Althouse: "Everybody’s gone completely crazy on this voter ID thing."

May 10, 2014

"Everybody’s gone completely crazy on this voter ID thing."

"I think it’s wrong for Republicans to go too crazy on this issue because it’s offending people."

Said Rand Paul.

90 comments:

Fen said...: Hell, the Electoral College is offending people too. Lets get rid of that while we're at it.

And that 2nd Ammendment? The Left has been throwing temper tantrums for decades. Lets ditch that too.

putz. Come back when you find your balls.; 5/10/14, 9:10 AM
Bobber Fleck said...: Anyone who thinks requiring a photo ID to vote is a burden should consider the history of why we vote on Tuesday.

From Ask History: "But why a Tuesday in November? The answer stems from the agrarian makeup of 19th-century America. In the 1800s, most citizens worked as farmers and lived far from their polling place. Since people often traveled at least a day to vote, lawmakers needed to allow a two-day window for Election Day. Weekends were impractical, since most people spent Sundays in church, and Wednesday was market day for farmers. With this in mind, Tuesday was selected as the first and most convenient day of the week to hold elections."; 5/10/14, 9:13 AM
Michael The Magnificent said...: Let's not forget that pesky first amendment. Who wants to hear offensive things? Toss it!; 5/10/14, 9:17 AM
Fen said...: Great point Bobber.; 5/10/14, 9:19 AM
Fen said...: At 2nd glance, Rand Paul is on to something: "...alienates and insults African-Americans and hurts the party"

Take the long view - we allow voter fraud, maybe lose the next several elections, but we'll pull all those "alientated" blacks into the party. Maybe shave 1% of the 97% that support the Dems.

Idiot.; 5/10/14, 9:22 AM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Rand Paul is being fairly consistent here. He also opposes E-verify. He is a libertarian and is against big government.; 5/10/14, 9:22 AM
grackle said...: I like Rand Paul. I really do. But this kind of murky thinking is the reason I hope he never becomes the GOP's pick for POTUS.; 5/10/14, 9:40 AM
Phil 314 said...: Agree with ARM on this one, though Dr. Paul's consistency will do him no favors in electoral politics.

PS. With its mention of the Civil Rights Bill "controversy" the NYT demonstrates that it, too, doesn't understand Paul.; 5/10/14, 9:40 AM
I'm Full of Soup said...: Dear Senator Pau:

Are you also concerned that the flood of job stealing illegal Mexicans is hurting blacks?; 5/10/14, 9:44 AM
Once written, twice... said...: The idea that massive voter fraud is somehow changing election outcomes is ludicrous. Most elections, even local ones that are close, are decided by thousand vote margins. So it would take a conspiracy involving hundreds of people to engage in voter fraud to maybe generate enough votes in a close election to sway the outcome. Are we suppost to believe that these hundreds of people would risk being arrested on felony charges for the slight chance that they might change an outcome of an election? Are we to believe that such a conspiracy involving hundreds of people would go undetected?

There is no better proof how shameful the Republicans have become than their exploration of this red herring. Why haven't Republican State AGs created special task forces and ferreted out this supposed widespread voter fraud? They haven't because they know it is non-existent.

Republicans who engage in this race-baiting fear-mongering are scum.; 5/10/14, 9:46 AM
Tank said...: Now he has two big, related negatives.

1. Open borders.
2. Voter ID.

He wants to broaden the party. He's right about that, but you do it by convincing people you're right, not by caving in.; 5/10/14, 9:51 AM
Fen said...: Yah, driveby troll gives us the usual talking point propaganda about how there just cant be any significant voter fraud.

Then tops it off with "racism!"

Please go fuck yourself.; 5/10/14, 9:53 AM
Tank said...: @Once written. You perpetuate the big lie. See Massive Voter Fraud.; 5/10/14, 9:54 AM
Hagar said...: You ever heard of "Landslide Lyndon?"; 5/10/14, 9:56 AM
Fen said...: BTW, I saw this exact comment on another site a few months ago. Are you a Soros-stooge, oncebitten? Just cut n paste your bullshit from your weekly TP memo?; 5/10/14, 9:56 AM
I'm Full of Soup said...: One of every fourteen Americans is not a citizen and is not eligible to vote. If one out every 100 ineligible Americans voted, that would total almost 250,000 votes. Apportioned by population among the states, that would represent 15-20,000 votes in a state like Florida or Ohio and could be sufficient to tilt an election.; 5/10/14, 9:59 AM
Bob Ellison said...: I vote every two years, and I like to think that my vote matters, or at least has the possibility of mattering. If there is one fraudulent vote, then my vote does not matter.

"Republicans who engage in this race-baiting fear-mongering are scum." No, the scum comes from the projectionists who say it's not about electoral integrity. Rand Paul is playing into their hands.; 5/10/14, 9:59 AM
I Have Misplaced My Pants said...: Republicans who engage in this race-baiting fear-mongering are scum.

It's very admirable when Democrats engage in race-baiting fear-mongering by accusing those who want a basic protection for clean elections of racism.; 5/10/14, 10:01 AM
tim maguire said...: "Voter ID is a burden" is such an obvious canard I can't help but think less of Paul for parroting it. There have been a number of Rand Paul comments publicized recently (though not all the comments are recent) that make me question his fitness for office.

Besides, voting should be a little bit of a burden. We want to limit voting to those who care, at least a little.; 5/10/14, 10:12 AM
campy said...: Right, there's no vote fraud. Senator Franken's "victory" was 100% kosher.; 5/10/14, 10:15 AM
Æthelflæd said...: AJ Lynch said...
"Dear Senator Pau:

Are you also concerned that the flood of job stealing illegal Mexicans is hurting blacks?"

This. This is also why I think the democrats are becoming the party of the white upper class and are losing the white working class.; 5/10/14, 10:17 AM
Michael K said...: Blogger AReasonableMan said...
"Rand Paul is being fairly consistent here. He also opposes E-verify. He is a libertarian and is against big government."

He is sounding more and more like he is sucking up to people who will never vote for him. The attack on Cheney was the first one. What he said about Cheney is standard Democrat propaganda. The recent book about Bush and Cheney by a NY Times writer makes clear what happened and it had nothing to do with what Paul said.

I understand why you love this stuff but don;t expect sensible Republicans to believe this stuff.

"Republicans who engage in this race-baiting fear-mongering are scum."

Here is the open lefty sentiment. Fact free, of course.; 5/10/14, 10:17 AM
madAsHell said...: I have to show ID to get on an airplane. I'm happy to do it because I don't want the plane hijacked.

I'd be happy to show ID to vote because I don't want the vote to be hijacked.; 5/10/14, 10:21 AM
Bobber Fleck said...: Once written... I live in Minnesota, where Al Franken won by 312 votes after an ugly recount process. The original tally had Norm Coleman winning by 215. There were lots of questionable votes. Voter fraud is one likely explanation of Franken's win.

During our country's history over a million American soldiers have lost their lives to preserve our freedom and the right to vote. We owe it to them to ensure the voting process is conducted with integrity.; 5/10/14, 10:24 AM
cubanbob said...: There is no better proof how shameful the Republicans have become than their exploration of this red herring. Why haven't Republican State AGs created special task forces and ferreted out this supposed widespread voter fraud? They haven't because they know it is non-existent."

Perhaps because the fraud is mainly in Democrat states. No incentive to look for it. See Pennsylvania. As for Internet voting, government can't get a website to function for health care purchasing is going to be able to pull off a fraud resistant website? Maybe I'm d fashioned but there is for me a certain feeling of civility in getting in line with a cross section of the people to vote on Election Day.; 5/10/14, 10:29 AM
Crimso said...: "The idea that massive voter fraud is somehow changing election outcomes is ludicrous."

Even more ludicrous is the idea that voter fraud should have to be changing elections in order for it to warrant prevention. Still more ludicrous is the idea that people concerned about it are necessarily terrified of supposed conspiracies to steal the elections.

I don't have to entertain the idea of some massive conspiracy to defraud banks nor that of widespread identity theft to see the basic common sense of asking for ID when accessing a bank account.

But if asking for ID to vote is automatically some KKK-inspired plot to disenfranchise blacks, then it follows that people in favor of asking for ID to purchase a firearm are motivated by a desire to keep blacks disarmed while the whites maintain ownership of their firearms. Now why do such people desire that sort of thing? Because they're planning on genocide? Alternatively, we can believe that asking for ID to purchase a firearm is simply a common sense safeguard.; 5/10/14, 10:31 AM
Bobber Fleck said...: One written... You said "
Republicans who engage in this race-baiting fear-mongering are scum."

Did you come up with that all by yourself? Or did you attend a "How to call Republicans names" seminar where they provided you with a template to make it easy?; 5/10/14, 10:32 AM
SJ said...: @once,

it is very hard to prove whether an election was tainted by fraudulent votes or not.

Unless something like a Voter-ID process is followed.

Even though most races appear hard to swing, the image of dead people voting by absentee ballot doesn't inspire confidence in me.

Especially when the woman in question wasn't known to be dead at the time the vote was cast...which makes me wonder whether there are political dirty-tricks teams who have access to the list of absentee ballot recipients and try to acquire the ballots from mailboxes.

And then there are stories like this. A woman is challenging a voter ID law, and is registered to vote in both Indiana and Florida.

How large of a 'snowbird' population dual-registered is necessary to swing local/regional elections? In the home state, or in Florida?; 5/10/14, 10:34 AM
SteveBrooklineMA said...: How about we just limit voting to voting day (except for very exceptional circumstances) and then have the purple finger thing?; 5/10/14, 10:36 AM
SteveBrooklineMA said...: I agree with "Once written, twice..." to an extent. I don't think there is significant vote fraud going on. It happens, but seldom to an extent that it has an effect on outcomes.

However, the perception that fraud is a serious problem is real and needs to be addressed. If people believe there is significant fraud, it undermines legitimacy.

That's why I propose we use the purple finger method.; 5/10/14, 10:41 AM
campy said...: A lot of democrat voters are too poor to afford fingers.; 5/10/14, 10:44 AM
mc said...: Once Written's comment has left me twice disgusted with our social, political and media milieu.

We'd all surely know about voter fraud if it were real...of course.

The media would be all over it, it would be investigated thoroughly.

Who could expect anyone to get a voter i.d. card?

Voting shouldn't anyone to step up and act responsibly. Everyone should be able to vote well before election day anonymously, illegal aliens should be able to "aver" they are valid voters and be registered when they get there licenses and use false or stolen Social security numbers at the DMV.

Democrats wouldn't ever take any illicit or fraudulent vote they could drum up.

I am a racist for thinking people should take voting seriously and step up to the actions necessary to keep it free from any suspicion whatsoever for the good of the confidence of those who do step up.

Liberals don't need to prevail outright...they just need to stymie addressing any problem as long as they can...that's a win.

See open borders...they block addressing the problem until they say "well you certainly can't fix it now...it's too big to address. Make them all legal."

That's a shameless win for them.; 5/10/14, 10:49 AM
Some Seppo said...: Afghanistan can, but they aren't "racist scum".

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/About/General/2014/1/31/1391194458299/Burqa-clad-women-show-ID--001.jpg; 5/10/14, 10:52 AM
Hagar said...: Not always. The Democrats have never denied that there was vote fraud in Illinois in the 1960 election. Their official story there is that it did not matter because the Kennedy ticket would have won anyway.

The real reason is that denying it would conflict with the official version of why JFK and his brothers met with Sam Giancana and his lieutenants at Frank Sinatra's place in Hollywood, and why Papa Joe following that sent Judith Campbell with a suitcase full of cash to Giancana in Chicago.
And their story there is that election fraud against Richard Nixon's candidacy was of course justified, no matter what.

But it wasn't, and anyway the meeting was not about organizing election fraud in Richard Daley's Chicago.; 5/10/14, 10:59 AM
Oso Negro said...: The need to vote without an ID is a black thing you whitey Althousians just can't understand. Now if you would just amend the Constitution to count each African-American vote as 5/3rds of a vote, we could probably allow voter ID to pass.; 5/10/14, 11:00 AM
Annie said...: The idea that massive voter fraud is somehow changing election outcomes is ludicrous.

Two come to mind. Gregoire of Washington state, and Al Franken. When an election is close, democrats keep recounting until they have enough felons or dead votes, counted. Sometimes they'll even find an 'overlooked' trunkful of ballots.

In the former, where she 'won' by 129 votes, even the judge acknowledged there was evidence that 1,600+ votes had been illegally cast. In the latter, it wasn't looking good for Franken, so hey, everyone check their trunks - you know, where most election officials store ballots!; 5/10/14, 11:02 AM
Curious George said...: Rand Paul is dead to me.; 5/10/14, 11:13 AM
JD said...: Looks like when real libertarians speak, fake ones don't like it. Hahaha, Rand Paul is dead in the water. Not pure enough, or too pure? It's starting to sound like Goldilocks.; 5/10/14, 11:39 AM
Michael K said...: "The idea that massive voter fraud is somehow changing election outcomes is ludicrous.

Two come to mind. Gregoire of Washington state, and Al Franken. When an election is close, democrats keep recounting until they have enough felons or dead votes, counted. Sometimes they'll even find an 'overlooked' trunkful of ballots."

Absolutely. Vote fraud gave us Lyndon Johnson, as well. His first election. Note the source.

It has been alleged for years that Johnson captured his Senate seat through fraud, but Mr. Caro goes into great detail to tell how the future President overcame a 20,000-vote deficit to achieve his famous 87-vote victory in the 1948 Democratic runoff primary against a former Governor, Coke Stevenson

Vote fraud. It's what Democrats are.; 5/10/14, 11:40 AM
rcocean said...: "Rand Paul is being fairly consistent here. He also opposes E-verify. He is a libertarian and is against big government."

He's an open borders fanatic and favors Amnesty. I'll never vote for him. We don't need a big business liberal in the White House. We already had the Bushes.; 5/10/14, 11:47 AM
Rusty said...: SteveBrooklineMA said...
I agree with "Once written, twice..." to an extent. I don't think there is significant vote fraud going on. It happens, but seldom to an extent that it has an effect on outcomes.

Oh my. You're not from around here , are you?
No mater how many votes the democrat candidate for president is short Chicago will make up the difference.
Vote fraud in Illinois? It's a spectator sport here.; 5/10/14, 11:52 AM
Rusty said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 5/10/14, 11:52 AM
Alex said...: You know what.... fuck you Rand Paul. The law is the law. You don't make exceptions for the "legacy of racism" or other such crap. You enforce the law.; 5/10/14, 12:09 PM
Alex said...: Republicans who engage in this race-baiting fear-mongering are scum.

garage's latest alias. You're not fooling anyone.; 5/10/14, 12:10 PM
Audacity17 said...: Rand Paul is the sort of libertarian I detest. Constantly mouthing off about the founders, but rejecting the federalism they implemented. These voter ID efforts are occurring at the state level....WTF is he talking about?; 5/10/14, 12:18 PM
n.n said...: It's simple, no voter id, no id, no registration, period.

That said, even third world nations takes steps to prevent disenfranchisement.

As for undue burden, with the imposition of health care "reform", do they really want to use that broken argument?

Finally, perhaps Paul knows that disenfranchisement will occur through other channels, and that authenticating eligible voters is merely a red herring. It's the corruption, stupid.; 5/10/14, 12:20 PM
Hagar said...: At the end of election night in 2000, George W. was ahead by 4 votes in New Mexico.
A union official in Las Cruces thought that could not be right, so he went looking, and what do you know, he found an envelope with 11 votes for Al Gore behind a file cabinet somewhere, so the next day Gore was ahead by 7 votes.
That was thought to be a little thin, so they kept on looking and found another envelope with 352 votes for Gore, so the official count was Gore by 359 votes, all in Las Cruces.

Did not matter, according to the Democrats, since who cares about such a small state anyway?
But I think it had a significant subconscious impact, since NM is fairly large in area, and there it was as a large blue peninsula jutting into the otherwise red southwest on the electoral map for the next 4 years.

I think the Democrats are well aware that though they may lose the national vote by hundreds of thousands in a wave election, the little local elections "won" by a handful of votes add up for laying the groundwork for a comeback in the next national election.; 5/10/14, 12:27 PM
MarkW said...: I have to show ID to get on an airplane. I'm happy to do it because I don't want the plane hijacked.

That's a false sense of security. The airport security circus not only degrades our civil liberties, it creates new and bigger vulnerabilities than before. Now if a terrorist wanted to kill a lot of passengers with no chance of security stopping him, all he'd have to do is tow a big suitcase bomb into the middle of a crowded security line.; 5/10/14, 12:39 PM
garage mahal said...: But if asking for ID to vote is automatically some KKK-inspired plot to disenfranchise blacks,

It's not just blacks and it's not just photo ID. Make it difficult for for all Democratic voters to vote. Students, the poor, the disabled. Even Rand Paul said eliminating early voting was bullshit. Wow!; 5/10/14, 1:19 PM
damikesc said...: Yeah, my desire to vote for Paul is effectively dead now. Congrats Rand.; 5/10/14, 1:25 PM
jr565 said...: I find it offensive when people who shouldn't be able to vote get to vote.; 5/10/14, 1:31 PM
Big Mike said...: We get the Russia Today (RT) television network here in Fairfax County, VA. Last election they were making fun of the US because we don't require ID to vote and thus expose ourselves to fraud and corruption.

Let's think about that for a moment, shall we? The. Russians. Were. Laughing. At. Us.; 5/10/14, 1:33 PM
jr565 said...: Tank wrote:
Now he has two big, related negatives.

1. Open borders.
2. Voter ID.

So, if we have open borders should those coming over the border be able to vote, OR, should we have some mechanism in place whereby people who aren't supposed to vote can't. And what would that be?
Some form of identification process. And he's opposed to that?

He just lost my vote.; 5/10/14, 1:35 PM
jr565 said...: "The idea that massive voter fraud is somehow changing election outcomes is ludicrous."

The idea that having people have ID cards and show them as proof of identity is an assault on minorities is even more ludicrous.
IF there is some issue whereby "people of color" aren't getting access to basic identification that would allow them to perform basic societal functions, then the democratic party is doing something wrong.; 5/10/14, 1:38 PM
Anonymous said...: I occasionally take a bus, from Quincy, Mass., to a casino in Conn. The bus is filled with immigrants from Asia, many with limited English, several American born blacks, and a few whites, like myself. It's a regular United Nations. ID must be shown to buy a ticket, albeit after the bus is on its way. No one has a problem showing proper ID. ID must be produced to receive the casino promotion package at arrival and again, no one has a problem showing ID. I've taken similar buses from Chinatown in Boston and Manhattan and Koreatown in Queens, N.Y. and again no problems. Hundreds of passengers traveling daily, none privileged, some living on the edge, all able to produce valid ID. So why, when it comes to voting is it a problem? Only a fool would think it didn't have something to do with election fraud.; 5/10/14, 1:40 PM
jr565 said...: madashell wrote:
I have to show ID to get on an airplane. I'm happy to do it because I don't want the plane hijacked.

I'd be happy to show ID to vote because I don't want the vote to be hijacked.

Even more importantly, any minority who wanted to get on a plane would already have this ID. Or would get it promptly.
So, then if you don't have this ID you can't fly. Or drive. Or go to bars. Or buy a gun. Or pick up your package at the post office. No wonder people can't get ahead in these inner cities (if we are to believe this completely bogus argument). They don't even have th necessary ID to cash a check at the check cashing place.

The libs are always talking about the causes of endemic problems and trying to assign racist reasons for why things aren't going well for the inner city. Here's a reason why someone might not get ahead. No BASIC ID. So then, rather than fight some bogus fight about how requesting ID is racist, find ways to make sure people who don't have BASIC ID have BASIC ID. And then maybe they can do basic things in society (unrelated to voting).
Back when it was talk of Katrina, the left tried to pin the lack of evacuation on republicans on Bush. The reason that thousands were left in New orleans was not due no local evacuation plan (even though we all saw the pictures of the buses in the flooded parking lots) and wasnt' due to people simply not heeding the call and leaving. No, it became an issue of class.
Blacks didn't leave because they had no money and no cars. So they couldn't drive away.
Well, if that were so, an evacuation plan should have taken that into consideration and made allowances for people without vehicles. That's a local issue, not Bush's fault.
Was Bush supposed to buy everyone a car in New Orleans?
Even more importantly, and back to the topic at hand, even if they had cars how would they be able to drive them? Because according to the libs, there is some issue with black people being able to get drivers licenses.
So, no drivers license, no car. Ergo, you will be stuck in a hurricane with no way to escape.

Do liberals want us to peg them with wishing death on black people because they aren't facilitating getting drivers licenses that will allow them to drive cars out of town before disaster strikes? Then stop with the argument that aksing for ID to vote has some racial agenda.
Blacks and minorities are not infants. This requirement will, or should,not hit minorities any harder than anyone else.; 5/10/14, 1:59 PM
jr565 said...: Once bitten, twice wrote:

Republicans who engage in this race-baiting fear-mongering are scum.

What race baiting? it's YOUR side saying that getitng basic ID is some hardship and that somehow blacks are incapable of doing so.
White people would have to present the same ID too. Why do you think blacks are incapable of getting ID?

if this were the case of a law abiding citizen, black or otherwise, buying a gun, wouldn't you want him to present the SAME ID to show that he is who he says he is and not some crazed loon?

If I said people shouldn't have to present ID to buy guns, I'd imagine you'd say I was an extremist in the NRA. And not even most people in the NRA are that extreme.

It's the same ID though.; 5/10/14, 2:05 PM
jr565 said...: garage mahal wrote;
It's not just blacks and it's not just photo ID. Make it difficult for for all Democratic voters to vote. Students, the poor, the disabled.

Would you make the argument that a bar checking for ID would make it hard for students, the poor and the disabled to go to a bar? Or to buy cigarettes? or a gun?; 5/10/14, 2:11 PM
chickelit said...: jr565 wrote: Then stop with the argument that aksing for ID to vote has some racial agenda.

That typo is racist!; 5/10/14, 2:20 PM
jr565 said...: Rules and regulations on check cashing:
http://www.ehow.com/info_8026499_rules-regulations-check-cashing.html

dentification
When you cash a check you must identify yourself by providing the establishment cashing your check with a valid form of government issued ID. Although in some instances, check cashing establishments can choose to cash checks without requiring ID. To do so would leave those businesses with no recourse in the event of fraud or if a cashed check later gets return unpaid by the issuing bank. Therefore, most check cashing centers and banks require an ID and many also take a thumbprint signature.

Check cashing places are cognizant of the potential for fraud if people who weren't who they say they were tried to cash checks. Does Garage Mahal think this requirement should be lifted for minorities, poor people, students or the disabled?
If they don't have the ID to vote, then they also couldn't cash a check. NO WONDER THEY'RE POOR! They probably have all of these un-cashed checks sitting on their counter because they have no way to cash their checks since they don't have ID.
Garage, your argument is frankly moronic.; 5/10/14, 2:20 PM
Anonymous said...: Big Mike said...

We get the Russia Today (RT) television network here in Fairfax County, VA. Last election they were making fun of the US because we don't require ID to vote and thus expose ourselves to fraud and corruption.

Let's think about that for a moment, shall we? The. Russians. Were. Laughing. At. Us.

Close.

The Russians were JUSTIFIABLE laughing at us because it's easier to commit vote fraud in a US election than in a Russian one.; 5/10/14, 2:25 PM
Anonymous said...: But you want to know who the real "racist scum" are? They're the people who fight to "make sure poor people can vote without a photo ID", rather than fighting to make sure poor people can get a photo ID.

You can not legally function in our society without photo ID. Anyone who actually cared about the poor would be fighting to make sure they all had one, not fighting to make vote fraud easier by blocking photo ID requirements for voting.

Democrats and Rand Paul: the people who want to enable failure, rather than support success.; 5/10/14, 2:28 PM
wildswan said...: "It's not just blacks and it's not just photo ID. Make it difficult for for all Democratic voters to vote. Students, the poor, the disabled."

If voter ID laws follow the same photo ID rules as the medical ID rules which the Obama regime has imposed on the disabled and poor, then I don't see how voter ID laws can be considered burdensome

President Obama issued a regulation which said that anyone using Medicare or Medicaid or any Federal insurance program had to have a government photo ID. Any poor person who is eligible for Medicare cannot get medical care without such an ID. But there are no stories whatsoever, not even one, of anyone being denied access to medical treatment because they did not have the required Medical ID. Medicaid covers the really poor while Medicaid covers the elderly, blind or disabled. So if all those covered by Medicare or Medicaid can get the necessary ID for medical treatment then it cannot be burdensome to get one. Furthermore we have to assume that the poor, elderly, blind and disabled all have a medical ID which they can also use for voter ID. So requiring voter ID is not burdensome on the poor, elderly, blind or disabled. As long as the law states that voter ID requirements are no more onerous than medical ID requirements; 5/10/14, 2:32 PM
JD said...: Hahahaha, "Rand Paul is dead to me". You can't make this stuff up. How many groups will the right splinter into? You people seriously are not going to be winning any elections anytime soon.; 5/10/14, 2:43 PM
Curious George said...: "garage mahal said...

It's not just blacks and it's not just photo ID. Make it difficult for for all Democratic voters to vote. Students, the poor, the disabled. Even Rand Paul said eliminating early voting was bullshit. Wow!"

Name one other thing that requires a photo ID that the left has complained makes difficult for people.

Just one.; 5/10/14, 2:48 PM
SteveR said...: Paul is talking about it as a campaign issue and he's right, unless republicans can figure out a better way to deal it, they will be portrayed as against old black people. No objective analysis can say there's not a problem or that the arguments against voter ID aren't weak, but we aren't trying to be right, we are wanting to win elections.; 5/10/14, 2:51 PM
Anonymous said...: Voter ID hasn't got much to do with "big government" one way or the other. It'd take a mighty purist libertarian to argue that government shouldn't be involved in running elections.; 5/10/14, 2:56 PM
Rusty said...: arage mahal said...
But if asking for ID to vote is automatically some KKK-inspired plot to disenfranchise blacks,

It's not just blacks and it's not just photo ID. Make it difficult for for all Democratic voters to vote. Students, the poor, the disabled. Even Rand Paul said eliminating early voting was bullshit. Wow!

You can be made to believe anything.; 5/10/14, 3:10 PM
Meade said...: Bob Ellison said...
"I vote every two years, and I like to think that my vote matters, or at least has the possibility of mattering. If there is one fraudulent vote, then my vote does not matter."

If you are as worried about electoral fraud as you seem, why focus on one of the least occurring types of fraud — voter impersonation — the only type of electoral fraud that voter ID prevents?; 5/10/14, 3:56 PM
cubanbob said...: It's not just blacks and it's not just photo ID. Make it difficult for for all Democratic voters to vote. Students, the poor, the disabled. Even Rand Paul said eliminating early voting was bullshit. Wow!""

All of these core Democrat voters are disproportionately beneficiaries of unearned government benefits-benefits that require photo ID. Garage and company believe that these very same people who can manage to acquire photo ID for benefits are incapable of producing them at a polling station. There are only two possibities : they are brain dead stupid or they know they can't win without fraud.; 5/10/14, 4:09 PM
Once written, twice... said...: The fact is that, outside of isolated incidents, no widespread voter fraud has been uncovered. You know that if Republicans could actually come up with it we would never hear the end of it. Also, the majority of State Attorney Generals are Republican. They are not even bothering to set up "special task forces" and the like because they know it is a made up problem.

But, Republicans have made this one of their central issues because it excites their shrinking foaming at the mouth rightwing base.

The American people want reasonable solutions to real problems. But Republicans keep serving up these shit sandwiches.; 5/10/14, 4:16 PM
Once written, twice... said...: This Republican assault is also directed at young voters who move a lot and do not have up to date I.D.s. These young votes of course skew Democrat.

How dumb is it of Republicans to piss off these new voters right out of the gate?

Also, Rand Paul believes his presidential run will excite younger voters like his dad's presidential runs did. He thinks he can cultivate these younger more libertarian activists to becoming his ground troops in early primary states.

That is why Rand Paul has taken this position.

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The analysis I just wrote is brilliant and Althouse should feature it in the original post or create a new one to highlight it.; 5/10/14, 4:37 PM
30yearProf said...: So Rand Paul is a coward unwilling to stand up to progressive pressure. OK, he ain't gonna be President.; 5/10/14, 4:41 PM
jr565 said...: "President Obama issued a regulation which said that anyone using Medicare or Medicaid or any Federal insurance program had to have a government photo ID. "

So then, how are the poor who rely on medicaire/medicaid actually getting to use those programs.

This is such a complete bogus issue from people who simply do not want any meaningful verification because they want votes to count of people who's votes shouldn't count.
Just as you'd want verification when buying booze or a gun, so to should you want it when people who may not be who they say they are want to vote. And since poor people need said ID anyway to take advantage of social programs wouldnt' they already have this ID?
I don't hear Garage Mahal saying that demanding ID for medicare is impacting poor people, minorities, the disabled or students. Why is that?; 5/10/14, 5:28 PM
jr565 said...: once written, twice...
The American people want reasonable solutions to real problems. But Republicans keep serving up these shit sandwiches.

The only shit sandwhich is that served up by the democrats on this. Verification when voting IS reasonable. And you know it.
And as far as young people moving around alot and not having updated ID's, doesnt that speak of potential problems? How do we know they're voting in the right location? Or not voting twice or of age to vote at all?
One things for sure if they moved they're probably registered to vote at a different location. If they show up at the new location and have no ID to show they are who they say they are and should be voting at that location, why should they be able to vote at that location?; 5/10/14, 5:32 PM
grackle said...: He wants to broaden the party. He's right about that, but you do it by convincing people you're right, not by caving in.

Broadening the GOP needs to happen. But how? I do not believe American blacks will ever vote for the GOP. As they say in the oil patches, that hole is dry.

But Paul does seem to realize that the Latinos might be captured. And I agree. Why? Because the Latino culture is itself basically conservative. It is literally a culture made to fit for conservatism.

But he is going about it in the wrong way. They are not going to be persuaded by a tactic of ditching voter ID.

The GOP needs to focus on 3 principles: limited government, free market capitalism, and a strong national defense. It's what Reagan did and it's what earned him 2 terms. The GOP should welcome anyone who adheres to those principles.; 5/10/14, 6:36 PM
Bob Ellison said...: Meade, I do not understand your question. Vote fraud is happening. It is not a matter of dispute.

I am not focusing on one type of vote fraud. You seem to be. Why?; 5/10/14, 6:40 PM
cubanbob said...: The American people want reasonable solutions to real problems. But Republicans keep serving up these shit sandwiches."

There you go again talking about Democrats.; 5/10/14, 7:25 PM
Drago said...: Verifying who you are when voting is McCarthyesque.; 5/10/14, 8:08 PM
garage mahal said...: Name one other thing that requires a photo ID that the left has complained makes difficult for people.

Not having a drivers license or ID is huge barrier for blacks in Milwaukee County to gain employment. Liberals have been complaining about that for a long time. Not that you give a flying fuck, of course.; 5/10/14, 8:58 PM
Curious George said...: "garage mahal said...
Name one other thing that requires a photo ID that the left has complained makes difficult for people.

Not having a drivers license or ID is huge barrier for blacks in Milwaukee County to gain employment. Liberals have been complaining about that for a long time. Not that you give a flying fuck, of course."

Sure they have. Please show me examples of a liberal website making this an issue.

BTW, proof of ID is a federal requirement.; 5/10/14, 10:37 PM
Real American said...: election fraud should offend everyone.; 5/10/14, 11:19 PM
Anonymous said...: Put me in the camp of, let's make it a lot harder for people to vote.

I've never understood this desire that anyone old enough and a pulse ought to vote and it outa be as easy as climbing out of bed.

Why would we want that?

Let's have some more standards in our voting.

1) Make people wait in line for hours on end to vote. No mail in ballots or extra voting days.

2) Voter ID.

3) Have to be able to read.

4) No one can assist you, you have to go in alone and vote.

If you can't do those simple things, then you don't care enough about our Democracy that you should be voting anyway.; 5/11/14, 3:29 AM
Anonymous said...: Meade wrote;

"If you are as worried about electoral fraud as you seem, why focus on one of the least occurring types of fraud — voter impersonation — the only type of electoral fraud that voter ID prevents?"

This isn't accurate in most states. In Washington, Hawaii and New Mexico (And perhaps California now), you can obtain a State ID if you can demonstrate you're a resident of the state. The bar for that is usually pretty low. Here in Washington State, we have quite a few illegal aliens from New York and New Jersey coming here to obtain Washington State ID as they pretend to be residents. Costs anywhere from $500 to $5000 depending on where you're from (Mexico is closer to the low end while Brazil is closer to the high end).

I imagine if you had to present an ID in New York, and were an illegal alien, and only had an ID from Washington State, you wouldn't be able to vote. Right?

So this wouldn't just stop impersonation, it would also make it more difficult for illegal aliens to vote.

Obviously this isn't true in Washington State and the others I mentioned, but we don't care about Voter ID here in Washington State. Our largest county, King County where Seattle is, all of our voting is done by mail in ballot.; 5/11/14, 3:34 AM
stlcdr said...: r.e. Showing an ID at security to get on a 'plane...

People have no problem doing so, not because they don't want to be 'blown up', but because it is trivially easy to do, and of no consequence.

When someone makes it a race issue, they have lost an argument. Are blacks incapable of getting an ID and whites are?

Students, likewise, have no problem with IDs. Indeed, IDs are big part of student life/requirements.

The disabled? Who are these 'disabled' people who can do everything to survive in the harsh world, but getting an ID is just over the top?; 5/11/14, 5:43 AM
Rusty said...: garage mahal said...
Name one other thing that requires a photo ID that the left has complained makes difficult for people.

Not having a drivers license or ID is huge barrier for blacks in Milwaukee County to gain employment. Liberals have been complaining about that for a long time. Not that you give a flying fuck, of course.

liar.; 5/11/14, 6:47 AM
Rusty said...: If you are as worried about electoral fraud as you seem, why focus on one of the least occurring types of fraud — voter impersonation — the only type of electoral fraud that voter ID prevents?

Because once you have presented an ID and voted you are on record of voting that day in that place. It prevents ballot stuffing and multiple voting because names can checked against lists of those that voted and where and when they voted.
makes it very hard to canvass cemeterys.; 5/11/14, 6:54 AM
Curious George said...: "Meade said...
If you are as worried about electoral fraud as you seem, why focus on one of the least occurring types of fraud — voter impersonation — the only type of electoral fraud that voter ID prevents?"

It's not the only type of fraud that it prevents. It prevents illegals voting, and can also prevent double voting by eliminating voting out of your residency, as well as out of residency voting in general.; 5/11/14, 7:37 AM
Curious George said...: "garage mahal said...
Name one other thing that requires a photo ID that the left has complained makes difficult for people.

Not having a drivers license or ID is huge barrier for blacks in Milwaukee County to gain employment. Liberals have been complaining about that for a long time. Not that you give a flying fuck, of course."

I googled this and the only hit was a uwm piece about the difficulty in gettiing a job without a drivers license...but it had to do with the lack of mobility. garage, you're just a liar.

But please, show me the disfranchisement outcry by not making if difficult for students, the poor, the disabled to have many many basics of modern life, or help from the government. From banks accounts, to library cards, hell to simply cash a check, no ID, no way. Plus no welfare, no food stamps, no job. all require ID's. Show me the left bitching about that.

Sadly, you can't because they don't. You give a rats ass about students, the poor, the disabled. Their pawns. They already consistently vote. This is about hiding your dirty little secrets.; 5/11/14, 7:48 AM
Paul said...: Without voter ID, ballot box stuffing is a foregone conclusion.

Remember Pelosi with the 'count every chad' during the Gore .vs. Bush dustup?

How can you have honest voting if you don't know if the one voting has the RIGHT to vote?

I have give my ID to buy a gun (2nd Amendment right.) I have to give my ID to get into some federal buildings, board an airplane, cash a check, go on most school grounds, etc...

And of course, if I fail to give a policeman my ID, I can be changed with 'failure to identify.'

So why not when I vote???; 5/11/14, 10:27 AM