Althouse: "What we have to figure out here is the perpetrators and whether they were self-radicalized..."

January 7, 2015

"What we have to figure out here is the perpetrators and whether they were self-radicalized..."

"... or whether they were individuals who fought in Syria and Iraq and came back, or whether they were actually directed by ISIS or al Qaeda."

143 comments:

NotWhoIUsedtoBe said...: No, we have to find out who they are. Period.; 1/7/15, 9:09 AM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past.; 1/7/15, 9:15 AM
Paul said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 1/7/15, 9:18 AM
Paul said...: No, not 'colonialist past', it's immigration. Britain, Germany, France, Spain, etc.. and yes, the United States, have let him MILLIONS of Muslims forgetting that not all that long ago we had THREE CRUSADES against the Muslims that invaded the Holy Land and alot of the West.

We are at war, a real war, with the Muslim world. Our politicians are just to afraid to admit it was a mistake to let them in.; 1/7/15, 9:20 AM
Anonymous said...: Blogger AReasonableMan said...
or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past.

1/7/15, 9:15 AM
-----------------------

Mais oui...they are all afflicted with Post Colonial Stress Disorder.; 1/7/15, 9:21 AM
Anonymous said...: "... or whether they were individuals who fought in Syria and Iraq and came back, or whether they were actually directed by ISIS or al Qaeda."

The options aren't just:

1. self taught loners off the internets or
2. a plot by external AQ or ISIL leadership with local guns.

Other options include:

3. a home grown group, radicalized by local Imams
4. an actual group of external terrorists (e.g. or 911 attackers)
5. state sponsored attack, e.g. Iran; 1/7/15, 9:22 AM
traditionalguy said...: Is it just a few mentally persons ill doing workplace violence? Or is it a Caliphate Seal Team Six operation?

Either way, the Franks stopped it once before in 732 and will stop it again.; 1/7/15, 9:23 AM
Curious George said...: "AReasonableMan said...
or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past."

This is so painfully stupid.; 1/7/15, 9:23 AM
Anonymous said...: No, not 'colonialist past', it's immigration. Britain, Germany, France, Spain, etc.. and yes, the United States, have let him MILLIONS of Muslims forgetting that not all that long ago we had THREE CRUSADES against the Muslims that invaded the Holy Land and alot of the West.

Colonists, not immigrants. Therein lies the problem...; 1/7/15, 9:23 AM
NotWhoIUsedtoBe said...: ARM you're like a parody.

Are any of the Indians in London murdering English people?

Or any of the Africans?

Do Vietnamese in America murder anyone?

Perhaps something is going on besides a reaction to events that happened before any of the perpetrators were even born.; 1/7/15, 9:30 AM
Anonymous said...: The spooky part is that Rationalizing Man appears to think he's defending muzzies by calling them inevitably violent.; 1/7/15, 9:35 AM
President-Mom-Jeans said...: Fuck you UnReasonableBitch.

I wish your mother had prevented the inevitable legacy of your constant apologia for islamic savages by coast hangering the shit out of you second trimester.; 1/7/15, 9:35 AM
President-Mom-Jeans said...: Damn autocorrect.

Coat, not coast.

I also would have accepted a tumble down a flight of stairs.; 1/7/15, 9:36 AM
NotWhoIUsedtoBe said...: Blame the victim! That's OK sometimes!

Sorry you go murdered, I'm going to make excuses for the people who made your final moments full of terror and suffering.; 1/7/15, 9:38 AM
garage mahal said...: Fuck you UnReasonableBitch.

I wish your mother had prevented the inevitable legacy of your constant apologia for islamic savages by coast hangering the shit out of you second trimester.

Are there ANY moderate Christians that will condemn this ugliness?; 1/7/15, 9:51 AM
Gahrie said...: or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past

Because that of course would make the attack OK.; 1/7/15, 9:51 AM
Anonymous said...: or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past

LOL, then where are all the Mexicans and Peruvians shooting up Madrid?

Or those Viets using AK's at the Bastille?; 1/7/15, 10:01 AM
President-Mom-Jeans said...: Don't you know it is only those extreme radical Christians who condemmn abortion?

Not to mention that my religion (or lack thereof as the case may be) has nothing to do with my utter contempt for your disgusting justification of the indefensible. Unlike the paedophile worshippers who killed at least 12 innocent people over a goddamn cartoon.

"Ugliness" is pixelated words on a screen to you. Not islamic murderers which are just the inevitable legacy of brutal colonialism.

Again, fuck you.; 1/7/15, 10:02 AM
buwaya said...: Everybody has a long and brutal colonialist past, not excepting Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia. Many European countries are probably still behind in terms of revenge accounting against them.; 1/7/15, 10:08 AM
tim maguire said...: garage mahal said...
Fuck you UnReasonableBitch.

I wish your mother had prevented the inevitable legacy of your constant apologia for islamic savages by coast hangering the shit out of you second trimester.

Are there ANY moderate Christians that will condemn this ugliness?

As usually, we can all depend on garage to draw the right parallels and zero in on the real issue.; 1/7/15, 10:12 AM
garage mahal said...: Not to mention that my religion (or lack thereof as the case may be) has nothing to do with my utter contempt for your disgusting justification of the indefensible

I have not defended anything, I am asking moderates to condemn your disgusting attacks. But, it doesn't look like that is going to happen.; 1/7/15, 10:26 AM
Gahrie said...: or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past

By the way, during that colonial past, the people living in the countries colonized by the French (like all western colonial powers) had a higher standard of living than they had ever had before, or since.; 1/7/15, 10:31 AM
Quaestor said...: Our Fearless Leader has condemned the murders without once mentioning Islam or its pedophile prophet.

And the surrender monkeys assuage their cowardice by tweeting je suis Charlie.

We are witnessing the death of a civilization, my friends. Some of us will fight, but only a minority. The rest are too contaminated with every little leftist meme that has emerged since Kerouac hit the road to do anything more virile whine to their iPhones.

Keep an eye on the hipsters. Soon you'll see hilal cafés opening in trendy neighborhoods, and burkhas being worn to gallery openings. When that happens you can kiss the entire Western achievement goodbye.; 1/7/15, 10:31 AM
FullMoon said...: garage mahal said... [hush][hide comment]

Fuck you UnReasonableBitch.

P-M-J I wish your mother had prevented the inevitable legacy of your constant apologia for islamic savages by coast hangering the shit out of you second trimester.

Are there ANY moderate Christians that will condemn this ugliness?

I guess I missed it, has P-M-J been slaughtering people with bombs and guns and knives lately? If so,I condemn it.; 1/7/15, 10:37 AM
MayBee said...: This is one way to ensure the future does not belong to those who slander the Prophet of Islam.; 1/7/15, 10:38 AM
Quaestor said...: "or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past."

A prime example of my cultural contamination thesis, no?

If France ever had a long and brutal colonialist past, it's high time France considered a long and brutal colonialist future, because one thing has become abundantly clear: Muslims can't be trusted.

And just who started this colonialist thing, ARM? Being an ignorant fool you'll probably squeal "Crusades!"; 1/7/15, 10:43 AM
kcom said...: "Are there ANY moderate Christians that will condemn this ugliness?"

Maybe I missed it but I didn't see any claim that the author was representing Christianity or had any ties thereto.

Non sequitur much?; 1/7/15, 10:44 AM
President-Mom-Jeans said...: Bitchtits you stupid fat fuck. So much more concerned about words on a screen than with the murder of a dozen innocent people.

You hate Wisconsin so much, go live in Fallujah. Or how about just Dearborn?

Your faux outrage is ridiculous. I hope you choke on the next artery clogging fried product you shove in your ignorant mouth.; 1/7/15, 10:45 AM
kcom said...: "or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past."

Way to infantilize an entire civilization, ARM. In case you hadn't noticed, long before there was a modern France, armies of Islamists were rampaging across the world killing and converting foreigners to their religion. They don't need to be treated as children. They have and do make up their own minds about which values are important to them and how they behave based on those values. They've been doing so for 1400 years. None of that is within our control.; 1/7/15, 10:53 AM
Quaestor said...: "The future must not belong to those who slander the Prophet of Islam." Obama's words, not mine.

The insipid speech Obama delivered to the UN should be read and appreciated by everyone who loves liberty for the wretched wholesale abnegation of our heritage it is.

Read it and weep.; 1/7/15, 10:54 AM
Drago said...: Fullmoon: "I guess I missed it, has P-M-J been slaughtering people with bombs and guns and knives lately? If so,I condemn it."

You have to remember that garage is a big time supporter of Hamas, so attacking Christians at the very moment of yet another attack by muslims is simply par for the course for him.

AReasonableMeltdown is simply a parody at this point.

I fully expect AReasonableMeltdown to call for the disarming of Christians before they can cause any discomfort to muslims.; 1/7/15, 11:02 AM
Quaestor said...: In case you hadn't noticed, long before there was a modern France, armies of Islamists were rampaging across the world killing and converting foreigners to their religion.

France was born in resistance to Muslim colonialism. France died when she forgot her past. What we saw today is just the twitching of the corpse.; 1/7/15, 11:10 AM
Drago said...: I understand that the islamists have their own version of the Venceremos Brigade.

I would expect AReasonableMeltdown to consider jumping in right up until he learned that instead of intimidating farmers and bourgeois peasants you would actually have to confront others wielding weapons.

That would cure him of his desire to help the islamist terrorists throw off the yoke of colonialism..at least physically.; 1/7/15, 11:13 AM
CWJ said...: Sigh,

ARM derails the thread at the second comment. Mission accomplished. Can't you see that he just kicked the anthill to watch you all storm about?

On a deeper level, he's correct to the extent that people from the former colonies enjoy greater rights to emigrate to France.; 1/7/15, 11:22 AM
Michael K said...: "In case you hadn't noticed, long before there was a modern France, armies of Islamists were rampaging across the world killing and converting foreigners to their religion"

Amen. Muslims are a people who harbor a barbarian philosophy and need to recognize it. The political left is good at excusing things they don't have to face every day.; 1/7/15, 11:25 AM
Drago said...: CWJ: "On a deeper level, he's correct to the extent that people from the former colonies enjoy greater rights to emigrate to France."

I would hardly call that a "deeper level".

As has been pointed out already in this thread, you don't see non-muslim immigrants from India, Vietnamese, etc committed these acts.

It is only the adherents of the leftists favorite religion performing these acts on a global scale.; 1/7/15, 11:26 AM
Michael said...: ARM

Pretty funny, actually, considering the lengths that the brutal French had bent over backwards to buy their way out of Islamic violence. I suppose you mean that they had it coming and I can certainly understand that is your world view.; 1/7/15, 11:26 AM
Michael K said...: A helpful primer for ARM on Islam.

As night follows day, progressive governments in Europe and the United States are already straining to pretend that this latest atrocity is the wanton work of “violent extremists,” utterly unrelated to Islam. You are to believe, then, that François Hollande, Barack Obama, David Cameron, and their cohort of non-Muslim Islamophiles are better versed in sharia than the Muslim scholars who’ve dedicated their lives to its study and have endorsed such scholarly works as Reliance.

There is a link to "Reliance" for you ARM.; 1/7/15, 11:32 AM
Owen said...: What we see (I think properly*) as an atrocity, they see as part of our collective conditioning. We have insulted the Prophet and that must be punished. This was a "teaching moment" and never mind all the "Je suis Charlie" gestures and candle-lighting bathos, we have been taught. Self-censorship proceeds apace, and thus the favorable environment in which the colonization can flourish.

*"Properly" is my "valorization" of a Western rational democratic point of view, and merely betrays how that system victimizes me. Sorry.; 1/7/15, 11:42 AM
Drago said...: Any Liberal: On the one hand we have mass murder. On the other hand we have manspreading. Who is to say which is worse?; 1/7/15, 11:55 AM
Big Mike said...: Je suis Charlie; 1/7/15, 12:05 PM
wildswan said...: This wasn't about "France's colonialist past", it was about cartoons of Mohammed. And there's a video up in which you see these guys shoot someone lying wounded in the street. And they shout Allahu Akbar in other videos. But some of us are still stupid colonialists and we explain other people's acts to them instead of listening to what they say about themselves and looking at what they do.; 1/7/15, 12:06 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: AReasonableMan unreasonably wrote:
" . . . whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past."
The marxist interpretation of history: all social pathologies are a result of economics, in this case exploiter/exploitee conflict. Also note that AReasonableMan believes that history is teleological, the "brutal colonialist past" "inevitably" caused today's terrorist attack in Paris.
The funny thing about marxists is that their entire shtick rests on having figured out how history works. They believe they understand history the way an engineer understands how a steam engine works. In the real world, marxists have been miserable at understanding history.
First World War One was end stage capitalism. Then the Great Depression was supposed to be end stage capitalism. Then World War Two was supposed to be end stage capitalism. After World War Two, the workers in the West were clearly better off than the workers in socialist countries by virtually every measure.
Yet some fools still believe in a marxist interpretation of history because they believe that it is "reasonable".; 1/7/15, 12:09 PM
HoodlumDoodlum said...: Holy shit, ARM was being sarcastic, right? Tell me that's sarcasm, man.; 1/7/15, 12:12 PM
CWJ said...: Drago,

You object to "deeper"? Fine, I'm not wedded to it.

But you did add "non-muslim" to John Lynch's characterization of the groups named, and there are plenty of muslim "Indians" aka Pakistanis, and a significant subset of them are causing problems in Britain today.

I don't think you can separate the UK's and France's colonial pasts from the mix of people emigrating to these two countries. ARM is correct only in a structural sense, not the inflamatory sense his use of the word "brutal" intended to convey. The truth of his comment is deeper than his words on the surface.; 1/7/15, 12:15 PM
PB said...: Find them, kill them, hang their bodies in the public square and toss shoes at their bodies. Strike back twice as hard, right Obama?; 1/7/15, 12:15 PM
HoodlumDoodlum said...: Can we lock up Nakoula Nakoula again? That damn video keeps forcing believers in Islam to kill nonbelievers, it seems. I condemn that murderous video--the future does not belong to those who slander the Prophet of Islam. I guess someone just rid the world of those turbulent slanderous journalists.; 1/7/15, 12:15 PM
buwaya said...: The obvious response to this, on the part of a traditional sort of French government (the "permanent" bureaucratic government, not the elected one), would be to ban immigration from Muslim countries. Perhaps, in the French style, in some underhanded, understated way.; 1/7/15, 12:19 PM
RecChief said...: AReasonableMan said...
or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past.

Maybe they are the legacy of France's experiment in Multiculturalism.

Let me guess, this wouldn't have happened if CharlieHebdo hadn't incited these men?

You're a waste of oxygen; 1/7/15, 12:34 PM
Matt Sablan said...: Drawing upsetting pictures is not reason to murder anyone.

I mean, no one's gone to kill Jack Chick yet.; 1/7/15, 12:36 PM
Alexander said...: Let's go ahead an knock this nonsense out:

Anyone who pulls the Colonialism! card, please answer me this.

Is it your position that European peoples have, through actions of their ancestors, lost the right to maintain their homelands, their faiths, their cultures? Are their children and grandchildren guilty at birth of an offense so large that only through de facto genocide can they be absolved?

Please, tell us what you really think.

I won't bother asking why a Spaniard colonizing the new world is bad but Islam rampaging up through Iberia wasn't. Why the Union Jack over Calcutta was a travesty but the Turkish one over Constantinople isn't - intellectual dishonesty comes naturally to you lot.; 1/7/15, 12:40 PM
Jaq said...: It is only "reasonable" to apologize for these bloodthirsty savages.; 1/7/15, 12:42 PM
Jaq said...: Isn't the fact that they have all been indoctrinated with the most pernicious terror manual of all time enough to settle the question of the headline of this post?; 1/7/15, 12:45 PM
Wince said...: John Kerry read a statement in French, so we got that going for us.; 1/7/15, 12:50 PM
Drago said...: CWJ: "But you did add "non-muslim" to John Lynch's characterization of the groups named, and there are plenty of muslim "Indians" aka Pakistanis, and a significant subset of them are causing problems in Britain today"

I specifically avoided lumping in Pakistanis with current day Indians for precisely the reason you raise.

Has AReasonableMeltdown started an #IllRideWithYou campaign for muslims who feel uncomfortable living and interacting with Westerners yet?

How about an #IllHoldYourGunForYou campaign?

BTW, it's a good thing there is such solid gun control in France, otherwise those victims might have fired back at their muslim attackers and somebody whose life mattered (muslims) might have been injured.; 1/7/15, 12:53 PM
damikesc said...: I have not defended anything, I am asking moderates to condemn your disgusting attacks. But, it doesn't look like that is going to happen.

Didn't see him citing or praising Jesus or God in his attack. Not sure how it's my job to condemn him. I don't spend my time condemning all things I disagree with, sorry.; 1/7/15, 12:54 PM
Drago said...: Alexander: "Is it your position that European peoples have, through actions of their ancestors, lost the right to maintain their homelands, their faiths, their cultures? Are their children and grandchildren guilty at birth of an offense so large that only through de facto genocide can they be absolved?"

The leftist answer to both of those questions is "yes". (with obvious exceptions for leftists, of course).; 1/7/15, 12:58 PM
Wince said...: Can anyone confirm the report that one of the cops killed in Paris was himself a Muslim?; 1/7/15, 1:07 PM
Alexander said...: Drago,

Of course it is. But you must get them on record saying it before you allow them to start talking about cultural crimes or how murdered Parisians is a just retaliation. Otherwise you are on their turf.

It is an impossible question for them. As you say, the answer is yes, but only the most obtuse will recognize that trying to convince multiculturalism in France by starting with "All frenchman should die and their women raped" is not going to win many converts. On the other hand, being forced to state that French people have a right to a homeland and a culture openly contradicts everything they are actually pushing for.

Never surrender, never back down, never moderate. Every trace of our culture and blood and history is on the line.; 1/7/15, 1:07 PM
Unknown said...: My wife, who was from Avignon, was a big fan of Charlie Hebdo. Sometimes at 3am in Avignon a car would drive around, blasting at extremely high volume some sermon by some pissed-off sounding imam. Popular hiphop always seemed to throw in lines like "I'm not a suicide-bomber, man, but I know how they feel."

Arab "youths" walked together in packs and the sight of young women particularly riled them up, so they'd show off to each other, and of course you never knew if they might have a gun. They were excited by the fear they could inspire.

It's been obvious for a long time that you can't ignore the banlieues forever.; 1/7/15, 1:13 PM
n.n said...: "Refugees". Does France also have a DRAT (Displace, Replace, Abort, and Tax) policy?; 1/7/15, 1:27 PM
n.n said...: Oh, well, where Western colonialism failed, the Chinese are likely to succeed. The typical "human rights" groups care neither about colonialism nor premeditated abortion (i.e. intentional collateral damage). The Western empires would have been better of supporting the native people, but instead chose to compromise with Marxists and their local prodigies (e.g. Mandela, Mugabe).; 1/7/15, 1:32 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: As a moderate, I find religious fundamentalism difficult to understand. Nonetheless, I would absolutely defend the right of PMJ to express his views.

To ignore the unusually fraught history between the French and their colonial subjugates seems foolish to me, both in terms of understanding the current ethnic makeup of France and the underlying conflicts between the various groups.; 1/7/15, 1:34 PM
Jaq said...: Remember when George W Bush was ridiculed for saying they hate our freedom?

"They hate our freedoms -- our freedom of religion, our freedom of speech, our freedom to vote and assemble and disagree with each other."

-- George W. Bush, Address to a Joint Session of Congress and the American People, September 20, 2001

In addition to the sheer idiocy of this statement...

Good times, good times. Except now Obama has said the same thing.; 1/7/15, 1:42 PM
n.n said...: The establishment of an Islamic state in Europe by an American administration, and the current administration's assassination of national Muslim leaders and support for Marxist replacements, not to mention the repeated betrayal of native white and black Africans by Western powers, has created a sense of entitlement by Dreamers imported by the left-wing in Europe and America.; 1/7/15, 1:42 PM
Titus said...: Even the French military, emt and police outfits are totally chic. I love the tucked in boot look and the totally cute hats-totally delish. And can we give a major shout out to all their freaking beautiful haircuts-those are a weekly clip, def.; 1/7/15, 1:43 PM
Michael said...: ARM

FYI, the topic is not the demographic consequence of the Algerian war. I would bet significant money that the murderous Muslims killing to avenge satire would not be able to form a single paragraph of grievance related to French colonial adventures.

As to understanding the fundamentalists, just keep this in mind. Do not mock their prophet or they will kill you. It is easy to understand. N'es pas?; 1/7/15, 1:48 PM
Drago said...: AReasonableMeltdown: "To ignore the unusually fraught history between the French and their colonial subjugates seems foolish to me, both in terms of understanding the current ethnic makeup of France and the underlying conflicts between the various groups."

Well, that certainly explains why islamist Boko Harum has no problem whatsoever capturing, murdering and enslaving blacks in Africa.

My favorite part of ARMeltdown's latest inanity?

"..various groups."

LOL

Yes.

"Various". Could be any number of groups. Certainly no way to narrow it down any further than that.; 1/7/15, 1:49 PM
n.n said...: tim in vermont:

They're competitors. International competitors. Nothing more. The same class of competitors that destroyed over 100 million human lives throughout the 20th century. The same class of competitors that spreads fairy tales about spontaneous conception that debases human life and offers comfort to women so that they will make the "choice". The same class of competitors that have deprived the poorest people of reliable energy production. Survival of the fittest or rather ruthless, it seems.; 1/7/15, 1:50 PM
Drago said...: Titus: "And can we give a major shout out to all their freaking beautiful haircuts.."

Well, one french policeman this morning, while begging for his life, was given one hell of a "haircut" by one of the lefts islamist heroes.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2900259/Gunmen-kill-11-Charlie-Hebdo-attack.html

I wonder on which republican Lena Dunham will blame that?; 1/7/15, 1:52 PM
Drago said...: AReasonableMeltdown: "I would absolutely defend the right of PMJ to express his views."

LOL

Sure you would.

Right up until the moment when you had sufficient power to take it away.

As is inevitable in any left-wing society.

I would expect no less from a very useful verencemos brigade idiot such as yourself.; 1/7/15, 1:54 PM
Drago said...: BTW, don't label these guys as islamist!

No sirree!

Why, they are no more islamist than Howard Dean!

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/01/07/howard-dean-dont-call-paris-terrorists-muslim/

The saddest part? Howard the left actually believe that.; 1/7/15, 1:56 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: There are 300k ethnic Vietnamese living in France. For some reason the long, especially brutal colonization of Vietnam by the French has not produced troops of rioting, murdering Vietnamese extremists in Paris.
The problem with the marxist view of history is that it does not explain history.; 1/7/15, 1:57 PM
buwaya said...: The main reason the French have these problems is that they let them in in the first place. The Germans, Danes, Swedes and Norwegians have the same sorts of problems, in proportion to their populations, having no colonial history with Muslim countries. And the bulk of the Muslims in France came in long after the colonial era. These arent for the most part the Harkis of the ancient and glorious colonial regiments. The new people have no grievances against Lyautey or Mangin.
BTW - recommended - Douglas Porch "The Conquest of Morocco".

The US has so far mostly dodged the bullet with Muslim immigrants because the US immigrant filter effectively limits the intake to more upmarket Muslim people, for the most part. Terrorists attacking the US are nearly all foreign born, operating plots hatched outside the US.

The US is extremely lucky in that the bulk of the lower-class immigration into the US is from Latin America and East Asia, a much more culturally compatible and assimilable bunch.; 1/7/15, 2:03 PM
Drago said...: Terry: "The problem with the marxist view of history is that it does not explain history."

Nor economics.

Nor just about anything.

But it does provide a basis for the seizing of power and totalitarian rule, all in the name of "helping" you help yourself. That is, if you're not one of the ones who end up face down in a mass grave.; 1/7/15, 2:03 PM
Unknown said...: Religion I found to be without any tendency to inspire, promote, or confirm morality, serves principally to divide us and make us unfriendly to one another.; 1/7/15, 2:05 PM
Jaq said...: Right up until the moment when you had sufficient power to take it away.

Naah! ARM is a "moderate." They will hunt him down and kill him like Trotsky, once his usefulness has passed and he becomes an obstacle to their real plans by believing their propaganda.; 1/7/15, 2:05 PM
buwaya said...: Titus would approve of Lyautey.
A conqueror after his own heart.; 1/7/15, 2:05 PM
Jaq said...: It is funny how all the religion condemners here forget the evangelical atheist movement that was Soviet Communism that led to scores of millions of dead, and untold numbers who spent miserable lives in countries that were virtual prisons.

Islam and Communism have far more in common as regards those who fall under their rule than Islam and Christianity.; 1/7/15, 2:08 PM
Alexander said...: Yeah, here's the thing, Benjie.

All European secularism has managed to accomplish is replacing Christianity with Islam. Excellent work. Golf claps all around.

As for conforming and promoting morality: we live in an age where morality is if not mocked and ridiculed, is denied to objectively exist. For any imperfections, the idea that religion is in some way lacking in this regard compared to modernist thought is hilarious.; 1/7/15, 2:08 PM
RecChief said...: I haven't seen the "It's their culture" argument...yet. But I am waiting patiently and I don't think it will be a long wait.; 1/7/15, 2:09 PM
Drago said...: Good news!

We hear from our "friends" on CNN that this could be another "Lone Wolf" attack.

There is no limit to how low the left will sink to begin the re-writing of this incident.

I guarantee within 30 days Cookie will be explaining how this was a "false flag" operation run by the CIA.

Of course, Oliver Stone will "go there" by this evening.; 1/7/15, 2:12 PM
Titus said...: I would bet money that a top designer designed all the Paris Military/EMT/Fire Costumes/Unis.

Could it be Gauthier?; 1/7/15, 2:13 PM
Fen said...: "I blame the Templars. And the crusades. And Bush. Or whatever false equivalence that I can use to justify murder so I can remain a feckless coward" - the Left; 1/7/15, 2:13 PM
Fen said...: Almost makes you want to join the other side. At least they have spine.; 1/7/15, 2:14 PM
Alexander said...: Fen - we are the other side. Make no mistake, the fifth column will be exposed.

In the meantime, read some Kipling. I recommend "Norman and Saxon" and "The Wrath of the Awakened Saxon". That which cannot be forever endured, won't.; 1/7/15, 2:21 PM
Anonymous said...: The US has so far mostly dodged the bullet with Muslim immigrants because the US immigrant filter effectively limits the intake to more upmarket Muslim people, for the most part. Terrorists attacking the US are nearly all foreign born, operating plots hatched outside the US.

Except of course the Somalians and Sudanese.

It's interesting to compare the lack of assimilation of both Muslim groups to the Christian Ethiopians...; 1/7/15, 2:21 PM
cubanbob said...: "AReasonableMan said...
As a moderate, (if you stopped right there, you would have had the audience howling with laughter) I find religious fundamentalism difficult to understand. Nonetheless, I would absolutely defend the right of PMJ to express his views.

To ignore the unusually fraught history between the French and their colonial subjugates seems foolish to me ( maybe to you but not to the subjugates that keep flocking to France, they want to come to France ), both in terms of understanding the current ethnic makeup of France and the underlying conflicts between the various groups.

1/7/15, 1:34 PM

Speaking of subjugates of the evil Europeans I have noticed that the Jews of Europe haven't been committing atrocities in Europe. Neither have the Vietnamese or non-Muslim Africans. Perhaps you can explain this anomaly.; 1/7/15, 2:23 PM
Alexander said...: A Reasonable Man:

Please answer the following:

Is it your position that European peoples have, through actions of their ancestors, lost the right to maintain their homelands, their faiths, their cultures? Do they have a right to live in peace within their homeland, and to enjoy the supremacy of their traditions, customs, and laws within that homeland?

Are their children and grandchildren guilty at birth of an offense so large that only through de facto genocide can they be absolved?

Thank you.; 1/7/15, 2:27 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: "It is funny how all the religion condemners here forget the evangelical atheist movement that was Soviet Communism that led to scores of millions of dead, and untold numbers who spent miserable lives in countries that were virtual prisons."
Both fascists and communists believe that there is no higher moral authority than the State. The State will approve or disapprove of your values based whether they promote state interests, as defined by the state.
It is the Left in the United States that wants to institute this arrangement.; 1/7/15, 2:27 PM
n.n said...: It's notable that the Egyptian President addressed the global fear of Islamic extremism. I don't recall if he mentioned it, but it's probably motivated by the same global fear of Marxists. They are both universal faiths and religions; the former Allah and Islam; the latter mortal gods and Atheism; with directives to convert or subjugate their competitors by force.; 1/7/15, 2:33 PM
Jaq said...: "Both fascists and communists believe that there is no higher moral authority than the State."

Funny how they are as unable to conceive of a class of people who don't believe this as a deeply religious person is able to conceive of an actual atheist. That's why Commies believe that if you are not a commie, you must be a fascist. Like the Irish troubles, outsiders couldn't tell them apart without a scorecard, yet they think they are so different from each other.; 1/7/15, 2:42 PM
n.n said...: tim in vermont:

The problem with atheism is three-fold. One, it is an unacknowledged faith. Two, it lacks a religious or moral foundation. Three, it engenders a narcissistic character (i.e. ego-centric), which is dangerous when coupled with a left-wing ideology.

The problem with Islam, is that while the human ego is subordinated to an extra-universal "God", their religion is both universal and coercive. Not unlike the Marxist ideological ensemble, which are also universal and coercive.; 1/7/15, 2:53 PM
Tarrou said...: I'm pretty sure they were Tea Partiers. No true muslim would do anything violent, the president said so.; 1/7/15, 2:54 PM
Jaq said...: Exactly n.n.

Communism, Fascism, and Islam are three totalitarian political systems that can not exist in their purest form without total state control of people's lives.; 1/7/15, 2:56 PM
Drago said...: Tarrou: "I'm pretty sure they were Tea Partiers. No true muslim would do anything violent, the president said so."

Howard Dean "screamed" that very same message this morning.; 1/7/15, 3:23 PM
Drago said...: I sure hope those large crowds gathering in support of CharlieHebdo don't utter anything negative about Islam.

Why, that would be "ugly".; 1/7/15, 3:25 PM
Jaq said...: It's the sizable Muslim population in swing state Ohio that gets Democrat's attention.; 1/7/15, 3:26 PM
chillblaine said...: The women afraid to walk the streets of Malmo are the inevitable legacy of Sweden's long and brutal colonialist past.; 1/7/15, 3:30 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: The Saudis' have a problem with Islamic extremism. I suppose that's a result of their long, brutal occupation of themselves by themselves.; 1/7/15, 3:36 PM
Paul said...: 'We are from al-Qaeda in Yemen'...

That is what they shouted... so, somehow al-Qaeda, the al-Qaeda Obama said was defeated, isn't so defeated.

Why, Obama wouldn't lie to us, right President Gruber?; 1/7/15, 3:46 PM
MAJMike said...: Charles Martel would know what to do.; 1/7/15, 3:55 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: Yemen! It can't be! Yemen was colonized by the Turks and the Brits, not the French!
It's almost like ARM doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about.; 1/7/15, 4:04 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: "Three suspects said to be all French citizens"

It's almost as if Terry is cherry picking from the news.; 1/7/15, 4:11 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: AReasonableMan unreasonably wrote:
"It's almost as if Terry is cherry picking from the news."

One of the officials said they were linked to a Yemeni terrorist network. A witness of Wednesday's shootings at the offices of weekly satirical newspaper Charlie Hebdo said one of the attackers told onlookers, "You can tell the media that it's al-Qaida in Yemen."
http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/shots-fired-french-satirical-paper-police-witness-28050653

At least I don't simply make things up to suit my ideology. How's the clown suit today, ARM? A little tight? Well, we all put on weight as we get older.; 1/7/15, 4:24 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Apparently Terry doesn't know what cherry-picking means.; 1/7/15, 4:27 PM
Drago said...: AReasonableMeltdown: "Apparently Terry doesn't know what cherry-picking means."

Looks like ARMeltdown's fallback position is going to be "hey, all those colonial powers look the same to me!"; 1/7/15, 4:31 PM
Drago said...: Paul: "That is what they shouted... so, somehow al-Qaeda, the al-Qaeda Obama said was defeated, isn't so defeated."

Hey, it's just the latest version of the al-Qaeda JV team.

Plus, they weren't even muslim.

Even if they are muslims, it's the fault of the colonial powers.

And poverty. But mostly colonial powers since they invented poverty.

Plus, there sure are a lot of Tea Partiers (white folks) around we need to watch.

Besides, did you hear about the small incendiary device found near the NAACP office in Colorado. Talk about Terrorism!; 1/7/15, 4:35 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: AReasonableMan unreasonably wrote:
"Apparently Terry doesn't know what cherry-picking means."
I guess I am totally ignoring the mountains of evidence you presented that supports your "inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past." theory, ARM. Oh wait, you didn't even bother to present any argument at all. I reckon a single piece of supporting evidence trumps a simple assertion. Do you agree, ARM?; 1/7/15, 4:48 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: "The Kouachi brothers were orphaned by their Algerian-immigrant parents as children."

Predictably, they are Algerians.; 1/7/15, 5:05 PM
Kirk Parker said...: Quaestor,

"The rest are too contaminated with every little leftist meme that has emerged since Rousseau first began his scribblings..."

FIFY.; 1/7/15, 5:17 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: Their parents were Algerians, ARM. They are French citizens. I bet they are Muslims, and that they killed their victims in some sick idea of avenging their prophet.
Or are you still holding to your " . . . inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past" theory?; 1/7/15, 5:28 PM
Anonymous said...: AReasonableMan said...
or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past."

One motive for French conquest of North Africa in the 1830s was to do away with the pirate raiding and slave-raiding practiced in North Africa. From Wikipedia:

The Second Barbary War:
However, securing uniform compliance with a total prohibition of slave-raiding, which was traditionally of central importance to the North African economy, presented difficulties beyond those faced in ending attacks on ships of individual nations, which had left slavers able to continue their accustomed way of life by preying on less well-protected peoples. Algiers subsequently renewed its slave-raiding, though on a smaller scale. Measures to be taken against the city's government were discussed at the Congress of Aix-la-Chapelle in 1818. In 1820 another British fleet under Admiral Sir Harry Neal again bombarded Algiers. Corsair activity based in Algiers did not entirely cease until its conquest by France in 1830.

Recall that the young US also had problems with the Barbary Pirates.

What says AReasonableMan about slave-raiding?; 1/7/15, 5:31 PM
Anonymous said...: President Mom-Jeans :
"I wish your mother had prevented the inevitable legacy of your constant apologia for islamic savages by coast hangering the shit out of you second trimester."

garage mahal responding to the above comment:
Are there ANY moderate Christians that will condemn this ugliness?... I am asking moderates to condemn your disgusting attacks.

The term "teabagger" originally meant "testicle-licker." To call Tea Party supporters "teabaggers" is an insult, an ad hominem attack, and an attack which is undubitably "disgusting."
What is garage mahal's position on use of the term "teabagger?" Does he consider it disgusting to call political opponents "teabaggers?" On the contrary, garage mahal uses the term.

garage mahal @ 10/30/14, 4:07 PM
Plus, she will have to work with Crazytown Teabagger legislature.
garage mahal @ 9/19/14, 4:25 PM
Same teabagging goons as last election.

garage mahal does not apply to himself the same standards of civility he expects of others. Which is one definition of a hypocrite. garage mahal thus has no credibility on the civility issue.

BTW, as an agnostic, I am not going to comment on how "moderate Christians" should respond to the "trimester" rant. I will simply observe that the rant has a tone similar to garage mahal's "teabagger" rants, and that such rants tend to be counter-productive.; 1/7/15, 6:09 PM
Michael said...: ARM

If the patriotic Algerian children were avenging the horrors of the French in their homeland why did they choose then to attack a stupid newspaper when the very home office of the offending invaders is just down the street?; 1/7/15, 6:15 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: 22.05 In an interview with Reuters, a Syria-based man calling claiming to represent Isil, said the Islamic State welcomed the attack, reports Henry Samuel.

“The lions of Islam have avenged our Prophet. They are lions. These are the first droplets. Others will follow."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/11329976/Paris-Charlie-Hebdo-attack-live.html
Cherry picking is easy when there are so darn many cherries. Not seeing any cherries labeled "inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past" yet.; 1/7/15, 6:21 PM
Revenant said...: the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past.

Normally I would appraise this as a really weak attempt at trolling, but I see that some people actually rose to the bait. So I have to give it a 7/10 instead.; 1/7/15, 6:32 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: “But in the context of things, France has been a target for many, many years, because they’ve been involved in foreign affairs in Libya, and they really prodded us along in — recently in Libya, but they’ve been involved in Algeria, so they’ve had attacks like this, you know, not infrequently. So, it does involve, you know, their foreign policy as well. When people do this, you know, the rejection of the violence has to be made, and with that I agree.”
Ron Paul agrees with ARM.; 1/7/15, 7:12 PM
kcom said...: "Predictably, they are Algerians."

No, predictably they are Muslims. The fact that they are Algerians is coincidental. Go back and look at the last 10 or 20 Islamist attacks. It really doesn't matter what country the perpetrators are from , the only thing that's constant is that they are Muslim. There are even perpetrators from non-majority Muslim countries never colonized by France. What do they have in common? They're Muslim. Name the last attack anywhere carried out by a non-Muslim Algerian.; 1/7/15, 8:01 PM
I'm Full of Soup said...: "As usually, we can all depend on garage to draw the right parallels and zero in on the real issue."

Tim, try and imagine what a parallel line looks like in Garage's little brain and then have a good laugh.; 1/7/15, 8:22 PM
RecChief said...: I read today that Josh Earnest says "America needs to redouble its efforts to explain the tenets of islam."

WTF is he talking about?; 1/7/15, 8:46 PM
Jupiter said...: Quaestor said...

"We are witnessing the death of a civilization, my friends. Some of us will fight, but only a minority."

I will just point out that the people we need to fight are not Muslims. Once we wipe out the surrender maggots, dealing with a bunch of 7th Century savages will not be difficult. That's what helicopter gunships are for. But we all need to calm down. A LOT more Westermers will need to raped and murdered by these animals before enough of our fellow Americans see the light.

And BTW, I don't exactly "condemn" what Mom-Jeans said, but I do think that in ARM's case, there was no real need to wait for the second trimester.; 1/7/15, 9:03 PM
Michael K said...: "A LOT more Westermers will need to raped and murdered by these animals before enough of our fellow Americans see the light."

I'm afraid this is correct and I hope they start with New York City, Marin County and West Los Angeles. The feminist warriors that Hollywood has to include in every movie these days could take the lead.

Cate Blanchet looked very capable with that sword in "Robin Hood." Send her out to do battle with Islam.; 1/7/15, 9:11 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Terry said...

Ron Paul agrees with ARM.

Of course he does, because he recognizes that ignoring history leads to trillion dollar mistakes, like invading Iraq. Everyone wants to believe that the world starts and ends with them but Bush was an extreme example. Cluelessly uninterested in the country that he tried to subjugate.; 1/7/15, 9:34 PM
Lewis Wetzel said...: Changing the subject, ARM?
The US has not suffered a terrorist attack by Iraqis. You really shouldn't comment on terrorist incidents. You're not very good at it. You seem confused.; 1/7/15, 9:45 PM
furious_a said...: or whether they are the inevitable legacy of France's long and brutal colonialist past.

Yemen was part of France's long and brutal colonial past?

Really, ARM?

Really?

Keep reaching for those root causes, ARM.; 1/7/15, 9:48 PM
furious_a said...: To ignore the unusually fraught history between the French and their colonial subjugates seems foolish to me

British, Ottoman, whatever. ARM too stupid to tell the difference.; 1/7/15, 9:54 PM
furious_a said...: The White House can launch more #HashtagDiplomacy:

#StopShootingFrenchPeople; 1/7/15, 10:00 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: furious_a said...
Yemen was part of France's long and brutal colonial past?

Algerians, buddy. Algerians.; 1/7/15, 10:29 PM
Achilles said...: AReasonableMan said...
furious_a said...
Yemen was part of France's long and brutal colonial past?

"Algerians, buddy. Algerians."

Are you seriously trying to say this attack was about French colonialism in Algeria and not about an attack on a paper that was specifically targeted for printing satirical images of the prophet Mohamed?

People who make excuses for barbarians are pathetic.; 1/7/15, 11:13 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: No one is making excuses, these are my people who were killed, all purpose anti-theists.

But, the determination to ignore history is why we started a trillion dollar war in a country that had nothing to do with the 9/11 attack, creating more enemies for our country and achieving nothing. Historical hatreds cross generations and borders. Irish born in England joined the IRA's terrorism campaign. Irish born in the US, who had never set foot in Ireland, funded the IRA terrorists.; 1/8/15, 6:54 AM
Rusty said...: I believe the perpetrators were French citizens of Yemeni or Algerian ancestry.
radicalized, no doubt, by a local imam.
Children wishing to fulfill the insane dreams of their fathers.; 1/8/15, 7:16 AM
Paco Wové said...: Will evil Bush ever loosen his grip on poor ARM's mind?; 1/8/15, 7:24 AM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Bush only had a grip on the minds of the idiots who voted for him twice.; 1/8/15, 7:30 AM
furious_a said...: ARM, dude, Algerian Islamists went to war against their own government twenty years ago, not against French colonial rule sixty years ago.

Try to keep up with the acronyms (AIGA,FLN, etc). Blaming Whitey is so cliche'd and lazy.; 1/8/15, 9:02 AM
President-Mom-Jeans said...: UnReasonable Bitch doubles down on his apologia for muslim scum.

What a despicable twat you are. I hope some of your islamic buddies give you the Daniel Pearl treatment.; 1/8/15, 9:03 AM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: PMJ, what's it like knowing that even in this forum no one thinks you are acceptable? A pariah, filled with hatred and self-loathing.

You have more in common with the terrorists than you think.; 1/8/15, 9:06 AM
Paul said...: "But, the determination to ignore history is why we started a trillion dollar war in a country that had nothing to do with the 9/11 attack"

AReasonableMan,

Uh al Qaeda trained in Afghanistan. Al Qaeda trained in Iraq (yes they even have the training grounds, hulls of airliners, etc..). The 9/11 attack were Muslim Saudis for the most part but the training was in those countries, ran by Muslims.

And we have had Muslim terrorist attacking us far longer than Bush was in office. Note the terrorist attacks when Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton were in office and the tepid response from botch presidents.

Our biggest fault was we didn't finish the job. Thanks to Obama we now have them far stronger than they were before.

His cut-and-run while apologizing and claiming victory is what has embolden them. When Bush was in office they were AFRAID to attack us.

See AReasonableMan, if you can't be loved... you have better be feared. We were feared under Bush, but they are not afraid of Obama.; 1/8/15, 9:43 AM
furious_a said...: Blame Obama for leading from behind, stepping back from his redlines, #hashtagging Boko Haram, and letting the Benghazi consulate burn. No wonder the Mujahs are laughing at us they lop heads on camera.

(ARM-style faculty-lounge lo-cal recycled-Huffpo easy-lifting, no thought required.); 1/8/15, 9:54 AM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Paul said...
Al Qaeda trained in Iraq

This is complete, unadulterated BS. Even Cheney didn't claim this. It was all about the nonexistent WMD before the war.; 1/8/15, 9:58 AM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Paul said...
if you can't be loved... you have better be feared.

China runs its business in a business like way. The way the US once did. It is not about being loved or feared but advancing national interests. Rather than embarking on ideological crusades against commies and Muzzies it might make some sense to keep our ideology to ourselves and focus on our flailing manufacturing interests.; 1/8/15, 10:06 AM
Rusty said...: AReasonableMan said...
Paul said...
Al Qaeda trained in Iraq

This is complete, unadulterated BS. Even Cheney didn't claim this. It was all about the nonexistent WMD before the war.

After his capture, Saddam Hussein admitted there were training camps in his country for al queda and other extremist groups. Syria has admitted that much of its chemical weapons stock comes from Iraq. And recently a stockpile of chemical weapons was found in some abandoned bunkers In iraq.
If you had read HR14-not really sure of the number-you would understand that it was to prevent Saddam Hussein from amassing WMDs. Not the ones he already had.
Finally.
Gravity always works.; 1/8/15, 10:35 AM
kcom said...: Boko Haram is killing fellow Nigerians (maybe 2000 this week) and threatening Cameroon, MILF is killing fellow Philippinos, ISIS is killing fellow Syrians, AQAP is killing fellow Yemenis, the Pakistani Taliban is killing fellow Pakistanis, and on and on ad nauseam (in the literal sense of the phrase). What they all have in common is Islamist ideology not a colonialist past. You can't see the forest for the trees, ARM. This is about ideas, not revenge. They have the idea they can kill anyone they want in the name of their religion. They tell you that to your face and yet you ignore it. You're living in the past. They're living in the present.; 1/8/15, 5:29 PM