October 4, 2017

I advise Neil Gorsuch to bring a sandwich to oral arguments and eat in front of everyone.

Let's see how that happened.

1. I wrote a post called "We sent you Unclubbable Neil!" in which I tweak Jeffrey Toobin for writing "Perhaps Gorsuch will, as the years pass, prove to be a more clubbable colleague...." and consult the OED for the definition of "clubbable" and the older word "unclubbable."

2. The commenter Henry remembers that the word "unclubbable" appears in the description of the The Diogenes Club, in the Sherlock Holmes story "The Adventure of the Greek Interpreter":
There are many men in London, you know, who, some from shyness, some from misanthropy, have no wish for the company of their fellows. Yet they are not averse to comfortable chairs and the latest periodicals. It is for the convenience of these that the Diogenes Club was started, and it now contains the most unsociable and unclubbable men in town. No member is permitted to take the least notice of any other one. Save in the Stranger's Room, no talking is, under any circumstances, allowed, and three offences, if brought to the notice of the committee, render the talker liable to expulsion. My brother was one of the founders, and I have myself found it a very soothing atmosphere.
3. I do a little reading on Diogenes:
Diogenes... became notorious for his philosophical stunts such as carrying a lamp during the day, claiming to be looking for an honest man. He criticized and embarrassed Plato, disputed his interpretation of Socrates and sabotaged his lectures, sometimes distracting attendees by bringing food and eating during the discussions. Diogenes was also noted for having publicly mocked Alexander the Great.
4.  Distracting attendees by bringing food and eating during the discussions? I say:
Note to Neil Gorsuch: Emulate Diogenes by bringing a sandwich to oral arguments and eating.
5. Why a sandwich though? Where did that come from? It's the most food food to me. Warren Zevon said: "Enjoy every sandwich." And I don't know what Diogenes ate, except that it is sometimes said that he died from eating raw octopus.

Now, leave Neil Gorsuch alone while he prepares for the next oral argument:

81 comments:

Nonapod said...

Defiant Milosevic Eats Big, Sloppy Sandwich During Trial

Meade said...

Note to younger self of 45 years ago: Live in a tiny house (or a large terra cotta planter), be disagreeable, and eat club sandwiches. You'll become famous!

tcrosse said...

A Chick-fil-a sandwich would be a nice touch.

robother said...

Peanut butter and jelly sandwiches maximize lip smacking, and are thus the go to lunch for oral arguments.

Karen said...

Ann Althouse, the painting is scrumptious. Who is the artist?

Chris N said...

Eat with your mouth open, Gorsuch.

Pat people on the back and ask them what all they're doing this weekend?

'Protestin?'

'Eatin' finger sandwiches at some club in NYC...talkin' fake news with THE Jeffrey Toobin?'

'I'll be at home readin' mah pocket copy of this here CON-stitution.'

EDH said...

Rather than oral argument it should be gastronomic argument?

Martin said...

Why do I get the feeling that Neil Gorsuch is to the Supreme Court as Donald Trump is to the political elite?

In Miller's analogy format--Gorsuch:USSC::Trump:Elites

The smartest guy in the room and focused on using common sense to solve problems, and violates the group social norms by which they all pretend they are smarter and better than everyone else.

And up to now, Greenhouse and Toobin and all the other mental midgets though Clarence Thomas was the bad guy.

Gabriel said...

mocked Alexander the Great

He had asked to meet Diogenes, and he asked if there was anything he could do for the philosopher. Diogenes said, "Move out of my light."

Alexander said to his hangers-on, "If I were not Alexander, I would want to be Diogenes."

robother said...

And no oral argument box lunch would be complete unless it included a noisy to open bag of extra crunchy Cheetos. The orange stain on your lips add visual emphasis to your every impertinent question.

tcrosse said...

The painting is Alma-Tadema's "Diogenes Greeted by the Cast of The Mikado".

Ann Althouse said...

The painting (which is at the Wikipedia link in the post and identified there) as by John William Waterhouse.

"John William Waterhouse RA (6 April 1849 – 10 February 1917) was an English painter known for working in the Pre-Raphaelite style. He worked several decades after the breakup of the Pre-Raphaelite Brotherhood, which had seen its heyday in the mid-nineteenth century, leading to his sobriquet "the modern Pre-Raphaelite". Borrowing stylistic influences not only from the earlier Pre-Raphaelites but also from his contemporaries, the Impressionists,[1] his artworks were known for their depictions of women from both ancient Greek mythology and Arthurian legend."

I love the women in the painting. It think of them as Ruth, Sonia, and Elena.

EDH said...

robother said...
Peanut butter and jelly sandwiches maximize lip smacking, and are thus the go to lunch for oral arguments.

They used peanut butter to make Mr. Ed the Horse look like he's talking.

Now, the owner of the dog with the world's longest tongue used peanut butter to demonstrate why she won the Guinness World Record.

rehajm said...

RBG would just confiscate it then offer it to Kagan or Soto.

Mr. Gorsuch has been kind enough to bring us a snack. Be my guest. Help yourselves.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

Maybe we could start a go-fund-me campaign to get him to eat an egg-salad sandwich during oral arguments.

traditionalguy said...

This is fun. You have branded a tabula rasa Gorsuch as an arrogant force. And it works. It is not enough that Gorsuch is Mr. White Male Privilege personified , he has gone wild and arrogantly presumed that he thinks correctly.

Henry said...

Why a sandwich though?

I see Meade beat me to it. Because the club sandwich.

Club steak would require extra logistical effort.

Henry said...

The painting is Alma-Tadema's "Diogenes Greeted by the Cast of The Mikado".

LOL.

MikeR said...

"eating raw octopus". "eaten raw by octopus": Fixed.
He wanted to eat the octopus, but the octopus disagreed with him.

Comanche Voter said...

As for a sandwich; I suggest a fried egg, with a thick slice of Bermuda onion on rye--then blow the exhaust at the notorious RBG.

harkin said...

So Clarence Thomas is an affront to the SC because he asks very few questions and Gorsuch is an affront because he speaks too much.......notice a pattern?

and Toobin: "Perhaps he thought that the other Justices were unfamiliar with this thing called “legislation.”

If it walks like a duck......

Regarding the sandwich: Turkey and avocado with red onion.

Even if he doesn't share they'll all get to participate.

Saint Croix said...

Peanut-butter, strawberry preserves, and bananas.

Bob Boyd said...

Gorsuch's wife loves Thai curry. Maybe he could bring some of that in his lunch box, plug in a microwave behind his seat and warm it up.
"Sorry Ruth, what were you saying about the uh...? Oh, it's a red curry. Louise made it herself. Would you like some? I have gobs."

Laslo Spatula said...

Eating an open-face sandwich is a great way to improve one's cunnilingus skills.

You start by licking the tomato.

I am Laslo.

Saint Croix said...

A Chick-fil-a sandwich would be a nice touch.

Without the pickle.

I am on board the Chick-fil-a train.

Except for the damn pickles.

Ralph L said...

Note to younger self of 45 years ago: Live in a tiny house (or a large terra cotta planter), be disagreeable, and eat club sandwiches. You'll become famous!

But you'll be overlooked by all the young ladies.

Ralph L said...

Still laughing at the cast of the Mikado.

CStanley said...

Just so long as he doesn't ask one of the female justices to make him a sandwich.

That wouldn't be funny.

Saint Croix said...

You want to really make them mad at work?

Nothing beats fish in a microwave.

CStanley said...

I am on board the Chick-fil-a train.

Except for the damn pickles.


Agree, but if you order it regular and then remove the pickle, the little bit of pickle juice it leaves behind mixed with the buttery bun and the seasoning on the chicken batter is sublime.

Bay Area Guy said...

Gorsuch should not eat a ham sandwich during oral argument, before he indicts it.

Laslo Spatula said...

"Eating an open-face sandwich is a great way to improve one's cunnilingus skills."

In which case Sonia Sotomayor's sandwich would be the one with avocado.

I am Laslo.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Diogenes was the earliest martyr in the centuries long quest to invent sushi.

Laslo Spatula said...

"Eating an open-face sandwich is a great way to improve one's cunnilingus skills."

Ginsburg's sandwich would probably be pretty dry. It has been a long time since it saw any 'mayonnaisse'.

I am Laslo.

Ralph L said...

The pipe doesn't nudge up to the wall properly. Must not have been painted from life.

Meade said...

"But you'll be overlooked by all the young ladies."

Would that I had been. Oh, the places I would've gone. To paraphrase some famous philosopher somewhere: if you gaze long into what Trump grabbed, what Trump grabbed also gazes into you.

Drago said...

Now that the "smart set" leftists on the east coast have settled on their initial strategy to begin the destruction of Gorsuch, it will be interesting to watch how long it takes for the usual "lifelong republicans" suspects, who pretend to support conservatives including Gorsuch, to begin the inevitable "walk back" from that early "support".

Saint Croix said...

Agree, but if you order it regular and then remove the pickle, the little bit of pickle juice it leaves behind mixed with the buttery bun and the seasoning on the chicken batter is sublime.

I've ordered that sandwich maybe 2000 times.

"Number one, no pickle, and a Coke."

On at least two occasions some bastard in the kitchen, probably working on the same pickle juice theory that you have, simply pulled the pickle off the sandwich and gave it to me.

It is not sublime! This is Sublime.

This is like anti-sublime.

Hating is what I got.
Hating is what I got.
You can't just pull off the pickle.
Because the juice soaks into the buttery bun
And it tastes like fucking pickle juice
Hating is what I got
Hating is what I got

buwaya said...

All those Greek chicks seem fascinated by Gorsuch/Diogenes.

holdfast said...

Toobin and Greenhouse are the judicial equivalent of fluffers.

Nonapod said...

Pickles are almost as polarizing as Trump. People just have strong feelings one way or another about them. They have such an assertive taste profile that it's rare you find people who just think they're OK.

PB said...

Here's what all those liberal tools what Gorsuch to be:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fiRPBCiJg2c

Mark O said...

I have always wanted to be a member of the Drones Club.

Ralph L said...

The only time I could stand even a little pickle was when I was on Prednisone, but then, everything tasted wonderful. I knew it made people hungry, but I didn't know why until then.

Big Mike said...

Alexander said to his hangers-on, "If I were not Alexander, I would want to be Diogenes."

And Diogenes is supposed to have responded "if I were not Diogenes , I would want to be Diogenes."

Bruce Hayden said...

Blogger Meade said...
"Note to younger self of 45 years ago: Live in a tiny house (or a large terra cotta planter), be disagreeable, and eat club sandwiches. You'll become famous!"

Or, you can just marry well, as you seem to have done.

exiledonmainstreet said...

Drago said...
Now that the "smart set" leftists on the east coast have settled on their initial strategy to begin the destruction of Gorsuch"

They can't destroy him though, anymore than they can destroy Thomas. He's not up for election.

The only one who can destroy Gorsuch is Gorsuch if he decides he wishes to be loved by Granny Ginsburg and the liberal elites and "evolves." He doesn't seem like the type.

Bad Lieutenant said...

I love the women in the painting. It think of them as Ruth, Sonia, and Elena.



Why? What did the women in the painting ever do to you, or to the US Constitution?

lgv said...

I was going with the indictable ham sandwich, but Chik-Fil-A it is.

Do you think Posner would have said little in deference to more senior members of the court? The ability to debate and ask questions may not be tied to court seniority. Now, if they had a union, then maybe.

buwaya said...

Diogenes had that Hindu swami thing, which gets them a harem of hippie chicks.

Saint Croix said...

So I google "Diogenes pickles"

and I got this

tcrosse said...

Ruth, Sonya, and Elena

Ignorance is Bliss said...

I advise Neil Gorsuch to bring a sandwich...

Why bring one? Couldn't he just ask Ruth to make him one? Seems like a great way to break the ice.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

Damn, CStanley beat me to it.

Christy said...

So, Mattress Girl is the 21st Century's Diogenes?

CStanley said...

So, Mattress Girl is the 21st Century's Diogenes?

I was thinking of Althouse based on her description of waving a Constitution pamphlet for effect.

Big Mike said...

I find myself objectifying the brunette in back with the parasol. Is that wrong of me?

HoodlumDoodlum said...

Did he mock Alexander, though? He certainly didn't treat him with the expected reverence, but I don't think that's enough to count as mocking. His lack of deference might have been insulting (or seen as insulting) but that's not, itself, mockery in my mind.

I thought the bigger breach of etiquette attributed to Diogenes was his habit of urinating & defecating wherever he liked/happened to be--including in the public places of the city (market, forum, etc). I think he was supposed to have openly masturbated, too, just wherever he wanted to. All of that is flouting the Greek customs and manners so I'd buy that as "mocking" the society at large/its conventions. Possibly he was a time traveler from modern San Francisco just doing what he was used to.

Fun fact: the word cynic is from the greek root for "dog" and Diogenes was described both as living like a dog and as praising dogs for living in a natural way (without people's pretension and artificiality). The technical term for a fear of dogs is cynophobia--I got that one right at trivia last week.

Johnny Sokko said...

It is going to be a wonderful news day when Ted Cruz is nominated by Trump to fill the vacancy on the U.S. Supreme Court left by Ruth Bader Ginsburg.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

Also, isn't Diogenes supposed to have heckled Plato directly--interrupted Plato's lectures, that sort of thing? I mean, lots of the philosophers argued and criticized one another, but Diogenes was notable for actively disrupting a prominent teacher.
Gorsuch has a long way to go if he's to live up to that! Might make it worth putting cameras in the Court if he did, though.

Ann Althouse said...

"Fun fact: the word cynic is from the greek root for "dog" and Diogenes was described both as living like a dog and as praising dogs for living in a natural way (without people's pretension and artificiality)."

OED: "Etymology: < Latin cynicus (perhaps in part through French; compare cinicque , 1521 in Hatzfeld & Darmesteter), < Greek κυνικός dog-like, currish, churlish, Cynic, < κύων , κυνός dog: see -ic suffix.
In the appellation of the Cynic philosophers there was probably an original reference to the κυνόσαργες, a gymnasium where Antisthenes taught; but popular use took it simply in the sense ‘dog-like, currish’, so that κύων ‘dog’ became a nickname for ‘Cynic’."

Hagar said...

To refuse pickles on your hamburger is un-American.
After the second time I was told to leave the establishment for insisting on having the burger replaced with afresh one; not just removing the pickles and leaving the juice, I decided to just accept the burgers and think of something else while eating them.

CStanley said...

LOL, Hagar...just lie back and think of America.

rcocean said...

The painting is Alma-Tadema's "Diogenes Greeted by the Cast of The Mikado".

That is funny, but I like the painting!

Static Ping said...

Yep, Diogenes general philosophy towards philosophy could be pretty much summed up as "I act like a jerk to make other persons uncomfortable." This was sometimes produced profound results and sometimes it produced a combined feces and semen pile that he left in the middle of the road for someone to step in. I do not think Gorsuch would approve.

On the other hand, any pornography cases that come before the court would be more interesting. "I know when it when I see it" gets replaced by "I know it when I see it and let me demonstrate right now!" The bukkake during oral arguments might be a bit much though.

Laslo, sometimes a sandwich is, indeed, a penis. Or a vagina. I suspect it depends on the pickles.

AlbertAnonymous said...

Didn't Toobin also think Thomas was terrible because he DIDN'T ask questions at oral argument?

Should call him "Jeffery Toolin"

traditionalguy said...

The Fake news is spending hundreds of commentary experts' time on whether Tillerson called President Trump a moron. They all agree it is proven because he avoids discussing the subject.And then they go on and on about why Trump has no choice but to fire Tillerson.

Fake News has gone Postal.

traditionalguy said...

Barrels of salt pickled cucumbers is as traditional as food gets. But there are also sweet ones, called bread and butter slices, that are great on hot dogs and sandwiches.

Hagar probably won't eat anchovies either.

exiledonmainstreet said...

I put bread and butter pickles on all my sandwiches. Well, OK, not peanut butter and jelly ones or meatloaf ones. But the others, yes.

Drago said...

Didn't Toobin also think Thomas was terrible because he DIDN'T ask questions at oral argument? Should call him "Jeffery Toolin"

Uh oh.

A certain #CNNStrongDefender is not going to appreciate that comment. Not one bit.

Mr. Fabulous said...

(World Famous Lurker says....)

At restaurants I usually tell the waitron that I'm allergic to pickles and pickle juice, and I could have a seizure. That seems to be more effective than asking for "no pickle please."

Etienne said...

The painting shows the groupies he had...

Gahrie said...

Pickles are almost as polarizing as Trump. People just have strong feelings one way or another about them. They have such an assertive taste profile that it's rare you find people who just think they're OK.

I always ask for extra pickles..onions too.

StephenFearby said...

In the early 1960's I spent a year at Diogenes Station, an Army Security Agency (then a cheap-to-pay military arm of the NSA) in Sinop Turkey. It was in the sticks, but historically interesting. I formed a hypothesis about where the lost tomb of Mithridates might be.

If you got the locals riled by paying too much attention to their women, you were shipped out inside the mail truck back to Ankara. The station has since been closed down and handed over to the Turks.

In 2006, perhaps to attract tourists, the Sinop municipality erected an 18-foot tall statue of Diogenes holding a lantern while standing next to his dog on top of his dwelling barrel. It was placed in a prominent location, the center of the narrowest point of the Sinop Peninsula isthmus.

On August 23, 2017, Breitbart reported:

'A militant Islamist group [the Erbakan Foundation] has demanded Turkey remove a statue of the ancient Greek philosopher Diogenes from a public square in Sinop, arguing that its presence promotes unseemly “Greek ideology.”

The demand follows attacks on multiple memorials to Mustafa Kemal Atatürk, the founder of the secular Republic of Turkey, by Islamists who see his vision as blasphemous to their religion.'

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2017/08/23/turks-demand-removal-ancient-greek-statues/

First statues of Lenin, then Confederate generals, now Greek philosophers.

Anonymous said...

Is that painting by Alma-Tadema? It totally looks like his style.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

Ann Althouse quoted the (unlinkable) OED saying: In the appellation of the Cynic philosophers there was probably an original reference to the κυνόσαργες, a gymnasium where Antisthenes taught;

Thank you for the OED cite and I hope it's not some subtle high-concept dig/gaslighting...'cause made me look it up, and the gymnasium was Cynosarges and that translates to "white dog."

From that Wiki link: Its name was a mystery to the ancients that was explained by a story about a white[2] or swift dog, etymologising the name as Kynos argos, from genitive of kyon (dog) and argos (white, shining or swift). The legend goes that on one occasion when Didymos, an Athenian, was performing a lavish sacrifice, a white (or swift) dog appeared and snatched the offering; Didymos was alarmed, but received an oracular message saying that he should establish a temple to Heracles in the place where the dog dropped the offering.[3]

The Cynosarges was also where the Cynic Antisthenes was said to have lectured, a fact which was offered as one explanation as to how the sect got the name of Cynics.[8]


Wikipedia + OED = learnin'.

Paul said...

Ah... Stoicism! To be a Vulcan!

Alex said...

Gorsuch should instruct Ginsburg to go 'make me a sammich'.

Big Mike said...

The Winterfest in Talkeetna, Alaska, features the Wilderness Woman contest. Women compete by running while hauling buckets of water, they have to snowshoe, haul wood on snowmobiles, and, oh yes, make sandwiches and fetch beer for men. The men attire themselves in waterproof clothing or drape themselves in plastic, as nothing in the rules requires the women to hand the sandwiches and beer to their assigned man.

J Severs said...

He persisted.

JAORE said...

RBG has every right to be upset at this effrontery. It is unconscionable. Tantamount to a terroristic workplace environment.

She should resign in protest with a strongly worded NYT editorial to follow.