November 22, 2017

Phrases from the past: "Crotchgate" and "pro-sex feminism."

After writing that post about Gayle King adjusting her position relative to Charlie Rose, I created a 2 new tags: "Era of That's Not Funny" and "Trump's Access Hollywood remarks." Both tags can be applied retrospectively to the archive, but the second one is going to take a long time, and I'll get to that eventually. The first one is a more recent concept, and I'm only applying it retrospectively to posts where I've used that exact phrase, and that task is done. But in searching for the phrase, which I failed to put in quote marks, I turned up a few random things, including, from December 2006, "Camille Paglia on... it's not my word.... 'crotchgate.'"

What was "crotchgate"?! I see that there's something right now that's got a #crotchgate and Donald Trump has even weighed in:


Oh, I see. A college football player grabbed his own crotch (in a taunting gesture):

But what was "Crotchgate" in 2006? It was something I only blogged about because Camille Paglia took it on: Some female targets of paparazzi — Britney Spears, Paris Hilton, Lindsay Lohan — were flashing their pantsless crotches. Paglia said:
"These girls are lowering themselves to the level of backstreet floozies. It angers me because I fought a bitter fight to get feminism back on track and be pro-sex at the same time. This is degrading the entire pro-sex wing of feminism.... [T]hey are cheapening their own image and obliterating all sexual mystery and glamour, which are the heart of the star system... These are women who are clearly out of control because the old studio era is over. The studio system... guided and shaped the careers of the young women who it signed up. It maximized their sexual allure by dealing it out in small doses and making sure you don’t have -- what has become here -- a situation of anarchy."
So the women are bringing the anarchy of too much uncontrolled sex?! That's not how it looks today, after the Weinstein revelations. But, of course, Weinstein and the men like him were active back in 2006, exercising control, trying to wrest "small doses" of "sexual allure" out the actresses for their own gratification. But, as Paglia put it then, the "girls" were "lowering themselves." And Paglia expressed anger, because it interfered with her "wing" of feminism: "pro-sex feminism."

Is anyone talking about "pro-sex feminism" — or "sex-positive feminism" — these days? Searching for both terms in the news of the last month, I find only a reference to Taylor Swift song lyrics and a description of a 1986 movie character (who's being brought back for a new TV show).

No one seems to be jumping at the opportunity to reconcile "pro-sex feminism"/"sex-positive feminism" with the new, staunch, zero-tolerance approach to sexual abuse. I'm sure many of those who write about feminism today are too young to remember the feminism of the 1980s, so they're unlikely to see that the things that are happening now resemble what sex-positive feminism fought against. And won. For a while.

But nobody wants to talk about sex-positive feminism now, and no female pop stars are seeking attention by giving paparazzi an unobstructed view of naked crotch.

ADDED: By today's standards, the flashing of naked crotch is considered sexual abuse. If a man were to do it, he'd be professionally and socially dead. 

AND: I've done the retrospective adding of the tag "Trump's 'Access Hollywood' remarks." 49 posts so far, including this one. I might do a project of analyzing my personal reactions over time. I'm told I really changed over time, and obviously the context has changed.

83 comments:

rhhardin said...

Women want contradictory things. What else is new.

A real woman would manage both at once instead of doing a pendulum thing.

rhhardin said...

Take it as resentment of men's sexual interest vs a celebration of their own.

Quaestor said...

rhhardin sums it up succinctly, as usual.

Althouse wrote: If a man were to do it, he'd be professionally and socially dead.

Maybe the Muslims have a point...

Laslo Spatula said...

Sometimes when a woman tells you "I'm not wearing panties" she is just saying "I'm not wearing panties."

I am Laslo.

Curious George said...

Baker Mayfield is a tool. Not to the level of Johnny Manziel but still a tool. He took the Oklahoma University flag and ran around the Shoe when OU beat Ohio STate earlier this year, before "planting" it on the Block O at midfield. What a dbag.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBL9iKC5H8c

Lucien said...

President Trump's support of Mayfield plays on multiple levels: It support's a player likely to be popular with the president's base, it criticizes "the media", and the sentiment displayed by Mr. Mayfield resonates with President Trump's approach to his critics.

lgv said...

"By today's standards, the flashing of naked crotch is considered sexual abuse. If a man were to do it, he'd be professionally and socially dead. "

Apparently, the day of wearing nothing under your kilt is no longer tolerable.

rhhardin said...

Your wish is my commando.

robother said...

You can grab yourself by the crotch. When you're a football hero, they let you do it.

rhhardin said...

MAX: How did I get into these clothes?
99: That's not important. Let's go.
MAX:Am I wearing boxers? For future reference, I usually prefer briefs... ...for their security and peace of mind. Going free-bird is not exactly ideal. I don't like it.

Get Smart (2008)

Fabi said...

"Your wish is my commando."

Orange juice expelled through the nostrils funny.

Laslo Spatula said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Laslo Spatula said...

An earlier era's Crotchgate. RIP.

NSFW probably.

I am Laslo.

Bob Boyd said...

"If a man were to do it, he'd be professionally and socially dead."

Especially if he was dealing a small dose.

JMS said...

The Trump tweet is fake.

rhhardin said...

[T]hey are cheapening their own image and obliterating all sexual mystery and glamour, which are the heart of the star system.

The feminine operation is concealing that nothing is concealed.

rhhardin said...

Star pussy has the problem that it's not better than any old internet woman pussy.

Models are selected for pussy, actresses for acting-star ability.

Laslo Spatula said...

"...I find only a reference to Taylor Swift song lyric..."

Taylor Swift just had the video out in the skin-tight clothes that appear to make her nude. Althouse link here:

"Since you're not going to get the monumental female nude that is "R-Evolution," here's the new Taylor Swift video:"

Are we not supposed to look at this video now?

Or are we just not supposed to masturbate to it?

I am Laslo.

Darrell said...

If beaver shots are wrong, there is nothing fucking right in the world anymore.

Chuck said...

With or without the subject tags, is it possible to count the number of Althouse posts on Trump's alleged sexual harassments and assaults, versus those of Weinstein, or Franken, or Clinton?

Laslo Spatula said...

In that Althouse link above there is the news about the proposed nude woman statue for DC.

That would've been a BIG crotchgate.

I am Laslo.

Darrell said...

Sure, Chuck. Count your fingers, then make a fist--and shove it up your ass. If you have a problem with the subject selection on the Althouse blog, stop coming here. Asshole.

Big Mike said...

... so they're unlikely to see that the things that are happening now resemble what sex-positive feminism fought against. And won. For a while.

No permanent victories.

Francisco D said...

Give it up Chuck.

You are becoming more tiresome than Inga and Ritmo.



Big Mike said...

Laslo! Welcome back! How did the tests go?

Laslo Spatula said...

Big Mike -- I put a comment at the end of that previous post (with 370+ comments).

Okay for now. More tests to come.

Thanks for the good wishes...

I am Laslo.

Big Mike said...

@Darrell, Chuck is paid by an outfit funded by George Soros or Tom Steyer or some other wealthy left-wing loon to comment here. But he hates it.

Sebastian said...

Women wanting to have it both ways: that's so old and passé.

Now they want it to have it three ways (hope y'all aren't triggered): be pussy-hat-wearing "pro-sex" abortion-loving autonomy-claiming feminists or crotchless seductresses trading on their sex appeal to snare men and put down other women or prim and proper neo-Victorians exploiting their weakness to rein in men.

AllenS said...

Someone hit a deer about half mile from my house. WHY AREN'T YOU BLOGGING ABOUT THAT ALTHOUSE? WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU!?

tcrosse said...

I got your crotch-grabbing right here.

EDH said...

What jumps out at me is the difference between Paglia then and the football commentators now.

Paglia speaks directly as a first person critic of what is wrong with the behavior she criticizes, the argument rests on her own veracity and persuasion.

Today, it's the gauzy language of "not representing OUR values," and "it's not what WE want," lest somebody in the stone throwing mob say something specific enough that might get themselves in trouble.

Who's "we" kemosabe?

To me it's mob appeal policed by fear that any criticism is an attack on shared values rather than the arrogance of the speaker claiming to speak for everyone else.

robother said...

Chuck is trying to transition from crotch-gate to crotchety- gate.

If only there were an internet regulation that required Althouse to mathematically balance her blog postings. That's the kind of regulation that even a life-long Republican could support.

Laslo Spatula said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said...

The silver lining in all this might be the return of a little dignity to the public square. Compare a 1947 movie to a 2017 movie. Which era values self-respect? Yeah, it's just a movie, but if the cover's trashed then the pages are probably in pretty crappy condition.

Darrell said...

Chuck sends emails to Althouse, too.
Her life is charmed.

Bay Area Guy said...

I'm intrigued by Camille Paglia's reference to "pro-sex feminism". It sounds like a group I could support, particularly if the gals were good looking and dropped the feminism part.

Baby steps and compromise.

AReasonableMan said...

Chuck's point is that Althouse's partisan bias, evident in her very selective posting, undermines her credibility on this issue. Seems to be a reasonable point. Other conservative commenters, like Peggy Noonan, are more even-handed with respect to Trump, and Noonan was one of the few mainstream conservative commentators who was prepared to give Trump a chance during the primary.

Darrell said...

Other conservative commenters, like Peggy Noonan

Stop! You're killing me.....

tcrosse said...

How wise is it to bust the chops of the woman whose finger is on the Delete button ?

Bob Boyd said...

Chuck gets what he wants which is not to bash Trump, but to make himself the topic of the thread.

Freder Frederson said...

America needs more men who act like an eighth grade asshole and display a shocking lack of sportsmanship? Who knew.

I noticed that Ann doesn't have some brilliant theory why Trump would want to get embroiled in a debate about whether or not a football player is a jerk.

Come on Ann. Present your essay on why this was a brilliant move by the President.

Darrell said...

Here's Trump's Twitter feed.
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump?lang=en
Find that Tweet.

Darrell said...

The comments in Althouse's link make clear that Trump didn't Tweet the cited text. Fake news again.

Clyde said...

LaVar Ball, Baker Mayfield, Kim Jong Un... Feh.

I have this NSFW response to them (from Team America: World Police) WARNING! NSFW!

Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...

Employing passive aggressive techniques to control Althouse and her blog content.

Filed under: Dumb ideas unlikely to work.

Big Mike said...

Crotchgate — the NFL will baulk at a guy who expresses contempt for his opponents but it’s okay to express contempt for the US of A by taking a knee during the anthem. Good to know where we viewers stand in their eyes.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

Ann Althouse said...But nobody wants to talk about sex-positive feminism now, and no female pop stars are seeking attention by giving paparazzi an unobstructed view of naked crotch.

*Citation needed. (About the pop stars; I'll take your word about no one wanting to discuss sex-positive feminism. Seems to me that it's more a case of people selectively relying on an appeal to sex-positive feminism when convenient and then ditching those ideas when inconvenient, but maybe that's just me.)

Mary Beth said...

"Some female targets of paparazzi — Britney Spears, Paris Hilton, Lindsay Lohan — were flashing their pantsless crotches."

At the time I just thought the women were vain for not wanting panty lines when they wore tight dresses. And that they had never been taught how to exit a car properly when wearing a dress - swivel your hips and put both feet out together at the same time, keeping your knees and feet together the whole time. The paparazzi had to be crouching very low, maybe lying on the ground, to get shots at that angle. I thought it was another example of (mostly) men taking advantage of foolish young women.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

National Lampoon's Loaded Weapon: Gratuitous Beaver Shot

HoodlumDoodlum said...

[Excerpt, Andy's speech on "Big Brother" from Extras Christmas Special]

I’m just sick of these celebrities just living their life out in the open, why would you do that? It’s like these pop stars who choose the perfect moment to go into rehab; they call their publicist before they call a taxi. Then they come out and they do their second autobiography, this one’s called Love Me Or I’ll Kill Myself, oh kill yourself then. And the papers lap it up they follow us round and that makes people think we’re important and that makes us think we’re important. If they stopped following us around, taking pictures of us people wouldn’t take to the streets going, “Ooo quick, I need a picture of Cameron Diaz with a pimple,” they wouldn’t care, they’d get on with something else. They’d get on with their lives. You open the paper and you see a picture of Lindsay Lohan getting out of a car and the headline is, “Cover up Lindsay we can see your knickers.” Of course you can see her knickers, your photographer is lying in the road pointing his camera up her dress to see her knickers. You’re literally the gutter press. And fuck you, the makers of this show as well. You can’t wash your hands of this. You can’t keep going, “Oh, it’s exploitation but it’s what the public want.” No. The Victorian freak show never went away, now it’s called Big Brother or X Factor where, in the preliminary rounds, we wheel out the bewildered to be sniggered at by multi-millionaires. And fuck you for watching this at home. Shame on you.

[my bold]

bgates said...

America needs more men who act like an eighth grade asshole and display a shocking lack of sportsmanship?

No, eight years was more than enough.

“The president was talking trash,” the Golden State Warriors star said Tuesday during an appearance on “Jimmy Kimmel Live.” “He tries to get in your head and take your mind off your swing.”

Curry said Obama would not allow him to take “gimmes” on short putts, which is customary for a competitive match. But Curry said the president constantly put pressure on him not to miss.

“He’d be crickets, just silent, looking at you like, ‘All right, you’re going to mark your putt? All right, you’re going to make that?’ Put the pressure on you, that type of deal,” he told Kimmel. “Talk about you’re shaking and all that kind of stuff.”

hombre said...

Frederick wrote: "Come on Ann. Present your essay on why this was a brilliant move by the President."

No essay necessary. It has been explained by many, best by Salena Zito. Trump does these things to yank the chains of effete secprogs, particularly the mediaswine. Only idiots take him literally.

BillyTalley said...

1. The instrumentalization of Free Love / Sexual Revolution of the 60's is in conflict with the current awareness of sexual transgression. The Left has Alinski'-ed itself.
2. Bohemians existentially requires a bourgeois context. Paglia may or may not be aware of this.
2a. Tim Black deposed Carly Hammond about Jordan Chariton's sexual trangression, which (inadvertently?) highlighted point #1 above. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCMvqR9Y5Ig

Mac McConnell said...

Unknown said...
"The silver lining in all this might be the return of a little dignity to the public square. Compare a 1947 movie to a 2017 movie. Which era values self-respect? Yeah, it's just a movie, but if the cover's trashed then the pages are probably in pretty crappy condition."

Yes in a lot of those old movies when a woman slapped a man he slapped back. Not to mention I'm hard pressed to remember where the man asked if he could kiss the women, She either kissed back or rejected him, she didn't call the media.

HoodlumDoodlum said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
AReasonableMan said...

bgates said...
No, eight years was more than enough.


Are you seriously suggesting that a professional sportsman, winner of two NBA titles, was doing something other than joking about Obama's own jokes when they played a social game of golf? Seriously?

Mac McConnell said...

"At the time I just thought the women were vain for not wanting panty lines when they wore tight dresses"

That's what thongs are for.

Gahrie said...

But nobody wants to talk about sex-positive feminism now

That's because it has been replaced with academic feminism that insists that heterosexuality is a tool of oppression by the patriarchy and all penis in vagina sex is rape.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

AReaonsableMan said...Are you seriously suggesting that a professional sportsman, winner of two NBA titles, was doing something other than joking about Obama's own jokes when they played a social game of golf? Seriously?

Just locker room-type sports jokes--ridiculous to take those seriously and try to make a big deal out of it.

Bob Boyd said...

"The Left has Alinski'-ed itself."

So true. They're trying to stick it to the man, but they are the man. It's a circular firing squad.

AReasonableMan said...

HoodlumDoodlum said...
Just locker room-type sports jokes--ridiculous to take those seriously and try to make a big deal out of it.


It is, but notably they are jokes about sports not sexual assault.

AReasonableMan said...

Bob Boyd said...
"The Left has Alinski'-ed itself."

So true. They're trying to stick it to the man, but they are the man. It's a circular firing squad.


Not sure why you think the 'left' is unhappy to see people like Weinstein or Rose made to face some consequences for their actions. The 'left' seems quite happy about this in general.

bgates said...

Not allowing gimme putts is a dick move. I'm sure Steph Curry enjoyed the whole experience, and I'm sure by telling the story on Kimmel he encouraged the spread of that kind of 8th grade asshole, bad sportsmanship behavior. It's simply incontestable that Barack Obama was a dick, especially when it came to sports.

Here's a little summary - by a supporter - of Barack Obama's 9 most disrespectful basketball moments, RANKED, subtitled "Barack Obama was a petty player-in-chief and he is my hero."

AReasonableMan said...

Have you ever played basketball? That link doesn't say what you think it says.

Bob Boyd said...

"The 'left' seems quite happy about this in general."

Really? I'm not so sure. I think the left is shocked at the toll this has taken already amongst their own and they're wondering where it's going from here and when it will stop.

n.n said...

Twilight faith (a.k.a. legislating from the penumbra).

Pro-Choice religious/moral/legal ("=") philosophy that is selective, unprincipled, and opportunistic.

Feminists' Slut Walk role models for young girls and women.

Denying women's agency by placing conception before choice.

And diverse euphemisms to smooth the pathological path to progressive dysfunction.

AReasonableMan said...

Bob Boyd said...
I think the left is shocked at the toll this has taken already amongst their own and they're wondering where it's going from here and when it will stop.


The 'left' is a diverse group. Young women, in particular, and women, in general, are not losing a lot of sleep over the fall of the Weinsteins and Roses of the world.

Bob Boyd said...

"The 'left' is a diverse group."

Yes. And it's a broad term.

I was thinking of the Democratic Party and its media wing. They've been breeding this virus as a weapon for a long time, but it has escaped into the wild. The election exposed Trump. He survived and seems to have developed antibodies, but many of their own people never thought they'd be exposed and they have no such immunity.

Mac McConnell said...

"The 'left' is a diverse group. Young women, in particular, and women, in general, are not losing a lot of sleep over the fall of the Weinsteins and Roses of the world."

Meanwhile a columnist from Teen Vogue, a mag owned by corporation that also owns the three newspapers in Alabama that condemns Moore, say she doesn't care if innocent men are destroyed professionally and personally over false allegations because it's for the cause.

Martin said...

Those ESPN reporters are real creeps. Whole teams can spit on the flag and the anthem and be complimented on their fine taste, but an angry football player who grabs his cup as a gesture to the other side is treated like a rapist?

According to these ESPN clowns, the NFL that a few years ago could hardly be roused to do anything about a player who cold-cocked his fiancee unconscious in an elevator, on camera, is now soooo sensitive they can't deal with an angry young man expressing himself non-violently?

I weep.

Earnest Prole said...

I'm told I really changed over time, and obviously the context has changed.

When you say context, I assume you mean people's opinions. The question is whether you have applied a single standard consistently to Bill Clinton and Donald Trump -- and if not, why?

bgates said...

That link doesn't say what you think it says.

Mkay.

“And he kind of looks at me, like, ‘Really?’ And fires one, and makes it, live on television, sort of feeding the legend of Obama.”

Obama continued to bring this up for FIVE YEARS. Later that year, Obama clowned Pfeiffer on a day when Pfeiffer didn’t miss a shot in warmups.


...

Obama was attending the United Nations General Assembly and stopped to bully a man who works for him....Obama blocked his shot so bad, he got his assistant to sign the picture and say he got his shit sent. Then Obama hung the picture up so the whole world could see.

This isn’t even the only time Obama did this.


...

Quote from a member of the 2009 women's championship team:
I don’t remember who initiated it, but he’s known to hold his own in the trash-talking category, so I feel like he probably challenged us to a game of P-I-G. I don’t like to make excuses, but he has a home court advantage, and he wasn’t in heels.

We'll have to agree to disagree on whether it's a sterling example of sportsmanship to beat one's employees and then rub their noses in it, or challenge young women in formal wear.

AReasonableMan said...

Bob Boyd said...
They've been breeding this virus as a weapon for a long time


I don't see it as a virus but a long overdue reckoning for a lot of sleazy men. Young women shouldn't have to put up with too much shit to get or keep a job.

AReasonableMan said...

Again, if you had played the game, you would know that verbal sparring is a big part of the game. A bit like Reddit plus sweat. You are misinterpreting what is written here. You may not like this aspect of the game but Obama's behavior is fairly standard. I don't sense anger in any of these quotes. People think it is funny and appreciate having had a chance to interact with Obama in a very different way than they might have done with Richard Nixon, for example.

Gahrie said...

Just locker room-type sports jokes--ridiculous to take those seriously and try to make a big deal out of it.

The same could be said of the Mayfield package check.

(Am I the only one who called it that growing up? I got it from a pretty good movie called The Boys in Company C)

Jim at said...

It's simply incontestable that Barack Obama was a dick, especially when it came to sports.

Yep. Simply go back to his high school coach at Punahou.

Obama rode the pine, yet constantly bitched about not getting enough playing time. Constantly.

I've said it time and again. If somebody - anybody - would've kicked Obama's butt at some point during his grade-school years, he wouldn't have turned out to be such as asshole as an adult.

AReasonableMan said...

You guys need to let it go. People like Obama, a majority of people like Obama. He was a likable guy. Not everyone liked Obama, almost no one here, but that doesn't change the fact that a majority of people liked Obama.

Bad Lieutenant said...


AReasonableMan said...
You guys need to let it go. People like Obama, a majority of people like Obama. He was a likable guy. Not everyone liked Obama, almost no one here, but that doesn't change the fact that a majority of people liked Obama.
11/22/17, 5:38 PM


Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Where is yours? President Obama got fewer than 70 million votes. There are something like 250 million people of voting age in the country.

AReasonableMan said...

Unclear on how sampling works?

Birkel said...

After non-stop positive press, halos in as many photographs as could be conjured, and charges of racism for every person who disagreed on principles policy matters, Obama only managed to oversee the evisceration of the Democrat Party.

People like Obama.
People rejected his policies.
People hated his policies so much Donald Trump is president running against Obama policies.

Birkel said...

I hope ARM is as well liked socially as Obama's policies were publicly.

Mark said...

Baker Mayfield is a tool

Perhaps, but the announcers are a couple of insufferable scolds. Furthermore, if the TV network didn't show it, no one would have ever known about the crotch grab. In that respect, the network and the announcers are even more irresponsible and crass that Mayfield. If something is really objectionable, you do not perpetuate it by bringing it to everyone's attention.

Bad Lieutenant said...


AReasonableMan said...
Unclear on how sampling works?
11/22/17, 9:29 PM

It worked for 44, who was happy to tell us just that.