December 20, 2014

"'I'm Putting Wings on Pigs Today,' a person believed to be the gunman wrote on Instagram..."

"... in a message posted just three hours before the officers were shot through their front passenger window."
“They Take 1 Of Ours … Let’s Take 2 of Theirs,” the post continued, signing off with, “This May Be My Final Post.”

122 comments:

Jason said...

Liberal logic: Sarah Palin is personally responsible for the shooting of Gabby Gifford, but Al Sharpton will never be responsible for anything.

Fernandinande said...

Ismaaiyl Brinsley's war on women.

jr565 said...

I hope it is his last post, and seriously hope cops shoot him dead.people have been milking these two deaths to get away with all sorts of criminality and now someone is resorting to murder over it.
Enough already. I'm long past having sympathy for the cause.

William said...

Aided and abetted by the lies of Ferguson. Inflamed by the President and his Attorney General . The death of innocents who were simply doing their job "to serve and protect".

Seriously disturbing times.

Bob Ellison said...

It's gonna get worse before it gets better.

dreams said...

The racist president and the liberal media have blood on their hands.

They had fun staring up racial tension but those of us who have to live near black people will suffer the consequences. The media wouldn't report the facts that differed from their preferred narrative.

Mary Beth said...

He killed himself. He had also killed his girlfriend earlier today.

I'd like to blame the agitators but I think it's likely he was just crazy.

The Drill SGT said...

a bit of classic combat white lie in evidence here. Sort of like the Pat Tillman thing.

Police, even those shot point blank in the head are never pronounced dead at the scene.

They are ALWAYS, "seriously wounded and rushed to the hospital".

That way, the spouse is notified in a standard way, and driven to the hospital to be met by the Commander, the Commander's wife, the Chaplain and a Doc, who, in a private area describe all the heroic measures that were taken to save him.

White Lies, like:

"He never felt a thing" and
"he died a hero"

you never used to tell the spouse that he died because he F'd up, and somebody shot him by mistake...





Chef Mojo said...

#bluelivesmatter.

I'm sure everyone who did a variation on "fuck the cops!" here on Althouse are feeling happy and smug this evening.

traditionalguy said...

If DeBlasio is let in at the funeral he can give them one of his of his Order of the Red Star medals.

The Drill SGT said...

which brings us to the political story...

did either execute one of those PBA anti-deBlasio living wills?


Anonymous said...

BECAUSE there are always crazy people out there, one should not encourage violence by yelling things like "kill the cops" and "burn the place down"in my opinion.

Curious George said...

Ha, this story was posted at the bottom:

http://nypost.com/2014/12/19/politician-follows-porn-star-says-twitter-account-was-hacked/

Story never said the politician's party. Which makes him a Democrat.

Gahrie said...

Do you really want to convince the cops that a specific ethnic group is determined to kill them?

Michael K said...

"one should not encourage violence by yelling things like "kill the cops" and "burn the place down"in my opinion."

I spent a fair amount of time dealing with and talking to psychotics in the days when they were still hospitalized (Now they are on the street). You NEVER got into their delusions with them.

This guy was aware of all the assholes shouting "What do we want ? Dead Cops!" so he obliged.

DeBlasio should stay away unless invited by the family.

Michael said...

Mary Beth

Let us stipulate that all murderers do something crazy. But you don't drive from Baltimore to NY to shoot NY instead of Baltimore cops in retaliation for a homicide of a NY guy by a NY cop if you are truly insane.

I would just say hats off to the president, the AG, the president of black people and the mayor of NY for really ringing the race hate bell. Their appeal to a poorly educated and irrational cohort has done wonders to u do fifty years of decent progress in race relations. For craven political purposes they have exacerbated every distrust. These are vile men.

Freeman Hunt said...

I'd like to blame the agitators but I think it's likely he was just crazy.

I agree with your take. At first I assumed it was someone inspired by local news stories, but then I read that he'd just killed his girlfriend and killed himself after he shot the officers. Sounds like a guy who wanted to kill some people, not a guy who wanted to fight for a cause. (Not that those are always mutually exclusive.)

Freeman Hunt said...

Sounds like he killed someone and enjoyed it enough to brainstorm who else he could kill. Bad guy.

steve uhr said...

Mr. Dreams -- sorry you "have to live near black people." Isn't there a white trailer trash park nearby?

Skeptical Voter said...

It's tough to be a "hero" when you're shot dead eating a hero sandwich in the squad car. But yes you tell the widow that he died bravely and didn't feel a thing. Or whatever else it takes to get her over the loss of her husband and the father of her kids.

Still "hero" is a term that's been considerably cheapened. For that matter so has "rape" People no longer call things by their rightful names--e.g. the Lightworker's use of the term "workplace violence".
Maybe these two dead policemen weren't herors, but merely victims of "workplace violence".

dreams said...

"Mr. Dreams -- sorry you "have to live near black people." Isn't there a white trailer trash park nearby?"


My point is that those staring up the racial tension don't have to live near black people but your comment about trailer trash park is revealing.

jr565 said...

Crap, didn't see where he offed himself. Thatll do too. So long as hes not breathing anymore.

mrs.e said...

Mary Beth, I'd agree. Does not seem political.

Curious George said...

"Freeman Hunt said...
I'd like to blame the agitators but I think it's likely he was just crazy.

I agree with your take. At first I assumed it was someone inspired by local news stories, but then I read that he'd just killed his girlfriend and killed himself after he shot the officers. Sounds like a guy who wanted to kill some people, not a guy who wanted to fight for a cause. (Not that those are always mutually exclusive.)"

Sorry, but that doesn't make sense. It's not known why he killed his girlfriend, but it is pretty clear why he killed the cops. Lots of people with nothing to lose, and now they, like this asshole, have a cause célèbre. And that's on the agitators. And Obama. And Holder.

MaxedOutMama said...

Isn't this the guy who first shot a woman in Baltimore?

If so, this seems like making an excuse for his murderous rage.

AJ Lynch said...

It's not political? Did you read what he wrote on Instagram? " Kill 2 cops for every 1 of us they kill".

Fandor said...

The shooter...gangbanger...mama's boy...pussy...probably a moran...big man with an illegal gun...shoots girlfriend...ambushes cops...enabled by Sharpton, Jackson, DeBlasio, Holder and President Obama to be a victim. This is a picture of a self loathing coward.

Jason said...

This must be fake. They have strict gun control in NYC.

Michael said...

The guy made it clear on Instagram that he was going to kill two cops in retaliation for Mike Brown and Eric Garner. Seems clear.

As usual there is a rush to say it is a mental health issue. Or, gosh, maybe it's NY lax gun laws that made him kill the cops. WTF.

When did we stop believing our own eyes.

Beta Rube said...

If Rush Limbaugh can have dirty hands for Oklahoma City, Barry, Eric, and Al can have a piece of this.

Fandor said...

When is America going to wake up?
All gangs should be declared domestic terrorists and dealt with accordingly.
In cities, in areas where gangs have taken over, declare Martial Law, disarm and arrest them (gang members) and prosecute the terrorists to the fullest extent of the law.

chickelit said...

I don't see the need to insist that the man had no motivation inspired by Ferguson and Trayvon. For one thing it just contradicts fact such as his internet postings.

Why do you people insist?

The Drill SGT said...
which brings us to the political story...

did either execute one of those PBA anti-deBlasio living wills?


If either of them did, de Blasio needs to honor it. It's a huge morale issue and he needs to act like a leader.

Fandor said...

If Obama had a son who was a pussy, self loathing terrorist, would he look like the shooter of these two NYPD officers who were murdered by ambush?

Fandor said...

Where's Obama? Where's Holder? DeBlasio?
Where is the outrage?

n.n said...

Assassination, huh. Hopefully this isn't following and perpetuating a precedent.

chickelit said...

May we also assume that all of the protestors chanting "What do we want? Dead cops!” in the streets were dissociated from Ferguson and Trayvon?

Michael K said...

More information on the police reaction.

"City Council President Melissa Mark-Viverito and Mayor Bill de Blasio were less than welcome guests at the poignant gathering.
“We’re all in this together,” the mayor told grieving cops, according to a cop who was there.
“No we’re not,” one officer said tersely in response.

This could get real ugly.

Christopher said...

Chickelit,

Absent a public statement by the officers' families barring his presence DeBlasio will go, to do otherwise would be to admit that he has lost the support of the police (even though it's obvious to everyone that he has).

chickelit said...

Jason said...
Liberal logic: Sarah Palin is personally responsible for the shooting of Gabby Gifford, but Al Sharpton will never be responsible for anything.

You know, I think that AlphaLiberal stopped posting here after making that assertion here at Althouse. Either that or he/she changed handles.

Fandor said...

RULE NUMBER ONE,

DMFers

DON'T MAKE WAR WITH THE PO-LICE!

chickelit said...

Christopher said...

Absent a public statement by the officers' families barring his presence DeBlasio will go, to do otherwise would be to admit that he has lost the support of the police (even though it's obvious to everyone that he has).

It's all hypothetical. We don't know if they signed. But if they did, de Blasio would exacerbate the tension to go.

chickelit said...

This should be a Sterling Hall Bombing moment for the idiot protesters.

Ebbers Palomino I said...

Townhall is reporting that shootings of blacks are down by 75% over the past few decades

http://townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/2014/12/18/racial-cop-stories-that-didnt-make-the-cut-n1933217

I'm not sure how accurate this is, but why doesn't major media look into this?

Could it be that the media is manipulating the people to generate news, just like Michelle Obama's contradictory interpretations of her trip,tomTarget?

Fandor said...

DeBlasio Resign...before the earth swallows you up!
Speak in spanish, speak in tongues, you're a fool.
Get out of the way!
RESIGN!

rhhardin said...

It's a small price to pay for racial division that fires the base.

richard mcenroe said...

Garage will be typing one handed for days.

Steve Uhr -- Look next door and see if there's a vacancy.

Bob Boyd said...

Its interesting that he picked two more women to shoot.

richard mcenroe said...

But, but everyone knows the shooter was a gentle giant who was turning his life around and planning to go to college...

Char Char Binks said...

One of Crack's buds, Ismaaiyl Abdullah Brinsley Obamason.

Gahrie said...

So how many stores have the cops and their families looted and burnt down so far?

SteveR said...

Valerie said that Michelle doesn't want the President disturbed until next year.

richard mcenroe said...

NY Cops Union says, "for the first time in years we are a wartime police force" and issues instructions to its members:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5VxMAzIUAA9FSA.jpg:large

richard mcenroe said...

Bob Boyd: and missed any white cops.

richard mcenroe said...

Where ARE all our brave social justice warriors? Not a peep out of ARM, or Garage, or anybody...

Bob Boyd said...

@richard mcenroe

victims not white? I hadn't seen that.

pm317 said...

Obama was not available for comment -- he was busy improving his golf game.

Michelle Dulak Thomson said...

The officers shot and killed were named Rafael Ramos and Wenjian Liu. Obviously, two fine exemplars of NYC's famously lily-white police force. (It was earlier reported that they were both women, but I assume Ramos wasn't.)

The girlfriend is widely being assumed to be dead, but as matters stand I think she's alive. The perp himself isn't.

As for "was he nuts?" Well, obviously he was nuts. He was just a man out to kill, who started with his gf, then drove from Baltimore to NYC and shot and killed two cops apparently at random, and then offed himself. Sounds totally sane to me, NOT. All the same, we have considerable forethought and preparation here. We fall back far too easily on "mental illness" when the truth is that some people just are consumed with evil intent.

JAORE said...

Well we know, or certainly have been told, that it is "open season on black men". We know, or certainly have been told, that a white cop killing a black man will never be punished. We know, or certainly have been told, that the recent deaths of certain black men was not in the least the result of their actions, but part of a long and unbroken string of unjustified killing of innocent black men. We know, or certainly have been told, that what we want is "Dead cops" and when we want it is "Now".

Why is this a surprise to anyone?

Anonymous said...

" Chef Mojo said...
#bluelivesmatter.

I'm sure everyone who did a variation on "fuck the cops!" here on Althouse are feeling happy and smug this evening.

12/20/14, 5:26 PM"

One of the Pants posters wished this on me not too long ago. I don't remember who though. I misplaced my pants, or president mom jeans, or maybe there is a third?

In get them confused.

Christopher said...

Yeah, I'd say
DeBlasio has lost the police.


Anonymous said...

Many people, especially Democrats, have to believe this man was crazy.

Their world view doesn't allow for truly evil people to exist who must be fought against.

Well, unless those people are Rethuglicans. Then they are evil.

But its not possible for their rhetoric to cause this sort of response. Its called circular reasoning. Only right wing rhetoric can do this.

Therefore, this man must have been crazy.

MadisonMan said...

All the same, we have considerable forethought and preparation here. We fall back far too easily on "mental illness" when the truth is that some people just are consumed with evil intent.

How does mental illness mean that forethought and preparation cannot occur?

Many things contributed to this nutso's rampage. I doubt we'll know the whole truth ever about it, and even if we did -- that's spending too much time thinking about an evil man.

Anonymous said...

Its not thinking about the evil man, Madisonman. Instead, its thinking of consequences for "just words!" And actions taken by Democrats and minorities over recent days.

I'd argue that these cops would be alive today if not for the current rhetoric.

Bobber Fleck said...

eric said: "I'd argue that these cops would be alive today if not for the current rhetoric."

Amen

Laslo Spatula said...

As any seamstress could tell you: you reap what you sew.

I am Laslo.

chickelit said...

Laslo Spatula said...
As any seamstress could tell you: you reap what you sew.

Sounds more like something a seamster would say than a seamstress.

Kelly said...

They just showed video of police officers turning their backs on the mayor as he arrived for his press conference. I think the higher ups will crack down on officers and insist they at least pretend to play nice.

Laslo Spatula said...

"Sounds more like something a seamster would say than a seamstress."

And it is a 'flight attendant' not a 'stewardess.' Now. I think.

Regardless.

The media stitched this quilt, but will never sleep beneath it.

I am Laslo.

buwaya puti said...

Being brutal and laying aside humanity, just a comment on the politics -
For the Democrats this is either the worst of luck or they lucked out. Its clear that this incident is blowback for the organized campaign to drum up the black/left vote for 2016. I gather they intended to keep this up till 11/16, or make the attempt. At this point (may be premature on my part, but I fearlessly predict) this campaign is over, as the other side now has its bloody shirt.
This may have a silver lining for the Democrats, in that this was playing with fire, and if it had persisted for another few months the general promotion of screaming rage at that point would very likely have created something much worse. Best all around that it stops now.

David said...

If this guy wanted to get back at white people, he did a piss poor job. Mostly it sounds like he just wanted to kill someone in a way that would make a splash, and two NY cops were a big splash.

Laslo Spatula said...

Re: "Mostly it sounds like he just wanted to kill someone in a way that would make a splash, and two NY cops were a big splash."

He kills his girlfriend and he is just another low-life to be forgotten.

He kills his girlfriend and THEN kills two cops while posting social-media rhetoric on Social Justice: he is now a political martyr.

You will see his name on shirts soon enough: the police obviously did not even try to prevent his suicide, I am assuming will be said.

Can't I just eat my Skittles in peace?

I am Laslo.


Laslo Spatula said...

The black gunman is the white protest students at Kent State; the NYPD are the National Guard.

There: I helped the media start a narrative.

I am Laslo.

Laslo Spatula said...

"Can't I just eat my Skittles in peace?"

I need to make that into a T-shirt.

I am Laslo.

Laslo Spatula said...

"“They Take 1 Of Ours … Let’s Take 2 of Theirs"

If this is to be followed to its fullest extent, then the resulting population numbers will be no black people left with 75% of the white population remaining.

Rabble-rousers: do the Math before speaking.

I am Laslo.

Curious George said...

"MadisonMan said...
How does mental illness mean that forethought and preparation cannot occur?

Many things contributed to this nutso's rampage. I doubt we'll know the whole truth ever about it, and even if we did -- that's spending too much time thinking about an evil man."

This same kind of idiocy was spouted about 9/11 and the Fort Hood rampage.

jr565 said...

When there's a school shooting the left blames the NRA, when its Giffords shooting the left blames Sarah Palin for her rhetoric comparing winning elections to wars (similarly to how people describe actions in football games) but when protesters scream "what do we want? Dead cops" and the next day two cops get murdered the left of course doesn't blame those who literally are calling for murder.

Michael said...

David

He specifically killed two NY cops in retaliation for Eric Garner and Mike the gentle giant Brown.

He was not crazy. He was not mentally Ill. He was not all oh-my-gosh-I-just-shot-my-girlfriend-I -should go shoot some cops distraught. He planned to kill and he killed.

richard mcenroe said...

Joare -- You have now been told there is no such thing as gravity. Feel any urge to jump out a window and fly?

KLDAVIS said...

"I doubt we'll know the whole truth ever about it, and even if we did -- what difference, at this point, does it make?"

Fixed that for you, MM.

Michael K said...

This will get uglier. DeBlasio has not seen the end of it.

Ctmom4 said...

I'm glad the cops turned their backs on him at the press conference. He is probably too stupid to have noticed. Twenty years of peace and prosperity circling the drain in NYC.

Scott said...

I used to think that I could not go on
And life was nothing but an awful song
But now I know the meaning of true love
I'm leaning on the everlasting arms

If I can see it, then I can do it
If I just believe it, there's nothing to it

I believe I can fly
I believe I can touch the sky
I think about it every night and day
Spread my wings and fly away
I believe I can soar
I see me running through that open door
I believe I can fly
I believe I can fly
I believe I can fly


etc.

Scott said...

Perhaps if they were a little more humble when they make mistakes like shooting unarmed civilians or the family schnauzer, and not try to construct some kind of backstory to the effect of, "They deserved it," the cops wouldn't have so many Americans loathing them.

JAORE said...

Blogger richard mcenroe said...

Joare -- You have now been told there is no such thing as gravity. Feel any urge to jump out a window and fly?

Nope, you are not a TV news personality, nor are you a recognized leader of a racial group. Therefore what you say has no import.

In a bit less sarcastic approach, I was never among the throng of gullible, emotion driven fools that jumped on the "facts" of hands up-shot-in-the-back choir boy Brown in the first minute of CNN coverage. Nor am I with those that don't give a damn about forensic evidence if it violates my narrative. In addition I am not with those that look upon a perceived injustice as an opportunity to burn and loot as some kind of solution.

Last, but not least, although I often think that gravity sucks (especially when before a mirror) I accept the evidence of that force.

So, perhaps, it is you who should go jump.

William said...

I'd rather live in a city where the cops are more supportive of the mayor than the low level drug dealers. DeBlasio has lost his police department. Things will get worse, especially for black people who now have to depend on the bloods and crips to police their neighborhood. This is a huge mess, and most of it is DeBlasio's fault.

Scott said...

Reason tells us that these were the first two NYPD officers to be fatally shot in the line of duty since 2011.

Donald Douglas said...

Really sick to my stomach with this news. And I fully and unequivocally blame the left for the murders.

RecChief said...

the celebrations from leftists in this country make me sick.

All the celebrities, football and basketball players, and politicians who did that stupid "hands up, don't shoot" or who drone on about how evil and bloodthirsty police officers are should be criminally charged, or made party to a wrongful death suit. And since we have twitter, there is ample evidence of their complicity

hamiyam said...

Another event of the series which fulfills Glen Beck's expectations of a few years ago regarding the decline of our moral fiber.

Michael The Magnificent said...

So, we have Sharpton meeting with Obama and de Blasio to coordinate this. And we have Holder, who should be prosecuting Sharpton for millions in unpaid taxes, doing nothing.

And we have Sharpton leading marches where they are chanting "What do we want? Dead cops!"

And a week later, we have two dead cops! Imagine that!

But you lefties have clean hands, right? Sure, you shouted "Fire!" in a crowded theater, and people got killed as a direct result, but hey, not like you're to blame, right assholes?

n.n said...

There is not a principle to attribute this tragedy to all black Americans. There is not a principle to attribute this tragedy to all police officers. Let's hope the prejudice remains contained to principled criticism.

chickelit said...

Could we at least have some street level views (close-ups even) of the NYC "we want dead cops" chanters/protesters on YouTube? These could be extremely useful for embarrassment purposes. They have to exist.

If only Mediahouse had been there there would have been quality viral footage.

Skeptical Voter said...

Over at Powerline there's a suggestion that the shooter had ties to The Black Guerilla Family, a prison gang that has "declared war on the cops".

I don't know whether Ismaayi (the shooter's first name) was just standard issue ghetto naming in the mid 1980's, or whether it represents some recent conversion to Islam. If that's the case, this may well be an instance of "workplace violence" ala Ft. Hood--just some crazy Muslim shooting up the place while yelling Allulah Akbar!

But if the shooter had connections to The Black Guerilla Family, his motivation in shooting two cops may have predated all of the nonsensical race baiting crapola that Sharpton, Holder and Obama have been spewing lately. Sorry to give those three clowns a pass--but maybe they get one here.

Michael The Magnificent said...

But if the shooter had connections to The Black Guerilla Family, his motivation in shooting two cops...

Could have done it in Baltimore, but drove to NYC instead. Try again.

Achilles said...

n.n said...

"There is not a principle to attribute this tragedy to all black Americans. There is not a principle to attribute this tragedy to all police officers. Let's hope the prejudice remains contained to principled criticism."

The people who profit from sowing racial discord are however directly responsible for this situation. They chose the Brown story and the trayvon martin specifically for the fact that it was obvious the white guy was innocent and would get off even if one of them was an honorary white guy.

For the people who are acting in good faith I agree with you. For those that aren't there should be some principled jail time. And chanting about dead cops in a protest march kinda eliminates you from the good faith club.

Trashhauler said...

Mob action contributes to random, murders. How could they ever have anticipated that?

WestVirginiaRebel said...

Officers turn their backs on Big Bill:

Video

wendybar said...

"President Obama, who has encouraged the national demonstrations, expressed proper regret over the assassinations, and played golf in Hawaii."quoted in UrgentAgenda 12/20/14

Christy said...

Rhetoric by Democrats has loaded up mental defectives across the nation and aimed them at cops. Let's demand Hillary, Warren, O'Malley, Webb, and Biden to disavow the hate mongered by fellow Democrat Sharpton.

Scott said...

"Let's hope the prejudice remains contained to principled criticism."

No worries. You'll always find the most principled prejudice here.

davinci78 said...

Wonder how many professional athletes will wear attire pronouncing support for the murdered police officers.

My guess equals zero.

paminwi said...

Michael you are an idiot! How many protests have we heard about in Baltimore? How many times has Al Sharpton been to Baltimore? How much has the Baltimore Mayor said about this issue and been on the news about it? The media is focused on NYC and this guy knew NYC was where he could make a splash. It wasn't going to be Baltimore!



Dennis said...

I am not sure how anyone with active brain cells did not see this coming? One cannot invite an arsonist into your organization, party or government without having a fire. The arsonist enjoys the flames and cares less about the destruction.
We have an arsonist as mayor of NYC. We have an arsonist as president of the US and we have an arsonist in charge of the Department of Injustice. What these three people have in common is that one of their closest advisors is the ultimate fire starter Al Sharton. This should have been obvious to the most casual observer.

Unknown said...

FYI, all you libertarians out there, this has not come without its own reward. The PBA has instructed its people to go to a war footing, which in another sense may be constructed as work to rule.

In other words, a minimum of two cars to respond to every radio reports, and no arrests unless absolutely necessary. So you want people to walk away from quality of life offenses, you don't want the Eric Garners of the world to be bothered, you got it.

And all it took was two policemen being shot in the head while having their lunch. Good show! Now let's see how you like it.

Unknown said...

Source for the previous claim:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3239400/posts

Same text as the tweet I saw earlier

Bruce Hayden said...

Unknown - yes, NYC is going to get the level of police protection that they voted for with DeBlssio. I feel bad for them, but not bad enough to visit there. Or, really pretty much anywhere in solid Blue America.

Scott said...

"The PBA has instructed its people to go to a war footing..."

Yeah, you better watch out, they might throw a bowling ball at you.

Mitch H. said...

There was an ambush-shooting of a cop in a radio-car on one of the NYC-shot procedurals on Thursday night. I see no signs that it's getting blamed for inspiration, and that's one for the social media era, I suppose. But the episode ends with the perp's street full of a silent crowd of glaring uniforms like a murder of crows; feels kind of like a sort of prophesy this morning.

Robert Cook said...

"In cities, in areas where gangs have taken over, declare Martial Law, disarm and arrest them (gang members) and prosecute the terrorists to the fullest extent of the law."

An idiotic and dangerous idea. Once the government has been given the go-ahead to impose martial law anywhere, for any reason, it will be martial law all the time, for everyone.

That's where we're headed, anyway, through the passive acceptance (and active support) of right-wing "law and order" types who applaud ever more onerous sentencing requirements, the prosecution of children as adults, three-strikes-you're-out laws, the militarization of police departments, torture by the government against scary bad guys, and not demanding reforms in response to the national plague of police brutality.

Robert Cook said...

"The PBA has instructed its people to go to a war footing..."


Yeah, that'll help.

JAORE said...

Robert, did you read what "war footing" entails? A key component sounds a lot like what you advocate. The cops NOT confronting alleged criminals unless in cases of injury or death. In essence allowing petty crimes to go forth unimpeded. Avoiding, therefore, confrontation. Just the opposite of martial law. What could go wrong?

Bruce Hayden said...

Cook - only in places that elect DeBlassios and the like. Places that put the lives of Black hoodlums like Mike Brown over those of the police officers we ask to protect us from them. The rest of the country, that puts law and order above racial divisisiveness for political gain will be just fine.

n.n said...

Achilles:

I am addressing principled individuals. Hopefully, they represent a majority of Americans. However, even pro-choice people abhor public displays of violence. So, at least we can keep up appearances. For whatever that is worth.

Robert Cook said...

@Bruce Hayden:

You misunderstand the nature of government...any government. If it is confident it has the power to declare martial law--always using as justification some exigent circumstance, some unprecedented crisis or emergency--it will do so, and, having done so without challenge, it will maintain martial law, or expand its geographic parameters. There is no criminal menace to the public in an orderly society--and ours is an orderly society--greater than the menace of a government that has dispensed with all claims of limits on its power.

(Do you really think the police are here to "protect us" from "black hoodlums?" I have lived in NYC since the beginning of the 80s, during the crack epidemic and era of high crime, and I never felt then or now that "black hoodlums" were a particular menace to me, or that the police were out there to protect me from them.)

mamawolf said...

New Year's Eve is only 10 days away. It would be a shame if a bad case of "blue flu" should occur to cancel those celebrations. This would be a huge hit to the wallets of New York City. Hitting them in the wallet seems to be the only way to get their attention.

buwaya puti said...

When I lived in Oakland CA decades ago I was twice robbed at gunpoint by black hoodlums. An interesting experience really, most educational, highly recommended. Lots of other people were too, even in "good" neighborhoods, and it did rather reduce the quality of life, particularly for immigrant women and kids who frankly lived in terror.
So, Cook, speak for yourself.

Achilles said...

Unknown said...

"In other words, a minimum of two cars to respond to every radio reports, and no arrests unless absolutely necessary. So you want people to walk away from quality of life offenses, you don't want the Eric Garners of the world to be bothered, you got it."

This is the necessary straw man you have to slide to. We are not in favor of race hustlers and progressives in general. We are not in favor of the progressives using incidents like this to divide the electorate by race.

And no, I don't want the Eric Garners of the world to be tackled and arrested. I don't want people to die so the state can protect their tax revenue stream. He wasn't hurting anyone. There shouldn't be state protection rackets charging 10$ for a pack of cigarettes.

You people are absurd.

Jason said...

Wait... they've been making unnecessary arrests?

Roger Zimmerman said...

@Scott

"Perhaps if _they_ were more humble ..."

Who is they? This is an entirely collectivist notion of justice and it underlines the point that is being missed by your side here:

Yes, there are bad cops, and yes there are even some that commit crimes. But, unless you are a principled anarchist, you must recognize the absolute need for government to have a conditional monopoly on defensive force (conditional in the sense that individuals must still retain the right of self defense in an emergency), an an absolute monopoly on retaliatory force. And, government officials must be 100% clear in supporting that arrangement in both action and rhetoric. The alternative leads us on the continuum to chaos.

They way to deal with the bad apples is to charge them with crimes, and then use the same justice system that is used when others are accused of crimes to try to convict them. This justice system is imperfect. We should always work to correct its imperfections. That would have been a reasonable approach for those that disagree with the way this system worked in the cases of Brown and Garner. (I am not one of those, though in Garner's case, I do see cause for internal discipline, since the cops should have been quicker to recognize the health emergency that was occurring).

But that is not the primary tack that was taken in these instances. Instead the protesters, egged on by the hucksters and race hustlers, focussed all of their attention on police behavior, and they didn't leave it at the individual behavior of the officers in these cases - they painted their broad brush across all police.

And the politicians followed suit. It is clear that the likes of De Blasio, Holder, and even Obama are making a general statement about policing, and are deflecting attention from other possible aspects of government failure in these cases. In that sense, the police are entirely justified in saying that the officials do not have their back.

Indeed, De Blasio's statements about policing are those of a dissident, not a mayor. If he really felt that way, he should have been going full bore into reform mode from the day he took office, and should have staked his administration on changing how the NYPD does their job. Instead, he has cynically tried to benefit from the outcry and protests, and most certainly has not emphasized the fundamental importance of police in preserving a free society (until yesterday, that is).

He should be ashamed of himself.

Robert Cook said...

@buwaya puti:

I don't dispute that people are victims of crimes--I was mugged by two men in my neighborhood years ago, and held up at gunpoint at my job, (neither time by "black hoodlums")--and I don't dispute that blacks commit crimes. However, I dispute Bruce Hayden's implication that we are fighting some sort of war for the survival of civilization against the scourge of "black hoodlums," with the police as the only wall protecting us from them.

Doug said...

Did anyone check with zerobama to see if these two slain officers "acted stupidly"?

Unknown said...

Achilles,

Every time I move towards sympathy for your point of view, you remind me why not. I've just gutted you and you won't admit it. As Quint said to Hooper in Jaws, "It proves that you [wealthy college boys] don't have the education enough to admit when you're wrong."