October 3, 2017

We don't include Muslims?

I'm disturbed by this gaffe on the front page of The New York Times:



Here's the column by Thomas L. Friedman, "If Only Stephen Paddock Were a Muslim." I know he's trying to insult the "right" people, but the damage is not limited to those he's targeting. In attempting sarcasm, he's coming across as cloddishly crude (and at such a sensitive time).

But the front-page teaser is even worse, since millions of Muslims have the United States as their country of origin.

202 comments:

1 – 200 of 202   Newer›   Newest»
Michael K said...

I guess San Bernardino didn't count.

He is such a fool and he used to write good books.

He is an example of the man who married money and stopped thinking.

John P Marquand used to write novels about men like that.

Krumhorn said...

I don't read him. It's bad enough that we have to endure the results of the leftie agenda, I don't need to get into the head of one of the nastiest of the leftie nasty shits. A guy could get lost in the fulminating clouds of LeftieHate in there.

No thanks, Ann. That's why we have you so that we don't have to.

- Krumhorn

rehajm said...

Hes a loonie

tim in vermont said...

Then, after its initial claim was dismissed everywhere, the Islamic State doubled down, issuing an official communiqué identifying Paddock as “Abu Abd Abdulbar al-Ameriki.” Even after their claim was dismissed everywhere, they didn’t back away from it. They don’t seem to be afraid that Stephen Paddock will turn out to be a white supremacist neo-Nazi or some such. They don’t seem to be worried about being exposed as grandiose liars.

And historically, they haven’t been liars, at least when they claimed responsibility for jihad attacks. Islamic State expert Graeme Wood notes in The Atlantic that “the idea that the Islamic State simply scans the news in search of mass killings, then sends out press releases in hope of stealing glory, is false,” and that those who claim that ISIS is in the habit of taking credit for attacks it had nothing to do with “do not have a preponderance of prior examples on their side.”
- Frontpage Magazine

madAsHell said...

I think he should get a motel room with Paul Krugman.

Earnest Prole said...

I hadn’t read a Thomas Friedman piece in years, so I figured what the hell, why not. Friedman comes to the blinding epiphany that if you want change in American politics, you have to . . . wait for it . . . “Get power.” And how is that done, might one ask? Like all fellow Underpants Gnomes, Friedman is short on details. “This is about raw power, not persuasion. And the first chance we have to change the balance of power is the 2018 midterm elections. Forget about trying to get anything done before then. Don’t waste your breath. Just get power. Start now.”

Dopey.

PB said...

I'm glad someone else reads the New York Times so I don't have to.

exiledonmainstreet said...

His political insight is on a par with Cassie Brunette's, the difference being that Cassie doesn't get paid big bucks.

exhelodrvr1 said...

There is at least an order of magnitude more prejudice and bigotry on the left than there is on the right.

Ken B said...

"Just get power. Start now." From a guy who praises the communist dictatorship in China. Now we we know for sure who Friedman was rooting for when that man stood in Tiananman square: the tank.

Unknown said...

I've always thought Americans who practice Islam to be every bit as American as Americans who practice Christianity, or any other religion. But if Paddock were to have been a Muslim, we would be hearing from Althouse readers how American Muslims are less American than other Americans and how scary and dangerous they are.

Left Bank of the Charles said...

Will millions of American Muslims will be insulted? Or will they read the headline and nod in understanding that they get unfairly stigmatized while gun nuts get a pass?

We'll know the answer soon enough - if it is the former Thomas Friedman will soon be fired. Not fired yet? I guess it's the latter.

Lyle Smith said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bob Ellison said...

It would be worse if he said that Islam is a cult of lies, pedophilia, and misogyny.

Lyle Smith said...

Violent Islamists are Muslims who kill people, including lots of Americans, for particular reasons. We have no idea why Paddock did what he did. Do you understand the difference?

GoodPerson_VeryFlawed said...

The piece has a bunch of "if only" questions.

I find it hard to believe that Atlhouse doesn't comprehend the article.

OTOH, it's known that the mind deteriorates during the golden years. If she really didn't understand this piece I am embarrassed for her.


I dunno.

Anonymous said...

@Unknown Foolish statement about Althouse commenters. I have seen less snark and prejudice on these pages than any other comments I read - particularly on the more left-leaning blogs. Perhaps you are transferring your self-perceptions to us making your initial statement is just so much hogwash.

Krumhorn said...

I've always thought Americans who practice Islam to be every bit as American as Americans who practice Christianity, or any other religion.

Here's some premiere virtue-signaling.

- Krumhorn

Unknown said...

"Violent Islamists are Muslims who kill people, including lots of Americans, for particular reasons."

How many American Muslims are violent Islamists?

Darrell said...

If only Thomas L. Friedman were someone whose opinions I respected. . .

Darrell said...

How many American Muslims are violent Islamists?

Now or fifteen minutes from now?

Unknown said...

"Foolish statement about Althouse commenters. I have seen less snark and prejudice on these pages than any other comments I read..."

Oh please.

mockturtle said...

Friedman has always been an asshole so this doesn't surprise me.

Lyle Smith said...

Probably thousands of American Muslims are Islamists. Most Muslims are not and most Islamists won't ever commit acts of violence, but all the Islamist violence America has suffered going back before 9/11 has been because of them or their Islamist brethren living in the United States.

Islamists are supremacists akin to white supremacists. We all hate white supremacists don't we?

Paco Wové said...

"I guess San Bernardino didn't count."

Or Orlando.

Unknown said...

"Probably thousands of American Muslims are Islamists."

Probably thousands of white men gun nuts are prone to go postal.

Sebastian said...

"since millions of Muslims have the United States as their country of origin." Yeah, but they are still the Other, you see, at least when it's convenient, as it is here: bad native violent white male us vs. innocent, unfairly maligned, only occasionally lone-wolfishly-violent Other. Us = bad, made worse by treating the Other as bad. Which makes the Other better. If only the US could have more Others, it would be better.

Unknown said...

"Islamists are supremacists akin to white supremacists. We all hate white supremacists don't we?"

Yes indeed. But I doubt there are thousands of American Muslims who are Islamists.

Paul Snively said...

Well, considering these are the same people who call people concerned about Islamist terror "racist," what do you expect?

HT said...

Friedman is that chameleon you were talking about earlier. Nothing more nothing less. Not a fan.

Lyle Smith said...

Unknown,

Probably thousands of "white men gun nuts" (Are you a racist and a bigot?) are prone to go postal? Thousands? Really?

If you could have only said that there are thousands of white supremacists in America. But you didn't.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Unknown said...
"Foolish statement about Althouse commenters. I have seen less snark and prejudice on these pages than any other comments I read..."

Oh please.

10/3/17, 7:35 PM

You haven't been around the Internet much then.

Sally327 said...

The Orlando night club shooter was born here and he was Muslim. The San Bernardino shooter was born here and he was Muslim. I don't know, I only skimmed the article so I guess maybe i missed the point.

The problem with the gun control advocates is that it is so easy to dismiss their arguments as pointless partisan posturing. It's not the message so much as the messengers. And if they were really committed to doing something about it they had a real opportunity in Barack Obama's first term when he had majorities in both houses of Congress.

But yeah, Power, people. Go out there and get the Power.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Yes indeed. But I doubt there are thousands of American Muslims who are Islamists.

10/3/17, 7:42 PM

There doesn't have to be thousands.

Thousands of Islamists did not bring down the Twin Towers.

Lyle Smith said...

There are thousands of American Muslims who are also Islamists. Please try and wrap your head around what thousands means, and then do the math yourself. There are thousands of white supremacists in America. There are 6,000 plus KKK members in America. That would be thousands of Americans.

Unknown said...


"Probably thousands of "white men gun nuts" (Are you a racist and a bigot?) are prone to go postal? Thousands? Really?"

Actually no, not really. In the same way there aren't "thousands" of American Muslims that are Islamists who are going to go on a rampage.

The Cracker Emcee Activist said...

These seems like a pretty lame attempt at changing the conversation. They must suspect that the shooter's a Democrat and they're desperate to round up some squirrels before it becomes generally known.

Unknown said...

"Thousands of Islamists did not bring down the Twin Towers."

American Muslims did not bring down the Twin Towers.

chickelit said...

I don't believe in throwing away books but I actually threw away Friedman's tome "The World Is Flat." We're downsizing to smaller space and some things had to go. I ditched McCain's book as well. Space wasters.

chickelit said...

I guess I could have given them to a library but why poison other minds?

Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...

Psychiatrist: 'CNN's Gonna Have to Answer' for Their Twisted Priorities on Mass Shootings

exiledonmainstreet said...

Inga, I love how you leftists talk about whites like you're not white yourself. Do you think this particular "gun nut" would have cared about your politics:

"The man accused of shooting churchgoers in Tennessee reportedly wanted revenge for Dylann Roof, the white supremacist convicted of killing nine in a black congregation in South Carolina.

Emanuel Samson left a note in his vehicle outside the church Sunday before he allegedly opened fire, leaving one dead and six others injured. The note described wanting to get revenge or retaliation for the 2015 church shooting in Charleston, South Carolina, according to a report from the Associated Press. "

Oh, well, you wouldn't be in a church anyway, so I guess you have nothing to fear.

SukieTawdry said...

I never considered the "country of Origin" to be the problem.

Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...

The Orlando shooting was the largest mass killing until this one. The left do not care at all about the innocent people, many of whom were gay, who were gunned down by an actual Islamic supremacist. An Islamic supremacist whose father was a huge Hillary Clinton supporter.

Doesn't fit the big liar D narrative.

n.n said...

We also don't include Pro-Choicers. Not the color diveritists or racists, sex diversitists or sexists, politically congruence or "=", the social justice adventurists who indulge in start or reopening wars and opening mass abortion fields, the anti-nativists who are first-order forcings of CAIR and Democratic gerrymandering, the Great Societists who profit from perpetual smoothing functions and dysfunctional communities, or the unprecedented violation of scientific integrity and moral principles: the abortionists and clinical cannibals at the twilight fringe.

rhhardin said...

What's wrong with insulting muslims?

Pinandpuller said...

Always bet on White.

Rob Schwarz said...

How does Mr Friedman know he wasn't a recent convert to Islam?

exiledonmainstreet said...

"American Muslims did not bring down the Twin Towers."


Syed Rizwan Farook, the San Bernardino killer, was an American citizen, as was the Orlando shooter. The latter's father (a good Democrat who said that gays deserved to die) sat right behind Hillary at one of her rallies.

Henry said...

The killer's country of origin was "crazy."

tim in vermont said...

Paddock’s motive remains unknown. “This person may have radicalised, unbeknownst to us, and we want to identify that source.” - Sheriff Joseph Lombardo

Pinandpuller said...

Left Bank of the Charles said...

Will millions of American Muslims will be insulted? Or will they read the headline and nod in understanding that they get unfairly stigmatized while gun nuts get a pass?

Not mutually exclusive.

n.n said...

Progressives do not judge based on character (e.g. principles), bur rather the "color of skin" (e.g. [color] diversity) and green policies of redistributive change.

Oh, well. They are our problem, past, present, and future.

As for Muslims, they became our problem when Obama targeted national Muslims, forced CAIR, created a trail of tears, and progressive and liberals, color diversitists and color supremacists, kneeled before Him.

holdfast said...

@Dickin'Bimbos@Home

Largest mass shooting you mean - obviously certain bombings and airplane attacks have killed far more.

Actually, KDW at NRO points out some larger mass shootings, but those were perpetrated by racist Democrats, so I guess they don't count.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/452267/mass-shootings-gun-control-and-shark-attacks

GoodPerson_VeryFlawed said...

BTW,

assuming that Althouse did understand this piece, it's too bad that she has a policy re not using the 'civility BS' tag re her own civility BS.


buwaya said...

"Probably thousands of white men gun nuts are prone to go postal."

Indeed, there is a very high statistical probability of this, given the sheer volume of weapons in civilian hands, the vast majority of which (and of the deadliest sorts too) are in the hands of white men, and the probability that quite a few of them, as with all human beings, are not too far from the edge of violence, by nature or circumstance.

This is a set of facts worth thinking on a bit.
And considering the implications of, within the politico-cultural game.
Such as - do you really want to make white men, as a group, angry?
Perhaps your best strategy is to stop provoking the tiger.

Unknown said...

"Syed Rizwan Farook, the San Bernardino killer, was an American citizen, as was the Orlando shooter."

So? Stephen Paddock was also an American citizen.

n.n said...

Only one nut cracked and targeted a diverse (around twenty thousand) group of Americans. I wonder if he kneeled first.

narciso said...

As widlanski points out, in battle for the mind, Friedman has been wrong since the shatila story, where his pot language skills, and dingy contacts named the wrong militia leader sAmi haddad, as responsible naturally he covered the stories of the embassy and .marine barracks bombing. Among those historically wrong he shares with Paul pillar of the counter terror center and chief middle east analyst

exiledonmainstreet said...

What exactly makes one a "gun nut?" Do you have to have as much weaponry as the LV shooter amassed? Very few people in America have (or can afford) that sort of arsenal. My brother owns about 20 rifles and shotguns - is he a "gun nut?"

I own 2 pistols and am a strong proponent of the 2nd Amendment. In my neighborhood that makes me Annie Oakley.

Pinandpuller said...

I've said it before:

Gun Culture is the culture of peace.

Mass killers are not true disciples of Gun Safety.

Gun Culture has been with the US since the beginning.

Gun Culture always knows when sunrise and sunset is.

They anoint their guns with Remington oil. They make me to lie beside game trails.

My cleaning rod and my mini tool, they comfort me.

The most beautiful sound in the morning is the call to bucks.

Amen

narciso said...

The san Bernardino shooters were radicalized abroad, they were part of a cell several year back, the wife at a madrassa in Pakistan.

n.n said...

What exactly makes one a "gun nut?"

Probably the same as what makes one a scalpel nut. Every year, there are nearly a million scalpel nuts that carry out a mass abortion in the privacy of chambers operated by Planned Parenthood et al. Fortunately, the gun nuts are fewer and far between than their progressive competitors.

GoodPerson_VeryFlawed said...

Buw,

"This is a set of facts worth thinking on a bit.
And considering the implications of, within the politico-cultural game.
Such as - do you really want to make white men, as a group, angry?
Perhaps your best strategy is to stop provoking the tiger."

Your suggested response is illogical. Why would all these armed angry white dudes expect the less/not armed "others" to cower as a response to whitey's demands that are backed up by the threat of violence?

The logical response is to use the 2A to become equally (or more so) armed. That's the only way to ensure that the angry white dudes can't use their weapons to force their will on you. Cowering and begging to someone more power ain't the logical answer when you have a green light to equaling or bettering that firepower.

Duh.

Unknown said...

"The san Bernardino shooters were radicalized abroad, they were part of a cell several year back, the wife at a madrassa in Pakistan."

Indeed. And Stephen Paddock went nuts here in the good old US of A.

Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...

holdfast - Mass shootings as a specific category.

Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...

9/11 wasn't a mass shooting, it was a terrorist attack and an act of war.

exiledonmainstreet said...

"So? Stephen Paddock was also an American citizen."

He does not appear to have been a Republican "gun nut" however. While we do not yet know his motives, there is now a report that he was "radicalized."

After the baseball field shootings, I modified my position on gun control. I now believe no Democrat should be allowed to own them. You're all too crazy and immature.

MaxedOutMama said...

Really. That's weirdly and offensively off-base.

Jupiter said...

Unknown said...

"Indeed. And Stephen Paddock went nuts here in the good old US of A."

So your point is, that if we find out that Stephen Paddock was merely one of the more zealous members of a populous religion that calls upon all of its adherents to do as he did, we should hasten to bring as many of them to this country as we possibly can.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Friedman's crude? You're avoiding the issue, and it's killing Americans. Many more Americans than are killed by Muslims.

Do you care about keeping Americans from getting killed or do you care about hating Muslims? Which is more important to you?

Unknown said...

friedman does not write articles - he writes headlines with 'filling' --- finally one of his fancy headlines is coming back at him --- he has not been worth reading for many many years.

exiledonmainstreet said...

So your point is, that if we find out that Stephen Paddock was merely one of the more zealous members of a populous religion that calls upon all of its adherents to do as he did, we should hasten to bring as many of them to this country as we possibly can.

10/3/17, 8:25 PM

Yep. she feels safe in her lily white neighborhood. If other people die, well, that's the price we have to pay for her holy god "diversity."

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

My brother owns about 20 rifles and shotguns - is he a "gun nut?"

I believe the correct term is "fetishist."

If only he were Jay Leno and directed his fetish into something beautiful and useful like cars.

buwaya said...

PB&J,

I understood this piece very well I think.
And in a general sense I actually agree with Friedman. The US state of civilian armament is bizarre and causes a great deal of trouble.
However, my opinion applies to some ideal state that does not exist here. Here you have to deal with Americans.

If you are closely connected with the actual culture that buys and uses these weapons the cultural connections are unmistakable. Americans are well armed because they are Americans and intolerant of authority by nature - violently, innately, and even fanatically. These are different people than you would, perhaps, wish they were, but you have to deal with them as they are.

Friedman is like the expat in a Muslim country that wishes it wasn't.
More, he does not seem to realize it, and demands the impossible.

Like so many liberals he blasts that bogeyman, the "NRA", as if it were some sort of independent malevolent entity. I was once a member of the NRA, though I have never owned a gun in this country; I joined for the sake of some friendships. From the inside it is possibly to see it for what it is, an assembly of those bloody minded, stiff necked Americans that wont take dictation from such as Friedman. The NRA is the product of its members, the members are not products of the NRA. He publicly hates the NRA as a handy handle without revealing what he really means, but it is these obstreperous people that he truly despises.

And those people understand Mr. Friedman very well. Hate is answered with hate.

What we have here is a clash of cultures, with the tinge of existential stakes, of blood already seeping at the point of contact.

Friedman and co are best advised to make peace with the actual people behind the NRA, and all those who feel like them, to come to them in true humility and penitence.

Darrell said...

Why can't we be like Europe, where nuts put chains on doors and start fires in buildings killing hundreds?

GoodPerson_VeryFlawed said...

"You're avoiding the issue, and it's killing Americans. Many more Americans than are killed by Muslims."

I noticed that she skipped this:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/02/opinion/editorials/mass-shootings-congress.html

OTOH, I do think it's important to not forget that Islamic terrorists are the ones looking for the big event, e.g. nuke type stuff. So the potential lethality re Muslim terrorists is very large. OTOOH, it's absurd to let emotions and pants-pissing cons make irrational fear the SOP of the US electorate and gov. IMHO.

Pinandpuller said...

Lyle Smith said...

There are thousands of American Muslims who are also Islamists. Please try and wrap your head around what thousands means, and then do the math yourself.

There are thousands of white supremacists in America. There are 6,000 plus KKK members in America. That would be thousands of Americans.

10/3/17, 7:48 PM

What the hell are they all waiting on, Ragnarok?

Unknown said...

"Do you care about keeping Americans from getting killed or do you care about hating Muslims? Which is more important to you?"

Good question, but the answer is obvious from the comments already made in this thread. The dreaded fear of Muslims overrides the normal fear of nuts with guns, 20 or more of them.

Unknown said...

"Friedman and co are best advised to make peace with the actual people behind the NRA, and all those who feel like them, to come to them in true humility and penitence."

Buwaya is trolling.

narciso said...

Even more examples here,

https://www.amazon.com/Michael-Widlanski/e/B00AYE53CW

Both Friedman and wright underplayed Iran's role in hezbollah

Allegedly paddock wanted to attack another venue, chance the rappers concert, talked by David brooks, although this current event had been sold out for two months

Michael K said...

How many American Muslims are violent Islamists?

I don't know. It depends on which month you are talking about. There have been a lot of Muslim terror incidents that slipped under the radar and we would up with worries about "Islamophobia."

The fact that this guy was video recording himself killing hundreds is very ISIS-like.

Inga you had better brace yourself for bad news.

The point is that they don;t seem to be assimilating well. Minnesota's Somali population of 50,000 is a good example.

We don't want more of them, especially young men of military age.

When they have proven they assimilate, more can come.

buwaya said...

"Cowering and begging to someone more power ain't the logical answer when you have a green light to equaling or bettering that firepower."

Because it isn't that easy to equal and better that firepower.
This is above all a matter of will.
I don't see the other side investing the time, the interest, the passion into this.
It takes some degree of sacrifice, a preference for this sort of amusement, vs so many other alternatives.

There are other ways to survive when there is a power imbalance. Every minority anywhere, with a lack of such power, knows to respect lines that are best not crossed.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Pinandpuller said...

The Cracker Emcee Activist said...

These seems like a pretty lame attempt at changing the conversation. They must suspect that the shooter's a Democrat and they're desperate to round up some squirrels before it becomes generally known.

10/3/17, 7:52 PM

There's a particular contingent around the net that wants you to know that liberals and democrats own guns too. Except this time. And the last time.

Mary Beth said...

I find it hard to believe that Atlhouse doesn't comprehend the article.

I find it easy to believe your comprehension skills are so poor that you think the "gaffe" had to do with the content of the article. It's the implication in the teaser that one couldn't be Muslim and American.

mandrewa said...

Islam is the religion of hatred.

It's legitimate for people to fear it. Because historically this is how Islam has spread and we seem to be seeing in the modern world that nothing has apparently changed. Modern Islam has the same or a similar dynamic to what it has always had.

A brief historical example: Turkey, less than a hundred years ago, one fifth of the population killed or expelled because they weren't Muslim.

How many times in history have similar events happened?

The left may claim that Christianity is a religion of hatred. This is not true. But suppose it were. Would this be a rational reason for Christians (or atheists) to not legitimately fear Islam? Of course not. Now what the left may be really arguing is that aside from expressing hatred towards Christianity, they are implicitly arguing that Christianity was once hateful but now isn't and therefore we can anticipate the same for Islam.

Ignoring the hatred being directed towards Christianity, I don't think this is reasonable. We have to deal with reality and not with some fantasy world that isn't here.

Another argument would be that we are just dealing with some tiny minority and it's that minority that is the problem. I don't believe that's true. If you look at what most Muslims believe there is an implied violence in what they say they believe. The dramatically violent minority is an expression of what the majority thinks and it's going to be rising up, sometimes more than others, as long as Islam exists.

America can tolerate a small percentage of Muslims, like say two percent. But it cannot deal with a large percentage, like say ten percent, without experiencing the reality of what Islam is.

rcocean said...

The Left never lets a tragedy go to waste.

Every act of Muslim terror is a chance to demand tolerance for Muslims. Every act of non-Muslim terror, is an a chance to demand tolerance for Muslims AND Gun control.

No one believes that if we agreed with Tom Friedman to institute Gun Control policy X, it would stop there. The Tom Friedman's would keep on demanding stricter and stricter gun control until the gun control Laws - nationwide - banned all guns.

Of course, people like Tom Friedman, don't like enforcing laws, especially against "people of color", so you'd end up like Chicago, only worse.

Pinandpuller said...

There's just a dam in California holding back all the old white guy violence in this country.

Believe it!

Unknown said...

"It's legitimate for people to fear it."

It's legitimate for Americans to fear angry American gun nuts.

buwaya said...

"It's legitimate for Americans to fear angry American gun nuts."

Then you should act realistically on your fear and try to propitiate them, because if you make them more angry you will have even more cause to fear them.

As with Friedman and his employer.
They will get further using honey than acid.

Pinandpuller said...

Blogger Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...

The Orlando shooting was the largest mass killing until this one. The left do not care at all about the innocent people, many of whom were gay, who were gunned down by an actual Islamic supremacist. An Islamic supremacist whose father was a huge Hillary Clinton supporter.

Doesn't fit the big liar D narrative.

10/3/17, 7:59 PM

It's like Navin Johnson's conclusion that the oil cans were the gunman's target.

Unknown said...

"Ignoring the hatred being directed towards Christianity, I don't think this is reasonable. We have to deal with reality and not with some fantasy world that isn't here."

Dylann Roof shot up a prayer meeting in a church, killing nine people.

Be said...

Which is why I don't look at much of anything anymore, save for here to see who's joking on things and in what way, the local news aggregate to see where I need to park the car, and the knitting site to get free patterns.

GoodPerson_VeryFlawed said...

"This is above all a matter of will.
I don't see the other side investing the time, the interest, the passion into this."


That's because "the other side" knows that your often repeated fear mongering and presaging the end of US civilization is wrong.

If your prediction re white loons w/ guns taking over the rights of others by arms was actually a reality, the others would be less lackadaisical. Until then, rather than being alarmed, folks will make the correct correlation between people who talk big about being powerful because of their guns and the fact that the big guy upstairs armed them w/ tiny cocks.

Unknown said...

"Then you should act realistically on your fear and try to propitiate them, because if you make them more angry you will have even more cause to fear them."

The USA wouldn't exist today if the colonists were so afraid that it had stopped them from rebelling. Decent people do what is right, despite fear.

Unknown said...

Buwaya, Land of the Free home of the Brave, don't you know?

mandrewa said...

It's legitimate for me to fear you, Unknown. Good lord, look at all the people the left has killed so far this century and last. Most of what we talk about is trivial compared to that.

Now I want to apologize. You argue for the left. But that doesn't you really are of the left. I'm trying to say that I don't really blame you for what the left has done.

Bob Ellison said...

mandrewa, powerful writing.

Mr. Majestyk said...

The LV shooter might turn out to be one of a number of things: a mentally ill person; an Islamic terrorist; a Republican "gun nut" shooting folks for the hell of it; a Bernie Bro Resister (a la James Hodkinson) shooting evil Republicans who brougt us Trump; or maybe even a White Supremacist aiming to kill as many blacks as possible who unwisely chose to target a country music concert. Maybe something else entirely. We don't know yet. To me, some of these possibilities seem more likely than others . . . .

Unknown said...

"It's legitimate for me to fear you, Unknown."

It's abnormal for you to fear me, yet not fear angry gun nuts with an easy supply of guns going on a rampage.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Good lord, look at all the people the left has killed so far this century and last.

It's time the right got to kill some people. Why can't they have their turn? So unfair!

Pinandpuller said...

GoodPerson_VeryFlawed said...

Buw,

"This is a set of facts worth thinking on a bit.
And considering the implications of, within the politico-cultural game.
Such as - do you really want to make white men, as a group, angry?
Perhaps your best strategy is to stop provoking the tiger."

Your suggested response is illogical. Why would all these armed angry white dudes expect the less/not armed "others" to cower as a response to whitey's demands that are backed up by the threat of violence?

The logical response is to use the 2A to become equally (or more so) armed. That's the only way to ensure that the angry white dudes can't use their weapons to force their will on you. Cowering and begging to someone more power ain't the logical answer when you have a green light to equaling or bettering that firepower.

Duh.

10/3/17, 8:20 PM

You need a civilian defense force. Just as well funded. Just as well organized...

narciso said...

Roof had no organization behind, hexwas literALLY a lone wolf, mcveigh had a little more support, but that was overblown. By contrast islamists, have the bulk of mosques preachers funding sources, in Europe as well as the middle east.

Unknown said...

"By contrast islamists, have the bulk of mosques preachers funding sources, in Europe as well as the middle east."

How many American Muslims are Islamists?

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Roof had no organization behind, hexwas literALLY a lone wolf, mcveigh had a little more support, but that was overblown.

Right wingers need to do MOAR killing! We know you want to!

Pinandpuller said...

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

My brother owns about 20 rifles and shotguns - is he a "gun nut?"

I believe the correct term is "fetishist."

If only he were Jay Leno and directed his fetish into something beautiful and useful like cars.

Beauty is in the scope of the beholder.

narciso said...

After Oklahoma city, the FBI dtilling down on militias, notably through operation megiddo, while Al queda was building up its cadres. It served the Clinton adminstrations
interests at the time, as they were slashing the military and intelligence component

Unknown said...

Trump: this American carnage...

Yes indeed.

exiledonmainstreet said...

"It's time the right got to kill some people. Why can't they have their turn? So unfair!"

Well, we have a lot of catching up to do before we hit the 100 million mark. And the left's not done yet - they're piling up the bodies in Venezuela and North Korea as we type!

Admittedly though, you people don't limit yourself to guns when you want to commit mass murder. Starvation works too!

mandrewa said...

Unknown. Your argument that Dylann Roof killing nine Christians proves that Christianity is violent doesn't make sense.

So the interesting thing here is whatever are you really thinking that led to you writing that.

I'm guessing it's a probably a tribal reasoning. He's not your tribe. He's white. He possibly was raised Christian. Therefore he's Christian. Therefore this is evidence of the evil of Christianity. And somehow it's similar to what's going on with Islam.

Look if you read the New Testament, if you understand at all what the words are saying, there's no way you'd ever attribute such an act to Christianity.

On the other hand if you read the Koran, and especially if you read the Hadiths, you can some explicit directives, allegedly from Allah, telling Muslims to do this sort of thing.

Or let's ignore the texts and go to the people. There's probably some tiny, tiny percentage of Christians that like what Roof did. And then there's the Muslims, where amazingly there's a surprisingly significant minority that admits to supporting ISIS. And then there's the much larger group, the majority, that while disavowing ISIS, at the same time express other beliefs that kind of imply an implicit belief in ISIS sorts of ideas.

narciso said...

My view is if kornilov had been given a free hand, and dealt with the Bolsheviks, something that useful idiot reed didn't understand. Much of the last blood soaked century would have been avoided. There likely wouldn't have any major revolt in Germany hence no need for a freikorps, likely mussolini would have stayed a socialust, and other salubrious circumstances

walter said...

If only these murders were black on black, the left wouldn't give a shit enough to fly their illogical policies up a flagpole stuck through the bodies of the barely cold dead.

n.n said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
exiledonmainstreet said...

Unknown said...
Trump: this American carnage...

Yes indeed.

10/3/17, 9:23 PM

Spare me the pious bullshit. You don't care one bit about those people who died - in fact, I think you're secretly, or not so secretly delighted, because you get to display your lust for controlling other people's lives under the guise of "caring." Why would you care? They were mainly white CW fans - Trump voters. Like that CBS exec, you have no sympathy for those whiteys. You're rolling in their blood.

You are a ghoul.

n.n said...

Americans kneel, as it were, before God, not men and women playing gods. The Constitution was designed to mitigate progress of the ancient narcissism.

narciso said...

Is that too deep an analysis, UN the united states as well the aftermath of the Russian revolution encouraged the Marxist and anarchist wave, whose response as thecfirst red scare and hoover's prominence in it.

Unknown said...

"Unknown. Your argument that Dylann Roof killing nine Christians proves that Christianity is violent doesn't make sense."

It doesn't make sense because it's nonsensical. It's a very strange way of interpreting my comment. How could you possibly come away thinking I was saying Christianity is violent because Dylann Roof killed nine Christians? Was Dylan Roof a Christian? If so he surely didn't follow the teachings of Christ, did he?

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

"It's time the right got to kill some people. Why can't they have their turn? So unfair!"

Well, we have a lot of catching up to do before we hit the 100 million mark.


Too bad the Nazis, Italians and Japanese didn't win, right?

The best thing we can say for the right wing is that their incompetence also extends to their acts of mass murder. What a virtue on their part.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Spare me the pious bullshit. You don't care one bit about those people who died

I know misery loves company, but stop projecting.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Unknown said...
"Ignoring the hatred being directed towards Christianity, I don't think this is reasonable. We have to deal with reality and not with some fantasy world that isn't here."

Dylann Roof shot up a prayer meeting in a church, killing nine people.

10/3/17, 8:50 PM

And a black man shot up a church in Tennessee to get revenge for Roof. We don't hear as much about that - because what stopped the carnage was a white "gun nut" who ran to his car, got his gun, and shot the would-be mass murderer.

Awfully inconvenient story for you. You just hate it when people defend themselves.

Unknown said...

"You're rolling in their blood.

You are a ghoul."

Don't shoot me Annie Ugly.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

You just hate it when people defend themselves.

Like the guy in Vegas, for instance.

Surely there is a better right-wing justification for him than what you've put together so far.

exiledonmainstreet said...

"I know misery loves company, but stop projecting."

I'm not the one who wished death on an entire state - 28 million people - when Irma hit.

That was you.

What kind of miserable, callous asshole wishes death on an entire state?

A leftist, that's who.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

I'm not the one who wished death on an entire state - 28 million people - when Irma hit.

How many people in New York and California do you want to die?

Unknown said...

"Awfully inconvenient story for you. You just hate it when people defend themselves."

How could people armed with guns defended themselves from an insane man shooting at them from the 32nd floor with automatic weapons, or weapons that can kill like automatic weapons?

exiledonmainstreet said...

Don't shoot me Annie Ugly.

10/3/17, 9:33 PM

Oh, I wouldn't do that. Or even hit you over the head with a bike lock.

I'm not a Bernie supporter, after all.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

It's possible that sexiled may not actually wish death upon her enemies. I'm sure that for her restricting their right to vote is good enough.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

so sexiled, where do you want the next American massacre to take place at? A NASCAR event?

Remember, the shooters were only pursuing their 2nd amendment rights. Very manly.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Unknown said...
"Awfully inconvenient story for you. You just hate it when people defend themselves."

How could people armed with guns defended themselves from an insane man shooting at them from the 32nd floor with automatic weapons, or weapons that can kill like automatic weapons?"

I wasn't referring to LV, dipshit. You brought up Roof, I brought up a black man who sought revenge for the Roof murders and killed a woman before he was stopped by one of your hated crackas with a gun.

Please try to read and think logically. I know I'm asking the impossible from you.

Unknown said...

"Please try to read and think logically. I know I'm asking the impossible from you."

Go play with your guns.

Pinandpuller said...

Ask Reginald Denny if a gun is useful to get from point A to point B.

One beep is yes, two beeps is no.

Unknown said...

And don't get too excited.

exiledonmainstreet said...

The Toothless Revolutionary said...
so sexiled, where do you want the next American massacre to take place at? A NASCAR event?"

I know you're hoping for that. You want more blood to roll around in.

I certainly wouldn't put it past your antifa buddies.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Unknown said...
And don't get too excited."

As excited as you got when you saw deplorables dying? You probably had an orgasm.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Go play with your guns.

10/3/17, 9:40 PM

I do, frequently. Right in Waukesha County where there is a big shooting range.

Pinandpuller said...

narciso said...

Even more examples here,

https://www.amazon.com/Michael-Widlanski/e/B00AYE53CW

Both Friedman and wright underplayed Iran's role in hezbollah

Allegedly paddock wanted to attack another venue, chance the rappers concert, talked by David brooks, although this current event had been sold out for two months

10/3/17, 8:37 PM

Maybe he killed Biggie and Tupac.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

I know you're hoping for that. You want more blood to roll around in.

Really? As far as I can tell, the only one worried about making sure the people she hates are the ones who get killed and the people she loves spared is you.

Michael K said...

The sun must have set. I see Ritmo has appeared.

exiledonmainstreet said...

I'm sure that for her restricting their right to vote is good enough.

10/3/17, 9:36 PM

If they're too stupid to get a photo ID, they shouldn't vote. But I trust most blacks are not that stupid. Too bad you have such a low, racist opinion of their intelligence and sense of responsibility.

I'm all for not letting Democrats own guns though. I certainly don't trust them to be intelligent and responsible enough to own guns. Hell, they can't even cross the street by themselves without help from the government.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

I see...

You do no such thing.

exiledonmainstreet said...

"Really? As far as I can tell, the only one worried about making sure the people she hates are the ones who get killed and the people she loves spared is you."

If, by "the people I hate," you mean violent criminals who are trying to murder people yeah, I have no problems with them getting shot by a citizen who is defending him or herself.

The Left: Cops are brutal racist killers!

The Left: Only cops should be allowed to have guns!

That makes sense.

Pinandpuller said...

mandrewa said...

Islam is the religion of hatred.

It's legitimate for people to fear it. Because historically this is how Islam has spread and we seem to be seeing in the modern world that nothing has apparently changed. Modern Islam has the same or a similar dynamic to what it has always had.

But Islam has updated itself. Much like the Leo DeCaprio/Claire Daines verson of Romeo and Juliet. Swords to guns.




10/3/17, 8:42 PM

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

If they're too stupid to get a photo ID, they shouldn't vote. But I trust most blacks are not that stupid.

So they're not stupid now, even less of them qualify. And if less of them qualify after your new jim crow literacy test, you'll find a new pretzel to tie yourself into. Maybe blame it on them if they can't manage to have a job that allows them in during restricted voting hours and lines that stretch for blocks in precincts that are denied the funds to have adequate polling locations.

Jim Crow Sexiled on Manstreet. Modern day literacy tests for voting.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poll_taxes_in_the_United_States#Voter_registration

http://www.umich.edu/~lawrace/disenfranchise1.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_test#Voting

Pinandpuller said...

Unknown said...

"It's legitimate for people to fear it."

It's legitimate for Americans to fear angry American gun nuts.

10/3/17, 8:45 PM

No angry American gun nut is illegal!!!

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

If, by "the people I hate," you mean violent criminals who are trying to murder people yeah, I have no problems with them getting shot by a citizen who is defending him or herself.

The Left: Cops are brutal racist killers!

The Left: Only cops should be allowed to have guns!

That makes sense.


About as much sense as the high gun-owner suicide rates! What an awesome outcome for such violent people!

Pinandpuller said...

I watched Tokyo Drift last night for the first time. As soon as Sonny Chiba's nephew pulled out a gun in Japan my suspended disbelief was shattered.

narciso said...

Heh, I don't think so, its more like the zeta/sunaloa/ guadalajara cattle senufinals. The corridors are the equivalentvof hip-hop down there.

Michael K said...

Oh Oh.

The sheriff is now mentioning "Radicalized."

exiledonmainstreet said...

Ritmo said:
About as much sense as the high gun-owner suicide rates! What an awesome outcome for such violent people!"

America is number 48 when it comes to suicide rates, according to the WHO. Sri Lanka is No. 1. South Korea, Finland, Japan, Sweden and Argentina all have us beat. It's hard for you to believe, I know, but somehow people in those countries are managing to off themselves without guns. Even in wonderful socialist countries where they have nationalized healthcare!!

Why, it's like people who really want to kill themselves will slash their wrists or jump off a bridge or drown themselves in wells if they are determined to do so. Guns not necessary!


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate

mockturtle said...

The sheriff is now mentioning "Radicalized."

One of the British papers today said there was a note in the room. Maybe it said, "Allahu Akbar!".

Unknown said...

"The sheriff is now mentioning "Radicalized."

Info Wars!

LOL!

mockturtle said...

Why, it's like people who really want to kill themselves will slash their wrists or jump off a bridge or drown themselves in wells if they are determined to do so. Guns not necessary!

And good old reliable carbon monoxide.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Unknown said...
"The sheriff is now mentioning "Radicalized."

Info Wars!

LOL!

10/3/17, 10:22 PM

And also ABC News, dumbbell. It's a direct quote from the sheriff:


http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wireStory/gunman-hotel-perch-kills-59-wounds-527-las-50246108

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

More guns for right-wingers!

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/magazine/guns-and-suicide/
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/05/160519220528.htm
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/business/wonkblog/suicide-rates/

Help your fellow right-winger to do the right thing and off himself/herself. Buy them a gun!

It appeals to their inner violence-addict, after all.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Ritmo, you know very well that people can not survive in today's world without a photo ID. You need it when you go to the doctor. You need it to buy liquor from stores. You need it to cash checks.

The "it's racist to require photo ID at the polls" is the dumbest excuse ever.

You just want your side to be able to cheat at elections, because if you didn't you'd have even fewer Dems in Congress than you do now.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Ritmo, they're not committing suicide because they have guns, idiot.

Would you be OK with it if they hung themselves instead?

jimbino said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Unknown said...

I saw the news conference live. The Sheriff stated that the investigation into the girlfriend was not over. They are interested in learning if there is anything, (including the possibility of radicalization) they can discover about her or Paddock. He didn't say he thought either of them were radicalized. You people are desperate to blame this bloodbath on Islam, instead of facing your own sick gun culture.

mockturtle said...

It looks like there was, in fact, a note on a table in Paddock's hotel room. Interesting that there has been nothing said in the MSM about this.

jimbino said...

@Exiledonmainstreet

Would you be OK with it if they hung themselves instead?

translated into English would read

Would you be OK with it if they hanged themselves instead?

jimbino said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Lewis Wetzel said...

Friedman is, undeniably, an idiot who sees most of America as an alien nation. There is something disturbing about born and bred Americans who view non_Americans with more sympathy than Americans. It's analogous to loving a neighbor family more than your own.

traditionalguy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
traditionalguy said...

Just when the Soros raised Antifa Army is the point of the spear being sent into every strange riot to divide the USA racially, and the Dems are joining in teaching the need for just hatred of all white skinned people, it is no time to disarm us people. The only gun control we need is issuing militia weapons to all Americans.

We can call them "Peacemakers."

jimbino said...

If Only Stephen Paddock Were a Muslim.

Even worse, since he's dead, one has to write

If Only Stephen Paddock Had Been a Muslim.

Not even the New York Times has writers any longer who understand usage of verb tenses in the subjunctive mood.

exiledonmainstreet said...

jimbino said...
@Exiledonmainstreet

Would you be OK with it if they hung themselves instead?

translated into English would read

Would you be OK with it if they hanged themselves instead?

10/3/17, 10:39 PM

Ah, you got me. Thanks for the correction.

exiledonmainstreet said...

You people are desperate to blame this bloodbath on Islam, instead of facing your own sick gun culture.

10/3/17, 10:37 PM

And you are desperate to avoid the fact that the scumbag might - and I say might because we don't know - have been one of your own.

He was not a Trump voter.

exiledonmainstreet said...

And goodness knows, it's not like Islamic culture has ever been responsible for mass murder!!

It's just completely unheard of!

Big Mike said...

Well, ISIS says that Paddock certainly was a Muslim. Arrogant of Friedman to say otherwise. They may feel constrained to behead him now.

furious_a said...

It's analogous to loving a neighbor family more than your own.

Well, yeah, one doesn't have to live with the neighbor's family.

Pinandpuller said...

The Toothless Revolutionary re Jim Crow Literacy test

You mean, the big red sign says "Stop" literacy test?

Is the eye test racist? I know a lot of black people self medicating for glaucoma.

n.n said...

The problem in America is the abortion culture. Social liberalism with a quasi-moral demand for instant gratification without responsibility. The Pro-Choice Church that denies individual dignity (e.g. color diversity) debases human life, and constructs favorable politically congruences. It is a culture that profits from social justice, elective wars, CAIR, redistributive change, and a rising anti-nativism. It deprecates civil and human rights. And indulges in opening mass abortion fields in "clean" wars, for gerrymandered districts, and for political/social leverage.

Pinandpuller said...

Michael K

Paul Joseph Watson has an English accent. If he was on Comedy Central or HBO he'd be 100% legit unquestionably.

HT said...

Daily Mail

"Police are investigating the possibility that Las Vegas mass murderer Stephen Paddock may have originally targeted another music festival in the city.

"Paddock had apparently attempted to book rooms at the Ogden, a luxury condo tower that overlooked the Life is Beautiful open-air festival, which ran across 15 Las Vegas blocks from September 22-24."

chickelit said...

@jimbino @10:49: Bravo!

Ray said...

I saw Mr. Friedman speak for his book tour, and my daughter and I were not that impressed. He seemed much better in the past, or perhaps I now see things clearer.

I asked him about the term fake news, and his answer was very long winded, mentioned he had eaten at the pizza place in D.C., and was basically he knew fake news when he saw it.

He also mentioned one of his goals with his columns was to be controversial.

Comanche Voter said...

Friedman is, was, and always be a flipping idiot.

And when I talk about "flipping" I should mention that if you read Friedman's columns at lunch over the course of a year or two (as I did back in 2002-2003) you will discover that sooner or later Friedman contradicts himself. If Friedman said something was "black" in February, by November he has said that the same thing is "white". Whatever passes through the vacuum between his ears winds up on the page. Consistency may be the hobgoblin of small minds---but Friedman doesn't even reach as high up as that level.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Ritmo, you know very well that people can not survive in today's world without a photo ID.

Or reading, really.

So what's wrong with those literacy tests, Jim Crow Sexiled?

Alex said...

If only the New York Slimes went out of business.

Alex said...

I'm still amazed at the excuses in 2017 as to why anyone can't get a photo ID. I guess if you're 600 pounds and are stuck/glued to your couch.

rcommal said...

Oh, for fuck's sake, Ann. Stop trying to be aggressively obtuse: That tactic of yours no longer works, on account of your having deployed it way too often over the last decade-plus-so.

rcommal said...

At least, for me, it does not.

urbane legend said...

Unknown said...
Probably thousands of white men gun nuts are prone to go postal.

Not concerned about that. I'm frightened by the number of women buying guns. What happens when several sharing a house go shopping one Saturday? Their periods have synced and they all want the same pair of shoes? :-)

My first movie script.

rhhardin said...

Friedman is writing from his own 32nd floor.

Bad Lieutenant said...


rcommal said...
Oh, for fuck's sake, Ann. Stop trying to be aggressively obtuse: That tactic of yours no longer works, on account of your having deployed it way too often over the last decade-plus-so.
10/4/17, 1:41 AM

Speak for yourself, I say the classics never die. That thing your girl does with her tongue? Gets me over every time.

Bad Lieutenant said...

As for "obtuse," jeez man, look at the coverage of President Trump, what else is there?

Ann Althouse said...

"Stop trying to be aggressively obtuse: That tactic of yours no longer works..."

What's "obtuse" about this post? I think it's pretty straightforward. The NYT forgot to notice American Muslims and I pointed it out and shamed them.

tim in vermont said...

Oh, for fuck's sake, Ann. Stop trying to be aggressively obtuse: That tactic of yours no longer works, on account of your having deployed it way too often over the last decade-plus-so.

Yet it works on millions when deployed against Trump, as it is constantly. FWIW, I don't think she is the one being obtuse.

JAORE said...

Friedman is proof positive that Nobel Prize level expertise in a narrow area (in this case a splinter of the broad category of economics) does not correlate with knowledge in general areas.

Or he's hacktastic to a remarkable degree.

'Tis a puzzle.

Roughcoat said...

I would bet good money on the assertion that most or a very large number of the young black men in the South Side Chicago neighborhoods I drive through on my way to and from work own guns, and that a significant number of those are carrying guns on their person. These young men are black not white and a rather significant number of them have used or will use those guns in the commission of crimes and to deadly effect. FWIW.

Martin said...

If you read much of his product you will see that under a very thin NYT-style veneer, Thomas Friedman's thinking IS "cloddishly crude."

He is merely another careerist of no particular intelligence, perceptiveness, or talent, who says the right things to impress other careerists with similar qualities, as they all help each other get ahead.

He has made a very nice career out of never being right about anything of consequence, but always in tune with the faux-intellectual zeitgeist.

mockturtle said...

Martin has Friedman pegged.

Gahrie said...

So what's wrong with those literacy tests, Jim Crow Sexiled?

The fact that the Democrats employed them in a discriminatory manner.

I will note that when poll taxes were made unconstitutional, no effort was made to make literacy tests unconstitutional at the same time, which would have been easy to do.

I personally believe you should have to pass a test in order to vote, just like yo do in order to drive.

mockturtle said...

I personally believe you should have to pass a test in order to vote, just like yo do in order to drive.

And I'm fascist enough to believe ballots should be printed only in English.

Achilles said...

The Toothless Revolutionary said...
Ritmo, you know very well that people can not survive in today's world without a photo ID.

Or reading, really.

So what's wrong with those literacy tests, Jim Crow Sexiled?


The problem was they were unevenly applied and specifically designed by democrats to keep black republican voters from voting. It is really impossible to have a fair literacy test so it is a bad idea.

But getting a photo ID is universal. Every American citizen has a photo ID or could easily get one.

The only opposition to photo ID to vote is people who employ voter fraud.

Jim at said...

"You don't care one bit about those people who died"

Of course she doesn't. The 'right' people were shot.
She's happy it happened.

I Callahan said...

The sun must have set. I see Ritmo has appeared.

The ghoul sleeps during the day. In a coffin.

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

"So what's wrong with those literacy tests, Jim Crow Sexiled?"

The fact that the Democrats employed them in a discriminatory manner.


We're Republicans! We employ them in a non-discriminatory manner! As long as it leads to less blacks voting then that means they're non-discriminatory! Yeay!

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