September 14, 2014

"I was not here in the run-up to Iraq in 2003. It would have been fascinating to see the momentum and how it builds."

Said President Obama to an unnamed set of persons just before his ISIS speech last week, according to some unspecified persons within that set, according to Peter Baker in the NYT.

It would have been fascinating... That's so professorial and distant. And read between the lines: He's seeing the momentum and how it builds now, in 2014, and he's projecting himself into the mind of George Bush, who experienced the momentum then and made the decision that seemed so wrong at the time to Barack Obama when he was not here in the White House.

Baker's source tells us:
Obama told his staff... not to evaluate their own policy based on external momentum. He would not rush to war. He would be deliberate.
I can't tell whether Obama thinks or meant to suggest that Bush responded to "external momentum," "rushe[ed] to war," and was not "deliberate." But I suspect that Obama remembers the way he judged Bush back in 2003, and he doesn't want to be what he thought George Bush was.
In forming a plan to destroy the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria using airpower and local forces, but not regular American ground troops, he searched for ways to avoid the mistakes of the past. 
Another way to put that is: Obama feels like George Bush, yet he must not be George Bush. Obama feels compelled to go to war in Iraq, but it must not be the same as what George Bush did. So he's grasping at distinctions: 1. He's taking it more slowly, being deliberate, and thoughtful. (Remember: Bush had no brain and was a cowboy.) 2. He doing it all from the air, so lofty and elevated. (Remember: Bush put boots on the ground. Ugh! Boots, so brutal! The ground, so lowly and filthy!)
“This will be a problem for the next president,” Mr. Obama said ruefully...
Ruefully.... see? Obama is not like Bush, he and his friends in the press are desperate to have you know. I've long seen "ruefully" an absurd adverbial boost to the good old verb "said." (Ask my ex-husband, the novelist, who I don't think ever used "ruefully" again after that one time I pointed it out, though I adopted "he said ruefully" to add punch to subsequent conversations. By the way, one of Elmore Leonard's 10 rules for writers was: "Never use a verb other than 'said' to carry dialogue." I'd add: Especially not "ruefully.")
“... and probably the one after that.”

But he alternated between resolve as he vowed to retaliate against President Bashar al-Assad if Syrian forces shot at American planes, and prickliness as he mocked critics of his more reticent approach to the exercise of American power.

“Oh, it’s a shame when you have a wan, diffident, professorial president with no foreign policy other than ‘don’t do stupid things,’ ” guests recalled him saying, sarcastically imitating his adversaries. “I do not make apologies for being careful in these areas, even if it doesn’t make for good theater.”
I laughed and laughed when I got to that line. Doesn’t make for good theater! But he is doing theater, the theater of thoughtfulness, the theater of reticence. He said "theater" because he was aware he was in a theater. Like an actor breaking the fourth wall, talking to the audience about the play within which he finds himself.

If we shadows have offended... That's Shakespeare. I'm trying to think of some 20th century play where an actor turns to the audience and says something close to I'm afraid this doesn’t make for good theater. It's a well-worn theatrical move. It's called "meta-reference."

And I know there's a Greek term for rhetoric like "I do not make apologies for being careful...." He's complimenting himself within the guise of self-criticism. Or are we just saying "humblebrag" these days?

282 comments:

1 – 200 of 282   Newer›   Newest»
Rusty said...

"Full of sound and fury. signifying nothing."He'll strut and fret his hour upon the stage."

SteveR said...

Listen to that bullshit rationalization enough and you might think he deserves a Nobel Peace Prize, or something.

Anonymous said...

“This will be a problem for the next president,” said the guy who's spent a term and a half using "inherited from Bush!" as an excuse. Ruefully.

David said...

And I know there's a Greek term for rhetoric like "I do not make apologies for being careful...."

The American term is bullshit.

Anonymous said...

"I just ate Paris," said Gozilla ruefully.

Original Mike said...

"The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose in."

What? Earth to Leonard. The character doesn't exist. I want to know the character's mind

Hagar said...

As I remember it, Bush decided that something needed to be done about the Middle East right there on 9-11-01, and then went very carefully and methodically about putting the pieces into place before he went to war. It took him a year and a half before he finally said, OK, that is it, let's roll.
By that time in WWII, Roosevelt was invading Italy and pounding the Japanese in the Western Pacific.

As for Bush and Saddam, it looked a lot like Victor Borge's routine about a car wreck at the opera. "Rush to war" indeed!

Terry said...

Getting pretty crazy at the Whitehouse:
"The New York Times first reported Friday that Obama administration officials believe that the 2002 law which authorized the war “would serve as an alternative statutory authority basis on which the President may rely for military action in Iraq.” The news comes just months after National Security Advisor Susan Rice said the Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF) was no longer operative."
http://time.com/3362683/obama-isis-iraq-syria-war-aumf/

MayBee said...

"If he had been “an adviser to ISIS,” Mr. Obama added, he would not have killed the hostages but released them and pinned notes on their chests saying, “Stay out of here; this is none of your business.” Such a move, he speculated, might have undercut support for military intervention."

Ann Althouse said...

"What? Earth to Leonard. The character doesn't exist. I want to know the character's mind"

Earth to Original Mike. The character's mind — which you say you want to know even though it can't exist if, as you say, the character doesn't exist — should be revealed in the character's own words, not some lame adverbial nudging next to the "said." If you want the character's line to be read as having been said ruefully, make the statement itself rueful.

Of course, that's about writing fiction, and when a journalist adds these adverbs, he doesn't have the alternative of redoing the quote to make it say what he wants it to say. But that's just another reason why the adverb is bad.

Is there some specific, observable fact that would tell us that it was rueful to say that "This will be a problem for the next president"? Something about the way he rubbed his face or a quaver in his voice? If not, I feel that Baker's adjective was there to try to keep us from thinking that Obama sounded disconnected and aloof. It didn't work on me, because it focused my thinking on why Baker saw a need to help Obama there.

Jason said...

McClellan was careful and deliberate, too. So careful and deliberate he failed.

Timeliness is critically important in war. Many a fine plan failed because it was executed too late.

Original Mike said...

"If you want the character's line to be read as having been said ruefully, make the statement itself rueful."

I'm just not as smart as you.

Was that said ruefully? Maybe yes, maybe no. How can you know?

tim in vermont said...

Too bad he couldn't have done his growing up before he became POTUS.

Stephen said...

One more way that Obama will be like Bush: lose both houses of Congress six years into his term.

One way that he won't be like Bush: shut up after he leaves office.

Cheryl said...

Leonard's rules are aimed at getting writers to write less self-consciously. Would that Obama had someone to give him similar advice on leading.

He is the most self-conscious leader I've ever seen. He seems unable to make a decision without distancing himself from it, qualifying it somehow. "I'm telling the truth here..." "...it doesn't make for good theatre."

This is a different quality than being able to accurately predict the effects of your actions.

Hagar said...

It is very disturbing that Obama not only seems to be totally ignorant of how "Bush's war" came about, but he also seems to have no understanding of what he will have to do if he wishes his administration to get something done about anything, and especially if the need to go to war should become so pressing that he would have to whether he wants to or not.

Skeptical Voter said...

He's just a poofter in a very bad play on the Potomac.

Woulda, coulda, shoulda signed that Status of Forces Agreement.

When Chef Poofter pulls the soufflé out of the oven before its done (as Obama did in Iraq) you're left with a sticky, floppy mess.

Achilles said...

Our foreign policy is a joke. Everything we accomplished in Iraq has been undone. If we are talking about rueful it should be those who voted for Obama taking a rueful tone.

Do not forget Iraq had several elections. Was safer to live in than downtown Chicago. Give progressives 5 years now here we are.

Just remember it is all about politics to them. People, especially brown skinned people, are too stupid to get democracy. Or a driver's license. People are tools to be used and votes to be bought.

traditionalguy said...

Obama is using the oldest trick in the book creating a comforting illusion that he doesn't like killing. Why it hurts him more than it does the people he is killing.

That is his usual disguise for his strong Marxist-Leninist resolve to kill off all opposition leadership.

MayBee said...

I bt he could get Bush on the phone in 30 seconds if he really wanted to know.

richard mcenroe said...

Has Obama figured out how to get the ENEMY to proceed on his internal momentum? Or does he just figure they have to run out of people to behead sometime?

Original Mike said...

"as he vowed to retaliate against President Bashar al-Assad if Syrian forces shot at American planes"

That's good to hear, though I don't believe Assad would be that stupid.

Michael said...

The Latin word phrase for smug is perfect

et aere corrupto

n.n said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
richard mcenroe said...

"Wow. That McClellan feller has a really impressive internal momentum." said Stonewall Jackson, never.

richard mcenroe said...

Paul Zrimsek: Obama probably thinks Manzanar was an inherited problem from Bush.

Terry said...

Obama din't oppose the Iraq War because he believed that Iraq was free of WMD. It could have been chock-a-block with WMD anthrax and mustard gas. Obama didn't care. "What I am opposed to is a dumb war. What I am opposed to is a rash war. What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other armchair, weekend warriors in this administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne."
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=99591469
Note the use of the most Jewish-sounding names of Bush's advisers.

Original Mike said...

"Woulda, coulda, shoulda signed that Status of Forces Agreement. "

Per MayBee on a previous thread, I'd like to know if he regrets this.

Roy Lofquist said...

"For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?" - 1 Corinthians 14:8

I couldn't find a biblical reference for a kazoo.

n.n said...

After six years of expanding wars far and wide, he still missed the momentum through executive actions. The suspense remains unfulfilled, but Obama only has himself to blame.

“This will be a problem for the next president,” Obama said

That sounds vaguely familiar.

I wonder if this is building to something unprecedented.

Sebastian said...

In ten years, it will be fascinating to consider how a Nobel Peace Prize winner managed to go to non-war war, how American clout and stature declined during his tenure, how his whole foreign policy turned into a cock-up, and how sophisticated law professors in Madison, WI, rationalized voting for him.

Robert Cook said...

"Do not forget Iraq had several elections. Was safer to live in than downtown Chicago."


Hahahaha!

tim in vermont said...

"Was that said ruefully? Maybe yes, maybe no. How can you know?"

You could add some little detail of observation of the character that might suggest ruefulness. Hollywood does this all the time, with quick shots of facial expressions, etc.

When have you ever heard a movie supply an adjective to describe a mood. Hollywood is at the top of the art right now.

MayBee said...

Obama has said before he wants to leave things all nice for the next president, so he can enact his agenda without having to deal with past problems.

He said it at the beginning of his presidency, and he said it again recently. I'm trying to find the referenences.
He also said he hated the idea of Mitt Romney winning in '12 because then Mitt Romney would get the credit for all the good that was to come from Obamacare.

Finally, he spent a lot of time at the beginning of his first term apologizing for what America had done before, and kind of casting himself as the clean slate. He did this in South American, talked about it w/r/t Iran, and of course the infamous "reset" button with Russia.

So I can see Obama being rueful that he was leaving a problem for the next president. The problem was his naivete before, not seeing America and the presidency as an ongoing concern, and he just a temporary caretaker.

tim in vermont said...

"Hahahaha!" laughed Cookie ruefully...

See, it just doesn't work as high art.

St. George said...

“This will be a problem for the next president."

Unbelievable.

chillblaine said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
garage mahal said...

Here's me...not caring at all that Bush signed the Status of Forces Agreement...think I'll just blame Obama for that....trololol

Hagar said...

I do not know that "this is going to be a problem for the next president."
Right now the world looks more unstable than at any time since July 1914, and events may not wait for our next presidential election, however much Mr. Obama wishes them to wait for the next guy.

Original Mike said...

"You could add some little detail of observation of the character that might suggest ruefulness. Hollywood does this all the time, with quick shots of facial expressions, etc."

Books don't have pictures.

Original Mike said...

Well, except the one's Garage reads.

Original Mike said...

As the next guy up, it was Obama's job to get a new SOFA. By all accounts, he didn't want one.

And here we are.

St. George said...

“Oh, it’s a shame when you have a wan, diffident, professorial president with no foreign policy other than ‘don’t do stupid things,"

Wan means weak.
Diffident means timid, lacking confidence.

It truly is as if we are in Obama's play. It's late in Act IV, and he is revealing to us who and what he is.

garage mahal said...

As the next guy up, it was Obama's job to get a new SOFA

Why? Neither country wanted one.

Saint Croix said...

In forming a plan to destroy the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria using airpower and local forces, but not regular American ground troops, he searched for ways to avoid the mistakes of the past.

air power = playing God

local forces = puny humans

Saint Croix said...

My name is Barack. Here is my thunder.

I spent six years thinking about this. Mostly on the back nine.

Original Mike said...

"Neither country wanted one."

I don't believe that.

Original Mike said...

It is true that Barack Obama didn't want onethen. and worked to see that come to pass. My question was, does he regret that now?

Charlie said...

Iowahawk called it in 2008.

http://iowahawk.typepad.com/iowahawk/2008/11/obama-names-bill-clinton-to-president-post.html

Terry said...

"Why? Neither country wanted one."
Lefties tell themselves crazy shit like this all the time, then try to build policies out of self-serving, half-considered, goofy impressions of reality.

William said...

The Middle East is now in far worse shape than when he took office. What terrible bad luck!

MayBee said...

Why? Neither country wanted one.

That's not true. There actually were negotiations for a new SOFA. Obama stopped negotiating when Iraq said they wouldn't grant our forces immunity, because Obama didn't want a new SOFA. He needed us out for his reelection bid, and used that information frequently in his 2012 campaign.

Anonymous said...

So basically anonymous sources say the President was talking to anonymous people. Did they also say anything about a Blue Fist poster above his desk in the Oval Office?

Sam L. said...

Well, I'm torn amongst "fool", 'idiot", and "crazed anti-American Leftist (redundant though it is)".

glenn said...

We'll see how he feels after the next large scale terrorist attack here.

garage mahal said...

Obama stopped negotiating when Iraq said they wouldn't grant our forces immunity, because Obama didn't want a new SOFA.

I found this:

The president agreed to urge PM Maliki to accept some U.S. troops after 2011, and that decision was made public in June 2011. It is correct that there was considerable debate within the administration on the size of the force, but there was agreement that it would be a training presence. In the end, everyone on the U.S. side accepted a force of 5,000 personnel including short-term deployments. While the major political parties with the exception of the Sadrist movement supported a U.S. military presence, only the Kurdish parties, about 20 percent of the parliament at best, supported parliament-granted legal immunities for U.S. military personnel. It was the considered position of the administration, including the U.S. military and myself, that our forces could not remain without a parliament-endorsed agreement granting such immunities, and so our forces were withdrawn in accordance with the 2008 agreement.”

Ann Althouse said...

"If not, I feel that Baker's adjective…"

Should say: "adverb."

PB Reader said...

As if Obama were immaculately conceived in 2004.

Original Mike said...

Either Obama wanted a new SOFA and he failed to negotiate one, or he did not want one and used Maliki's position vis-a-vis immunity as an excuse to walk away. I believe the latter is the case, but given Obama's demonstrated inability to negotiate anything, a case can be made for the former.

In either case, the mess we are in now is a direct result.

Original Mike said...

I do wish I was as smart as Althouse, Original Mike said sincerely.

The Crack Emcee said...

I wish white people would quit trying to read Obama:

They don't even THINK about race, so - really - they don't have the skills:

They see anger when he's, clearly, ambivalent about something, and more.

His black skin throws you every time - for almost any subject.

It's just useless to even try,...

Terry said...

You can find anything if you look hard enough, Garage Mahal!

The candidates at one point saw eye-to-eye on an exit strategy, Romney said, though they now disagree over Obama’s call to withdraw all troops by the end of 2011.

"With regards to Iraq, you and I agreed, I believe, that there should be a status of forces agreement," Romney said during the Lynn University debate in Boca Raton, Fla.

Obama cut in, saying, "That’s not true," prompting more cross-talk about the number of troops each wanted to remain and the lack of a status of forces agreement with the Iraqi government.

Obama criticized Romney for saying in a speech "just a few weeks ago that you indicated that we should still have troops in Iraq."

"No, I didn’t, I’m sorry -- I indicated that you failed to put in place a status of forces agreement at the end of the conflict --" Romney said before Obama jumped in again.

"Governor, here’s one thing … I’ve learned as commander in chief. You’ve got to be clear, both to our allies and our enemies, about where you stand and what you mean," Obama said. "Now, you just gave a speech a few weeks ago in which you said we should still have troops in Iraq. That is not a recipe for making sure that we are taking advantage of the opportunities and meeting the challenges of the Middle East."

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/oct/23/barack-obama/obama-romney-said-troops-should-still-be-iraq/

St. George said...

Garage..

To go back to the WP article you quote from (actually the former US ambassador to Iraq), the article also says:

"A subsidiary question is whether the number of troops Obama offered to remain in Iraq was enough to make worthwhile such a politically difficult choice for Iraqi leaders. Questions certainly could be raised about whether the administration took too long to settle on a troop number — but it’s also uncertain whether Maliki would have sought more troops."

It all goes back to Obama's unwillingness to man-up. The US offered a paltry 5,000 troops. The Iraqis wouldn't grant them immunity from local laws. Obama didn't press the matter. Here we are.

furious_a said...

yet he must not be George Bush.

Evolved and gay marriage.
Going into Iraq.

More like Dick Cheney.

St. George said...

"If he had been “an adviser to ISIS,” Mr. Obama added, he would not have killed the hostages but released them and pinned notes on their chests saying, “Stay out of here; this is none of your business.” Such a move, he speculated, might have undercut support for military intervention."

From the same NYT article.

furious_a said...

They see anger when he's, clearly, deeply in over his head
.


There, fixed it for you.

It's always sad, and extremely awkward, when an affirmative action hire just. doesn't. work. out.

garage mahal said...

It's always sad, and extremely awkward, when an affirmative action hire just. doesn't. work. out.

Indeed.

Original Mike said...

"In the end, everyone on the U.S. side accepted a force of 5,000 personnel including short-term deployments."

To add to St. George's observation above (adverb alert!), I've heard frequent claims that the military wanted many more troops than the 5,000 Obama offered to Maliki. The phrase "In the end" in above quote supports this claim.

The Crack Emcee said...

furious_a,

"They see anger when he's, clearly, deeply in over his head BY WHITE'S STANDARDS.
.
There, fixed it for you.

It's always sad, and extremely awkward, when A BLACK MAN DOESN'T HAVE TO LISTEN. TO. WHITES."


That it doesn't bother you guys to be racist - in 2014 - is all that's needed to judge you. Unlike whites with blacks - who, studies have shown, you studiously avoid engaging with - we can read you perfectly. We understand your cries:

Go on - mention AA as a pejorative. You're just admitting we kicked your ass on the subject and you feel victimized - that's why you squeal.

Go on - mention BO as a pejorative. You're just admitting he kicked your ass on the politics and you feel victimized - that's why you squeal.

Go on - mention the fact he wouldn't listen, to whites who got us into our collective messes, as a pejorative. You're just admitting blacks are kicking white supremacy's ass and you feel victimized - that's why you squeal.

We don't have to speculate as whites do. We don't have to lie as whites do. We don't have to resort to delusion as whites do. We just have to look at the same people we've always known - intimately - and know their long-standing claims to white supremacy can find shelter no longer.

Go on - squeal:

It's music to black ears,...




Paul said...

"I was not here in the run-up to Iraq in 2003. It would have been fascinating to see the momentum and how it builds."

Obama just keeps showing how clueless he is. His Administration really is the JV team.

buwaya puti said...

If it is truly the case that Obama cannot be "read" reasonably well by people outside the US, let alone by non-black Americans, he has no business being president.
And if this inability to clearly communicate across the very minor cultural gap between US black and white is typical of black Americans then none of them has the qualifications to be the leader of the other 87%.
I do not believe this to be true at all, because I don't believe this gap exists in any meaningful sense. It is rather a very parochial and self serving affectation.

Anonymous said...

I've heard frequent claims that the military wanted many more troops than the 5,000 Obama offered to Maliki.

You heard correctly (pardon the adverb).

Paul said...

Hilarious, Crackhole. I know white people who are "blacker" than that pussy.

When it comes to the most overtly racist bigot on this blog you are simply in a league of your own. Too bad you could never amount to anything on your own and have nothing but hatred and blame for the white man, who invented the entire modern world, for your pathetic existence. I'd feel pity for you were it not for the fact that your vile ugliness renders it impossible.

Michael K said...

"In the end, everyone on the U.S. side accepted a force of 5,000 personnel including short-term deployments. "

Everyone that is except the US military. But it's OK because Obama has never wanted their advice.

The U of Chicago Law School had Obama figured out .

According to my professor friend, he had the lowest intellectual capacity in the building. He also doubted whether he was legitimately an editor on the Harvard Law Review, because if he was, he would be the first and only editor of an Ivy League law review to never be published while in school (publication is or was a requirement).

The same goes for the presidency.

sdharms said...

MayBee wrote:"If he had been “an adviser to ISIS,” Mr. Obama added, he would not have killed the hostages but released them and pinned notes on their chests saying, “Stay out of here; this is none of your business.” Such a move, he speculated, might have undercut support for military intervention." Instead, ISIS was more like Gen Pershing. And it was effective for Pershing.

Seeing Red said...

Barry can't be in the mind of W. He never literally stood on smoldering ruins.

The Crack Emcee said...

uwaya puti,

"If it is truly the case that Obama cannot be "read" reasonably well by people outside the US, let alone by non-black Americans, he has no business being president."

Now THAT's a crazy formulation:

If the people who've been racist to blacks for 400 years can't read us, then WE have no reason to lead.

White's blindness endows them with insight?

ROTFLMAO!!!!

The Crack Emcee said...

Paul ,

"Hilarious, Crackhole. I know white people who are "blacker" than that pussy."

So do I - it's the racists who don't understand race in America.

That you would think you could inform me on the subject is a laugh riot!

Racism gives you power to imagine it so, but nothing can make it true:

I can run circles around you on your best day,...

JPS said...

Crack:

"I wish white people would quit trying to read Obama"

You really are something.

He's my president and my Commander-in-Chief. I will damn well try to read him when I want to, and I won't seek the Crack Emcee Certificate of Sufficient Racial Consciousness before doing so.

Terry said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
The Crack Emcee said...

JPS,

"You really are something."

So are you, though it's a racist, and not anything even vaguely representing a human being.

"He's my president and my Commander-in-Chief."

Yup.

"I will damn well try to read him when I want to, and I won't seek the Crack Emcee Certificate of Sufficient Racial Consciousness before doing so."

Spoken like a true member of the "We don't even THINK about race" crowd:

Whites know exactly how to interpret what whites admit whites don't understand.

Colorblind racism at it's best,...

buwaya puti said...

Er, because everyone who is not black and therefore "racist" far outnumber the blacks ? And that they have way more money and true power than do the blacks ? And that there is a big wide world out there that is largely unsympathetic?
That's a hard set of facts. A small weak minority has to adjust to the facts, expecting everyone else to adjust to them is a rather quixotic and futile position. Whatever leeway black people have achieved seems to me to be mainly due to the
(name your preferred cause, either works) the basic disinterest of the majority due to your community's irrelevance, or the occasional compassion of the majority. There are consequences to numbers and power. Weak people can be ignored or indulged by the stronger. In history this is a best case scenario.
Can a black man get elected again in Los Angeles ? I doubt it. Not enough blacks, not enough guilty white voters anymore either. This situation is coming everywhere.
The only way for a minority to get ahead, or even to be tolerated, under these circumstances is to become useful. Rage and guilt tripping won't work. Consider the Asians as a model.

JPS said...

Crack:

"So are you [really something], though it's a racist, and not anything even remotely representing a human being."

You write this knowing precisely nothing about me. All you need is that I am white and have had the unmitigated temerity to disagree with you even fractionally.

Goodbye, Crack. You're boring.

Michael K said...

" Rage and guilt tripping won't work. Consider the Asians as a model."

Or the Jews who used accomplishments to work their way up. Of course, that got them in trouble with blacks who see any achievement by other blacks as "acting white."

The Muslims seem to be the only other group that sees hatred and violence as useful tools to gain acceptance. We'll see how that works out.

Matt said...

"You write this knowing precisely nothing about me. All you need is that I am white and have had the unmitigated temerity to disagree with you even fractionally."

Bingo. Same sufficient "evidence" for Crack to call me a racist Nazi. All with the Professor's endorsement.

Cruel neutrality? No, cruel stupidity and bigotry. Crack reflects directly upon the Professor, not because she allows him to post, but because she has promoted him and his career.

Anyone else doing his dumb shtick would have been moderated away quickly and thoroughly.

Matt said...

"But what Crack does is performance art!"

That's like farting in an elevator and when everyone looks at you yelling RUEFULLY, "Shut the fuck up; it's art!"

The Crack Emcee said...

buwaya puti,

If you seriously think blacks are going to let a little thing like superior numbers stop us, you REALLY don't understand black people, or the history of our struggle.

"My race needs no special defense, for the past history of them in this country proves them to be the equal of any people anywhere."

Black parents, telling every black kid we have to be "twice as good," doubles our power.

All whites numbers are is a challenge.

And - considering how well whites HAD things locked-down - they're not even much of one.

The battle for reparations begins in January:

Let's see how well y'all fair then,...

The Crack Emcee said...

Michael K,

" Rage and guilt tripping won't work. Consider the Asians as a model."

Please. You take apples and oranges - and leave white supremacy out of it, of course - and think you have an answer.

Racists are so WEIRD IN THE HEAD.

Where are the family ties - disrupted by slavery - for these Asians? Where is the money from home, that Asians clearly get, for blacks?

This is as silly as calling whites "successful" when we know they made it impossible for others to compete - which reveals their injustice and cowardice towards fairness.

You are a people without honor.

And common sense,...

The Crack Emcee said...

JPS,

"You write this knowing precisely nothing about me."

I know you sit on your ass as a group of whites attack a single black guy defending his people against his country's historical racists and killers.

Is there something more important for me to know but that?

The Crack Emcee said...

Matt,

"Anyone else doing his dumb shtick would have been MURDERED quickly and thoroughly."

These ARE whites we're talking about,...

Unknown said...

Matt, you sound like a racist. If you don't like that Althouse has allowed Crack to post here, why do you continue to read and comment here. Get lost, whiner.

The Crack Emcee said...

Matt,

"Anyone else doing his dumb shtick would have been MURDERED quickly and thoroughly."

Isn't it GREAT that I can write that and it's grounded in centuries of documented historical fact?

Takes the whole "The Crack Emcee's a racist thing" and tosses it.

This is CENTURIES OF WHITE-ON-BLACK MURDER we're talking about.

NOT the knock-out game, folks - MURDER.

BY WHITES.

FOR NO GOOD REASON.

FROM 1600 TO NOW.

You should be so proud to accuse me of slandering you:

Or your ancestors anyway,...

buwaya puti said...

Asians compete against whites very well indeed, in spite of the most blatant and well documented and mathematically verifiable discrimination against them where it truly matters in the modern elites cursus honorum, top college admissions. US society truly is trying to keep them down, but is failing.
As for blacks, with respect to the effect of any double-effort requirement or particular spiritual powers, to date this is not apparent.
I don't see anything about this is likely to change this January or any January.

JPS said...

I was done with you, Crack, but seeing as how you've asked me a direct question:

"Is there something more important for me to know but that?"

Gosh, I don't know. It might be more important for you to know why I consider "racist" to be a vile personal insult. My black friends know why. You don't, and won't. Because I don't owe you that explanation; because you've erased any interest I might have had in offering it.

But I will retract what I wrote about you being boring. After reading your comments on Asians, I admit: It's downright fascinating, how ignorant a man can be, and still think he's schooling others.

CWJ said...

I used to snicker at the thought that The Crack Emcee wasn't even black and that his was just a performance to wind up other commenters.

The more I read him, particularly on this thread, the more I think that may be true.

The response to JPS' 2:45 comment was particularly telling.

Matt said...

Right, Crack "moderated" = "murdered" you ignorant, racist piece of shit.

Matt said...

What you completely fail to grasp, Crack, is that I am criticizing Althouse for NOT treating you equally to everyone else, dumbshit.

Cedarford said...

Another thread devolving into Crack and his gullible fish. He tosses the bait, they go for it.

Cedarford said...

Another thread devolving into Crack and his gullible fish. He tosses the bait, they go for it.

Hagar said...

and Crack has destroyed another thread.

However:
What in the world did Obama mean when he said "he was not here in 2003"?

Mentally he was not here, or one of his half-brothers stood in for him? He is a half-brother, and the real Obama has left the building? What?

Matt said...

Cedarford,

What are you talking about? When Althouse created her blog many moons ago, she dreamed of every thread being derailed by a racist "performance artist". This is what she wants in her comments section. That is why she fosters it. If she didn't want it to look like this, she would take action. She's done so before. It is within her power.

Now, why don't you do your part and tell us more about the awful JOOOOOS! as you so like to do.

The Crack Emcee said...

buwaya puti,

"Asians compete against whites very well indeed, in spite of the most blatant and well documented and mathematically verifiable discrimination against them where it truly matters in the modern elites cursus honorum, top college admissions. US society truly is trying to keep them down, but is failing."

And they have home countries they're connect to - blacks don't, thanks to whites.

They have financial networks from family - blacks don't, thanks to whites.

They aren't targeted by whites still today - blacks are.

I could go on for decades,...

Matt said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Matt said...

I just hope that, if I do my part well enough, Althouse will start promoting my career too! Mr. Meade, I am worthy of a million dollar investment too!

However, I have to draw the line short of making racist comments. I find racism so repugnant I cannot even pretend to do so. Unlike Crack who seems to revel in his pretend(?) racism.

(Reposted... typo bothered me too much.)

CWJ said...

C4,

But here's a problem. Things have changed. You describe Crack's former MO. Now that people are not rising to the bait as often, Crack is proactively going after other people's comments when things get slow for him/her.

Nothing wrong with that. Nonetheless, Crack can still fill a comment thread with repetitive and overlong comments. IOW, even if no one directly responds, The Crack Emcee can still dominate a thread.

The Crack Emcee said...

JPS,

"It might be more important for you to know why I consider "racist" to be a vile personal insult. My black friends know why. You don't, and won't. Because I don't owe you that explanation; because you've erased any interest I might have had in offering it."

Whatever. My white friends know why I use it - and, with a brief explanation, I'm sure any blacks in America would, too. I mean, you haven't included white's history of mass murder in any of your assessments of me or my arguments. You want "clean hands" without doing anything for them - which is different from other racists how?

Oh yeah, you passively find racism bad - just not enough to attack white supremacy for it - with the dead bodies of black kids piling up daily.

"But I will retract what I wrote about you being boring."

I knew better anyway - I command every thread I'm on, so when whites claim I'm boring I mostly roll my eyes:

I can see what's happening here - just as I can see white supremacy.

"After reading your comments on Asians, I admit: It's downright fascinating, how ignorant a man can be, and still think he's schooling others."

Please, enlighten me - how are blacks and Asians the same?

Start with the fact we can't go "home" as they can, because we don't have one and have to live with our torturers.

This ought to be good,...

The Crack Emcee said...

CWJ,

"The more I read him, particularly on this thread, the more I think that may be true."

That makes two white commenters today who would rather put their imaginings ahead of physical reality.

But whites aren't crazy?

Sure they're not,...

Michael K said...

"If you seriously think blacks are going to let a little thing like superior numbers stop us, you REALLY don't understand black people, or the history of our struggle."

I don't understand your passion for failure. I admit it.

The Palestinians are another group that seeks failure as some sort of affirmation. Maybe that is why so many blacks, especially those in prison, adopt Islam.

I don't believe in psychoanalysis but, if I did, blacks would be worth a PhD. Especially you and Al Sharpton and Jesse.

The Crack Emcee said...

Matt,

"What you completely fail to grasp, Crack, is that I am criticizing Althouse for NOT treating you equally to everyone else, dumbshit."

But why should she? Do you deny whites have always had a historical advantage? If so, how is treating us equal going to change that dynamic?

Whites get to stick the knife in for 400 years and the white answer to the bleeding man on the ground is merely to stop. No trip to the hospital, nobody goes to jail, nobody suffers anything but the guy whites stabbed.

And whites even get to drink the blood through contemporary ridicule towards the effects of what they did to us.

You guys are some real compassionate thinkers.

And FAAAAAIRRR,....

The Crack Emcee said...

Michael K,"

I don't understand your passion for failure. I admit it."

TELL IT TO YOUR PRESIDENT

The Crack Emcee said...

HEY, MATT, CHECK THIS OUT:

Michael K,"

I don't understand your passion for failure. I admit it."

When whites start policing each other to stop this kind of bullshit racist talk, then I'll believe you're becoming decent people.

Allow it, and you're no better than a lynch mob,...

Cedarford said...

CWJ said...
C4,

But here's a problem. Things have changed. You describe Crack's former MO. Now that people are not rising to the bait as often, Crack is proactively going after other people's comments when things get slow for him/her.

================
You may be right, but the dumb fish are still playing his game. It has been observed that often when someone finds out they have been played by a swindler, they are madder at the person that pointed out they had been suckered, than mad at the swindler himself.

But besides his stable of stupid fish like Matt, he can count on others jumping even if they claim they will not be suckered anymore - in when he criticizes what they have said. (As if Crack has any built up credibility or reputation as an honest and bright person - versus being a loser).

The Crack Emcee said...

Matt,

"I have to draw the line short of making racist comments. I find racism so repugnant I cannot even pretend to do so. Unlike Crack who seems to revel in his pretend(?) racism."

Translation:

I think racism is so bad all I can do is make passive comments about it, and leave the heavy lifting to those it affects most.

Thanks, big guy.

MLK

The Crack Emcee said...

CWJ ,

"Things have changed. You describe Crack's former MO. Now that people are not rising to the bait as often, Crack is proactively going after other people's comments when things get slow for him/her."

I just deliberately stayed away from here for a week (remember everyone asking "Where's Crack?" and you claim this?

You're delusional, I tell you.

Unknown said...

No Matt, you're not worth promoting, get lost.

CWJ said...

C4,

Granted but still look. 5 comments, all but one, longer than my original comment in less than the time it took you to respond to me.

Crack will fill any comment thread he/she wants to fill. Fish not required.

ken in sc said...

Crack is right. Asians are not targeted by whites. They are targeted by blacks. Ask any Korean in a big city.

President-Mom-Jeans said...

"I could go on for decades,..."

I don't think you can Crack. You are old, poor, black, and have a history of health problems and hanging out with murderers.

Hopefully you won't go on for even a few more years.

buwaya puti said...

I still don't see a strategy here. Given the facts, there is no way to extract more for blacks from whites even through politics.
Anything like this requires a trade. Everything is a transaction, even when a robber takes from a victim. What have you got to offer?
Its not votes (except see below) as those are already conceded to the Democrats and voting% is already reasonably high. Also the votes in question are already highly concentrated.
If not that, what?
The only thing I can think of would be an offer to switch sides to the Republicans in exchange for racial benefits - reparations, whatever. There is nothing else to trade. And this trade I find very unlikely.

John Lynch said...

The "Rush to War" narrative about Iraq in 2003 won't die. There was an enormous public debate, lasting long enough for books to be published advocating both sides. The President's decision this year was arrived at far more quickly and with far less public input, and without Congressional debate or approval.

So, bullshit.

Robert Cook said...

"The Middle East is now in far worse shape than when he took office. What terrible bad luck!"

And it was worse off when Bush left office than it had been when he entered office. This should make clear to even the most obtuse of the obtuse that American foreign policy in the middle east is ruinous...to them and to us.

CWJ said...

When Bush took office both towers were still standing. But heaven forbid the the ME should be touched.

CWJ said...

Robert, I disagree with your assessment. In what way was the ME worse. It was bad before. Please tell me how it was worse.

buwaya puti said...

When Bush left office the ME and North Africa were as stable as they were in 2000, and probably more so.
Every dictator and despot save one was still in place. There was some extra terrorism going on in Iraq but the government there wasn't about to fall. In exchange, there was much less Islamic killing going on in Algeria, and the terrorist campaigns in Jordan, Saudi and Egypt were over. And Libya had ended their nuclear program.

MayBee said...

If Obama doesn't want to call Bush, Obama could also ask his Vice president and his secretary if state why they voted for the war at the time. He could call Hillary Clinton, or even ask Bill Clinton about the state of affairs at the time. He could call Colin Powell.

I can't imagine any member of the Bush team who would not take his call and give him their honest recollection of the administration debates at the time.

Instead, he is left to wonder aloud to people who were not there and cannot inform him.

Michael K said...

"And it was worse off when Bush left office than it had been when he entered office. This should make clear to even the most obtuse of the obtuse that American foreign policy in the middle east is ruinous...to them and to us."

So, I assume you preferred Saddam to be the ruler of Saudi and Kuwait. The left is devoid of logic but they are so charming in their delusions.

DavidD said...

" ' “This will be a problem for the next president,” Mr. Obama said ruefully...' "

This will be a problem for the next president precisely because President Obama has failed and is failing to deal with it adequately.

(BTW, were there any meaningful comments--before this one, of course--after Crack started his ranting? I stopped reading and skipped to the end.)

Achilles said...

No Michael k, they are not delusional. They are on the other side. They don't believe in freedom here. They don't believe in freedom there. They treat those who protect them here like criminals. They make excuses for barbarians. Look at how Garage,ARM, even Crack act here. What they say. Who they support.

They would rather Saddam like tyrants were in charge. As long as they got to be cronies and punish those who disagree with them. That is why they can look past the IRS scandal and call it fake. It was ok because it targeted the right people.

Terry said...

"And it was worse off when Bush left office than it had been when he entered office."
Europe and Asia were worse off when Roosevelt left office than when he took office. Damn FDR and his ruinous foreign policy!

Robert Cook said...

"Barry can't be in the mind of W. He never literally stood on smoldering ruins."


Ohferkrisesakes! As if standing and posturing on the smoldering ruins makes any difference. I work near there and saw much of the destruction happen live and in person, while Bush was in Florida. I smelled the burning, acrid odor that emanated from the pile for weeks.

None of this made me agree with a single thing Bush did in response to the attack, or with the continuation and expansion on those policies by Obama. Our response has been completely wrong-headed and disastrous.

Terry said...

"None of this made me agree with a single thing Bush did in response to the attack"
Not even taking out the Taliban. My God you are an ass, Robert Cook. Whose side are you on, anyway?

AReasonableMan said...

Achilles said...
No Michael k, they are not delusional. They are on the other side. They don't believe in freedom here. They don't believe in freedom there. They treat those who protect them here like criminals. They make excuses for barbarians. Look at how Garage,ARM, even Crack act here.


If you think ranting like some Z-grade winger radio hack makes you look smart you probably have bigger problems than those currently plaguing the country. My suggesting is that you lose the subscription to Rush, turn off FOX and read a book or two, none by a talk show host. The real world bears no relationship to your image of the world.

AReasonableMan said...

Terry said...
Not even taking out the Taliban


He didn't even go close to taking out the Taliban. They simply moved back to Pakistan. Mullah Omar is still alive.

In marked contrast, Obama did actually take out Bin Laden.

Terry said...

AReasonableMan, you just read Robert Cook say that he did not agree with Bush taking out the Taliban and you think Achilles is showing Z-grade thinking?

garage mahal said...

Hopefully we can get Iraq back to pre invasion level stability. 2 trillion dollars later.

AReasonableMan said...

How am I responsible for what Cook writes? We disagree as often as we agree.

broomhandle said...

"yet he must not be George Bush.

Evolved and gay marriage.
Going into Iraq.

More like Dick Cheney."

To say nothing of expanding the Patriot Act, drones, Gitmo, NSA, etc.

We may not all have voted for Obama, but we all (except for the Greens and Libertarians) voted for Dick Cheney.

Terry said...

Not responsible for what Cook writes, AReasonableMan, but responsible for what you write.

Drago said...

ARM: "In marked contrast, Obama did actually take out Bin Laden"

LOL

Who can forget the diligence and perseverance of obama as he painstakingly used contacts and intel assets (electronic and humint) to develop a detailed theory as to where bin laden was located, then, as if that wasn't enough, obama suited up, slipped a knife into his teeth while he shimmied down a SPIE rig into bin ladens hideout and personally slit his throat.

Thank you obama for finally getting those dregs in Specials Forces, the NSA, the CIA and our European allied services to just get the hell out of your way so you could get the job done.

Yeah.

"obama did actually take out bin laden".

How about just a teensy weensy eensy bit of acknowledgement that some folks other than our earth bound messiah took out bin laden.

Just once perhaps. Then you can return to your idolatry.

Drago said...

Robert Cook: "None of this made me agree with a single thing Bush did in response to the attack, or with the continuation and expansion on those policies by Obama."

LOL

None of it made you blame the perpetrators either.

AReasonableMan said...

Drago said...
How about just a teensy weensy eensy bit of acknowledgement that some folks other than our earth bound messiah took out bin laden.


How about acknowledging that Bush/Cheney didn't achieve squat in Afghanistan?

Obviously Obama did not personally shoot Bin Laden. In this regard he does differ from Cheney who can at least claim to have shot someone during the course of the conflict, albeit a rich donor, but maybe I am being unreasonably critical.

Drago said...

DavidD: "(BTW, were there any meaningful comments--before this one, of course--after Crack started his ranting? I stopped reading and skipped to the end.)

Not really.

I think Crack is especially irritated today since his islamist pals haven't sent him any of the newly minted sex slaves from Africa.

Which, it should be noted, Crack has no absolutely, positively no problem with whatsoever.

Crack is quite agnostic as to enslavement of black african girls to islamist slavers.

He's very "open minded" that way.

Drago said...

ARM: "Obviously Obama did not personally shoot Bin Laden."

LOL

Oh, it's clearly not "obvious" at all to those on the left.

Including you.

I couldn't help but notice that in your "rapid response" you still could not muster a word of praise for those that actually did ALL the work in getting bin laden, even though you did have time for a gratuitous dig at Cheney's hunting incident.

Priorities.

AReasonableMan said...

Drago said...
Priorities.


Apparently you had 'other priorities', like Cheney, when it came to acknowledging their complete incompetence in Afghanistan.


Drago said...

ARM: "How about acknowledging that Bush/Cheney didn't achieve squat in Afghanistan?"

Define "squat".

While we're at it, why don't you regale us with what precisely obama's strategy is and what "victory" will look like once the "light bringer" is done with his term in office?

LOL

Don't worry, we all know your sole purpose here along with cooks is to minimize islamist atrocities, blame America and never, ever, under any circumstances get drawn into a conversation about what obama is doing and why it's right or wrong and what will come out of it.

khesanh0802 said...

Just a new slant on a puff piece. Written differently it would have explored Obama's lack of historical perspective, his difficulty understanding strategy and his absolute terror when required to make a decision.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "Apparently you had 'other priorities', like Cheney, when it came to acknowledging their complete incompetence in Afghanistan."

Still not even a word of praise for the men and women who really did get bin laden.

Only the light-bringer gets that sort of praise from ARM.

Drago said...

Go ahead ARM.

It's not so hard to do.

Simply credit the actual people who got bin laden and relegate obamas role to what it was: simply saying yes (after a number of delays) to the teams that found bin laden and wanted permission to get him.

Go ahead.

It's not that hard.

AReasonableMan said...

Still not a word of criticism for the clowns who ran this country into the ground militarily and financially. The definition of a hack.

I, on the other hand, have no problem acknowledging the remarkable bravery of everyone who actually fought in either Afghanistan and Iraq.

AReasonableMan said...

Come on Drago let's hear you talk about the failures of Cheney.

AReasonableMan said...

You can do it Drago. Prove you aren't a complete hack. You are constipated now but get that turd out of your system. Stop carrying the water for those clowns. I've got faith in you.

AReasonableMan said...

What's holding you up big boy? Cat got your tongue?


AReasonableMan said...

Coward.

Michael K said...

I left when Crack started spreading his crap but I apparently missed something.

"How about acknowledging that Bush/Cheney didn't achieve squat in Afghanistan?

ARM, you really hate Cheney and Bush, don't you ?

What they accomplished in Afghanistan was to run the Taliban out of town with a small force of Special Forces and the JDAMs.

The problem was that then they decided (I think it was Bush as Cheney is too practical) to do some nation building in a place that was not a nation ever.

"Obviously Obama did not personally shoot Bin Laden. In this regard he does differ from Cheney who can at least claim to have shot someone during the course of the conflict""

The word is that Obama could not make up his mind, somewhat like Clinton who was afraid to take out Osama for fear of "collateral damage" among the hangers on.

What I have heard, and believe, is that the shoot command was finally given by an officer on the spot when Obama couldn't make up his mind. Valerie might have been out of town or something.

I am sincerely surprised by the willingness of the left to go down with the Obama ship.

AReasonableMan said...

Jesus, now we have Michael K carrying Drago's water.

Can a man sink any lower?

Michael K said...

"Jesus, now we have Michael K carrying Drago's water.

Can a man sink any lower?"

I came back late, I guess. What has Drago to do with your statements about Bush and Cheney ? Can't you stand on your own ?

Michael K said...

I have to admit that blaming Bush and Cheney for stuff that happened 10 years ago is less important to me than things happening right now .

I know politics trumps everything else in the left wing mind but dying of hemorrhagic fever seems significant, too. Only in my universe, I guess.

Achilles said...

AReasonableMan said:

"If you think ranting like some Z-grade winger radio hack makes you look smart you probably have bigger problems than those currently plaguing the country. My suggesting is that you lose the subscription to Rush, turn off FOX and read a book or two, none by a talk show host. The real world bears no relationship to your image of the world."

Au contraire. I was over there when the British were cleaning up Saddam's chemical weapons. But I have to listen to douche's like you spout the lie about how they weren't there. Abu Ghraib was on page 1a of the NYT'S for over a month. I could go on. Every time a soldier did something wrong. Front page news. Always with the grim milestones. Pining for the days when Saddam was in charge.

But that's not enough. Turning a blind eye when Obama topples regimes then purposely allowing the country to fall into chaos. That resulting in the sacking of an embassy and death of more servicemembers. Then lying on their graves and blaming it on a video and throwing a citizen in jail to support the lie.

Through all that you support him. You are on the other side.

Michael said...

ARM can tell you what is broken and who broke it but has no idea about how to fix that which is broken. ARM thinks like a housewife.

Michael K said...

"ARM thinks like a housewife."

Amusing.

I am not the only one who thinks Obama's ship is sinking.

Achilles said...

AReasonableMan said...
"Still not a word of criticism for the clowns who ran this country into the ground militarily and financially. The definition of a hack.

I, on the other hand, have no problem acknowledging the remarkable bravery of everyone who actually fought in either Afghanistan and Iraq."

Bullshit. If you actually supported us you wouldn't repeat lies like the no WMD lie to undermine our mission. You would call Hillary out for lying about Benghazi. You wouldn't have voted for Obama the second time after he sold the people at that embassy out.

AReasonableMan said...

Achilles said...
You are on the other side.


Bullshit. When will you get sick of calling people who disagree with you traitors?

garage mahal said...

What I have heard, and believe, is that Obama was so pissed off that he wanted to go over and do bin Laden himself but had to be restrained. That's the word.

AReasonableMan said...

garage mahal said...
What I have heard, and believe, is that Obama was so pissed off that he wanted to go over and do bin Laden himself but had to be restrained. That's the word.


This will go straight over MK's head.

Drago said...

LOL: "I, on the other hand, have no problem acknowledging the remarkable bravery of everyone who actually fought in either Afghanistan and Iraq."

Uh, clearly you had no acknowledging obamas wonderfulness in "getting bin laden" but you certainly had a difficult time reaching the point where you were willing to praise the servicemembers who served in either Afghanistan and Iraq.

Unfortunately, our topic was the men and women in all branches of our services and intelligence services who spend 10 years tracking bin laden down and then "getting him".

Many of those people did not serve directly in Afghanistan and Iraq and those were the ones you were also being asked to recognize.

But you haven't.

But you did praise obama...who last time I checked has never served directly in Afghanistan or Iraq.

So, logic and consistency fail you once again.

Now would be a good time to bring up Cheney again.

Drago said...

garage: "What I have heard, and believe, is that Obama was so pissed off that he wanted to go over and do bin Laden himself but had to be restrained. That's the word."

I have no doubt that could be "the word" that is circulating amongst WI high schooler-level educated morons who never served.

I doubt it goes much further than them though.

garage mahal said...

"This will go straight over MK's head"

Predictably, it went over Dragobot's head. But he ain't too bright as we all know.

Michael K said...

"What I have heard, and believe"

You have to stop listening to those voices in your head. It's just not healthy,

You, too ARM,

Drago said...

ARM: "Bullshit. When will you get sick of calling people who disagree with you traitors?"

LOL

This from the side that was calling political opponents "unpatriotic" for not supporting Bill Clintons budget proposals in the 90's!!

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/02/17/us/president-s-new-pitch-redefining-patriotism-as-a-banner-for-peace-not-war.html

Did you really "forget" that?

Drago said...

garage: "Predictably, it went over Dragobot's head. But he ain't too bright as we all know."

Ah, the GED crowd checks back in.

Comforting.

AReasonableMan said...

Drago said...
Many of those people did not serve directly in Afghanistan and Iraq and those were the ones you were also being asked to recognize.


Is there anything more contemptible than someone trying to wrap themselves in the courage and sacrifice of others?

Simon Kenton said...

apophasis, though this is not a classic example of it.

Drago said...

ARM: "Is there anything more contemptible than someone trying to wrap themselves in the courage and sacrifice of others?"

LOL

I'm just asking you to recognize the contribution of those who actually played a role in getting bin laden after you decided it was enough to simply laud the light-bringer.

And you just can't do it.

So naturally you lash out and try to make it something else.

What else can you do really?

AReasonableMan said...

And, Drago, when are you going to prove that you are not a complete hack?

Coward.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "And, Drago, when are you going to prove that you are not a complete hack?

Coward."

LOL

Already at Phase II of "ARM can't bring himself to credit anyone other than the light-bringer".

I wonder what Phase III will bring?

AReasonableMan said...

Come on Drago, let go of that turd, show us that you are not a complete hack.

AReasonableMan said...

Let's hear it Drago.

Coward.

Drago said...

Again, all ARM was being asked to do was credit those who actually played a role in "getting bin laden".

He. Just. Can't. Do. It.

Something or other about Cheney prevents it apparently.

AReasonableMan said...

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

I guess you have 'other priorities'.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan said...
Let's hear it Drago

What's your latest demand of me that you offer instead of full throated credit for those who actually got bin laden?

AReasonableMan said...

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.
Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

AReasonableMan said...

Coward.

AReasonableMan said...

Coward.

Drago said...

Again, simply extend credit for getting bin laden beyond the light-bringer.

That's it.

That's all.

And you can't do it.

So then the interesting question would be "why"?

Something to do with the fact that you don't like crediting CIA operatives with success.

Or, and I think this might be it, the uncomfortable fact that intel that was brought to light after waterboarding 3 of our Gitmo "guests" led to discovery of couriers who were then traced to bin laden?

Ah, that must be it.

You don't want to credit them because it blows up other talking points!

Achilles said...

AReasonableMan said...
Achilles said...
You are on the other side.

"Bullshit. When will you get sick of calling people who disagree with you traitors?"

It is one thing to disagree about a policy. It is another to use our shortcomings or deaths as political fodder against those you disagree with.

And the shit you apologize for in Obama. He threw an American citizen in jail to support a lie about why our embassy was sacked. He has leaked things we, the defense community, have done to make himself look better getting our people killed.

I will never get tired of calling you people traitors. I stood in too many formations looking at helmets and AR15'S propped up in boots to lose that anger. You people can take your grim milestones and shove them up your ass.

Drago said...

Achilles to ARM: "You people can take your grim milestones and shove them up your ass."

Achilles, first, thanks for your service.

Secondly, I don't know if you've noticed or not but the "grim milestones" tracking ended on January 20, 2009.

Such is the power of light-bringers.

AReasonableMan said...

Drago, the coward, attempts to wrap himself in the sacrifice of others.

Give up man, you look like a complete tool.



AReasonableMan said...

Achilles said...
He threw an American citizen in jail to support a lie


That would be a con artist posing as a Jew in order to incite violence against Jews.

Drago said...

AReasonableMan: "Drago, the coward, attempts to wrap himself in the sacrifice of others.
Give up man, you look like a complete tool."

Astonishing the backflips you will turn to keep from saying kudos to those intelligence and military operatives/servicemembers who actually go bin laden.

Lets say that I was as big a coward as say, garage, or you.

That wouldn't change the fact that you are willing to give your messiah obama credit for getting bin laden but not anyone else.

Why would that be?

AReasonableMan said...

There is no doubt you are a coward Drago. Unwilling to move out of your safe zone.

Pathetic little loser.

Kelly said...

Even Bush knew enough not to nation build to much in Afghanistan. Certainly we helped hold elections, did some school construction, but otherwise the military was sort of treading water keeping things at a slow simmer. With Obama's ridiculous "surge" what did he hope to accomplish exactly? Did he ever say? It was the war we should have been fighting all along he argued during his campaign. When it came to it, he did it half-ass, the way he will do it in Iraq. If he does anything at all that is.

Drago said...

ARM: "That would be a con artist posing as a Jew in order to incite violence against Jews."

The con artist is the one who had his entire administration embrace and promulgate a lie that a video was responsible for the deaths of American personnel overseas.

And to continue doing it long after the lie was exposed.

And to have your Sec of State tell this lie to the family members of the deceased personnel.

AReasonableMan said...

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.
Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Coward.

Achilles said...

Coward.

Seriously. You use that word in a thread like this to describe someone else.

We don't even need you to fight with us. We just want you to resist the need to lie about what we do or brag about our accomplishments as if they were obama's. But you sit on the sidelines, bitch about all the Iraqi "civilians " we killed. About Abu Ghraib.

Wow.

Drago said...

ARM: "There is no doubt you are a coward Drago. Unwilling to move out of your safe zone.

Pathetic little loser."

What's most amusing is you think, somehow, beyond all reason, that this is an effective tactic for you.

The only thing pathetic here is your now absolute refusal to credit anyone with getting bin laden beyond obama.

Drago said...

Some folks (with a large amount of excess time) are going to view this thread and wonder precisely what it is that ARM was asking me to do which led to his astonishingly adolescent response and they are going to find...what exactly?

Achilles said...

AReasonableMan said...
Achilles said...
He threw an American citizen in jail to support a lie

"That would be a con artist posing as a Jew in order to incite violence against Jews. "

You apologize for a tyrant acting like a tyrant.

You are on the other side.

Drago said...

Now, in the interest of fairness, I will say that I have never seen ARM respond in such a silly manner.

So I'm going out on a limb here and assume that perhaps it's been a very active and fun "partying" day for ARM (perhaps football related, perhaps not) and he's simply not up to his usual standards.

That actually makes the most sense to me.

AReasonableMan said...

Well Drago, you sad pathetic little fuck, I have given you enough chances. From here forward let it be known what a complete coward you are. Unable to think for yourself you hide behind crude simplistic slogans. A party hack.





Drago said...

ARM: "From here forward let it be known what a complete coward you are."

LOL

What are you, the Town Crier?

LOL

Oh yeah, I'm sure your declaration from on high will be accorded precisely the degree of "respect" to which it deserves and will be accepted by the "Althouse Masses" (copyright pending) to the very same degree.

LOL

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