December 21, 2014

"If you want a government that’s gonna intrude on your life, enforce their personal views on you, then I guess Jeb Bush is your man."

"We really don’t need another Bush in office," said Terri Schiavo's widower Michael.
Though Michael Schiavo got a court order in 2002 to remove his wife’s feeding tube — he said his wife had not wanted to be kept alive artificially — Jeb Bush intervened, pushing the state legislature to pass an unconstitutional bill in a special session giving him authority to order the feeding tube reinserted. When a state judge ordered it removed again, [Michael Schiavo's lawyer George] Felos told ThinkProgress, Bush “manipulated the organs of state government in order to try to evade the court order.”
There's an unfortunate phrase in a serious discussion —  "manipulated the organs of state government" — and yet it's oddly apt, expressing outrage at the inappropriateness of Bush's intrusions. 

100 comments:

Gahrie said...

Do you really want to make a hero of a man who led a crusade to kill his wife?

Oso Negro said...

Another way to say it might be "if you like the way the Establishment has steered this country for the past 25 years, and want more of the same, then Jeb Bush is your man." Otherwise, TED CRUZ might be your man!

ddh said...

Didn't Michael Schiavo manipulate the law to allow him to starve and dehydrate his wife to death? Did not Mr. Schiavo have a financial stake in being married to Terri Schiavo whenever she died, and did he not want to remarry?

Would it be fair to say that Jeb Bush believes that euthanasia is legalized murder and should be opposed?

Krumhorn said...

Jen Bush did exactly the right thing. Her parents strongly believed that she was conscious and aware. Her sniveling husband just wanted to avoid having to care for her. She was damaged goods.

If we cannot rely on government to value and protect our lives, then even that last piece of justification for its existence is gone.

It was Jeb's best moment.

- Krumhorn

Humperdink said...

Another case where the main street media's volume overwhelmed the side of right.

Schiavo's husband wanted her dead, Schiavo's parents and Bush did not. The husband was released of all financial obligations for her care, yet still wanted her dead. I am thinking there was a financial reward for him when she met her demise.

David Hampton said...

Jeb Bush values life. Consider that when thinking of the families of the two dead NYPD cops assassinated by the black thug from Maryland. We would find it easier to support Jeb Bush's pro-life stance than Diblasio's support for psychopath anarchists shouting "Kill a cop."

MayBee said...

That was a tough case, and Michael Shiavo is odious to continue to use it to push his Democrat party politics.

CStanley said...

There's a much better argument against the federal officials who got involved than against Jeb Bush. Plus, Michael Schiavo is a monster in my view, so anyone that he opposes is someone that deserves a second look.

Amadeus 48 said...

As I remember it, Florida had a robust system for reviewing these cases, it went up and down the court system two or three times, and the GOP, in an awesome example of forgetting why they were sent to Washington, made a federal case out of it. I remember saying to my wife that the Republicans in Congress had just jumped the shark and the GOP was through. They had forgotten that they were the party of small government. Then came the 2006 elections and Pelosi became speaker.
Folks, we have court systems at the state level that are fairly close to the people in the community. If the people don't like the way the system is working they can toss out judges and prosecutors. We don't need officious, grandstanding politicians intervening in ongoing cases. Both Bush brothers deserve low marks on this one.

Unknown said...

This guy made his wife brain dead in the first place and now he resents being interfered with in trying to finish the job?

Anonymous said...

Jeb Bush values life. Consider that when thinking of the families of the two dead NYPD cops assassinated by the black thug from Maryland. We would find it easier to support Jeb Bush's pro-life stance than Diblasio's support for psychopath anarchists shouting "Kill a cop."

Why are you only pointing out the race of the "thug" who killed the cops? Why aren't you pointing out the race of Jeb Bush? Or Diblasio? Or the two cops that were killed?

Why is it so important to you that the race of that one person be noted and singled out, while totally ignoring the color of the skin on everyone else?

dbp said...

As I recall the case; the husband kept his wife alive through the malpractice suit and was awarded additional funds to pay for further care.

Money in hand and new girlfriend in tow--the old wife became expendable.

jr565 said...

F Michael Schiavo. He told a court he would take care of Terri and got a settlement for thwt very purpose. Then all of a sudden she expressed wishes that she wanted to die. After he got the money and no longer wanted to take care of her.
Further he had moved on with his life. let Her parents and family continue providing for her if they want. And they did.
If he can't produce documents where she expressed her intentions and has moved on with his life, and got money to take care of her, the default position shouldn't be to kill her. Sorry.
Did she have a chance to recover? Probably not. But let the parents deal with that. Not the guy who wants to move on with his life.

Paul said...

Bush is no totalitarian. We have that example already in the White House and Bush is no where near like Obama.

Whom ever wrote the article does not know what they are talking about.

Do I want a Bush dynasty?

No really.

Do I want a Clinton dynasty?

Yuck no.

I sure hope a better libertarian/Republican candidate comes forward but if forced between the two Bush is 10x better.

jr565 said...

She never signed a paper expressing her intent. Since she didn't I don't see why Jeb should take the position that it's better that she dies. The husband himself expressed a desire to keep her alive. And got money for it. If she never wanted to be revived, why did he take the money in the first place.
If I was the husband, And wanted out, I'd turn over care to the parents.

tim in vermont said...

Oh great, another lecture from another "Nurse in Maine"

Jeb must have paid him to say this.

tim in vermont said...

Governors have the final say on death sentences in their state. Except in this case where those chanting kill kill kill won.

stan said...

Democrats love killing innocent people who can't fight back. Democrats only think it noble to fight like hell and manipulate the law if the effort is to keep convicted murderers alive.

Michael K said...

"Do you really want to make a hero of a man who led a crusade to kill his wife?"

Exactly. I read a lot about that case and the issue was that the parents were willing to pay for her care whether the docs said she was brain dead or not. That is not the first time I have seen that sort of thing but it is usually somebody else paying. In this case, it was his own self interest. Nothing else.

Gabriel said...

What's funny about "government intruding on your personal life" is how little progressives include under "personal life".

Progressives want to regulate what you can smoke, eat, and drink, what kinds of light bulbs you have in your home, how many miles you drive your car, etc etc. And in end-of-life decisions they DEFINITELY think the government ought to be involved.

I once challenged my progressive sister after she claimed she thought anything between consenting adults should be legal. I said, I can think of something you will find so perverted that you think it ought to be illegal. She said, what? I said, "agree to work for less than minimum wage."

She had no answer to that.

Michael K said...

"Why is it so important to you that the race of that one person be noted and singled out, while totally ignoring the color of the skin on everyone else?"

Whaaat ? Does the news media ever, ever point out the race of the criminal or killer ?

The facts, as unpleasant as they are to boobs like you, are that blacks are killing and attacking whites for racial reasons. They attempt to conceal this fact by alleging misbehavior by police. The rare cases of police misbehavior are punished.

This creep killed those cops because he was BLACK, or Muslim, take your choice but probably both.

MisterBuddwing said...

Does the news media ever, ever point out the race of the criminal or killer ?

Well, obviously they do, otherwise you wouldn't know what this guy's race was, would you?

Donatello Nobody said...

Plus, we already know the race of the other people mentioned.

Steven Wilson said...

I never understood why she had to die. As per usual the media was all over one side of this issue. The details are fuzzy but I hadn't remembered that he got a malpractice settlement to keep her alive and then "remembered" that she didn't want to be kept alive.

I think comment #1 was a very concise and adequate appraisal of Michael Shiavo and the entire process.

Anonymous said...

This creep killed those cops because he was BLACK, or Muslim, take your choice but probably both

Interesting theory that people are committing crimes simply because of their skin color. I'm sure that a lot of people on this blog will agree with your the urge to kill is part of their genes idea.

If committing murder is really just part of their natural tendencies, as you claim, then what solution are you proposing?

Laura said...

To paraphrase Merriam Webster, a "widower" is a man whose wife has died and who usually remains unmarried.

Use of the term does well to remind of the victim, but gives Mr. Shiavo standing he does not deserve.

robinintn said...

Wait, the guy who hit the jackpot with his wife's death doesn't approve of Jeb? Hmm. Second look.

MisterBuddwing said...

Interesting theory that people are committing crimes simply because of their skin color.

Well, in all fairness, there have been instances of racially motivated homicides in which the races and ethnicities of those involved - perps as well as victims- do become relevant. That's not to say that "race explains everything." And in this case, can we say that the victims were targeted because of their race - or their occupation?

ThreeHeaded Throop said...

Bush is a nut sack. I wouldn't vote for him to stop the re-animated corpse of Karl Marx from becoming president.

Robert Cook said...

"I once challenged my progressive sister after she claimed she thought anything between consenting adults should be legal. I said, I can think of something you will find so perverted that you think it ought to be illegal. She said, what? I said, 'agree to work for less than minimum wage.'

"She had no answer to that."


Probably because she couldn't make sense of the completely baffling non-sequitur that you thought (and apparently still think) is such a devastating "gotcha!"

MadisonMan said...

Schiavo's husband wanted her dead

Teri Schiavo was already dead. The post-mortem did, after all, show irreversible brain damage.

I don't see this as pushing a Democrat on us, MayBee, so much as being specifically anti-Jeb, and given what was done against Michael Schiavo, can you blame him? I won't.

The Schiavo case reminds everyone, I hope, to have Advanced Directives. Even though my Mom had one, and she expressed many many times not to end up like her Mom (multiple strokes left Grandmother unable to recognize anyone), when it came time to withhold food from Mom, even knowing it was her wish, and that wish was written down, and Dad agreed with it, well even then, it's a nightmare to live through. Because at that point they can't tell you.

donald said...

Yeah, well she wasn't. Her brain was gone. When the autopsy was performed, he brain was basically mush.

My wife's family was very religious, but they weren't delusional or morons. Sitting in that room with her mother and sister was the most horrifying thing I will ever experience. Making the decision was something I would never wish on anyone and to judge me, or Genetha, or Rhonda or Michael Schiavo in the despicable way he experienced is disgusting.

There was a little flickering in my wife's and my mother's eyes. don't mean they could comprehend anything.


Every motherfucker that wants to play those games needs to suffer through it one time.

MayBee said...

I don't see this as pushing a Democrat on us, MayBee, so much as being specifically anti-Jeb, and given what was done against Michael Schiavo, can you blame him? I won't.

Mad Man- I say that because of his Democrat party politics postings on Daily Kos, etc.

donald said...

After reading more here, so fucking what? He was the husband, it was his decision. It is horrible that the divide happened.

I ain't saying he wasn't a shitbird, I don't really know, but I saying, experience it bitches then get back to me.

John Lynch said...

Yeah... I don't think bringing the Schiavo case up again is a winner for anyone. This is something people already have an opinion about, and it isn't a wedge issue.

donald said...

And fuck the entire concept of knowing they're not coming back then starving them to death.

Like I said, live it, like I have twice, then get back to me.

Deirdre Mundy said...

War on women--not giving out free contraception to them.

NOT war on women - allowing abusive husbands kill their wives to make it easier to marry their girlfriends.

Yeah. That makes total sense.

Remember, she wasn't on 'life support'. She was being tube fed. He didn't get the right to 'pull the plug, he got the right to deny food and water to someone who had feeding difficulties.

If you did that to your newborn, it would be murder. But for a guy whose cheating on his wife and refuses to divorce her (b/c then he'd lose the court settlement), it's a triumph of human rights.

After she died, he used the money to buy a boat.

Real great spokesman there, Democrats.

MadisonMan said...

I don't think bringing the Schiavo case up again is a winner for anyone.

Disagree. I'm no fan of YABIO *Yet Another Bush In Office* -- I just made that up. And I probably wouldn't vote for Jeb -- unless the Democrat is Particularly Odious (Hi Hil!) -- but it's useful to remember a good reason to keep a Big Govt Republican out of office.

MadisonMan said...

After she died

I'll repeat, then get back to grading: She was Dead already.

I write this as someone who denied food/water to a parent at their specific request. It's a hellacious thing to live through.

John Lynch said...

What Deirdre said. The scumminess of the whole affair will come out the more it is talked over.

You can try to make the case about principles, but the details are appalling.

John Lynch said...

MM-

"YABIO" is perfect. What a great word!

mccullough said...

This burnishes Jeb's pro-life credentials. It will
help him with those voters for whom this is an important issue, and that is not an insignificant percentage of Republican primary voters in many states.

Laura said...

"If you want a government that's gonna intrude on your life, enforce their personal views on you, then I [know ______ are] your [power couple]."

Why bother to fix "food deserts" for children with unhealthy eating habits then? Mr. Shiavo makes a life decision for his wife in the short term, the children's parents make the decision in the long term.

But then again, scavengers and demagogues have to eat too.

Next up: When "race" in Race to the Top becomes a noun, while testing companies prosper.

MayBee said...

Tom Harkin was a big force behind the Shiavo thing, too.

It was a tough case.

mccullough said...

Think how pissed Michael Schiavo would be if he had to buy an Obamacare policy for Terri Schiavo.

MayBee said...

Even Obama was in favor of Congress getting involved in the Terri Shiavo case. Although he later regretted it (when he was running for President)

It was a pretty bipartisan effort. Making it all Jeb's fault is pretty revisionary.

http://www.wnd.com/2008/02/57488/

Laura said...

If willing to play God, prove it: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/23/rom-houben-man-in-coma-fo_n_367798.html.

EDH said...

A few thoughts:

1.) The individual rights they tout using genderless pronouns are the husband's, not the now dead wife's.

2.) It was a court order, not an advance directive, that was the basis for the removal of the feeding tube. There was no affirmative consent of the decedent in advance.

3.) There's been a story in the news recently about a husband who is no longer allowed in a nursing home because she has dementia and cannot affirmatively consent to sex. Who's the government to say her wedding vows did not constitute an oral "advance directive" giving her life-long consent to sex?

I saw nothing wrong with the state investigating this creep and giving her parents a hearing before a federal judge before she was put to death by order of the state. Where are all the defenders of habeas corpus?

Anonymous said...

Because, let's face it, nothing says "hands off everyone's private life" quite like a court order.

EDH said...

I suspect the people who believe this case called for additional review/investigation do so because they believe if they were in the same position as Michael Schiavo, advocating the same outcome as Michael Schiavo, they would expect to receive the same scrutiny.

I know I would.

iowan2 said...

That the take away for Jeb?

How about Jeb was just using his legal executive authority for the best of all the people?

Thats the Obama stance. I might add, the left finds that a very acceptable power.

(the left is just too stupid to realize who ever is in power gets to decide what is 'for the best of the people' and not the actual people themselves)

Freeman Hunt said...

"She never signed a paper expressing her intent."

Exactly. This wasn't an advance directive case. She didn't have one.

Big Mike said...

Jeb Bush is way outside the mainstream of the Republican party. I have no idea why he thinks he ought to be the GOP standard bearer.

Achilles said...

My wife is fervently Christian. She believes and goes to church much more regularly than I do. She has told me on many occasions not to keep her alive if she is in that situation. She has been quite clear.

If I was in that guy's situation and the governor of the state jumped in I would be pissed.

You people getting up on your high horse celebrating Jebs abuse of power are misguided. You also have a tendency to be very strident when the only things you know about a situation were learned from a media with a truth problem.

traditionalguy said...

At least that kerfuffle to appeal to right to lifers was educational.

Who knew that there was a vegetative state? Comas were trouble enough.

The Legislature in Georgia changed the statute for a model Living Will to include the option of using it in a Vegetative State. They also made the maker pick among the three acts of approved withdrawal of life support as 1)All, or 2)all but feeding tube, or 3)all but feeding tube and hydration.

n.n said...

Said the guy who lost interest in caring for his wife and ordered her abortion.

The Godfather said...

Terri Schiavo couldn't be reached for comment.

The Godfather said...

In the future, the Death Panels will take care of issues like this.

The Godfather said...

I STILL don't support Bush for president. On the other hand, if the rape-defender is the other candidate, I'd have to vote for Jeb, wouldn't I?

Charlie Eklund said...

It is sobering to realize that we live in a society that can not only rationalize but also judicially order the murder of those who are too ill to defend themselves.

The question that comes to mind is, who's next?

Achilles said...

The Godfather said...
"In the future, the Death Panels will take care of issues like this."

Exactly. Jeb Bush knew better about Terry's wishes than the guy she married and lived with for years. We need to bring these decisions to the highest most removed level possible.

The husband might have been scum. But I guarantee the government bureaucracy everyone here seems to want making these decisions will be scum just like the IRS, EPA, FCC, DEA etc.

Gabriel said...

@Robert Cook:Probably because she couldn't make sense of the completely baffling non-sequitur that you thought (and apparently still think) is such a devastating "gotcha!"

One person offers work to another at a wage, and the offer is accepted.

How is this not between consenting adults? How is this a non-sequitir?

You prove my point--to you the private decision ought not to be left to individual decision.

You are so far into regulating the private individual decisions that you literally cannot interpret the question in the sense that everyone else does.

n.n said...

Generational "progressives" rally around abortion, again. If it wasn't for fiscal "liberalism" (i.e. redistributive change), the libertarians would join them in a democratic consensus.

Michael K said...

"If committing murder is really just part of their natural tendencies, as you claim, then what solution are you proposing?"

Are you an idiot or just trying to be clever ?

He SAID he was going to kill cops. He SAID that was why.

"Their natural tendencies" refers to what, exactly ? Are you trying to project your racial views on me ?

The political left is the group that thinks blacks can't get along without their ministering to their needs. Read a book !

richard mcenroe said...

The only people who want Job Bush to run for President are the Republican National Committee and Democrats. But I repeat myself.

Michael K said...

"Jeb Bush knew better about Terry's wishes than the guy she married and lived with for years. We need to bring these decisions to the highest most removed level possible."

How about her parents ? The husband had an obvious conflict of interest in that he had been paid to care for her and now decided to stop doing so. Why not let the parents do so ? So he could keep the money ?

I don't think Jeb Bush made the decision. I probably would have advised the parents to let her go but they had an interest, too.

bgates said...

It's so important to Democrats that Terri Schiavo ended up dead, you'd almost think she was a police officer.

n.n said...

bgates:

Burnt offerings to their mortal gods. Their mortal gods feed them opiates, and demand taxable and liquidated assets.

Rusty said...

I think we've seen enough of the Bush clan for awhile.
Lets let someone who is not entrenched in the party establishment have a chance.

Gahrie said...

How is this not between consenting adults? How is this a non-sequitir?

You have to understand...Bolshie Bob doesn't believe in contracts, or private contracts between consenting adults.

Follow Boxer's lead and do what Napoleon tells you to.

Bolshie Bob dreams of being Squealor.

tim in vermont said...

Basically Democrats are about Kill! Kill! Kill!

Racist cops? Kill'em, kill 'em now!

Subhuman babies? Kill 'em, Kill 'em now!

Woman whose family wants to take care of her, but her husband wants the money for himself?

Kill 'er, Kill 'er now!

Boy Democrats are sweet people!

And Robert Cook, just because you can't understand that working for less than the minimum wage can be agreed between consenting adults doesn't make it a non-sequitur, it just makes you a bit slow and incapable of examining your own assumptions.

tim in vermont said...

I only hope, if Jeb should be the candidate, that the Dems make a big deal about their huge snuff party for Terry.

Brando said...

You may hate Jeb, or have good reason to oppose him over the Schiavo flap, but if Michael Schiavo is your spokesman you've basically given up.

Brando said...

And whatever I may think of Jeb, if it comes down to him versus the Rapist enabling Hilary, then he's already got my vote. I'd hate for our first female president to be a rapist enabler, and think America can do better.

jaed said...

Teri Schiavo was already dead. The post-mortem did, after all, show irreversible brain damage.

You are seriously going there? Brain damage and resultant disability are equivalent to death? I'm not at all sure you want to go there. (I certainly don't.)


The Schiavo case reminds everyone, I hope, to have Advanced Directives

And what if your Advanced Directive says "I don't think being fed and watered a couple of times a day is too much to ask"? Then there's still a problem, if someone wants you dead and you're not cooperatively dying.

(It might be noted as well that up until a few years after Terri Schiavo suffered the incident that left her with massive brain damage, Florida did not allow denial of food and water to patients. Even if she had filled out a directive, she would have had no reason to think she needed to specify a yes or no on basic care (food, water, being kept sheltered and warm), since no one at that time was contemplating denying these things. In other words, her directive wouldn't have helped.)


got a court order in 2002 to remove his wife’s feeding tube

It was worse than that. She was also under court order forbidding any attempt to feed her or give her water by mouth. The court order was in essence a death sentence, something acknowledged by the judge when he stated that Michael Schiavo was entitled to a "date certain" by which her death was to occur.

Alex said...

Is anyone shocked that the Bush KKKlan are statists?

Alex said...

Do you really want to make a hero of a man who led a crusade to kill his wife?

She was already brain-dead. But go ahead, fighter of the rights of vegetables.

Alex said...

This guy made his wife brain dead in the first place and now he resents being interfered with in trying to finish the job?

By all accounts Terry Schiavo put herself into this brain-dead state by severe dieting. Who knows how many other women do this to themselves.

Jack Wayne said...

So let's review: For thousands of years the spouse made family decisions in the case of the incapacity of the other spouse. Jeb Bush - acting as a Progressive, not a Conservative - decided to interpose the government into what has always been a family decision. And most of the commenters here think that was the right thing to do? Is it any wonder freedom does not exist in this country anymore?

jr565 said...

Alex wrote:She was already brain-dead. But go ahead, fighter of the rights of vegetables

She had no directive saying what she wanted. And she had a family that was willing to take care of her. And her husband won money in court saying he would take care of her. IF it was her express wishes not to be kept alive he shouldn't have taken the money in the first place.
He wanted out. Let him go. but let the family who still wanted to keep her alive do so.

jr565 said...

why didn't michael get a divorce. He had kids and a new girl friend. he had already moved on with his life. So let the parents take care of her.

jr565 said...

Terri Schiavo timeline:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terri_Schiavo_timeline

1992
August: Michael meets his future wife, Jodi Anne Centonze, at a dentist's office. Shortly after meeting, they begin to date each other.
Michael brings a medical malpractice suit against Dr. Stephen Igel, the ob/gyn who had been treating Terri. Jury finds the obstetrician had not properly diagnosed Terri's condition. The case is appealed.
November: Settlement with Dr. Igel. $750k for Terri's care, $300k for himself.
1994
Michael accepts the diagnosis that Terri is in an irreversible persistent vegetative state. In consultation with Terri's physician, Schiavo halts most therapy for his wife.
Terri develops a urinary tract infection. Following a doctor's recommendation, Michael chooses not to treat it. Michael enters a "do not resuscitate" order, which he later rescinds after the parents protest.


there's a conflict of interest there. He's her guardian. He gets money for her care. He's dating another woman.

He should no longer be her guardian. He should have turned over the remaining money for her care to the parents and let them continue her care while he goes on with his life. As he already had.

Anonymous said...

Now you're making me reconsider my desire to stay far away from Bush.

More like this and I might vote for the man.

Anonymous said...

Alex writes;

She was already brain-dead. But go ahead, fighter of the rights of vegetables.

Absolutely disgusting and evil. In an area of science known as modern medicine, where we continually find out how wrong we've been in the past, you'd think people would have a little more doubt about such pronouncements.

Michael K said...

"Alex writes;

"She was already brain-dead. But go ahead, fighter of the rights of vegetables.

Absolutely disgusting and evil. In an area of science known as modern medicine, where we continually find out how wrong we've been in the past, you'd think people would have a little more doubt about such pronouncements."

Alex is an expert and knows all about vigilant coma.

He can tell us all about it.

There was a recent case. I knew of one that shocked all the medical staff at LA County hospital.

There have been quite a few cases of major brain damage with loss of a lot of cerebral hemisphere with recovery.

hombre said...

Wait. When a judge ordered the feeding tube removed he did not intrude on Terry's life, but when Bush acted to reinsert it he intruded on Michael's life.

Go figure.1004

hombre said...

1004? WTF's with the captcha?

tim in vermont said...

Fucking statists already outlawed murder. We knew then it was a slippery slope.

Achilles said...

eric said...
"Now you're making me reconsider my desire to stay far away from Bush.

More like this and I might vote for the man"

We should have Jeb in charge of all family care decisions. If it is too much for him we should have judges in charge of all of these choices. Hell we should just have a majority vote of the entire population when someone issues a DNR order.

Pretty soon you will get your wish. These decisions will be made by the government. But you will be sad when they are made. Government is inherently progressive.

I am resentful that people like you are so foolish and willing to give government officials more power over my life.

Gahrie said...

She was already brain-dead. But go ahead, fighter of the rights of vegetables.

When they came for those in a vegestative state......

jr565 said...

Achilles wrote:
"We should have Jeb in charge of all family care decisions. If it is too much for him we should have judges in charge of all of these choices. Hell we should just have a majority vote of the entire population when someone issues a DNR order.

Pretty soon you will get your wish. These decisions will be made by the government. But you will be sad when they are made. Government is inherently progressive.

I am resentful that people like you are so foolish and willing to give government officials more power over my life."

There's an easy way tovt can stay out of your life. Have a directive that states how you should be treated in the event of catastrophic injury. If you don't have that, I'm not sure thwt it's somehow wrong for govt to side for life when there's a question about your vegetative state, and more importantly when your family is asking you not to pull the plug.

I've known enough cases of spouses killing their spouses for me to accept the husbands desire to kill his wife whn he clearly has a conflict of interest in doing so.
He got almost three quarter of a million for her care, plus 300,000 for his own pocket. And then he starts dating and doesnt get a divorce. How convenient then for him that he suddenly suggests she never wanted to be kept on life support.
If there's a directive to pull the plug, pull the
It. If there isn't courts need to determine on case by case basis whether the person pulling her plug in fact doesn't have conflict of interest. If family members are willing to pay for her care, then what's the problem?
Let the husband give the money for her care to her family, divorce his wife so he's not engaged in adultery every time he screws his new gf.

n.n said...

Michael K:

Not only was she murdered, but tortured also. Her husband could have taken an affirmative step to abort her life, but instead chose to cause progressive distress to her body and mind. Not exactly ethical.

re: Coma and vegetative states... a novel approach

That's a good place to start. The next step is to identify criteria to aid prediction of recovery. Is that even possible? Life is a chaotic process, which precludes prediction. However, forecasting a recovery based on known characteristics would at least mitigate creation of a moral hazard.

chillblaine said...

If you want a government that's gonna intrude on your life and send hundreds of federal agents with assault rifles and full battle dress to deport a little kid back to Cuba, then yeah, I guess you want a Clinton.

Ann Althouse said...

The issue for discussion is the mind of Jeb Bush, which he offers as "the decider" for the whole world.

You can rehash what the courts did with the Terri Schiavo case and who should have won, but I would recommend talking about the judgment and governmental philosophy of Jeb Bush.

Abdul Abulbul Amir said...


Have you ever seen a sadistic sergeant manipulate his privates?

BudBrown said...

There's a nice St. Pete Times article from Nov 2, 2003 reviewing the events. Quote:
Bush called the decision "an act of compassion." He and House Speaker Johnnie Byrd, R-Plant City, got most of the credit - and gratitude - from people across the country who agreed with the decision. Bush said more than 160,000 people made calls and sent e-mails."
Did yall know Jeb converted to cathoicism? I cant remember if that's something I'd forgotten.

Say you mention that in a given circumstance you'd want this or that. But turns out that's against your religion and religion rules.
Have there been cases where it was considered if religious affiliation is the determining factor in dnr events?

And was the Catholic Church opposed to pulling the feeding tube?

LilyBart said...

They STARVED that woman to death!

Michael Schiavo said his wife didn't want to live that way. Maybe, but wouldn't it have been more humane just to give her too much morphine, or similar drug? They killed her.

Its illegal to starve a dog to death.

LilyBart said...

"The issue for discussion is the mind of Jeb Bush, which he offers as "the decider" for the whole world."

Of course - Jeb is an arrogant elitist who loves to substitute his judgement for the little peoples'.

I disagree with a number of his views, but it's his contempt for people like me that puts the nail in the coffin of my support for him.

LilyBart said...

Still - they STARVED a woman to death.

LilyBart said...

"mind of Jeb Bush, which he offers as "the decider" for the whole world."

But doesn't Obama do the same really?

He doesn't mind lying to us, because he KNOWS what's best for us when we don't (according to him).