Althouse: Columbia Student says he didn't rape that mattress-carrying protester who's been getting so much press.

February 3, 2015

Columbia Student says he didn't rape that mattress-carrying protester who's been getting so much press.

The Daily Beast has the story.

99 comments:

Emil Blatz said...: The arms of Schwarzenegger she must have!; 2/3/15, 6:09 PM
Rob said...: It sounds like there may in fact have been a rape that night. Ms. Sulkowicz says that Nungesser was drunk. If that's true, he couldn't give informed consent, and she's guilty of rape.; 2/3/15, 6:11 PM
Anonymous said...: What he says really doesn't matter. The narrative is the imperative.; 2/3/15, 6:13 PM
Tom said...: Whether he did it or not, the reaction to this event and events like it make it harder for men and women to have healthy relationships. It undermines the fundamental trust necessary for a a relationship and family. I wonder if that isn't the point. With no one left, our only source of comfort is the state.; 2/3/15, 6:13 PM
bleh said...: Women don't lie about rape!

Right?; 2/3/15, 6:15 PM
Quaestor said...: With no one left, our only source of comfort is the state.

Bingo!; 2/3/15, 6:16 PM
madAsHell said...: He didn't rape her. He just failed to call her the next day.

She should have left her earrings on the night stand, or panties under the bed. That way, the next girl will assume that she is going to be a one-night-stand as well.

....not that this has ever happened to me!!

The really strange part is they know where to look for evidence of the other woman.; 2/3/15, 6:21 PM
David said...: “What really struck us as outrageously unfair,” says Nungesser’s father, Andreas Probosch, a schoolteacher who speaks near-perfect English, “was the university’s non-reaction to Emma Sulkowicz's public campaign. After investigating the allegations against Paul for seven months they found them not credible, but when Ms. Sulkowicz went to the press and claimed Columbia had swept everything under the rug, why didn’t they stand by his side and say, ‘We do have a process and we followed that process and we stand by the acquittal’? Instead they declined to comment and just threw him under the bus.”

Because they are cowards? That is my working assumption until the evidence shows a better explanation.; 2/3/15, 6:29 PM
steve uhr said...: Whether he raped her or not, her carrying the mattress around everywhere suggests she has some mental health issues.; 2/3/15, 6:31 PM
Big Mike said...: @madasHell, but it wasn't a one-night stand. They had sex that night, but they had consensual sex on at least one later occasion and maintained a Facebook friendship for some considerable length of time thereafter.

According to the girl, she didn't "realize" she had been raped until being persuaded by a professor that she had been raped.

Female professors are sick. (Meade, please unclench that fist. Thank you.); 2/3/15, 6:41 PM
Virgil Hilts said...: Don't they teach young men about the "hot crazy matrix" in Germany.; 2/3/15, 6:42 PM
Quaestor said...: Because they are cowards? That is my working assumption until the evidence shows a better explanation.

That wouldn't be my assumption. Columbia hoped to achieve by humiliation and ostracism what they couldn't pull off in their Star Chamber.; 2/3/15, 6:46 PM
chuck said...: Is why I don't give Columbia money. Ah, my callers say, it's for the students. Ah, I say, they would be better off elsewhere.; 2/3/15, 6:48 PM
madAsHell said...: Her Facebook page shows that she likes to color her hair blue-green. I'm guessing that she hasn't come to grips with her orientation.

I think she's going to give Sandra Fluke some competition as the poster child for the narrative.; 2/3/15, 6:49 PM
jr565 said...: She had sex with him one more time after then incident? Not rape.; 2/3/15, 6:54 PM
tim maguire said...: Madashell, did you read her post about attending the SOTU? She is shocked, SHOCKED! that John Kerry didn't know who she is.; 2/3/15, 6:58 PM
traditionalguy said...: Sounds like she finally realized that giving it away without money/marriage exchange means he had his way with her for which he must PAY.

The War to Get Paid. We all know that is why the College Presidents always chicken ou...it's the money they get paid stupid.; 2/3/15, 7:00 PM
walter said...: Has her art project been graded? Will the mattress be turned into an installation? Sold on the art market? Movie?; 2/3/15, 7:01 PM
Spiros Pappas said...: This man should just sue Columbia and this young woman. He'll get everything out in the open and a few dollars to help alleviate the PTSD he's undoubtedly suffering from.; 2/3/15, 7:02 PM
Quaestor said...: Female professors are sick

Much too heterogeneous a category to be so generalized. What's sick and destructive are:

1) Women's Studies, a self-sustaining academic Tartarus of scorned women who sublimate sexual fulfillment by tenure.

2) African-American Studies, a conspiracy intended to keep NCAA sports team swell-supplied with athletically gifted players regardless of scholastic achievement.

3) Critical Race Theory, a fiction designed to keep Al Sharpton on TV and out of jail.

4) Post-modernism, Progressive academia's next-to-last attempt to replace Enlightenment Liberalism with Stalinism

5) AGW Theory, Progressive academia's last attempt to replace Enlightenment Liberalism with Stalinism, AKA the Final Solution of the Liberty Question in America; 2/3/15, 7:05 PM
walter said...: So..she is now "married to" a woman?; 2/3/15, 7:06 PM
m stone said...: This will not be resolved. Someone is lying and will not fess up. A bitter root that will fester in someone's heart and destroy at least one party.; 2/3/15, 7:14 PM
I Have Misplaced My Pants said...: I like how identifying as a feminist automatically = being against rape.

I guess those of us who reject the feminist label are pro-rape.

Sigh.; 2/3/15, 7:15 PM
walter said...: Well..some folks want to own the definition of "social justice" too.; 2/3/15, 7:28 PM
Quaestor said...: I guess those of us who reject the feminist label are pro-rape.

And the little lady wins a cigar!; 2/3/15, 7:30 PM
Michael K said...: "Whether he raped her or not, her carrying the mattress around everywhere suggests she has some mental health issues."

Most of feminism has mental health issues. All of "transgender" people have mental health issues. Johns Hopkins, which was the first medical center to do sex change surgery in this country has closed their unit. The patients were mentally unstable and they decided that they were supporting a bunch of lunatics.; 2/3/15, 7:31 PM
YoungHegelian said...: Each & every one of us here knows people who we say to ourselves or to others in private conversations "You know, s/he just doesn't have both oars in the water".

Mental illness is an everyday fact of life. It's not like you have to look hard to find it.

Why is it difficult to say, after the evidence comes out, as it did in this case with the young man's exoneration & now his release of documentation showing a long term "friendly" relationship, that we're just dealing with a young woman (and maybe the young man as well) who has some serious mental health issues?; 2/3/15, 7:39 PM
Laura said...: What an ass to use an intact mattress for rape, when the accused could have made her carry a concrete slab around campus...; 2/3/15, 7:46 PM
Bruce Hayden said...: Women don't lie about rape!

This is the one that drives me crazy. Of course they lie about rape, and a lot of other things, and esp. when it comes to sex.

My partner raised 2 boys and 2 girls, and it was the girls who were the sneaky ones, and more likely to lie. No different when she was growing up with 2 brothers and 2 sisters.

Why are females possibly more likely to lie about sex than males? I would suggest that part of it is their two competing sexual strategies - sex with a partner/husband to bond him to raise her kids, and sex with an alpha male to get the best genes for her kids. The obvious problem is that there are a lot of times when the guys raising the kids aren't the ones who fathered them. My memory is that it was somewhere around 1/4 to 1/3 in cultures where it was easy to pass off someone else's kid as that of a husband.

The other place where this comes up is in the reality that males prefer females who are less experienced. Why? One big reason is that the fewer the guys a gal has slept with, the more likely that those are his kids he is raising. And, hence, the traditional value of virginity. What is wrong with a female being known as a slut? Her value on the marriage market is lower, presumably because of worries about paternity. The solution? Sneak around and sleep with the alpha males, but pretend that they are virtuous. And, if caught, scream "rape".; 2/3/15, 7:50 PM
David said...: Hegelian, mental health is a possible conclusion to be sure, but there's also a social pathology involved. The "relationship" described between these two apparently is not unusual. A friendship, or approximation thereof. Sleep overs with without major sexual content. Sex. Regret of sex. Later more sex if they get around to it. The anal only episode is kind of weird, but so is the whole relationship. It lacked commitment, connection, clarity, strong emotion or passion, apart from some episodes of sexual arousal. Quite pathetic really.; 2/3/15, 7:51 PM
rhhardin said...: There's a reason they rate women's craziness on a scale of 4 to 10.; 2/3/15, 7:55 PM
Curious George said...: Third date, casual relationship. And she taakes it in the ass.

I'll bet daddy is very, very proud. His little girl is all grown up.; 2/3/15, 7:58 PM
Christy said...: Didn't know about the anal sex aspect before reading the article. Changes everything. A previous vaginal relationship in no way implies acceptance of anal sex. Prevailing pressure to be cool about it keeps her ashamed and unwilling to talk about it until months later a respected authority figure gives her permission to be angry. Might not have happened that way, but if it did, I find it believable that she was raped even after all that time and the soi-distant friendly relationship she continued with her rapist.

Suddenly, affirmative consent become a much less absurd notion.; 2/3/15, 7:59 PM
Sebastian said...: “What really struck us as outrageously unfair,” says Nungesser’s father, Andreas Probosch, a schoolteacher who speaks near-perfect English, “was the university’s non-reaction to Emma Sulkowicz's public campaign. After investigating the allegations against Paul for seven months they found them not credible, but when Ms. Sulkowicz went to the press and claimed Columbia had swept everything under the rug, why didn’t they stand by his side and say, ‘We do have a process and we followed that process and we stand by the acquittal’? Instead they declined to comment and just threw him under the bus.”

Welcome to America!

Foreign students already pay the $$ for American liberal social policy. Now they will pay a personal price as well.; 2/3/15, 8:04 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: The under appreciated lawprof blogger Tom Smith:
What you want to do is draw a line from the land of the crazygirls through the center of the earth and then out to the other side of the world. That is maximum distance from the land of the crazygirls and that's where you want to dwell. This is nothing to fool around with, not even as a tourist.
Read the whole thing, as they say.
http://rightcoast.typepad.com/rightcoast/2008/12/beyond-the-planet-of-the-crazygirls-tom-smith-.html; 2/3/15, 8:06 PM
buwaya said...: In loco parentis for college students is stupid and backward. They are adults. This case and its like should be treated as any such complaint would be from any grown woman of any age in New York City. The university should worry about providing professors and facilities, not adjudicating social relations between its students.; 2/3/15, 8:17 PM
n.n said...: She consented to be reduced to a vagina. She then consented to be reduced to a rectum. Either she's confused or has lowered expectations about a human relationship. Either way, they are both prime candidates for the HPV vaccines. They should probably be monitored for HIV and other STDs too. Perhaps the mattress is a visual expression and outlet for a covert psychopathy.

That's one small step out of the kitchen, through the clinic, and into a taxable position. One giant leap to a sociopathic civilization. Losing our liberty...; 2/3/15, 8:18 PM
Brando said...: He ought to sue her for defamation, sue the university for enabling her project, and sue Sen. Gillibrand for spreading the defamation. Win or lose, there needs to be publicity demonstrating what dangerous lunatics these people are.; 2/3/15, 8:21 PM
David said...: FullMoon said...
.
She insisted on anal, not him.

Yup. Under Christy's theory, it seems she is therefore guilty of rape. Or would be if women were guilty of anything in these situations.; 2/3/15, 8:24 PM
David said...: Brando said...
He ought to sue her for defamation, sue the university for enabling her project, and sue Sen. Gillibrand for spreading the defamation. Win or lose, there needs to be publicity demonstrating what dangerous lunatics these people are.

He ought to pack it up and go back to Germany. Much safer.; 2/3/15, 8:25 PM
Chuck said...: From her Wikipedia page, I learned that she had been the guest of Sen. Kirsten Gilibrand at the State of the Union address.

What a circus.

She declined to cooperate in any prosecution, if there was to be one.; 2/3/15, 8:36 PM
walter said...: "Didn't know about the anal sex aspect before reading the article. Changes everything. A previous vaginal relationship in no way implies acceptance of anal sex. Prevailing pressure to be cool about it keeps her ashamed and unwilling to talk about it until months later a respected authority figure gives her permission to be angry."

There would be no "prevailing pressure" to revisit/maintain such an intermittent relationship..but that's what the facebook posts suggest she did. But in the end (no pun intended), it's a matter of consent..which is impossible to prove either way. All that's left are actions afterwards...which are muddy at best.; 2/3/15, 8:36 PM
Christy said...: Did she say she asked for anal sex or did he say she asked for anal sex?; 2/3/15, 8:37 PM
walter said...: I don't know where full moon got that version. The article here says "According to Nungesser, they briefly engaged in anal intercourse by mutual agreement"
But does it really matter who said what?; 2/3/15, 8:46 PM
madAsHell said...: Madashell, did you read her post about attending the SOTU?

No, not on first reading. I was confused as to why she kept a facebook page, and then I came to understand that is her grounding rod. Yes, that might be a pun.

Anal sex requires preparation. You have to evacuate the lower bowel with an enema. Otherwise, there is shit everywhere.

No, I've never had anal sex, but youtube is full of porn star interviews, and they can be quite enlightening.; 2/3/15, 8:46 PM
Quaestor said...: She declined to cooperate in any prosecution, if there was to be one.

Of course, slander is much safer than perjury.; 2/3/15, 8:47 PM
bleh said...: It is amazing to me that the campus feminists have their minds closed to the possibility that the accuser is a remorseful, shame filled slut. They assume the truth of the accusations by calling the accuser a survivor, and then pivot to the larger, systemic problem of campus rape when confronted with the facts of a single case.

Some women lie about rape. Why? Venegeance. Or attention seeking. It's no mystery.

The people those women hurt most of all are the women who are actually raped. By creating distrust of accusers, they enable actual rapists.; 2/3/15, 8:47 PM
Quaestor said...: Otherwise, there is shit everywhere.

That's how they nailed Oscar Wilde.; 2/3/15, 8:48 PM
bleh said...: I have no idea what actually happened in the Columbia case, but life experience has taught me to be skeptical. The post-incident facebook messages increase my skepticism. The "acquittal" in the university star chamber increases my skepticism even further.

In any event, this art installation would be considered harassment in almost any other context.; 2/3/15, 8:50 PM
Laslo Spatula said...: There is nothing called 'rape' anymore: it is all TBD - To Be Determined Later.

I am Laslo.; 2/3/15, 8:54 PM
jr565 said...: Didn't know about the anal sex aspect before reading the article. Changes everything

"Because anal
anal changes everything.
Anal, anal changes everything.
We think we know what we're doin'
That don't mean a thing
It's all in the past now
anal changes everything"
- sung to the tune of Cyndi Lauper's Money Changes Everything.; 2/3/15, 9:19 PM
Big Mike said...: In any event, this art installation would be considered harassment in almost any other context.

And this context, too, I think.; 2/3/15, 9:23 PM
jr565 said...: If rape has to be determined by someone telling you you may have been raped, you may not in fact have been raped.
Unless someone slipped you roofies and you woke up with a hurt butt. There is no suggestion that she was unconscious when making her conscious decisions.
So, probably not a rape.; 2/3/15, 9:24 PM
William said...: Anyone read about the Vanderbilt rape case. The girl didn't know she had been raped until she was shown pictures of it afterwards. The pictures had been taken by her boyfriend. When she was drunk and passed out, he invited some friends over to rape her. He took pictures to capture those very special moments. The "boy friend" was despicable beyond all measure......Women are capable of lying about rape, but, when it comes to bad behavior, men are capable of just about anything and taking pictures of the crime to memorialize the moment......There's not much to recommend the human race.; 2/3/15, 9:28 PM
The Godfather said...: On the one hand, this is a sad story about two particular young people. On that level, who, other than them and their families and friends, gives a sh*t?

But we need to care about the kind of society in which our young adults are living, our best and brightest in the case of Columbia, UVa, and other colleges where these things have been reported. I'm not a prude: When I was in college and law school I tried as hard to "get some" as anyone else. In those dark days, the girls were the ones that usually said "no". But now casual, uncommitted sex seems to have become the norm.

The ideal that was promoted by the female liberationists and Hugh Hefner was that men and women should just enjoy sex as a recreational activity, with no need for commitment much less love. We're there now.

Is this really the way we want the world to be?

Is there anything we can do to change it?; 2/3/15, 9:32 PM
walter said...: When one party drags a mattress around for publicity/art/activism, it starts to involve a larger audience.; 2/3/15, 9:37 PM
FullMoon said...: madAsHell said...
Anal sex requires preparation. You have to evacuate the lower bowel with an enema. Otherwise, there is shit everywhere.

No, I've never had anal sex, but youtube is full of porn star interviews, and they can be quite enlightening.

Hopefully college students use free condoms; 2/3/15, 9:53 PM
MadisonMan said...: William: relevance to the Columbia case? None.

Columbia students and faculty by and large seem insufferable. There are likely exceptions. I'm glad my kids didn't go there.; 2/3/15, 10:00 PM
walter said...: "See how that works?"

No..how does that work?
It reads to some as you changing both of their claims.; 2/3/15, 10:07 PM
walter said...: Well..she Emma's account and followed up with "if" it happened that way. You came up with an account neither suggested.

Doesn't "work"; 2/3/15, 10:22 PM
walter said...: Some clever folk have probably come up with a term for this..I'll call it "linkbits". Information that informs a story, is linked to, but not mentioned directly.
The article here has the embedded link to:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/04/us/fight-against-sex-crimes-holds-colleges-to-account.html?_r=0

"They started to have sex, she said, but then he began to choke her, slapped her face, pinned her arms and penetrated her anally. She said she had screamed for him to stop, but that he would not."

I suspect Christine followed that link to get her opinion. It's in this sentence "While Sulkowicz has always said that they started out having consensual sex, her account diverges"; 2/3/15, 10:52 PM
Alex said...: Maybe she can marry Sandra Fluke.; 2/3/15, 11:47 PM
Achilles said...: The whole point of this story is division. They don't care if he goes to jail. In fact it is better for them if he gets off. Just like when they picked Williams who was justifiably shot By police. It works better for them if the perpetrators are innocent.; 2/3/15, 11:56 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: My guess is that she wanted anal sex, it grossed him out and he couldn't deliver (it's kind of homo), and now she's getting her revenge.
Dames.; 2/4/15, 12:31 AM
Zach said...: This wasn't "casual, uncommitted" sex. Read the article. Read the facebook messages. This is a multi year flirtation between two people that led to sex on multiple occasions. These people are texting and flirting with each other a lot, over an extended period.

On Aug. 29, two days after the alleged rape, Nungesser messaged Sulkowicz on Facebook to say, “Small shindig in our room tonight—bring cool freshmen.” Her response:

lol yusss

Also I feel like we need to have some real time where we can talk about life and thingz

because we still haven’t really had a paul-emma chill sesh since summmmerrrr

Actually, another set of messages from Emma about a week before the incident seems to cut to the heart of the matter:

dude

If I have one piece of advice

It's to just dive in

and not think about how you're with [Redacted] and [Redacted]

Because [Redacted] is really wonderful

and you are obviously the best

paul!!!

It seems to me that there's another reading of the publicly available facts (minus the dispute about the night in question):

Emma has an unrequited crush on Paul. Paul flirts with Emma but dates other girls. They have sex on the night in question. Paul isn't interested in a relationship and

Nungesser claims that these exchanges represent only a small portion of their friendly communications, which also included numerous text messages. But he also says that during those weeks, they were starting to drift apart; they saw each other at meetings and parties, but plans for one-on-one get-togethers always seemed to end in “missed connections.” Nungesser says that he assumed it was simply a matter of hanging out with a new crowd and, in Sulkowicz’s case, being in a new relationship.

Paul dates other girls and the relationship peters out. Emma waits a while, and starts what can only be described as a harassment campaign. There are suggestions that she solicited the other two accusers and urged them to submit complaints; when this failed to get Paul expelled, she started carrying around the mattress.

Obviously, you can't prove Paul's story any more than you can prove Emma's. But the "psycho stalker ex" story is his defense -- if you can't disprove it, he's established reasonable doubt of his guilt.

Once again, the idea that you can dispense with burden of proof in these situations is mystifying to me.; 2/4/15, 12:53 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: "In fact it is better for them if he gets off."

This gets to the nibis hens of the issues.; 2/4/15, 12:57 AM
Quaestor said...: Maybe she can marry Sandra Fluke.

Could we put that in a form of a motion, adhering to Robots Rules of Order and all? I'd surely like to second that motion so we don't have to finance the Fluke/Sulkowicz love life! (Well, I hope we don't. If Fluke/Sulkowicz trade their food stamps for a goddamn dildo better call the law, cause somebody's gonna die!)

P.S.
Robot's Rules are more useful for our 21st Century world with our flying cars, anti-gravity belts, and spaceships and stuff. Robert's Rules make no allowance for cyborgs, surrogates, droids, drones, etc.; 2/4/15, 1:02 AM
furious_a said...: According to her Facebook page, Ms Sulkowicz "started working at a condom store in NJ".

Tuition for the Dalton School and Columbia and now this on top of the third-date shagging and mattress-dragging? Her poor parents.; 2/4/15, 1:06 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: As Jerky Boys knew decades ago, sue everyone.

We need lawyers roughing 80 hour weeks at $439 per hour to start.

Lawyers will pay for these lawsuits by suing their buddies with deep pockets.

Saul's called yo: Saul done been called.; 2/4/15, 1:08 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: More than all else ('till nuke time*) what matters is lawfare.

They know better than to sue their buddies now, but that, as must all things post- atomic extrapolation, end.

I accept numerous applications of the term "robot" that apply to me, especially if thinking in terms without special attention paid to time.; 2/4/15, 1:24 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: Perhaps this is Catholic in that instances drawn out and hyper-evolved constitute more than brief inspirations quickly replaced.; 2/4/15, 1:39 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: Would you rather "keep your head on a swivel" in the NFL against Warren Sapp or in a hotel room?

If you answer you are racist.

Keep it shut.; 2/4/15, 1:47 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: I am regarding this toward an abyss.

You understand.; 2/4/15, 2:52 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: So Rogers wins, Warren losses in terms long.; 2/4/15, 2:58 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: I have a lot a memorable experiences yet refuse, despite and because of the intensity of passion, to turn my back on (our) future.

We are here, in it to win it, and cognizant.; 2/4/15, 3:13 AM
Aussie Pundit said...: Anal sex requires preparation. You have to evacuate the lower bowel with an enema. Otherwise, there is shit everywhere.
This is flat out wrong.

I can tell you from personal experience that there will not be 'shit everywhere.'

Anyone who drops an enema in preparation is crazy. Maybe porn stars do that, but ordinary, non-porn-star people don't.; 2/4/15, 4:21 AM
bleh said...: Never take a girl's butt virginity without going through the motions of a relationship. At least a month of dating should follow. Appearances, feelings and reputations must be maintained.

Not saying that's what happened here. But it that is what happened, Paul might have learned a tough lesson. Most women are crazy, skilled liars. Tread carefully.; 2/4/15, 6:12 AM
Douglas B. Levene said...: Two points:
1) Her claim, unlike many of these she said/he said stories, actually states a good case for rape. It is the law in every state that forcing anal sex on an unwilling woman who had consented to vaginal sex is rape. This contrasts to many of the cases we read about, where the woman claims that it was sexual assault because her consent was invalid due to the fact she had a couple of drinks.
2) If the mattress girl had done immediately to the hospital, then there would now be forensic evidence that would be highly probative. Her claim is that she was violently anally raped. If that's true, then there would have been bruises to her neck and anus that a medical examination would have documented. If that's not true, then the absence of bruises would also have been documented. Her failure to go immediately to hospital or the police (who would have taken her to a hospital) is the primary reason she has no case.; 2/4/15, 6:30 AM
iowan2 said...: 86 posts and no resolution.

There is only one way to resolve these situations. The American judicial system. As some famous person said, it's a messy flawed monster of a system..........Its just better than any other system ever used or proposed.; 2/4/15, 6:39 AM
JHapp said...: I would like to see a poll as to who is most likely telling the truth here and on Drudge. It appears to me that the parties involved would also welcome same.; 2/4/15, 7:35 AM
Curious George said...: "Terry said...
My guess is that she wanted anal sex, it grossed him out and he couldn't deliver (it's kind of homo), and now she's getting her revenge.
Dames."

Alternative theory:

Better to be a victim than an ass whore.; 2/4/15, 7:42 AM
Brando said...: I'll go ahead and ask what everyone else here is wondering--is she carrying around a real mattress, or is it one of those inflatable deals? Because I have a hard time believing even a strong young person can carrying around a real mattress all day long.; 2/4/15, 8:15 AM
Michael K said...: The solution is obvious. Ivy League colleges need to go back to single sex institutions. Women are too delicate to be around men all the time.; 2/4/15, 8:20 AM
Brando said...: There's a good followup in the Washington Post today--Sukowicz is saying she felt betrayed by Cathy Young's questions because Young is "anti-feminist" (because of course nothing is more feminist than taking every alleged rape victim at their word, no questions asked).

The SJW Left has infected itself with its own stupidity and fascism. They are cancerous rot for our society.; 2/4/15, 8:26 AM
Brando said...: "The solution is obvious. Ivy League colleges need to go back to single sex institutions. Women are too delicate to be around men all the time."

At least some are. Perhaps they'd be better off in a sheltered indoctrination center, safe from "triggering" words, knowing that nothing will ever make them safe from rampant rape, and always being told that they're all winners. Sure, they won't be functional adults, but maybe that'd leave room for actual educational institutions to flourish.; 2/4/15, 8:28 AM
Brando said...: I sometimes wonder if this is really a widespread problem at colleges (the fascism of SJW activists and PC hysteria I mean--while one rape is too many, I don't think it's occurring anywhere near the numbers the Left is citing) or if it just seems that way because of the cases being publicized. It's just not looking like a safe place for independent, normal students who just want to learn, live, and graduate--not when just anyone can accuse you of anything and ruin your life.; 2/4/15, 8:32 AM
dbp said...: There are a couple of things that struck me about the story.

1. The post "night in question" FB and other evidence points to Emma not feeling like she was raped in the days that followed.

2. The guy had screen shots of their social media messages? Who does that? They are exonerating but why would he think to save them?

If we take these two things together, then a credible scenario emerges. The night in question, they engage in anal intercourse and it is not pleasant. They break this off but the event creates an awkward situation. Eventually, this jells in her mind as rape and she pursues a resolution to that conclusion. On his part, that event makes him want to document further friendly gestures because the event was so creepy, he does not know what her future feelings on it may be.

From the standpoint of justice: In what sane word would a third party (police, courts, school administrative proceedings) decide to punish a guy, when the "victim" only comes to the conclusion she was wronged after months of soul-searching?; 2/4/15, 8:40 AM
MayBee said...: How in the world did Sen Gillibrand decide to bring her to the SOTU?

Batshitcraziness all around.; 2/4/15, 8:42 AM
damikesc said...: Whether he did it or not, the reaction to this event and events like it make it harder for men and women to have healthy relationships. It undermines the fundamental trust necessary for a a relationship and family. I wonder if that isn't the point. With no one left, our only source of comfort is the state.

The college --- who is in interested in nailing him to the wall --- said he didn't do it.

She should be sued for slander.

And anal sex with an unwilling partner? Good luck with that. Hardly easy to execute with somebody quite willing. Trying it without lube is painful, don't you know?; 2/4/15, 8:49 AM
Brando said...: "The guy had screen shots of their social media messages? Who does that? They are exonerating but why would he think to save them?"

It might be that they stay on Facebook until deleted, and he had no reason to delete them and it never occurred to her to go back and delete her own comments.

"From the standpoint of justice: In what sane word would a third party (police, courts, school administrative proceedings) decide to punish a guy, when the "victim" only comes to the conclusion she was wronged after months of soul-searching?"

While the delay may point against rape, I wouldn't say it necessarily means there was no rape--victims may have a lot of reasons to delay reporting or deal with trauma. In this case though, and considering her continued voluntary interactions with him, this strongly suggests it wasn't rape. (She claims she was sober and conscious, and he violently forced her--so it is highly unlikely she would be confused about what happened, or only learn about it later. I'm not surprised the school found against her. But all the more reason she should not be allowed to publicly defame him).; 2/4/15, 8:55 AM
MarkW said...: "2. The guy had screen shots of their social media messages? Who does that?"

No, he wouldn't need to take the screen shots at the time -- they're preserved by the various systems. So the logical assumption is he took screen shots in preparation for his defense before he deleted his accounts.; 2/4/15, 8:56 AM
Laslo Spatula said...: Close to a hundred comments in a thread with anal sex and I haven't said anything inappropriate.

I am disappointed in myself.

I am Laslo.; 2/4/15, 9:05 AM
damikesc said...: 2. The guy had screen shots of their social media messages? Who does that? They are exonerating but why would he think to save them?

Facebook messages don't go away. He said he decided to close all of his social media accounts but logically decided to screen cap what was there for his own protection.

While the delay may point against rape, I wouldn't say it necessarily means there was no rape--victims may have a lot of reasons to delay reporting or deal with trauma.

I just don't buy this. What other crime has the same issue?

Do victims of mugging wait WEEKS to report it? Assault victims? Arson victims?

No. It's ONLY rape that has this. It is insane and illogical and we need to stop coddling this nonsense.

If you're raped, go to the police. If you do not, then no, I will not believe you. At all.

...even if you were raped (which, no, you probably were not), you're STILL loathesome for not doing anything to stop it from happening to others.; 2/4/15, 9:07 AM
Known Unknown said...: Here Laslo,

a link for you.; 2/4/15, 9:15 AM
Kyzer SoSay said...: War is peace.

Freedom is slavery.

Sex is rape.

This little slut is lying. She needs to trade her mattress in for a broom and start sweeping the walkways there, then when she's done, she can come cook me dinner.; 2/4/15, 9:21 AM
Birches said...: Notice that it's mostly feminist males who are getting slapped with rape charges.

Most of the other college aged men know to keep out of crazy.; 2/4/15, 9:36 AM
Brando said...: "Notice that it's mostly feminist males who are getting slapped with rape charges."

Two theories--one is that men who openly call themselves "feminist" (that is, aren't simply men who respect women and treat them as equals, but rather have bought into making a big show of joining SJW fauxminist causes) think they have a sort of political cover (like "I can't be racist, I voted for Obama!") so they push the envelope when it comes to harassing behavior or even rape. Two, when men act like that--making a show of their "feminist" credentials--the SJW woman will suspect (often correctly) that something is afoot and see that guy as a snake in the grass. Men of the right, often sensitive to being labelled "oppressors" with the "wrong" beliefs, will tend to watch their step more around the SJW woman.; 2/4/15, 11:23 AM
Lewis Wetzel said...: Suppose you are a male college student, and you have a short, sexual relationship with a coed, and months after the breakup you get pissed off at her for some reason (or maybe you're just crazy), and you remember she bit your chest or scratched your back during sex.
Can you file assault charges against her with the college sexual assault people?
This is frikkin' nuts.; 2/4/15, 11:35 AM
SayAahh said...: Inquiring minds want to know if it was a Proctopedic mattress.; 2/4/15, 2:15 PM