September 14, 2015
Scott Walker is so proud of his enemies he takes credit for enemies that are not even his.
WaPo's Fact Checker gives Walker 4 Pinocchios for whatever claim he made to inspiring the Occupy movement he made when he said: "The Occupy Movement didn’t start in Washington, didn’t start in Wall Street, it started in my capitol" and "The [budget] hearing would soon claim a more ignominious place in history — as the moment that gave birth to the ‘Occupy’ movement."
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Hmmm...making a prediction WaPo thinks won't come true is a "4 Pinocchios" lie? If I knew nothing else about Walker, this alone would tell me he is a Republican.
Occupy Madison seems to think that they were part of what created Occupy Wall Street; I think it is just a general historical assumption that all prior things feed into a current thing. It is definitely, historically, a runner up to Occupy Wall Street, even if it is not formally connected.
A silly thing to say, but I get the meaning.
Dog bites man.
"According to one writer associated with the Occupy Movement, Act 10 protests 'charged workers’ political consciousness in a way that prepared for the Occupy Wall Street movement, as well as greater social movements on the horizon.'"
-- Seems to me that the Occupy Movement writer clearly thinks the same thing, but not nearly as strongly, as Walker. That Occupy Madison prepared for/started the ball rolling on Occupy Wall Street. This is, at most, a 2-Pinnochi lie: "Significant omissions and/or exaggerations. Some factual error may be involved but not necessarily. A politician can create a false, misleading impression by playing with words and using legalistic language that means little to ordinary people."
A four Pinnochio lie is defined by the website as a "Whopper." This in no way comes close to "if you like your plan, you can keep your plan," and other actual political whoppers "Read my lips, No new taxes;" "I did not have sexual relations with that woman."
If the Occupy people are giving credit to Occupy Madison as an early potential source of inspiration, all Walker is doing is exaggerating it. Their own scale says that's 2, not 4.
Having gone and read the whole article, it sounds like Walker exaggerates and massages in a fairly typical politico way. Four Pinocchios is still too much, but 1 or 2 is probably justified.
Lets see.
Wapo gives Hillary 4 Pinochios for "sniper fire in Tuzla" lie.
Wapo gives Obama 4 Pinochios for "like your doctor, ..." lie.
Has Wapo rated Obama's "Ayatollah issued anti-nuke fatwa" lie?
Scotty is running in elite circles.
By the Way, looks like those sneaky Iranians found some more uranium. Timely, huh?
Poor Scotty is circling the bowl.
The insane level of hatred certain people on the left have for Walker is comical. Scott Walker is just kicking an old hornets nest in hopes of getting a little attention. Given how strongly some people have responded Trump's "controversial" statements you can understand this strategy. Whether it's too late or not remains to be seen.
I fucked up my state beyond recognition and they hate my guts. Doesn't that count for anything?????
Subscription block to WaPo.
Might be brilliant and incisive commentary. But WaPo wants to make money on it.
Not from me.
The WaPo certainly lacks a sense of humor. I'm sure he was referring to "occupy" as what happened to Wisconsin by the truckloads of Illinois thugs. And bus loads, of course.
WaPo fact checker = partisan hack.
We all know that Republicans are not allowed to speak figuratively, and every figurative statement a Republican might make must be interpreted literally, if that is what it takes to jack up the number of Pinocchios.
The only thing propping up the Walker campaign at this time is the delicious lamentations of his enemies in Wisconsin. Every time I am ready to write him off, they show up to remind me why I liked him.
It turns out that winning three elections = "whole state hates his guts."
Who reads WAPO?? Liberal Newspaper as bad as NY Times.....all the liberal spin, all of the time!!!
Walker is a Republican! A Republican can never misspeak, they can only be misunderstood! Liberal media strikes again!
garage mahal said...
I fucked up my state beyond recognition and they hate my guts. Doesn't that count for anything?????
While this is certainly an exaggeration ( you are only a small cog in the liberal machine ) I would not award this any Pinocchios, as it speak to a deeper truth.
But it doesn't count for much, as Walker is busy fixing what you fucked up.
I love his guts for protecting Wisconsin from the stupid "high-speed" train.
Walker was right.
$11 billion here, $10 billion there... pretty soon it starts adding up to real money.
Meade, there is your problem. You must express your opinion as if you spoke for the whole state! When a liberal speaks, they speak for everyone! When a conservative-libertarian speaks, he speaks for himself.
The insane level of hatred certain people on the left have for people on the right is pathological.
I wonder how many school teacher retirement checks you can write with 10 billion dollars?
A Republican can never misspeak...
It is dirt simple to refuse to understand figurative speech, we get it garage, you refuse to understand it..
"A Republican can never misspeak, they can only be misunderstood!"
-- At least two people here, and I'm partial to Walker, acknowledge that this isn't a 100% accurate statement. I just think ranking it at 4 Pinnochios is overboard. Compare Walker's 4-Pinnochios on Occupy Madison birthing Occupy Wall Street, a metaphorical statement that has some grounding in even Occupy people acknowledging that Occupy Madison served as an inspiration.
Compare that to this Two Pinnochio statement from Clinton. Clinton stated: “It was fully above board. Everybody in the government with whom I emailed knew that I was using a personal email.”
"But at least one e-mail released by the State Department suggests a senior official was out of the loop." -- We know have a knowingly factually incorrect statement. It gets 2-Pinnochios, which is meant to only be for exaggerations or misrepresentations.
Here's another 2-Pinnochio'er. It is titled: "Sanders’s repeated, exaggerated claims on income and wealth inequality." So, here we have someone knowingly lying, repeatedly, getting scored LOWER than an exaggerated statement from Walker that the Occupy people SOMEWHAT agree with.
WaPo's Fact check is a partisan tool used to protect the left and attack the right; there's no reason to treat it like legitimate news.
The stupid high speed train that we're paying 100 million dollars to keep out of the state. A 100 million here, a few billion there, and your approval rating in the 30s.
Here's a two-Pinnochio statement. Note that the WaPo is deliberately trying to show Clinton in the best light, usually by pretending to be stupid: 'She refers to “classified material,” which could be code for documents, leaving open the possibility of “classified information” having been received." -- Sorry, if an email has classified information, the email is classified material.
"The question thus turns on whether Clinton should have at the time recognized that this information could be deemed as classified and should have taken better steps to protect it." -- Anyone vaguely familiar with how you get a security clearance knows the answer to this is yes.
"Never mind the IG’s concerns. According to the State Department redactions of the released e-mails, the answer is yes. Clinton earns Two Pinocchios for excessively technical wordsmithing." -- So, essentially, the WaPo is saying, "We're confused, and like Clinton, so despite finding SATELLITE DATA ON HER EMAILS, we're going to just go with what she said."
So, if only Walker were a better liar, he could have confused the WaPo into giving him a lesser score.
I actually think it would be interesting for someone to do a thorough study and audit of these fact checkers. Just scanning through, I definitely see the bias. I definitely feel, when reading them, that the authors give more ground and are more accepting of people on the left's exaggerations. But, I've not done a scientific review, I just do it now and again when I want to demonstrate how pointless the fact checkers are.
It'd make a really interesting website.
Walker is finding out that the national media is quite different from the Wisconsin media who propped him up his entire career.
"Walker is finding out that the national media is quite different from the Wisconsin media who propped him up his entire career."
-- That's odd; I always got the impression the Wisc. media was hostile to Walker. Do you have examples of them propping him up?
I can say that I have enjoyed Garage's recent silence. I am disappointed by his return.
garage- if you are really hankering for a high speed train, you should move to central California.
LOL, I bet if Wisconsin had taken the 100 million, they would have gotten a free high speed train and it would never have cost taxpayers another penny!
I have ridden on the Eurostar. Guess what, it was empty between London and Paris. London and Paris, populations ranked 27 and 29 on a world list of population centers where Chicago comes in 30 something.
If I'm paying 100 million for a train I would at least like to receive it. I'm weird like that.
If I'm paying 100 million for a train I would at least like to receive it. I'm weird like that.
100 million won't even cover the graft....
"If I'm paying 100 million for a train I would at least like to receive it."
Are you? You said that the 100 million was, apparently, being spent to not get a train.
I fucked up my state beyond recognition and they hate my guts. Doesn't that count for anything?????
You're right, garage. Every decent person does hate your guts.
Mathew, It gets complicated when you are a liberal. For instance, if you drive by a car dealer and he says, "I will give you 4,000 dollars toward the down payment on your new car!" and you don't buy it, you just spent $4000 and never got a car.
This is known in the theme to the old show Good Times, as an "easy credit rip-off."
But imagine the jobs for lazy slobs!
"I'd like to buy this car."
Thanks for the payment. Here are your keys.
"That's okay. I don't actually want the car, I like paying for things I don't want."
This is what passes for conservative thought. Fortunately for conservative leaders there are so many stupid people.
"I'd like to buy this car."
"It costs $40,000. To sweeten the deal, I'll throw in a $5,000 dealer discount"
"Sounds good, I'll buy it"
"Ok, so that's $35,000 now, and ten another $10,000 a year for the next five years."
"But you said it costs $40,000!"
"cost over runs, unforeseen circumstances....."
"But it is going to end up costing me more than twice what you said the price was!"
"..plus another $20,000 for explanations...."
"What?"
"Make that $30,000..."
"forget it, I'm not paying $90,000 for a $40,000 car!"
"but you'll lose that free $5,000!"
But, Garage, you said the money was for NOT buying the train [I'm not sure actually what you mean, but I'm accepting that what you said was what you meant.] If you paid to NOT get a train, why are you complaining when you don't get a train? You're getting what was paid for [Not Train].
You literally typed: "The stupid high speed train that we're paying 100 million dollars to keep out of the state."
Then you literally typed: "If I'm paying 100 million for a train I would at least like to receive it. I'm weird like that."
But... you're NOT paying 100 million for a train. You're paying it for Not Train. So, what's your complaint? Would you RATHER have spent that money on a train? If so, make that argument, not this weird Unargument.
So, not taking money is the same as spending money? Care for a mulligan, garage?
Wait, wait, wait.
People are saying something different than what Garage posited. Which is it? Did we turn down money for a project we didn't want to do, or did we pay money to not do a project?
Scott Walker is in trouble because of his wobbling and waffling.
On immigration, he flip-flopped back and forth and suggested we needed to build a wall on our border--with Canada. That made him a laughingstock, and he never recovered from it.
This new idea isn't going to help.
Standing up to public-employee unions, though desirable, isn't viewed by the GOP base as anywhere near as important as reducing all immigration.
Garage:
Two words:
Big Dig.
"That's okay. I don't actually want the car, I like paying for things I don't want."
This is what passes for conservative thought. Fortunately for conservative leaders there are so many stupid people.
So the people of Wisconsin wrote a check for 100 million dollars for the train. That 100 million dollars would have paid for the train in full, including all operating expenses into the future, up to and including retirement payments for all employees of the train, and after having written this check, they will now not get the train?
Because if that is the case, that Wisconsin taxed its citizens, took the money, gave it to some entity to buy a train, and then turned down a free train, I can see garage's point.
On immigration, he flip-flopped back and forth and suggested we needed to build a wall on our border--with Canada.
He never did any such thing, and the fact that you think he did says a lot about the state of affairs of our current electorate.
Ultimately, the fact that garage can't even acknowledge a fair point made by Walker says all you need to know about the value of his opinions.
Same goes for the WaPo.
I get it now, because if Walker had signed up for the high speed rail boondoggle, he would have gotten 150 million dollars to improve existing service "thrown in" along with the bondage of committing to the other huge and expensive project, and now he wants that 150 million dollars to improve the *existing* rail service in the *existing* corridor, he is a hypocrite.
Well, it was probably well worth the 150 million dollars to avoid that other project of unknowable costs. Of course Obama will probably prevent Wisconsin from getting that rail money as a way to punish the state for defying his will on the other huge project, but that is Scott Walker's fault!
I get it now, it is so simple.
http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/118842999.html
MayBee said...
garage- if you are really hankering for a high speed train, you should move to central California.
I got a C-note that says it'll never be built.
The question of course, is: Why didn't Scott Walker's handlers google #OccupyWallStreet?
Most people who pay attention to news know that Occupy Wall Street began at Adblock Magazine in Vancouver back in July 2011, with the occupation of Zuccotti Park in lower Manhattan set for September 17.
Occupy Madison began at Veteran's Plaza and Reynold's Park about mid-October of 2011.
gadfly said...
Occupy Madison began at Veteran's Plaza and Reynold's Park about mid-October of 2011.
The protests over Act 10 which occupied the state house began in February 2011.
"Do you have examples of them propping him up?"
Examples ? We don't need no stinkin' examples !
Meanwhile back to the real Presidential campaign, how about this ultra-conservative position from the Wisconsin Governor in The Hill:
Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker is proposing the elimination of federal employee unions as part of broader package of policies aimed at curbing the influence of unions across the country. [. . . ]
The plan, released Monday morning, includes shuttering the National Labor Relations Board, a government agency that protects employee’s ability to join unions and rules on unfair labor allegations. Walker plans to call the NLRB a “one-sided proxy for the big union bosses — often at the expense of taxpayers and workers” . . .
It also calls for a federal “right to work” law, a measure that prohibits compelling employees to join a union.
This this should put WaPo owner Jeff Bezos in a real bind, since Amazon is as non-union as it can be.
IIB, you don't expect gadfly to discuss the issue honestly do you?
What you guys don't understand is that the federal government wanted to give us money (give us money!) that they print in a big building in Washington. For free! And we turned it down. Hicks.
What you guys don't understand is that the federal government wanted to give us money (give us money!) that they print in a big building in Washington. For free! And we turned it down. Hicks. - Original Mike
Really? No strings attached? No kidding. Wow, when you put it that way, it was stupid to turn it down!
"Wow, when you put it that way, it was stupid to turn it down!"
That's what garage is trying to get us to understand!
So that money comes from nowhere? Just 'poof' and it appears as if from on High?
Man, that Scott Walker sure is stupid for not believing in God-verment.
He seemed like such a better candidate when running for governor in Wisconsin.
What happened?
I know I'm proud to take credit for garage being my enemy even though garage isn't even my enemy. I mean, it's not like garage has ever threatened to gut me like a deer.
There is no documented record, anywhere, that the "gut me like a deer" ever happened. Like almost everything says, it's m9re than likely just another lie. One that gullible rubes like Meade happily lap up like warm milk. Like his story of getting attacked in LA Crosse by angry union mobs
Oh my, how far the mighty Walker has fallen.
There is no documented record, anywhere, that the "gut me like a deer" ever happened. Like almost everything says, it's m9re than likely just another lie. One that gullible rubes like Meade happily lap up like warm milk. Like his story of getting attacked in LA Crosse by angry union mobs
More evidence of that exists than any "War on Women" your party has gone on about for years now.
"More evidence of that exists than any "War on Women" your party has gone on about for years now. "
Not only gone on about but happily sucked on like an endless supply of creamy buttery nutty melted brie. I say endless but at the same time it looks like the Wisconsin (and other states) Democratic party is beginning to run out of all kinds of yummy big government cheese.
Yikes! Might be time for my Dem frenemies to suck in their guts.
The higher a monkey climbs up the pole the more everyone can see his ass. Getting lonlier by the day being a Walker supporter. We told you 5 years ago but you wouldn't listen. I mean, isn't it clear by now that Walker is a complete idiot?
garage mahal said...
The higher a monkey climbs up the pole the more everyone can see his ass. Getting lonlier by the day being a Walker supporter. We told you 5 years ago but you wouldn't listen. I mean, isn't it clear by now that Walker is a complete idiot?
Not really. Even if he looses to Trump he'll still be a great and respected Governor of Wisconsin.
Meade said...
I know I'm proud to take credit for garage being my enemy even though garage isn't even my enemy. I mean, it's not like garage has ever threatened to gut me like a deer.
I noted before that if Walker were to gain national traction and become a front-runner, garage mahal is perfectly poised to ca$h in as an anti-Walker pundit. He has so many anti-Walker tidbits and trivia filed away in his head from over the years. What if he collected them on note cards like Joan Rivers collected jokes? Why, he could sell that little collection to the DNC for a tidy sum if he hasn't already.
Here's garage in a nutshell:
Politically, he a lifelong Dem. When his old flame, Hillary, was extinguished in 2008 by Barack Obama. Garage grudgingly supported Obama in both elections, but his real zeal was always for the Wisconsin recall election(s). It's hard for me to fathom garage supporting Hillary this time around, but hey, maybe just one more time out of conjugal duty or sympathy.
Garage's real zeal this election will emerge whenever Althouse chooses to blog the Feingold v. Johnson Senate race. Garage will emerge as this blog's biggest Feingold proponent. You read that first here.
Outside of politics, garage seems like a perfectly ordinary Wisconsin male -- he enjoys the outdoors, drinking beer, and watching the Packers.
"We told you 5 years ago but you wouldn't listen. I mean, isn't it clear by now that Walker is a complete idiot?"
I've never wanted Walker to go anywhere but here.
"Garage will emerge as this blog's biggest Feingold proponent. You read that first here."
La Follette incarnate, he is.
"I mean, isn't it clear by now that I'm a complete idiot?"
FIFY
I mean, isn't it clear by now that Walker is a complete idiot?
Yet he's 3-0 against the best you've got.
You there, eating the paste, I'm talking to you, garage...
"Standing up to public-employee unions, though desirable, isn't viewed by the GOP base as anywhere near as important as reducing all immigration."
The GOP base is well aware that the public employee unions are the main cash cow for the Democrat Party. Public unions donate more money to Democrats than corporations do to the GOP, and that's not even counting the massive amounts they spend on lobbyists. Take them down, and it becomes a lot harder for them to get Democrats elected and to lobby Congress for Democrat policies. THEN you can actually pass votes on things like reducing immigration.
And if the GOP base *isn't* aware, a good spokesman would tell them about it.
I think the prioritization here is a correct one. It'll be a lot easier to tackle Democrats on other issues once they're no longer able to forcibly extract dues even from public employees who don't want to belong to the union, and pass those dues off to Democrats and lobbyists for Democrat causes.
You're right, garage. Every decent person does hate your guts.
Nobody hates the organ grinder monkey.
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