Althouse: What going off the "fiscal cliff" will cost you...

December 27, 2012

What going off the "fiscal cliff" will cost you...

... in increased taxes.

96 comments:

chickelit said...: Shouldn't this news warm the hearts of tax and spend cockles? All that additional Government control.; 12/27/12, 5:26 PM
chickelit said...: It's not like the entitlements aren't in place to use it all up.

There will be lesser deficit!; 12/27/12, 5:28 PM
chickelit said...: Think of it as the first balloon payment on the Washington, DC Bubble.; 12/27/12, 5:31 PM
Indigo Red said...: Just wait til ObamaCare fully kicks in, then some real squealing will happen.; 12/27/12, 5:35 PM
n.n said...: Explicitly increasing taxes would actually be a step in the right direction. As it is, both capital and labor are devalued at nearly 10% annually through maintenance of a perpetual account deficit. However, as there are mitigating circumstances (e.g. illegal aliens, shifted environment and labor disruption, progressive involuntary exploitation) to realizing this loss, people do not comprehend the damage done in America and around the world.

Anyway, the bottom line is if people want redistributive change, then it must be paid for and the effects of involuntary exploitation must be universal. We cannot reasonable transform the producer to become the servant of the consumer through fraud or willful neglect. We cannot enslave part of the population to serve another, who choose to exist at a low energy state, but desire the products and services available at a high energy state.

It is dissociation of risk which causes corruption. It is dreams of instant gratification which motivates its progress.; 12/27/12, 5:38 PM
Anonymous said...: People forget the dynamics of the original cuts. Back then, the republicans wanted to give surplus money back to the people who were actually paying taxes based on how much they were paying. Democrats thought that was unfair and thus the majority of the cuts went to the "lower and middle classes".; 12/27/12, 5:41 PM
Michael said...: Hilararious! Just now these crafty New Yorkers are calculating the cost of sanctimony and smug. We mean Republicans are costing them as we scourch the earth in our war against women. And blacks. And the poor. Oh, and the stupid.; 12/27/12, 5:43 PM
Ann Althouse said...: Isn't the plan to go off the fiscal cliff and then pass a tax cut for the middle class (with the Dems getting credit for it)?

That was always in the "fiscal cliff" scheme. The GOP got played, but why were they so dumb?

The only question is where they'll draw the line for "middle class." Think Obama will stick to the $250,000 figure he kept using in the campaign?; 12/27/12, 5:45 PM
Dante said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/27/12, 5:49 PM
Dante said...: How much will the cost of a loaf of bread increase? If it were just the taxes, that would be one thing. But somehow, these increases have a way of working their way into the food chain.; 12/27/12, 5:50 PM
Tim said...: "That was always in the "fiscal cliff" scheme. The GOP got played, but why were they so dumb?

The only question is where they'll draw the line for "middle class." Think Obama will stick to the $250,000 figure he kept using in the campaign?"

They didn't get "played" as much as they didn't have position to out-play the media and the president.

There was no package the House could send the president that would also pass the Senate that would embody any meaningful Republican policies, i.e., there was no compromising with the Democrats.; 12/27/12, 5:50 PM
Tim said...: If the Republicans got "played," what is the oh-so-obvious proposal they could have sent the president that the president and Harry Reid couldn't possibly turn down?

It's easy to say someone got played when they had an obvious solution to avoid being played, so what is that obvious solution?

House Republicans are outnumbered three to one: Media, president, Senate Democrats.; 12/27/12, 5:53 PM
Dante said...: That was always in the "fiscal cliff" scheme. The GOP got played, but why were they so dumb?

I don't see how the current tax code is defensible. I also don't know why Republicans would want to defend it, except for framing communities.

The wealthy mainly live in true blue states anyway, so what value is there to Republicans to hold the line on taxing the rich?

And insofar as the taxes go, isn't this where we were under Bill Clinton? What's not to like? It's a Democrat's wet dream.; 12/27/12, 5:53 PM
Titus said...: I am ready for the fiscal cliff.

Buckle up.

For those who don't work, like Needy, this must be child's play.

When will Needy actually work, instead of videotape protests?

Get a fricking job Needy.; 12/27/12, 5:55 PM
Tim said...: "I don't see how the current tax code is defensible. I also don't know why Republicans would want to defend it, except for framing communities.

The wealthy mainly live in true blue states anyway, so what value is there to Republicans to hold the line on taxing the rich?"

The Republicans are trying to leverage the "fiscal cliff" for tax reform and spending cuts. They have a weak hand, but they aren't powerless.

The long-term problem isn't tax revenue; it's spending.

So yes, taxes are going to go up - one way or another - but unless one believes the Republicans should sign off on a 1/10th solution of tax increases on the "rich" while Obama adds $1 trillion/year to the national debt, there is a better deal out there.

And, given the rampant idiocy in the electorate these days, it's probably better for the Republicans to take the hit now, before the new Congress is even sworn in, for a better deal they can tout in a mere 20 months.; 12/27/12, 6:02 PM
Titus said...: Needy, who doesnt work and Althouse who works for the government (one class a year at full pay) are so takers.

Althouse, you receive really poor reviews from your students too (I know totally libtards) but how do the two of you become some teabag? You are so the altternate of teabag. And Needy even votes for the fag haters! Althouse must be so proud of her fag hater hubby. You know Ron Johnson is a big fag hater-contrats Needy and Althouse for your votes for him.; 12/27/12, 6:03 PM
Lem Vibe Bandit said...: There is an article that says if you die on January it will cost over a million dollars in the death tax.

A flock of millionaires were turned away and were told that the death panels promised by Obamacare have not been implemented yet.

They had to seek other means of avoiding the tax.; 12/27/12, 6:05 PM
Dante said...: The long-term problem isn't tax revenue; it's spending.

I wonder if you are wealthy blue state ownership type if you like all the spending, as it increases your bottom line.

I would suppose so.

In any event, it's getting confusing who is advocating for what.; 12/27/12, 6:07 PM
Michael said...: The Republicans were/are going to be blamed regardless. I think it will be nice for the middle class to get the evil Bush Tax Cuts taken away from them by the Democrats who opposed them from the outset. The nice middle class people can then focus on the costs associated with affordable health care and all the other little taxes on the edges of their fragile economic existence. And they can like it and shut up because the government is their friend and helps them in all kinds of ways they are not grateful for.; 12/27/12, 6:08 PM
Shouting Thomas said...: That was always in the "fiscal cliff" scheme. The GOP got played, but why were they so dumb?

Correction, Althouse.

It was the electorate that got played.

Mostly women, too.

All that free stuff was just too tempting to turn down.; 12/27/12, 6:09 PM
Paul said...: And somehow the Democrat tards think this is going to help the economy. Maybe bureaucrat's economy but not anyone else's.

Well thank God for Obamacare, right?

You voted for the putz and his crew, again, so suck it up and quit whining. Gonna become one big California.; 12/27/12, 6:11 PM
Michael said...: Professor. The Dems will try and keep the threshold at 250k which is definitionally millionairesandbillionaires.; 12/27/12, 6:12 PM
Lem Vibe Bandit said...: Taxes are going to go back to the Clinton rates...

Weren't those the good old days Bill Clinton just campaigned on for Obama?

The Dems are getting what they wanted... this whole thing is a farce.; 12/27/12, 6:17 PM
Leland said...: I'm curious how many divorces (or avoidance of marriage to begin with) will occur to avoid house hold income topping $250,000. "Living in sin" will raise that cap up to $400,000, while avoiding other financial liabilities.; 12/27/12, 6:25 PM
I Have Misplaced My Pants said...: Wondering why Meadhouse delete that Mary woman but Titus is A-OK.; 12/27/12, 6:27 PM
Shouting Thomas said...: There must be two Titus-es out there!

Or, maybe a split personality.

Once again, the insistence that opposition to the leftist gay activist agenda is proof of personal animosity toward gays.

That's the usual tactic.

The inclusion of that tactic in this thread is an attempt to link the Democratic tax hikes and the leftist gay activist agenda. What's the link?; 12/27/12, 6:32 PM
chickelit said...: Titus said...
And Needy even votes for the fag haters!

Titus is a hag-fater. He sentenced some poor woman to a fate spinsterhood by marrying a man.; 12/27/12, 6:33 PM
gadfly said...: If we did not know better, we would think that a President's duty always consists of dictating negotiations that are normally left to the opposing sides inside the House chamber.

Even when Obama was a member of some legislature, he never did the dirty work of actually composing the bill being considered.

Hell's Bells, separation of powers is violated everyday in every way when the narcissistic one decides to push his weird agenda. This is not about America, this is about Obama.

We need a Speaker who will ignore and reject any and all negotiations conducted outside the House chamber.; 12/27/12, 6:34 PM
Sydney said...: My accountant tells me my taxes will go up by $8,000 next year. Is Spam very expensive? Maybe I'll have to make do with plain Ramen noodles for every meal.; 12/27/12, 6:35 PM
Shouting Thomas said...: Is Spam very expensive?

Spam is considered a delicacy in Hawaii!

I've seen several Food Channel shows that confirm this.; 12/27/12, 6:37 PM
chickelit said...: @Titus: Did you vote for Obama? I know you're a Sullivanist in your heart of hearts.; 12/27/12, 6:39 PM
Chip S. said...: Clothing designer Peter Opie, of Canary Wharf Clothier, made about $2 million this year — and would see his tax bill spike by a staggering $100,000.

...said Opie. “You work your butt off and you end up with next to nothing.”

Amazing. A virtual lock to be an Obama voter and he sounds like the worst caricature of a Republican fat cat.; 12/27/12, 6:48 PM
edutcher said...: All those fake people who voted for Zero will be so bummed.

Ann Althouse said...

Isn't the plan to go off the fiscal cliff and then pass a tax cut for the middle class (with the Dems getting credit for it)?

Remember, Willie always promised a middle class tax cut, but never delivered. I think Choom wants us to go over as another means of spreading the wealth around.

Mommy the commie would be so thrilled.

That was always in the "fiscal cliff" scheme. The GOP got played, but why were they so dumb?

Did they, or was there no intention to do a deal ever?

Barry can't get one through by himself and neither can Dingy Harry. If the House leadership changes hands in January, the demos could be in for a sad awakening.

The only question is where they'll draw the line for "middle class." Think Obama will stick to the $250,000 figure he kept using in the campaign?

I remember a line that went around in '08, supposedly among black schoolkids, going, "He's gonna legalize pot, give us all a whole bunch of money ,and get even with white people".

I think the definition of middle class is going to hit a new high in low.; 12/27/12, 6:51 PM
Bob said...: The Bush tax cuts were evil until this year. Now, just some of the cuts are bad. Who knew?

Of course the AMT "fix" expires too. You know, the one that "fixes" the last attempt to make the rich bastards pay but, oops, hits millions of the middle class.; 12/27/12, 6:56 PM
Bob said...: The Bush tax cuts were evil until this year. Now, just some of the cuts are bad. Who knew?

Of course the AMT "fix" expires too. You know, the one that "fixes" the last attempt to make the rich bastards pay but, oops, hits millions of the middle class.; 12/27/12, 6:57 PM
SteveR said...: Not matter what happens many people (see Nov 6, 2012) will blame republicans and the media will be there to confirm that view. Its actually funny more than sad. If Nancy Pelosi was still Speaker and everything else the same, the debt would be worse, the deficits would be even larger, taxes would have already gone up and the economy as bad if not worse. But its George Bush's fault.; 12/27/12, 6:58 PM
Aridog said...: Tim said ...

It's easy to say someone got played when they had an obvious solution to avoid being played, ...

That obvious solution expired at approximately 2000 hours 06 Nov 2012. The Republicans lost....and there is no other play that mattered.; 12/27/12, 6:59 PM
jr565 said...: sn't the plan to go off the fiscal cliff and then pass a tax cut for the middle class (with the Dems getting credit for it)?

THe problem with this is, don't any tax bills come out of the house of representatives?
So then why couldn't republicans simply reintroduce the bush tax cuts for everyone?; 12/27/12, 7:01 PM
Big Mike said...: The only question is where they'll draw the line for "middle class." Think Obama will stick to the $250,000 figure he kept using in the campaign?

No.

But the way I see it, the young women who voted so strongly for Obama figured that as long as contraception is free plus abortion is guaranteed and treatment for STDs is covered under Obamacare, they can always make a little extra money no matter how bad the economy is.; 12/27/12, 7:11 PM
Dante said...: I'm curious how many divorces (or avoidance of marriage to begin with) will occur to avoid house hold income topping $250,000. "Living in sin" will raise that cap up to $400,000, while avoiding other financial liabilities.

It's illegal to divorce for the purposes of lowering ones taxes.; 12/27/12, 7:14 PM
Phil 314 said...: “What am I supposed to do, work harder?” Hagon said. “I don’t want to find myself in front of my store dead with a heart attack!”

Or your government could spent less.

But look on the bright side, that last hour of your life in the ER will be paid for.; 12/27/12, 7:14 PM
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...: Obama doesn't give a shit. He wants the whole thing to collapse. More government dependents.; 12/27/12, 7:23 PM
Chip S. said...: So then why couldn't republicans simply reintroduce the bush tax cuts for everyone?

Taxes are currently covering about 70% of federal spending. The deficit is now an incredible 7% of gdp.
Revenue has got to go up; the only question is how to do it. The political key is explaining clearly why Obama's "plan" is a joke.

The best move by the Republicans would be to vote to enact the Romney plan for limiting deductions, explaining how that would raise the share of taxes paid by the "rich". They could even raise the top rate by a small amount as a token move. At the same time, eliminate all the discretionary spending being wasted as "stimulus".

That should cut the deficit by enough to appease the debt hawks temporarily. Then the Senate's only option would be to send it to Obama or take us over the cliff.

Obama would probably take the Repubs' deal, figuring it would make it easier to blame them fully for the next recession.

The great unknown is when the debt becomes so large that we go over a different--and much, much worse--cliff.; 12/27/12, 7:24 PM
Sydney said...: “What am I supposed to do, work harder?” Hagon said. “I don’t want to find myself in front of my store dead with a heart attack!”

The problem is, if you work harder, they just take more of it. Then you would have worked yourself to death for nothing.; 12/27/12, 7:33 PM
chickelit said...: Big Mike said...

But the way I see it, the young women who voted so strongly for Obama figured that as long as contraception is free plus abortion is guaranteed and treatment for STDs is covered under Obamacare, they can always make a little extra money no matter how bad the economy is.

A falling tide lifts all skirts?; 12/27/12, 7:40 PM
Charlie Currie said...: Wait...I thought the Bush tax cuts were only for the rich. You mean all those people who voted for Obama are going to have their taxes increased to pay for all the free stuff he's promised everyone.

Funny thing about free government stuff - it's really expensive when it comes time to pay for it.

LOL HaHaHaHaHaHa LOL

Cheers; 12/27/12, 7:43 PM
Methadras said...: When are you leftards and democrats ever, ever, ever going to learn that your party is a menace to this country, it's economy, and to its citizens? Barack Obama, does not care one iota if this countries economy goes into the tank because he knows it will increase his voter base and help the democrat party eviscerate the GOP into obsolescence. I've heard how that because he was re-elected that it was a rejection of conservative values. I say this is not true considering that for 60 years, leftist ideological indoctrination and inculcation in our public schools and university systems have led us to this point. Coupled with the massive expansion of entitlements and the welfare culture amongst democrat whites and minorities, what we have now is the low hanging dumbed down child-like thinking voter who sees someone like Obama and thinks they can keep the gravy train going.

Obama knows his demographic well and so do the democrats. He/They have been savoring this for decades and now it's here for them, to finally see America get its just deserts in putting it on the downward sliding path of a waning nation in the name of sociopolitical-economic justice. They know this will entrench their power base for decades to come. It used to be that independents decided American electoral politics, not so anymore. Now it is the moron voter that can and will continually vote for their own special entitlement interests into infinity. Wasn't it Lyndon Johnson that said, “I’ll have those niggers voting Democratic for the next 200 years."? Guess what.

Conservative principals and ideology didn't lose, but rather there were more idiot voters that came out for Obama while many GOP'ers stayed home because they simply did not like Romney for whatever reason. Popularity trumped the best interests of the country. This notion that somehow being a liberal or a leftist proves that republican/conservative ideas are outdated couldn't be further from the truth. They have proven themselves to work, not just in this country, but those economic principals work in other countries as well. Obama wants this, make no mistake and it looks like he is going to get his wish. God help us all.; 12/27/12, 7:45 PM
Hagar said...: @Dante,

and in D.C. it is illegal to have 30 round magazine in your possession.; 12/27/12, 8:01 PM
Carol said...: Huh, those tax charts start at 50k. Guess the cliff will have no effect on us chump-changers in flyover.

Party on.; 12/27/12, 8:06 PM
Hagar said...: But TurboTax Timmy says they will just not collect the additional taxes from people's paychecks and just double-dare the Republicans to let the wage earners face a lump sum payment at the end of the year instead of a refund.

I think this scheme is probably also illegal, but what the heck; why not!

Then I hear now that the farm bill is somehow tied up in this, and the price of milk in the stores will go up to 7-8 dollars/gallon, because the way the milk prices are figured will legally have to go back to the methods of the 1949 farm bill, and we must follow the law rigorously; right?

Add in the couple of thousand new regulations already issued for the AHCA, half of which probably conflict with each other in some way, and I think this administration is going to have a world more troubles than they are competent to cope with.
And that is just those of its own making.

Whe the rest of the world chimes in, we are toast!; 12/27/12, 8:12 PM
Dear corrupt left, go F yourselves said...: Michael said..
"I think it will be nice for the middle class to get the evil Bush Tax Cuts taken away from them by the Democrats who opposed them from the outset."

I'm hoping at least some the idiots who voted for Obama will feel some pain.; 12/27/12, 8:15 PM
Hagar said...: No one, but no one, has any idea what the cumulative effects and costs of all this are going to come out as.; 12/27/12, 8:18 PM
chickelit said...: Can anyone think of another reason for registering all guns besides children's safety?; 12/27/12, 8:22 PM
Ann Althouse said...: I hope no one is drunk-commenting. Or drug-commenting. That could screw up your brand.; 12/27/12, 8:25 PM
machine said...: Bitter much?; 12/27/12, 8:26 PM
Aridog said...: AprilApple said ...

I'm hoping at least some the idiots who voted for Obama will feel some pain.

Those who have jobs and work for a living will feel some pain...more pain that they imagine. To the Cliff!! Tally Ho!! [Forward!]; 12/27/12, 8:40 PM
Levi Starks said...: No matter what they do, it will be nothing more than rearranging deck chairs. Here's why:
Despite claims of reduced unemployment, the actual number of people who are actually "employed" continues to drop.
What happens to the newly "not looking for work?"
Lets group them:
1) unemployment benefits have expired, they have stopped looking for work (or are being paid under the table) in either case- no longer paying taxes, probably collecting the modern equivalent of food stamps.
2) have joined the ranks of the SSI disabled, drawing monthly benefits for the rest of their lives, and probably food stamps.
3) have actually reached retirement age and are drawing the benefits earned during a lifetime of work.
As the number of those working vs not working continues to head in the wrong direction, and government sees as its roll to provide for the non workers, it has only 2 choices either loan money from itself (Fed Res.) to itself (Treasury), or increase taxes.
Choice 1 steals from our future,
Choice 2 steals from the present.
Either way we're screwed.; 12/27/12, 8:56 PM
Sam L. said...: Oh, come on, folks; it will be GOOD for us! The Big Guy hisownself says so. Would he lie?; 12/27/12, 8:57 PM
sakredkow said...: But its George Bush's fault.

Not Bush's fault. He will be remembered as one of the last sane Republicans.; 12/27/12, 9:00 PM
Pastafarian said...: Althouse: "I hope no one is drunk-commenting..."

Are you saying that this is frowned-upon here? Oopsie.

Re the cost of the cliff: If my small business has a year like it did this past year, the higher rates will cost us an additional $25,000. And by "us", I mean the corporation.

In other words, it's going to cost someone their job. Someone who probably can't afford to lose that job, who makes $12 an hour.

That should make you feel good about yourself, Titus.; 12/27/12, 9:03 PM
bagoh20 said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/27/12, 9:04 PM
bagoh20 said...: "The GOP got played, but why were they so dumb?"

I don't think they are the ones who got played, nor are they the fools, since they will all live well for the years they have left on this earth. The people you are thinking of are the ones who are gonna pay this bill. Hint: It ain't getting paid off soon.

"I hope no one is drunk-commenting. Or drug-commenting. That could screw up your brand."

This from someone who thought voting for Obama and creating this mess was gonna be good for the country because the Democrats would then be held responsible for their policies. That's hilarious! You must have learned that in a university.

Yet her brand stays strong. Like somebody else who gets it so wrong, but lives it up on popularity anyway, long after the folly is obvious.

I don't know what drug you were on in 2008, but there clearly is no negative correlation between being delirious and the popularity of one's brand. "Winning!"; 12/27/12, 9:06 PM
bagoh20 said...: I just spent the last few weeks negotiating and working out the details of our company's health care plans for next year and planning for the effects of the ACA in 2014. People not involved at this level of detail have no idea how totally fucked up the thing is. It makes no sense on a multitude of levels and has a hundred ways it screws people over, and some people really bad. Most everything you were promised in the selling stages turns out to be a complete lie. Costs are gonna soar, and you will probably forget what your doctor looks like, let alone keeping the insurance and the doctor you have.

Talk about getting played? The only people who will not be in trouble are gonna be the very rich, but everyone will be worse off, even those who didn't have insurance. They will now have insurance, but have to pay for it, it will be useless, and it will take longer to get treatment than the the emergency room did. A total clusterfuck of incompetence, layered with lies told right to your face, and you suckers rewarded them for it. Tell us some more how you won.; 12/27/12, 9:18 PM
SteveR said...: Not Bush's fault

OK I'll play..

Who's fault is it???; 12/27/12, 9:19 PM
Paul said...: Tell you what is going to happen when the tax rates go up.

Two words.... UNDERGROUND ECONOMY.

Yes the economy will go Galt.; 12/27/12, 9:21 PM
Hagar said...: I think Obama may well be thinking in line with "critical race theory" that the rich, white people have just been hogging an inexhaustible cornucopia of goodies for themselves, so that anything he does to wreck the existing system(s) will just result in a more equitable division of the good life and have none, or only minor drawbacks.

I am not at all sure that he is not all for "going over the fiscal cliff," etc.

You surely have noted that whenever he goes off script on economic matters, he sounds like a high school sophomore?; 12/27/12, 9:23 PM
John said...: As a nation we went over the cliff long ago... now, we see the ground rising up to greet us. It is not the fall that kills... it is the sudden stop.; 12/27/12, 9:30 PM
purplepenquin said...: My accountant tells me my taxes will go up by $8,000 next year. Is Spam very expensive? Maybe I'll have to make do with plain Ramen noodles for every meal.

Pulling in over $200k a year and you're planning on eating Ramen&Spam?!

I don't mean to be mean, but you might wanna start listening to this guy. He's done a lot of good for folks in your situation.; 12/27/12, 9:39 PM
Hagar said...: and I don't think he is much interested on striking any bargain - grand or petit - with John Boehner.
I think he is more bent on breaking the Republican Party and basically ruling by decree with a compliant Democrat Party and the MSM as a back-up chorus.; 12/27/12, 9:41 PM
Sydney said...: Purple Penguin Guy,
I don't make over $200,000 a year. I make far less than that. That's the point of the fiscal cliff. The tax credits that are going to expire are going to hit people who make less than that. Hope you get hit, too, buddy.; 12/27/12, 9:45 PM
Rusty said...: Told ya.; 12/27/12, 10:01 PM
purplepenquin said...: Sydney dude

I came to the figure of $200k based on the chart provided. Either the Post or your accountant got it wrong.

Either way, if you're making even $150k or $100k or however much ya gotta make in order for your taxes to increase by $8,000 due to these cuts lapsing and you're still eating like a couch-crasher then you should check out Dave Ramsey, for real. That first link is kinda cluttered and confusing...this one tells who he is and what he does.; 12/27/12, 10:06 PM
Shouting Thomas said...: By the bye, I wouldn't want people to think that I'm confident that a Romney victory in 2012 would have produced a much better result.

The failure of the Republican Party to effectively oppose illegal immigration and the sexual and racial and quota systems is, in many ways, just as bad for my self-interest as the machinations of the Democrats.

And, the Republicans and Democrats were co-conspirators in the subprime mortgage scam.

So, no, I didn't see Romney and the Republican Party as potential saviors.

There is a bad moon on the rise. That's true no matter who wins.; 12/27/12, 10:08 PM
CWJ said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/27/12, 10:37 PM
cubanbob said...: If weepy wants to avoid being played, let the cliff happen, let the debt ceiling happen then tell Zero and Reid to go fuck themselves and tell them this is the only budget that we will pass. When those on entitlements don't get their checks, that will be a good thing. A little bit of fear will concentrate their minds to focus on reality.The reality being don't always count that the government will always be a sport for you with other people's money. Romney was right, that crowd is never go to vote republican anyway so why kowtow to them?

As for which budget to present? Clinton's last budget adjusted for population and inflation. First thing then would be pass the budget then raise the debt ceiling. Zero and Reid will fold like cheap suits when they really feel the heat. Then they will see the light.; 12/27/12, 10:40 PM
Michael The Magnificent said...: Ann Althouse said: Isn't the plan to go off the fiscal cliff and then pass a tax cut for the middle class (with the Dems getting credit for it)?

The plan is to win back control of the House two years from now. Going over the fiscal cliff, as long as more people blame Republicans than Democrats, is just a means towards that end.; 12/27/12, 11:50 PM
KCFleming said...: Voting for Obama only cost you the US Constitution, nothing more.; 12/27/12, 11:51 PM
Unknown said...: Voting for Obama only cost you the US Constitution, nothing more.

The Althouse lemmings are really quite silly and stupid creatures.; 12/28/12, 4:23 AM
rhhardin said...: It does raise revenues from the middle class, where the money is, which might suggest that all this debt that it substitutes for is also costing them, if the MSM knew enough to point it out.

Cash or credit card.; 12/28/12, 7:01 AM
Steve Koch said...: "The Althouse lemmings are really quite silly and stupid creatures."

Why comment at all if you contribute nothing to the discussion? Why shouldn't we ignore you if all you ever contribute are mindless stupid insults? Why don't you grow up and comment on the actual thread topic?

The idea that conservative commenters on the Althouse blog follow her political views like a bunch of lemmings is obviously wrong. Althouse is not conservative, she mostly votes dem. Conservatives vote for the GOP, so there is very little overlap between Althouse's political views and conservative's political views.

Btw, didn't we already address this with you when you were commenting as a different sock puppet? Why are you so slow to understand something so simple?; 12/28/12, 8:51 AM
CWJ said...: Steve Koch, because you just gave him what he wants.; 12/28/12, 8:53 AM
TosaGuy said...: One undercovered aspect of these tax hikes is how many of the 47 percent will now join the 53 percent. It will be alot since some child credits and the 10 percent bracket will go away.

Everyone should have skin in the game.

Tax cuts or hikes for all or none.; 12/28/12, 8:57 AM
Steve Koch said...: My guess is that Althouse thinks the House GOP reps got rolled because they did not vote for plan B.

My guess is that many House GOP reps voted against plan B because they did not want to antagonize conservative voters in their districts by voting for a tax increase and not pushing for bigger cuts in spending.

Probably almost all of the GOP reps also think that increasing taxes is the wrong thing to do, that the best solution is to reduce spending.

When voters start paying more taxes, some of them are going to be very unhappy and will blame the dems for the higher taxes so rejecting plan B has some political upside.

The House is, by design, far more partisan than the Senate so it is to be expected that most House members will be more partisan and less middle of the road than a typical senator.; 12/28/12, 9:11 AM
MadisonMan said...: That article would have been better if the people interviewed had volunteered for whom they voted.

I'm also curious about how much this will cost me (although I "only" make 5 figures). My property tax bill dropped $1K this year, so at least I have that.; 12/28/12, 9:15 AM
Known Unknown said...: That first link is kinda cluttered and confusing...this one tells who he is and what he does.

But it's biblically based!! ; ); 12/28/12, 9:19 AM
Rusty said...: purplepenquin said...

If you think it's not going to effect you, you're mistaken.; 12/28/12, 9:36 AM
Unknown said...: Althouse is not conservative

And most of the Althouse lemmings aren't either. So what's your point?; 12/28/12, 9:44 AM
Unknown said...: Why shouldn't we ignore you

This has to be one of the dumbest questions I've seen at Althouse.

You dumbshits read all the moronic posts from losers like edutcher, Jay, Shouting Dumbass, and too many more to mention, and yet you draw the line at my posts that mock them for their idiocy. You obviously lack the ability to think critically. Therefore I recommend that you ignore my posts.; 12/28/12, 9:49 AM
Unknown said...: Btw, didn't we already address this with you when you were commenting as a different sock puppet?

Which "different sock puppet?" Please put a name to it so I can be amused by your lunacy.; 12/28/12, 9:51 AM
Steve Koch said...: Jake,

It is a common tactic for lefties to attack blogs by hijacking threads via insulting comments. It takes no wit, knowledge, or intelligence to do this and the effect on a poorly moderated blogs can be devastating. It is obvious to me that you are simply trying to hurt the Althouse blog with your relentless, content free insults of other Althouse commenters and the blog would be much better without you.; 12/28/12, 10:26 AM
Aridog said...: Hagar said...

I think Obama may well be thinking in line with "critical race theory" that the rich, white people have just been hogging an inexhaustible cornucopia of goodies for themselves, so that anything he does to wreck the existing system(s) will just result in a more equitable division of the good life and have none, or only minor drawbacks.

I am not at all sure that he is not all for "going over the fiscal cliff," etc.

For one, I never thought for a minute that Obama didn't subscribe to critical race theory. His entire life represents for it...even the nearly bodice ripping fictions in his ghost written books. Every word he utters off prompter screams it.

He's man grown from a kid who was essentially abandoned by his natural parents fairly young. He had to struggle and connive just to become an *American* again, and Obama rather than Soetoro. He had to struggle to "be a black American" when 90% of his life was "white"...and he had no real connection to historic black America, unless his father was actually Frank Marshall Davis rather than some student from Kenya who never lived with his mother. All of that can make for a screwed up adult who has to live in fantasy because there is no reality left in him.

Part of raising my own daughter, who is of mixed race, was to instill in her a sense of pride in herself as herself and not some clique's idea of normal. I doubt anyone ever gave young Barry Soetoro any such support.

Barack Obama today is precisely who he has to be...there is no individual there there. He's a proponent of the Cloward-Piven strategy and going over the cliff fits that perfectly. Somebody else, here, said, correctly IMO, his goal now is to destroy the Republicans and take over the House in 2014, so that he and future Democrats of his ilk can *rule* as autocrats, essentially by edict.

Unless you've worked in government as some managerial level, you just can't fashion how autocracy and no budget government works...so let me illuminate it: *Rules* written as regulations do not require jurisprudence in order to find you guilty, with penalty immediate, until such time as you manage to prove your innocence...and if you can, government doesn't give back what it took as penalty. New rule: You are presumed guilty until proven innocent.

What bagoh2o has said about the real costs and take aways of Obamacare is a perfect example of the new governmental order. It is going to punish you and your employer and you must like it none-the-less. It is *designed* that way. Stand up and cheer now, since our Supreme Court's [purported Republican] Chief Justice has redefined penalty & punishment as taxes.

No budget? That means under a continuing Resolution the Executive Branch (virtually all agencies)and the Office of the President can spend 95% of the prior year's expenditures without Congressional oversight. this traps Congress into adding to the expenditure total by spot appropriations in order to deliver *the bacon* to their constituents and cronies. Total Expenditures can never decrease under such a system.

Nothing about Obama and his minions is more true than the fact he intends autocracy and says so, more or less, whenever he can.

How else could an abandoned child grow up?; 12/28/12, 10:43 AM
Peter said...: Ann Althouse said, "Think Obama will stick to the $250,000 figure he kept using in the campaign?"

There's already (effective 1/1/2013) the Obamacare surcharge of 3.8% on capital gains.
It's not as if no households with less than $250,000. own mutual funds that are required to distribute capital gains every year.

As for "Republicans being played," they held no hand to play. How else could they have played it?; 12/28/12, 10:47 AM
Aridog said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 12/28/12, 11:07 AM
Aridog said...: Another thing that this *fiscal cliff* will bring up is the efficacy of the Anti-Deficiency Act, specifically under 31 U.S.C. § 1341(a)(1)(A)....which provides essentially that government cannot spend what is not appropriated.

What *Debt Ceiling*, eh?; 12/28/12, 11:11 AM
Unknown said...: It is obvious to me that you are simply trying to hurt the Althouse blog with your relentless, content free insults of other Althouse commenters and the blog would be much better without you.

Dear Whiner,

Cry to Althouse, not to me.; 12/28/12, 12:32 PM
purplepenquin said...: Hey Rusty,

I ain't saying it will have no effect whatsoever on moi. If my neighbor is starving, of course that will affect me.

However, I wasn't living on a diet of just Spam&Noodles before the tax cuts were in effect, and I don't see that changing just because they are now expiring.; 12/29/12, 9:53 AM