they took BDS (Borderline Personality Disorder) out of the DSM as a favor to Hillary.

Michael K said...

The upper echelons of the FBI have corrupt since Hoover was Director, including him.

Qwinn said...

Hoover was the lone wolf in the wilderness shouting that FDRs Japanese internment camps were wrong.

And the post mortem smears of him as a transvestite were entirely fabricated.

I really don't count any of the evidence that Hoover was corrupt as credible. The sources for that were themselves utterly corrupted.

I think his main motivation was to *prevent* the corruption and communist infiltration that we see now. He failed, because those who control the Narrative were already in place by then.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

but the problem now is perception, and...

The problem is that they screwed up and didn't keep the truth from the public and now it isn't just the "perception" of conflict of interest, it is the actual fact being exposed.

They (being the insiders deep state swamp dwellers) did everything they could to hide it but like trying to hide 10 pounds of slime in a 3 pound sack, eventually the slime will leak out.

"They" were so certain that Hillary would win and that their cushy control would never be uncovered because they actively were helping Hillary (behind the scenes). Now that Trump was in, the gig was up, and they must do whatever they can to save themselves, rectify the situation or otherwise keep control. How dare the deplorable people elect someone that they don't approve of. What NERVE!

"They" should all go rooftopping like the guy in China.

Hagar said...

Quite so, but that was agency politics and personal; Hoover carefully stayed clear of party politics - just vote for FBI funding and don't mess with us, and you have nothing to fear!

These people have jumped into party politics with both feet, and that is different. Also disatrous for the agency.

tim in vermont said...

Their problem was their overconfidence that Hillary was going to win, and all of this stuff would be swept under the rug, and would have set them in good stead with the new administration. That's the problem they had. America's problem is that they are corrupt. Country before party, boys! Even Eric Holder said it! OK, he was winking to you guys when he said it, and typed that tweet with his fingers crossed, but still.

Hagar said...

They have the tiger by the ears and can't let go.

Hagar said...

Get a large serving of hot popcorn and a coke; it's going to be a long night!

tim in vermont said...

40 percent of Democrats.

Let the purges begin! I told you guys even the trolls don't believe what they are peddling.

Sebastian said...

"Shouldn't this have come up back when he was appointed?" Actually, it did. But it was only us cons raising the issue, so no matter. This is, after all, the swamp battling Trump. When Dem interests are at stake, there is no conflict.

"Yes, but the problem now is perception," The actual problem is the deep-state subversion of an election by means of a slow coup d'├ętat.

Qwinn said...

So looking at msn.com, the only story they have is "DOJ: Release of FBI texts wasn't authorized."

Cause that's the real story.

Obviously.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

...but the problem now is perception...

The perception got a little too perceptive.

Mike Sylwester said...

Why did Rosenstein select Mueller?

Who is the one person in the entire world who is most motivated and able to white-wash the FBI?

-----

Why did Mueller select the staff he did?

Who are the next-most motivated and able people in the world?

Qwinn said...

Wow! Even that story is gone already! It's 100% celebrity news on msn.com today, for some crazy unknowable reason.

Mike Sylwester said...

What Rosenstein and Mueller did not foresee was that the Justice Department's Inspector General would not go along with their white-wash.

Original Mike said...

Mueller needed an insurance policy.

Caligula said...

The problem: who shall investigate the investigators?

(An obvious extension of "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"?

Mike Sylwester said...

Robert "The FBI White-Washer" Mueller still has not indicted "Crazy Comey the Leaker" for leaking FBI documents to journalists, and Mueller never will do so.

Mueller is too busy trying to catch Trump's associates in process crimes and is too busy leaking to journalists about his every progress on that front.

John Tuffnell said...

Yes, but the problem now is perception.

The thing with perception is that it requires a person to do the perceiving. The person appointing Mueller was so sure in his judgment that Herr Mueller was pure as the freshly fallen show that he couldn't perceive that anyone would have a different perspective.

That's the thing about the swamp. The people who inhabit it don't see the muck. They think the water and their motives are transparent and clear.

Different perspective, different perception.

Qwinn said...

That same msn.com article is back again.

Here's the last sentence.

"Republicans have since pounced..."

Republicans pounce!

:...on the text messages, saying they show a bias on Mueller's team toward Trump ".

Seriously.

John Tuffnell said...

And maybe Herr Mueller is well-regarded inside DC. But it's hard to agree with those who demand we take their word for it when we can see who he surrounded himself with. HIs staff choices reflect his judgment and that is the only objective evidence of his fairness most of us see.

For some Old Testament righteousness: “Thou art weighed in the balances, and art found wanting.”

David said...

The conflict of interest is perceived because it exists.

The outrageous conduct of (some of?) his employees has put a spotlight on it.

Mac McConnell said...

"Republicans pounce!

:...on the text messages, saying they show a bias on Mueller's team toward Trump "."

And the Democrats are pouncing on Rosenstein for releasing the text messages, saying they show a bias against Mueller's team toward Trump ".

David said...

"And maybe Herr Mueller is well-regarded inside DC."

If he ever was, he's not now. Feared by some. Useful to others. But not well regarded.

steve uhr said...

He isn't investigating Comey or the prior investigation of comey. He is investigating I think whether trumps communications with Comey were improper or part of a larger effort to obstruct justice. That he is friends with Comey should not in my opinion impact the outcome of the investigation. Anyway, he will have to lay out the evidence supporting any charges he may bring in the future for very one to see.

Let's not forget that a trump appointee very critical of Comey picked Mueller.

And what is he solution? Appoint someone else to replace mueller? Who do people suggest?

Qwinn said...

I suggest Steve Bannon. It would be a roughly equal level of obvious conflict, just from the other side.

tim in vermont said...

That he is friends with Comey should not in my opinion impact the outcome of the investigation

Well, if steve uhr isn't worried about it, then I am sure that this investigation will be completely fair to Trump. And that only the stuff that sees the light of day will matter, and that we have no need to worry about anything that gets buried along the way, because, once again, steve uhr is not worried about it.

Mike Sylwester said...

steve uhr at 9:03 AM

He [Mueller] is investigating I think whether trumps communications with Comey were improper or part of a larger effort to obstruct justice.

Mueller sure is not investigating whether Russia meddled in the election.

cubanbob said...

When all is said and done, this will point back to Obama. None of the players here did this without the blessings of their masters up to Attorney General and Lynch wouldn't let things slide if her boss didn't give the nod. In their arrogance they never believed that Trump could win and his winning and affect them in ideological terms but more importantly in financial terms. Obama doesn't appear to be able to rack in the bucks on a Clintonian level thanks to Trump's winning.

Henry said...

And what is he solution? Appoint someone else to replace mueller? Who do people suggest?

Pontius Pilate the thing.

Paddy O said...

I don't think he has conflict of interests. His interests are pretty straightforward to take out Trump. If he had any interest in actual truth and objectivity, he might have some conflicting interests.

Qwinn said...

Last night we received irrefutable proof of obstruction of justice in the investigation of Hillary's email server.

Expect every single leftist post for the next few days to mention "obstruction of justice" with Trump as the culprit.

That way, when any low information voter hears those words, they'll think Trump, not Hillary.

They always project, because it always works.

Steve uhr just gave us the first example.

Roy Lofquist said...

There's never a Pied Piper around when you need him. I smell a rat.

So Robert Mueller, a graduate of Princeton, a distinguished lawyer, former head of the FBI, is so very stupid that he doesn't realize that any prosecution he brings is, prima facia, a partisan witch hunt because of his team.

How about Mueller, along with Comey and Rosenstein et. al., are honorable men who are alarmed by the politicization of the DOJ? That they have deflected attention from the Inspector General who is doing the real investigation. When the axe falls on the real miscreants, soonest, the special counsel is immune from claims of partisanship.

Henry said...

How about Mueller, along with Comey and Rosenstein et. al., are honorable men who are alarmed by the politicization of the DOJ? That they have deflected attention from the Inspector General who is doing the real investigation. When the axe falls on the real miscreants, soonest, the special counsel is immune from claims of partisanship.

So are they all, all honourable men--
Come I to speak in Caesar's funeral.
He was my friend, faithful and just to me:
But Brutus says he was ambitious;
And Brutus is an honourable man.

buwaya said...

What I suggest, which gets to the root of your actual problems, is to abolish the FBI, dismiss all its present personnel, and create an entirely new national police agency with completely new staff. The present one is compromised beyond utility and beyond public confidence.

FIDO said...

It is sad that many on the Left would rather see the FBI brought into at least questionable repute over more than half the population because they would rather damage a duly elected president. Not even take him down. Damage him.

Though, to those who want to throw out the FBI, at this point HOW can we replace it? Life if far too partisan for any organization to be trusted by more than half the nation and the FBI does a lot more than just try to destroy Trump (though that is their passion, it seems according to Mueller's Minions)

Now, there IS a way to reform it, which is to utterly destroy the careers and reputation of Mueller, Strokz, Strokz's Squeeze, Lisa Page et al.

However the Left will not allow that until they have Trumpian blood on the blade.

tim in vermont said...

The Obama State Department allowed former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and her then-Deputy Chief of Staff Huma Abedin to remove electronic and physical records under a claim they were “personal” materials and “unclassified, non-record materials,” according to new documents released by Judicial Watch today. The files Clinton was permitted to remove included her calls and schedules, which were not be “released to the general public under FOIA.”

Meanwhile Hillary is allowed to decide which of her calls and meetings she can keep secret at a time when she is raking in hundreds of millions of dollars from "donors" who have business before the State Department! Of course these same people who were in charge, McCabe, Strzok, etc, kept their partisan feelings utterly in check?

The whole thing stinks, and Trump was the man for the job of putting a wrecking ball to it.

tim in vermont said...

Of course, deeming them "personal" gets her around this law:

18 U.S. Code § 2071 - Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally
US Code

(a) Whoever willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, or destroys, or attempts to do so, or, with intent to do so takes and carries away any record, proceeding, map, book, paper, document, or other thing, filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.


Remember that she even burned some of these records in State Department burn bags.

Imagine Trump taking 145 million dollars for a personal "charity" that he had used to hire and park political operatives like for example, Steve Bannon, paying him the same 10K a month Hillary paid to former Cable TV bimbo smear artist Sidney Blumethal?

Liberals cannot see the above. It's got to be either a mental illness, or they are cynical to the bottom. I think it could be both.

tim in vermont said...

I menat to say, imagine him taking 145 million from Putin and his cronies.

Mike Sylwester said...

steve uhr at 9:03 AM

Appoint someone else to replace mueller? Who do people suggest?

Patrick Fitzgerald has successful experience in prosecuting Scooter Libby on the process crime of lying to the FBI.

That is what this current "investigation" is about.

tim in vermont said...

Why didn't Dick Nixon just say that the erased 18 1/2 minutes of tape that cost him his presidency were about grandchildren and yoga lessons?

Ray said...

The longer Mueller's investigation goes on, the more will come up and hit his credibility. Time is not on Mueller's side. Trump is good at surviving legal, political, and MSM attacks, and hitting back. The other side is not so good at defending, since against the usual GOP types, LLR especially, they have never needed too.

What is funny is the only reason the texts came up was because of an investigation, called for by the Democrats, into bias into Hillary's E-Mail investigation.

And now you have Democrats attacking Rosenstein for releasing some texts. Invasion of privacy I think, that came from FBI owned phones. The hypocrisy amazes me.

Ohr's wife, working for Fusion on the Trump Dossier shocked me.

And then the comment about insurance policy?

Are we a banana republic?

Critics accuse Trump of being erratic, but when you look at his opposition, they are much worse. Is this because of Trump they are so incompetent, arrogant, and plain stupid, or it was just never noticed before? Or is this a result of the Obama Presidential culture? Or something else? Rise of non MSM reporting / outlets such as Judicial Watch, Breitbart, Cernovitch, Project Veritas, Fox News?

roesch/voltaire said...

Everybody has a conflict of !nterest toaday, the question is does their past record show an even handed prosecution and how transparent is their process. In defense of Mueller he did reassigned the FBI agent when he found out about the text messages, and these messages were made before the investigation began. While I am critical of our justice system and the CIA, I do not want to tear them down to be replaced by what--private contractors, and I would worry that this replacement would just make us more vulnerable to terrorist.

Qwinn said...

"In defenze of Mueller he did rassign the agent"

To HR!

Where he can pick his replacements! And the people who will investigate him! And maintain or worsen the political partisanship of the bureau!

Mueller does not get a brownie for this!

And this is your best defense of the guy!

Original Mike said...

"In defense of Mueller he did reassigned the FBI agent when he found out about the text messages, ..."

And then hid the matter from Congress.

"...and these messages were made before the investigation began."

This is untrue. They were made before Mueller arrived on the scene. Not the same thing.

Original Mike said...

Blogger tim in vermont said..."Why didn't Dick Nixon just say that the erased 18 1/2 minutes of tape that cost him his presidency were about grandchildren and yoga lessons?"

Because his own party wouldn't have let him get away with it.

Mac McConnell said...

You don't appoint Mueller the best boyfriend of James Comey, Comey being a prime witness or perpetrator of possible criminal events.

glenn said...

My problem is with a senior COUNTERINTELLIGENCE guy at the FBI having an extramarital affair with a co-worker and texting stuff back and forth with her. Anybody who doesn’t see the problem here doesn’t want to.

FIDO said...

Speaking as a Devil's Advocate, (I really want Mueller to resign...not because I like Trump but because I think this FAR to political than real)

What exactly could Mueller do?

If he left the guy, that was unacceptable.

If he visibly and blatantly removed the guy and gave the reason for removing the guy, he would give everyone ammunition to scuttle his investigation from the get go.

So the only 'least of all evils' action he could take would be essentially what he did.

Unfortunately that action would be the same if he were 'true blue' and honest in his intent, work and objectivity, or 'True Blue' as a hyperpartisan hack trying to hide his ill intent.

I am of the 'Caesar's wife' state of mind: he has a few too many questions asked and this needs to be visibly reformed or no one is going to believe the outcome...even Democrats. They will just think that 'justice' was done by corrupt means.

Drago said...

R/V: "While I am critical of our justice system and the CIA, I do not want to tear them down to be replaced by what--private contractors, and I would worry that this replacement would just make us more vulnerable to terrorist."

LOL

Just how obtuse are you?

The dems used CrowdStrike, a strongly democrat affiliated security firm, to "analyze" their server breaches and never allowed any law enforcement agencies to analyze those very same servers, even though obambi had stocked the DOJ and FBI upper echelons with his flunkies.

It was CrowdStrike that asserted it was the russians and it was the 3 political heads of the politicized DOJ/FBI/CIA that agreed with the finding...which they were never able to independently verify.

Thanks for playing.

Original Mike said...

"While I am critical of our justice system and the CIA, I do not want to tear them down to be replaced by what--private contractors, and I would worry that this replacement would just make us more vulnerable to terrorist.

I hear you. It was complete BS to rest the intelligence community's assessment of Russian interference in the election on CrowdStrike (as opposed to the CIA/FBI) inspecting the DNC server.

Drago said...

glenn: "My problem is with a senior COUNTERINTELLIGENCE guy..."

Not just "senior", the number 2 Counterintelligence guy.

Man, what a jackpot China and Russia hit with obama and Hillary in charge.

Original Mike said...

""Speaking as a Devil's Advocate, (I really want Mueller to resign...not because I like Trump but because I think this FAR to political than real)

What exactly could Mueller do?

If he left the guy, that was unacceptable.

If he visibly and blatantly removed the guy and gave the reason for removing the guy, he would give everyone ammunition to scuttle his investigation from the get go."


Tough shit. He had a duty to report it.

Matthew Sablan said...

"It was complete BS to rest the intelligence community's assessment of Russian interference in the election on CrowdStrike (as opposed to the CIA/FBI) inspecting the DNC server."

-- A report, recall, that even CrowdStrike walked back in significant ways.

Ray said...

Electing Trump may have been the best thing that happened in a long time. I am surprised I am writing that.

Why? Because he is causing his opponents to over react, and show their biases. He is triggering them to do stupid stuff, and just over reach. And Trump is good enough to pour gasoline on that. He is shining a light in places that need it. So you can see how biased / politicized many institutions have become.

FBI and Justice Department are just the latest.

tim in vermont said...

question is does their past record show an even handed prosecution and how transparent is their process." -R/V

Meanwhile RV refuses to critically examine how these same actors handed the Hillary investigation.

Concern, like your concern about pedophile Senators, duly noted.

tim in vermont said...

Everybody has a conflict of interest today! Just yesterday we learned that everybody is a sexual harasser!

Original Mike said...

"Everybody has a conflict of !nterest toaday, the question is does their past record show an even handed prosecution and how transparent is their process."

The FBI has been stonewalling Congressional investigators for months.

Original Mike said...

Rosenstein was asked if the FBI funded the Steele dossier. He was asked if the dossier was used to obtain a FISA warrant. He said he couldn't answer. Tranparency my ass.

Matthew Sablan said...

"So looking at msn.com, the only story they have is "DOJ: Release of FBI texts wasn't authorized.""

-- Whoever released them probably can claim whistleblower protections. Or at least, it will be fun when they do so.

Matthew Sablan said...

"Everybody has a conflict of !nterest toaday, the question is does their past record show an even handed prosecution and how transparent is their process."

-- Given the FBI's inept handling of the Clinton associates (letting themselves be lied to and not prosecuting) and the Trump associates, the prosecution is *not* even handed. We know that they are not transparent (they redact things from Congress, stonewall, refuse to answer questions until forced on point of FOIA, while leaking damaging things about Trump and his associates, including illegally releasing FBI memos and transcripts of the Flynn tapes.)

Yeah. Sorry. This is a political witch hunt. Maybe they'll find a witch, but, history says: Probably not.

Matthew Sablan said...

"So the only 'least of all evils' action he could take would be essentially what he did."

-- Actually, full transparency was the least evil he could do.

Qwinn said...

When a leak reveals Republicans behaving badly, the headline is always "Republicans behaving badly".

When a leak reveals Democrats behaving badly, the headline is always "Republicans illegally leaking vital secrets".

buwaya said...

The FBI was behind the creation of the dossier; they funded Fusion GPS; they kbew about "unmasking" as they had transcripts of it and were most likely behind the whole thing; their men were implicated in the election; their ex-boss knew about all this, of a certainty; and when he was removed it was his ex-boss, who had also managed everyone previously mixed up in this, who appointed them to the investigation.

This all is not simply conflicts of interest, it is open corruption, attempting, it seems, a coverup of the political use of a federal agency. This is a security/police agency, a counterintelligence agency. This is extremely dangerous ground for any nation, when the spooks meddle in politics.

This is so dangerous that its imprudent to permit this agency to continue its existence. They cannot and should not be trusted again. Any subsequent US government will be looking over their shoulder, subject to blackmail or worse (a coup d'etat is not out of the question) from their own servants.

Qwinn said...

Remember when a whistleblower revealed Democrat Congressional emails showing that Leftist groups had commanded them to torpedo Miguel Estrada's nomination "because... he is Latino"?

You might remember that story as "Democrat emails hacked, Republicans in trouble!"

Original Mike said...

""So looking at msn.com, the only story they have is "DOJ: Release of FBI texts wasn't authorized.""

Well, that would explain R/V's cluelessness.

From watching the Dems/Media's response to the Strzok/Page emails it is clear what their talking points are: "They are allowed to have their opinions." Fine, but this reponse is a straw man. They never address the "insurance policy" email. Astoundingly, they often add "they're entitled to their opinions; what matters is actions". But then they refuse to address the "insurance policy" email.

Qwinn said...

Original Mike: they were texts, not emails.

Doesn't make a damn bit of difference in any relevant way, but you know they'll use that inaccuracy to deem you utterly discredited and their side completely vindicated.

Al Franken mastered this technique in his supposed fisking of Ann Coulter's "Slander".

buwaya said...

They did not simply "permit themselves to be lied to"; what we know so far re Clinton and her email amounts to collusion.
They had to be active participants, not just idiots.

I.e., they were cooperating with the special needs of a political party and candidate.

Who can trust them now? Even the party they favor has to know they have power over them. When such a dangerous machine is so compromised it is a danger to its masters also.

AlbertAnonymous said...

Didn't Sally Yates go to the White House to tell Trump bad things about Flynn ostensibly because she thought Flynn could be compromised by the Russians (or some such shit)? And lefties thought that was a good thing? Yea!, Sally the hero!

So how is it that a high ranking FBI Agent involved in all these political and counterintelligence cases who is having an extramarital affair with an FBI Lawyer is not "subject to compromise" by the Rooskies?

Shouldn't Strzock and Page have been shit-canned right away?

Original Mike said...

""This all is not simply conflicts of interest, it is open corruption, attempting, it seems, a coverup of the political use of a federal agency. This is a security/police agency, a counterintelligence agency. This is extremely dangerous ground for any nation, when the spooks meddle in politics."

Yes. I'm actually kind of surprised at R/V's take.

Qwinn said...

Buwaya: don't call it collusion. As we've been pointing out for a year, "collusion" isn't a crime.

Obstruction of justice is what it clearly was, and that's what it needs to be pursued as.

buwaya said...

Collusion is a word.
This problem with the FBI is beyond law.
Legal definitions are by the bye.
This is a matter of political and social structure, of the nature of power, way upstream of law.

Its a question if who are your masters.

Matthew Sablan said...

"Shouldn't Strzock and Page have been shit-canned right away?"

-- My understanding is that Page reported to Strzock about the investigation, which if my understanding is correct, it's textbook workplace sexual harassment between a superior/subordinate.

Bruce Hayden said...

“How about Mueller, along with Comey and Rosenstein et. al., are honorable men who are alarmed by the politicization of the DOJ? That they have deflected attention from the Inspector General who is doing the real investigation. When the axe falls on the real miscreants, soonest, the special counsel is immune from claims of partisanship.”

I am not sure how to take this. My impression of the first two is that they were token Republicans who were card carrying members of the Deep State. As noted above, FBI Directors (and their top staff) have been political since Hoover, which is most of a century now. Ros3nstein though is a harder one. Right now, he has both sides yelling big for his skin. Republicans question his appointing Mueller, not reining him in, and not appointing a special prosecutor to go after the corruption at the top of the DoJ and FBI, and after Crooked Hillary, and the Dems in the much more credible Russian collusion scandal, while the Democrats are after hi because of the IG investigation that is being run looking at the top of both the DoJ and FBI. He may be the only honest man there, holding over at the top of those organizations from the Obama years. We shall see. I don’t fault him for firing a Comey but surely he could have hired someone better than Mueller.

Original Mike said...

I wish I could link to today's Kimberley Strassel WSJ piece. It's about the non-transparency of the FBI and DOJ in this matter. There are several items, including this:

The Office of Special Counsel (a federal agency that polices personnel practices and not to be confused with Mueller's office) interviewed top FBI officals regarding Hatch Act (re: political bias) violations in the Hillary email investigation. "... the FBI had refused to let the OSC interview them unless it first signed unprecedented nondisclosure agreements, giving the FBI full authority to withhold the information from Congress."

Senator Johnson (Chair of the Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs) has given the FBI until Dec 27 to release the transcripts of those interviews.

Transparency my ass.

Qwinn said...

"Collusion is a word"

Yes. And Obstruction of Justice is a crime.

Why plea it down to a non-crime FOR them, before they've even released their BS talking points?

Mac McConnell said...

Fucking the help or a colleague at DOJ or the FBI is a fire-able offence according to the rules.

Bruce Hayden said...

I don’t think that Mueller actually has a conflict of interest, being somewhat of a friend with Comey. Comey isn’t, per se, under investigation. Should be maybe, but the investigation is into the possibility of collusion between the Trump team and the Russians, presumably to steal her coronation away from Saint Crooked Canklepants. He is compromised because he is part of the Deep State, and brought in a bunch of Dem activists as prosecutors and investigators. And didn’t call it quits when he quickly saw that there wasn’t any evidence of Trump collusion, or that he didn’t switch his focus when evidence of Clinton collusion became so obvious. And that there was no evidence against the Trump team became obvious when his people burned Flynn as a witness by wringing the lying to the FBI admission w/o any mention of any possible Trump team conspiracy or collusion. It is the rank hypocrisy of the whole thing that is driving the anger on the right right now. Crooked Hillary lived up to her name here, and appears to be skating again, while Mueller’s Clinton supporting team continues to try to damage Trump as much as they can, at a cost of millions of taxpayer dollars, despite the evidence showing that her team did precisely what his team is unjustly accused of doing.

Yancey Ward said...

As the details of the investigation of the Clinton home server slowly come out, it is quite apparent there was a provable conspiracy to obstruct justice. The editorial changes made to Comey's original planned public statement he gave on July 5th 2016 are all but conclusive in this regard- pretty much everyone with input in the matter were doing pretty much everything they had to do to justify not indicting Clinton and her aides. What is striking to me is that Comey himself seems to have been the person who was the most reluctant to follow through on this conspiracy, but in the end acceded to it. It may simply be the case he was the most reluctant because he was going to be the public face of this act of injustice.

As I wrote a couple of days ago in another thread- McCabe cancelling his appearance before the oversight committee at the last moment seemed to be the result of the publication of the Strzok text about the meeting in "Andy's office". That text clearly implies that there was some sort of plan put in place in the event of a Trump electoral victory. I think McCabe wasn't prepared to answer questions about this text, and I expect him to either cancel again next week, or bring his own attorney to the hearing.

tim in vermont said...

In its 1821 decision affirming the right of the House to hold people in contempt and jail them, the Supreme Court noted that depriving Congress of this authority would mean “the total annihilation of the power of the House of Representatives” to prevent people from just flipping it the bird. Isn’t that just what government officials from Ms. Lerner to Mr. Wray have been doing Tax Prof

Looks like the FBI, IRS, DOJ, CIA, have all figured it out.

Qwinn said...

Yancey: You're absolutely right about Comey's original letter and the changes made to it being proof of conspiracy and obstruction.

What media outlet has mentioned it, aside from Fox News?

steve uhr said...

If trump is truly concerned with the so-called Deep State, why has he left so many political appointment positions, at State, DOJ, etc vacant? Those should be the people to ensure the agencies fulfill their lawful obligations and are not taken over by a bunch of unaccountable beurocrats with their own nefarious Agenda

AReasonableMan said...

Maybe they can get a Democrat to investigate the firing of the Republican, that should solve the problem.

Inga said...

Collusion is a word"

“Yes. And Obstruction of Justice is a crime.”

Yes and Conspiracy to commit Computer Fraud and Abuse is also a crime.

“One potential charge might be conspiracy to violate the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act, says Barak Cohen, a partner and litigation lead at Perkins Coie in Washington, D.C. Mueller's team could reach for that if there is evidence that Trump associates worked with Russia on the hacking of the Democratic National Committee or the emails of Hillary Clinton's campaign chairman, John Podesta.

"I think the special counsel would like to be able to charge them as co-conspirators to the hack or accessories after the fact," Cohen said. "It's the most credible and well-established legal theory."

If Trump associates weren't directly involved in the hacks but, say, knew about them and kept them hidden, then they could be charged as accessories after that fact, Cohen said.“

https://www.npr.org/2017/12/10/568929285/as-muellers-russia-probe-forges-ahead-potential-legal-endgames-begin-to-take-sha

Khesanh 0802 said...

An interesting take on Sessions and the role of the IG

Khesanh 0802 said...

in the investigation of Comey (Hatch Act) and the other miscreants at the DOJ and FBI.

Qwinn said...

Yes, and we know Russia hacked fhe Dems because the firm paid by Dems, Crowdstrike, said so. No other agency was able to investigate the server to verify that conclusion, but "verify" it the agencies already implicated in Obstruction did anyway. And a forensic analysis by independent computer scientists of the speed of the data transfer rule out it having been anything other than an inside job.

Hilarious that you think you're helping your case by bringing attention back to all this.

n.n said...

Page reported to Strzock about the investigation, which if my understanding is correct, it's textbook workplace sexual harassment between a superior/subordinate.

The Reckoning, as with other Pro-Choice matters, is characteristically selective.

Qwinn said...

Oooh, finally, an article on msn.com that mentions Comey's original letter revision.

Second sentence of the eight paragraph:

"Edits to the Comey draft appeared to soften the gravity of the bureau's finding in its 2016 investigation of Hillary Clinton's use of a private email server while Secretary of State."

Appeared to!

Eighth paragraph!

May every one of these people die in a fucking fire.

320Busdriver said...

Just explain how Abedin and Mills faced no jeopardy after its been proven they both lied to FBI Strzok about their knowledge that HRC was using a private server. Flynn, not so much.

This shit is rotten to the core and heads need to roll.

Makes me proud to have voted for Ron Johnson.

tim in vermont said...

f trump is truly concerned with the so-called Deep State, why has he left so many political appointment positions, at State, DOJ, etc vacant?

Senate is obstructing approving them, would be one theory.

BillyTalley said...

Into the Wild
by Jon Krakauer

An underestimation of the lethality of nature.

Bruce Hayden said...

@khesahn - As I noted above, Rosenstein may be the only honest player left at the top of the DoJ from the Lynch days. We shall see. Or, the OIG investigation may be another whitewash. But the Dems are starting to squeal like stuck pigs over him and the release of those incriminating emails. His response to the House questioning seemed to repeatedly be “wait for the IG report at the beginning of the year”. Maybe he knows something that the rest of us don’t. Maybe he trusts the process more than we do. We shall see - first of the year is coming up pretty fast now.

I am a bit troubled about what crimes these DoJ and esp FBI people may have committed, but that may not be that important sending them to prison. Rather, firing them may be sufficient. Strzok Still has a job. McCade is still one of the top people in the FBI, despite his wife taking maybe $750k or so from a Clinton crony, while essentially killing the investigation into the pay-to-play Clinton Foundation investigation (among other irregularities). Can’t build back up the integrity of the FBI (or DoJ) until the Deep State corruptocrats at the top are excised as the cancer that they clearly are.

Bruce Hayden said...

“Senate is obstructing approving them, would be one theory.”

To clarify, THE DEMOCRATS IN THE SENATE, LED BY CHUCK SCHUMER [are] “obstructing approving them, would be one theory.”

320Busdriver said...

What was the "insurance policy" ??

Martin said...

I want to know more about Rod Rosenstein, who appointed Mueller almost instantly after Comey resigned, and gave him a very over-broad charge. Like in about a day--way too quick for someone who wasn't ready for it--Rosenstein to pull ten trigger and Mueller to accept the job.

And Rosenstein was in position to do that because Sessions had hastily recused himself from anything to do with the Russia issue when a couple of Democrats, including Franken (iirc), got their underwear in a twist that Sessions had failed to put on a form that he had met with Russians as part of his Senate role, after being advised that he didn't have to report that, and that those meetings were not only as a Senator, but well-known to others.

As far as I can see, this whole thing was scripted way back in January or February and only needed Trump to fall into it by firing Comey, which one way or another they could provoke him to do. This is not justice, this is a coup d'etat, little different than a banana republic where the army shows up at the Presidential Palace, National Assembly, and Supreme Court, claiming to be the guardians of the Constitution.

Original Mike said...

"Blogger 320Busdriver said..."What was the "insurance policy" ??"

I'm sure Inga will be happy to field that. {/sarc}

Original Mike said...

I'm not concerned (until I know more) about the edits to Comey's statement. I am concerned they occurred two months before they even interviewed the principals.. Sure, they knew from the get go they were going to exonerate her but you'd think, for appearances sake, they would have at least waited until they collected the evidence.

Qwinn said...

Every media outlet aside from Fox News has simultaneously, randomly and with no evidence of cooperation whatsoever, embargoed any mention of the "insurance policy".

They're all incredibly focused on how those "personal" texts made on official government phones could possibly be released to the public.

Unexpectedly.

Bruce Hayden said...

The two top possibilities aof what the “insurance policy” was are using the Steele Dossier to open the FISA investigation of Trump and his campaign, and the whitewashing of Crooked Hillary’s email (and maybe foundation) investigation(s) (remember the meeting was apparently in McCade’s office, and he was effectively running the Clinton Foundation investigation, while Strzok was one of the top investigators in her email investigation - and was involved in the FISA investigation of the Trump campaign).

Original Mike said...

"The two top possibilities aof what the “insurance policy” was are using the Steele Dossier to open the FISA investigation of Trump and his campaign,..."

There's little doubt in my mind this is it. Everything fits.

We need to have Strzok testifying, pronto.

Qwinn said...

AG Sessions sez:

"I don't share the view that the FBI is not functioning at a high level all over the country."

That's not "playing possum". That's proving that the only thing that'll wake him up from his nap is to exonerate the Left.

I can't believe I was happy about his appointment. The blackmail they must have on him must be epic. Or the death threats against his family. Nothing else makes sense.

Original Mike said...

"I can't believe I was happy about his appointment. The blackmail they must have on him must be epic. Or the death threats against his family. Nothing else makes sense."

I think he's just a tool. I hated this appoitment.

320Busdriver said...

Make sure to read WI AG Schimels report on the illegal leak of John Doe collected info to the Guardian if you have not already.

This is just weoponized law enforcement for political means on a national level. It's that simple!

Original Mike said...

From @Khesanh' link:

"Sundance from Conservative Treehouse, made the case that the Department of Justice Office of Inspector General is where the real action is taking place. Here was an explanation why Rosenstein gave evasive answers in recent congressional testimony and a suggestion that the OIG is laying out a case,"

I'll say this about his thesis; it's the right way to go about it. I hope that's what's happening.

Original Mike said...

"I am a bit troubled about what crimes these DoJ and esp FBI people may have committed, but that may not be that important sending them to prison. Rather, firing them may be sufficient."

And throw in an apology from Inga.

Original Mike said...

Seriously, if the "insurance policy" was using a ginned up FISA warrant to spy on a Presidential candidate, prison time is mandatory, IMO.

Bruce Hayden said...

“Seriously, if the "insurance policy" was using a ginned up FISA warrant to spy on a Presidential candidate, prison time is mandatory, IMO.”

Not sure how that would work though - the Obama/Lynch DoJ had greatly loosened up the ability to misuse FISA collected information. You have one group making the regs more accommodating, and a second group arguably and colorably staying within those rules to surveil the Trump campaign and transition, despite the latter being outside a strict reading of FISA. It might be easier if you could find a smoking gun tying the two together, but you won’t be able to, and both Obama and Lynch are safe from prosecution.

Qwinn said...

I'd say the Clinton-Lynch tarmac meeting qualifies. And any investigation of the FISA surveillance that doesn't include Obama and Lynch is a miscarriage of justice.

Original Mike said...

"Not sure how that would work though - "

Yeah, I don't know; I haven't thought about the law. I was just thinking of the need for future deterrence.

320Busdriver said...

I will be placing a call to Ron Johnsons office to let him know how pissed I am and how I fully support his efforts to get to the bottom of ALL of this and hope everyone else lets their reps know the same whether via email or call.

On second thought I will probably email so I get his response on paper.

Original Mike said...

And I'm sure Obama and Lynch are safe. I actually doubt Obama did anything.

Bruce Hayden said...

@Quinn - Obama is home free. First, he is essentially legally immune from prosecution for laws violated while President (Bill Clinton’s offence was judicial (contempt of court), essentially actionable under Article III, as contrasted to Article II, which covers criminal prosecutions). The legal remedy is impeachment and removal, not indictment and trial. Plus, it would be horrible precedent, with Presidents criminally investigating their predecessors. Lynch though is a different story - but so far, there is no evidence that she did anything besides violate DoJ regulations.

320Busdriver said...

Blogger Original Mike said...

I actually doubt Obama did anything.


Well, surely he would have found out about it on the news!

Qwinn said...

Obama helped whitewash the IRS scandal, Fast and Furious, the New Black Panthers votiet intimidation in Philly, Benghazi, the list goes on and on... why would you doubt he'd participate in this?

Qwinn said...

Actually, better analogy: Joe the Plumber.

buwaya said...

Prosecuting any given individual is pointless.
In this corrupted system one will do as well as another.
Who cares if you remove one, if the next is also compromised.
This is a trivial concern.
Its also a waste of effort, and may indeed be an effective defense through diversion, by the system, in absorbing their enemies energies in trench warfare for very minor objectives.
The big picture is about the system, not winning some minor legal games.

You must destroy this system. This is not a legal problem, this is a strategic-political problem.

Original Mike said...

"why would you doubt [Obama'd] participate in this?"

I'm agnostic on whether he did, but I know of no evidence.

buwaya said...

To illustrate the triviality of law;

What you have here is the equivalent of a Soviet armored division waiting for their chance to fall on you.

You are therefore arranging for environmental inspectors to investigate and if necessary cite them with EPA violations because they have been sloppy with their engine oil.

Original Mike said...

"You must destroy this system."

The country needs an FBI. I don't get what you're suggesting.

buwaya said...

I suggest that this is an emergency situation that requires extraordinary measures, and whatever other functions the FBI is doing (and can you trust them on anything?) are much less important.

This is something only your President can do, but, presumptuously, if I were in his shoes I would:

Order an immediate stand-down and cessation of all activities, a furlough of all employees, a military occupation of all their facilities, and whatever measures seem prudent for the preservation of data.

Mac McConnell said...

Mike
I think there are about three investigations going on besides Mueller's. DOJ is still looking at leaks, the handling of Hillary's fuck ups and the FBI brass.

Qwinn said...

"Plus, it would be horrible precedent, with Presidents criminally investigating their predecessors."

You know what I think is an even more horrible precedent?

A President who wiped his ass with the law for 8 years that gets away with it utterly and completely.

And no, no previous President came anywhere *near* the destruction of law and order that Obama did. Not even Clinton had the brass balls Obama did, because Clinton didn't get to play the "if you criticize me you're a racist" card.

tim in vermont said...

Plus, it would be horrible precedent, with Presidents criminally investigating their predecessors

Yeah, but criminalizing the transition, and, for example, getting a plea deal with Flynn where he as agreed to testify that DURING THE TRANSITION he made contact with other countries. Apparently, he has agreed to testify that Trump violated the Logan Act as President Elect!

Talk about a "horrible precedent." Sounds more like unilateral disarmament.

Matthew Sablan said...

Obama spied on journalists and Congress. I would be shocked if he wasn't involved.

Original Mike said...

Page: "So look, you say we text on that phone when we talk about Hillary because it can’t be traced,"

Days before the questioning of Huma and Mills.

Original Mike said...

"-- A report, recall, that even CrowdStrike walked back in significant ways."

Matthew, do you have a link so I can brush up on that?

Bad Lieutenant said...


Original Mike said...
"You must destroy this system."

The country needs an FBI. I don't get what you're suggesting.

12/15/17, 4:08 PM
buwaya said...
I suggest that this is an emergency situation that requires extraordinary measures, and whatever other functions the FBI is doing (and can you trust them on anything?) are much less important.

This is something only your President can do, but, presumptuously, if I were in his shoes I would:

Order an immediate stand-down and cessation of all activities, a furlough of all employees, a military occupation of all their facilities, and whatever measures seem prudent for the preservation of data.

The FBI is 35000 people from typists to terrorist-fighters. Do this:



1. Take 35,000 Army soldiers between E-5 and O-3, plus the top half of Army CID, who have first trained their replacements. Give them a shake-and-bake course in doing whatever FBI agents are actually supposed to be doing. Do this in total secrecy.

2. Reassign, or direct to various travel assignments, all FBI employees. In transit, with total secrecy, redirect all their flights to Sherman Army Airfield at Ft. Leavenworth, KS. Deboard the FBI agents, and move them to convenient holding facilities in the area.

3. When this is done, move the CID and the shake-and-bakes into FBI HQ and field offices. Have them seize and search everything, process it, and determine a) how to proceed with existing casework, b) how to proceed against the former FBI.

4. Meanwhile, due to a clerical error, all 35,000 Fibbers have mistakenly been executed, along with their families and friends, and their assets expropriated.

5. PROFIT!!!?!!!!!!!

Birkel said...

I believe what buwaya suggests is that the rot is too pervasive to allow a surgical removal. Rather, many bureaucracies are self-aware and acting in their own interests; they are gangrenous and the part must be excised to save the whole.

Obama encouraged the rot. Obama wanted greater centralized control and less freedom. He was incredibly successful by his own victory conditions. Accepting the status quo is accepting your own imprisonment.

We must reassert and expand individual freedom. Anybody who thinks the current situation does that is willfully blind or, like Obama, a fan of government control and diminished freedom.

Bad Lieutenant said...

I dunno, Birkel, I think buwaya would like my idea. I particularly insist on no high brass. Probably at this point military brass needs purging too.

Thanks Rapone!

No seriously, you show us how deep the rot has gone.