This is a he-who-smelt-it-dealt-it argument. Or, as Stephen Colbert's persona likes to say, "I don't see race." This line of argument wants to change the subject to something, anything other than race. Hey, what about free phones?! Patterico at Patterico's Pontifications tried defending the video, saying, "The above video is hilarious. It is representative of a group of Obama voters who feel entitled to handouts from government. It does not matter what the color of the speaker is. It’s news... Conservatives should not have to shy away from such amusing examples of entitlement mentality simply because the particular proponent of that mentality happens to be black." This is intellectually dishonest, at best. We await Patterico delving into the minutiae of the Universal Service Fund. Until then, it's just "hilarious." Specifically, it's hilarious because it uses one person to portray a huge group of people in a negative way is. The point of the video -- and the reason Drudge and Limbaugh hyped it -- is to say, this is what Obama voters look like: black, poor, stupid, and after your money. The video's subject wasn't picked out because she "happens to be black," she was picked out because she is black. Lee Atwater, strategist for Ronald Reagan and George H. W. Bush, explained how this works way back in 1981 -- better to talk about cutting taxes and bussing, because it's "a hell of a lot more abstract than 'Ni***r, ni***r.'" Of course, this Internet meme isn't all that abstract.If it's insufficiently abstract, it won't work. Our conscious anti-racism filters may keep the material from reaching us. In fact, as I said in my post yesterday, what I feel happening to me emotionally — and what I'm guessing may happen to other middle-of-the-road types like me — is repulsion away from the Romney side. It's not Romney's fault, he can't control what his supporters say in their efforts to promote him, but he needs to be a more dominant figure in his own campaign. Voters need to associate him with a clear and compelling message that doesn't feel connected to this racial material coming from other sources.
September 29, 2012
"Why are you making this about race?"
Elspeth Reeve answers a question she's been asked after her "How Racist Is the Obama Phone Video?," which I linked, approvingly, yesterday.
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326 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 326 of 326Maggot&Broad wrote:
Althouse is not driven by prospective policy. Or national security issues. Or ideology. Or anything rational.
No, the top graduate of one of the most prestigious law schools in the country may decide to vote for Obama because a screeching woman wanted to be recorded urging people to vote for Obama because she believes he gave her a phone.
I'll say it. I think Althouse is a racist because she finds this video to be race baiting.
And if you think back to the last election her voting for Obama was not based on policy or national security issues or ideology. It was all surface stuff. Which candidate sounded better. Her voting is like a bird fascinated by shiny objects. You expect rationality from that?
I can't believe that in this day and age she still considers herself undecided? REALLY? Do such people actually exist?
Michael wrote:
[Our] hostess cannot distinguish between culture and skin color. There is a name for that.
You mean there used to be a word for that. Back in the day when America had no propaganda ministry the word was racist. It meant someone who held special theories about race, as in all Jews are greedy, all Chinese are inscrutable, all Japanese are workaholic drones, all blacks dine on fried chicken and watermelon. From circa 1980 until 2008 the meaning changed radically to a completely unrelated concept to mean someone who opposes the policies of the Democratic Party. Since 2008 the word refers to anyone who opposes Barack Hussein Obama.
I've known about the free cell phones for some time, they existed before Obama. I'm surprised people are calling them Obama phones or giving him credit for it.
Yeah, sure, go ahead and assume the black lady is stupid. Nobody's going to call you racist! She's so stupid, she's got a phone and has no idea where she got it.
Welfare Queen: "I got my Obama phone!"
Liberal Ninny: "I'm surprised you're call it an Obama phone. Or giving him credit for it."
Welfare Queen: "Shut up, cracker."
Boy, she's dumb. Everybody knows it's a George W. Bush phone. No, wait, it's a Ronald Reagan phone.
Reagan gets his name on an airport. Roosevelt gets his name on the dime. Obama gets his face on the free swag he's giving people in order to buy their votes.
Sure, we've had welfare a long time. You didn't build that, Obama!
He's just the top ant on the dunghill of welfare stupidity. But he's planting his flag, taking all the credit. And so I think he and his Obama Phone deserve all the credit we can give him.
It sure takes some "reality-based" vision to see Republicans as playing the race card in this campaign. To see Republicans as trying to make this election about race. Because obviously, Republicans like Limbaugh would like to make the 2012 election between Obama and Romney be about race, they want American voters to think about race, because that would help Republicans.
In Bizarro World.
And then you've got concern trolls lamenting the inveterate racism of the Republican "base." They'd vote for Republicans, if only Republicans weren't such nasty racists!
When the present-day Republican/ conservative base's two favorite politicians are probably Allan West and Mia Love.
Oh, it feels so futile and depressing to try to argue against this silliness and/or bad faith. I expect this from the usual suspects and certain quarters; not from Althouse.
Remind me-- Sandra Fluke is black, right? Because all the talk about Fluke and contraceptive "freebies" was dog-whistle racism too, right?
Sandra Fluke is black, right?
Yes, apparently, by virtue of having ladyparts.
The War on Women is racist. Romney must denouce it by promising to enforce the Sebelius Edict if elected.
Which he won't be, being so far behind in the polls and all.
"I live on the south side of Chicago (about 1.5 miles from the Obama's home, actually), and it would not be much of an exaggeration to call it a war zone. There are children and young adults being shot on a daily basis. Less than two weeks ago, a teenager was the victim of a drive-by in sight of my front window. And, yet, our host is more interested in talking about the color of their skin, and the implications of that on our collective psyche, than in electing officials who might reform the economy, the feckless police unions, and the culture of victimhood that pervades this area and countless urban centers across America. That would be real change. That would be actual healing. Althouse, come to your senses."
Yes, exactly! That situation is America's disgrace. There is no inevitability or justifiable acceptance of it. Its existence disgraces the entire country and every citizen of her. Basically, untie the knots by getting the blizzard of laws, lawyers' delight, off those people's backs. It's the myriad of compulsions that is bending them over. Blacks, like all Americans, are objects of lawfare by lawyers. They call the compulsions help. The lawmakers are helping themselves.
So an awful woman talks up how, as a minority, she is the recipient of wonderful benefits from Obama.
But whites, as "non-minorities," promote her own words (without any comment regarding her race) and they are racist?
Althouse cannot allow herself to vote for Romney. Like Andrew Sullivan, she will ultimately find the Republicans too...something for her vote. It won't matter what and this video will do fine.
Paddy O,
There definitely are racists in the world, and racism is still a huge issue. The trouble is that a lot of real racists hate that element in themselves and so become activists against racism--yet because it is such a driving element of their own worldview they insist everyone has a problem with it.
James Taranto said it a couple of weeks back: The whole point of a dog whistle is that if you can hear it, you're the dog.
And then you've got concern trolls lamenting the inveterate racism of the Republican "base." They'd vote for Republicans, if only Republicans weren't such nasty racists!
Very clever, Yashu.
Absolutely, R's care more about cheap labor, as evidenced by allowing millions of illegals to come to this country, not pushing e-verify, when they had the chance.
yashu wrote:
Remind me-- Sandra Fluke is black, right? Because all the talk about Fluke and contraceptive "freebies" was dog-whistle racism too, right?
Nah, that was dog whistle sexism and the war on women. don't you know?
The only way you couldn't be race baiting or sex baiting would be if the idiot you had in a video was a white male apparently. Dumb crackers in videos are perfectly acceptable.
Dante illustrates yashu's point nicely.
Republicans are racists for letting people enter the country illegally. They're also racists for wanting to stop people from entering the country illegally.
Equality is the radical notion that minorities are human beings... not fragile things in need of "protection".
http://althouse.blogspot.com/2012/09/sarah-palin-says-romney-should-be-very.html
In fact, as I said in my post yesterday, what I feel happening to me emotionally — and what I'm guessing may happen to other middle-of-the-road types like me — is repulsion away from the Romney side.
So this is the issue you're undecided mind will use to justify another vote for Obama? Because you "feel" that Romney supporters are using racist tactics? Wow- the Dem leaders really know their base, and what will work on them. They have you hooked alright.
Dems supporters and the media have used the race card since day one to marginalize and delegitimize Obama critics-- why doesn't that repel you?
Whatever. Have fun stirring up shit. I'm not going to bother to read these race threads. Political "debates" about race are predictable and pointless. And it's been my experience that the only people for whom race is a major focus - outside of the lefties who use it as a tool against Obama supporters- are the above 55 age cohort. The rest of us have "moved on".
If there is some "dog-whistle" race message being sent out by the video of the black woman with the Obama phone, the only ones responding to it are the older folks like you Ann, who are race-obsessed.
Is the emotional consideration like yours, Professor, not a lazy and bigoted reaction, generalizing guilt to Romney and his supporters because of public reactions of a few to an interview? You use against Romney and his supporters the same prejudicial mechanisms that you claim evidence racism in citations of the Obama cell phone video.
If that flimsy appeal to emotion decides a vote and disregards all else that is Obama, the threats to speech and religious liberties, the disastrous foreign policies, the failed economic policies, the corporate cronyism...if that decides the vote and the election, then we no longer deserve a Republic.
We cannot afford all this spending. It will crush the poor in the end - will crush most of us in the end. And the end is not too far away. Most of us will live to see it.
But Ann Althouse is worried that we're being mean to the nice lady with the cell phone.
Here, for Althouse's perusal is an example of some dumb rednecks being critical of Obama:
The very heading of the link is "Wait Until you hear how dumb these poor Obama hating Mississippi Conservatives sound".
http://dimewars.com/Video/SMH------Wait-Until-You-Hear-How-Dumb-These-Poor-Obama-Hating-Mississippi-Conservatives-Sound.aspx?bcmediaid=b1219db1-b994-4d8c-8b53-49d8a403c567
Now, is that white race baiting, or poitning out the stupidity of some people in Mississippi who happen to be white? I mean, must all of the people they find have that really stupid redneck accent? Is that not playing to the white stereotype of the dumb redneck? why is that acceptable but showing a video of a dumb black person somehow racist? Why is mocking dumb whites somehow ok, but mocking dumb blacks somehow racism by default.
The Caveman.
A caveman is upset and won't even eat a meal offered to repair a perceived insult. The insult/bigotry/prejudice: "So easy a caveman can do it".
And what will you be eating caveman? One order's a sumptuous meal, and enjoys it, while the other caveman replies that he "isn't hungry".
During the series of commercials begun by a remark made unconsciously about the smarts of cavemen, one "sells out" and enjoys his fame, while the other continues to reject the "apology".
Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton exposed and explained!!
How Althouse has missed that blatant "racist" commercial is a fact of her lack of racial awareness.
Or, how's that cute TaxMonkey doing? Comes in the mail(income tax notice) by a government agency(USPS), and out pops a adorable black monkey. He's decked out in a suit and smiles at you and destroys your house. He's still cute and adorable while he sticks his tongue out, mocking your inability to stop his destruction of your possesions.
Have we heard how Meade views the modern day welfare queen on youtube?
A good professor asks uncomfortable questions and in doing so, forces her students to think about things they'd rather not think about, perhaps even about themselves.
Given the response to Althouse's recent postings, it is obvious she has been performing as a good professor to her students on this blog. Particularly the racist ones. Carry on!
Ive been waiting for ms. Althouse to drop the other shoe for a while.
The thud was quite clear.
She foreshadowed it so well she should write teenage horror flicks.
My hope was that Ann, in her stated search for honesty or truth or whatever ideal it is that she purports to achieve, would have faced down her own demons by this stage in her life.
Clearly she hasn't.
She hears a disembodied voice repeated and HER thoughts turn more deeply to the race of that person? What could be the genesis of that? Suppressed or latent racism? Of course she must not acknowledge those innermost feelings and deal with them.
Why not?
Where is the motivation? Self-awareness can be painful...and Ann's social/professional environment offers no rewards for her if she ever publicly endorses Romney. Faculty meet n' greets become a bit awkward you know.
The Obama campaign has been hoping that they could reframe the debate this way.
Sad that Ann fell for it. I fear for America more than ever now.
I did not expect her to be so intellectually dishonest about it though. I can see why she teaches instead of, for example, litigates. Some old aphorisms contain huge truths.
Her ego must be very relieved that she can rationalize her vote for Obama now. Her psyche has found its own plausible deniability excuse.
How very sad.
A good professor asks uncomfortable questions and in doing so, forces her students to think about things they'd rather not think about, perhaps even about themselves.
But Althouse is not our professor. She is our peer, and hopefully she is also perfectly capable of thinking things about herself she'd rather not think about.
How luxurious it would be to go through life imagining you are always the one doing the teaching!
Back to the video I posted of the white redneck crackers from Mississippi.
Lets go to the paragraphs quoting the woma suggesting that video is racial.
Specifically, it's hilarious because it uses one person to portray a huge group of people in a negative way is. The point of the video -- and the reason Drudge and Limbaugh hyped it -- is to say, this is what Obama voters look like: black, poor, stupid, and after your money.
Isn't the point of the video I linked to that this is what those who aren't voting for Obama look like - white, poor, stupid and RACIST?.
Would Althouse point to my video and say it was an example of playing the race card. Would Elspeth Reeve?
THese voters were fair game, their ideas worthy of ridicule. But somehow a particularly inarticulate person who got a free phone, getting paid 11 dollars an hour to follow Romney around as a democratic op and agitator, why to even use her likeness in any way, and all of a sudden there's RACISM afoot.
Please explain why one is racist and one is simply pointing out dumb crackers. Can we not point out people who are similarly dumb who may not be crackers? or is taht just too racist.
Andy R.,
Should we hold it against the Republican Party because they are explicitly trying to do this. The Republican Party is intentionally trying to increase white racial resentment to help them electorally.
Is it? Rush Limbaugh is not the Republican Party; an audio clip is not identifiable as belonging to a person of any particular race (unless you have the racial equivalent of gaydar); and should someone happen on the Drudge video (which I wouldn't have had Ann not linked it, fwiw), what the hell is racist about letting a citizen say what she wants to say? You really think we ought not to allow minority citizens to say their piece if we think what their saying is monumentally stupid? That we have a duty to protect people from inadvertently setting themselves up as representatives of their "race" for people like Ann Althouse?
Anyone who can vote for Obama after Benghazigate is putting something very secondary to First Amendment rights and national security. But hey--it's still a free country, more or less.
Man, you guys are sorry:
You're about to lose the biggest election of our lifetimes because you're too stubborn to change according to the landscape.
I've railed about Obama for four years, and was ready to vote for a dog to unseat him - you know this - but then you chose Romney and BAM!
I changed, because you left me no choice.
Yesterday, I was going to explain how to get Romney out of this mess, but then I took one look over here and thought, "What's the point? These guys don't just WANT to go down with the ship - they demand to steer!" I mean, you're all over Ann for this - stupid assed race? - when she told you "What Is Beautiful And Wonderful About Human Life Is Full Of Inaccuracies And Distortions"?
Figure it out, guys - that "Beautiful And Wonderful" lady is fucking with you - and everybody else is, too.
I told you to tell the truth, demand it in return, and make things right - so you cynically laughed at me.
Crack wants to start a cult. Crack's a bigot. Crack's gone over the deep end.
And you're going to lose. Not me - I told you:
Between Ann's Obama vote on one side, and your Romney idiocy on the other, my hands are clean - that's how the "crazy man" rolls.
There's more than a month until the election - that's a lifetime in politics.
If I were you guys, I'd start doing some serious soul-searching about what you're going to do differently between then and now, because what you've been doing ain't working.
Not for me anyway.
And when you've lost The Crack Emcee,...well, you know.
I'll be willing to help, whenever you come back to your "We The People" senses again, and start deciding (whether you understand my gig or not) TMR ain't the enemy,..."
I wonder if anyone here remembers the uproar among Conservatives when Alexis Pelosi's video about southern whites were portrayed as racists based on a the utterances of a few southern (and one certifiably insane or drunk) people. The cry was this is unfair, these are the thoughts of just a few people, this is not representative of the majority. Point taken. It is unfair to taint a whole race based on the words of a few. What is gained by showing it. We know that there are some out and out racists in the South. We are looking at some people's stereotype of Southern Whites. It is being proven by a small number of people saying what some liberals think southern whites actually are thinking. Their rantings adds nothing to the political dialogue we are having. Let's move forward.
So now I ask what is to be gained by showing over and over the utterance of one ignorant black woman. She is, after all, just one woman. She is not representative black people as a whole (Mia Love, Thomas Sowell, Herman Cain to name a few). She is living up to a stereotype that some conservatives have of blacks. She becomes the problem. But more of a problem than say giving billions of dollars to banks and car manufacturer's? What is the bigger problem?
Finally, I am not sure the people jumping on Althouse are getting the point. The True Believers are going to vote for Romney no matter what he says and the same goes for Obama's supporters. What she is trying to point out is that people who haven't honestly decided how to vote may need a different approach more appealing to this type of voter.
instead of persuading Althouse, they are basically calling her a stupid, emotional woman who misses the more important point that Obama is destroying our country. Hmm, I don't know about you but I have never been persuaded to change my opinion by insults.
Also, lets put an end to Obama single handedly is destroying the country. It isn't an argument. It is hysteria. I have been told Obama was going to make me a Muslim, that Obama wasn't born in Hawaii, that Obama is a Socialist (which is actually contradictory to him being a Muslim but never mind), that Obama is the son of a Communist and that his grandfather conspired to cover his communist heritage up by making Obama's father marry his pregnant daughter. There have been so many wild and silly rumors pursed at the expense of legitimate Obama failings that the whole Conservative movement has been undermined.
Finally, just because people vote for Obama doesn't mean they are supporting for Obama or are drinking the Koolaid. I know people who are voting for Obama because they think the Republicans have gone bat shit crazy and don't trust them. That doesn't mean they trust Obama, it just means the Republicans scare me more.
Good luck trying to convince Althouse. I think if you call her stupid 567 times, she might finally get the point. But don't hold back, call her stupid a thousand times for good measure.
Man, is this topic overworked yet?
Hey guess what, neither Rush Limbaugh, nor Ann Althouse, speaks for anyone but themselves. Period.
Somebody said here that this was the closest thing to "Oh, look, a SQUIRREL" they'd seen in a while.
That is either the thread winner or "Crack's" BWA HA HA HA, one or the other.
Everybody said "Howdy" to CouponMom, but Nobody answered her question in her first comment? It was germane to the topic...everybody miss it or something? We say a word without grasping its real meaning, utter appropriate "tut-tut's"...and feel good? Hogwash.
Look!
SQUIRREL!
Gotta say, though, Meade’s love for Althouse is the stuff of dreams. A lady’s dreams, that is. We all want a man to stick by us, no matter what.
America's Politico .... I realize you are just an "act", like the video of "Glozell" I posted on the other thread, without response vis a vis racism. Is Glozell racist? "He black, he black he black!! Ah Haaaaa." Oh, my....
HoweverYou could do those of us who lived in and participated in the civil rights movements of the 1960's a favor by NOT frigging referring to your silly re-election club as "CORE."
Real people made real sacrifices in CORE, rides in the dark, sitting in at lunch counters, and just because it has lost cachet today, ran off the rails in the 1970's with black nationalism etc., doesn't give you the right to appropriate the famous name. Roy Innis is still there...call him up and ask him what he thinks.
But mainly, your punk arsed self, AP, has never ever experienced anything like the experience of CORE or the Southern Christian Leadership Conference.
So stop the mockery.
THis woman got paid $11 an hour to shill for Obama. Sorry if she's so inarticulate. But the fact that she's a paid op should necessarily allow for someone to question her, mock her, and disagree with her without necessarily being branded a racist. The reporter didn't put words in her mouth.
Sometimes when something comes out of someones mouth it's so breathtakingly stupid or profound that it becomes a meme all by itself or becomes emblematic of what either candidate is professing as ideology.
The woman who after Obama won thought it meant that Obama was going to buy her a house was another example. That woman though wasn't being paid to protest. and her statements were still stupid enough to warrant the news highlighting them. And that too was not a racial attack.
My inner racist can't resist.....is it too late to vote for the white guy?
Watch it all, its only 1:26 minutes long, pay attention at 0:55 onward...
Now, is this racist? If not, why not?
Or is it comedy mocking a mentality, not a skin color ...given that the majority of welfare and food stamp recipients are white.
Just sayin'.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNG068z9FYk
Hey it's catchy. Her voice has a sing songy quality to it that is just dying for an auto tuning. (Pretty please someone).
In addition to being exactly relevant to the discussion we're having about who is voting for Obama and or Romney, its also entertaining video. You can therefoe see why someone would highlight it regardless of any racial content.
And why do you think racist ANne? Why not support what the woman is trying to articulate? Do you have some sort of inherent bias against poor black women where we must hide what they say so as not to embarrass them? Kind of condescending if you ask me.
This woman IS the typical Obama voter, expecting handouts.
Thanks, Tom.
Chip S
Do you really not see the point? Somehow, I doubt it. The Medicare numbers I provided were a response to the suggestion that we all pay in to the entitlements what we get back. This is patently absurd (and, ironically, is exactly how FDR wanted us all to think so as not to see these entitlements for what they were, welfare transfers plain and simple). We are ALL on the dole from these programs, and by a lot more than a cell phone's worth. Including me, you and Rush. No one has any right to point the finger of accusations of dependency at anyone else in this society no one. And it is a totally self-defeating arrogance and ignorance for the right to keep doing it. It is what keeps us marginalized. It is time for self-righteous and pathetically surface superficiality of conservatives such as those taking pot shots at Ann here to get called on their silly arrogance by other conservatives. I for one am tired, tired, tired of reading this inane, unthinking, superficial and often utterly paranoid ranting from the right, almost as plentiful now as it has been on the left. It is a losing game.
"There have been so many wild and silly rumors pursed at the expense of legitimate Obama failings that the whole Conservative movement has been undermined."
So do you agree that the leftist movement has been undermined by fat broads saying that fire doesn't melt steel ? I'd say you, like Ann, are reaching for excuses to do something that you know deep down is irrational.
"I know the economy will not recover if Obama gets another term but you hurt my feelings."
OK. We might still win without you.
Tom said...
So now I ask what is to be gained by showing over and over the utterance of one ignorant black woman. She is, after all, just one woman
Sorry Tom. Lets go to the tape.
Pretty sure she said something like 'YES EVERYBODY IN CLEVELAND, YO MINORITY GOT OBAMAPHONE . . . HE GAVE US A PHONE. HE GONNA DO MORE".
"everybody" "us".
Doesn't sound like "just one woman" speaking for herself. She's claiming, though she wouldn't know this word, that she is legion.
Now, how about "thanking" ME, Ann, for correcting Tom, who you prematurely thanked - probably because he agrees with you.
Tom. So you are scared of Republicans whilst the hostess is afraid that Republicans are trying to make people afraid of blacks. I see.
16 trillion in debt. Trillion dollar plus deficits/annum. 4 dollar gas. 8+% unemployment. Failed foreign policy. Drones killing those checked off by the president. Gitmo open. No budget in years. A massive healthcare bill crammed through without one single vote from the opposition. A president that didnt know, whose office didnt have, Bohner's phone number. A man who has intentionally, cynically, turned citizen against citizen.
But you are scared of Republicans. Because of a radio host.
Thanks Tom.
jr565 has it right.
Twenty years ago my son pointed out to me what was going to happen here in California, and it has. The takers have overtaken the producers, and we are accelerating downward. The same is happening on the federal level, and the woman whose video rant led to all of this demonstrates the taking mentality of an almost-fatal percentage of our population. Tom and Jon may say it it isn't so and join Ann in putting her head in the sand, but that won't change the facts. If Obama wins in November, by 2016 the number of takers will outgrow the shrinking number of producers and America, as a whole, will be like California is today.
Tom:
Well-stated, but you are doing the same thin: Telling people they are stupid for calling someone stupid.
Is there an argument to be made that the playing of the audio is racist? Sure, albeit not a good one. At least not to me. This 'controversy' is as relevant as the one about the doll who used the phrase 'black hole' and was villified by the racemongers. Did Rush promote her race? No. He promoted her belief system. Is there an argument to be made about her belief system? Of course, but apparantly we on the right are not allowed to make it because of HER race.
So who is being racist here?
Ann.
That's who.
I have no intent to convince her. Nothing I could say could be more eloquent than the past four years.
Ann's struggle is within her.
She needs to really open her eyes.
Is she just here to teach or is she also here to learn?
That audio was nothing but a Rohrschach Test and it revealed quite a bit about Ms. Althouse.
I wonder if she is honest enough to recognize it.
And folks, in trying to understand Ann, it can't be repeated enough that this is all pretty much a spectator sport activity, to her.
She has nothing at stake. Just wants a good show.
That's why she can play coy with her vote, and even perhaps help push Obama to victory.
And when his policies destroy this country, and most of us with it, she'll still be fine. Living large on a guaranteed pension and savings. Just like all the political upper class that brought us to this ruin.
They'll be sayin':
Good show, everyone!! Now, stay the fuck off our lawns, and out of our gated communities.
Jon Burack. But do you believe we should all just shut uo and let our children worry about the consequences of our profligacy? Or do you think it a winning argument to point out that the system pays back three times what is put in? If you understand compound interest and you note current rates how do youthink this sorts itself out? It is nice to get all huffy about the math but it is not helpful.
Tom Wrote:
I wonder if anyone here remembers the uproar among Conservatives when Alexis Pelosi's video about southern whites were portrayed as racists based on a the utterances of a few southern (and one certifiably insane or drunk) people. The cry was this is unfair, these are the thoughts of just a few people, this is not representative of the majority. Point taken.
It IS unfair to view that video through the prism of race. But you're the one viewing it through that prism. What I object to is the assumption that the only way you can view this video (or that one for that matter) is through that racial prism.
It is unfair to taint a whole race based on the words of a few. What is gained by showing it. We know that there are some out and out racists in the South. We are looking at some people's stereotype of Southern Whites.
Who says thought that everyone is tainting a whole race by showing this? i.e. why does showing the video have to be viewed racially and not based on class, or what some people expect govt to be giving them. Do you think someone like MIa Love will assume that the only way you can look at this video is that conservatives view ALL blacks like the woman in the video. I bet MIa Love would have similar issues with the idea that Obama is giving out free phones and that is why you should vote for him, and it wouldn't make her a racist.
THis actuall ties in more to Romney's point that the left latched onto, and not a question of race. Romney said that 47% of the population will vote for Obama because of a sense of enttitlement. blacks do not make up close to 47% of the population. Meaning, that a good chunk of htose beleiving in govt largesse are white. Why then does this video have to be about race and not about the conversation we've been having for the longest, and that is the role of govt? You're the one bringing racism to the table and saying this is how we must view this video.
She is not representative black people as a whole (Mia Love, Thomas Sowell, Herman Cain to name a few). She is living up to a stereotype that some conservatives have of blacks.
And now you are living up to the stereotype that some people have of conservatives.Again, you are the one saying this video must be viewed through racial prism,that those posting this video ARE saying that she is emblematic of blacks as a whole and that therefore any conservative who links to this video can only be doing so beucase of latent racism (and not because they are making a totally different argument). You are the one necessarily making it a racial argument and then assuming that is the only way to look at the video. You are constructing the straw man you are then attacking.
"There have been so many wild and silly rumors pursed at the expense of legitimate Obama failings that the whole Conservative movement has been undermined."
Isn't this the point being made about racism as well, that there are so many false and politicized charges of racism at the expense of legitimate forms of racism that the whole civil rights movement has been undermined?
As far as Obama, it's not him but it is his politics--so it is him inasmuch as he institutes for the country what Democrats have instituted in California.
The thing about California is that we have a very wide mix of nationalities and races, with great and poor examples existing in each. But, it's the white liberals who really put California over the edge--then they'll pick up and move elsewhere. That's what they do. Move, vote, destroy, move, leave ruin behind them.
Wait a second, was that racist? Can I blame white liberals without feeling naughty?
I need to make a correction to my earlier post where I said The rest of us have "moved on". What I should've said is that the rest of us are trying to move on.
Unfortunately we are not allowed. The race-mongers look for anything, like the word "Chicago", to be some code word for racism. Or an audio of a black women to be some sort of racist "dog whistle" that we can't help respond to. It's insanity.
Meanwhile all these "dog-whistles" and "code-words" can drown out any real instances of racism that exist. The word "raaaacist" is becoming a joke to younger people. Well, who knows; maybe that's a good thing?
Jon Burack,
Of course we pay into Medicare-- but it's going broke. That's the problem. Obamacare removes huge sums of funding from Medicare to pay for ObamaCare. ObamaCare raises taxes on the middle class, has promted higher premiums and it's already a dismal failure.
No once talks about Hawaii anymore. Certainly not here.
Obama's ideas are socialist, that's not name-calling or craziness- that's fact. Look up the word Socialism. It has a meaning that applies to the modern Democrats (not just Obama).
So this Obama recession is just paranoia? It’s just a figment of our imagination?
Sure.
No ONE...(not once)
One of my daughter's friends stopped by with her today. Not only did they mention the repulsive ObamaPhone woman and had seen the UTube as a trainwreck you counldn't stop watching and had to replay a few times to see how parasitic and self-entitled she was...my daughter's friend said she herself got a free ObamaPhone last June and loves it and has mentioned it to everyone she knows.
Easy to get.
And she was a Democrat before, but really thinks Obama gave her something great with 300 free minutes a month. And unlike ObamaPhone woman, she needed that phone because she had a modest income and travelled a lot and needed the phone to make travel connections.
I said that news said it was 250 minutes a month, which seems a lot in itself, but she said, no, its 300 minutes and no penalty fees like her existing cell phone has, which charges by the minute after 100 minutes a month.
Obama.
Winning one vote at a time.
My daughter's friend is black, BTW.
But most of the people she turned on to the free ObamaPhones this summer are white.
SomeoneHasToSayIt said...
That's why she can play coy with her vote, and even perhaps help push Obama to victory.
And when his policies destroy this country, and most of us with it, she'll still be fine.
This is hysterical. The closest the country has come to destruction since the great depression was the financial collapse during Bush's presidency, and even that was a long way from destruction. The country has been governed in a notably more sane fashion subsequently.
This was another earlier incident (From back in 2009). And I suppose you (Tom) and Althouse would also argue that it was a racial discussion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ojd13kZlCA
Now it just so happens that the person the host spoke with was black. But was the issue about their blackness, or what they were expecting from govt?
ROGULSKI: Why are you here?
WOMAN #1: To get some money.
ROGULSKI: What kind of money?
WOMAN #1: Obama money.
ROGULSKI: Where's it coming from?
WOMAN #1: Obama.
ROGULSKI: And where did Obama get it?
WOMAN #1: I don't know, his stash. I don't know. (laughter) I don't know where he got it from, but he givin' it to us, to help us.
WOMAN #2: And we love him.
WOMAN #1: We love him. That's why we voted for him!
WOMEN: (chanting) Obama! Obama! Obama! (laughing)
Is that a discussion about race, or is that a discussion about money? By putting that out and having a republican comment on it is it then a commmentary on race, or on what certain people expect from govt. Does the fact that a black person said Obama money mean that noone can address the issue lest they be accused of racism or racialism or suggesting that ALL black women are out for Obama money and that this particular person is emblematic of ALL black people.
Rush limbaugh higlighted this particular story too, but it had nothing to do with the person saying she was there for cash's race. Rather it was about how govt was giving out this cash because the economy was in such shambles and were doing a pretty crappy job of getting the money to people to boot. Looking back on it you could also make the case that it too was emblematic of a sense of entitlement. Does she really care where the money came from? Apparently not. Obama could pull it out of his ass and it wouldnt be an issue, just so that she got her money. To tie it into the current discussions, Romney said again that there is a certain percentage of the population that is primarily there for the cash, and feels that govt should give them this money. WHy would pointing to this particular call then be an example of latent racism since the whole point we've been arguing over has been how Romney said a good chunk of the electorate have their hands out and thus are not going to vote for Romney no matter what. Why is that NECESSARILY some covert racism or racist code.
I really think TOM and Anne, that you are arguing in bad faith. And trying to deflect from the real discussion to one of race because, frankly that's what the left/dems do all the time. THere are endless race cards to be played. Even when the context is clearly about something else, no you and Ann will be able to sniff out the racism. The proof is merely in your projection and the projection actually says more about you and Anne than it does about Rush Limbaugh. Got me Tom?
Man it's getting even worse. Tom's comment is just more of the same.
Face it....Althouse tied a string to a raggedy $20 bill and dragged it through the trailer park of public opinion here. And we provided a spectacle almost as weird as dozens of jumping Asian Carp heading upstream.
Weird.
As I said earlier, Althouse speaks for Althouse. Period. If she thinks Rush speaks for Republicans and Romney per se...that is her problem, not yours or mine.
I've never even heard Rush on radio, or seen him, anywhere, ever. He has zero effect on my vote preferences. Zero. I am a former registered Democrat, lapsed totally in 2004, and independent since...and I wouldn't vote for Obama in 2008 or 2012 if my life depended upon it. I will vote for Romney...I would have voted for Herman Cain, or Allen West, had they made it to the finals.
It isn't about race, never was. Race enters in to it only if the individual observer chooses to let it, for some pathetic self actualization and comfort. I am of the 60's and participated in the issues of those days.I have no need for feel good impulses today. YMMV....
Somebody mentioned Mia Love. She is so bad an example of black people that Mother Jones magazine is complaining about the immigration status of her parents. So the lefties aren't immune to anti-immigrant sentiment. It just has to be the right party.
In teaching medical students, I have observed that foreign born blacks have a totally different attitude toward whites and work and education. They are getting ahead with everybody else but American blacks, who are held back by this story playing in their heads that they are victims and whites are all racist.
I guess that makes me a racist but it is true and heartbreaking. Most of my black students are foreign born and I teach at a private medical school so I doubt affirmative action is a factor. A few years ago, I had a black student from LA who was failing and a couple of other black students from my group tried to help him. He couldn't make it. Really sad but us racists shouldn't worry about that, I guess.
The two kids that tried to help have gone on and graduated. One was from Eritrea and so poor she didn't have a laptop, which has replaced the microscope these days for medical students. Her car broke down and was a disaster. Some of the faculty helped. The other was a kid from San Diego who had played water polo in college. He had escaped the curse but water polo seemed to me to be a marker for good attitudes.
Obama, of course, plays basketball.
Ann seems to be making a pragmatic argument: some "people in the middle", herself included, view this video as racist and Romney will lose these people. So drawing attention to it is a tactical mistake for Romney supporters.
That may well be true. But is also true that many "in the middle"
will not see it as racist at all, but rather the inevitable result of a culture of dependency, an ever-growing culture vigorously aided and abetted by the Obama administration. (It is not by accident that Obama himself has christened this phone "the Obamaphone".) These people will move towards Romney.
Which group is larger? Ann seems to think her group is. But I think people who react as Ann does fall into a relatively small sub-group based on age and class. The majority of the class of those "in the middle" will react to the audio just as it is and nothing more. And they will resist drawing convoluted inferences grounded in emotion.
Ann seems to be making a pragmatic argument: some "people in the middle", herself included, view this video as racist and Romney will lose these people. So drawing attention to it is a tactical mistake for Romney supporters.
That may well be true. But is also true that many "in the middle"
will not see it as racist at all, but rather the inevitable result of a culture of dependency, an ever-growing culture vigorously aided and abetted by the Obama administration. (It is not by accident that Obama himself has christened this phone "the Obamaphone".) These people will move towards Romney.
Which group is larger? Ann seems to think her group is. But I think people who react as Ann does fall into a relatively small sub-group based on age and class. The majority of the class of those "in the middle" will react to the audio just as it is and nothing more. And they will resist drawing convoluted inferences grounded in emotion.
You want 'repulsed'? How about being repulsed by the stupid racist bitch screaming about her phone and other bennies? How about being repulsed by her enablers. Maybe you could criticize her just a little for screaming, 'Romney sucks'.
There is some seriously tribal bullshit going on in this country.
Wow, I see the beating is still ongoing. Poor Althouse.
I hope Meade is being especially tender today.
Jon Burack said...
Do you really not see the point?...We are ALL on the dole from these programs, and by a lot more than a cell phone's worth. Including me, you and Rush. No one has any right to point the finger of accusations of dependency at anyone else in this society no one.
When you've figured out how this is arithmetically impossible, come on back and we can have a coherent discussion about entitlements.
Here is another video from the same rally, that leads into the bit about the Obama phone. The guy is more articulate, but doesn't make a lot of sense about what he expects Mitt Romney to do (Mitt talked about raising taxes on the middle class?).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nmdp3nr4mjQ&feature=player_embedded
Also of note is how they start hemming and hawing when asked how they got down there. Why? Because then they'd have to reveal that they were in fact paid to be there.
Why can't Rush Limbaugh or any one else not only point out that the woman is a dumbass (an hilariously so) but that they are a bunch of liars without it becoming an issue of Rush's racism and not their lack of truthfulness, or an attack on their mentality and not their race. Or even on the fact that they are not real protesters but paid for their services.
That's why I got so turned off when Ann admitted to directing blog traffic a few days ago:
A rare thing when I agree with Crack
Alex said...
This woman IS the typical Obama voter, expecting handouts
No the professor is the typical Obama voter. A white liberal who cannot tear herself away from her imaginary black boyfriend.
It is fools like her that got us in this mess.
Never doubt it.
" Zero. I am a former registered Democrat, lapsed totally in 2004, and independent since...and I wouldn't vote for Obama in 2008 or 2012 if my life depended upon it. I will vote for Romney...I would have voted for Herman Cain, or Allen West, had they made it to the finals. "
I actually was a Cain supporter when I thought Romney was not doing well in the primaries. That, of course doesn't count because I am a racist who thinks that cellphone woman is pathetic and I watched the video several times to decipher what she was saying.
I wonder what ever happened to those women that came out of the woodwork. Probably they are holed up with Meg Whitman's former housekeeper.
Benghazi was "all about the video."
The Obamaphone issue is "all about the audio."
The presidential election is "all about race."
Silliest Althouse post ever, but consistent with this year's presidential politics.
Inga said...
I hope Meade is being especially tender today.
Yeah, I think he should go all Adolf on her.
If she doesn't care that I - the "modern" post-racial black man she supposedly feels so much for - have almost been driven crazy by being made to endure the Althouse blog persecution, Glenn Reynolds-inspired side-lining,
Why do you feel so singled out Crack? Because it's you? You're not singled out. People choose who to promote and who not to promote.
Instapundit was nice enough to post about my first book--helping sales, but decided not to do the same with the second one--after emailing him about it and sending him a copy.
I could get upset or see that's just how things are. There are gatekeepers in every industry and they don't always pick the best or the most worthy to highlight. I don't know if he ignored it because he didn't get it, or didn't think it had enough sales to justify any other marketing, or if he thought it was terrible.
He didn't link to it, I move on. Move on to better hone what I have to say and how I say it.
Sometimes they do highlight was is genuinely good and people who are saying something worth hearing in ways that are very hearable. There's a reason why Ann has a popular blog and why I don't. There's a reason why you're a great voice saying a lot of true things, but aren't getting the attention you deserve.
Blaming the audience or blaming the gatekeepers is a victim mentality. You're seeming to look for approval and validation. Which doesn't seem to be what really is in your heart. You're playing a beta role to the alpha blogging law professors, complaining at them, when that's not who you are either.
You have a great voice and you have significant insight and experiences that add depth to that. Say what you have to say, keep saying it, hone how you say it so people listen--and don't get distracted when the gatekeepers don't throw a parade in your honor.
If you're at the top of Kandinsky's pyramid, then live it out and don't expect others to get you. If they could, then what you're saying isn't unique.
And yes, I know this post is long... someday I'll learn succinctness.
I'll say one thing: I'm not a Rush listener, but I'm going to tune in for any slap down of Althouse on Monday.
Hmm, I don't know about you but I have never been persuaded to change my opinion by insults.
But that's the conceit behind the idea that somehow not yet making up your mind by now is superior.
You have to persuade me, because *I* am being a critical thinker and *you* are a non-thinking true believer.
It's simply a way of elevating your own opinion above the opinions of others, and then demanding every body else dance to your tune. They may or may not dance, it's up to them. But most people are smart enough to see when even those people who see themselves as convinceable really just aren't. You start to recognize there is always one more hoop to jump through to assuage the "independent thinker"'s ego.
From one law professor to another:
"Shes-got-an-obama-phone-and-shes-proud-deal-with-it" Prof. Jacobson at Legal Insurrection.
Prof. Jacobson has a screen print of what WAS at www.freegovernment cellphones.net It said: Obama Free Cell Phone Program and had a picture of Obama. Timothy Dalrymple over at Patheos also has the screen print (Patheos.com, The Shady Ethics of "the Obama phone") Now, however, the screen has been changed and it no longer talks about Obama phones.
Seems like Obama was, once again, taking credit for what predecessors had done until it became less useful to do so.
Maybe you, Prof. Althouse, should be castigating Obama and his followers for using and abusing people like the Obama phone lady. He did this...not Romney nor any of Romney's supporters. Maybe it is Obama and his supporters who are the true Racists. Where is your sense of fair play and justice Prof. Althouse?
From Althouse August 30th, 2012.
Rush Limbaugh the day before said:
"Clearly what we've known for years is true. The Republican hierarchy, from its consultants on down, truly believes that mentioning Obama by name and then criticizing will cause these swing voters that [focus groupster Frank] Luntz had that I told you about to run straight back to the Democrats. It is clear they believe it.
Naturally, I profoundly disagree.
But I think also it's obvious that these people don't see this as a turning point election. They see it as just another one in the cycle. Here's Joe Trippi. Joe Trippi is a Democrat consultant. Trippi ran Howard Dean's ill-fated campaign in 2004 when John Kerry (who served in Vietnam, by the way) ended up being the nominee. He was also on the Fox show this morning. After Ed Rollins said, "Yep, yep! Not hitting Obama was the perfect way to go," Joe Trippi said..."
So Rush would say Althouse thinks like a member of the Republican hierarchy.
Crack implores: If I were you guys, I'd start doing some serious soul-searching about what you're going to do differently between then and now, because what you've been doing ain't working.
Is he suggesting we vote for that Don Johnson guy instead?
Here's an example of a WHITE SEIU (paid protester). Is it ok to talk about his views without it being racial?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKKiWUFBXx8&feature=relmfu
I like how uninformed these protesters are. But in particular I like how he too says that Romney is going to raise taxes on the middle class (suddenly the dems/libs are concerned about high taxes. who'd of thunk it?). But then the interviewer says that Romney promised to cut taxes. The guy says he's going to cut it for the rich at the expense of the middle class. THe interviewer then asks "WHat if he cuts taxes for everybody, would that be good for you?" and the guy thinks about it for a second before finally answering "No". Its all about appropriating the rich guys wealth out of a sense of fairness. Simply cutting taxes for everyone is not 'fair" that's helping out the rich, apparently.
(I also like his comment on the killing of the ambassador in Libya - typical of his side, though he does realize that this happened under Obama's watch though right? Meaning, they just might be reacting to Obama's mid east policies. And yet he's voting for those very policies...).
THe point being, there are a lot of people that could be interviewed (and were) about a lot of issues. Most of them happened to be black, and one of them happened to be hiliariously on point when it comes to the entitlement mentality and said it in a way that will launch a dozen You Tube remixes. But why must any criticism of what these people said be about race, and not what these people said. THe reason the woman talking about the Obama phone was highlighted is simply because she is the most entertaining of the bunch. But there is no racist code words or subtext behind her video any more than there is a racial subtext behind this guys video. Saying there is deflects from the fact that people have a right ot both here and respond to what some peopple are in fact arguing without having their position demagogued. And they have a right to defend Mitt Romney's position that a large chunk of the electorate are looking for govt handouts and unreachable to Romneys tax cutting to help the economy message. Hell, half the people here are under the impression that he's going to raise their taxes. Which proves his point to begin with. And then another chunk of them are all about what govt will give them (free Obama phones! etc).
Oh, Paddy O, I thought that was great.
Seems like Obama was, once again, taking credit for what predecessors had done until it became less useful to do so.
What made you think Obama was behind that website? It seems to be clearly a private website.
Have you ever heard Obama talk about Obamaphones? Anyone in government?
It's like those word puzzle Million Dollar Sweepstakes we used to get in the mail.
You had to solve the puzzle and mail it in with a small processing fee, and then you would find out if you got the answers right and so qualified for the next level. When you qualified, you got the next puzzle to solve and turn in with the fee, and then you were one step closer to winning that million dollars.
My college roommate, for kicks, did this for the better part of the year. Seriously, she got so very close to winning. So close. She just had like one more thing to do to finally earn that prize.
Tom: I think if you call her stupid 567 times, she might finally get the point. But don't hold back, call her stupid a thousand times for good measure.
a. The point of showing the "Obamaphone" video is not racial, it's tribal.
b. Tom is a supercilious ass-kisser and that condition is also tribal.
c. Althouse is having trouble choosing tribes.
Paddy-O,
Blaming the audience or blaming the gatekeepers is a victim mentality.
Man, you guys LOVE that kind of language. The idea that people do wrong - and neither you nor they are doing anything about it - just endorses the wrong they do:
Hey - you Jews in the ovens - stop that victim talk!
Yeah, that'll fix everything.
Hmm, I don't know about you but I have never been persuaded to change my opinion by insults.
No, what you aren't is persuadable. Insults has nothing to do with it. Most of you are so locked into your bullshit a person could coo all day and you still would go on being the Germans during WWII.
That's seriously how I see most of you - there was nothing special about them or you:
YOU are them.
You don't respond to ethics, you won't respond to evidence, you won't respond to reason - you simply won't respond. Paddy-O's game of "a victim mentality" is how most of you escape taking responsibility for wrong in the world. You let it go on. Whatever it is.
It took Ann all of two posts to make some of you forget she makes no sense - THAT's how committed you guys are to righting the wrongs of the world.
Romney won't save you because already you're lost.
You're simply not committed to anything worthwhile.
@Althouse
"Thanks Tom"
Were Althouse simply pointing out that such things as the vid in question and Rush's emphasis on it might jeopardize Romney's chances for the feelings it might engender in some, less analytical people (i.e., those shallow-thinking "independents" who do not want to be thought of as "racists"--the reasoning of which she actually accurately describes) and left it at that as a warning proffered by a "cruelly neutral" observer most here would hardly quibble with her about the truth of her observation about campaign tactics. But no, Ann had to go further and opine that she, herself--a highly educated, sophisticated woman teaching logical thought every day and immersed in politics on a daily basis via her blog--actually had HER "spidey senses" tingled by the racist "penumbra" supposedly emanating from Rush's treatment of the Obamaphone vid. Worse, she suggests that the rest of us are bigots as well for not recognizing that fact--as witnessed by the felt need for someone to come to her defense, e.g., "Thanks Tom."
A sad, sad, spectacle..
I had a phone call from a friend yesterday - a guy who puts my sense of masculinity in the dust - and he says, "You were right." Then he tells me about something we've talked about many times, but he always said I was over-reacting about, that went totally wrong for him.
And that's the point:
You guys ALL share a mentality that will wait until disaster strikes before you'll admit, even to yourselves, that you're wrong. Hell, you may never admit it to anyone else, simply out of stupid pride. Ann has that. In spades. Glenn Reynolds definitely has it.
Never say you're wrong. Never apologize. Never "punch down." Never sound like a "victim". All that stupid Oprah shit. You heard me:
Oprah shit.
You need to grow up. You're NewAgers and you don't even know it. You don't let facts get in the way - that's NewAge. You don't respond to reason - that's NewAge. You don't respond to evidence - that's NewAge.
You might as well go fit yourselves for dolphin earrings.
You are backing a guy who believes in cold fusion, follows a con man's dictates, is married to a user of quackery, and thinks his mother and father god lives on an unknown planet.
That's about as NewAge as it gets.
And you won't stop doing any of it.
Until everything falls apart.
That's who you are - deal with it.
You're simply not committed to anything worthwhile
I am. I'm committed to saving my own ass, my family and friends in the upcoming meltdown of the former United States. I'm committed to stocking up food, supplies ammo and booze (gal's gotta have some fun). I'm committed to growing my garden for fruits and vegetables, saving seeds and planning for next year's crops.
The rest of the country can, and probably will, go up in flames for all I care. The stupidity of the American public as evidenced by Althouse's completely self delusional posts is staggering. If she and the rest of the country want to commit suicide, follow each other blindly off the cliff like politically correct little lemmings....go for it.
If we, my neighborhood, family, friends survive, that's all I'm concerned about.
virgil xenophon,
She suggests that the rest of us are bigots as well
With Romney in the race, "bigot" is the Right-wing version of the Leftist's "racist" this election season.
Ann's a self-proclaimed (and laughably so) moderate, so throwing such terms around are pretty equal opportunity.
Whatever works,...
Dust Bunny Queen said...
I'm committed to saving my own ass,...
Then you will lose it. There wasn't a single German who got out of that nightmare without scars of some kind - which is the lesson of letting things happen to others while you stand by "looking out for Number One."
The rest of the country can, and probably will, go up in flames for all I care.
And you've got enough ammo for forever? And that life will be better - for you and your kids - than doing the right thing NOW?
You're talking insanity,...
Crack you are 100% correct about the people of Germany and the rest of Europe too for that matter, no one was left unscathed.
The Crack Emcee said...
Dust Bunny Queen said...
DBQ - "I'm committed to saving my own ass,.."
Cracky
Then you will lose it. There wasn't a single German who got out of that nightmare without scars of some kind - which is the lesson of letting things happen to others while you stand by "looking out for Number One."
=============
War and disaster don't touch everyone.
Other than soldiers coffins and occasional bombing raids late in the War, Bavaria was untouched. Russian east of Moscow and Stalingrad were untouched. For many Jews outside the zone of conflict in Europe, WWII was a time to make fortunes off war contracts and lending money.
Keep out of the business of war fighting, and look for opportunities.
If the inner cities erupt again and you hear mobs are burning Columbia, Yale, Harvard, and U of Chicago.....And in DC, burning Fed Office buildings...why risk yourself saving the lawyers at Yale or Fed Government Satraps, ideologues of Columbia or Obama's pals on Chicago's Gold Coast???
Look after your own 1st, and if you can spare the altruism on others, by all means do so.
Best DBQ and the rest of us can do is protect ourselves, family, neighbors.
Crack you are 100% correct about the people of Germany and the rest of Europe too for that matter, no one was left unscathed.
And you both know this, how?
AndyR: I think you are right about the website being private and using Obamaphone. The truth is, and you know this because you are an activist in Atlanta-or claim to be- that Obamaphone is the term used by the owners of those phones.
That is what "the community" calls them. The private site was picking that usage up not inventing it
Cedarford,
Other than soldiers coffins and occasional bombing raids late in the War, Bavaria was untouched. Russian east of Moscow and Stalingrad were untouched.
Physically untouched. The scars were everywhere - and still are.
Some of you are so limited in your "thinking",...
Cedarford, yes there probably were areas that were untouched. But I warrent that the ones who lived there lost something more precious than a plod of dirt, their sons and husbands, leaving them as injured as the rest.
Sometimes live isn't worth living, just to be a survivor, when the most precious are lost to you. I think I'll paint a bullseye on my roof.
This is intellectually dishonest, at best.
Of course, it's intellectually honest to claim anything involving a black person is about race. You could have just as easily found a white hillbilly or white trailer park trash (remember James Carville's comment about dragging $20 through a trailer park? Carville's still hawking Democrats including Obama.) and no one would have given a shit. The greatest racism is in the minds of people like Reeve and Althouse.
Cedarford,
Best DBQ and the rest of us can do is protect ourselves, family, neighbors.
Yes, because doing the right thing, now, is so HARD.
And your answers are a perfect example of why:
You simply are incapable of thinking and reasoning,...
One of the One Million owners of Obamaphones in Ohio is quoted:“I am unable to have a cellphone and I need one for emergencies,” said Aliesa Azbill of Dayton, who is in a work training program at Community Action Partnership. She said the 250 free minutes she gets per month through SafeLink isn’t enough to use it for much more than emergencies."
Four hours of emergencies a month. Wow.
http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/news/subsidized-cell-phone-program-nearly-doubles-in-oh/nRDqC/
@Crack: OK, I understand finally. I was wrong. You were right.
Now what?
Someonehastosayit.
I know this because my parents lived it, in Eastern Europe, lost everything, spent 10 years in a DP Camp in Austria waiting for a Visa to America, because they could never go home again, their farms and relatives who stayed gone or dead. I was born in the DP Camp, lived there until age three.
You desperately want to validate that Obama phone post idiocy, don't you althouse? Are you sure you actually have a law degree, because you aren't exhibiting much logic.
"Hey - you Jews in the ovens - stop that victim talk!"
Really? Instapundit not giving you links is like Jews in the ovens?
Nazis had power over Jewish people. They were victims. Instapundit and Althouse don't have power over you.
And it's very egocentric to say they're doing some kind of major wrong. In the annals of sin, choosing not to link or promote someone else is pretty low on the list. There's only so much time and space and if they think there are others more deserving then that's their right.
I would think you have enough experience in the music industry to not get all out of sorts because people play favorites, and often play favorites among a vast pool of talented people (not all of whom have musical talent).
I think you say a lot of truth, i think you have a needed and necessary voice. But when you mix it in with all the whining, it's just not all that macho.
If Ann and the rest are as you say they are, of course they won't promote you. You have to find a way of getting around their influence.
It's like writing advice. You're telling a lot of people, but you're not showing.
Lots of folks play victim around here, like getting a link or a promotion or whatever is our right. Getting feisty when Ann or Reynolds control their blogs according to their own fashion.
They don't owe us anything. Not a link, not a tag, not a rebuttal, not a phone, not an explanation.
They're popular bloggers who put in the daily work and are in a zone of influence, bless their hearts. Want to protest them--then go around their influence, make your mark. Show. Don't tell.
That's what I'm trying to do. Not here, though, here is just a place to sort out thoughts and listen to other voices and have a variety of topics to riff on. That's how I can keep enjoying hereabouts for as long as I have without getting the huffy puffies that so many other commenters have gotten over the years.
Allie is trying to pull the "victim" card on us.
Alex, why? For what purpose? Sometimes you're such a dope.
Paddy O,
Nazis had power over Jewish people. They were victims. Instapundit and Althouse don't have power over you.
Instapundit and Althouse don't direct traffic? Misuse information?
I dare you to find one (1) article linked on Instapundit that's critical of Romney. Find one on Althouse. I dare you.
THEY ARE ROLLING YOU.
That's not trying to help the country - that's a pure expression of power.
I've had an Instalaunch and to see those thousands upon thousands of people stream in tells you something:
These people are controlling things.
You think it's an accident Reynolds takes pride in the Tea Party?
Where's his criticisms of it? I've been to a few gatherings and I've got some. Why doesn't he help them and the rest of us by being honest and having a real discussion of what's going on?
Because he might discover he's an ass, that's why.
I swear, you guys LIKE being controlled,...
What about Mother Jones' racist attacks on Mia Love and her families immigration status This absolutely looks like a reason to vote against Obama and any other Democrat. Oh, my emotions!!
DADvocate,
What about Mother Jones' racist attacks on Mia Love and her families immigration status This absolutely looks like a reason to vote against Obama and any other Democrat. Oh, my emotions!!
Mia Love sucks big ones.
Again, the Althouse's point is being missed.
She is a potential buyer of Romney.
She is seeing something from conservative site that she finds distracting from Romney's argument.
She points it out.
Instead of listening and trying to understand her perception, you are telling her she is wrong to feel that way.
You are not listening to the market here. You are telling your potential buyers that their feelings are wrong.
Instead of thinking, OK this is potential needless problem here. We can avoid this. I don't understand why but when we use images of black people, a few of our customers interpret this differently than I would like. I think we should stop using these images until I can drag my candidate across the finish line. I can use different images that make the same point. The important thing here is not to be misinterpreted in a middle of election.
Instead you attack the customer.
Perception is reality until you can change the perception.
Get bad poll results, you blame the pollsters. This is market research, you can try to improve the message.
Again, you are not trying to convince the convinced. You are trying to win a vote of someone who doesn't necessarily think like you.
Bad poll results, the polls have to be bad. Ignore the research because it doesn't match what you want to happen.
Remember the wonderful design of our founding fathers make it possible for sly voters to keep the government divided.
Until then, continue to ignore any feedback that doesn't match your prejudices. you don't have to change the customer has to change.
Paddy O - I had to take a shower, so I broke my answer up:
And it's very egocentric to say they're doing some kind of major wrong.
I'm not the one screaming we all have to be humble.
In the annals of sin, choosing not to link or promote someone else is pretty low on the list.
Only a religious person weighs what sins they'll commit - gonna be kinda hard to get into Heaven, with you dancing with the Devil, ain't it?
I would think you have enough experience in the music industry to not get all out of sorts because people play favorites, and often play favorites among a vast pool of talented people (not all of whom have musical talent).
Yeah - and we see where that got 'em, haven't we?
I think you say a lot of truth, i think you have a needed and necessary voice. But when you mix it in with all the whining, it's just not all that macho.
I don't think you understand machismo, but have the feminist stereotype in mind.
If Ann and the rest are as you say they are, of course they won't promote you. You have to find a way of getting around their influence.
Then let's stop pretending the blogosphere is a place to counter the media's influence, O.K.? Let's admit it's a cesspool, too, and treat it that way.
It's like writing advice. You're telling a lot of people, but you're not showing.
Oh, I'm showing, but - as I find with my cowardly friends offline - you can't make men act like them without force of some kind, and there's laws against that.
Lots of folks play victim around here, like getting a link or a promotion or whatever is our right.
No - ideas should rule - especially if we're pretending we're playing politics here. These are people who can't even admit when they're wrong and punish others for telling them so. Ann admitted she does it a few days ago.
They don't owe us anything. Not a link, not a tag, not a rebuttal, not a phone, not an explanation.
Bullshit - we're all human beings. What kind of religious person are you?
They're popular bloggers who put in the daily work and are in a zone of influence, bless their hearts. Want to protest them--then go around their influence, make your mark. Show. Don't tell.
Oh yeah - in a culture where most of you will elect a man who thinks Jesus is returning to Missouri (but will diss Pat Robertson) and cold fusion is real - you expect water to rightly find it's own level?
That's insane talk.
That's what I'm trying to do.
Bullshit - you, too, want to build some cult utopian society based on everybody sucking on the tit of Jesus. It won't work, Paddy-O, because I WON'T JOIN.
I'm trying to get you to live in the real world.
Unfortunately, you don't have time - or the balls - for THAT,...
Even the phones themselves are racist.
Tom said...
Again, the Althouse's point is being missed.
Tom,
Instead of listening and trying to understand her perception, you are telling her she is wrong to feel that way.
How many years has Rush been accused of being a racist?
It's fucking silly to even bring it up,...
@Tom
I don't think anyone is trying to convince Althouse of anything, she is free to vote for another four years of the president. What I will not accept is this idea that she is the moderate undecided independent. She has her mind made up like MOST people. Early voting is going on already, people KNOW who they are voting for. With that being said I would rather not have low information emotion driven people deciding who will be president for the next for years. The next president needs to be equipped to deal with the American and Global Economic crisis, what has the last four years shown you about the incumbent's ability to do so?
I think we are responding to what we believe is her desire to find anything to justify a vote for Obama, even if it is an IMAGINED instance of racism. Maybe it's just me but when I see the Obamaphone lady and the 08 "Obama's going to pay my mortgage" clip it is not RACE but IDEOLOGY that I find important. How can you jump inside the hearts and minds of the whole Republican base including a talk radio host and declare that they play this video because they are RACIST? I need more evidence. Did he say something racial the day or minute before playing the clip?
I don't think poor people should be made fun of, I think the president should try to DO something to help lift the poor OUT of their circumstances. Mitt Romney cares about poor people, he GAVE almost 30%of his OWN money to help the needy and took NO salary while serving others. Limited government and JOBS will help poor Americans of all racial backgrounds and ideologies.
You people don't have to live with the environment that YOU are creating. Let us PLEASE fight real racism, there are so many real examples you can highlight. THIS IS NOT ONE OF THEM.
jr565, Aridgo, mtrobertsatty, Col. Mustard, Baron Zemoo, uztobealib,virgil X, and others similarly disposed:
Bless all of you. Perhaps this November we will save the America we once knew and loved, despite squishes like Althouse. Her posts these last 2 days, however, highlight the magnitude of our challenge.
Romney was just about my last choice for the Republican nomination, and I contributed to several of his opponents. Now, however, I am likely to max out in contributing to his campaign.
Althouse's posts the last 2 days are quite discouraging. I mistakenly had thought more of her, despite her 2008 vote for Obama.
@Tom
It is IMPOSSIBLE to get Althouse to see reason, so what is the point? When she listened to Rush she felt it was racist to replay the clip, we don't think it is. We can go round and round all day long but we will never agree. If Althouse is representative of the TRULY "independent" undecided then we're in trouble. She's dug in her heels. You think WE are dismissing her view, when she is dismissing the views of 600+ blog comments. Reminds me of a married couple arguing. Both sides are convinced of their "rightness." Who will budge? Not I.
@Crack
My point isn't defending Rush Limbaugh I don't even listen to his show. Who knows what's in his heart, who cares? All I can say is I think I am a reasonable enough person and I as a black woman did not see racism or "dog whistles" at play here. When Bill Clinton said Obama would have been carrying his bags, is that a racially tinged remark? Or is he referring to his former status as Jr. Senior and last place in line? Was he simply angry that Obama "took" Hillary's spot? Who knows?
"Good luck trying to convince Althouse. I think if you call her stupid 567 times, she might finally get the point. But don't hold back, call her stupid a thousand times for good measure."
Again, Althouse is totally unaffected by anything anyone posts at her blog, especially her con flock.
It's part of her charm! As she rises above the fray ...
Elspeth R. Says:
"the program is supported by surcharges on phone bills, not tax dollars."
If she can convince herself that this is not a tax, she can convince herself that most people are racists. Why argue with her?
Ann is deeply scared shitless of any association with potential racists, so she's thrown up a storm of posts to PROVE to her librul friends she's NO RACIST.
Well, I think this whole thing is nonsense. To illustrate: I usually agree with Crack about most things but I think he is too angry. Wait, did I just accuse a black man of being too angry? RACISM! Because you are not allowed to express the opinion that persons of certain races have any negative characteristics BECAUSE you are really saying (IN CODE) that all members of said racial group (I don't believe in them, myself, but some folks seem obsessed.) have that negative characteristic. Sadly, intelligent people acting in good faith are willing to play along.
I don't understand why but when we use images of black people, a few of our customers interpret this differently than I would like. I think we should stop using these images until I can drag my candidate across the finish line. I can use different images that make the same point. The important thing here is not to be misinterpreted in a middle of election.
I'm sorry, Tom.
But when your answer is we just have to get every single Republican or conservative to agree to behave in one certain way so no one can be misinterpreted, you really don't have a feasible answer.
Michael,
@Crack: OK, I understand finally. I was wrong. You were right.
Now what?
As the monkey said to the buzzard, "straighten up and fly right," what else?
Can't sleep and the caravan has probably moved on, but I can't help commenting on the fact that anyone who willingly goes thru life using the "too clever by half" pretentious phonetic spelling of Elizabeth (Elspeth) totally forfeits all claim to be regarded as anything but a committed leftist feminist ideologue whose views may be safely ignored..
CouponMom,
@Crack
My point isn't defending Rush Limbaugh I don't even listen to his show. Who knows what's in his heart, who cares?
I used to listen to him a lot, and never heard a racist word come out of his mouth. Plus, his producer, Snerdley, is black, so I have kind of a hard time understanding how all these racist comments are being said without he or I hearing them.
I think Ann isn't used to a post-racial world, where black people aren't always addressed by their skin color - even when being mocked. That's a major theme of conservatism.
All I can say is I think I am a reasonable enough person and I as a black woman did not see racism or "dog whistles" at play here. When Bill Clinton said Obama would have been carrying his bags, is that a racially tinged remark? Or is he referring to his former status as Jr. Senior and last place in line? Was he simply angry that Obama "took" Hillary's spot? Who knows?
I think Clinton was referring to the racial past of this country - that's how I heard it. Did it matter? Not to me. I know Bill Clinton's story, with his "Sistah Soulja" moment and the killing of Ricky Ray Rector, so it was just par for the course. The man's scum and that's all he ever was. Hillary, too, for that matter.
Two of the most celebrated, and wretched, people this political system has ever produced,...
Cannot believe it.
Looks like Ann completely missed it!
This was about unions ... went back and re-listened to Friday's broadcast of Rush where he played 'the tape' again and here are the opening comments:
"That's the 47% that Romney was talking about by the way that is a bought and paid for SEIU protester
we have since learned that the SEIU paid these people 11 dollars an hour to follow Romney around ..."
_Jim
.
Mia Love sucks big ones
So, you're pissed because you're left out?
"This is intellectually dishonest, at best."
How is "intellectual" dishonesty different from dishonesty? Well, it's a phrase that always seems to roll from the tongue of one presuming to argue from a position of moral superiority. And that suffices as a reason for Ms. Althouse to conclude that the nation would be better off if Mr. Obama gets a second term.
This is intellectually stupid, at best.
Although I don't think it would be correct for Ricky Ray to suffer for 50 minutes intentionally, because that would say something very bad about the state and its executioners, the fact this murderer shot himself retarded doesn't affect me nor does his 50 minutes of presumed unintentional pain.
I am glad he is dead and will never kill again. His victims are the heartbreaking part of the story, and maybe even Ricky Ray's family unless they brought this deathshit storm on through negligence or worse.
As my, the most brilliant comment of all time on the interwebs, pointed out under the name "unknown" the other day (not on purpose) the fact is Rush would claim Ann is acting like a member of the Republican Hierarchy.
Anyone upset with her highlighting the thinking of our paid Republican consultants (and sometimes our candidates) is barking up the wrong tree.
This doesn't mean we should, or even can really, self-censor or not allow Rush to be Rush and get all those listeners and voters to argue with their friends/others nearby and change minds and opinions, but it does mean this approach, that works with many, doesn't work with all.
Anyone trying to bully Ann is acting stupidly, as they should know that tactic isn't going to work, and then devise a strategy with tactics that will work.
This takes more than emotion, it takes brains. We got 'em, now we gotta use em. You know her lib coworkers aren't nasty to her face, so why should we be nasty to her in her virtual home and expect her to to listen and change her well-thought-out opinion?
Watch this:
Ann, I really understand where you're coming from with regard to black people being portrayed as stupid for the entertainment of whites. Look at all the racist Hellshit from Hollywood starting a century ago and going strong today in manners both subtle and not. For us, on the right, to engage in such horror is something, of course, we would never intentionally do, and we thank you for trusting us to defend our shared American values against the Hollywood racist and racialists today, tomorrow, and forever.
Watch this video, taken by the same guy who did the Obamaphone video, until it becomes racist.
http://youtu.be/LKKiWUFBXx8
I think I finally figured out what it is, specifically,that is making me so mad at the Obamaphone lady, and those she represents.
It has to do with gratitude.
The complete lack of it.
And it's not even misplaced gratitude that she is displaying.
It's replaced gratitude. She has replaced the gratitude she ought to be feeling for her free phone, provided by taxpayers, with an in-your-face sense of pure entitlement.
And she supports Obama, because he told her she has every right to feel entitled to that phone.
Despicable, actually.
The damage that has been done to civil society by the insidious and steady diminishment of gratitude, is enormous and tragic.
And Obamaphone lady proudly represents all that.
"I swear, you guys LIKE being controlled,..."
Sure they direct traffic. But, you know what? The great majority of people have never heard of instapundit. The MSM directs the conversation too. There's lot's of streams.
I'd only be controlled if I saw these blogs as my source of wisdom and insight. I listen to a lot of voices, swim in a lot of streams, make my own decisions.
And you're the one complaining about how Instapundit and Althouse aren't bowing to your wisdom, so caught in their zone of apparent control that you have to rage against them and all who associate with them as being equivalent to New Age gurus.
Maybe you like being controlled in such a way, gives you a place to rage and people to blame.
But don't complain about others being controlled when your message of late is centered on how Instapundit won't bestow favor upon you, as if you are a vassal requiring his blessing.
If you have a message, if it's truth, you don't need particular bloggers to help you speak. Speak. You have a voice and a great one at that. Show that you're better.
"I don't think you understand machismo"
Ha! Well, I understand enough to know that a commenter on a law professor's blog who spends a lot of time begging for more attention doesn't define it.
I also understand that machismo is something expressed in real life. Your dainty little insults about religion and my apparent goals with what I'm doing and how I'm doing it suggest a highly reactionary response to hurt feelings in your past. There, there, Crack. There, there.
Meanwhile, I know who I am. I know what I do. I know what it means to do the right thing as a man. I know what it is to take stands against those in power. Real power, not rhetorical blogginess power.
It just isn't all that macho to spend all the time explaining to people what macho is and what I've done to express it.
I think you take on the world and have a mission and a voice--but your failing won't be ignoring what you see as truth, your failing will be needing to get the popular kids to put a stamp of approval on your message. Which dilutes the mission.
I know who I am and what I'm doing, how standing against cults and such behavior in or outside organized religion is essentially at the heart of my life's projects. That's why I applaud your message.
It's also why I started off this response with a "ha!"
DADvocate,
Mia Love sucks big ones
So, you're pissed because you're left out?
I don't even know what that means
But anyway, no, I met her at a Tea Party gathering and didn't like her - she's a token, conservative AA thingamajig.
None of my friends like her - my black friends despise her - and we have no reason to feel differently.
It's funny you'd think I'd feel left out of a group of losers I have no intention of joining,...
@Alex
True!
I live in the country..in a rural area. I have been listening to regional snobbery from Liberals for years...they make fun of the way we live, the way we worship, the way we speak, the way we dress...but I guess that is okay. Ann is being a cry baby here. After all, given all the posturing by Obama and his supporters concerning race you could actually say that they invited this sort of thing. After all, the lady is the real thing. Right?
This video makes you not want to vote for Romney because it's racist. Look, pretty much everyone who reads this blog appreciates that you put your opinion out there honestly. It's brave. But do you see that people are not holding back from giving their critique for the same reason that they don't hold back from critiquing Obamaphone lady? It's insulting and uninformed. Of course you're getting blowback.
There is plenty of video out there of white Obamabots saying ridiculous stuff on par with this video, and worse. They're not shy about it! They're so proud to be stupid for Obama, the lemmings. There's one circulating now at legalinsurrection linked up with this Obamaphone one. The featured twit du jour offers as how Christopher Stevens "probably had it coming." Racist? Sexist? Or can we possibly find it in our selves to just say "that's hideous" without reference to the progressive categorizations of humanity? Just because you're hung up on the fact that this particular Obamabot is black does not mean anyone else is. As usual, the people who are wrapped around the axle about race are progressives. The people who have created the level of stupidity that allows a person to think it's just fine to exchange their vote for free stuff and government uber alles are progressives, fucking community organizers and humanity destroyers.
Who is emotionally associating Romney with racial material coming from "other sources"? Repeatedly? You are! And Andy R. In bestowing this honor upon Romney you let Obama off the hook for the voluminous racial material coming directly from the candidate himself, and his vice president, and other high ranking officials as well as his campaign to say nothing of "other sources."
Why the double standard? Is it racially inspired? Is it okay for Obama to say racist/racial stuff because he's black?
Maybe you're right and it's all going to come down to people who just can't get past the racial thing. Again. Who allow themselves to be led about by the media. That's one of the themes lately, that Romney just hasn't "defined" himself (while the media works overtime to misrepresent him). And you're repeating it.
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