Yesterday, while I was in class, around 4 p.m., Meade went down to the Capitol Square to see what was going on. The main thing was this picket circle in front of M&I Bank. The protesters have some theory justifying dragging the bank into the protests, but I don't think you can figure it out from the signs. They're using the same chants they used against the government, notably "This is what democracy looks like." Democracy against a bank? But they are so passionate. Especially that one guy.
But what's really interesting here is the attention some of them give Meade. Watch for the lawyer with the Walker-as-Marie-Antoinette sign. Remember him from the graffiti-on-the-Civil-War-monument video? Watch for him to step out of the line and talk to some other guy, who then takes a picture of Meade. And then there are those 2 other guys who are suddenly up in Meade's face, who follow Meade as he leaves to go into the Capitol. Are they going to intimidate Meade?
This is edited video, and I've left out what happens when they get into the rotunda. Standing in the center of the rotunda, the 3 men converse/argue about freedom of speech. I've uploaded the 14-minute video separately and unedited. If you have the patience to watch that, it's funny to some extent, particularly because the young men are so fervent about their cause that they can't hear how bad some of the things they say are. They persist for a while, but they can't shake Meade and they can't answer the questions he asks. In the end, they walk away. And there's Meade standing alone in the center of the rotunda.
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So by your interpretation, the Obama administration is suspending the Constitution with security screening and access control in the national Capitol building as well.
How about the WH, isn't it The People's House?
How about federal, state and county court buildings? Airports? Sports Arenas?
Sorry, but the Madison protesters screwed the access pooch, not "you guys" or Walker.
btw- I am not a conservative, a guy or a Republican. I don't need no stinkin' labels to advance an argument.
AlphaLibtard: Really, almost any post here? If someone disagrees with righties, they are immediately insulted.
False. The only people who are treated like trash are libtards like you who have demonstrated a patterned history of not arguing in good faith.
For your kind, a kick in the face is all you rate.
I base that on the numerous plans by Republican Governors to increase taxes on the poor and cut taxes on the rich.
Don't like it? Move to Alaska, they have no state income tax, no state sales tax and will even give you a yearly check from their oil revenues! Last year each resident got about $1200 from the state.
What a great country!
@C4
"...incredibly intense national security talks taking place between Scott Walker and David Koch."
C4, have you been eating from that little cactus again?
I see cannonfodder Fen is back from his stint doing prison detail at Abu Ghraib.
Conservatives 4 Better Dental Hygiene,
So you're conceding their are some places where freedom of assembly and association can be limited, but you just don't think Wisconsin's capitol is one?
It was sarcastic DT. Context for it is provided by comment number 190-some odd, that went on about the repercussions for banging drums outside of the Oval Office.
I recognize limitations and a need for balance, ambisinistral -- just not for arbitrary reasons.
Your comparison of the lobby of Madison's state capitol building to the Oval Office was kind of arbitrary, wouldn't you say?
For what it's worth, I don't think anyone would be allowed on the White House grounds, let alone right outside the Oval Office, unless on official state business, without being tackled by the secret service.
Is there really a need for such incredibly intense limitations in the state capitol building in Madison?
Come on. Let's start getting reasonable and stop being so hyperbolic.
@C4
"...banging drums outside of the Oval Office."
Don't think Gov Walker would meet anyone in the Oval Office while drums were being beaten outside.
I'm here to help.
I really like the work Meade is doing, he's really giving the union thugs a taste of their own medicine, isn't he???
Does anyone find it strange that the union thugs apparently don't like video cameras? I haven't seen evidence that they themselves have shot video of their own carryings-on, either - curious.
The limitations to getting into the Capitol are less than getting into Yankee Stadium. You have to buy a ticket and you get treated worse.
Now I realize that Yankee Stadium is more important than any cheesy state capital but youse guys got to calm down.
Don't think Gov Walker would meet anyone in the Oval Office while drums were being beaten outside.
Does the state capitol building in Madison even have an "Oval Office"? We were talking about a comparison to the White House, or so I thought.
You're confusing me with all these trails, Don't Tread.
Your comparison of the lobby of Madison's state capitol building to the Oval Office was kind of arbitrary, wouldn't you say?
Conservatives 4 Better Dental Hygiene,
Is it any more arbitrary than a Union hall? After all, we're talking about freedom of assembly and association, which implies the freedom not to assemble or associate, and closed shops deny that.
And that's really the root of the problem, isn't it? The Union protest kicked into overdrive because of the portion of Walker's bill that allowed people not to pat dues -- that is, not to associate.
Isn't that what we should be debating instead of minutia about where and when you can pound on a drum?
If the Capitol can tolerate free assemble and association (which it clearly does), why not Union Halls?
Now I realize that Yankee Stadium is more important than any cheesy state capital but youse guys got to calm down.
Hear, hear!
I second the motion!
We's a gonna have a meeting right over home plate, you see. A real sit-down.
I'm a bit perplexed that someone who works in government wouldn't recognize that a union is a private institution and not given to the same expectations regarding public assembly as a capitol building, Ambisinistral.
@C4
"Does the state capitol building in Madison even have an "Oval Office"? We were talking about a comparison to the White House, or so I thought."
Look if Gov Walker wanted to hold meetings, he certainly wouldn't hold them in the White House. I would expect them to be held in a drum-free location where union thugs wouldn't make a nuisance of themselves and interfere with state business.
@C4
"...a union is a private institution... "
Whats this then C4? You've sunk to calling a private union an 'institution'? Horsehockey I say, institutions are generally public/charitable/educational, i.e. a college. Not a private union.
The White House is in D.C. and not in Madison, Don't Tread.
Is there something I'm missing here? The point of his comparison was between two government buildings, one that houses the legislature of a state and one that houses the setting where high-level diplomatic negotiations are held at the national level.
Why am I the one being put in the strange position of explaining one Republican's argument to the other.
Don't Tread, if you're going to use an alias that invokes American revolutionary history, it might befit you to understand the structure of its government a 'lil better. Just sayin.
Alpha Liberal: I give up. You are too shallow to debate on economic matters. Keep your govt.job if you have one, get one if you don't. You will prosper if you keep your mouth shut.
You also would not be able to film the game at the stadium as any rebroadcast, retransmission, or account of this game, without the express written consent of Major League Baseball, is prohibited.
Yankee stadium is the gulag next to the Wisconsin state capital.
I work in a Right to Work State. I also grew up in Wisconsin and have been forced to pay Union dues on a couple of jobs.
I'll take Right to Work any day of the week -- but you're free to join a Union if you want.
Remembber, you're all about freedom, aren't you?
Don't Spread, if you're going to sink to the level of arguing with the dictionary, it's obvious that most of us are going to find better things to do.
Come on. Get relevant. Just give it a try. If you don't like it, then go back to arguing with the dictionary.
Plus all the diplomatic stuff is going on at the Beach in Brazil right now. Just sayn'
@C4
"Why am I the one being put in the strange position of explaining one Republican's argument to the other."
Are you talking about the drumming, or Scott Walker meeting in the Oval Office? Why would he do that? He has his own office in Madison that unfortunately continues to be harassed by unemployed, smelly union types.
I do wish you could keep your threads straight, C4, you'd think someone like yourself with a modicum of sense could at least stay on topic.
wv - glucki
I'm glucki I'm polish!
@C4
"...it's obvious that most of us are going to find better things to do."
Are you a little cranky tonite C4?
Ah yes. Ipanema beach.
Someday I'm going to have to activate a Flickr page and show you all the shots I took there.
If any setting will allow for fruitful discussions of world peace, it's a beach in Rio.
Don't Spread: You should chill for a bit and think of Brazil.
If any setting will allow for fruitful discussions of world peace, it's a beach in Rio.
Conservatives 4 Better Dental Hygiene,
Hehehe... Rio is a wonderful city aint it? And you're right, Ipanema would be a better setting to bicker about Unions, drumming, the Oval Office and whatnot.
Could you believe how much meat the Brazilians eat? My gawd, they had meat in their salad bars., Truly amazing.
Best deal in NYC is the rodinzio at Chausco Platformia at forty ninth and ninth avenue.
Unlimited skewers of meat, all you can eat.
I proposed an commenter meat up there. So to speak.
Could you believe how much meat the Brazilians...
How much meat they... have on their bodies for gratuitous display? Why yes I can! Happily so!
But as for food, I've actually tended to eat somewhat frugally in Rio. Maybe that's because I don't mind blending in with the street life in a foreign setting. But with such an increase in land available for pasture, carnivorous excess is bound to swell.
Myself, it's enough for me to make use every now and then of the hugely expanding market for Brazilian steakhouses here in the states (and even Canada).
Trooper, you and me (and whomever else you want to bring along) will def have to meet up for some churascarria sometime. Wives/s.o. Optional. Ok a huge lightning bolt just knocked out my isp so i'm going to chill with the lady for a bit. Cheers.
You're on. Bring the ladies.
Conservatives 4 Better Dental Hygiene,
Cheer back at ya. Have a good night.
c4: I have never been to Brazil but I have been to a Brazilian steak house pig out. Do such emporiums exist in Brazil or are the American restaurants someone's fantasy of what it should be like:?
"That guy with the neck beard is not an attractive man."
LOL!
the constant sucking up to The Queen and Needy is rather sad
Again, it's part of their "daily routine" like ditto heads sucking up to Limbaugh, etc.
Although it's encouraging AA doesn't pretend to be a liberal in any way, shape or form anymore as that ship sailed some time ago ...
And a very wise move that AA and her tagalong have totally "escaped" this thread.
Rinse, lather, repeat :::zzzz:::
BTW - The Tennessee State Capitol Building has restricted access at all times with a metal detector and armed trooper at the door whenever the building is open to visitors. It has bullet hole in an interior wall too.
“Where Free Unions and Collective Bargaining are Forbidden, Freedom is Lost”
- Ronald Reagan
So, freedom is only for the Polish people?
You're using the guy who busted the flight controllers' union to try to score points for unions?! Rich.
There still ain't no Federal employee unions.
I ain't go no problem with unions in the private sector. The companies will just move to open shop states like my beloved Tennessee. Why do you think Nissan is in Tennessee and Toyota in Kentucky? Unfortunately, state and local governments can't relocate.
Normally, I think of α-lib as a soulless propaganda-spouting machine, but this:
I've been close to tears at time, marching with the trades of my ancestors,
made me laugh hard enough to aspirate my drink.
No, "genius". I read. You know, English?
So comprehension is your problem. There's a difference between intimidation and repression. Try to figure it out.
BJM said...
"How about federal, state and county court buildings? Airports? Sports Arenas?"
One of these is not like the others. The private owners of sports arenas are not obliged to follow the First Amendment
Conservatives 4 Better Dental Hygiene said...
"Is there really a need for such incredibly intense limitations in the state capitol building in Madison?"
Events seem to have demonstrated that there is. When the protesters cease their attempts to disrupt the legislature, normal access can resume. That goes for "Tea Party" protests, too, were they to get as out of hand as the WI unions.
ambisinistral said...
"Meade didn't acquit himself very well in his rotunda debate"
You'd be absolutely right... if it had been a debate. But it wasn't. And whoever said I flubbed my Supremacy Clause statement is also correct. Good thing I wasn't taking a law school exam.
Those two protesters followed me because they were trying to intimidate me. I have to laugh. Questions and attempts at answers were exchanged but nothing was really proven except I was not intimidated and they have seemingly caused themselves some brain damage.
My theory is it was all the drumming and chanting they subjected themselves to while occupying the Capitol for 2 weeks. Poor things.
lemondog said...
"@Meade, try this link:
Events"
Many thanks!
Protests can project power. That power can come from large numbers, an enthusiastic spirit, a righteous cause, clever signs, or people with obvious pride in who they are.
Then there was that bank protest.
I find it a little sad that this whole thing appears to be winding down, and the excellent videos will come to a end.
I also wondered if the bearded man is going to run back to his lawyer friend and tell him Meade blogs at althouse.blogspot.com. For the lawyers sake, I hope not. There are some things one is better off not seeing.
Nothing in US constitution gives protesters right to enter WI capital. WI law does. It seems that true idiot does not reside in Alabama. Someone owes Meade an apology.
Listening to these dumbasses is like listening to an animal wheel whose string keeps being pulled time and time again:
The cow says moo
The sheep says baaaahhh
The protester says Shame, Shame, Shame
It's amazing to see how humans can act as absurdly as barn animals.
Meade, you're a good guy. None of us is perfect and we all make mistakes - even on the internets. Imagine that. I guess that is what the internets are for. Finding out stuff like that.
That said, I think Paul is wrong. The 1st amendment restricts Congress from prohibiting the petition of grievances and the SCOTUS has interpreted this as applying to every state and municipality, going back to 1925. Time, place or manner exceptions must conform to some degree of scrutiny, even moreso if they are content based or viewpoint based. The latter, challenges to which the protesters seem to be an example of, are usually overturned.
Of course, restricting interruptions to the normal course of government operations would be a time/manner/place restriction, and would probably be upheld - as Simon indicates.
Michael: As an American I'm inclined to believe that the all-you-can-eat places are more of a domestic phenomenon. However, I'd like to assume that the quality of the cuts and their preparation that we enjoy applies back in Brazil as well.
Good news for the teabaggers:
More Americans would prefer to see Barack Obama re-elected than would prefer a Republican to win in 2012, according to a new poll released today by the Pew Research Center.
In total, 48 percent of respondents said they would rather see Obama re-elected, while 35 percent said they would prefer a Republican and 16 percent didn't know. Among registered voters, 47 percent favored Obama and 37 percent preferred a Republican.
Sounds like Obama will be lucky if he can hold on to 48% of the popular vote in 2012. I predict he'll lose 46% to 52%.
BallSucking Libtard said: for the teabaggers:
More Americans would prefer to see Barack Obama re-elected than would prefer a Republican to win in 2012
*yawn*
1) Poll was registered voters, not likely voters.
2) Democrats were oversampled by 10%
3) and my fav disqualifier: Respondents in the landline sample were selected by randomly asking for the youngest adult male or female who is now at home
LOL. What a waste of time and money that poll was. Would have been easier for you Ball Suckers to pick a number you liked.
You're ground zero - in more ways than one...If someone has already pointed this out, my apologies, but...
THIS THING IS ALREADY IN PLAY: If you listened to the tape at GlennBeck.com or on The Blaze - where Stephen Lerner brags about an unfolding campaign to be launched to take down JP Morgan Chase and destroy the financial industry - you heard the plan: "The goal would be that we will roll out of New York the first week of May. We will connect three ideas:
-- that we are not broke there is plenty of money
-- they have the money - we need to get it back
-- and that they are using Bloomberg and other people in government as the vehicle to try and destroy us
And so we need to take on those folks at the same time. And that we will start here we are going to look at a week of civil disobedience - direct action all over the city."
Then he says it can't look like the Labor Unions are doing it. It's gotta be the "community organizers" that are doing it...
Then, in Wisconsin, MICHAEL MOORE says:
-- "we're not broke.
-- This country is not broke; state of Wisconsin is not broke.
-- There's a ton of cash in this country, trillions of dollars of it....What's happened is that we've allowed a vast majority of that cash to be concentrated in the hands of just a few people ...We've allowed them to take that.
-- That's not theirs, that's a national resource, that's ours."
It's already in play - and no one even saw it coming.
"They play on your fears." And more.
in short, they broke it early - in Wisconsin, they laid the groundwork, planted the meme...
Cult leaders is going a bit far eh?
Chanting is simply the product of the marches down State Street. Sure, you could march with a few hundred people with everyone yelling out their opinions, or just being quiet, but that defeats the point of a political march.
It's a quick, concise way to get the people's purpose known and declared. I don't like all of them*, but when you have a lot people with a somewhat similar goal in mind, they might just resort to some sort of chanting to make that point loud n' clear.
I don't know what the issue with talking to someone in the Rotunda has been recently, but even two weeks ago(not Saturday), you could have a reasonable conversation with people. Heck, you could talk to all the people at the People's mic they setup both in and outside.
Also, the Wisconsin constitution does have a bit on the people's right to assemble in Section 4. I'm sure that's been brought up though.
Dylan said...
Cult leaders is going a bit far eh?
No. But "mob leaders" would also work.
Chanting is simply the product of the marches down State Street. Sure, you could march with a few hundred people with everyone yelling out their opinions, or just being quiet, but that defeats the point of a political march.
50 thousand people marching silently would be far more impressive. And smart.
It's a quick, concise way to get the people's purpose known and declared.
I agree. Especially if the purpose is to intimidate.
I don't like all of them*,
Which ones don't you like, specifically?
but when you have a lot people with a somewhat similar goal in mind, they might just resort to some sort of chanting to make that point loud n' clear.
The point that they are making loud n' clear is that they have chosen to turn over their minds to their leaders.
I don't know what the issue with talking to someone in the Rotunda has been recently, but even two weeks ago(not Saturday), you could have a reasonable conversation with people.
Once again, the exception proves the rule.
Heck, you could talk to all the people at the People's mic they setup both in and outside.
Yes, but you would be shouted and chanted down within seconds.
Also, the Wisconsin constitution does have a bit on the people's right to assemble in Section 4. I'm sure that's been brought up though.
Why don't you read that to us, Dylan. Show us where a mob has a "right" to assemble.
Meade you are awesome! Thanks for doing what you are doing! Please, if you ever do want a wingman, let me know. I am not afraid to peacefully stand with you and get more video of my own as well. Email me: newlyconservative@gmail.com
Fen said...
BallSucking Libtard said:
~~~~~
It goes w/out sayin' Fen is one of AA's fav posters lol
Especially w/AA's ad nauseam, faux conservative "civil discourse" meme minutia. :-P
'nuf said!
shiloh - given that AA doesn't ban anyone, how would you know Fen is her favorite? Has she ever indicated?
Alex, it's sarcasm re: AA's absurdity sayin' conservatives are 100% better at "civil discourse" than liberals. Much like conservatives have claimed the "religion/party of god" crown the past 30/40 years as indicated by gingrich, livingston, sanford, ensign, vitter, fossella, mark foley, larry craig et al.
Good thing for Reps forgiveness is a virtue, eh.
take care
shiloh - please post the AA quote where she said conservatives are better at civility.
Caesar's smug assassins had a habit of calling human beings (i.e. the "people" who supported him) a mob, too, Meade.
Do you remember what happened to those guys?
Alex, no direct quote, but it's inferred in every WI union post she's made the past (2) mos.
ie conservatives civil, respectful, dignified ...
whereas liberals, an unruly mob w/no decorum.
Surely you have been payin' attention as AA always adds sarcasm when talkin' about the stark dichotomy of each side's manners.
>
The phrase (((beating a dead horse))) comes to mind re: AA's biased observations about said WI never ending union posts.
>
It also is a great indication of how much a die hard Rep AA has become, her previous "stories" re: her supposed liberal leanings notwithstanding.
Again, AA's political ideology is an open book at this blog w/no grey area. Her generalizations are legend! ;)
Alex, no direct quote, but it's inferred in every WI union post she's made the past (2) mos.
So basically you're full of shit as usual. I nailed you to the wall and you could not provide any evidence of your outlandish claims. Fuck off.
Alex said...
Fuck off.
~~~~~
Re: AA's lemmings civil discourse, the prosecution rests!
Meade, I agree with Fen that you need a wingman. I’m in upstate NY so even a weekend duty is a stretch for me to help out with. You might also want to video over your shoulder to see who might be following you.
You really confused the wanna-be wise sage lad when you agreed that it would not be illegal to drive 55mph in a 55mph zone. I would say that further confounded him when you applied simple logic and common sense to your side of the dialogue. These guys seem to be all about free speech as long as that speech coincides with what they want to hear.
AlphaLiberal said...
Just like the Southern lawyer in My Cousin Vinnie who referred to the "sovereign" state of Alabama (or whatever).
Or any of 1,000s of "tenthers" who say things like Arizona State Senate President Russell Pearce (R):
Do you know, you’re not a citizen of the United States. You’re a citizen of a sovereign state. The fifty sovereign states makes up United States of America, we’re citizens of those sovereign states. It is not a delegated authority. It’s an inherent authority that states have over the federal government. It’s about time somebody gets it right!
The "states' rights" crowd, sans sheets.
Um.
You know they are sovereign, right? Otherwise they wouldn't have their own constitutions. You know,"reserved for the states or the people themselves." All that 10th amendment bullshit.
Also. You know the KKK was founded by democrats, right? To prevent civil rights to negroes.
Really your Hinn version of history isn't serving you very well.
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