July 24, 2017

"Impeachment is an outlet for anger and frustration, which I share, but politics ain't therapy. [The President] would much rather debate impeachment than...."

Just a quote from Barney Frank from 2006 that I happened to run across and thought might be helpful to people these days.

The words at the ellipsis were "the disastrous war in Iraq." The President at the time was, of course, George Bush, and a motion had been filed in the House to investigate and perhaps impeach him.

58 comments:

Sebastian said...

Good one. Shows that it doesn't matter who is GOP president or what he does--mild-mannered, America-as-savior, turn-the-other-cheek W got it from progs just as blustery, America-first, give-no-quarter Trump does, though the insanity syndrome does seem to have gotten worse (i.e., from the prog point of view, better, more calculated, more total, more all-MSM-all-the-time).

eric said...

But this time it's different.

buwaya said...

I suspect one reason Frank was defending Bush (to the degree he was) was that Bush was not opposing the Democratic establishment very much. One must consider the political-economic situation of the time in totality. Frank was an important tool of players in Wall Street, of the policies of Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac, of the speculators in derivatives.

This was a bipartisan consensus indeed, and I don't mean merely the party affiliations of elected officials.

EDH said...

"Impeachment is an outlet for anger and frustration, which I share, but politics ain't therapy. "

In other words, politics ain't no gay bathhouse?

Trumpit said...

That is one reason I didn't vote for Hillary; she voted for that insane war. Bush and Chaney and all the rest should have gone to prison for twenty-five years for their part.

Michael K said...

"Frank was an important tool of players in Wall Street, of the policies of Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac, of the speculators in derivatives."

Frank, along with such sages as Maxine Waters, was pushing the CRA and the Mortgage Backed Securities scam until it collapsed.

Then, after the catastrophe that he had so much to do with, he and Dodd wrote the legislation that was supposed to fix it and which destroyed community banks.

We are heading toward round II with student loans and auto loans.

rehajm said...

Shows that it doesn't matter who is GOP president or what he does...

Yes, even Romney was Hitler to these people. It's frustrating we indulge impeachment fantasies. The GOP weenies in the Senate are easily frightened. Hopefully they'll be back...and in greater numbers.

Michael K said...

"Bush and Chaney and all the rest should have gone to prison for twenty-five years for their part."

More leftist lunacy. In the panic after 9/11, all the lefties voted for the war lest they be exposed as the accessories to bin Laden they were.

I remember Madeline Halfbright being asked why she did nothing about terrorism. She replied that they took terrorism very seriously, They had meetings about it almost every week.

Clinton is the one who should have gone to prison if anyone did.

That's why Disney sat on "The Path to 9/11" all these years. Until Hillary was no longer a serious candidate. You can find the DVD of the miniseries from an obscure source now.

Mike said...

Once or twice a century I find myself in agreement with some small thing a detestable character like Barney "Housing Crisis" Frank says. This is one: "Impeachment is an outlet for anger and frustration, which I share, but politics ain't therapy."

Of course my current anger and frustration at DC isn't the same as his, but the concept holds.

n.n said...

Bush Sr. started the war in Iraq in response to Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. The war was sustained under Clinton. The war ended with Bush Jr. Obama, Clinton et al reopened and progressed the war in Iraq, which metastasized as wars (a.k.a. social justice adventures) in Egypt, Yemen, Somalia, Libya, Syria, Ukraine, etc., and forced catastrophic anthropogenic immigration reform.

Bay Area Guy said...

In Watergate, there was a crime -- a burglary on June 17, 1972.

For the Russian-"Collusion" story, where is the crime?

n.n said...

Mr. Chairman, we do not have a crisis at Freddie Mac, and in particular at Fannie Mae
H.R. 2575—THE SECONDARY
MORTGAGE MARKET ENTERPRISES
REGULATORY IMPROVEMENT ACT
Thursday, September 25, 2003
U.S. House of Representatives,
Committee on Financial Services


It wore a Democratic face and a Republican rump. Or perhaps a Democratic Ass and a Republican tail. Either way, it was bipartisan, but strangely was a consensus only of the Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming kind.

JPS said...

If Trump gets impeached for anything other than some pretty clear-cut malfeasance that even his core supporters can see (even if they defend him of it), expect pretty much every president from here on out to be impeached. Gosh, this is going to be fun....

Nonapod said...

My assumption continues to remain that the Russia story is ultimately a big nothing burger with a side of zilch fries and a large nada soda. It seems highly, highly unlikely that there was ever any real crime committed, but Democrats, the MSM, and the anti-Trumpers have deluded themselves into a weird corner and are willing to triple and quadruple down on this.

But my guess is that if Trump is guilty of any actual crimes, they wouldn't have anything to do with Russia. He was a large commercial real estate developer who built Hotels and Casinos, hardly the most irreproachable industry (what with all the connections to corrupt labor unions and organized crime). If Mueller ferrets out anything that could be considered an impeachable offense it'll have to do with that.

n.n said...

For the Russian-"Collusion" story, where is the crime?

DNC collusion with the post-coup government in Kiev, other foreign and domestic assets, and CAIR policy in order to disenfranchise American citizens.

For their part, WaPo and the NYT thought they could entrap Trump, which would either engender impeachment or force resignation, but Trump is not Nixon, and perhaps with the benefit of hindsight knows that the baby hunt will not end there. So, he has been proactive and confronted the JournoLists of the Fourth Estate and now they are chasing their tails in a twilight haze of confusion. This is uncharted territory for these award-winning masters of manipulation.

Fabi said...

Trump is a novice politician, but this ain't his first rodeo.

Paul from Decatur, GA said...

Oh well, shoe on other foot and all that. Our modern ability to come up with the previous comments by politicians on any subject goes makes the eternal hypocrisy of these folks more evident.

Michael K said...

I cannot think of a Republican president, even including Nixon who withstood a lot, who could take the present insanity as well as Trump has done.

At least since Lincoln.

Paul from Decatur, GA said...

"does" not goes

Michael said...

Michael K: Mortgage backed securities were, and are, a valid investment in a variety of asset classes. In real estate the MBS market got very frothy indeed in the run-up to the collapse but the securities themselves were, and are, in no way a "scam." The problem lay in underwriting bad credits and in accepting non documented incomes and other very dumb lapses in due diligence. The MBS themselves are broken into a number of tranches, meaning that an investor may only own the senior secured debt in a pool whereas another would own a riskier portion etc with as many as five tranches in each pool with each tranche earning a different rate of interest based on the risk of the position. The "scam" would have resided with the rating agencies l who put AAA against piles and piles of junk when only the very most senior pieces of those securities would have been secure. The MBS format is an extremely efficient method of forming capital for the commercial real estate industry.

johns said...

If the media-Democrats were not obsessing about impeachment, what would they be doing? Probably 1) screaming about the slashing of regulations that is ongoing at the EPA and 2) howling that the voter fraud commission is the rebirth of Jim Crow.
Trump is running a fantastic diversion campaign here to keep the heat off of some pretty great projects he has going. I don't know if this is his genius or not, but the fact is that the press portrayal of Jeff Sessions changed from racist outrage to embattled hero in about 30 minutes after Trump criticized him. I imagine that Trump said to Sessions, "Didn't I tell you I could make the press love you?"

Michael K said...

"The problem lay in underwriting bad credits and in accepting non documented incomes and other very dumb lapses in due diligence. "

That was the scam. "Liar loans" and pressure from CRA advocates. Plus the MBS were mis-rated by Moody's and others with ratings for sale.

The tranches were combined.

There is my book review of Nicole Gelinas' book.

Mike Sylwester said...

On Saturday I listened to the entire podcast discussion between Sam Harris and Scott Adams.

Harris impressed me as an intelligent and judicious person, but he really is insane about the RussiaGate nonsense.

One of Harris's absurdities was about NASA announcing that a meteor was approaching the planet Earth. Harris was hysterical that anybody would question NASA's announcement.

Harris thought this was just like anybody questioning the CIA leaks of secret findings about RussiaGate to the mass media.

If the New York Times reports that an unidentified source says the CIA has X information about RussiaGate, then that is the same as NASA reporting about an approaching meteor.

Harris thinks it's intellectually perverse to express any skepticism about the leaks about RussiaGate.

Such thinking is just deranged.

By the way, that podcast was superb.

Nonapod said...

@Mike Sylwester said... Yeah, I kind of guiltily like Sam Harris even though I disagree with him at times, especially when with his appeals to authority. Generally he's extremely articulate and well ordered in his thinking, but he seems to have some weird blind spots.

His podcast with Charles Murray was very good too.

buwaya said...

"On Saturday I listened to the entire podcast discussion between Sam Harris and Scott Adams.
...
By the way, that podcast was superb."

Yes it was indeed. Very rare to see such a direct and revealing confrontation between such able advocates of the current controversy.

Fabi said...

Agreed Nonapod -- his invocation of the "97%" was embarrassing.

Sally said...

If "Bush and Cheney ...should have gone to prison for 25 years" for Iraq II what should LBJ have gotten for Vietnam?

Ralph L said...

Someone should tally and compare the public usage rate of the word "impeach" between 1975 and 1997, and 1998 until now. Of course, there's been at least an order of magnitude more political blather since 1998.

Clinton said repeatedly that the Repubs thought he was illegitimate, which was another lie, since they thought he was unfit, and he knew it.

Ralph L said...

His presidency was illegitimate. His parents' marriage could have been bigamous, but everyone gave him the benefit of the doubt. Obama didn't get that from everyone because his alleged father was foreign.

cubanbob said...

Michael said...
Michael K: Mortgage backed securities were, and are, a valid investment in a variety of asset classes. In real estate the MBS market got very frothy indeed in the run-up to the collapse but the securities themselves were, and are, in no way a "scam." The problem lay in underwriting bad credits and in accepting non documented incomes and other very dumb lapses in due diligence. The MBS themselves are broken into a number of tranches, meaning that an investor may only own the senior secured debt in a pool whereas another would own a riskier portion etc with as many as five tranches in each pool with each tranche earning a different rate of interest based on the risk of the position. The "scam" would have resided with the rating agencies l who put AAA against piles and piles of junk when only the very most senior pieces of those securities would have been secure. The MBS format is an extremely efficient method of forming capital for the commercial real estate industry."

I beg to differ. I bought that paper back then. I didn't care if it stunk or not ( and I knew a lot of it was questionable) because-Surprise!- it was backed by the full faith and credit of The United States. There is your scam. Maybe the government shouldn't be in the mortgage business or at least not privatizing the gain and socializing the risk ( did you forget the Clinton pals and Fanny and Freddie?). Also remember every bank that failed was a regulated bank and the sketchy loans were blessed by the regulators. Indeed when the bank run started I took my cash out of banks where I was above the FDIC and put the cash into banks paying the highest yield as long as the principal and interest were within the FDIC coverage. Clue: a real deposit insurance scheme would charge the depositor and charge based on the risk level of the bank. However the government insurance doesn't work that way so why put money in a bank that offers the lowest rate (because of it's soundness) when you can get more with Uncle Sam making you whole if things get ugly? And if Uncle Sam can't make good on the FDIC insurance coverage, your money becomes instantly worthless so why worry?

cubanbob said...

Trumpit said...
That is one reason I didn't vote for Hillary; she voted for that insane war. Bush and Chaney and all the rest should have gone to prison for twenty-five years for their part."

Hmm Obama allowed Hillary to run an illegal enterprise for four years. Lets see, she has at least thirty thousand counts of obstruction of justice among other counts and Obama is an accessory so between the two them they have at least Twenty Thousand Years In Sing-Sing. Let's not forget Bill as he is neck deep in obstruction of justice with his Tom Hayden act at Phoenix airport and then there is Jim Comey, Loretta Lynch, Lois Lerner and the cast of criminals. Just to put the Obama Admin people in prison would require a federal prison just for them.

Now how fast would Russia disappear if Sessions actually did his job and appointed special prosecutors to investigate the crimes of the Obama Administration?

megapotamus said...

There is one simple fact, easily adduced, that should at least bring some necessary perspective to the would-be impeachers. It is this: The Trumpies will stick to Trump like the Democrats would stick to Hillary, Obama, Bill, Kerry, a Kennedy... You get the idea. So if you wonder, just what will it take to blast the shiny off of DTotUS? Consult the many crimes and malefactions of these villains. It will have to be bigger than that.

Kevin said...

Now how fast would Russia disappear if Sessions actually did his job and appointed special prosecutors to investigate the crimes of the Obama Administration?

Jason Chaffetz agrees:

“Republicans need to get a backbone,” Chaffetz said. “Every time the Democrats say they need to call up Jared Kushner or Don Jr. — call up Chelsea Clinton, call up the Clintons.”

h said...

Impeachment (and subsequent removal from office) is a political decision, not a legal proceeding. "High crimes and misdemeanors" has no precise legal meaning. A president can be removed because he plays golf too often, because his birth certificate has not been publicly released, because his policies are too pro-RUssian, or not pro-RUssian enough. THe constraint on congress that keeps congress from impeaching for trivial or doubtful reasons is not a legal constraint -- the Supreme COurt would never agree to rule on a suit that an impeachment was improper -- the constraint is a political constraint -- fear that the voters will punish as they did to a degree after the Clinton impeachment. So in this context, Barney Frank's comment is perfectly coherent and reasonable.

Unknown said...

Putin put the RU into T...RU...MP

Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...

Impeach Barney. over and over. He's a living economic wrecking ball.

FullMoon said...

Unknown said...

Putin put the RU into T...RU...MP
7/24/17, 5:33 PM


We will get to that in a minute. What is important now is that head of Fusion GPS is afraid to discuss his dealings with Russia. Will take fifth if called to testify.

gadfly said...

In defense of the Bill Clinton during impeachment hearings at the House Judiciary Committee hearings, Frank characterized the proceedings against the president as an issue of "what did he touch and when did he touch it?"

Lets hear it for My Boy Lollipop!

Unknown said...

How interesting. This attitude will make impeachment easier.


"The Washington Examiner reported that Paul Ryan spoke to Wisconsin-based radio host, Jay Weber on Monday and defended the witch hunt by Mueller, saying, “Remember, Bob Mueller is a Republican who was appointed by a Republican who served in the Republican administration who crossed over and stayed on ’til his term ended.”

“I don’t think many people are saying Bob Mueller is a biased partisan. He’s really, sort of, anything but,” Ryan continued.

“The point is we have an investigation in the House, an investigation in the Senate and a special counsel, which sort of de-politicizes this stuff and gets it out of the political theater, and that is, I think, better to get this off to the side,” Ryan said. “I think the facts will vindicate themselves, and then let’s just go do our jobs.”"

Ralph L said...

Lawrence Walsh was a Republican too.

buwaya said...

Paul Ryan is a weasel.

He signed off on this -
https://www.wsj.com/articles/welcome-to-the-world-of-pension-smoothing-1407800119

FullMoon said...

Unknown said...

How interesting. This attitude will make impeachment easier.


Yes. But let's remember Trump is responsible for our new Supreme Court judge, as well as ending "catch and release" policy. And , of course,signing forty new bills into law.

FullMoon said...

Ralph L said...

Lawrence Walsh was a Republican too.

7/24/17, 6:01 PM


So was Joe Scarbourough

Unknown said...

USA Today Poll

"Nearly half, 46%, say Trump isn't likely to complete his first term, for whatever reason. Only about one in four, 27%, express confidence he'll serve all four years of his term. Even one in 10 Republicans doubt he'll finish his tenure."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/07/24/impeach-donald-trump-poll-americans-split-remove-president/501871001/

FullMoon said...

Unknown said...

USA Today Poll

We will get to that later.
What is important now is Debbi Schultz' computer is being searched for connections to Russian espionage agents.

Unknown said...

"We will get to that later."

Don't bother, I've said what I want to say.

Michael said...

Let's say for argument's sake that 99.999% of people polled thought that Trump would not last the first year. That factoid and $6 will get you a Grande Latte.

Michael K said...

“I think the facts will vindicate themselves, and then let’s just go do our jobs.”"

If only Ryan WOULD do his job, things would be easier. He is a squish and the GOPe might have a few primaries to think about by next January,

I think somebody needs to get into that Pakistani family and the DNC IT disaster.

FullMoon said...

Unknown said...

"We will get to that later."

Don't bother, I've said what I want to say.

7/24/17, 6:35 PM


Of course, but more importantly is that Kamala Harris was not present at the Dem relaunch today.

Michael said...

cubabob: Not sure what kind of paper you were buying but CMBS paper has no government guarantees attached to those securities. Private investors do not participate in this market except through bond funds or retirement accounts so it is unlikely you invested in the MBS market at the private level. If so I would be curious to know the tranches you picked. The senior secured were generally not wiped out even in the riskiest pools.

Khesanh 0802 said...

@Sally 3:40. Boy, talk about a bullseye! Lyndon and his bosom buddy McNamara are two of the biggest "war criminals" that this country has produced. I have had a hate on for those two since well before I visited sunny SE Asia. H. R. McMaster (currently Trump's national security adviser) offers a frightening expose of the utter treachery and failure of Johnson and McNamara in his book "Dereliction of Duty". Along the way he indicts the Joint Chiefs for their cowardice as well. I sent my copy to my son who is also a former Marine. He called me after reading most of it and asked me why "they" hadn't just taken all those people out and shot them.. I didn't have much of answer other than to say it sounded like he now understood why I had been pissed off about Johnson and his "Best and Brightest" for so long.

Khesanh 0802 said...

I am a little late on this thread, but if no one has mentioned Michael Lewis' "The Big Short" then I must. If you want a view of what was going on prior to the "housing finance crisis" he does a great job of indicting all the right villains.

Brian McKim and Traci Skene said...

"Helpful?" Since when is pointing out blatant hypocrisy and selective amnesia helpful?

Michael K said...

"he does a great job of indicting all the right villains."

Yes but Nicole Gelinas book is also excellent and has more history.

Khesanh 0802 said...

@Michael k I have put Gelinas' book on my list for "winter" reading. Thanks.

HoodlumDoodlum said...

It's not over until we win, say the Dems. I take them at their word.

The Dems'll impeach ya' any time they have a chance. It's beyond silly to think they have any allegiance to a higher code or principle.
I don't know that the Repubs are much better, but they haven't, in the past, been as quick to toss off all norms the moment they became inconvenient. I guess we'll see, next time it matters.

Achilles said...

Health Care? Tax Reform? Regulatory Reform? He doesn't even try to do his part. It is clear he has no intention of doing any of the things he promises to do. His job is to trick republican voters into thinking they are voting for people who will do what they want done and betray us once he gets to DC.

Paul Ryan wants Trump out just as badly as the democrats because he wants to go back to passing democrat budgets outside of regular order by voice vote.

Paul Ryan is a traitor.

Guildofcannonballs said...

The House passed a health care bill.

Ryan is still a perfect D.C. shitstain though.