Our financial adviser sends us about $6,000 a month, generated from investments. We also collect Social Security and a small pension. We have a "slush fund" of about $20,000, which allows us to make advance deposits — for housing, cruises, flights, hotels and so forth — without affecting our cash flow.Alternatively, would you do something like that but entirely within the United States?
We follow some simple strategies to keep our budget in line. Stays in more expensive locations, like Paris or London, are balanced by living in less pricey countries like Mexico, Turkey or Portugal....
October 22, 2012
Retiring and living "home free," moving from place to place in other countries.
Could you see yourself retiring like this?
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We met a couple that were doing this. They had an RV, were working at the gift shop in Death Valley, CA for the winter. Had sold everything, hiked the Appalachian Trail, traveled all over the country. They seemed extremely happy.
I think it could work as long as your health was good.
This is actually a long running fantasy for me regardless of how much money I happened to collect before retiring. With a little creativity, you could do it at some level regardless of how much wealth you have. Being a nomad does not have to be expensive.
I keep blowing it though by taking on new challenges, responsibilities and just plane stuff. You need to cure that compulsion first, I'm getting worse instead of better. I have a hard time just leaving home for a week right now.
Retired parents of friends of ours have had no home for the last 15 years. They travel around the country in an RV. They just bought a home, and are moving in later this month. That should be quite an adjustment.
I could do the RV thing for a year or so, but I like having a home base. International travel appeals to me, but not on a full time basis. Too much to see in the US, and even in the midwest.
Alternatively, would you do something like that but entirely within the United States?
I could do it, but my wife would get tired of living in cardboard boxes.
Hmmm. First, I suspect they are grandchild- free. My 70 yr old mom spends a fair amount of time as a road warrior - but splitting her time visiting kids/grandkids/nieces & nephews around the US and abroad.
Secondly, a strategy like this works so long as both are fit seniors. Living "house-free" loses a little lustre when following up with cancer treatments or caring for a spouse with Alzheimer's.
I had a patient about 1987 who had retired from a wholesale grocery business and he and his wife had lived in Crete for about five years. They didn't speak Greek but had found that no obstacle. They spent five more years in Paris. Then, as he was now 75, decided to come back to the US anticipating medical problems would soon appear. Sure enough, he had a tiny colon cancer found on routine colonoscopy (to be banned by Obamacare) and I took it out. They had lived their dream and returned in time to avoid a serious problem.
At one time, I wanted to retire to France but a divorce ended that dream.
If you were to buy a time share, use it for your one week a year, but then rent timeshars through your units timeshare rental agreement, you could probably move from spot to spot every wek in the U.S., and stay in some pretty well equipped units.
I've actually been thinking of doing that. redweek.com I think is the website I use to look for timeshare rentals.
I have an urge to see the USA. I haven't even been to the Grand Canyon yet!
I do like a home base too so I'll probably do it a week or two at a time.
I have a sister who does this. She also has a home and a 'summer' home in Hawaii. She has been wise in investments and makes a very good living. She is in her 80's now and life has been very good to her, health wise. To the poster who said, in effect, as long as your health was good was correct. I have had health issues since I reached 65 and could not do that. Also I like a 'home', I could not travel all the time. It's a pain for me to travel 250 miles. Puttering around is so much more fun that driving.
Before buying my job - and effectively cancelling my retirement - my plan was to bicycle around the U.S. and Europe and live by camping and staying in hotels. I bought the new bike and much of the other stuff needed, started dumping possessions, and riding a lot to get in shape.
Man what a difference a couple years make. I made the right decision, but my female liver keeps telling me I can have it all, and I want to believe.
Even in the US it'd be fun. There are so many great places to spend a month or two, small towns and big.
One thing I like about the article is the couple isn't carrying around all of their stuff -- all the crap people fill their houses with.
as your health was good.
That's the rub. I suspect when they're in their 80s, this won't quite be so enjoyable.
Dad always said they retired too early. One apparently can get tired of traveling.
The other thing is, you don't have to sell your home.
You could rent out your home while you do this for 1-2 years, and then have the option to continue or come back and stay at home for awhile before setting out again, or to say you've gotten the extensive travel bug out of your system.
And I think if I were to do this, I'd have a small (2 BR) condo base to return to every now and then. Have the condo someplace that doesn't have many taxes. And I'd do the US. Based on althouse's link to NoDak pictures last week, I'd spend every early September on the northern Plains.
I wonder: what are the US Tax implications of not having a permanent residence?
Yes!!
But....I would still want to have a 'home base' to return to for a few months a year. After all. Where would I put my stuff?? And, as others have mentioned once you reach an age/condition where travel is difficult, you want to have a more permanent location.
Given the world situation, I'd stick to the good old US of A, but the issue of health is the biggie.
PatCA said...
I have an urge to see the USA. I haven't even been to the Grand Canyon yet!
Go!
There aren't enough adjectives in the English language to do it justice.
el K said ,"At one time, I wanted to retire to France but a divorce ended that dream."
I know what you mean. It's always been my dream to have my wife retire to France.
No I wouldn't, but then again we're not afraid to fly!
If you are a US citizen, you have to pay federal income taxes.
There are weird things about having no permanent address in the US: keeping a valid drivers license, being registered to vote (I think you can register for Federal elections only), voting, getting mail, and taxes. Maybe you have to pay state taxes based on where your investment fund comes from?
It struck me that they are getting social security. Maybe there should be a cut-off and wealthy people shouldn't get Social security or Medicare.
Michael K just to set the record and not to spread false information: Under the Affordable Care Act, screening colonoscopies are now fully covered by Medicare and by many private insurers. Patients will still be responsible for co-insurance or some out-of-pocket costs if the colonoscopy is a diagnostic rather than screening procedure. Patients may also still be responsible for costs related to anesthesia.
hmmm my wife and I don't expect to be that "selfish" in our retirement. We want to support the community in ways we couldn't do when working but on our schedule and for our priorities. There's no way we would abandon our grandchildren by moving to a foreign country. Screw the rest of the family BS but my kids and grandkids are important to us. To each his own I guess.
I made the right decision, but my female liver keeps telling me I can have it all, and I want to believe.
Think with your brain, not with your lady-parts.
My wife and I will be doing something similar in few years. We've purchased and remodeled a 1,000 squaare foot single-story home in one of the three lowest taxed townships in northern Wisconsin. It will be our base of operations for motorcycle trips throughout the US during three seasons, and we'll decamp to Florida for a month during winter.
The cabin is within 15 minutes of a hospital and clinic, and 45 minutes of a major medical center.
Property taxes are about $1800/year.
Yes. My husband is a dozen years older than I am and I envision myself selling everything off if he passes away while I'm still middle-aged and dividing my time between our kids and rental cabins in the mountains.
" roesch/voltaire said...
Michael K just to set the record and not to spread false information: Under the Affordable Care Act, screening colonoscopies are now fully covered by Medicare and by many private insurers. Patients will still be responsible for co-insurance or some out-of-pocket costs if the colonoscopy is a diagnostic rather than screening procedure. Patients may also still be responsible for costs related to anesthesia."
Fortunately, we will not have to deal with Obamacare and the IPRB which would stop screening colonoscopies for anyone over 65. I remember when Massachusetts was going to stop elective hernia repairs for those over 65 because they were not working, or some such reason.
There is no limit to the inventiveness of the progressive mind.
As for the health issues, if they'd stayed in their big California house, they might have had to move out when the health went bad anyway and into a small place better designed for folks with mobility problems and so forth.
This way, they've already scaled back and made themselves movable. if and when they need the manageable home base in the US, they'll be able to get into much more easily. No house to sell either.
Sounds wonderful, they generate $72K a year in interest? Or more to cover taxes?
Teachers in IL get that pension.
The girlfriend and I are doing just that in about a year. Much, much cheaper to live in Costa Rica, Chile and Portugal than to stay in America as a retired couple. Plus they all have great surf. I'll hve about $6K a month and whatever she brings in as a catalouge designer. Can't flippin' wait to retire from public school teaching. i'll never have to dance to spattering and sprayed bullets again.
my lady friend and I have talked about the prospect of living abroad (and in the US as well)--given our respective incomes it is certainly in the realm of possibility. We have travelled to Hungary and Spain in the last year and both countries offer inexpensive living arrangement. We figure we can also spend three months a year living on a cruise ship. The possibilities are intriguing and we will be exploring them in more detail in a few years when she is eligible for retirement.
Before they left CA, their monthly home costs were $3600. (That seems really high to me) So freeing themselves from their house certainly helped the bottom line.
The key leap here is 'no home'. Keeping a little place somewhere doesn't count. No boats or RV's either...
This would be much more expensive if you always remained in the US. You lose any cost of living and exchange rate advantages you'd gain from certain overseas stays like Mexico.
Of course, you could do the cruise ship thing and live on the QE2 like Bea Muller
My lady friend and I travel extensive and throughout the mid south. Prices for longer term rentals are easily within reach of most budgets--Towns like Heber Springs in Arkansas (great trout fishing and gold and the 3 night a week free dances at the Cleburn County historical society.) Town like Clifton TN on the banks of the TN river.
We both have kids and grandchildren, but neither of us have tee shirts saying "worlds greatest grandparents." This is our time together.
It is easily within our financial capabilities. Makes sense to rent a flat in Vienna, Budpest, the Baltic states, and buy a stateroom on a cruise ship for three months during the winter (or summer if we are in Argentina or Chile)--I speak a smattering opf German, Italian and Spanish. Trying to learn Magaryol (hungarian) and basque was a losing proposition, but you dont really need them.
in short--go for it--sell you wordly goods, pack up what you need is three suit cases and have a great time.
Kelly said, "It struck me that they are getting social security. Maybe there should be a cut-off and wealthy people shouldn't get Social security or Medicare."
Maybe. But the politicians who created these programs intended them to last forever, and tried to make them repeal-proof. If they'd been set up as just another form of means-tested welfare they'd have far less political support.
I traveled with my girlfriend with backpacks throughout South America; it cost us roughly $1000/month for both, including cheap rooms, food, and bus transportation.
I traveled by VW camper van throughout the Southern Cone, overnighting at gas stations and in the streets of Buenos Aires, Montevideo, Asunción, Rio de Janeiro, Santiago and numerous small towns. Some towns let me stay for free at their city park, showers and bathrooms provided free, too. It cost less than $1000/month, including gas.
I've done the same throughout Europe, as well, overnighting in a VW camper in cities from Munich to Barcelona and Lisbon.
I've twice walked with a backpack along the beautiful Brazilian beaches from Maceió to Recife, paying about $15 per day for room and food for two.
Some disadvantages of Amerikan citizenship should be noted: while you are overseas, you are still liable for income taxes and Obamacare fees, even if you never return to this country. While you will still get your monthly SS benefit check, all that Medicare and Medicaid you qualify for are entirely not available.
If you do travel by RV in Amerika, you will not have to deal with African Amerikans or Hispanic Amerikans, since they never visit national parks and forests or even state parks and beaches. Except for Obama's family, which did visit Yellowstone shortly after his inauguration, and Clarence Thomas, who, together with his wife, are avid RVers!
Kate Danaher said, "Secondly, a strategy like this works so long as both are fit seniors."
Well, there's young-old-age and there's old-old age. Young-old-age is that period of life after age 65 when one still retains most of one's physical and mental capabilities. Old-old-age begins when one or more chronic illnesses permanently limit one's capabilities.
There really should be a word for young-old-age. After all, adolescence (which apparently extends to age 26 in today's USA) is socially constructed, as people in this age group used to just go to work and were expected to assume full adult responsibilities at what to us seems a shockingly young age.
And people who lived beyond age 65 were mostly used up by then, and thus already in old-old age.
They need a safe house in the USA just like most Brits, Grrmans and and Frenchies are arranging.
The area we call Lake Oconee, which is 70 miles east of Atlanta closer to Augusta, has many million dollar + homes in a secure place fill of them.
There is even a house there owned by W.
Capitalism and a world hegemon called the USA is coming back fast despite the dark destructive Obama days.
"Before they left CA, their monthly home costs were $3600. (That seems really high to me)"
That's not high in CA.
We could do this and we could see ourselves doing this. If one is already well traveled, it's not a great leap.
Health/medical issues are a concern, but that's part of the planning and location selection.
I've been places where they had to get the cats out of the operating room before surgery. Conversely, an ex-pat haven like Merida has great medical care.
There are pros and cons for maintaining a U.S. residence. I think the benefits outweigh the cost. One can see the grandkids between location changes.
If I was in a financial position to do it right now, I would.
I know a few folks who are full timers in the RV world. Roam around the US and Canada as the seasons and their desires change. Almost went that route (no pun intended) myself but it's nice to have a home base.
While you will still get your monthly SS benefit check, all that Medicare and Medicaid you qualify for are entirely not available.
If you qualify for Medicaid....you shouldn't be able to travel like that. Medicaid is for welfare/poor people. If you CAN travel then you are a welfare cheat and I want you to go to jail :-)
A good medicare supplement insurance plan will cover you for many things while traveling.
Kelly said, "It struck me that they are getting social security. Maybe there should be a cut-off and wealthy people shouldn't get Social security or Medicare."
So....because they were astute investors, saved their money, sold their home at a profit, worked hard all their lives, perhaps created a business that they sold.....AND were forced FORCED to pay into the Medicare and SS funds all of their lives......they should be robbed of the benefits of the INSURANCE plans that they were compelled to participate in?
How DARE they be successful. They MUST be punished.
If you buy life insurance and then somehow become wealthy, should your life insurance benefit be stolen from you because you were successful? How about health insurance. You pay the premiums just like everyone else, but because you were smart and made a success of your life, the policy suddenly gets changed and your deductible goes sky high and your benefits get cut?
That'll show you....you nasty person who stole the money from everyone else to be successful.
Isn't Communism great?!
You've got a lot to learn about Medicaid, DustBunnyQueen!
For starters, here in TX welfare benefits (Medicaid, foodstamps, Obamaphone) are generally available to folks who earn up to 150% of the poverty level, which for a single person is about $18000 per year and for a couple is well over $20000--about enough to spend over $1900 per month traveling together.
Furthermore, since I am a single guy, I can get full Medicaid benefits and still live and travel with my rich girlfriend, one of the very few advantages of not sucking at the gummint marital-status-benefits tit.
My brother claims to know a couple who does that. They own a trailer and travel from national park to national park, working part-time at each one. They have permission set up their trailer inside the park [their major concern], have access to park facilities, and make a little money to boot. They are both retired government employees so an adequate income and their health care costs are covered. It sounds like a nice life.
That's the plan. We loved to travel and for us the best part of being military was moving every couple of years. Now that I'm retired military, half my pension is going into 401k along with 10% of my current salary (matched by 4% by my employer). I have a house rented out and a house to live in while our youngest child (the bunso) finishes HS.
Once the bunso is gone, we'll put stuff in storage and rent out the big house while we travel. I expect we'll spend at least a year or five back in the Philippines visiting friends and family and setting up a base of operations near Aliminos (Gulf of Lingayan, South China Sea).
Health care is a concern, but we'll adapt as needed. There used to be a large number of ex-pats living in the PI and if we need first-world care, we can come back to the US as needed. Assuming we can't get robo-repaired overseas. -CP
So jimbino. You ARE an admitted welfare cheat then :-)
Your income is being subsidized by another person and you aren't reporting it. Your residency requirements, which vary from state to state, are just being used as a front in order to rip off the taxpayers in Texas.
Can you cash in your food stamps in Costa Rica too?
You have to be near a hospital at all times when you get seriously into your retirement years. Definitely over-70 even if you were a super healthy 60-something.
If they're getting 6000 a month from investments in this economy with these excessively low interest rates, that's quite a lot unless they're pulling on principal as well and betting they can run out the clock until death.
Dust Bunny, The ss system and Medicare are in obvious distress. It just seems to me that really wealthy people could do without it. We need reforms, not fake outrage.
half my pension is going into 401k along with 10% of my current salary (matched by 4% by my employer).
Only earned income can be deposited into your 401K or any other current retirement plan, not your monthly pension payments which are unearned income.
@ Sleepless.
They may be receiving a guaranteed or lifetime annuity pay out, which would be interest and principle for part of their income. The low interest rate environment today, would not affect cash flow from earlier investments. When I was an advisor in the early late 90's and early 2000's, I positioned many of my retired and soon to be retired people into high quality, long duration, non callable bonds. for example John Deere, 30 years at 7.5% pay out. Not only are these bonds way up in market value, the income stream is very nice.
And YES, I am very cranky today because it is snowing :-(
We need reforms, not fake outrage.
Oh I agree. Entirely. The system is broke and needs to be reformed.
However, I am outraged that people like jimbimo, and you too evidently, think it is ok to game the system, illegally collect benefits, collect more than you are entitled to, cheat, lie and basically steal.... while people who paid in for decades, in good faith, should be shafted.
Sorry for derailing a good thread.
DBQ, you are correct. Half my pension is going into investments through a fund manager. I use the term 401k because I'm a software and techie geek, and I am finance-voodoo stupid.
I set up mechanisms to funnel money automatically in the hope to have nest egg when I finally quit the day job, hopefully within the next 8-10 years; about the time I hit 60.
National Park Service has a program where mobile travellers (usually retirees with RVs) receive free extended camping privileges/hook-ups/etc at lesser-visited National Parks/Monuments/Rec Areas in return for uncompensated custodial/night-watchman work. At the end of three months, pack up and head off to the next pre-arranged campsite.
DustBunnyQueen,
You will have to admit that even folks with foodstamps, Medicaid and an Obamaphone are allowed to have a girlfriend, and you don't yet have to report to the Welfare Authority on the existence, height, weight, sex or income of your lovers. Or what positions you prefer. Or if and when or where you travel.
No doubt all that is Coming Soon to the USSA. Until then, I'm real into Gaming the System in a probably vain attempt to gain back a portion of all that has been stolen from me by gummint over the years. I used to work hard to contribute to the welfare of the state, but now I'm determined to contribute to the bankruptcy of the Welfare State!
"We need reforms, not fake outrage."
The only way to fairly reform Soc Sec is to take a good part of worker's "contributions" and place in individual accts.
As to reform, how is it fair, as DBQ asked, to penalize people who planned and saved for their retirement or for their kid's college tuition?
This is what we do today: Since you Mr. & Mrs. Good Foresight have a college savings plan for your kid, you are not eligible for the free and/or cheap govt grants and loans. And don't tell me I am wrong - I know a blue collar couple who saved for their only son and they got bupkus.
DustBunnyQueen,
You should be aware that successful lawsuits have been mounted against folks like you who on the Web falsely accuse others, charging that they "illegally collect benefits, collect more than [they] are entitled to, cheat, lie and basically steal."
Gaming the system is not fraudulent or illegal. That's why Gaming the System is not called Defrauding the System, just as Tax Avoidance (quite legal) is not called Tax Evasion (defined as illegal).
Gaming the system is what Romney does when he legally pays tax at a lower rate than his secretary, what a person does who takes marital or child tax-deductions, what a person does who takes spousal Medicare or Social Security benefits or who gets SSDI, never having worked a day in her life, what a person does who marries only for tax savings or divorces for the same reasons. Or a woman who has sex so that she can stick her rich lover for child-support.
OK, I put you on notice: stop libelling me with charges of fraud and theft, else I will have to sue you, and though having a JD, I will do so in forma pauperis, as I am fully entitled to do, allowing the Welfare State to finance my lawsuit and then attempt to recover the fees and expenses from you.
AJ Lynch,
Your statement that
"The only way to fairly reform Soc Sec is to take a good part of worker's 'contributions' and place in individual accts"
ignores some realities of SS, namely, that indolent spouses and minor children of SS, not to mention disabled folks, participate in SS benefits without paying an iota of the costs! What are you going to do about those free-riders?
Could you see yourself retiring like this?
Our financial adviser sends us about $6,000 a month, generated from investments. We also collect Social Security and a small pension.
No. My industry doesn't receive old-fashioned perqs like defined-benefit pensions. Also, I seriously doubt I'll receive a single Social Security check. I'll be retiring on whatever's left of my 401k and home equity. Which means there's a good chance I'll be flipping burgers when I'm 72.
Shorter jimbino when he's talking to DBQ: blah blah blah.
"OK, I put you on notice: stop libelling me with charges of fraud and theft, else I will have to sue you,..."
Hahahahaahh! You're a fool. How's that, for a non-libelous statement of truth.
DBQ, how dare you ruin the reputation of an anonymous idiot on the internet. This will ruin his ability to make the millions he does as an anonymous commenter with no profile, name or photos. He's famous for that. We thought he was just one of many, but no he is THE anonymous idiot.
DBQ, how dare you ruin the reputation of an anonymous idiot on the internet.
LOL. I know. I'm shaking in my boots. Ha ha.
On the internet, no one knows you are a dog. However it is pretty easy to spot the idiots.
Ha ha ha. Fuck you. I'll work until I can't.
1) Most people who claim/dream of doing this don't have the savings to even approach such a life.
2) People like setting down roots. Having a winter home and summer home is even difficult for many people. (Some travelers, perhaps many, especially RVers and boaters, end up essentially traveling with the same group everywhere.)
3) I've found that extended vacations tend to start our fun, but end up being very, very boring.
3a) I also find I miss the mundane things, like a specific brand of milk available only in my region.
4) I'd miss my kids and especially grandkids too much. I'm tired of the winters where I live, but even with a recent chance to relocate for a job, I found I couldn't do it.
Hey DustBunnyQueen:
Try me. Subpoena and discovery work wonders.
We're laughing at you Jim!
Hey Jimbino,
You have also, on a few occassions, eaten dead chikdren, and on many occasions have gained unlawful carnal knowkedge of farm animals.
Sue me! Sue me!
OK, I put you on notice: stop libelling me with charges of fraud and theft, else I will have to sue you, and though having a JD, I will do so in forma pauperis, as I am fully entitled to do, allowing the Welfare State to finance my lawsuit and then attempt to recover the fees and expenses from you.
OOooooo! Another keyboard commando heard from.
Imma gonna sooo yooo for being mean to me!!!
Grow up, loser.
I met some Habitat for Humanity "Care-a-Vanners" on a build last summer. They were retired folks going from site to site volunteering. It was the first time I'd heard of it but think it's pretty neat. http://www.habitat.org/rv
Getting a place off campus makes sense for so many reasons. And if you're having problem finding additional students, some grand valley housing will even help you with a roommate finder. Isn't it amazing.
grand valley housing
Roaming country free is really nice
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Well it's pretty cool, I'd love to rent apartment buenos aires and then go straight to another country and so on
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Thank you so much for this post. My dad is close to retiring and we are thinking of retirement homes in Surrey. Regarding what everyone has said we have means to pay for his retirement and he has built up plenty throughout his life. But he does want to do a bit of traveling before he finally settles down.
I have not reached an age when I will start thinking about retirement. However, I do have a few investment policies with an insurance company but I am uncertain whether or not they will suffice to support my retirement days. Thus, I have also came up with a plan to rent out my house to generate income should the need arises in the future. Or rent out a room or two for storage purposes for partial income channel.
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I think if it is within the U.S. alone, it would be more convenient, as compared to across the globe. This is because of the comfort level and familiarity you already possess in your own home country. You know the people, language and your way around. Furthermore, in case whatever happens, you can simply return home. The idea of an RV is very enticing because my family loves camping! Thus, to actually permanently stay in one and travel the country, sounds like a very good retirement plan. However, how do we ensure there is enough storage onboard without the hassle of having to offload stuff every now and then? That is the concern.
In the portable storage Gold Coast business, and even in self storage business in general, we often encounter clients who are leaving the country for a good 1 year to explore the world. They planned their 1 year way in advance – saving up money over the years, quitting their job, renting out (or even selling) their house, and the likes. These are people who have lived meagerly and within their means in order to enjoy this transient life.
Thanks for the share, I totally agree on your thoughts here.. Same in independent retirement living, you have nice point of view.
My grandmother has decided to move out of her home and into a retirement residence. This may be a good thing for her because she is having a hard time getting around her current home. I'm sure that I will see her this weekend to begin looking for a place for her to live. http://schlegelvillages.com/guelph1/village-life
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