The replacement flag read, "There is no God but Allah and Mohammad is his messenger."It is clear that today is September 11th.
Others expressed more general grievances about U.S. policy, chanting anti-American slogans and holding up bits of a shredded American flag to television camera crews in front of the embassy....
The U.S. Embassy said in a statement Tuesday that it "condemns the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims -- as we condemn efforts to offend believers of all religions."
"Respect for religious beliefs is a cornerstone of American democracy," the statement said. "We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."...
It is not clear which film upset the protesters in Cairo.
Interesting statement about rights. The Embassy did not articulate a right not to have your feelings hurt, though at first look, you might think that it did. In fact, it affirmed the right of free speech.
It carefully conveyed the distinction between the U.S. government and those who make films. The filmmakers have a "right of free speech." They don't mean to say that the right is a "right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others" even though the words appear in that sequence and in fact we do have such a right.
They're trying to say some people "abuse" their right to free speech, and that the U.S. government thinks that although there is a right, it's bad to use it in a way that hurts feelings that arise from religious beliefs — or as the U.S. government awkwardly puts it: hurts "the religious beliefs of others." A film insulting a religion doesn't hurt beliefs. How do you hurt beliefs?! You hurt feelings.
Posts
197 comments:
Did we learn nothing in 1979?
If someone climbs the walls of the embassy in an overt act of aggression, shoot them. Why the fuck else do we have armed US Marines in front of every embassy?
I have to say I'm a bit ashamed of the statement from our Egyptian embassy.
Really, publicly affirming one's disagreements with Islam is an abuse of free speech?
We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."
Whoever wrote this should be fired.
We can add that savings to the 1.7 billion in aid we should cancel by the end of the day.
BTW I'm not saying that out of a thirst for blood. I think that, once they find they can do this with impunity, we may well have a Tehran 1979 situation on our hands really soon.
That's bad for America, and it's wrong for any country to sit back and allow that to happen to its diplomatic corps.
"Respect for religious beliefs is a cornerstone of American democracy," the statement said. "We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others.".
Since when?
So in other words, free speech is sancrosanct unless it offends someone. Got it.
Maybe Obama can go over there and bow to someone. Perhaps that will make everyone feel better.
"Whoever wrote this should be fired."
Yeah, we can allow them to be taken hostage for all I care. But not innocent people.
I bet Barack Obama wrote the statement.
I seem to recall the second worst president having some difficulty keeping embassy security intact.
Hurting the feelings of Muslims is pretty easy. Maybe its time for another apology tour.
it's wrong for any country to sit back and allow that to happen to its diplomatic corps.
True. I'd like to see how the police in Egypt will handle it. I'm not holding my breath for an outcome in which the protestors are arrested. Maybe the continued $1.7bn in aid should be contigent on something good happening.
At the same time, I don't think martyring them for this is worthwhile.
I wonder what would happen is USA protestors invaded the Egyptian compound in DC.
But the statement should read: Americans have a right to free speech. Feel free to be offended by it, but don't expect America to change because you're offended.
So much for the Arab Spring and Smart Diplomacy.
Maybe the trolls should start looking at their foreign policy excuses.
The U.S. Embassy said in a statement Tuesday that it "condemns the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims
Somebody needs to be fired. Before you represent our country abroad you need to swear an Oath to follow our Constitution. Or at least read the fucking thing, you fucking morons.
How nice that we are represented abroad by the sniveling, bowing, toe-sucking class of spineless squishes!
"Maybe Obama can go over there and bow to someone. Perhaps that will make everyone feel better."
Or Hillary could press the "re-set" button again. And we could have yet another glorious revolution in the Islamic middle east which merely results in further repression of the people of the middle east and the general annoyance of everyone else.
Hey, it's 1979 all over again!
What Barry D said. Start to climb MY wall and you get warning shots. Come over my wall and you get aimed fire from Marines.
I was shocked by this as well:
An embassy operator told CNN that the facility had been cleared of diplomatic personnel earlier Tuesday, ahead of the apparent threat, while Egyptian riot police were called to help secure the area.
I thought, when there was a security problem, you brought people into the Embassy rather than send them whereever.
Bottom line. If you aren't going to defend the Embassy and it's not safe for your staff, why have Marines? Close it and bring all those nearly hostages home before Romney needs to send the 6th Fleet in to get them.
Oh, and that Billion in aid that Hillary was talking about.
Bet somewhere in Cairo there is a Marine Gunny hanging his head in shame...
Fugettaboutit
BarryD said...
Did we learn nothing in 1968?
There: FIFY
Son Of Carter. Maybe another hostage taking will be the October surprise. First carter give us Khomenei. Now Obama is giving us The Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt.
What could go wrong?
How do you hurt beliefs?! You hurt feelings.
You mistake the subject and the direct object. It should be:
"Someone felt hurt in relation to something you did."
That way there's no actor, and it's more accurate.
If memory serves, the CO at an embassy is the ambassador; only (s)he can give an order to fire.
It's not the usual chain of command.
"Respect for religious beliefs is a cornerstone of American democracy," the statement said. "We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others.".
Mohammed sucks.
Can I stop paying taxes now?
If someone climbs the walls of the embassy in an overt act of aggression, shoot them. Why the fuck else do we have armed US Marines in front of every embassy?
So you want to provoke an international incident? Thank god there are clearer heads in charge.
Didn't Egypt get most of their money from tourism? I wonder how their tourism industry is doing right now.
They don't have the luxury of sitting on a big goddamn pool of oil that some of their neighbors have. If we closed the money spigot, these nincompoops would feel it.
And you know, a billion here, a billion there (Pakistan) and pretty soon, you're talking about serious money (as the old joke was once made about mere millions).
Too bad neither Obama nor Romney would actually cut off aid.
"We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."
Whaddya mean, "We", Kemosabe? The U.S. Government officially believes that anti-religious speech is abusive? When did we vote on that? Incoherent and offensive drivel.
When you believe that your God will strike down those that insult your religion and He or She doesn't, that really does hurt your beliefs.
Really, the summation of anti-Americanism in all it's forms can be boiled down to this, "We're good, faithful followers, how come we live in sh*t and poverty while those godless *ssholes over there are living the good life?"
But Jesus H. Christ! Have we no respect for the Constitution?
Bryan - would you be as sanguine if it were anti-Christian bigotry?
MadisonMan said...
I wonder what would happen is USA protestors invaded the Egyptian compound in DC.
I know what would happen if you came over the wall to the Russian Embassy in Cairo...
Back in the 1985, for example, Islamic terrorists in Lebanon kidnapped 4 Russian diplomats (and killed 1). The Russians (then the Soviets, a distinction without much difference in these matters) quickly found out which faction had their guy, kidnapped a relative of one of the kidnappers, and had a body part delivered to the Islamic kidnappers. The message was, release the Russian diplomat unharmed, or the KGB (Soviet secret police) would keep sending body parts, and grabbing kinfolk of the kidnappers. The Russian diplomat was released.
Beliefs can be hurt, and that's precisely the problem.
Groups of people don't care about physical hurt, or emotional hurt, but they'll do anything to prevent belief hurt. That's pretty much what defines global fundamentalisms.
That's why when there are massive riots after some perceived slight, it's the slight that gets emphasized while the people who get hurt or killed are barely mentioned.
People here are being very unfair to President Obama. He has in the past spoken out very forthrightly against those who cling to guns and religion. Do you think he only meant white Pennsylvanians? You don't appreciate the subtlety of the man.
Still another jarring reminder how much Obama is like Carter.
edutcher said...
If memory serves, the CO at an embassy is the ambassador; only (s)he can give an order to fire.
correct, but there should be standing orders about various scenarios. Suppose a guy come over the wall with 20 pounds of C4 strapped around his chest. Do you shoot him on the wall, or allow him to run up to the building while you call for instructions?
Alex said...
So you want to provoke an international incident? Thank god there are clearer heads in charge.
The diplomatic incident already occurred when the local police lost control of the area outside the Embassy as required by international covention and allowed hostile persons to invade the soil of the USA.
Put up flags all over for them to tear down.
Make it a daily search for them.
It wouldn't surprise me at all if there wasn't a movie. Just like there wasn't a "cartoon" of Muhammad as a pig or getting humped by a dog.
Those were added and distributed along with the Danish flags that someone took several months to order.
So who suddenly decided that an American movie offended Muhammad and started pounding pulpits over it?
So that there could be a big old protest, Embassy mobbing, and flag burning on 9-11?
I suppose it's the job of Embassies to be mealy-mouthed appeasers over the world. It's certainly above their pay grade to call the locals on their shenanigans. But I sure wish someone would.
But, but .........we were told if we elect Obama Hussein they will love us more..... And didn't the Democrat's tell us last week
"We are more respected and loved around world because Obama is the best President in the whole wide world"......
someelse that's as fake as Obama's 19 million face book followers .
Alex said...
So you want to provoke an international incident? Thank god there are clearer heads in charge.
So, if a home invader attacks you, and you shoot back to defend yourself, you are actually the one "provoking" the crime? Good to know.
If we're going to have armed Marines at embassies, they should be authorized to shoot, so that only those who provoke the international incidents lose their lives, and not the embassy staff.
And yes, this does feel like Carter v2.0. Maybe we need to organize a hockey game.
Wasn't Cairo supposed to be an example of Obama's foreign policy? And can we now use the lefty argument against Obama. It's blowback! They just hate us for our policies. We are just creating more terrorists!
Obama lied/ people died! Hey hey HO HO Obama's got to go. Sorry, getting carried away channeling my inner leftist.
"Bryan - would you be as sanguine if it were anti-Christian bigotry?"
Um, yes? The vast majority of non-imaginary Christians would feel the same way.
In all seriousness, some of my best friends are anti-Christian bigots. It's not something I get upset about.
"But Jesus H. Christ! Have we no respect for the Constitution?"
That's rhetorical, I assume?
BTW, Do you know what that "H." stands for? Hallmark. Because God cared enough to send the very best.
Some day, Americans will realize that most people who join the Foreign Service do so not to explain or represent America to the rest of the world, but to explain and represent the world to America.
That day cannot come soon enough.
We can start by changing the chief executive to which Foreign Service officers report.
The Egyptians are very dangerous enemies because they are the smart ones. The capture of that much brain power by a religious spirit that sends them out to eliminate the Jews and the Christians ( a sect of Judaism) is a true dark day.
I remember the Egyptian pilot who was mad about his Moslim life so he shouted "allah akbar" and turned the plane's nose down and flew it at full speed straight into the sea.
Which reminds me of Muslim raised pilot Obama who has lowered the nose and is now flying the American financial system at full speed straight into the sea of a financial disaster and world wide depression.
'We're idiots and we're here,' is kind of a variant of the gay rights chant, 'We're queer and we're here.'
Alex said...
Bryan - would you be as sanguine if it were anti-Christian bigotry?
What evidence exists the alleged cause of the riot includes bigotry?
"Close it and bring all those nearly hostages home before Romney needs to send the 6th Fleet in to get them."
And Obama's people must understand, it will be Romney who is Commander-in-Chief, if that happens. They must understand that, right? They can't all have been born since 1980.
This is not an Obama reaction. This has been the reaction of all western civilization to the acts of barbarians.
It's time we stop putting up with it.
We need to unequivocally defend freedom of speech and freedom of religion as the two most important freedoms that man has, and this is non-negotiable.
"So you want to provoke an international incident?"
No. This is already an international incident. Nothing we can do about that. All eyes are on us, to see what we do. It's not about Egypt, any more.
Tehran 1979 led to 9/11/2001. Osama Bin Laden said exactly that.
So, if a home invader attacks you, and you shoot back to defend yourself, you are actually the one "provoking" the crime? Good to know.
Bad analogy. First that would mean you go locate your home in GANGLAND and then complain that the criminals break in? You might as well bend over and take it.
What evidence exists the alleged cause of the riot includes bigotry?
Even Michael Medved said it was offensive to the Prophet Mohammed.
The Drill SGT said...
I wonder what would happen is USA protestors invaded the Egyptian compound in DC.
I know what would happen if you came over the wall to the Russian Embassy in Cairo...
Back in the 1985, for example, Islamic terrorists in Lebanon kidnapped 4 Russian diplomats (and killed 1). The Russians (then the Soviets, a distinction without much difference in these matters) quickly found out which faction had their guy, kidnapped a relative of one of the kidnappers, and had a body part delivered to the Islamic kidnappers. The message was, release the Russian diplomat unharmed, or the KGB (Soviet secret police) would keep sending body parts, and grabbing kinfolk of the kidnappers. The Russian diplomat was released.
But that's Torture, according to all our little Leftists.
We can't be nasty to our enemies.
What's the matter with you?
Why warning shots?
Invading an embassy is tantamount to an act of war and we’d be well within our rights to shoot anyone who tried to force their way in or over the gate. Considering this is the anniversary of the most infamous terrorist attack in US history and that we have no way of determining whether any invader is carrying an explosive or worse, we’d be foolish not to assume the worst and act accordingly.
Reading stories like this one just makes me want to thank President Obama for keeping us safe these four years. Nobody thought it could be done! THANK YOU.
"First that would mean you go locate your home in GANGLAND"
No it wouldn't. Look at where these crimes take place, you arrogant fool.
"Even Michael Medved said it was offensive to the Prophet Mohammed."
What do you men, "even"? Like Medved is some sort of civil libertarian hero or something?
In fact, it affirmed the right of free speech.
No, not really, because it described the act of offending someone else as "an abuse of free speech".
The right to offend others IS the right to freedom of speech. You don't need a "right" to say things that don't bother anybody, because obviously nobody would ever object to them.
Why would you expect the President to react in any way to displease the Brotherhood.
America does not care in the least. They are too fat and happy.
After all our ultimate response to 911was to elect a Muslim President.
You should not be surprised you fools.
Even Michael Medved said it was offensive to the Prophet Mohammed
Michael Medved is an enthusiastic supporter of censorship where speech "offensive" to social and religious norms is concerned.
You might as well say that "even" Barack Obama favors tax increases on the rich.
"Reading stories like this one just makes me want to thank President Obama for keeping us safe these four years. Nobody thought it could be done! THANK YOU."
So you confirm that you're a sockpuppet, with this. Thanks.
Nobody, Democrat, Republican or whatever, would just write this spontaneously. It did make me laugh, though, so at least you're a funny sockpuppet. I hope they're paying you well.
One might even suggest that Michael Medved is rather disturbingly enthusiastic about theocracy in the social realm.
Alex said...
Even Michael Medved said it was offensive to the Prophet Mohammed.
Can you substitute a name for "it"?
replacing it with a black standard with Islamic emblems
You mean this flag?
I think everyone refers to that flag as an al Qaida flag--except for those that do not want to be truthful...er, hurtful of the muslim image.
There really is a movie.
Muslims are in full "religion of peace" mode over "Mohammad's Trial," a 13 minute film produced by US-based Coptic-Christian Egyptians to be broadcast Tuesday as part of the 12th anniversary commemoration of the New York City and Washington, D.C. 9/11 Muslim raids.
Ahram Online
Sadly, Obama supports radical Islamist control of Libya, Tunisia, Egypt and Syria.
Obama will do nothing.
The fact is he agrees with them in his heart.
He hates America just as much as they do.
"Respect for religious beliefs is a cornerstone of American democracy," the statement said. "We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."...
Last year in Cairo and our government said what.....? Sorry, speak up! I can’t hear you.........
Coptic Christians slaughtered in Egypt as the world looks away
Multiculturalism works great so long as all the cultures you include are tolerant of other cultures. That's where PCism comes in.
Political Correctness is a nice way to paper over intolerant cultures, and make them appear to be tolerant. For instance, it is not politically correct to think of Muslim Terrorists as Muslims.
Political Correctness also generates memes like "Blacks can't be racist."
Zemo, please shut the fuck up and go away. We've got enough phony right-wingers here already.
So you confirm that you're a sockpuppet, with this. Thanks.
Nah, been posting under this same screen name for close to 7 yrs now. Glad you like :)
Even Michael Medved said it was offensive to the Prophet
Mohammad
well let's not assume that because we have a right to free speech that we can't be offensive about it. Lefties are offensive about Christians all the time. Crack is more than offensive about mormonism. They have a right to be. Doesn't mean they arent assholes about it though.
It IS offensive to deliberately insult someone's religious beliefs. BUT what is REALLY offensive is the response to that offensive language.
Right now, only Islam is so thin skinned that saying anything negative about it gets you killed.
"I think everyone refers to that flag as an al Qaida flag--except for those that do not want to be truthful.."
I suspect that, if "Al Qaida Flag" were plastered all over the headlines, people would REALLY wonder why the Marines didn't open fire. Al Qaida is a group that has declared war on the US. An embassy is US soil. Many of us still remember these facts.
Well if they want to have a tantrum at the US Embassy instead of murdering Copts, I suppose that's the better thing.
It hurts my feelings to be called an infidel. Whose flag can I tear down and burn?
My dear boy I am as phony as you are you sanctimonious twit.
The fact is Obama will do nothing and he does favor the actions of the Muslim brotherhood. He will do nothing to stop them. As he would stand by and see Israel destroyed.
Nice to see you to defend free speech. Was that not the content of this thread?
BarryD said:
"An embassy is US soil. Many of us still remember these facts."
Muslims remember that soil once occupied by Islam, is always Muslim land. Andalusia will forever be Muslim no matter how long we call it Spain.
Indigo Red said...
There really is a movie.
I don't doubt that movie exists. But all three reports I've read, including the one linked by the professor, says the source of the anger isn't clear.
So to follow up:
jr565 said...
well let's not assume that because we have a right to free speech that we can't be offensive about it.
No one is saying we can't be, but asserting we are takes some evaluation. We're not going to accept the rantings of a rioting lunatic as factual, are we?
Also, if anyone had any back-bone we'd retaliate appropriately... how about this as an official US Embassy statement?
"The United States will contribute money equal to the cost of repairs to our embassy to the producers of the film Muhammad's Trial."
And when they hire Egyptian crews to do the labor, they should only hire Copts.
Even Michael Medved said it was offensive to the Prophet Mohammed.
He's been dead for quite a while. How can a dead person be offended?
Garage mahal wrote:
Reading stories like this one just makes me want to thank President Obama for keeping us safe these four years. Nobody thought it could be done! THANK YOU.
wait so now the left is acknowledging the threat they needed to be protected from. Where were you during the eight years of Bush?
The jihadi-created international incident in Egypt today makes me sick, as does the feeble response of the regime. It was an insult to the 9/11 victims and was meant to be such. And our tax dollars are still being sent over there.
This incident at least deserves withdrawal of the American Ambassador until Egypt takes steps to guarantee the safety of our diplomatic personnel and our sovereign property, but the administration's response is worse than Obama's bowing to that Saudi King.
I'm sure that the angry protesters could be quelled with just the right statement from some diplomat. That's all they ever want. No, really.
911 means nothing to Obama.
You can tell by his reactions and body language today.
He shrugs and thinks of it as an unpleasant duty he has to do to pretend to hold the same values as most of America.
He would rather be golfing.
Wait, our embassy "firmly rejects" the actions of people who made some film, and we don't yet know what film it was, let alone what was in it?
US Consulate set ablaze in Benghazi, Libya
Please forgive me for commenting before reading all the other comments, but this hits too close to home to wait. This year our exchange daughter is an Egyptian Coptic Christian. Ask me how confident I am that her family is safe, and that I'm comfortable sending her back home to the new "free" Eqypt.
The U.S. Embassy said in a statement Tuesday that it "condemns the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims -- as we condemn efforts to offend believers of all religions."
Really? Because it's pretty damned easy to "hurt the religious feelings of Muslims" - are they condemning the annual Victoria's Secret Fashion Show? I bet that offends Muslims.
And they really condemn efforts to offend believers of all religions? Including the Democrat Party shills who make fun of Romney's "secret underwear" and the many academics and others on the left who refer to Jesus as "an imaginary friend? Maybe a bunch of Christians should storm and embassy or two, then they'll get some respect.
Oh, hey - how do they feel about the movement in Germany to make male circumcision illegal?
Once upon a time, if an embassy was attacked we'd response with lethal force on scene and immediately.
Not anymore.
This statement from the US State Department just goes to show you...that they must really hate the Crack Emcee.
Paddy @3:38
"Groups of people don't care about physical hurt, or emotional hurt, but they'll do anything to prevent belief hurt."
Blithely ruin their careers and credibility, avert their eyes from reality, doom their children and grandchildren to economic slavery, kill their elders and unborn children, demonize and drown out anyone who speaks contra to their religion.
"Beliefs can be hurt, and that's precisely the problem."
The utopian ideal fantasy world must be preserved at all costs.
This has a familiar ring, no? The aggrieved ragers at the US Embassy look a lot like our homegrown grievance mongers in Occupy and elsewhere. Not a coincidence.
I think we should follow the example set by the Brits when they not only shut their Tehran embassy but also ordered the Iranian embassy in London to close. Circumstances were the same as in Cairo - Iranian protesters stormed and damaged the British embassy.
America should also tell President Mohamed Morsi that his request for forgiveness of Egyptian debt to the U,S, is denied!
Marshall said @Indigo Red
"I don't doubt that movie exists. But all three reports I've read, including the one linked by the professor, says the source of the anger isn't clear."
I think Ahram Online is very clear what the source of the anger is.
Egyptian protesters on Tuesday took down the American flag from the walls of the US embassy in Cairo during a thousands-strong demonstration held to protest a short film produced by US based Coptic-Christians that critics say demeans Islam and the Prophet Mohammed.
That is assuming Muslims need some auxiliary source for anger and violence beyond Allah commands destruction and killing of all things infidel.
My news source is also more recent than the good Professor's source.
There was a time when Islam was the religion of the most developed and sophisticated societies in the world. But now, much of Islam has been taken over by ignorant, childish, murderous bullies. What the adults of the world ought to do is put them all in time out. No more embassies from the civilized world, no more foreign aid, no more visas to the garden spots of the West, etc.
But we won't do it because so much of the oil we use is under Muslim sands. There may not be any oil in Egypt, but we're afraid to treat them as they deserve to be treated for fear it will piss off their fellow Muslims who have the oil.
(By the way, almost all the American Muslims I've met are fine, grown-up people (as grown-up, at least, as most of us), so I don't think this is a religious matter, but a cultural one.)
So I say: Let's get fracking, let's start digging our coal, let's expand the oil wells on the continental shelf, let's start building current-generation nuclear plants. So we can give those middle-easterners the time out they need for a generation or two (or three).
The question "why today" has a different answer than... because everyone got spontaneously upset about a movie.
Synova said...
Also, if anyone had any back-bone we'd retaliate appropriately... how about this as an official US Embassy statement?
VNJAGVET beat me but here goes.
Since the Government of Egypt has demonstrated repeatedly that it can not protect its Christian population and now also the US Embassy we are taking the following steps immediately:
1. Closing our Embassy in Cairo
2. Withdrawing our diplomatic staff, while reminding the Egyptian government that the ground remain US soil and a return to the Embassy is predicated on demonstrating a restored respect for its sanctity
3. advising US citizens throughout Egypt to leave the country immediately
4. We are diverting the $1.7Billion in proposed Eqyptian aid to the following Coptic aid groups....
5. For the forseeable future, the State department has determoned that Egypt is unsafe for Americans and other Western tourists. We recommend that unless it is an emergency, that you avoid the country.
6. The Swiss government has graciously volunteered to serve as the Interest section for any US citizens that find themselves stranded in the country.
"Blogger garage mahal said...
Reading stories like this one just makes me want to thank President Obama for keeping us safe these four years. Nobody thought it could be done! THANK YOU. "
garage just sounds like a sock puppet.
You could also thank Barry for keeping the Fort Hood soldiers safe while you're at it. And the Somali victims. And the folks at the El Al counter at LAX and the...
Alex,
First that would mean you go locate your home in GANGLAND and then complain that the criminals break in?
This cannot be a serious comment. Are you really saying that the people who live in ghettos should just have to put up with crime? And so by analogy, when a US embassy, which in American soil lest you forget, is invaded by violent foreigners, this should just be accepted?
Alex,
Even Michael Medved said it was offensive to the Prophet Mohammed.
Fuck that pedophile warlord.
"it [Egypt's Nour Party] submitted a request to the US embassy demanding that the US government ban broadcast of the film and issue an official apology for its offensive content."
Somehow I just don't think they quite get the "free speech" thing.
And I'd guess the U.S. Embassy prefers that it remain so- just think of how murderously angry they'd be if they truly comprehended the blasphemous horrors permitted by the USA's First Amendment!
Although arguably what the Embassy is doing is (or should be) deeply insulting to Egyptians, as it inherently assumes that they're just too weak (or deranged) to handle the truth about the extent of freedoms in the USA.
I wonder how far back the tradition of yelling with fists in the air and eyes bugging out goes.
What did crowds do before that.
"Since the Government of Egypt has demonstrated repeatedly that it can not protect its Christian population and now also the US Embassy we are taking the following steps immediately:
1. Closing our Embassy in Cairo
2. Withdrawing our diplomatic staff, while reminding the Egyptian government that the ground remain US soil and a return to the Embassy is predicated on demonstrating a restored respect for its sanctity"
Instead, Barry cancelled most of the military exercises with Israel and changed them to Egypt. We're now sort of honorary Muslim Brothers, except, of course, for riots and stuff.
Who does " Shouting Tomas". think he's fooling, cloaks all his arguments as if he's conservative... then you realize there all just rationzaions for Obama and critiques for Romney
And the best he wants Oama to win, supposedly because of divide government
What will divided government bring us if Obama and democrats already passed every major legislation two years old,
Obamacare, reordering of the whole healthcare system, which will be in full 2013,
Dodd/frank reordering of Wallstreet and Financial markets,
government took over college debt, another bubble to burst.
Stimulus wasn't just 860 billion dollars of one time spending, democrats added 359 billion in welfare spending to the baseline of the federal budget.
Plus Obama added 11, 312 new regulations in 3 years
And numerous other bills, executive orders that will take to long to name.
All Obama will do with another 4 years is protect the crap he inflicted on America when Democrat's got flukky and got a super majority...
All republicans will just be is tax collectors for tsunami of debt we already have and the exploding debt once Obamacre starts paying out , and the markets realize America's debt and deficits are worse then anything in Europe right now.
But go try , I guess Axlrod is trying reverse sociology ....
The Twitter page for US Embassy, Cairo shows a blended US/Egyptian flag.
That's why Obama is the best...
https://twitter.com/USEmbassyCairo
They're on American soil once in the Embassy grounds.
Shoot them down like the dogs they are.
I just read something elsewhere how these are just a small group of Salafist extremists, or something.
But a person has to wonder even more then; why are WE apologizing to THEM?
"garage mahal said...
Reading stories like this one just makes me want to thank President Obama for keeping us safe these four years. Nobody thought it could be done! THANK YOU." Thirteen Americans at Fort Hood were unavailable for comment.
Synova -
There is no binary choice between attacking the U.S. Embassy and persecuting the Coptic Christians. I am sure they will do both, and in fact the protests at the Embassy seem designed to further inflame prejudice against the Copts.
Our assholes are tweeting.
I hate this administration.
Garage@3:57
GOFUCKYOURSELF!
IN RE JIHADI CAEDITE EOS NEVIT ENIM DOMINUS QUI SUNT ELUS
Synova said...
The question "why today" has a different answer than... because everyone got spontaneously upset about a movie.
This could be another reason (as if Muslims need alternate and multiple reasons):
11 years after 9/11, Egyptian still languishes in Guantanamo
GOFUCKYOURSELF!
So, I'm to assume you like jihadi attacks? Nice. Real nice.
Alex: So you want to provoke an international incident? Thank god there are clearer heads in charge.
Thats what you said when Hilter occupied the Rhineland. And when he took the Sudetenland.
Go back to playing with your xbox.
rhhardin said, "I wonder how far back the tradition of yelling with fists in the air and eyes bugging out goes."
I'd guess it goes back about as far as as television (or at least photojournalism). What's the point of performance art without an audience?
No US member of our Diplomatic Staff should ever be allowed to Tweet ANYTHING.
How freaking embarrassing.
And how could the "don't use free speech to hurt feelings" is anything at all but siding AGAINST the Copts and justifying oppression and outrage?
Oh Em Gee... A bunch of Copts got MURDERED so some other Copts made a movie and hurt some feelings?
If the Embassy can't find a mote of clarity over the incidents they all need to be fired and replaced.
Why should they be replaced?
They reflect the world view of the President and his party.
Seriously Garage, now is not the time to try to score points. How old are you? Are you really the 14 year old you appear to be? These are serious times and serious events. I care about our children and the countries to which we send them home. So I say again, GOFUCKYOURSELF!
"Muslims remember that soil once occupied by Islam, is always Muslim land. Andalusia will forever be Muslim no matter how long we call it Spain."
If that's the case, then we'd best stop screwing around and get crackin'. Generally, though, I think that most of the billion people identified as Muslim just want to be left alone, just like most everyone else.
The Jihadists, on the other hand...
"US Consulate set ablaze in Benghazi, Libya"
And so we already begin to reap the consequences of our failure to defend the embassy in Egypt?
Reading stories like this make me want to thank Vice-President Cheney for keeping us safe these last eleven years. Thank you Mr. Vice-President!
The only sensible thing Bark's done in his time in office is grab his ankles and keep Cheney's programs in place.
The writer doesn't know the difference between eluding and alluding?
If you think about it... AGAIN... the Christians respond to violence with non-violence and the Muslims respond to non-violence with violence.
Is it REALLY that hard to chose sides?
Is it really necessary for our Embassy to attempt to appease those who are clearly in the wrong?
You can harm beliefs if you cause doubt. Making someone think about their beliefs might strengthen them too. The problem isn't with the one challenging the beliefs.
"Blogger gadfly said...
I think we should follow the example set by the Brits when they not only shut their Tehran embassy but also ordered the Iranian embassy in London to close."
The Brits closed the Iranian embassy after a radical Muslim shot a British policewoman who was guarding the embassy. The SAS went in and kicked ass. I was there about a week later. It was quite a battle and the embassy stayed closed for a while.
Obama released a statement condemning US citizens using freedom of speech in a way that offends Muslims. It is a revolting denunciation of our rights by our president.
"condemns the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims -- as we condemn efforts to offend believers of all religions."
"Respect for religious beliefs is a cornerstone of American democracy. We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."
Nauseating.
NB Freedom of religion does not equal "respect for religious beliefs."
Guess that means the Obama admin has e.g. defunded the National Endowment for the Arts, prohibited the teaching of evolution in public schools, and rebuked those who argue for gay marriage, right? Since anything that "offends believers" or "hurts religious beliefs" is to be condemned.
Whoever wrote that is an idiot.
Remember how Obama running a successful campaign was proof of his leadership skills?
Boy, isn't America lucky that all worked out so swell?
Egypt vows structural reforms, meets US executives
The move by Mohammed Morsi, who hails from the Muslim Brotherhood, aimed to assuage fears that an Islamist-led economic program could dampen investment, particularly in tourism. Morsi vowed that Egypt would remain a secular state, said Ahmed Ghanim, head of biotech firm Bio Natural America Institute.
Good start, no?
"Guess that means the Obama admin has e.g. defunded the National Endowment for the Arts, prohibited the teaching of evolution in public schools, and rebuked those who argue for gay marriage, right? Since anything that "offends believers" or "hurts religious beliefs" is to be condemned."
Heh.
Maybe offended Christians should start burning stuff down instead of making movies.
Whoever wrote that is an idiot
More specifically, whoever wrote that is a foreigner to American thought and ideas. They are utterly unfit to represent us.
"Remember how Obama running a successful campaign was proof of his leadership skills?"
Why yes, yes I do.
Blew my mind then, blows it now.
My dear fellows!
It is only important that we not offend Muslim beliefs or denigrate their cult.
Everyone else can have their symbols rest in jar of urine and be funded by the government.
garage mahal said...
Reading stories like this one just makes me want to thank President Obama for keeping us safe these four years. Nobody thought it could be done! THANK YOU.
Yes. Obama has kept us safe precisely in the manner Chamberlain kept Britain safe in 1938.
When people storm an embassy, they should be met with machine-gun fire.
Otherwise, as others have mentioned, the lesson is "you can storm an American embassy with impunity".
It'd be an act of war if these were State actors... which they might very well be, unofficially or by proxy.
Putin seems to be the Strong Horse. Nobody attacked the Russian embassy, even though they are killing Muslims right and left. They have Dr. Evil, we have Peewee Herman. Which one do you think gets the most respect?
@Mary Beth
Thank you for that. We are so on the same page. Nothing focused my mind more than knowing we would have a Muslim daughter. What would I say to her when she asked me about my beliefs?
"Ayaan Hirsi Ali, shut up. Your kind of speech is contemptible."
Yes. Obama has kept us safe precisely in the manner Chamberlain kept Britain safe in 1938.
I don't man, Obama has been pretty proactive in the killing of American enemies. Even pirates aren't spared. We're inside probably 4-5 countries, not including Iraq or Afghanistan. Not sure what more he should be doing.
BarryD said
"Generally, though, I think that most of the billion people identified as Muslim just want to be left alone, just like most everyone else."
That's been my experience with the Muslims I've known and worked with.
It's fine to criticize a movie, by the way.
What's horrible is to wait until the American flag is torn to shreads, and then, out of pure cowardly fear, abase and attack your own freedom of speech.
It's pathetic. I don't know if I've seen a more cowardly display by Americans in my lifetime. Utterly, utterly shameful. And an invitation to further attack, since you're rewarded this behavior! Morons.
We're inside probably 4-5 countries, not including Iraq or Afghanistan.
Imagine how many countries we'd be fighting wars in if he HADN'T won the Nobel Peace Prize.
More specifically, whoever wrote that is a foreigner to American thought and ideas. They are utterly unfit to represent us.
Agreed. This is an expression of U.N. values and ideas-- cf. the U.N. resolution against "defamation of religions"-- not American.
Eventually we will fight World War III against the Muslim world. We can deny it, and evade it, and betray our allies, and appease our enemies in order to avoid it, but nothing we can do will keep us out of it. We may refuse to fight, but the Muslim world will bring the fight to us. Statements such as that released by the Cairo embassy amount to invitations to make war on us.
The war could begin tomorrow, or ten years, or twenty years from now, but the longer we wait, the stronger the Muslim world becomes. The Iraq war delayed them for some time, and in fact that is what has "kept us safe", garage's wishful thinking aside.
If you know anything about early American history, you know it had nothing to do with respect for other people's religious beliefs.
It was about my religious freedom, and fatigue at Old World wars of religion. Not like the New World was totally tolerant of others' religion.
The first freedom is about freedom of religion. There is no right of respect.
You come to Murka, you embrace this freedom. Don't come here and try to recreate the hellhole you escaped from.
Today, let's remember Jan Sobieski's victory over the Ottoman Turks in the Battle of Vienna in 1683. This was the gateway to Western Europe.
Were it not for Sobieski, I might be wearing a burka and getting plowed like a field and beaten like a dog.
This is what leading from behind looks like. I guess Urkel finally put to use that Nobel Peace Prize he received simply for existing to good use after all.
Urkel's moto is "Did I do that?"
"Generally, though, I think that most of the billion people identified as Muslim just want to be left alone, just like most everyone else."
That's been my experience with the Muslims I've known and worked with.
Agree. Most want to live their lives as best as possible.
EGYPTIAN MUSLIMS ASSAULT AMERICAN EMBASSY ON ANNIVERSARY OF SEPTEMBER 11 ATTACKS,
We won't see that headline.
It might be insulting.
My intelligence is insulted.
I am wondering how the drafter of that statement would craft words about booing the inclusion of God in the Democratic platform.
"We firmly reject the actions of the boorish delegates to the Democratic National Convention who booed the name of God and used their universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of other Americans."
Not . . . gonna . . . do . . . it.
Hey the majority of Germans just wanted to live out their lives as best they could in relative peace. Does that eliminate the nation's responsibility for the war? For the Holocaust? At what point will this silent majority of Muslims cease being silent?
Hey Romney, the ball's all teed up for you, take a swing. Or is the new fear in RINO circles offending Arab Americans?
"The move by Mohammed Morsi, who hails from the Muslim Brotherhood, aimed to assuage fears that an Islamist-led economic program could dampen investment, particularly in tourism."
Tourism is dead in Egypt for 50 years. Famine is about 6 months away as they have driven out anyone involved in business or finance. Not even Obama could trash the people who make the country run as effectively as his friends in the Muslim Brotherhood.
I see no useful purpose served by supporting the Egyptian military now that they have renounced the Israeli peace treaty.
Pakistan has nukes so there is some sense in bribing them but not Egypt. Let Saudis feed them.
Oh lovely:
A US official was killed and another wounded on Tuesday as an armed mob protesting over a film they said offended Islam attacked the US consulate in Benghazi, an official told AFP.
Libya's deputy interior minister Wanis al-Sharef said: "One American official was killed and another injured in the hand. The other staff members were evacuated and are safe and sound."
He could not say if the dead man was a diplomat.
Aren't you glad Obama is such a good foreign policy President?
I can't find any content summary that would allow anyone to accurately describe the film as bigoted.
What a SCOAMF Obama is.
Close the embassy, now.
Get out, now.
Tyrone Slothrop said...
Eventually we will fight World War III against the Muslim world. We can deny it, and evade it, and betray our allies, and appease our enemies in order to avoid it, but nothing we can do will keep us out of it. We may refuse to fight, but the Muslim world will bring the fight to us. Statements such as that released by the Cairo embassy amount to invitations to make war on us.
The war could begin tomorrow, or ten years, or twenty years from now, but the longer we wait, the stronger the Muslim world becomes.
==================
No, we need to wait...because the Will is not yet there to wage an effective war that would focus on reducing the power of the Muslims.
Like it or not, 9/11 was a piddlingly small enemy attack and the rest of the world that has seen REAL war and REAL substantial enemy attacks quickly grew sick of America claiming it's 3,000 casualties "Changed Everything"!!
To wage true war...you have to get to a point where people ARE willing to shred the US Constitution, the Geneva Conventions and go at it with the intent to kill and starve vast masses of Muslims and cleanse them off many footholds they have gained.
Not there yet, hope we never will be.
BUt liberals and progressive Jews devotion to enemy rights and insistance that any action is for civilian lawyers dressed in robes to do is stupid,
Even more stupid than the idiot Bush with his nation-building and Religion of Peace garbage. And all the powers that be are FAR too deferential to whacked up ideologies deeply hostile to America and many other nations that has a religious component to the Idealogy.
No, David, it does not. Muslims who do not speak out against violence in their name are just as culpable as those actively destroying and killing.
But, there is a difference - WWII Germans in Germany bore the weight of the guilt; Muslims today, all over the world, carry the weight of guilt for the violent actions of a huge Muslim lunatic fringe minority.
I don't want to find out how many of the Muslim silent majority would join in if they thought they could win.
So on the anniversary when America was attacked in the name of Islam, two embassy's were attacked and one person is dead.
Way to go Barry!
Thumbs up!
The oceans stopped rising!
Marshal said...
We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others."
Whoever wrote this should be fired.
We can add that savings to the 1.7 billion in aid we should cancel by the end of the day.
===============
As long as the Jew's piece of the action in the Jimmy Carter welfare entitlement package is canceled as well. Few Arabs or American swould object.
Thats 3 billion a year Israel gets vs the 1.7 Egypt gets a year.
That was supposed to be temporary few years only adjustment sweetener back in 1979, but AIPAC delivered it as a permanent welfare subsidy for Israel..and the Egyptians were smart enough to have language that if Israel kept getting the welfare checks, treaty reciprocity meant Egypt continued to get it's 1.7 billion from US taxpayers.
Caving to Islam...great.
Why are we such cowards when Muslims actively seek to destroy us.
Muslims are the least tolerant people in the world.
"Meanwhile, Muslim Brotherhood spokesman Mahmoud Ghozlan said on Tuesday that the group planned to call for a million-man rally on Friday to register their opposition to the anti-Islam film.
Ghozlan also said that the US administration should issue a formal apology for the film to the Muslim world, adding that the US government should prosecute the "madmen" whose activities were harming Washington's relations with Arab and Muslim countries.
Ahmed Khalil, for his part, a senior leader of Egypt's Salafist Nour Party (which played a leading role in Tuesday's protest), said the party would not call for an open-ended sit-in in front of the embassy. Rather, he said, it had submitted a request to the US embassy demanding that the US government ban broadcast of the film and issue an official apology for its offensive content. Khalil added that the actions of 'certain US citizens' who produced the film served to jeopardize Washington's relations with the entire Muslim world." hint hint
And of course we will comply. We wouldn't want to send a message that the US Constitution trumps Sharia law (do not offend Islam under penalty of death) as that might offend the religious feelings of the Muslim world.
Isn't there anyone Obama can drone attack about this?
Hey, Ann, that's one tortured explanation.
As long as the Jew's piece of the action in the Jimmy Carter welfare entitlement package is canceled as well
Unsurprisingly, Cedarford considers "not giving money to Jews" a higher priority than "not giving money to people who invade our embassies". :)
We can't be nasty to our enemies.
What's the matter with you?
"Nasty" is sometimes needed in wartime...but not as nasty as the picture you painted. Kidnapping innocent family members and cutting off their body parts is not something I would be comfortable at ALL doing and I'd never ask a fellow solider/sailor to do something I wouldn't personally do.
Don't get me wrong. I able/willing to kill if need be (have served as both an Infantry Solider as well as in the US Navy; howz about you?) and got no problem with shoot-to-kill orders against anyone storming an embassy wall (felt that way ever since the Beruit-bombings in '83) but going after innocent family members crosses the line for me. It goes way beyond just "nasty"...it reeks of evil, no matter what the justification given.
Would you, yourself, really be able to cut the fingers of the cousin or sister of someone who did you wrong?
It is also kinda interesting that a hardcore conservative like yourself is looking to the Russians of the '80s as an example we as a country should strive towards. I remember as a kid being told that the Soviets were the Evil Empire and that America, as a society, is way better than them.
Are you suggesting that I was taught wrong and that Reagan should have should have instead emulated the Russians rather than face 'em down?
Revenant said...
As long as the Jew's piece of the action in the Jimmy Carter welfare entitlement package is canceled as well
Unsurprisingly, Cedarford considers "not giving money to Jews" a higher priority than "not giving money to people who invade our embassies". :)
============
No, just pointing out that we are bound by treaty to give Egypt it's 1.7 billion as long as AIPAC keeps the 3 billion welfare entitlement to Israel viable.
The money to those two welfare queens was only supposed to last a couple years by the initial Camp David understanding.
Another victory for radical Islam. Oh, and they burned down our embassy in Libya.
Another day of shame for Obama and the media.
We have to condemn the film so you can find out what's in it.
"There was a time when Islam was the religion of the most developed and sophisticated societies in the world."
Yes, it was right after those societies were conquered by armies of brutish, ignorant savages shouting "Alahu Akbar". Let's hope it doesn't happen again.
Remember when embassies were so inviolate Julian assange could hide in one?
No, just pointing out that we are bound by treaty to give Egypt it's 1.7 billion
I wonder if you're actually dumb enough to believe that. :)
The treaty was signed by Israel and Egypt. We're not a signatory to that treaty. Jimmy Carter *agreed* to send them money, but that has no binding effect on Obama. It didn't even have a binding effect on Carter.
The only legal obligation we have to send money to either Israel or Egypt is that Congress authorized it in the budget. Even then, the President (under his foreign policy and executive powers) can simply opt not to send it.
But hey, look on the bright side.
When the Middle East is embroiled in WW III, we might actually have to start drilling for all the oil we have in US territory, look for REALISTIC alternative energy sources instead of greenie hallucinations, and build that pipeline from Canada (that is, if Canada isn't pissed off enough to tell us where to stick it by then).
Energy independence. That's what Obama said he wants, right? Maybe this is a start!
"it [Egypt's Nour Party] submitted a request to the US embassy demanding that the US government ban broadcast of the film and issue an official apology for its offensive content."
I hope someone sent back a note that read: "Nuts!"
I can't imagine what they'd be doing if they didn't love Barack Obamam so much.
"Nasty" is sometimes needed in wartime...but not as nasty as the picture you painted. Kidnapping innocent family members and cutting off their body parts is not something I would be comfortable at ALL doing and I'd never ask a fellow solider/sailor to do something I wouldn't personally do.
I'm not with the Penguin on too much, but I'm with him on this. We don't trade innocent people for our diplomats, and we don't slice limbs from innocent people.
But you also don't don "nothing" which is the grand total of what "leading from behind" is.
--Son Of Carter. Maybe another hostage taking will be the October surprise. First carter give us Khomenei. Now Obama is giving us The Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt. --
I think it was Vodkapundit who posted a few months ago The Muslim Brotherhood declared war on us. We ignored that like we ignored Al Queda and 5 years later, the clock is ticking.
It is now officially the policy of the US Government that Islam is not to be criticized or mocked lest one be accused of abusing their free speech rights.
Good going guys! You gave the barbarians exactly what they wanted.
"Eventually we will fight World War III against the Muslim world. .....The Iraq war delayed them for some time, and in fact that is what has "kept us safe", garage's wishful thinking aside."
Eventually? What eventually? We're fighting it now. At least they're fighting it, and some us are aware it's going on.
Harold said...
Eventually? What eventually? We're fighting it now. At least they're fighting it, and some us are aware it's going on.
If you think this is World War III, you've got another thing coming. I'm talking about entire cities, ours and theirs, gone in a flash of light. Maybe entire countries.
Carter was blind-sided. This one planned it.
Condemn Catholicism and apologize to islam. Do you need anything more to tell you what Obama's agenda (and true religion)is?
Remember ten days ago when Obama said "Around the world, there is a new respect for America."
Utter bullshit.
The war could begin tomorrow, or ten years, or twenty years from now
Fortunately, mass religious fanaticism doesn't last forever. The question is, has it peaked yet?
@Ralph L
Wow, tell me more. I'm a religious person, but I do believe and acknowledge that mass religious fanaticism is one of the more enduring motivations around.
So I'm more than a little surprised by your comment.
Home of the submissive. What a shame. The American philosophy which held individual dignity and human life in high regard was a short-lived example of positive progress for the human condition. Unfortunately, without a will to preserve our sovereignty, we are no longer exceptional, but merely another population which elects or is coerced to exchange their liberty for submission with benefits. Well, at least until evils are no longer sufferable. I suppose each generation must recognize and preserve their dignity anew.
Ralph L:
It's worth noting that while religion has indeed been exploited to commit human and individual rights violations, it has been secular interests which have murdered and enslaved more people, in more places, in shorter time periods, and most recently. However, it is incorrect to assign blame to either religion or atheism for the nonsense. The common thread which joins all individuals and cooperatives in their quest to dominate and exploit others is a disregard for individual dignity and human life, and dreams of instant gratification.
CWJ, seen any Puritans or Zealots lately? Are you expecting the Spanish Inquisition?
In 2009, the Iranians showed how tired they are of strict theocracy (and Obama did nothing).
I noticed that earlier in the day, the @USEmbassyCairo twitter account had engaged in a (losing) conversation with twitter users (presumably Egyptians; accounts with Arabic names, at a minimum). Unfortunately -- or fortunately, depending on one's perspective -- those tweets have been deleted.
The embassy's tone on twitter reminded me of the way a teenager might engage with a significant other who was about to dump them. My guess is that the embassy hired a twenty-something year old wunderkind with little practical, high stakes life experience to be the social media guru, and the wunderkind thought that the job was going to be all "OMG! The pyramids are so AWESOME! LOL!" and was a little overwhelmed with reality.
As an aside, I recently had a conversation with a 20-something year old social media person who recently became wealthy when Google bought one of his projects. He said, "Twitter changes everything! It powered the Arab Spring, you know!" He had absolutely no clue what I was talking about when I replied, "No, it didn't." My bet is that the embassy staffer thought the same way, and that he or she still doesn't understand why their tweets didn't keep the embassy walls from being breached.
No one is saying we can't be, but asserting we are takes some evaluation. We're not going to accept the rantings of a rioting lunatic as factual, are we?
I haven't seen the movie, and in fact hadn't even heard of it. It MIGHT be offensive. Just as piss Crist was not only offensive, it was meant to provoke offense. And Christians SHOULD have felt offense. But I dont remember any Christians storming embassies or killing anyone over it. The guy who made piss Christ was a douche bag . Yes he had a right to make his art work but it doesnt mean he wasnt an a hole for doing so.
You have a right to be offensive and an asshole and not be killed for it.
This was in response by the way to the assertion that somehow it was wrong of Medved to say insulting Allah or Mohammad was offensive. How is he wrong about that?
That being said, so what? Muslims seem to be incapable of taking offense without going on jihads and storming embassies and chopping off people's heads.
I'M OFFENDED that some savages tore down our flag and put up al Qaeda's. Under Muslim logic. Now would be a good time to kill some random Muslims.
Drop 10 nukes on each country. NOW.
Any nation that doesn't keep mobs of its citizens from attacking OUR SOIL is aiding and abetting attacks on our nation. Therefore, they are enemy countries who portrayed themselves as friends, and should be dealt with swiftly and mercilessly as all traitors to friendship should be.
Obliterate them into a radioactive stone age.
Guaranteed no other country in the world will let anything like this happen for at least fifty years if we do so.
Another way to say it: do you think the Chinese, the Russians, or Israel would let this happen to an embassy without swift, public death to many in revenge?
Patrick and Purple Penguin,
I wasn't advocating the torture of family. I was pointing out however that in some parts of the world, you get more respect with fear than with weakness/love. Some Roman said it well.
"Let them Hate us, as long as they Fear us"
Well there are a bunch of ME Muslims who don't fear us much.
On that note, the same types, killed our Ambassador to Libya yesterday in support of the same issue, along with 3 other diplomatic staff.
Time to channel some Teddy (The good Roosevelt)
Obama and Hillary had both better "man up," fast. Apologies and appeasement won't cut it with most of the American people. A Carter-like response will guarantee a Carter-like election result in November.
Clyde ... from your lips to G-d's ears. One would think that we'd know the script by now, that certainly Obama's adminitration would know it. They do not.
The appeasers have forgotten completely what Tet'1968 Vietcong attack, PAVN Saigon Attack 1975, and Tehran's 1979 Revolution portended. And that is just post WWII...actually, the phenomena is ancient.
Politicians today have failed recall on other similar events of defiance such as Beirut 1983, WTC- NYC 1993, Khobar 1996, and USS Cole 2000, among several others....worst among them being NYC 11 Sep 2001. To me, if I listed this sequence of events to almost any 8th grader they'd come to a conclusion that bigger & worse things were coming.
Now we have Egypt 2012 and Libya 2012, both on an anniversary of 11 Sep 2001. Both highly symbolic attacks, but ones relatively easy to make and fair low risk because they were in their own countries.
The "movements" behind both the "Arab Spring" (a western imaginary concept) are now striving to drag their populace & culture back to 610 AD in a blatant attempt to establish a new "Saladin", a Kurdish Muslim born in Tikrit, Iraq; crowned "Sultan" in 1174 in Cairo, Egypt; died and buried in Damascus, Syria. In short, it is not like this stuff is new to the region these days.
Now in the Jurassic of my youth, say 1958 in high school, virtually every 10th or 11th grader would know who "Salidin" was, what he did, as well as King Richard I of England. We had to take history courses, covering both the BC and AD time spans. No more.
Today? Today I doubt you'd find 1 in 100 high school kids, or adults under 45 who would know who Saladin was, let alone King Richard of 12th century England...BUT we're still making movies and television shows about "robin Hood", eh?
The risk...it is varied, but one of the worst is the fact that today's modern Jihadist Muslims are no where near as civilized as Saladin...not even close. Reason is the same, ignorance abetted by failure or or lack of education.
Clyde, your remark on your own blog, excerpted here, just may be more germane than we think...
It is quite apparent that nation-building in the Middle East is a fool's errand, a waste of vast quantities of American money and American lives. We've been in Afghanistan for almost ten years and it's still one of the world's armpits. Iraq is better, but only marginally so. We would have been better served if we simply crushed our enemies and then left them to rebuild themselves, with the warning that if they ever messed with us again, we'd come back and hit them twice as hard and make the rubble dance. That's the kind of lesson that once applied, seldom needs to be repeated. But such ruthlessness is unfortunately not in the American character.
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