1. We heard that statement from Dr. Lisa Bardack, "who examined her at her home in Chappaqua." Bardack said, "On Friday, during follow up evaluation of her prolonged cough, she was diagnosed with pneumonia." I can't tell from that whether Bardack is the one who did the examination on Friday and gave the diagnosis of pneumonia. Perhaps Bardack is cagily relating what some other doctor saw fit to say to Clinton, and Bardack herself does not believe that is the correct diagnosis. I'm assuming Bardack will not lie, which is why I'm noticing the particular words and the distance Bardack has taken from that diagnosis.
2. Bardack also said, after Clinton's collapse yesterday at the 9/11 event, that "she became overheated and dehydrated," and "she is now re-hydrated and recovering nicely." This seems like a separate diagnosis apart from the diagnosed-on-Friday pneumonia, or is that supposed to be a consequence of the pneumonia? Bardack does seem to be attaching her reputation to the assertion that Hillary "became overheated and dehydrated," but that's just a statement of the symptoms, not why they happened. It wasn't a hot day, but Hillary might have become hot because of the bright sun and her heavy clothing. I just can't tell from Bardack's statement whether there is some underlying medical problem that would lead to overheating. What's the diagnosis, the reason for overheating? I don't think Bardack said anything that even purports to be an answer to that question.
3. NBC — the news site at the link above — has a health news reporter explaining the concept of "walking pneumonia" — "patients don't feel great, but they're not sick enough to stay home in bed or to be hospitalized.... Pneumonia can be caused by viruses or bacteria [or fungi], and it refers to an infection that gets into the lungs. Bacterial pneumonia is common, usually not serious and easily treated with antibiotics." Since Bardack told us that Hillary Clinton "was put on antibiotics," it might mean that the diagnosis was bacterial pneumonia, but it might mean that antibiotics were given because they'd work if it's bacterial, and it might be bacterial, so try antibiotics because they might work. If not, we know it's viral... or fungal... or bacteria that didn't respond to that antibiotic... I don't know.
4. "Walking pneumonia" is not a technical term, and it seems particularly infelicitous when Hillary quite conspicuously could not walk.
5. I think it's fair to say that the Clinton campaign has been withholding information about Hillary's health and that it intends to continue to withhold as much as it can. The Bardack statement seems only to push us back in a hope that we will not ask for more, and that came only after a very dramatic, impossible-to-ignore video of Hillary collapsing.
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Words were spoken. The passive voice was used.
Well, she got her head bobbing under control. But when her knees buckled as she fainted, her head remained rigidly in place and her shoulders square as a scarecrow, and something metal fell out of her clothes.
Her first instinct of course was to lie about the pneumonia and assure us that it was only "allergies." Nothing new there. Hillary does not trust the American people with information, which is why she wants the wings clipped on the first amendment, and why she demanded complete control over her documents as Secretary of State.
"Pneumonia"
That's the thing. We can't trust a thing the Clintons say.
Althouse has to deconstruct and parse every word.
There are indeed lots of varieties of pneumonia. The once common bacterial pneumonias are now much less so thanks to pneumococcal vaccine. All the rest is a mixed bag. Viral, fungal, autoimmune. They range from trivial (sure have seen plenty of folks with a cold who insist it is a touch of pneumonia and demand antibiotics) to dire. The real issue is whether it is part of a bigger problem.
I will start by giving a hint of credence to dehydration. She was probably overdressed and for all we know wears some kind of bullet proof garb under the suit. And dropping a couple of bags of IV fluid into somebody is about the only way to go from blegghh to upright in a short time.
But was she dehydrated in February when she had to be helped up the steps? And when she got the concussion in 2011? And didn't she fall and break her elbow in 2008? Something is wrong with this patient.
I can't emphasize enough that falling while on blood thinners, which is grudgingly admitted now, is perilous. One slightly less alert Secret Service agent yesterday and she face plants and has a brain bleed.
HRC should step aside. Those of us who indeed find Trump-if not his supporters- deplorable
would breathe a huge sigh of relief. And the country would be better off.
Tacitus
Pneumonia is handy because it covers the coughing she hasn't been doing, which were due to Donald Trump if you were conspiratorial enough to notice them.
But why the "she was overheated" if they aren't going to take off her heavy jacket and give her some water?
Why the walk of health out of Chelsea's apartment if she knew she had pneumonia?
"a very dramatic, impossible to ignore video of Hillary collapsing."
A quick skim of the news this morning shows the usual suspects ignoring it nicely, thank you very much.
She slipped the press and was gone for 90 minutes before the campaign even admitted she had left the ceremony.
Also, they drive her around in a big handicap van, rather than an SUV or a limo.
This is not the first time Hillary was unable to walk on her own. There was another vidoe of her stumbling and then being carried or assisted up a short flight of steps to a house front porch several weeks back.
Hillary looks as big as a house herself, and is probably in terrible physical condition, the results of being treated like the Queen of America, not being expected to walk anything but short distances to her illegally parked limos, etc, talk of "yoga" notwithstanding. However, the video from Manhattan sure looked like Parkinson's or MS to anyone famliar with that. Her feet just would not go where he knees were pointing, because she was unable to lift them. The follow-up video in front of Chelsea's building made her look stiff and unsteady, afraid to actually move much. And especially those suffering from MS are sensitive to overheating, which can cause symptoms as displayed yesterday.
And I don't think a personal doctor would necessarily avoid lying - sorry, prevaricating or withholding - about Hillary's condition, considering the consequences of a serious condition and the politics, especially since a personal doctor is likely to share a philosophy and a relationship with the candidate.
A suggestion by an internal med MD, that Hillary suffers from aspiration pneumonia due to a neurological disorder like Parkinson's.
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2016/09/rockin-pneumonia-a-unifying-diagnosis.php
OK to post a link to another site here?
Walking pneumonia does not make your legs not work. She could not walk. Period.
And it was in the low 80's. Overheating is not the cause, either.
She has a medical guy who is always there to "treat" whatever issues she has at all events.
Well, she got her head bobbing under control. But when her knees buckled as she fainted, her head remained rigidly in place and her shoulders square as a scarecrow, and something metal fell out of her clothes.
It went beyond knees. She couldn't move her legs. Her feet weren't moving. That isn't being overheated. That isn't pneumonia.
I think you have it right Althouse...the doctors lies are lies of omission. You must know however that the doctor can reveal only what the patient allows.
Best comment so far: "The last time something that big and puffy collapsed it was the Hindenburg."
Pneumonia responds to antibiotics and bed rest under a hospital oxygen tent. You are well in a three weeks.
But this is a cover up of Parkinson's disease which is permanent brain damage/death to that part of the brain which secrets the chemical that gives the coordination of muscle movements. It is treated with a carefully monitored dose of Levadopa. For example, Michael J. Fox seems normal until he goes off his meds.
Aspiration pneumonia is common symptom of advanced Parkinson's because of a lack of swallowing coordination. And the side effects of long term Levadopa therapy are the list of Hillary's evident symptoms: She cannot endure stress. She freezes up from flashing lights. And she is likely to disappear for 3 days at a time.
The Dems will replace her soon.
Drudge headline, "Will she survive? " with link to NBC report.
Now, it'd be wise for Trump to release his medical records so "The American people can be assured that their future President is in good health and isn't hiding anything".
President Reagan, shot in the lung, walked into the emergency room.
I just watched Kellyanne Conway on Morning Joe. Some of the Morning Joes tried to bulldoze her but she doesn’t bulldoze very well. Conway says Trump will release his medical records(derived from a recent checkup) next week.
When they DEMANDED to know why Trump hasn’t released his tax returns she told them that Trump was wisely following his lawyers’ advice – which was not to release his tax records until after the IRS audit Trump has been under for months is over – and THAT was the end of their curiosity.
One of the reasons that they might have been so quick to drop the subject is that they did not want to get into the strange fact that Trump has been audited by the IRS for several years in a row. That seems excessive, even for a billionaire real estate magnate and I’m sure they would not want to cause any sympathy to come Trump’s way for being harassed by an out of control federal agency that has the power to ruin us lesser beings.
Of course the Morning Joes want Trump to release his returns before the audit is over. That would mean that 10,000 progressive, Democrat, elitist anti-Trump tax lawyers could give tips to the IRS auditors. They could crowd-source it. And they could then indulge in one of their favorite tactics which is to take the normal and ordinary and turn it into something they can make out to be ominous: “Did you hear? Trump took DEDUCTIONS, that right, you heard me right – Donald Trump actually took DEDUCTIONS.” The GALL, the pure EFFRONTERY of the man!”
This is what they are. This is what they do.
One of Trump’s best decisions was getting rid of Manafort and putting Conway in charge.
One of my inspectors once collapsed on the job. The Contractor's people thought he was having a heart attack and drove him to the ER, where he was diagnosed with potassium deficiency, given a potassium injection, and advised to eat a couple of bananas a day. So they drove him home and stopped by the supemarket on the way. The next day Harold was back on the job just fine, just a bit embarrassed about causing so much commotion.
Where in the hell is Bill? Surely, someone from Hillary's group has Bill's girlfriends telephone number.
There is nothing definite to be learned from tax returns, though they can be mined for things to make dark innuendos about.
"I think it's fair to say that the Clinton campaign has been withholding information about Hillary's health and that it intends to continue to withhold as much as it can." Goodness, you had to go all Derrida on us to reach that point? Better to work from first principles, following the General Field Theory of Clintonicity, according to which it's fair to say that the Clintons aways withhold information about anything Hill does, feels, says, or thinks, and intend to continue to withhold as much as they can.
What a pathetic candidate. Yet people support her. I shake my head in wonder.
Comrade Clinton is just a little under the weather, advises the Politburo.
BTW, if you believe Hillary is going to release her medical records you are being naive. Bits and pieces, incomplete yet filled with irrelevant detail, are all we are likely to get. I would not trust anything she volunteers.
Either Hillary is just having bad luck with her health (another similarity to Nixon--remember when he banged his knee on a car door in 1960, it got infected, and screwed up his first televised debate?), or there's something more serious going on with her and her need for constant secrecy keep this all under cover until now.
You bought it, Dems! Could have nominated anyone, but went with this scandal-plagued and possibly health-challenged lady. Now you run the risk of her bailing out at the last minute.
Which actually might be a plus for her campaign. I think Kaine would be a stronger candidate.
grackle said, "One of Trump’s best decisions was getting rid of Manafort and putting Conway in charge."
That seems correct. I saw Manafort interviewed a couple of times while Trump was in the gaffe wilderness, and Manafort comes across as a buffoon. Conway, in interviews, comes across as a sincere and sharp leader, and the change in Trump's public persona and in his poll numbers started the the day she took over the campaign. We'll probably see a lot of her in the future, no matter who wins the election.
The doctor's statement sounds like the regular way doctors like to write their reports.
She's got pneumonia and is gonna go hang out with her seven week old grandson?
How is she going to get through the debates? They have to be hoping that they get lucky.
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/09/does_hillary_have_parkinsons_disease.html
Hagar - what happened to your inspector is a reasonable explanation for a unique occurrence to an otherwise health person, but not for someone who has a history of falls and stumbles.
Still, I can't believe that she was dehydrated. She seems to drink a lot of water.
I get minor ailments often enough that I think it's reasonable that presidential candidates should do the same. Just say, she's not feeling that well this last week... I've heard speakers do that plenty of times: "I think I may be coming down with something, but I didn't want to miss this event tonight!..." No big deal. The fact that her campaign didn't do that, seems to be trying to cover the whole issue up as much as possible, makes it seem that it might be a much bigger deal after all.
As for Trump's taxes, that issue might be a big loser for Clinton's campaign. What will she do if she mentions it in one of the debates, ta-da!, and Trump says, "Well, the audit is over now, so I'm releasing the tax returns today. You can all see what I said: My tax lawyers tried every trick in the book to save money, because of all those stupid tax laws I plan to fix. Now, what's your excuse for not releasing your speeches to Wall Street - was anyone auditing you? Release them today as well or admit that you're the one who has something to hide."
She's got pneumonia and is gonna go hang out with her seven week old grandson?
Yeah. And kiss babies on the campaign trail.
Pneumonia my ass. She's had that cough for months.
Trump probably gets audited every year, regardless. They do it for the same reason that Willie Sutton robbed banks -.that is where the money is. My memory is that his income is in the hundreds of millions a year right now, and, thus, a 1% discrepancy would be in the millions. That pays for a lot of auditors. If someone is earning $50k a year, a 1% discrepancy is $500, which likely won't pay for even 10 hours of auditing. Which is why you mostly face just computer matching and verification at that level.
The dirty little secret here is that the Clintons, with income averaging maybe $10 million a year, are probably audited more years than not. Unless a political decision was made somewhere in the IRS not to audit them, which wouldn't be a complete surprise, given how political that rogue agency has been under Obama. You can be pretty sure that the union that represents most IRS employees will endorse Crooked Hillary, if it hasn't done so already.
Watch the video at the link.
"Dr. Ted Noel, former Director of the NovaMed Surgery Center in Orlando, has recently released a video replying to critics of his earlier analysis of Hillary’s medical condition. That video makes a detailed, persuasive case that Parkinson’s disease best explains the neurological and other symptoms Hillary has displayed since 2005. Those who haven’t seen it should take a look."
Read more: http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/09/does_hillary_have_parkinsons_disease.html#ixzz4K2y6GCxy
Follow us: @AmericanThinker on Twitter | AmericanThinker on Facebook
Any patient of mine who staggered and fell like that in front of me when they had pneumonia would be admitted pronto. They aren't telling the truth.
1. The third person voice is very common in medical journals and dictation, so I would not give that much importance at all.
2. Hillary's long coughing bouts do not look like an allergic cough, which is intermittent but short-lived and usually associated with nasal symptoms as well, since the cough is cause by "post-nasal drip".
3. "Walking pneumonia" is viral and antibiotics would be useless. However, an aspiration pneumonia caused by Parkinson's-related swallowing difficulties would call for antibiotics.
4. The video is pretty alarming. You can see that Hillary is "dead weight". They are dragging her into the car.
The Morning Joe crew couldn't repeat the term walking pneumonia enough this morning. And they all wanted to testify that the same this has happened to them.
Kellyanne Conway was on at around 6:30 and she rocked it. During her interview she was obviously the smartest person at the table.
Mika just kept using that empty stare to fake being perplexed.
I thought it was pretty yesterday. (I live in NYC.) In fact, I didn't wear a tie or jacket to church due to the heat, which is very unusual for me after Labor Day. So I don't know what Prof. Althouse's statement that it wasn't hot is based on.
Sorry, I thought it was pretty HOT.
Pneumonia is NOT believable. After watching the closeup video of her collapse/seizure I fully buy into the theory that she has been suffering from seizures since her concussion back in 2012. First there are two videos of minor seizure incidents. One in a coffee shop, the other when the balloons come down at the DNC. AA even commented at the time regarding her bizarre facial expression. She has had Dr. Oladotun Okunola traveling as part of her entourage long before the Friday diagnosis - why? Then she was wearing those odd sunglasses at the 9/11 memorial. No one else in the photos is wearing sunglasses because it was an overcast day. It turns out that blue lenses are helpful to those who suffer epileptic seizures triggered by color/light.
Listening to NPR this morning. They ain't talking about this much, but when they do, they're sticking to the term "stumbled".
"I thought it was pretty yesterday. (I live in NYC.) In fact, I didn't wear a tie or jacket to church due to the heat, which is very unusual for me after Labor Day. So I don't know what Prof. Althouse's statement that it wasn't hot is based on."
It was about 80 to 82 degrees.
One additional advantage with having Conway be both one of Trump's campaign managers, as well as the face of his campaign, is that she is a woman. When the Crooked Hillary surrogates and minions (esp in the MSM) try to play the sexist card against his campaign, she can say honestly that he loves women, hires women, and trusts women, from personal experience. How can he be a sexist if he trusts her in that position?
"Listening to NPR this morning. They ain't talking about this much, but when they do, they're sticking to the term "stumbled"."
One witness said they had to throw her in the van like a slam of beef.
Aspiration pneumonia has a lot of explanatory power. Explains why it's OK for her to hang out at Chelsea's with the grandkids and pose with the adorable little girl outside. Explains the persistence of the cough. Possibly explains the Wikileaks memo about the medication research if it's secondary to a neurological condition. Possibly explains dehydration if difficulty swallowing leads to less fluid intake. And it's classically Clintonian to take a diagnosis of aspiration pneumonia and announce it as "pneumonia," perhaps leading to Dr. Bardack's prudent distancing, as noted by the Professor.
The crooked Dems thought it was hot yesterday, I guess they can't stand the heat.
One witness said they had to throw her in the van like a slab of beef.
Two points: 1. Her handlers on the scene did not seem very concerned about the episode which makes me think it was not an uncommon for Hillary to become too weak to stand. 2. If she was really dehydrated/overheated, why didn't anyone unbutton her jacket, give her water, have her sit down, or at least fan her?
Where was Huma Abedin yesterday on the anniversary of 9/11? Is usually by Hillary's side.
I thought the episode looked like a seizure, IMHO. Not a faint.
I'm sure Slick Willie is rushing now to the bedside of his beloved Hil. There is no love nor bond like that shared by a long-time married couple. Brings tears to my eyes.
"I thought the episode looked like a seizure, IMHO. Not a faint."
Or maybe a freeze due to Parkerson's disease.
Ann Althouse said...The Bardack statement seems only to push us back in a hope that we will not ask for more, and that came only after a very dramatic, impossible-to-ignore video of Hillary collapsing.
This is probably THE important takeaway from all this--the campaign put out the "overheated" line before the citizen-shot videos were widely circulated. The candidate left her press pool behind, and had that random person on the street not gotten that video we'd still be talking about a minor overheating event.
It's said half-jokingly, but it's really the case that the only way to get any kind of transparency in government (from an interested Media) is to have a Republican in power.
Either Hillary is just having bad luck with her health (another similarity to Nixon--remember when he banged his knee on a car door in 1960, it got infected, and screwed up his first televised debate?), or there's something more serious going on with her and her need for constant secrecy keep this all under cover until now.
Nixon's issue was quite ironic given that he was WAY more healthy than Kennedy.
Trump probably gets audited every year, regardless. They do it for the same reason that Willie Sutton robbed banks -.that is where the money is. My memory is that his income is in the hundreds of millions a year right now, and, thus, a 1% discrepancy would be in the millions. That pays for a lot of auditors. If someone is earning $50k a year, a 1% discrepancy is $500, which likely won't pay for even 10 hours of auditing. Which is why you mostly face just computer matching and verification at that level.
Does anybody think Buffett is audited all of the time? Soros? Bezos? Zuckerberg?
I don't.
The Morning Joe crew couldn't repeat the term walking pneumonia enough this morning. And they all wanted to testify that the same this has happened to them.
They are frequently completely immobile and have to be physically manhandled into a vehicle because they are unable to move their legs?
So I don't know what Prof. Althouse's statement that it wasn't hot is based on.
It was 82 degrees. Nobody calls that "Really hot" --- and you'd likely take a jacket off somebody who is "overheating".
"And I don't think a personal doctor would necessarily avoid lying - sorry, prevaricating or withholding - about Hillary's condition, considering the consequences of a serious condition and the politics, especially since a personal doctor is likely to share a philosophy and a relationship with the candidate."
And the constant threat of a HIPAA lawsuit means you can only say what you've been allowed to say.
I thought the episode looked like a seizure, IMHO. Not a faint.
I had a co-worker whose epilepsy caused him to completely lock up. Her "issue" looked a lot like that.
The deadline for putting a name on the November ballot has passed in 30+ states. If Clinton were to drop out, could the Democrats add anyone new?
AA: Hillary might have become hot because of the bright sun and her heavy clothing.
I don't understand the reference to "heavy clothing" I see here and elsewhere. Normally, Mrs. Clinton is wearing something that looks like a car coat, and has it fastened all the way up to her neck, but yesterday was one of those few times where she wore a woman's suit, which should have been lighter than her normal attire.
If I were one of Hillary's health care providers I would be running for the hills, unless I placed no value on my reputation. It is obvious that the campaign ultimately will pin any health issues on the medical staff. I, like so many others, would like to know who the big black guy is who is in constant attendance on Hillary. Looking at the videos, he is obviously there for medical reasons.
Good analysis.
We might also ponder why she is taking Coumadin "as a precautionary" even though the same doctor has said that she shows "no evidence" of propensity to clotting. She has been taking Coumadin (dose undisclosed) since 2009. There are risky side effects to Coumadin. Why would she take such a powerful drug if she has no apparent issue?
Could she have had a TIA on September 11? Her lack of body control makes me wonder. If she did, they are playing fast and loose with her life, as she should have been in a hospital for tests. Did they even consider that possibility? If not, why not?
TIA usually does not manifest with total loss of ability to walk, and there are other symptoms of TIA that would not be apparent in the video that was published, so maybe it's clear that there was no TIA. But the flat out dishonesty on other matters makes one wonder. As does the Coumadin.
And where is Bill?
I think it's fair to say that the Clinton campaign has been withholding information about Hillary's health and that it intends to continue to withhold as much as it can. The Bardack statement seems only to push us back in a hope that we will not ask for more, and that came only after a very dramatic, impossible-to-ignore video of Hillary collapsing.
That is her modus operendi. Keep in mind NOT ONE news camera or reporter was there to witness the event except Rick Leventhal of Fox news (no video) and the random Twitter guy who filmed Hillary collapsing and being dragged into the van. Without this citizen journalist filming her event we would not know now what happened. The press would be totally incurious as to why she ditched them for 90 minutes. And nothing different would happen AFTER she's elected. This is the same openness and transparency you can expect from Hillary on every subject.
A kevlar vest might indeed make it hot under that ugly jacket. Also, the IV drugs and saline take up a lot of space. Maybe if we saw her dressed normally, she'd look like a normal older citizen.
This could all be part of the plan. She'll go to the first debate looking like Marie Osmond after a six-month NutraSystem diet. Then she'll turn on her beady laser eyes and pierce Trump's skull before his first rebuttal.
This the third event attributed to dehydration she's had in recent years. The first "fainted from dehydration" happened in late 2012 or early 2013 and resulted in her head injury ("I don't recall"), blood clot, 6 months rest (according to Bill) and confusion (according to Huma's emails) and her famous appearance at the Benghazi Committee with those Fresnel lenses (indicating neurological damage). Then when she fell and broke her arm on Air Force One that was also attributed to the old "dried out skank" excuse. Now this sudden extreme dehydration episode.
Hmmm.
Why does such a brilliant lady keep putting herself in the position of major medical trauma REPEATEDLY for the lack of a little water? Questor was on the case yesterday and there are unifying medical reasons, but the dried up hag's campaign won't admit to an illness that makes sense because the diagnoses would end her career. Let's just say trouble swallowing often leads to aspiration pneumonia, and coughing fits, and makes it difficult to keep hydrated. Maybe Laslo can explain why she has trouble swallowing. Certainly her campaign won't do it.
And they all wanted to testify that the same this has happened to them.
Yeah. I noticed that too. Suddenly everyone has a personal anecdote which just happens to prove that “walking pneumonia” is harmless. I consign to these the same importance I place on most anecdotes. And man-in-the-street interviews. And “focus groups.” And anonymous sources cited by the MSM.
Well, her doctor has prescribed rest so that gives them the excuse to put her on ice until the debates, at which they are hoping that Lester Holt will destroy that devil, Trump.
Clinton and her campaign have spoken, so lies were told. As someone said, she just can not keep from lying.
It is fun to watch all of the democrat media have to now break their necks telling us that, well there is some medical issues here after all you conspiracy nuts, but trust us, they are not serious.
All a bunch of wankers.
Why does such a brilliant lady keep putting herselsf in the position of major medical trauma REPEATEDLY for the lack of a little water?
She might melt.
the Unknowns must not have gotten their talking points yet
Regards the coumadin (or more likely now one of the newer ones like Eliquis). With deep vein thrombosis it is two strikes yer anticoagulated for life. She had a previous DVT in her leg then later the highly unusual thrombosis of one of the large veins inside the skull.
Its all a Vegas odds scenario. Does thinning the blood reduce the odds of a disasterous event such as fatal pulmonary embolism? Yes. Does it increase the odds of a disasterous event like a brain bleed? Yes. House odds....how often do you fall on your head?
She probably does have a hereditary clotting issue. They are common. This is being lied about but is likely not nearly the biggest whopper being spoken.
Tacitus
Warren Buffet may not get audited as much, but he really doesn't make all that much in actual income. Supposedly less than a million a year in salary. Much less than the Clintons. And his dividends are likely qualified, which is part of how he pays a lower tax rate than his secretary. What has made him so filthy rich are unrealized capital gains. If he sold his Berkshire stock, he would have an immense income. But he doesn't, but just holds onto it, and, at his death, much, if not most, of it will apparently go to the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation.
And now here is a dark and awful thought. If we actually call Trump a Republican for a moment, who among the herd of R candidates may actually have had any first hand knowlege of Hillary Clinton's true health status. Who, oh who, might have seen her in social occasions far from the Press and her handlers? Who might have known how befuddled she got after the hour got late (3am phone call anyone?) or she had a second drink?
Perhaps Donald has had the goods on her all along. Just waiting to be revealed in some incontrovertable form. That would make his bizarre, implausible campaign make total sense and this is the first time in the current election cycle that I could say that.
Maybe The Donald has all along been the only, sorta, Republican wielding The Ring of Power?
Tacitus
"It was about 80 to 82 degrees."
-- That can be hot, but not, collapse from the heat-heat for a relatively healthy person not exerting themselves.
If you're a high-level Democrat right now, here's the big problem: Just how sick is HRC? How are you ever going to find out the true state of affairs?
When the HRC campaign sandbags the Republicans or the press, the Democratic operatives cheer. They know she lies like a rug, but it's lying like a rug in a good cause. But now, what if she's lying to them? Clinton is so cocooned they probably don't have any trusted sources within her close circle.
HRC is now in a position to single-handedly throw the election to the Republicans if she sicks out at the wrong time, & the Democrats are entirely at her mercy.
Serves 'em right.
They sure are going to great lengths to get the basket of irredeemable un-American deplorables off the front page.
'withholding' is a little sexist, althouse - i'm surprised!
(wink)
"the Unknowns must not have gotten their talking points yet"
Whereabouts unknown.
Relax people.
Humanoid Robot technology is still in it's infancy. Glitches are inevitable, it's part of taking new machines out of the lab and into the field.
I admit I'm a little curious as to what they did with the real Hillary, but...you know...at this point, what difference does it make?
My mother, who has been taking Coumadin for years, died on Thursday after a blood clot from a fall completely blocked a vein in her leg, necessitating an amputation. Falls and Coumadin are no joke.
The Clinton Lie Machine (patent pending) works 24/7. It is an impressive piece of machinery with many cogs and gears, each turning obediently every minute of the day to churn out lies. Yesterday, for the first time in a long time, it failed, albeit briefly. Bill himself crawled underneath it and found the problem quickly ... a shoe was lodged in the gearing. Once removed, the machine spun out an impressive list of lies culminating in the 5:20 p.m. lie that Hillary has pneumonia.
Some have asked, why did the Clintons need to rely on the Lie Machine when the simple truth (whatever it is) could have sufficed. The answer to that is easy: When you've got a machine
I think she has the boogie-woogie flu.
The sad/funniest part was the little girl who happened to be on the scene when Hillary came out to show everyone she was fine who also just happened to want her picture taken with Hillary.
She may have pneumonia or been dehydrated, but what we saw yesterday was neither pneumonia nor dehydration nor fainting. None of those would produce what we saw when her escorts had to manhandle her into that van.
She clearly has a neurological or muscular degeneration problem--her movements were not those of exhaustion, they were spastic.
My old doctor use to say "There's no such thing as 'Walking Pneumonia.' Just a patient who is too stubborn or stupid to STAY IN BED, so they make themselves sicker and end up with more complications."
It is telling that none of her surrounding handlers had an OMG or WTF response. It seemed like that they had experienced the same type of episode by Hillary before.
An Article quoting an Internist at PowerLine makes the argument that the pneumonia diagnosis asks as many, if not more, questions than it answers. He distinguishes between community acquired pneumonia, which is what most of us think of when seeing that diagnosis, and aspiration pneumonia, which basically involves small bits of food and the like going down the wrong pipe. He thinks that is maybe more likely, given her other medical issues. We are watching that sort of thing with my almost 95 year old father right now, and things like that appear to have killed my partner's father and grandfather. Something we watch very carefully with her. The thing is, that aspiration pneumonia is not something that you can knock out with antibodies. Rather, it appears to often have neurological roots, in getting the flap closed whenever you swallow. Or something like that.
Scott Adams predicted it in 2015
http://blog.dilbert.com/post/150284922631/checking-my-predictions-about-clintons-health
Pneumonia can kill you especially now that there are more antibiotic resistant bacteria. My 67 year old brother-in-law died just recently from pneumonia despite being treated with antibiotics in the hospital.
"The thing is, that aspiration pneumonia is not something that you can knock out with antibodies. Rather, it appears to often have neurological roots, in getting the flap closed whenever you swallow. Or something like that."
Its the main cause of death for those with Parkerson's disease.
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/09/does_hillary_have_parkinsons_disease.html
@Tacitus2
The candidate you describe is Jeb. The Bush and Clinton families are well known to be besties. Jeb may have been willing to spring the Hillary health surprise for his own candidacy. Doubtful he is looking to help Trump in any way.
The Hillary had to cancel her California fundraising trip because it's not safe to put her on an airplane until they resolve the over-heating issue.
It's exactly the same sensible precaution they have taken with the Samsung S7 Note.
WebMD's description of walking pneumonia seems to nail exactly what's been going on.
Most pertinent aspects relating to H's case bounded by ***:
"Walking pneumonia is often the result of a lung infection from a bacterial microorganism called Mycoplasma pneumoniae."
"Cases of walking pneumonia are most common in the ***late summer and fall***..."
"Symptoms generally appear 15 to 25 days after exposure to the mycoplasma and develop slowly over a period of two to four days. Symptoms include:
• ***Cough that may come in violent spasms but produce very little mucus***
• Mild flu-like symptoms such as ***fever and chills***
• Sore throat
• Headache
• Tiredness
• Lingering weakness that may persist after other symptoms go away"
"People who live and work in crowded places...have a higher risk of contracting the disease. That's because walking pneumonia is contagious. It's spread when someone comes in contact with droplets from the nose and throat of someone who has it. That commonly happens when the person with walking pneumonia ***sneezes or coughs***.
"Walking pneumonia is generally treated with antibiotics....With treatment, most people begin to feel better within a few days."
http://www.webmd.com/lung/walking-pneumonia
OK, probably a nothingburger...but since she may be still be in the contagious phase, best for her not to hug people.
Consider avoiding her like the plague.
http://www.webmd.com/lung/walking-pneumonia
It is interesting that so many people continue to take statements by the Clintons and their representatives at face value.
They lie.
What I would like to know is why Hillary saw a doctor last Friday, what the name of the doctor is, and what the full diagnosis was.
Even if it is true that a doctor diagnosed her with 'walking pneumonia' last Friday, that doesn't mean that he saw her for her pneumonia symptoms or that he did not diagnose Hillary as having pneumonia plus something else.
There has been a plague!
Per Ed Morrissey (HotAir):
"The illness that sickened Hillary Clinton with pneumonia and caused her to have to be escorted away from September 11 ceremonies in New York on Sunday also struck down several members of her campaign team at Clinton headquarters in Brooklyn, PEOPLE has learned.
“Everyone’s been sick,” a campaign source tells PEOPLE.
At the end of August, two weeks before Clinton was diagnosed with pneumonia, a debilitating bug was making the rounds among staff at her headquarters and campaign aides who travel with Clinton, a source tells PEOPLE.
At least half a dozen senior staff were felled, including campaign manager Robby Mook. Two top advisers even needed emergency medical treatment, the source says. One top adviser diagnosed at a Brooklyn urgent-care center with a respiratory infection was being treated with antibiotics in the days before Clinton’s diagnosis. Another top adviser was taken by ambulance to the ER by ambulance after collapsing from what turned out to be severe dehydration, the source said..."
"...The obvious answer is that the campaign didn’t want to admit that Hillary was ill at all. The collapse forced their hand, but even in the immediate aftermath of the news reports about her fainting spell, they tried to pass it off as “overheating” … on a 79-degree day. And now she’s canceling events in California today and tomorrow only because the secret’s out.
Team Hillary won’t tell the truth until all of the lies stop working. That, even more than Hillary’s health, is a big lesson for voters in 2016. This parade of obfuscations has begun to resemble Soviet prevarications about the health of Politburo members back in the 1980s."
http://hotair.com/archives/2016/09/12/people-respiratory-illnesses-began-sweeping-hillary-clinton-campaign-weeks-ago/
First the glaciers, then the polar ice caps, now were losing Hillary.
Dammit! Will there be anything frigid left on this planet before we finally get serious about Global warming?
"5.I think it's fair to say that the Clinton campaign has been withholding information about Hillary's health and that it intends to continue to withhold as much as it can. The Bardack statement seems only to push us back in a hope that we will not ask for more, and that came only after a very dramatic, impossible-to-ignore video of Hillary collapsing. "
Agreed. They would've kept pushing the "overheated" story, and insisting that claims of her ill-health were a vast alt-right wing conspiracy from deplorable Trump supporters, if not for the video.
Even with the video, if this were an isolated incident, she could skate by with the pneumonia/dehydration excuse. But she has a history of falls, a concussion, blood clots in the brain, memory loss, double vision, problems walking up stairs, strange head movements, freezes, uncontrolled coughing -- symptoms that she herself said had a negative impact on her performance as Sec. of State. Which is why seeing her like she was yesterday was especially disturbing. When you add that image to the list above, the pneumonia excuse does not erase the perception that there is something seriously wrong with her.
A close relative of mine had Parkinson's and I have to say that Hillary just doesn't seem like someone who has had Parkinson's for several years. At the start there was a general slight deterioration in every action involving muscles - a slight foot drag, a fumbling when fine finger co-ordination was required, a slight slurring of speech, a slight freezing of facial expressiveness. As the muscle deterioration got worse there was "freezing" and a danger from choking but the muscle problem was painfully obvious by then - stumbling, fumbling, slurring, frozen face. Hillary doesn't have that kind of obvious muscle deterioration and I don't even see the slight beginnings in her. Bill looks more like it than Hillary.
I realize that commenting physicians think it's possible she has Parkinson's and I suppose there might be new drugs that mask the problem for longer. I think she has brain damage from falling when she overworked in 2012 not realizing she was getting older. It gives intermittent problems so her entourage stays in denial and keeps harnessing her up and sending her out to work. They're killing her for their rice bowl.
Only the most casual, flippant, uncaring of physicians would make a diagnosis of pneumonia on the basis of a physical exam in someone's home and then treat on that basis.
Upon auscultation, one can strongly suspect or even (if you were, say, in a jungle) presumptively diagnose pneumonia. And (again, in a jungle) treat on that basis.
But the standard of care, for even the lowliest rural American general practitioner's office, is a chest x-ray. That is the one single cornerstone for the diagnosis. Nothing less.
You could then do blood work and sputum cultures to get to the bottom of it. You SHOULD do all of that, in a case like Mrs. Clinton.
All of this -- unless you were an organized crime figure or a fearful Mideast potentate -- would routinely be done in any metropolitan New York City hospital. Not at home in Chappaqua.
I am willing to believe that Mrs. Clinton has pneumonia, and that she was dehydrated, and that both things are treatable.
No one can possibly tell me, that it was in any way normal for her to be checked out at home by a private physician without going to a hospital emergency department. Did they not do an x-ray? Did they import a portable x-ray machine into the Chappaqua home? The one and only explanation there is that the Clinton campaign felt that secrecy was more important than her health. Secrecy, privacy, concealment; these are the only plausible conclusions even if you wish to believe the Clinton-supplied diagnosis.
She doesn't look like a Parkinson's patient to me. They have a very distinct flat affect, and as robotic as she is, she doesn't have it. I still vote for seizure disorder.
Whenever I hear the passive voice used, I just immediately infer dishonesty until proven otherwise.
I should add something; if Mrs. Clinton was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday, I'd say all the same things about how pneumonia is diagnosed and treated. With all the same questions. Was there a chest x-ray? Is there a blood culture? A sputum culture? What was her personal schedule on Thursday and Friday? Was she anywhere near an x-ray machine?
"They're killing her for their rice bowl. "
"The one and only explanation there is that the Clinton campaign felt that secrecy was more important than her health. "
I agree.
Her staff didn't seem surprised or startled by Hillary's shocking condition. They have probably done this with her before. The actions of her handlers-- surreptitiously dragging her into a van and taking her to her daughter's apt rather than a hospital-- was deplorable.
She has some chronic disorder causing all this, I believe, it might be Parkinson's Disease, or it might not be. I also have a close relative with Parkinson's and I can see similarities and some dis-similarities- for example, she often walks with a much smoother gait, when she isn't stumbling or passing out, than my relative does, but it is possible his disease is just further advanced. He does have great trouble at times clearing his airway- that is a great similarity. If she does have pneumonia, it quite likely is caused by aspirating her food and drink.
I think pneumonia story, however, is BS. After yesterday, they couldn't continue the charade that she is healthy, but they couldn't let linger the idea that it was a chronic and progressive thing, so they needed to fall back to an infectious disease explanation. The problem is the later appearance in the afternoon, plus the interaction with the child on the street. Whoever came up the the pneumonia story didn't take that into account.
"They're killing her for their rice bowl. "
Karma's a bitch.
"Was there a chest x-ray? Is there a blood culture? A sputum culture? What was her personal schedule on Thursday and Friday? Was she anywhere near an x-ray machine?"
The press does not want to know.
If you have pneumonia, heat stroke or dehydration severe enough to cause you to seize and keel over, you don't get "better" in three hours unless you are in a Monty Python sketch.
Let me get this strait: Hillary goes to a boarded resident in internal medicine, and Donald gets a quack non-boarded gastroenterologist to write a letter in five minutes saying that he only has positive results and would be the healthiest president ever...and Clinton's hiding something? In your republican zeal, you people are grasping nonexistent straws. And for what? As your lady fingered sunset said, "what do you have to lose by trying something new"?
So we got: parkinsons, MS, and seizures.
But not dehydration and not pneumonia.
FYI: it does not have to be >95 degrees to have hyperthermia or dehydration.
And for sure no one with a neuromuscular condition should ever lead a major power and/or take us to war. Nooo.
...anyway, I think they should move Kaine up and find him a nice running mate.
The Grifter withholds or loses everything. Even when she "opens up" she lies, her LSAT story, her being under sniper fire, Marine recruiters' sexism, etc. Will she be replaced with another liar if she drops out, like Biden?
Clinton team avoided ER to conceal details of her medical treatment
You know, each time the story changes, I cannot help but think it's a Nixonian Modified Limited Hangout.
Here's my issue with them skipping going to the ER on Sunday.
Let's stipulate that Hillary was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday.
How can anyone be sure that her episode on Sunday might not have been due to pneumonia? At least without a trip to a hospital? It's not inconceivable that she might have some new condition, and by not getting her re-diagnosed on Sunday, they're risking Hillary's life with a potential new illness that goes undiagnosed. And for what? To keep the press out of the loop that she has walking pneumonia?
Here's an episode from June that also makes me think she has a seizure disorder. At first I thought it was fake video, but the people around her don't seem to be altered and one woman draws back in shock and seems to mouth "Are you Okay?." I thought Sunday's episode looked similar, but from behind.
"coupe said...
...anyway, I think they should move Kaine up and find him a nice running mate."
I'm not sure who you think "they" are, but only Hillary will let that happen, and she won't. Even if her Parkinsons becomes public, she won't drop out.
I would not assume that Bardack would not lie. Everything about how Sunday's episode was handled suggests that Clinton has something to hide regarding her health, from the hasty departure to ditching the press to going to Chelsea's rather than a hospital or even a doctor's office, followed by going home to Chappaqua. As with the Clinton Foundation's accountant for most of its existence being a small hometown outfit, I suspect Bardack is retained for her willingness to be loyal to Clinton, no matter what that entails.
If there really is nothing seriously wrong with her, she just threw doubt into everybody's minds for no reason at all because everyone managing her campaign was too afraid to tell the truth that she'd come down with something. Had it been announced on Friday, it would have given her an excuse to avoid Sunday's ceremony (and similarly prevented her "deplorables" soundbite on Friday night), possibly make a video-taped statement while ginning up sympathy, and avoid what ended up happening, a public crisis that unfortunately for her got caught on video by a bystander.
The question is how believable anything coming out of Clinton's campaign or any non-independent physician will be now. They already withheld the initial diagnosis, flat-out staged an "all is well" lie for the cameras leaving Chelsea's, and then finally brought out pneumonia late in the day on Sunday after running with an "overheated" explanation most of the day. I'm pretty sure if we didn't have the video of her collapsing, the story today would just be more denials and blaming of right wing conspiracies.
The lackeys are busy spreading the word that Hillary just won't drink enough water:
http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/295508-clintons-reluctance-to-drink-water-causing-tension-with
The better to explain away the next three or four episodes of "dehydration." Even Slate thinks it's crap:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/09/12/does_hillary_clinton_really_hate_water.html
An unconscious Clinton is more qualified to be president that a conscious Trump
An unconscious Clinton is more qualified to be president that a conscious Trump
If you could guarantee that Clinton would remain unconscious through her entire term, unable to veto any legislation, write any executive orders, appoint any judges, or pardon any of her criminal cronies, then she'd have my vote. Otherwise, not a chance.
Ya know, Hills enjoys her booze. I had a physician tell me that it is often extremely difficult to tell if ones balance and falling problems are the result of Parkinsons or of excess alcohol intake as they both attack the same parts of the brain affecting balance, gait, etc., the only difference being with Parkinsons the deterioration is progressive while with alcohol once the damage is done the condition doesn't continue to worsen over time.
NPR is criminally misrepresenting this election, you shoulda heard them tonight, talking trump=hate from every program, even "wait wait don't tell me", and of course "media matters" where they actually addressed Hillary's problem of not telling the truth, and wow! they took a good bit of time explaining that the evil vast right wing conspiracy of the 90s planted that idea, the notion that Hillary is deceitful. Oh.My.God. Those mean right wingers have amazing mind control over all of us, hUh NPR?
Nothing recently would make us believe she does not tell the truth?
criminals of journalism, they should be perp-walked along with Lois Lerner, Koskinen and about 120,000 others. ( that sounds like a lot, Maybe we should pen them temporarily into the camps they earmarked for us, as we process their treason.)
cf speak Heap Big Medicine..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zr1IDQ2V1eM&feature=youtu.be
is alarming. But I'd like to see some apolitical MDs, neurologists, comment on this.
campaigning in the heat with pneumonia = Clinton
campaigning while a lady fingered narcissist without a hint of empathy = Trump
real people go to work when they're ill. Note that ladyfingers isn't talking about this. He knows this is going to rebound for her, and increase the talk about his heath records. Then we'll find out about those bone spurs that got him out of Veitnam, his diet of tacos and french fries, and why his doctor was still using xp.
@Esoxyz - this is not Twitter, and Twitter type arguments just sound silly here. Parroting Twitter length Crooked Hillary campaign slogans just makes you look like a Millennial living in their parents' basement after college, earning minimum wage for her campaign to disrupt discussions that criticize her.
We have one candidate who is flying around the country, making multiple campaign events every day, and the other candidate making maybe a couple a week, and that latter candidate has had multiple examples of ill health all through the spring and summer, from being carried up those stairs to that house, to collapsing at the 9/11 memorial. Which do you truly think is in better health?
Dehydration and pneumonia may be the cause of Crooked Hillary's collapse, and maybe her coughing. Or, they could just as easily be the symptoms of something far worse. One of the big killers of the elderly is pneumonia. I had assumed that meant that they picked it up as an opportunistic infection, like MRSA, and they are just too frail to fight it off. But it also apparently also includes swallowing problems, where stuff goes down the wrong tube, and ends up in the lungs. And, it turns out that sort of thing often has neurological roots. We just don't know here. Spending time with grandkids and kissing babies with pneumonia, would seem to suggest either extreme indifference, or not having an infectious type (or phase) of it. And while it may have been a little hot in the sun last Sun., it wasn't that hot. 80 degrees at top. My law school graduation was two hours at almost 100 degrees, in much brighter sun than NYC is capable of. And, amazingly, no one collapsed. How does she get dehydrated, with an army of sycophants and aides, as well as a Secret Service detail, with her at all times, to give her water any time she needs it?
And why would anyone in their right mind believe her campaign in the first place? Sure, she actually may have these things. But we have known for better than twenty years now that the Clintons lie on a regular basis. A lot of it isn't strictly a lie, but rather lying by implication. Such as Bill saying that he didn't have sex with that women, when he had received a BW, and had intruded into her vagina, because his penis hadn't followed his cigar or his finger in there. Or her telling us that she hadn't sent or received classified emails on her private server, then qualifying that to mean that she hadn't sent or received email with classified headers (after the headers, and sometimes the classified markings, had been removed by her staff for her). After 24 years, most of us here know that you need to parse anything a Clinton says very carefully, because that is what they do - they are both Yale educated (former) attorneys. Which is why, when her campaign grudgingly admitted to dehydration and pneumonia, our natural tendency is not to believe them (as some do here), but rather to ask what aren't they saying? My view is that only fools accept what either Clinton says at face value.
Bruce Hayden - you mean like the lady fingered seventy year old sunset living off his father's money paying nothing in taxes and tweeting at three am?
finally, someone on this blog cares about women's health, to bad you know nothing about it.
Esox, too bad the Clintons detest women. Use them and toss them aside.
@esoxyz - as I said, Twitter type insults here just make you look silly.
Annie - too bad ladyfingers detests right wingers. Use them and toss them aside.
OK esox, you're some kind of a diagnostician, what's wrong with Hilary?
thanks for elevating the conversation and asking, bad lieutenant. i think she's a human woman, trying to become president in a man's world. in a way, i think hillary has a bigger hill to climb than obama. implicitly being against the first african-american president was nakedly racist, but it's too easy to say that she's secretive, sick, shrill, moody, or all the things that come with being female instead of examining your inherent sexism. women do things by committee, which men see as secretive. they have periods where they're anemic and prone to infection, which men see as sick. their voice is naturally high so when it rises it can seem shrill. they are a soup of hormones, which can make them moody. criticize her platform all you want, but when you spread rumor about her femaleness, you say that half of our population is unfit to lead. that thinking is not only unfair to women, but hurts us all as a country.
Dear Esox,
Respectfully:
Bosh.
I don't know what you mean by the modifier "implicitly" but it is no more racist or sexist to oppose Obama or Hillary Clinton than it is [other Booga Booga word]-ist to oppose Trump (for his flamboyant hair?) or George W Bush (for his aw-shucks manner?). No debate is possible under such terms. The only determinable outcome of what I believe is known as intersectionality is who checks the most boxes. End of the Republic, start the shooting.
As for your assertion regarding Hillary Clinton's health. If I read you correctly, and I will go back and look sometime when I shouldn't be sleeping instead, you won't even admit she has or had pneumonia. As for blood coming from her wherever, I dare say that curse is behind her. Overall, I must regard your assessment as politically motivated.
If it makes you feel any better, I detested Bill Clinton as utterly as either of these two, and unless you're really going to go with the first black president trope on his behalf, it's just that I'm prejudiced against communists and fellow travelers and other parasites.
And, not calling Paul Tsongas a communist, I was very concerned about his health, and I was right. FDR, Wilson, JFK Kama all white males, concealed serious health issues which I daresay affected their ability to do their jobs.
But thank you, I agree with you in preferring a reasonable tone.
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