The other night we watched this show "Objectified," where the host Harvey Levin interviewed Donald Trump. I don't know if this is a regular show, but the idea is for the interviewee to show various objects in his home and through these objects for us to learn something about the person. Levin isn't really a very good interviewer, and nearly all of the objects were photographs, awards, letters, and invitations, so I'm not recommending this as a show with any real vitality to it. But I was interested in getting a different angle on Trump, and for that, it was okay. You can watch the whole show here. I just wanted to focus on the segment about Trump's attitude toward drinking, which arises out of his experience with his beloved older brother Freddy, who became a hopeless alcoholic and died at the age of 43:
What particularly struck me was a scene described by Levin. Once — we're not told exactly when — Ivanka told her father she was going out with some of her friends and Trump — in front of some person who related the story to Levin — gave her "a speech... and the speech was 'I don't want you to drink, boys will take advantage of you...."
Boys will take advantage of you.... That sounds like the kind of thing young women are offended to be told these days. But maybe fathers (and mothers) still say things like this to their daughters. (I say "still" even though I never heard such warnings from my parents. I just imagine that's what other people's parents must have said in the old days.)
The segment ends when Levin asks Trump if it's hard for him to talk about his brother's alcohol problem, and Trump imagines "somebody's out there" hearing him — maybe only one person — who will change what they are doing because of him — "and there's something really cool about that."
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"Boys will take advantage of you.... That sounds like the kind of thing young women are offended to be told these days."
But they have no problem with "boys take advantage of us." It's the underlying assumption of the campus "rape" wars, which posits healthy young women as unable to protect themselves when they consume alcohol, therefore transferring responsibility for drunken sex to the male.
The Donald knew her mother.
My impression is that many fathers ouldn't say this to their daughters because it would make them sound too much like an adult. If you want to stay forever young, being uncool is a bigger obstacle than any feminist dogma.
We tell them never let their drinks out of their sight, and if they lose track of it for even a second, dump it. We will pay to replace it. Shit goes on these days, roofies and whatnot.
It's a true fact that until you know a boy and he earns your trust, he is a potential rapist, and you should be on your guard. Sorry if that offends some of you.
Women today have no problem with the idea that boys and men will try to take advantage of them.
They merely have a problem with the idea that their (women) behavior should reflect that fact.
Gee, maybe their fathers (or someone) should have told today's college women "you know, maybe you shouldn't get all drunked up and go upstairs with some guy you barely know and take off your clothes; maybe he'll get the wrong idea somehow..." But that would involve individual responsibility for one's own well-being, which even to suggest is now apparently offensive.
I think there is a genetic component to alcoholism and if it runs in the family it is best not to drink. One of the girls I knew in high school went to college and her freshman year roommate went from never had a drink to full blown alcoholic in the space of a week. It ran in the family.
It's good advice though perhaps too specific. People take advantage of drunk people in general.
Trump is uninteresting. The less I find out, the better.
Excellent piece on alcoholism and alcohol. I did not know that. Now, if he only had a solution for cookie eating.
Or groping women.
I know, I repeat myself but: If a girl gets drunk at a frat party and wakes up in some guy's bed with evidence of sexual contact that she doesn't seem to remember, it is her own bloody fault. If a woman wants to be respected, she might consider acting respectably.
"Women today have no problem with the idea that boys and men will try to take advantage of them." Except after the fact, when regret turns into men taking advantage.
So did your parents want boys to take advantage of you, Althouse? Or had they figured out that you had figured it out for yourself?
Actually, it works in both directions. Girls have been known to take advantage of boys.
And alcohol is a drug that has different effects on different people, so there very definitely is a genetic component.
Sure is tough, coming up with topics, after the election, where one can only wiggle for "it's a shame, we'll get 'em next time, the arc of history is on our side. World Government.
Sad.
It's amazing how stupid the Left has become on basic issues: the whole point of getting girls drunk or high was to loosen inhibitions.
I'm not endorsing that, by the way. And since I have a daughter, I often remind her to, Yes, have fun, but don't be reckless or clueless, and look out for your friends (while they look out for you).
Simple common sense.
"I don't want you to drink, boys will take advantage of you...."
That goes well with this recent comment to a Rolling Stone reporter: "Yeah, she's really something, and what a beauty, that one. If I weren't happily married and, ya know, her father . . . "
"If Ivanka weren't my daughter, perhaps I'd be dating her," Trump cracked in a now-infamous 2006 interview with "The View."
Trump was talking to Howard Stern on air about his daughter, who was then 23 years old, in a 2004 interview, as reported by CNN:
“By the way, your daughter,” Stern said to Trump.
“She’s beautiful,” the brash businessman responded.
“Can I say this? A piece of ass,” Stern asked.
“Yeah,” Trump replied.
Ivanka discussed her father’s lewd "Access Hollywood" comments . . . at Fortune’s Most Powerful Women Summit, calling them “jarring” because they did not contain “language consistent with any conversation I've ever had with him, certainly, or any conversation I've overheard.”
But like father like daughter, Ivanka while discussing never having seen an uncircumcised cock, casually added,"I've never seen a mulatto cock, but I'd like to!" https://t.co/WrgCoM0MGK
"the whole point of getting girls drunk or high was to loosen inhibitions." Pretty much the whole point of getting girls to listen to rock music too.
Well, just let your minds go nuts.
.
.
.
Nuts?
.
.
.
"Let me tell you 'bout the birds and the bees and the flowers and the trees and the moon up above...
and a thing called love."
When I look into your big brown eyes, it's so very plain to see...
gadfly continues its descent.
"So did your parents want boys to take advantage of you, Althouse? Or had they figured out that you had figured it out for yourself?"
They expected me to figure things out for myself.
With a strong paternal interest in the welfare of our female Posterity, and no pornographic magazines left on the coffee table, women rose to great pedestals in our society. Perhaps the expectation and pressure of striving for a moral life were too great for girls and boys.
I wonder how any equivalent conversations with Donald Jr and Eric went. Suspect he's never had an advice-giving conversation with Tiffany.
Hi! It's early! Weigh in on this Important topic!
Kardashian comments will blow you away!
Obama says it's all bullshit!
Trump kills everything!
Yadda, Yadda, Yadda,
well, TP has not yet let loose its "t.p."s. ...Yet.
Remember the old saying: Candy is dandy but liquor is quicker.
HILLARY CLINTON WILL NEVER BE PRESIDENT
Conversation with my 22 year old daughter a few years back: "You can't tell me what to do. I might not be making a mistake."
Follow up conversation in the ER 3½ weeks ago: "I should have listened to you." Older guy, never married, series of girlfriends, no car, and just above minimum wage job. It didn't end well, and statistics said it wasn't going to.
Four sons, they all listened to the important life lessons. One daughter, not so much. She listened to her teachers who told her she was empowered and should do what she wants.
Hello darlin'. May we be forever grateful to our fabulous, fabulous friends who made it possible, as well as the millions of "normals" out there that didn't see the way to subjugation. XOXOXO
Sorry Charlie. I have two daughters---now in their 40s--but when they were teenagers, their boyfriends were damned well terrified of me. That's the way it should be.
And when their eventual husbands came to me and told me of their intention to marry my daughter(s) they were quaking in their boots as well. Took them months to get up the cojones to do that.
Any of you other fathers out there have a problem with that? I don't think so.
That is, good evening, sprite.
There's a streak of alcoholism in my family that's wide and deep. When I was younger, I drank heavily, and I've had my share of sour experiences. I have the genes, the exposure and have had the triggering events, but I didn't end up as an alcoholic. Go figure.
Well, I'm in my 50s, and certainly adults told us things like this when we were young. Not just parents - also teachers.
Also guys in groups, etc.
Any parent who loves their teen (male or female) should speak realistically to that teen.
Trump also spoke about one of his sons (I forget which) having developed a drinking problem some years ago. I presume he solved the problem by never taking another drink. I've never known anyone who became smarter, wealthier, healthier, or more attractive by drinking. Mostly, it just makes people more stupid, poor, ill, and ugly. And also maudlin and forgetful while losing a sense of appropriate social boundaries.
That's what I taught my daughter. But she's always been pretty smart. I think she would've looked around and figured it out on her own anyway.
For a law prof you sure watch a lot of rubbishy TV, Althouse. Not that there's much good stuff to choose from.
hahahah, yes!
Blogger Jon Ericson said...
HILLARY CLINTON WILL NEVER BE PRESIDENT
Blogger Jon Ericson said...
Hello darlin'. May we be forever grateful to our fabulous, fabulous friends who made it possible, as well as the millions of "normals" out there that didn't see the way to subjugation. XOXOXO
what Jon ericson says, I will drink to that, Clink!
hip hip hooray and
godspeed, america
I got that same lecture many times from my father. I rolled my eyes and sighed - but he was right.
I didn't find that interview to be all that interesting, because Trump is not an articulate man. He says his parents were terrific and Fred was terrific and Melania is terrific and the kids are terrific - but you still don't know much about them or have any sense of their personalities, really. No good stories about them, almost no descriptions of their quirks or interests. His mother sounds like an interesting woman - or her life story does. An immigrant from a rather bleak and isolated part of Scotland ended up marrying a successful business man and raising a large family. How did she meet Trump's father? Was he wealthy when they met or did that come later? The only glimpse of her personality we see is that she loved the Queen and the pomp and ceremony of the British royal family.
His mother reportedly spoiled Trump. Would threaten to "get the wooden spoon" but never hit him with it. His father was "firm but had a big heart". Best decision they made for him was sending him to military school.
Trump has a good heart and is well intentioned. People need to understand that about him.
Well cf, thanks mightily.
Like Germans & Scots are folks that publicly share intimate personal details about their families. If Trump was Italian & Irish it would be different.
Apparently his eldest son had a drinking problem, this is what Miami-based DJ Scott Melker said about his time spent at the University of Pennsylvania with none other than Donald Trump Jr.
https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/u6tscwklh9s3684gimgq.jpg
Comments on the facebook post about times shared with Trump Jr are also interesting.
"I was at Penn at the same time as Melker. Donnie was indeed a sad sack of a human being who peed everywhere and assaulted everyone. He belonged to the most rape-y of rape-y fraternities and comfortably communicated with his asshat brothers in the misogynist language of his father and...he just sucked. He really did have a terrible drinking problem which, impressively, he seems to have resolved. Whether or not he was a good person perverted by his father, I don’t know. But his soul was obviously damaged and it was hard to be around him because he was so angry and disgusting and dark and entitled. My memories of him are very sad. He was all that is/was wrong about everything."
Amanda:
Very nice.
Keep up the good work.
There's a place for you.
Thanks, Geo. S
readering said...
I wonder how any equivalent conversations with Donald Jr and Eric went. Suspect he's never had an advice-giving conversation with Tiffany.
It is funny watching you people prance about as if you actually care, have any intellectual honesty, or give a shit.
Amanda keeps it classy. She was probably one of the Trig Palin truthers. Seriously there are no depths these people will not sink to.
It needs to be remembered that Amanda supported a rapist and the enabler that attacked and harassed his victims. These are terrible people and they should be shunned and ridiculed.
Amanda: Student Brain or Not?
UW?
Law?
Heh.
It is very weird to me how people on the right are so easy giving out the accolades to Donald Trump about well his children turned out. From what I've seen, the boys are less than spectacular and with Ivanka, one could naturally make the assumption she turned out half way normal only because Trump did not raise her. And if you ask me, probably goes some ways towards explaining his unbridled attraction towards his own daughter, the reason being why the incest taboo is not there for him because of the distance. And I don't mean "my daughter is so beautiful" because he has literally never said anything so pleasant as that, it is very weird.
Anyways, why is it that CEO who never see's his kids is a role model but a man on welfare who never see's his kids is a dead beat? so much for a child needs a mother and a father ah. Althouse, you are telling me that hypocrisy doesn't bother you? knowing how hard women work to bring up children and here is a man taking credit he doesn't deserve?
Woah! this is some loose shit!
You go girl!
@Birkel said...
gadfly continues its descent.
Gosh Birkel, you certainly have a strange way of attacking the messenger. Everything I posted came directly from the mouths of the elitist Trump family - which I suppose, in your fractured mind, makes it godlike and above reproach.
And just so you know, my ancestors were English.
@David Begley said...
Trump has a good heart and is well intentioned [sic]. People need to understand that about him.
I am indeed honored to correspond with a close friend of Donald Trump who has spent time conversing with the Donald. How else would you know so much about Trump's personal feelings?
That stuff that Amanda posted about how Trump slapped Donald, Jr (the family drunk as was his Uncle Fred) in front of God and everyone in the UPenn dorm - that had to be a lie, I guess.
Did dunderhead Amanda and the hypocrite gadfly ever hold the Clintons to the same standard? Everyone knows what an impeccable family life they had. Thus the rumors that Chelsea is really Webb Hubbell's spawn.
And Amanda loves a woman who covered for a man who held a woman down, raped her, bit her lip so hard she bled and then told her to "put some ice on it." Juanita Wright cried tears of joy on election night because she was so relieved that the enabler of her rapist would never be in the WH. In the meantime, Amanda, who had been so arrogant and snide and sure that her favorite bitch would be coronation, cried and ate 2 pints of Ben and Jerrys.
Amanda wouldn't listen to the women who accused the Clintons. Gadfly didn't give a shit about the emails and the moral corruption they exposed. But we're now supposed to listen to Gawker and some character called "Don Melker."
Nah. I'd rather remind both of you of one glorious, beautiful fact:
HILLARY CLINTON WILL NEVER BE PRESIDENT.
Let me repeat that:
HILLARY CLINTON WILL NEVER BE PRESIDENT.
And there is nothing, nothing at all you can do about that, except throw your pathetic little spitballs.
BTW, word's out that the old bitch couldn't come out and address her followers on Election night because she had drunkenly physically attacked Podesta and Mook before being sedated.
Amanda can't you just imagine the crone raging and staggering drunkenly around before collapsing in sobs? (Which is probably what you were doing too at the same time.) Now there's a strong woman! Can't even keep it together to address a crowd that had worked hard for her. Boy, she'd be just great in a crisis situation. No, wait, we know she already sucks in crisis situations.
At least now we don't have to worry about the CoC being drunk and passed out when that 3 am call comes in.
HILLARY CLINTON WILL NEVER BE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
Jon, exiled et al,
Please give the two-legged bag of shit, gadfly, and the whatever she is, Amanda, a break. They are in mourning.
Why just think, if this vital information had only been plastered on every forum, it might have made the difference and got Mrs. Rapist elected!
Gadfly, I hope Trump cheated you good. I hope the financial loss hurt you and your family. I hope you sleep in a burnt-out Plymouth.
Amanda, you remind me of Biden, treated so much more respectfully. Was his cokehead reckless driver kid the one who died, or was it the other one?
Why did you hold back? WHY??? A grieving nation wants to know.
If I had you two in front of me I wouldn't kick you. My shoes don't deserve it.
It is very weird to me how people on the right are so easy giving out the accolades to Donald Trump about well his children turned out. From what I've seen, the boys are less than spectacular and with Ivanka, one could naturally make the assumption she turned out half way normal only because Trump did not raise her.
At least one of Obama's daughters is a pothead and Clinton's daughter is a greedy little princess with no discernible skills.
It's not like they didn't use their families as benefits in their campaigns, so fair is fair, right?
Anyways, why is it that CEO who never see's his kids is a role model but a man on welfare who never see's his kids is a dead beat?
Who is viewed as such? Do you think social activists see their kids much?
That was an outstanding interview. Fox needs to hire Levin to do more of this. Harvey has figured out how to give audiences what they want. His TMZ show and app are catnip for a certain kind of person. My wife got me hooked on TMZ because it is one of the funniest shows on TV by virtue of the (anonymous?) voice-over/narrator for the show. It's hard to describe but the show works because Harvey plays to the celeb-obsessed (which describes a good deal of his employees) yet the cast and crew make fun of each other and Harvey mercilessly.
Anyway, because Harvey has figured out with his TMZ main show, the live afternoon show, the tour of Hollywood etc., how to give viewers what they want. What we really needed was an old fashioned apolitical look at the president-elect with no agenda or ugly gotcha lurking in it and Harvey gave it to us.
I wonder if he did one with Hillary, since this was pre-recorded in September. Would she have given Levin the same access and been as open as Trump? Very interesting. Thoroughly enjoyed every moment, even the out-takes at the end. Trump comes off as supremely likable and human, everything the MSM has been obscuring and trying to supplant with Monster Trump for 16 months now. When he say, "I was lucky because I was just playing myself," it made me exclaim to my wife, "Hillary can't say that."
A moment that happened more than once in this fine interview.
This is why Trump connected with the white working class. Everyone has a drunk in the family.
Amanda said...
It is very weird to me how people on the right are so easy giving out the accolades to Donald Trump about well his children turned out.
Weird that you missed that being the one nice thing HRC could think of to say about Trump at the debate, that he had wonderful children. OR WAS SHE LYING?!?!?
Or of course she could have just been wrong. Don was wrong about her being a fighter and not a quitter, after all. Apparently she's more of a Shikker and an abuser of subordinates, as CNN could tell us from election night if only they hadn't flushed their souls down a toilet.
They owe us her pain. CNN owes it to the nation to show us Hillary Clinton melting when the water from Pennsylvania was thrown upon her. To let us see the bullet we dodged in rejecting her and all her works. God bless Pennsylvania! Or whatever was the deciding, "Steiner couldn't make the attack," Untergang Downfall state of 2016.
I explained to my daughter that the smart boys would listen to her talk for three hours until she ran out of things to say and then expect sex just to continue giving their attention to her. (An idea promulgated by Cardinal Richelieu, in a book of his epigrams.)
Her older brother told her, in even more explicit terms, the sort of things boys do to take advantage of girls.
I like the guy she brought home for us to meet. Trump would probably like him, too.
Hillary deplores us all. And I am OK with that.
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