March 23, 2010

Saul Alinsky's interest in excrement and (bizarrely racial) flatulence.

I've been reading Alinsky's "Rules for Radicals," and I've run into some really weird things. I'd copy out text from the book, but to save time, I'll just cut and paste this material — which tracks the book — from an interview he did with Playboy here and here:
ALINSKY: The most effective way to [attack Chicago mayor Richard Daley was] to create a situation in which he would become a figure of nationwide ridicule.

Now, O'Hare Airport in Chicago, the busiest airport in the world, is Mayor Daley's pride and joy, both his personal toy and the visible symbol of his city's status and importance. If the least little thing went wrong at O'Hare and Daley heard about it, he was furious and would burn up the phone lines to his commissioners until the situation was corrected. So we knew that was the place to get at him. But how? Even if we massed huge numbers of pickets, they'd be virtually lost in the thousands of passengers swarming through O'Hare's terminals. So we devised a new tactic. Picture yourself for a moment on a typical jet flight. The stewardess has served you your drinks and lunch or dinner, and afterwards the odds are you'll feel like going to the john. But this is usually awkward because your seat and those of the people sitting next to you are blocked by trays, so you wait until they're removed. But by then the people closest to the lavatories have got up and the OCCUPIED signs are on. So you wait a few more minutes and, more often than not, by the time the johns are vacant, the FASTEN SEAT BELTS signs are on, so you decide to wait until landing and then use one of the terminal restrooms. You can see this process in action if you watch the passenger gate at any landing airplane. It looks like almost half the debarking passengers make a beeline for the lavatories.

Here's where we came in. Some of our people went out to the airport and made a comprehensive intelligence study of how many sit-down pay toilets and stand-up urinals there were in the whole O'Hare complex and how many men and women we'd need for the country's first "shit-in."... For the sit-down toilets, our people would just put in their dimes and prepare to wait it out; we arranged for them to bring box lunches and reading material along to help pass the time. What were desperate passengers going to do -- knock the cubicle door down and demand evidence of legitimate occupancy? This meant that the ladies' lavatories could be completely occupied; in the men's, we'd take care of the pay toilets and then have floating groups moving from one urinal to another, positioning themselves four or five deep and standing there for five minutes before being relieved by a co-conspirator, at which time they would pass on to another rest room. Once again, what's some poor sap at the end of the line going to say: "Hey, pal, you're taking too long to piss"?

Now, imagine for a second the catastrophic consequences of this tactic. Constipated and bladder-bloated passengers would mill about the corridors in anguish and desperation, longing for a place to relieve themselves. O'Hare would become a shambles! You can imagine the national and international ridicule and laughter the story would create. It would probably make the front page of the London Times. And who would be more mortified than Mayor Daley?....
PLAYBOY: How did you organize Rochester's black community?

ALINSKY: ... We had a wide range of demands, of which the key one was that Kodak recognize the representatives of the black community who were designated as such by the people....
[An] idea I had that almost came to fruition was directed at the Rochester Philharmonic, which was the establishment's -- and Kodak's -- cultural jewel. I suggested we pick a night when the music would be relatively quiet and buy 100 seats. The 100 blacks scheduled to attend the concert would then be treated to a preshow banquet in the community consisting of nothing but huge portions of baked beans. Can you imagine the inevitable consequences within the symphony hall? The concert would be over before the first movement -- another Freudian slip -- and Rochester would be immortalized as the site of the world's first fart-in.

PLAYBOY: Aren't such tactics a bit juvenile and frivolous?

ALINSKY: I'd call them absurd rather than juvenile. But isn't much of life kind of a theater of the absurd? As far as being frivolous is concerned, I say if a tactic works, it's not frivolous. Let's take a closer look at this particular tactic and see what purposes it serves -- apart from being fun. First of all, the fart-in would be completely outside the city fathers' experience. Demonstrations, confrontations and picketings they'd learned to cope with, but never in their wildest dreams could they envision a flatulent blitzkrieg on their sacred symphony orchestra. It would throw them into complete disarray. Second, the action would make a mockery of the law, because although you could be arrested for throwing a stink bomb, there's no law on the books against natural bodily functions....
A shit-in and a fart-in. I thought you should know.

206 comments:

1 – 200 of 206   Newer›   Newest»
Quayle said...

An intellectual achievement of historic proportions: crap according to the principles of queue theory.

This Alinsky chap seems really bright.

Well, bright enough to burn a building down, but not bright enough to actually build one.

(He probably never knew there is a difference.)

Julius Ray Hoffman said...

I like this Alinsky dude. He's bizarre but creative. But wait... he's been dead since 1972! So what? (Note to all Julius-haters: "So what?" is a serious question).

This reminds me, Professor, that I am still upset with you for crapping all over Ron Paul and his supporters back in 2007 and 2008.

You seem to be totally supportive - now! - of the fiscal conservatism and small-governmentism that you rejected so quickly back when it was being touted by the Paulbots.

Palladian said...

Now I see how they flipped all those Democratic "no" votes...

And remember people trying to figure out what transpired with Kucinich on AF-1? They farted him into submission.

somefeller said...

It's amazing how much interest there is in Saul Alinsky among the anti-Obama crowd. I've certainly never heard his name come up around any liberals/Democratic activists I know. But I guess for some folks, it's always 1968.

lyssalovelyredhead said...

Wow, so this is the big bad boogy-man? He sounds like a 7 year old.

Andrea said...

Somehow I can't see 100 black people gathering together at some white guy's behest to eat beans and fart in public in front of a bunch of other white people. Then or now. Dignity has always been very important to black people, though nowadays it mostly has degenerated to demanding "respect." But back in the Sixties, when they were fighting for real respect not the bogus stuff physical display of dignity and impressiveness was very important. Farting both in comedy and in real life diminishes the dignity of the one doing the farting, because of the ridiculous noise and smell. Really, what was he thinking.

Oh, and the "shit in" wouldn't have worked either, because someone would have figured out what was happening.

Lem said...

There was an atrocious singer on Idol just now.

SteveR said...

Don't underestimate his influence in spite of these examples of his methods. He was, after all a "community organizer", and a very famous one. And as we well now, community organizers are the foremost experts in everything, able to leap tall buildings in a single bound and able to turn no votes to yes votes with a few hundred thousand of your dollars spent in the right place.

Peter V. Bella said...

Sounds like something this White House would do. I mean, look who we have- Gibbs, the clown stand up comedian and Joe Biden, the court jester. Plus Pouffe- the rude, inconsiderate juvenile delinquent.

Lem said...

As far as being frivolous is concerned, I say if a tactic works, it's not frivolous.

How do you justify extortion?

ricpic said...

Why are you surprised? The important question to ask yourself is what kind of person is attracted to leftism. And the answer is a child. A child in a large body, but not a grownup. The world is incomprehensible and therefore maddening to someone who can't grow up. So what does he do? He throws excrement at the grownup world in a resentment filled tantrum.That's Alinsky in a nutshell. And Obama. Scratch Obama and there, just below the surface, is pure malevolence. Malevolence at what? At the productive. At those who make the world work. The adults. They must be punished. Simply for being adults. Simply for being adjusted. That's how horrible the Left is: an enraged child throwing shit at what it can't understand and can't be part of.

JAL said...

Why read Alinsky?

Why now Professor?

Maybe a few more influential people should have read Alinsky a couple years ago and taken the wind out of some sails.

Read Alinsky to meet the man who helped create the person who sits in the most powerful place in the wrold.

Scarey, that.

wv conchice
Eva Gabor being brief.

rhhardin said...

Concerts are too long anyway.

Paul Zrimsek said...

Dad, I won't have a chance to get the unfinished business done until these damned Alinskyites clear out.

ironrailsironweights said...

He was right about one thing. As soon as an airplane lands there's a big rush to the nearest donickers.

Peter

former law student said...

These are simple ways for the powerless to have an impact on the powerful.

Alinsky is all about showing the have-nots how to get what they need from the haves. The powerless always have more power than they think they do, while the powers-that-be have less than they think they do.

But like the farmer who hit his mule with the 2x4, first you have to get their attention.

The other advantages of the shit-in and the fart-in is that they are memorable, largely because they are in poor taste. And they are forgivable because everyone, even Warren Buffett or the Pope on his throne, must shit and fart. They speak to our common humanity.

Nora said...

somefeller said...
"It's amazing how much interest there is in Saul Alinsky among the anti-Obama crowd. I've certainly never heard his name come up around any liberals/Democratic activists I know. But I guess for some folks, it's always 1968."

Yeh, they are still somewhere in the last centuries with Marx and Trotzky, I guess.

Nora said...

It looks like Alinsky's is a fartmeister of the left

Theo Boehm said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Theo Boehm said...

Oh, and we'll still smell bad.

former law student said...

What Alinsky spent most of his time doing in the 50s and 60s was attempting to stop white flight for the benefit of the Catholic Church. For a century, parishioners had contributed to magnificent churches, huge hospitals, and excellent schools. These tremendous investments were in jeopardy of becoming completely worthless as white Catholics fled as blacks moved in. (Attempts to convert Protestant blacks to Catholicism were largely unsuccessful.) Massive capital campaigns were needed to duplicate infrastructure in the former cow pastures and truck farms that were being turned into tract housing.

Alinsky attempted to get black and white churchmen together to stabilize the newly changing neighborhoods -- ultimately it didn't work, and many magnificent buildings had to be closed.

veni vidi vici said...

I have to agree with FLS here. Whatever it makes me to say so, I found those two ideas pretty funny in a good-natured, not trying to break anyone's face, kind of way.

I'd feel differently were I fresh off a plane needing to take a leak, but at least the folks trying to make their point wouldn't be doing it with violence, thuggery or general nastiness. Olfactory unpleasantness from a bit of gassery isn't the same as the negs that come off malignantly unpleasant interactions with others, after all.

Lem said...

The baked beans blacks at the Philharmonic was calculated on the premise that people who go to the philharmonic would not stand up to a black person and make an accusation no matter how rousing.

The fact that the fart-in conspirators were black also meant that they could come back repeatedly. Who is going to deny admission to a black patron?

Joe said...

The most effective way to [attack Chicago mayor Richard Daley was]...

Effective? It didn't work. How effective could it have been?

All Alinksy did was inconvenience innocent people trying to go about their lives.

Theo Boehm said...

ha ha

shit wit

Doug Wright-OG said...

Heck, we ought to do to Alinsky what Charles II's loyal ass-kissers did during the Restoration! Dig up Cromwell's body, chopping the head off, and posting that head on a pike! That'll really show'em!

Of course, MSNBC might get a tad upset with that unsightly showing.

David said...

Alinsky?

Shit and Fart?

Maybe this was the unfinished business Patrick Kennedy was referring to.

Clay Spinuzzi said...

Alinsky also said that community activists might get cold feet, "But we knew that the baked beans would compel them physically to go through with the tactic regardless of how they felt" (p.141).

Theo Boehm said...

aux armes shitoyens!

Lem said...

We'll still have nuclear weapons.

Its the only way I can sleep at night when I remember we still have the bomb ;)

Theo Boehm said...

all we need is stinkbombs

Lem said...

I wonder how would Alinsky extract life saving information from a jihadist?

Lem said...

This has to be the worst bunch of Idols ever.

Theo Boehm said...

bad smells

and what is life saving or a terrorist

anyway?

Hagar said...

The main thing I remember of Alinsky's rules from back then - and that I do not see mentioned in current quotations of "Alinsky's 13 rules", so perhaps this was his 14th - is that "you only show the people how to organize, you let them figure out what they want to do with it."

My understanding is that Obama failed at the two organization projects he was engaged in, because he ignored the 14th rule and insisted on telling the people what they were organizing for.

Marxist or whatever, I always have had a weakness for Alinsky. One should remember that it was Mayor Daley's Chicago he was fighting, and Marquis of Queensberry rules did not apply.

Theo Boehm said...

or is that jihadist?

gee, i had a fist

Theo Boehm said...

you're organizing for methane
their bane
what a pain
ha ha

Lem said...

Bad smells?

wouldn't that be torture? against the Geneva Convention? The Army field Manual and the Sears catalog ;)

Kirby Olson said...

Classy.

So this is the Obama mentor?

Theo Boehm said...

organizing against
major peepee's shitcago

Theo Boehm said...

yes, he's the obdure manure

Lem said...

Que cago?

Chicago. Not to mention these Idol "singers".

Dust Bunny Queen said...

Once again, what's some poor sap at the end of the line going to say: "Hey, pal, you're taking too long to piss"?

Good thing that old Saul never tried that cute stunt at the good old Buckhorn Saloon.

(Where they pour a damned stiff drink. Frequented by loggers, cowboys and farmers. Many the loaded harrow bed or logging truck has been seen parked there until long after dark)

He wouldn't have had a chance to fart.

rhhardin said...

People can't listen to long musical forms anymore, either.

Hardly anyone reads anything long these days.

Pretty soon, music will be songs with two chords, and writing will be texting.


Tiffany Eckhardt (real audio), a pop song in the form of a barcarolle.

(a modern real player may ask to download an old codec.)

NewHam said...

"It's amazing how much interest there is in Saul Alinsky among the anti-Obama crowd. ... But I guess for some folks, it's always 1968."

This is "The Art of War" 101.

Rule #1: Know thine enemy.

Rule #2: Know thyself.

What the Democrats don't really realize is that we're not anti-Obama. We like Obama. Hate his policies and understand that his policies will destroy the shining City on the Hill.

We're planning to war. The only way to deal with a bully (Alinsky) is to punch his fucking lights out.

It's the only thing a bully understands or respects.

They put one of yours in the hospital, you put one of theirs in the morgue. That's the Chicago Way.

What are you prepared to do?

Theo Boehm said...

chicago
cagado
¿quien es cabrón?

Theo Boehm said...

unsupported, rh
get moderne

wv = muzerste

Theo Boehm said...

What are you prepared to do?

composting toilet?

NewHam said...

Obama has become Mayor Daley.

Obama is the man.

Obama is the establishment.

Obama is the tax man.

But look, what he's doing is textbook Democrat Party: Funnel money to our guys (unions, candidates, caucus).

Everything Obama does is first and foremost a way to funnel money to his guys. If there is some other side benefit to America ... well then that's how we'll sell it to the rubes.

Borrow, steal, bribe ... doesn't matter.

Show me the money.

That's all they care about, and that's how you get Capone.

They're cheating on their taxes, but they're able to get away with it because they control the investigators, they control the Justice Department, they control the cops.

They won't always.

Once Republicans regain control of Congress I hope they're smart enough to unleash all fucking hell on these people with subpoenas and special prosecutors and Independent Counsels and every other legal means of harassing Democrats.

That's what Alinsky would do.

That's what Republicans should do (assuming they're not OK with what Obama is doing, but I suspect they might be OK with it in private and only outraged publicly).

Beth said...

I've never read Alinksy, because I'd never heard of him until this past election, here, on this blog.

somefeller said...

They put one of yours in the hospital, you put one of theirs in the morgue. That's the Chicago Way.
What are you prepared to do?


Well, for starters, I am prepared to ignore internet tough guys, but I guess I just broke that rule. Shame on me.

Theo Boehm said...

new ham
no, ma'm
boil it
in the toilet

bagoh20 said...

All I could think of while reading that was the innocent victims who clearly would suffer if they could not use the bathrooms after hours on a plane. Or the other innocent victims in the orchestra, the audience and the blacks degraded by this narcissistic fools plans.

Maybe conservatives see other people as fellow humans and not simply props in our plans. Or maybe, I'm just unable to see, as FLS says that: "These are simple ways for the powerless to have an impact on the powerful." and "They speak to our common humanity."

Yea, that's what they do.

Theo Boehm said...

nevah of alinsky hoid?
oh, what a hemorrhoid!

Theo Boehm said...

they shit for our commun humidity
oh what a roil for the night soil!

NewHam said...

Ann,

Look at somefeller's comment and see how it comports with the tactics you are reading about (Alinsky).

Any time they see anyone who is advancing an argument that will work against Democrats, they suddenly appear to ridicule that person.

They're quiet until they spot anyone who appears to have a good strategy to defeat them ... and then they deploy Alinsky mob tactics against that person.

GarageMahal is the best example of this, but "somefeller" also just revealed himself. So, that's how I know I stepped on the right nerve.

That's how you know you're on the right track. Just wait till they squeal ... and then fucking stomp.

Meade said...

Lem, It really was suck night, wasn't it?

Untiul Saobhan.

Lem said...

I've heard so many bad singers in a row like that.

Lem said...

i meant I've never heard.

Theo Boehm said...

splat splat splat
in
stoolfella's droppings

bagoh20 said...

Apparently, treating other people with respect and compassion while carrying yourself with dignity was beyond Alinsky's genius. It shows in his disciples. What was that earlier post about having disciples with small heads. Alinky failed in that regard big time.

garage mahal said...

Me and somefeller stalk blogs together in unison, Rules for Radicals in hand, looking to crush any dissent. Quirky conservative law blogs are our favorite. We're weird like that.

Ann Althouse said...

Beth said..."I've never read Alinksy, because I'd never heard of him until this past election, here, on this blog."

So then, you're pretty unfamiliar with Hillary Clinton (not to mention Barack Obama). Okay. Noted.

Theo Boehm said...

what do you do with it all
when it's just shit
in the end?

maybe there's no end to shit
the shit which is the shit
is no shit

Alex said...

NewHam... no everyone is ridiculing you because you're ridiculous spouting violence at every turn.

Theo Boehm said...

g m and giant steel mills
and union halls n' catholic churches
full of proles oh love those proles
of all the rainbow colors
one big happy new industrial family
what do you do
oh, what do you do when it's all
shit?

Lem said...

I don't think Miley Cyrus helped anybody either.

All I heard her say how fav everybody was.

Maybe they invited her just for a ratings boost.

edutcher said...

When you read about Altgeld Gardens, it seems The Zero got Uncle Saul all backwards. Zero's change caused the effluvia.

The Gospel according to Jimmy:

Chapter 1

There's a big difference between what a man can do and what he will do. What are you willing to do to get Capone?

Chapter 2

Capone pulls a knife, you pull a gun.

Capone sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue.

That's the Chicago way, and that's the way to get Capone.

somefeller said...

It's amazing how much interest there is in Saul Alinsky among the anti-Obama crowd. I've certainly never heard his name come up around any liberals/Democratic activists I know.

I heard of him in undergrad school, back in the 60s.

I guess you aren't high enough in the caste system. You're going to find it tough being just another one of the useful idiots when rationing of health care begins.

somefeller said...

Me and somefeller stalk blogs together in unison, Rules for Radicals in hand, looking to crush any dissent. Quirky conservative law blogs are our favorite. We're weird like that.

Like two Lords of the Sith. But which is the apprentice and which is the master?

Pogo said...

Imagine what Alinsky tactics can do in health care, say, when you're in the hospital, and the doctors decide to do a shit-in instead of seeing Medicare patients for less than 50% of the cost of caring for them.

Or maybe they just go home.

Thanks, Saul.
You just made my next 5 years a lot easier.

garage mahal said...

So then, you're pretty unfamiliar with Hillary Clinton (not to mention Barack Obama). Okay. Noted.

Don't forget Tea Partiers. Dick Armey and FreedomWorks were training supporters with literature and PowerPoint presentations on the gospel of Alinsky, on how to organize and setup Tea Party groups.

jaed said...

These are simple ways for the powerless to have an impact on the powerful. Alinsky is all about showing the have-nots how to get what they need from the haves.

The "powerless" in this case being political activist types who have the leisure time to go sit in an airport bathroom for hours, and the "powerful" being people who just got off an unpleasant coach flight and just want to get to a bathroom.

The "have-nots" being people who can afford to buy a ticket a concert solely to spoil other people's enjoyment, those other people being the "haves".

What an odd notion of privilege you have.

Theo Boehm said...

health care?
what a scare!
just poo
it'll do

wv = ashfxua
it'll do for carradine

Andy said...

Real impressive Outhouse.

Beth said...

Althouse, that's an odd conclusion to come to - are you saying reading Alinsky is essential to "knowing" anything about Hillary or Obama? I think it's about as relevant as caring that Jesus is W's favorite philosopher. It's something to know, but obsessing over it is silly.

Joe said...

As near as I can tell, Alinksy was a failure in every way except pop fame. Why does anyone listen to him?

Theo Boehm said...

concert ticket?
bourgeoisie stick it!

what will become of these little men
with their brown fiddles
and dented horns?
some will enter the military
some will be retrained for useful
occupations
some will simply disappear on cattle
cars in the night
yes, the Final Solution
to the Orchestra
Question.

Ann Althouse said...

Hillary famously wrote a college thesis on Alinsky. It's pretty important for thinking about her political development. And Alinsky was a key figure in "community organizing" in Chicago, Obama's one-time line of work.

"Rules for Radicals" is an amazing book, really laying out political tactics for all to see. Everyone should read it, if only to be aware when the tactics are used.

Joan said...

but at least the folks trying to make their point wouldn't be doing it with violence, thuggery or general nastiness.

But what is their point? To inconvenience people, to cause innocent, unrelated bystanders who just happened to be there, public discomfort? What message is that sending, other than that they are spoilers, ruining everyone else's experiences? That kind of behavior is sociopathic.

All of Alinsky's rules are sociopathic, IMO. That business about identifying the target, isolating it, and finding a fact you can twist out of context, distort, and broadcast, over and over -- it is fundamentally dishonest. It works because people on the whole still believe (or want to believe) what they're hearing. People who employ these tactics are undermining what's left of our social contract.

Pogo said...

"Don't forget Tea Partiers."

Damn right.
Thanks, garage, for the pointers.

It's amazingly simple to break things, like processes.

Theo Boehm said...

and what brand
of toilet paper do you
reach for when you hear the word
"culture?"

somefeller said...

I heard of him in undergrad school, back in the 60s.

Like I said, for some folks, it's always 1968. I heard of him in undergrad school too, back in the 90s. It was a historical discussion. Did you know back then there was also a musician named Jim Croce? Interesting trivia. Haven't heard much of either since that discussion among the people I hang out with.

JAL said...

@fls Alinsky is all about showing the have-nots how to get what they need from the haves. The powerless always have more power than they think they do, while the powers-that-be have less than they think they do.

Typical class warfare crap.

Very Marx. Very tiring.

Theo Boehm said...

ever heard of lenin, marx, aristotle, trotsky, plato, spinoza, or pope john paul II?

they all wrote books, too
they're dead, as well
they also smelled bad, i bet
we do sometimes

NewHam said...

"Everyone should read [Alinsky], if only to be aware when the tactics are used."

Are they legitimate tactics?

Where do such tactics lead when both sides deploy them?

Is bullying OK?

What about stronger forms of bullying?

What about outright intimidation?

What about targeted beatings?

Killings?

Assassination? (Isn't what Obama is doing in Afghanistan with the drones assassination?)

The problem with Alinsky-type tactics is that if you deploy them correctly they work wonderfully. They also produce a shitty fucking country nobody would ever want to live in.

For blacks fighting for their civil rights, these sorts of tactics were perfect because blacks already lived in a shitty country. So for them there was only an upside.

If you have no conscience, and your goal is to win at just about any cost, the strategy laid out by Alinsky is almost flawless. Imagine yourself as a union thug and these tactics just make you smile.

His type of thinking works very well for a Democrat type party and for a Tea type rebel party but not for the gentile Republican type party.

Republicans don't even know how to fart. And even if they managed to squeeze one out at the opera it would probably smell good.

Theo Boehm said...

smogfella
if you're hanging
have a care against carradine's fate!

Pogo said...

"Haven't heard much of either since"

You'll hear a lot about it soon enough.

Beth said...

Althouse, maybe it's naive of me, but I am not going to define Hillary by her college thesis. I've left my undergraduate and graduate writing behind for the most part; I'd hate to be defined by the way I saw the world in my early 20s. Obama seems to be very much a Chicago politician, so I'll give you that.

But I seriously wonder whether most liberals, outside of that Chicago culture, or who aren't stuck in the 60s, know or care about Alinsky.

Lem said...

When we get the government issued insurance card ..

Any Ideas what to do with those?

Julius Ray Hoffman said...

I meant "non-Democratic" not "non-Republican" in that fictional e-mail above.

Beth said...

theo,

spy nosy? sounds subversive to me. maybe someone should investigate.

somefeller said...

You'll hear a lot about it soon enough.

Cool. Time in a Bottle was a good song. Do you have it on 8-track?

TheGiantPeach said...

I think it's only fair to report that in the War Between the States of Consciousness circa 1970 the other side employed (or was said to have employed) complementary tactics. The "Dirty Tricks" squad had this itch-inducing powder that they could apply to toilet seats at sit-ins.

LilyBart said...

Somefeller:

According to this post - Obama taught Alinsky in his Chicago classes (near bottom of post - under Obama's picture). Reading his book, Ann can perhaps verify the "Power Analysis" concept is Alinky's


http://gatewaypundit.firstthings.com/2010/03/barack-obama-a-constitutional-professor-in-alinskys-rules-for-radicals/

Freeman Hunt said...

Beth, I think it's not that all these people are Alinsky acolytes, but that they've been influenced by him, whether directly or indirectly.

Theo Boehm said...

julie julie julie
ever heard of the art of war
dead chinese guy wrote that
long ago
for soldiers w/bows n' arrows
no shit
they still read it at
west point
they're learning to make dead people
at west point
somebody else's dead people
but as i say
in these times of high farts
anything longer than a text message
is high literature
and anything written before
your last bowel movement
is ancient history

NewHam said...

"Typical class warfare crap."

Yes, but it's not, see?

Nowadays, Alinsky-type tactics are being used by the Obamas to steal from the have-nots. Is Obama powerless? Dude, he's a fucking multi-millionaire.

He is deploying Alinsky tactics against average working-stiff Americans ... not fighting for rights for the poor.

Obama isn't giving anyone health care. He's forcing lower income people to buy health insurance (from his donors) to lower the cost for those who already have health insurance. To bend the cost curve by fucking over the poor.

It's a class war all right. It's a war on the lower classes by the elite government employees.

Only the totally poverty stricken will escape the bullets being fired on Americans by Barack Obama - and only because it would hurt his cause overall to target them.

We need to rise up and smite these motherfuckers. But good.

And I don't mean pussyfoot Alinsky tactics like farting around them.

I mean fucking smite them.

Theo Boehm said...

ooh i lurv free ponies!
they poop all over yah gaadn
as we say heah in bwahston

Theo Boehm said...

smite them
bite them
smash them in little pieces!
yay cowpies!

NewHam said...

"... offer a better solution and present it in a sensible way that engages new types of people?"

Because that won't get it done against people who are employing Alinsky type tactics against you.

Offering a better solution won't work if the media decide not to even write about your better solutions.

That's simply not enough.

A bully must be met with equal and opposite bullying. He must be smote.

Every parent knows this.

Then, once he's smote, and you control the narrative, you can start talking about solutions.

But not until he's smote.

Freeman Hunt said...

But I agree that a college thesis doesn't predict one's future thinking. You all should see the little commie thesis I wrote for one of my political science classes in college. (So in line with the far left thinking of my professor that he asked if he could keep a copy. Chompsky, rather than Alinsky, heavy.) Ha.

Beth said...

c'mon. spy nosy. no one's read coleridge here? jeez.

NewHam said...

"The shit-in is cruel."

No, a cruel shit in would be for 100 people to crap in their seats at an Obama town hall meeting and just sit in it.

And then just watch the pandemonium ensue.

They fart at one of your operas ... you shit in their town meetings.

That's the Chicago Way. That's how you get Capone.

What are you prepared to do?

Beth said...

no wordsworth?

Synova said...

I think that it's pretty clear that rather than being harmless, the "pranks" described are a way to do violence to people without consequence because you're relying on their adherence to a standard of good behavior that you've abandoned.

Anyone can "win" by being dishonest if other people can be counted on to behave honestly.

So, essentially, the whole thing, the whole method of gaining power and battling against those in power relies on the fact that the people you're fighting aren't the bad guys at all, but the good guys.

So someone does a "shit-in". And the result is... stories about how your grandmother was humiliated because she lost bladder control in public. And this isn't going to be blamed on the people actually to blame for it?

I think that it truly is a matter of reading those two examples and either thinking of the people involved as human beings, or not.

Theo Boehm said...

spy-nosy dint beeleve in gawd!
spy-nosy wrote some awful book
back before anyone's bowel-mvts.
even before the 1st movement of
the 1st symphony before the fart
in
spy-nosy started all this
shit!

Julius Ray Hoffman said...

@NewHam-

Hey, I'm all for taking things over and installing a new Princeps. I was saying that all the time here a few weeks ago...

SARAH PALIN FOR EMPEROR!!!

Fight Alinsky with Augustus.

Let's get it on! Dwelling in some sort of Aristocrats joke cum blog post is not going to help bring Empire about.

Freeman Hunt said...

I don't think either of these ideas would work at all.

The first would be annoying, but people would just hold it and go on their way.

The second relies on filling the air with bad smells but in a place with extremely high ceilings. Too much air in the place to keep up much of a concentration of odor.

No chaos would ensue.

Theo Boehm said...

opera intitulata
obama farta

Lem said...

btw.. I think we should declare Althouse meet-ups - Alinsky free zones

Its the decent thing to do ;)

JAL said...

Beth -- Hillary Clinton's Wellsley dissertation on Alinksy was unavailable while Bill was in office.

Theo Boehm said...

yes, and have you ever sat in a
clarinet section?
i mean talk abt bad smells!
the bassoon section alone could
power chicago with the methane
a typical bass instrument player
exudes

Theo Boehm said...

julie julie julie
that's really old shit
we want fresh excrement
nothing frozen from alaskya

Beth said...

JAL, I guess that's why she shot Vince Foster. He must have had a copy.

JAL said...

@ synova I think that it truly is a matter of reading those two examples and either thinking of the people involved as human beings, or not.

Bingo.

Lem said...

I guess that's why she shot Vince Foster. He must have had a copy.

Beth? I never pegged you as a conspiratorial type.

Theo Boehm said...

ever heard of haydn's symphony no. 106
the "water closet?"
he wrote it in 1806 when the first
flush toilet was installed in vienna
just ahead of the french
not a moment too soon, either
it has the famous toilet flushing effect
in the violas where they drag their
bows col legno over the strings in
the slow movement, which is all
haydn could manage in 1806.

NewHam said...

"I think that it truly is a matter of reading those two examples and either thinking of the people involved as human beings, or not."

So .. OK .. then, let's review the facts.

Obama won by using Alinsky tactics (such as ridiculing Sarah Palin). They were very, very effective because they have guys like Andrew Sullivan on their side who will do absolutely anything. They have no conscience.

And it worked.

Obama is in power and turning American into Soviet Russia circa 1940.

How do you counteract that?

To bitch about their tactics and whine about their moral rightness only sends the signal to Sullivan that his tactics are effective and are working like a charm.

They don't care how many bodies pile up in pursuit of their goals because they've convinced themselves (delusionally) that the ends justify the means.

It's not enough to say we shouldn't employ their tactics. If that's your position, then you have to offer up alternative strategies and tactics that have been proven to defeat bullies.

Or else you just surrendered.

Beth said...

In Biographia Literaria, Coleridge recounts how he, with William and Dorothy Wordsworth, raised suspicions in some lake district official, who set a spy after them:

"He had repeatedly hid himself, he said, for hours together behind a bank at the sea-side, (our favourite seat,) and overheard our conversation. At first he fancied, that we were aware of our danger; for he often heard me talk of one Spy Nozy, which he was inclined to interpret of himself, and of a remarkable feature belonging to him; but he was speedily convinced that it was the name of a man who had made a book and lived long ago. Our talk ran most upon books, and we were perpetually desiring each other to look at this, and to listen to that; but he could not catch a word about politics."

Theo Boehm said...

now the problem for a stupe like
alinsky
is he never heard of haydn except
as some dead white guy to shit on
but haydn had a lot more movements
than alinsky

Beth said...

Lem, and well you shouldn't.

NewHam said...

"I don't think either of these ideas would work at all."

Both of these tactics were deployed with great success (read the book!).

The point of them is to puncture the illusion that the powerful are in control and to anger them.

The O'Hare bathroom caper was undertaken to humiliate Daley. To piss him off. Pissed off people don't think straight. They say off the cuff remarks. They make mistakes. They look out of control. They get red-faced.

The entire point of the effort was merely to anger Daley and it worked perfectly.

The mask of competence was off. It looked to all the passengers as if the airport didn't have enough bathrooms and that any moron could see that. It made Daley look incompetent (even though this was not true). It's OK even if he finds out what you did because that's just going to anger him even more and if he ever makes the mistake of accusing you of doing what you just did he looks even more off his rocker.

They aren't after truth.

They're after power because the power leads directly to the money and the means to control the cops so's nobody gets pinched.

These people don't have a conscience like you do.

They're amoral.

Lem said...

good

Theo Boehm said...

beth
can you get all spy-nosy's ideas into
a text message?
otherwise people today will not think
they're worth a shit.

JAL said...

@ Beth

?


Just the facts, m'am.

Just as conservative authors have speculated, it was the Clintons who asked Wellesley in 1993 to hide Hillary Rodham's senior thesis from the first generation of Clinton biographers, according to her thesis adviser and friend, professor Alan H. Schechter, who describes taking the call from the White House. [See sidebar: "A stupid political decision."]

(from coverage in 2007 found here on MSNBC.com)

No big whoop, maybe, but it wasn't just the dissertation, it was the impact on her thought and choices. Unlike Freeman, Hillary did not have a wake up call she answered -- at 3 am or any other time.

Interesting in how Alinksy has had the impact he has.

Ann Althouse said...

"Althouse, maybe it's naive of me, but I am not going to define Hillary by her college thesis."

It was the long suppression of it that called attention to it.

Pogo said...

What would happen if Alinsky tactics were used on, say, a decision tree for cancer treatment?

Haw!
Those farting shitting dumbasses.
All redfaced n' struggling to breathe.

Theo Boehm said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Theo Boehm said...

ham ham ham
"they're after the money" won't do
anymore
it's all shit, doncha know!
g m and the steel mills and the proles
why, it was all worth taking! the power!
the wealth!
the money!
for the people! for the children!
guess what?
the chinese own it all
and it's all turned to shit
there are no more steel mills
g m's bankrupt
who used to score onetwothreefour
winning quarters just like that
and what do you think of your
profitable corporation now,
mister death?

NewHam said...

"Dick Armey and FreedomWorks were training supporters with literature and PowerPoint presentations on the gospel of Alinsky, on how to organize and setup Tea Party groups."

This is exactly right.

We're going to do to you what you did to us, only we're going to do it better, and harder and faster and more times.

You have no idea the whirlwind you have fucking reaped.

No. Fucking. Idea.

NewHam said...

"It was the long suppression of it that called attention to it."

And why did she want it suppressed?

Certainly not because she was embarrassed.

No, it was because that's her playbook. Every team hides its playbook with a passion.

That's the gold in Fort Knox.

Beth said...

It's always the cover up, as they say. Did she want it out of sight because she didn't want anyone to know her secret powers? Or because she'd become aware that it would be negative baggage? Or even a degree of chagrin? Whatever the case, it seems to be a Clinton family reflex to do exactly the wrong thing.

Pogo said...

What if Big Pharma types go full Alinsky, and start messing with medication supplies?

Ain't hard.
Few clicks of a mouse, and 1000s are outta luck.

Boy, they wouldn't do that, right?
I mean, it's only OK for the left, ain't that so?

Michael McNeil said...

One of the most interesting threads. Thanks, Althouse.

Theo Boehm said...

getting sucked off by monica
was about the most wrong thing
i've ever heard of.
you're the pres
of the u s and all you can
get is some zaftig 20-sumpfing
who can't swallow?
i complain abt blow jobs alot
but this is yet another
example of total
shit.

wv = splum

no shit

Joe said...

I think you've had enough vodka for now, Theo.

William said...

This tactic is consistent with the times in which Alinsky lived. Now it's outlandish, but those were different times. Consider that Alinsky's target audience had bushy sideburns and lapels that were wider than their shoulders. Good taste was not their distinguishing characteristic. There was the idea that acting like an asshole somehow helped to subvert the system.... Ginsberg tried to levitate the Pentagon. Hoffman threw money down on the floor of the New York Stock Exchange. Krassner used to make out with women dressed as nuns in airport waiting rooms. These tactics were designed to destabilize the system? There was a guiding, Machiavellan purpose behind them? Who knew....Young people like to goof off. I suppose this was a way of politicizing their goldfish swallowing instincts, but youth passes. And Daleyes are forever.

Pogo said...

Say it ain't so, Joe.

Vodka is the primary medication for socialist healthcare.

Theo Boehm said...

oh joe
i don't drink spirits
sorry if the crappy truth offends
i'm just drinking of the Spirit of Alinsky
you know the one that wanted excrement
in our symphonies and our airports
he's got it
everyone's got excrement in everything
these days:
symphonies
airports
steel mills
your doctor
the various recent pres.'s of the u s
the banks
congress
etc.
yes, they've all turned to merde
and we still have nuclear weapons
sweet dreams

Theo Boehm said...

oh, and i forgot to mention
pubic hairs on the coke can
brought to you and your 10
year old at the time live
on t v by Your Federal
Government

Theo Boehm said...

william
enough people acting like assholes
DID
turn it all to shit
Alinsky got his pile of excrement

so far nobody's been able
to turn it into
a pony.

wv = teddly
about right

Lem said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Doug Wright-OG said...

TB: All your fine rhetoric is meaningless unless you know how to construct barricades from materials close at hand. The Paris Commune had it made because of all the cobble stone streets back then.

What in the heck do we have today? Asphalt and concrete make piss poor materials for such purposes. So, listen to the Insta Guy and stock up on useful tools from Amazon. Peace through strength and superior firepower is the only way.

However, civility plus using Alinksy's own tactics will work too.

Port wine is great too.

Nora said...

Joe said...
"I think you've had enough vodka for now, Theo."

Theo is just doing his Alinsky - farting in the crowd

vw: whessnes

Theo Boehm said...

doug,
thanks, but port wine gives me a headache
plus the stuff that doesn't
is too expensive.
haven't touched port since i was
sommelier serving the haute bourgeoisie while they oppressed the
proletariat & people of color.

We had to educate our palates back in
the day and raise our consciousnesses
to the level of at least a nice Ficklin California port.
I think that's how you spell Ficklin.
Don't live in California anymore, and can hardly remember how to spell it, either.

WV = stoplude
"Noone but Ludd did the poor any good!" Why should we stop him?

Pogo said...

"Don't live in California anymore, and can hardly remember how to spell it, either."

Try C-u-b-a, or mebbe G-r-e-e-c-e.

Lem said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Lizzie said...

That is SO odd!

Methadras said...

Right, so this piece of marxist shit, proves how much of a sinister and devious motherfucker he is. I'm glad that his soul is rotting in hell at this very moment. I bet that Satan hasn't let him take a shit and a piss since he's shown up. Interestingly Titus is aroused.

TheGiantPeach said...

So, last week it was Abbie Hoffman. This week it is Saul Alinsky. As long as we are reminiscing about the radical figures of the late 60s, is it in order to put in a request for the next in the series? How about a post on Paul Goodman, whom I consider the most interesting (and largely forgotten) member of the group?

madawaskan said...

Synova-

Are you recognizing this:

described are a way to do violence to people without consequence because you're relying on their adherence to a standard of good behavior that you've abandoned.

Anyone can "win" by being dishonest if other people can be counted on to behave honestly.

So, essentially, the whole thing, the whole method .....battling ... relies on the fact that the people you're fighting aren't the bad guys at all, but the good guys.



Change the actors-what do you have?

They have a lot in common with our current "foreign" enemies .

Oh wait...they've given them the rights of US citizens.

Scratch that.

reader_iam said...

As I just commented elsewhere:

***You know, Alinsky quotes are all the rage now: He's getting ever more famous and influential, posthumously. FTR, I actually read Alinsky decades ago (along with reading all sorts, and all along the spectrum, of things). I mean, for what that's worth 'n' all.

Anyway, here's a bit of rosemary that's poked its way up into my mind this evening:

"The normal and the stigmatized are not persons, but perspectives."--Erving Goffman***

Theo Boehm said...

The Giant Peach:

Yes! Paul Goodman was very interesting, and not that full of merde. I think I might do a blog post about him if I can violate my principle of only putting boring posts on my own blog.

The Community of Scholars is still a book to contend with about higher education, and practically everything else Goodman wrote is worth a look. He may have been wrong about a lot of things, but he was no evil asshole, à la Machialinsky.

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Kirk Parker said...

Theo wins the thread at 8:13 PM!
.
.
.
.
And dude, you are on a roll tonight! What, were you involved in some weird collision where half of Trooper's brain cells got exchanged with yours??? :-)

Lem said...

Now that the democrats have made health care a right, Alinsky will be more relevant than ever.

edutcher said...

The best Indian fighters, people like Daniel Boone and Kit Carson, knew the Indians and how they lived.

Patton read Rommel's, "The Tank in Attack" in the days before he threw the Afrika Korps out of western Tunisia.

Lesson: You want to beat somebody, get inside his head.

garage/Montagne/Jeremy all are slaves to Uncle Saul. That's what they're doing here.

When they sneer because we talk about him, it's because they know those methods can be used against them, too.

And that's exactly what's gonna happen.

Scott said...

A blog post that gets 160 comments in 6 hours, in the evening.

Alinsky is a really hot topic, even though the original point didn't make much of a point. It shows that conservatives are finally getting tuned into Alinsky, which is a good thing. Rules for Radicals may be a vile little book, but it also gives us a clear picture of the pathology of the left. It's must reading for everyone who wants to understand the Uglycrats

NewHam said...

"Right, so this piece of marxist shit, proves how much of a sinister and devious motherfucker he is. I'm glad that his soul is rotting in hell at this very moment."

All Saul Alinsky did was prove that being an asshole can be very effective.

If you go to the opera manager and demand $100,000 for your "community organizing" and they refuse, of course you send in the farters.

You'll have the check the next morning.

That's just garden variety extortion that is already illegal. Alinsky banked on the fact that nobody would fucking arrest his "community organizers."

If you want to extort your neighbor, it's not that difficult to do. Alinsky has lots of good ideas.

Obama has, of course, perfected them. Nothing Obama does is divorced from the idea of extorting his neighbors (because he hates his neighbors the Americans).

Do you want to know the secret of why the stimulus isn't working?

Gather 'round and I'll tall you: It isn't working because there is no stimulus.

That's right, there is no stimulus. Obama took the money and funneled it to his guys (the teachers unions and the other public employee unions and the road building unions). The union bosses funneled it right out the back door.

The stimulus was being stolen.

And it still is.

It is a neverending pot of money that is being stolen by the corrupt, Mafia-ridden unions.

Nothing Marxist about that really. It's just garden variety evil and we have to deal with it on its level.

We have to ... well, I think you know what we have to do to it.

And make no mistake ... the Mexicans are paying very close attention. They're the next grievance group that will use these tactics. Think La Raza.

But that's not the real problem. The real problem is that the group after LaRaza is al Queda.

Once al Queda realizes how the game is played - it's game over man.

So we can deal with this now, or we can deal with it later ... but we're going to have to deal with it one way or the other.

And there are going to be a lot of dead bodies in the streets.

AprilApple said...

Alinsky sounds like a total asshole.

is it any wonder the left like him?

Theo Boehm said...

Thanks, Kirk.
I'm not sure which half.
Maybe the ones that aren't doing taxes.

Stinking up an orchestra concert.
What a concept!
From the days when brown-shoed squares
ran things, and their wives dragged them to the
opera or the symphony
not to mention the van Gogh exhibit at the Museum,
because that was what wives did, and the guys in
wing tips went along because they had to pretend
to have civic pride and kinda believed what it said
over the door of the Pottsley Memorial Concert Hall:

Without Vision a People Perish.

Nowadays, the Power Elite were mostly raised on the Bee Gees and the Pretenders when they were kids,
and were into Springsteen in college, and their wives
Joan Jett & Pat Benetar
and the boss may have been a Dead Head back in
the day.
So, how do you disrupt their music?
Hijack trucks carrying iPods fresh off the ships from San Pedro?
And what do you call a lot of people who smell bad at a rock concert?

So I come back to my old Question:
What brand of toilet paper do you reach for
When you hear the word, "Culture?"

WV = "blest"
Blest are the Poor in Spirit; for they shall inherit the Earth.

Lem said...

Coulter speech cancelled over fears of violence.

Some conservatives know how to do it.. going after liberal sacred cows is one way.

But the question could be asked does turning yourself into the things you condemn in order to defeat them an un-conservative thing to do?

And is that why ultimately most conservatives never fight that way?

Are we willing to get our uniforms dirty?

Theo Boehm said...

Yes, New Ham, I hear La Raza is big on demanding the return/creation of Atzlàn, i.e., California and the rest of the Southwest.

My only question is where do we sign to give it to them?

And what rhymes with "Forty-three?"
Kids today learn "nifty."

NewHam said...

"A protest by hundreds of students led organizers to cancel a Tuesday night speech by American conservative commentator Ann Coulter at the University of Ottawa. A spokesman for the organizers said Coulter was advised against appearing after about 2,000 "threatening" students crowded the entrance to Marion Hall, posing a security threat."

What's the lesson?

The threat of violence can shut down free speech.

The left doesn't believe in free speech, so they have no problem threatening violence to achieve their goal of shutting down conservative speech. (They'll never admit this, so you have to watch what they do, not what they say.)

Conservatives believe in free speech; so conservatives would never threaten someone to get their speech cancelled.

In this way, conservatives are doomed, because they will neither stoop to the level of their opponent, nor will they arrest the lawbreakers.

Is it against the law to threaten violence? Well, Eric Holder dropped charges against the baton-wielding Black Panthers intimidating voters at the polls, didn't he?

They have a strategy and they are employing that strategy to great success.

What are you prepared to do?

Paco Wové said...

(hmmm, think I'll try out this 'Theoposting' style...)

I think Spy Nozy
is hiding under
Cedarford's bed
right now

Lem said...

Is Russell Kirk's The Conservative Mind the matter to Alinsky's Rules for Radicals antimatter.

Or could they coexist in one person?

We need a Clark Kent/Superman.

Lem said...

... in a hastily generalizing fashion one may say that radicalism since 1790 has tended to attack the prescribe arrangement of society on the following grounds -

(1) The perfectibility of man and the illimitable progress of society: meliorism. Radicals believe that education, positive legislation, and alteration of environment can produce men like gods; they deny that humanity has a natural proclivity towards violence and sin.

(2) The contempt for tradition. Reason, impulse and materialistic determinism are equally preferred as guides to social welfare, trustier than the wisdom of our ancestors. Formal religion is rejected and various ideologies are presented as substitutes.

(3) Political Leveling. Order and privilege are condemned; total democracy, as direct as practicable, is the professed radical ideal. Allied with this spirit, generally, is a dislike of old parliament arrangements and an eagerness for centralization and consolidation.

(4) Economic levelling. The ancient rights of property, specially property in land, are suspect to almost all radicals; and collectivist reformers hack at the institution of private property root and branch.

As a fifth point, one might try to define a common radical view of the state function; but here the chasm of opinion between the chief schools of innovation is too deep for any satisfactory generalization
.

The Conservative Mind - R Kirk.

Susan said...

Alinsky is proof of the old saw-- it is far easier to destroy than to create. His purpose in life was to gleefully, busily figure out how to screw things up. He claimed to have been driven by a moral desire to create 'good' out of the ashes of destruction... but I see little evidence of any real morality at work here. He presumes the nation is evil and then gets to work destroying it.

Hey look.. if you chip away at the bottom stone, you can use a hammer and chisel and bring down an entire castle! wow. It's called "undermining". what a concept.

Alinsky was an overgrown junior high troublemaker.

NewHam said...

"Alinsky was an overgrown junior high troublemaker."

I think this understates his influence. He has, after all, left a significant mark on two of the country's most powerful people - Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama.

Both Clinton and Obama see America as a racist pit of evil and they intend to use Alinsky tactics to "cleanse" us.

They fund their activities by funneling taxpayer dollars to their co-conspirators (ACORN, the union thugs, etc.)

If all Alinsky did was impact people's junior high school experience then it might be easy to laugh him off. But very powerful people are now using Alinsky's tactics against the American populace.

They're bullies and theives with the US military and the US Department of Justice and the Internal Revenue Service at their beck-and-call.

They're dangerous. And we must end their ability to wield these weapons against us.

Doug Wright-OG said...

NewHam: Remember that while Robespierre raised the concept of the "Rights of Man" to new levels, he himself was brought down by the same hysteria that revolution generated. It's too damned difficult to say where such an event shall wind up, so tread carefully from now on.

The only way we should try to beat Alinsky's students is at the ballot box and that is only possible through an on going concerted political effort; If Obama / Rahm / Axelrod want it to happen in the streets, let them cast the first rock; they'll soon learn that's a big time mistake.

Hagar said...

Alinsky was not a failure; he was rather quite effective in Chicago. Which is why Richard II Daley's Chicago decided that "if you can't beat them, join them!" or rather - make them join you - and gave the "radicals" cushy jobs in the organization and the universities where it had influence.

This co-opted crowd is where Obama and his advisers come from - not the people that actually run Cook County, but the pacified though frustrated former "radicals."

NewHam said...

"It's too damned difficult to say where such an event shall wind up, so tread carefully from now on."

No.

I choose not to go silently into that night.

Ann Althouse said...

"It's always the cover up, as they say. Did she want it out of sight because she didn't want anyone to know her secret powers? Or because she'd become aware that it would be negative baggage? Or even a degree of chagrin? Whatever the case, it seems to be a Clinton family reflex to do exactly the wrong thing."

There's a fear or the "or have you ever been" aspect of the old question "Are you now or have you ever been a Communist?'

NewHam said...

"let them cast the first rock"

Their thugs have already cast the first rock. They beat Ken Gladney to a pulp as a message to all who would oppose them.

They dropped charges against the Black Panthers to send a message to the brotherhood that it's OK to show up at polling places with billy clubs to intimidate elder voters.

The American people have turned the other cheek only to be slapped again and again by these thugs.

Enough.

They've put one of ours in the hospital. Time to put one of theirs ... well, do I really have to spell it out for you?

That's the Chicago Way.

And that's how you get Capone.

Hagar said...

Lamest excuse yet for not to take up the immigration issue:

"IMMIGRATION PLAN WOULD CREATE bACKLOG
Washington Times, by Stephen Dinan Original Article
Posted By: StormCnter- 3/24/2010 4:46:49 AM Post Reply
The federal government is not equipped to process the flood of applications from a proposed immigration legalization bill and the agency that would oversee that program won't be ready for "a few years," the office of the Homeland Security Department's inspector general told Congress on Tuesday. The warning, from Assistant Inspector General Frank Deffer, could severely complicate President Obama's new push to pass an immigration bill this year."

but then, he may have a point. Just establishing the agencies and hiring staff for the programs outlined in the healthcare takeover bill will take them years to get off the ground.

JAL said...

Good morning Theo.

How's the headache?

(But you were very funny. :-))

rhhardin said...

Kenneth Burke would say that the low illustrates the principle of hierarchy as well as the high.

So Alinsky is right on, literarily speaking.

Comrade X said...

I like the one where Alinsky had the Tulane students dress up in the traditional garb of the Democrat Party, Ku Klux Klan robes. It was OK though, because of the ends.

PD Quig said...

All Alinsky and his acolytes will accomplish is to hasten the day of reckoning. Whether it be by destroying the economy, or by breaking down the final inhibitions against direct--and possibly quite violent--counteraction to their 'politics,' the shit&fart crowd is going to set loose the dogs of war.

As with the public sector union pensioners, they have made a strategic miscalclation: it matters not how good a deal you have negotiated if your benefactors can no longer pay the bills. When we're digging out from the inevitable statism-induced collapse, there were be a lot of very angry folks. And we have the vast majority of the guns and ammo. We'll see whose underwear is soiled when the SHTF.

richard mcenroe said...

"Andrea said...
Somehow I can't see 100 black people gathering together at some white guy's behest to eat beans and fart in public in front of a bunch of other white people. "

That's because you're not a true progressive, and don't understand that black people are really just objects to be moved around to further smart white people's aims.

Blue@9 said...

The airport prank just seems assholish and counterproductive. I've always thought it was dumb for activists to do things that mess with the lives of normal people, because you've just made a bunch of enemies. What's going to happen after the prank? News stories about how a bunch of long-haired hippie douchebags caused unspeakable discomfort and embarrassment to pregnant mothers, elderly couples, and traveling children. Yeah, I'm sure the people are going to rise up in furious anger against Daley because he failed to stop Alinsky's douchebag college pranksters.

This kind of issue often came up a few times when I was a law student in DC. Protesters who came through were always talking about shutting down the beltway, shutting down the trains, shutting down downtown streets. It was surreal to me that they couldn't wrap their heads around the idea that the only people they really hurt were the wage-earners who had to commute into the city every day to earn their income. The salaried professionals could work from home, but the building staff, the doormen, the taxi-drivers and restaurant staff, etc., were all at the mercy of these white twenty-something college kids. And I can guarantee that these protests did not generate sympathy among the working people. Imagine being a single mom having to commute into the city to earn your hourly wage. Imagine finding that you can't get into work because a bunch of white college kids bussed in from Mass are angry about the WTO. Are you going to blame the WTO for losing a day's pay? No. The wretched thing is that the protesters would always say the same shit to me: "This is more important than losing a day of work." Yeah, there's nothing like empathy from a community organizer. Your needs are unimportant compared to my grand political gesture. Way to win allies to the cause.

Blue@9 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
elc said...

Methadras: I bet that Satan hasn't let him take a sh*t and a p*ss since he's shown up.

Ha! That thought is going to keep my spirits up for days to come. I believe Alinsky originally dedicated Rules for Radicals to "Satan, the first community organizer." (Later editions removed this embarrassing little item.)

I imagine Satan to be the type who stomps the hardest on his most devoted and slavish followers. He knows a useful idiot when he sees one.

c3 said...

After reading the excerpt my only question is:
When did it stop being the "establishment"?

Robert said...

This is the same crowd that told us to kill anyone over 35 back in the '60s. It is the same crowd that worked with the Russians to defeat us in Vietnam. It is the same crowd responsible for the deaths of millions of citizens after they forced us to betray the South Vietnamese. It is the same crowd that still thinks it was courageous to bomb police headquarters and the Pentagon. This is the same crowd that is now in charge of our Federal government. And now they are evacuating themselves on us. Welcome to Starnesville.

issues said...

I read the book, too. Whenever I try to get into Obama's head, and decipher what he means by change, I remember Alinsky's contempt for the middle class. He doesn't care about the discomfort of or disruption to the activities of others because they are the complacent status quo supporters he despises. And are we to suppose that Progressives feel a lot different? These people - and their movements - are totally about self-justification. They are, at their best, destructive virtue-seekers. That's why the Chileans killed them.

issues said...

I read the book, too. Whenever I try to get into Obama's head, and decipher what he means by change, I remember Alinsky's contempt for the middle class. He doesn't care about the discomfort of or disruption to the activities of others because they are the complacent status quo supporters he despises. And are we to suppose that Progressives feel a lot different? These people - and their movements - are totally about self-justification. They are, at their best, destructive virtue-seekers. That's why the Chileans killed them.

issues said...

I read the book, too. Whenever I try to get into Obama's head, and decipher what he means by change, I remember Alinsky's contempt for the middle class. He doesn't care about the discomfort of or disruption to the activities of others because they are the complacent status quo supporters he despises. And are we to suppose that Progressives feel a lot different? These people - and their movements - are totally about self-justification. They are, at their best, destructive virtue-seekers. That's why the Chileans killed them.

Beth said...

Remember that while Robespierre raised the concept of the "Rights of Man" to new levels, he himself was brought down by the same hysteria that revolution generated.

Yay. Finally my spy-nosy digression comes 'round to the topic. Count Wordsworth and Coleridge among those turned circumspect by the bloody turn of the French Revolution. They too resisted the question Althouse mentions - "are you now or have you ever been..."

pst314 said...

Speaking of excrement, those same leftists were fond of throwing plastic baggies of feces. Barbarians.

veni vidi vici said...

"But what is their point? To inconvenience people, to cause innocent, unrelated bystanders who just happened to be there, public discomfort? What message is that sending, other than that they are spoilers, ruining everyone else's experiences? That kind of behavior is sociopathic."

By your definition, then, all forms of protest or demonstration are sociopathic. No question such juvenilia as Althouse reprinted in this post is disruptive and designed to cause inconvenience, but compared to, say, a mob of roughhousers running rampant through the streets at drive-time, smashing shop windows, pushing pedestrians out of the way, and denting cars and breaking car windows, I'd say it's a pretty mild protest.

If you can't see the difference in measure, regardless of how one feels about the point of any given protest, that's on you, not me (nor Alinsky, for that matter).

Seems he's more promoting a juvenile/douchebagular version of Gandhi/MLK style non-violent protest than much else, if Althouse's excerpt is any guide.

former law student said...

and don't understand that black people are really just objects to be moved around to further smart white people's aims.

If this is your understanding of Alinsky, then you have him exactly, precisely, 180 degrees-out-of-phase, wrong.

former law student said...

Coulter was in luck. She should know that Canada preserves the "fighting words" exception to freedom of speech:

Public incitement of hatred (s. 319[1]). Every one who, by communicating statements in a public place, incites hatred against any identifiable group where such incitement is likely to lead to a breach of the peace is guilty of [a crime].

– s. 319[1], Criminal Code of Canada

The Canadian authorities feared people would react negatively to Coutler's delightful sense of humour:

The incident followed a Monday night lecture at the University of Western Ontario, where Coulter told a Muslim student to "take a camel" as an alternative to flying.

Coulter made the comment as she responded to a question from student Fatima Al-Dhaher, who asked about previous comments in which Coulter said Muslims shouldn't be allowed on airplanes and should take "flying carpets" instead. Al-Dhaher noted she did not own a flying carpet and asked what she should take as an alternative transportation.

Coulter did not deny making the flying carpet comment and replied to the university student, "What mode of transportation? Take a camel," to jeers and cheers. It was a decidedly pro-Coulter audience. One man, who identified himself as a U.S. citizen, described U.S. President Barack Obama as a "Marxist."

Theo Boehm said...

Ah, yer playin' with definitions, v v v.
'Cause we don't like the stinking
You say we can't do thinking
And any protest is a bad ideé?

Phooeé

Just think how far he would've got if ML
(not K) had nailed 95 feces on that door
instead of some stupid Latin

ha ha
Stunk it to the Man!

I hear they want to fix the roof on the Cathedral
of Our Lady Star of the Sea, you know, the one
they built in Boston in 1636.

Theo Boehm said...

fls,

Do farts count as Hate Speech?

We have some real tough legal questions
to discuss.

Nate Whilk said...

I think these juvenile tactics also include the far left's habit of calling conservative ideas "wet dreams".

Disturbed, demented children. With power.

From NPR On The Media for Aug. 7, 2009:

RYAN LIZZA: [of the New Yorker]

But the ideas behind community organizing are the opposite of idealistic. There’s a famous story. Whenever Alinsky would have a new student coming to organize, he would ask them, why do you want to be an organizer, and they would always say, well, I want to help others, you know, I want to devote my life to doing good. And he would scream back at them, no, you want to organize for power.

Obama’s organizing buddy shared with me a manual that was very similar to the one that Obama used to train as an organizer, and in it, it said, we are not virtuous by not wanting power. We are really cowards for not wanting power because power is good and powerlessness is evil. This is the first concept you learn as a community organizer and the first concept that Obama learned when he got to Chicago and learned to be a community organizer.


The fart-in is also mentioned. And Lizza laughs over conservatives using Alinsky.

Beth said...

Conservatives don't want power. They just want to do the right thing. Thank goodness for that.

Cue sun rising over morning in America.

M. Simon said...

I've got to support Ann here. As far as I'm able to tell from reading her blog she has never been a Communist.

She just voted for one in the last election. Or would the correct term be fascist? I'm going to have to study that more.

What I do know is that fascist did not fancy ownership. What they were into was control.

Theo Boehm said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
veni vidi vici said...

Theo @ 1:50 pm today.

About as well said as anyone could. Bravo!

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