"... but this society we have, lucky enough, that the heroes in Egypt are making today. They are not waiting for our children to dream. They are bringing all of our dreams true today.... The biggest square in the Arab world is being liberated today.... I'm proud to be an Egyptian today.... I kiss the dust under your feet."
(From the NYT live blog.)
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43 comments:
Belmont Club is not so hopeful.
Those are eloquent words and a beautiful sentiment, but they don't hold a candle to
Democracy! Whiskey! Sexy!
I am not optimistic "freedom" will be so well enjoyed by women and Coptic Christians.
I so fervently want to believe - want them to have the same freedoms we have. I hear the words, I see them fighting, same as in Iran, and my heart goes out to them and wishes them well. And prays they mean it, and understand freedom for ALL.
If Mubarak does not resign nor is he forcibly removed could this guy end up in some gulag?
Odds of this ending well.
After one month: 1 in three
After one year: 1 in 98
After five years: 1 in 54,983
I really hope this turns out well, and there is some room for hope because Egypt is a more educated and culturally advanced place than other parts of the Arab world (like Saudi Arabia, for example). Still, I'm not overly optimistic, given historical precedents and some of the local players.
You guys are weak. Of course it'll fall apart with you pansies supporting it. "Belmont Club is not so hopeful." Then tell him to shut up! "I so fervently want to believe - want them to have the same freedoms we have." Then let them hear that! Scream it to them! "Odds of this ending well,..." Odds of me kicking your ass: 1 in 1. "I'm not overly optimistic,..." Then just forget it, assholes!
Remind me to never join any revolution you idiots are a part of.
Imagine the American Revolution:
George Washington: "Well, I don't know,..."
You guys defeat yourselves.
He's Back!
America's Politico said...
Prof. this video will be of interest to you, as you are a blogger. It is must be watched in its entirety. We are seeing a birth of revolution with or without social media. We are all from Egypt.
====================
1. No, we are all not from Egypt. Thank God for that.
2. Beware of people using this rhetorical trick to enforce solidarity. It is something the media puppeteers noticed "resonated with people" when Edward R Murrow used it to rev up US audiences during the Blitz to display support and empathy. "We Are ALL...Londoners...Now".
The puppeteers thought "Wow, that schtick works! Lets use it in advertising and in any other news where we wish to demand solidarity with a cause or a side!!!!"
3. The stupidity spread as a media meme.
A. "We are all Stalins children, since the Nazi invasion. (That one didn't work so well, to the surprise of Madison Avenue).
B. "I am a jelly donut. We are all jelly donuts, now" Berliners laughed but got the idea.
C. "9/11 means we are all Israelis now, and must help our Special Friend with everything they want."
D. We are all oppressed Haitians living in rubble now. We are all Chilean copper miners. We are all Noble Darfurans. We are all Egyptians demanding justice!"
No, we are not. That is stupid.
E. We are all not eager or obligated to buy the world a Coke, and furnish it with love.
4. Did Edward R Murrows exortations lead America to want to kill or maim millions of citizens in war in 1940? Even if they sympathized? No. It wasn't yet in our vital interests to get involved.
Egypt has a strong identity from their long history of intellectual and scientific advancements. They regard the USA as silly braggarts from their watching our Hollywood movies. But we do have the one thing that draws them here...we have freedom; and until Obama's regime we had a right to work and to get rich without being a cog in a Government favored business like Egyptian society required. We will be enriched if many more leave Egypt and come here to escape the Muslim murderers.
Yeah, well too bad that what is happening in Tunisia, Egypt, and now in Jordan are the result of the Muslim Brotherhood, leftist trade unions, and the World Workers Party being agitators for a new Iranian Revolution. The Ayatollahs are secretly smiling and nodding their heads at this. This is what they have been fomenting now for years and it's coming to pass. The Middle East is not going to get more democratic they are going to become more radically aligned than they are now.
Expect the Muslim enclaves in the UK, Holland, Denmark, Sweden, Germany, Finland, et. al in the EU to start their agitation really soon.
The Crack Emcee said...
You guys are weak. Of course it'll fall apart with you pansies supporting it. "Belmont Club is not so hopeful." Then tell him to shut up! "I so fervently want to believe - want them to have the same freedoms we have." Then let them hear that! Scream it to them! "Odds of this ending well,..." Odds of me kicking your ass: 1 in 1. "I'm not overly optimistic,..." Then just forget it, assholes!
Remind me to never join any revolution you idiots are a part of.
Imagine the American Revolution:
George Washington: "Well, I don't know,..."
You guys defeat yourselves.
Crack, I'm with you in understanding exactly what you are saying. However, if you look at Nasrala/Hezbollah in Lebanon literally laughing his way to power there coupled with his syrian/iranian backers and the Muslim Brotherhood, you would see immediately how this is going to end up badly for everyone. This is going radical islam in no time. Just watch. Arabs and the arab world in general have not and do not have a history of liberty in their respective countries. They never have, and I suspect in this case they never will. Anything they remotely view as freedom was an sedative illusion to keep them at bay by their corrupt regime and their dictators like Mubarak and if you think he isn't a dictator, think again. That's all these people know.
Of course they yearn for freedom, but there are larger forces of evil in Islam at work in this than you think there are and they won't stop. This won't end well.
"I kiss the dust under your feet."
Even a moment of freedom rides the divine wind.
Tables once turned keep on turning. It's like the revolutions in the East Bloc. They may have started one way, but it's like a roulette wheel.
My thought is that this may be like the East Bloc, and all they want is to be more like us.
After all, we're perfect. Multiculturalism stinks.
The multiculturalists look to ancient Egypt and think oh, how diverse! But they wouldn't want to be building a pyramid.
They just all want to be like us. Who can help it? Let freedom ring.
Israel is gonna need a lot more bombs than before.
Crack is probably the most realist blogger out there (realism to the fullest extent of the word).. but then some people cry freedom and protest and he goes all mushy on us.
I'm just kidding Crack.. Its hard to be optimistic when historically when these protest have been crushed one after the other.. China, Iran, Greece..
tradguy - "We will be enriched if many more leave Egypt and come here to escape the Muslim murderers."
Just like we have been "enriched" with Somalis fleeing rival Muslim murderers, the "enrichment" of Dearborn by Iraqi refugees, the Freedom-Loving family of Nidal Hasan fleeing repression??
How many millions of "enriching Muslims" do you want here, trad guy?
I am with Crack Emcee, too. What the people of Tunisia and Egypt are doing is unbelievably courageous and could be the catalyst for real change in the Arab world. The American people should stand in solidarity with them. Our governments, Democratic and Republican, have too often supported dictators and thugs in the name of "stability". We are rightly viewed as hypocrites by millions of people all over the world. It is time for our leaders to stop talking about democracy and freedom and actually promote it with our foreign policies. No more support for thugs. The tear gas used to quell the peaceful Egyptian protesters was MADE in the USA. Do you think the people of Egypt do not know that? That 80 percent of over 1 billion in yearly U.S. aid to Egypt goes toward propping up the regime's military? No more!
I'm with Crack too.. but there is never anybody with a gun ready to blow the motherf*&r brains out when they are need it.
Never!!
(oh wait.. did I just violate the new civility rules..)
What are they protesting for - the Muslim Brotherhood? Fuck that.
Actually there was one dictator killed by his own countrymen..
This is the rare exception otherwise there would be less of these vermin around.
On a second look.. Wikipedia says the CIA might have been involved in the killing of Trujillo.
See what I mean?
These dictators usually surround themselves with well paid gutless wonders.
And does this passionate gentleman want to stone adulterers, and cut off the hands of thiefs?
Will women progressively have to adapt their clothing to match what the Muslim Brotherhood decrees?
Will his children live in a more human society?
I have mixed emotions about Egypt.
Tunisia -- what's the story on Tunisia these days. For them I had more hope.
Why do I doubt this guy will be moving to Eqypt to stay after the revolution?
Methadras,
Arabs and the arab world in general have not and do not have a history of liberty in their respective countries. They never have, and I suspect in this case they never will.
I know, I know, I know. But if we allow anyone over there to define us and where we stand, because we're either standing on the sidelines waiting for disaster or too politically correct to speak forcefully - anything other than speaking LOUDLY for ourselves - then those "Made In The U.S.A." canisters will be all they know of us and all will definitely be lost. They need to hear us - in our own Tea Party voices - telling them what freedom means to us, and why we stand with them in getting it.
Or you can let the Muslim Brotherhood do it, your choice.
Crack - what do propose we do? All I hear from you is generalized bullshit.
They are just like true Tea Partiers... when the Tea Partiers aren't obsessing over Sarah Palin's ability to incite masturbation.
If they are like Tea Partiers then where is their Sarah Pali -- I mean, where is their Cleopatra?
Well, a pattern seems to be emerging; the Egyptian revolution has been too peaceful, so the empire is striking back. It reminds me of New Orleans during and after Katrina - where the worst and only offenders were the police and their masters.
In Cairo, Mubarak is loosing thousands of criminals on the people. And he's shut down Al Jazeera before loosing the canons on the crowds.
Revolutions need warriors, if only a few, to spill government blood. But what Cairo has are pedestrians caught in the Mubarack crossfire. Peaceful pedestrians suddenly caught up in a revolution. With no one to fill the proposed vacuum.
Egypt, Schmeegypt. If they don't pull it off over there, the broadcasts still go out around the region, if not in. Other countries in the region will get a taste of the spirit of democracy and revolt against autocracy. That's a good thing regardless of however the Religious Right in Dar al Islam wish to exploit it.
I think what Islam needs is a good Pat Robertson. Or its own Jesse Helms. Or Ralph Reed. You know, someone who gets all slicked up and gussied up and presents the clean face, the "family values" side of Islam, all over regional broadcasts. As long as they stay away from the fire and brimstone and God Hates Fags end of the Loving Father, that's cool.
Heck - Maybe one of them could even get embroiled in a Ted Haggard or Jimmy Swaggert type of sex scandal.
You guys are really failing to see the incredible potential for good in all of this.
Or you can let the Muslim Brotherhood do it, your choice.
They've reached down into the sewer and come up with Iran's chief nuclear champion, friend of the Brotherhood... Mohamed El Baradei.
If the Egyptians had just one Irishman, he would find El Baradei and kill'im. He'd take no chances and kill El Baradei's entire family, including his pets. Even his parakeet.
And, he'd kill Mubarak.
Muslim Brotherhood has been part of the (co-opted) opposition for a long time. They are a more or less ossified part of the political establishment but if you yahoos want to believe that a popular uprising is all about entrenching their power, you can go ahead and believe it. As long as it helps you identify and demonize the proper enemy, I guess.
"I worry that the 59 percent of Egyptians who prefer Islamists to modernizers are going to have to learn the hardest way possible–as the Iranians have and the people of Gaza are learning right now–that modernizers are better. There may not be another way."
On the other hand, "Israeli reports of 'friendly atmosphere' in Cairo" (via Instapundit).
vza,
Where do you get your information that the tear gas is made in the USA, from the International Answer website?
You're an idiot.
PatCA said...
" Where do you get your information that the tear gas is made in the USA, from the International Answer website?"
"You're an idiot."
Noooooo, PatCA, the information is from here:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/01/28/reporter_finds_made_in_usa_tear_gas_canister_in_egypt.html
And here:
http://articles.cnn.com/2011-01-28/world/egypt.us.tear.gas_1_gas-grenade-gas-canisters-weekly-protest?_s=PM:WORLD
Good grief.
Wow, now I know how wonderful the Muslim Brotherhood is! Thanks Ritmo.
Self-determination is the most important thing... even if the Islamist come into power. The Egyptian people can deal with them in their own due time.
Go freedom, go!!!
So what if the tear gas canisters were made in the US?
The Chinese invented gunpowder. Should we blame all the resulting deaths on them?
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