September 14, 2009
Should the President be insulting pop stars?
Obama called Kanye West a "jackass." Which he is, but what business is it of the President's?
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206 comments:
1 – 200 of 206 Newer› Newest»I was amused by Wilson calling Obama a liar, and I'm amused by Obama calling West a jackass. Both statements were refreshing bits of honesty from national politicians.
Exactly. The president has a very disagreeable quality of criticizing American citizens by name. It demeans the office.
It also shows a bit of solipsism. Why does he think the rest of us care what he thinks about Kanye West?
Our leader proves he is brave enough to take a stand on issues that are of utmost importance to the American public.
Which he is, but what business is it of the President's?
Gee . . . maybe because the President is an American citizen with the same opinion about a behavior that every decent human being calls rude and thoughtless?
Do you think the President called him that because Kanye is black? I mean isn't that the fall back position - imputing racism to everyone who does something you don't like or agree with?
Kanye apologized on tonight's Jay Leno show and said he's taking time off to evaluate. Good for him.
Maybe the President can have a root beer summit with Kanye and Taylor.
Kaney teabags?
Who knew ;)
Joe Biden wants video.
Now he's trying to do a Sister Souljah Moment.
the man is completely lost and out of his depth. It's embarrassing.
Does it matter that the remarks were off the record?
Or shouldn't I have bothered asking?
Not something a president really should publicly comment on. But ya, he is a jackass.
There is no distinction between on the record and off the record now. You'd think a savior as savvy and post-partisan as Obama allegedly is would know that.
Maybe he just kind of sucks.
"The president has a very disagreeable quality of criticizing American citizens by name. It demeans the office. "
Who else has he critiiczed by name?
I don't believe Crowley was mentioned by name, nor was Palin.
He's trying to make up for the "acting stupidly" gaffe.
The President wants his presidency to be about grand ideas but he seems most interested in trivial altercations and events around the nation. It's odd.
I don't believe Crowley was mentioned by name, nor was Palin.
This level of quibbling demonstrates how embarrassingly bad things are right now for Obama supporters.
I could have written 1000 words and not explained it as well.
I picked up a touch of resentment from Obama of Black Men who can get to be famous by party time music and alcohol consumption and actually become popular African American community role models. He has had to overcome that image all of his adult life to become our "President Obama" in a 80% white country. Skip, the 40% white Phd at harvard is his friend, but Kanye with a only a Rapper's personae IS NOT Obama's friend. Welcome to the underside of the social class Bus, Kanye.Our President must be feeling un-appreciated these days.
He didn't "publicly comment" on them. He was asked -- OFF THE RECORD -- about it, and he had a response. It's not like he held a freakin' press conference.
Clearly, Obama should apologize.
But what I want to know is what does Kanye West think of Joe Wilson and how many protesters does West think were in DC last weekend.
Ask Obama about Adam Clymer.
Someone, I forget who it was, has predicted Obama will expose his true self and ruin his presidency in an unscripted, but open miked incident.
He doesn't know his place.
Before anyone tosses the racist accusation, consider the statement at face value. Obama doesn't understand the role of the President of the United States. His oath of office says nothing about restructuring the Cabinet process, dictating orders to private companies, or commenting on pop culture. He is a rank amateur doing a poor job, and whining when that fact is mentioned.
I am guessing that someone asked him, and he answered. I'm okay with that. If he just blurted it out during a Press Conference with the Prime Minister of Belize, or someone like that, then I'm wondering if he has Tourette's.
Phosporus:
Seven is on fire tonight. My advice is be very careful or he'll torch you good.
wv = cootabl = what grade schoolers are
Off the record. That's the important distinction here. It matters so much. It mattered so much, just for example, during Plamegate.
There is no off the record. This is as dumb as arguing about the number of people at a march on Washington.
And, again, the quibbling demonstrates the desperation of Obama supporters.
The President hires jackasses, so he's not in a position to talk.
Former SF Mayor Willie Brown, from his SF Chronicle column yesterday. Had Obama asked him about Van Jones, Willie would have said:
"Yeah, I know a lot about him. He's really a pain in the ass. when he ran Bay Area PoliceWatch, he slanted every case to make the cops look as bad as possible. And while he might be talented enough, he's totally and completely unreliable."
For me the big news is the mainstream press going out of its way to make Obama look bad. Granted, it was tweeted, but it was tweeted by someone at ABC.
wv: fught (Althouse's word verification committed a hate crime against me!)
"Obama will expose his true self and ruin his presidency in an unscripted, but open miked incident."
Impossible. For that to happen O would have to have a true self to expose.
FLS:
Holy smokes! Are you jumping ship on Prez Obama too?
wv = pelfuzi
...and I would think he'd have an opinion on Kanye West because his daughters are likely fans of Taylor Swift. I wonder if they were watching the VMAs.
Rhhardin beat me to it, but a more presidential term would be "major league asshole."
First Obama them Willie Brown.
So Van Jones was thrown under the bus twice. For those of us keeping score, does that count as a double?
Osama was right about Obama?
Obama talks like a powerless person?
Bush didn't actually say "major league asshole" because it was off the record. Or something.
The truth is I don't know any more. These Obama defenders stopped making sense awhile ago, and I've had a hard time responding to the gibberish.
No President will ever out do Harry Truman and his letter to the NYT Music Critic that wrote a MoDo toned column about Harry's daughter's performance. Does anyone have a copy of that one? I keep thinking that we want the Obama/Soros Socialist agenda to fail, but too much rejection is not something that Obama knows anything about dealing with, unlike Harry Truman who could take it about himself, but not those he was dedicated to guarding.Truman was an old style Democrat like the Georgia Democrats of that era, and I really loved Truman's style of being President.
phos asks: "Who else has he critiiczed by name?
I don't believe Crowley was mentioned by name, nor was Palin."
From telegraph.co.uk 24 Jan 2009
Mr Obama has told Republicans in Washington to stop listening to the right-wing talk show host Rush Limbaugh, risking a new culture war with conservative voters.
Who's polling better, West or Obama?
"Someone, I forget who it was, has predicted Obama will expose his true self and ruin his presidency in an unscripted, but open miked incident."
This incident has ruined his presidency?
Are you peopel for real?
"It mattered so much, just for example, during Plamegate.
"
Whiskey. Tango. Foxtrot.
This incident is equivalent in political ramification to the Valerie Plame affair?
I don't think it's the Obama supporters that are grasping at straws here.
So if Kanye West was a desk jockey for the CIA with an open identity -- as say, Kanye West -- this would be a really big deal?
"His oath of office says nothing about restructuring the Cabinet process, dictating orders to private companies, or commenting on pop culture."
If this were anyplace other than Althousia, I wouldn't have to ask, but:
Which of those do you think is the worst thing for a president to do?
This thread is the most hysterical that I've seen you people. Everything Obama does is the worst thing that has ever been doen, as far as the Althouse comments section is concerned.
I've said this before: Bizarre.
Damn you ABC and your premature unedited tweeting.
Gibb: "The president was speaking symbolically. It pains me to have to explain this but the president was just saying he thought Kayne West is Democrat. Next."
Preposterous;
No, of course I was not saying or suggesting this was a big deal. It is just another incident, however innocuous, but is part of a trend for the most inexperienced Prez of all time :)
Btw, did you hear Glenn Beck is in the lead for Time Magazine's Man of The Year ?
What's your take on the sincerity of the apology from ABC News?
And damn you, Seven, for making the Sister Souljah reference before I got to.
"So if Kanye West was a desk jockey for the CIA with an open identity -- as say, Kanye West -- this would be a really big deal?"
Ahh. . . so your contention is that Plame was not outed. Everyone knew she was a spy.
And that even if she were outed, this would be no worse than calling a rap star a "jackass".
Do I have that correct?
Did I just now say Gibb? Sorry, meant to say Gibbs.
Windbag tries to make the same point that John Roberts once tried to make with Ronald Reagan:
[The] oath of office says nothing about . . . commenting on pop culture.
Here we have a thing that Obama said that is funny and vacuous. Althouse posts about it. We talk about it. And our token way-too-serious Obama supporter is all up in arms, doing damage control by accusing us of making a big deal over the situation.
Nobody here thinks much of it. But if you aren't somewhat concerned, dude, why are you here? Why your uproar?
And, Peter, I am sorry to steal your thunder.
Attacking someone, to a certain extent, drags you down to their level.
In the case of Kanye West, it makes him look goofy to be in the same headline as a ditzy celebrity.
In the case of James Crowley, it made Obama look petty to be attacking an ordinary Joe who didn't have a giant White House media apparatus backing him up.
Does anyone remember when it became known that Obama's mother-n-law was going to live with them at the White House? Conservatives were OUTRAGED. "This has never been done before!" they cried. Except that it has, often.
Then there was the time Bill Clinton made some remarks, as ex-president, that were critical of W, who was sitting president at the time. Again, conservatives were OUTRAGED!! "Never before has an ex=president criticized a sitting president! It's just not done!!" Except that it has been done. Often.
Now we have a president who called an entertainer a jackass, off the record. This is of course proof. . . as if Althousiana needs more proof . . . that Obama is unfit for the presidency, because THIS HAS NEVER BEEN DONE BEFORE!!
Except that it has.
But wait. . . no, when Truman did it it was. . . different somehow.
Jesus. you peopel are screaming yellow bonkers!!
Except now I see that this is all in jest!!
Silly me.
Peter:
Nah ABC needs to apologize again by tweeting the original tweet but this time do it backwards.
wv = oring [is Bill Clinton around?}
Phos -- Is anyone else here screaming except you?
If you didn't think this was some kind of a big deal, you wouldn't be here. You'd be off on your merry way.
I'd argue, in fact, that you are the only person in this thread who thinks this episode is a big deal. We're all cracking jokes, making observations. You are pissing down your own leg in capital letters.
Think about the psychology of the situation.
Valerie Plame was a rapper? Was that her cover?
MC Yellow Cake.
Plame's rapper name was Vanilla Niiiiice!
Kanye is a jackass - and an asshole - but I knew that when he saud "George Bush doesn't care about black people."
Where was Obama then? Where were any of the critics?
Standing with Kanye, the jackass, being a bunch of jackasses - and looking forward to the presidency based on their jackassery. A "movement" of creeps.
I swear, I can spot these assholes a mile away. What's wrong with the rest of y'all? You let them get away with murder.
I hear ya machos, but there is something about the way Althouse throws out her huffy "what business is it of the President's?" -- purely to get Obama supporter's goats, I'll bet-- that makes us want to come in here and try to throw up some wall against the idiocy that is sure to come pouring forth. It's like death by a thousand cuts, the idiot things that Obama haters throw into the ring on a daily basis.
Is this comment-- and "off the record" DEFINITELY still means something between a journalist and a formal interview subject-- really the basis for any kind of judgement about the President's character?
But I get it-- this was done to Bush for so long that his supporters (broadly speaking) built up a ton of frustration, which it must now be extremely salubrious to vent out.
It's depressing, though, as if it's a noxious spiral that will never end. I think historians will write about this period's "crisis in executive branch legitimacy" or something, with partisans increasingly eroding the whole edifice of the executive branch. I guess it started with Nixon, but maybe it goes all the way back to John Adams.
Hmm. Maybe there's nothing odd about this at all. Carry on.
Laughter is the best medicine. MC Yellow Cake!
@Harsh, or that Kayne West making a ass out of himself at an entertainment awards show is news.
Jesus, Montaigne. What a great post. My respect for you has bounded up. I will remember this one moment we were able to share, at least for awhile.
Come on MM:
What formal interview? If there was one, what else did Terry Moran report from the formal interview?
Be real- Obama and the reporter were probably grabbing a smoke and Obama got chatty.
The American public will like Obama more for saying this about Kanye.
Montagne Montaigne, you hear Althouse in a different voice than I do. Huffy? Hmmm. How about quizzical, by way of initiating a conversation?
Incidentally, you have an interesting name. Is that after the French fellow who established the essay as a literary form?
If he felt the need to comment, he should have said that West acted like a jackass. But he really should refrain from commenting in public on a citizen.
I believe it was Sista Souljah.
We thought it was Anne Baxter moving to the White House, not Michelle's mother.
It is funny how the leftists see Althouse as all smarmy, while the conservatives and libertarians see her as a witty observer.
I think it's the off-the-reservation syndrome.
@MM I think you just proved Macho's point.
Is there anyone in the world who wants to go on the record and say that Kanye West is not a jackass?....I think Kanye intuitively recognized the threat that Taylor Swift represents to MTV values. Life is hard, and the best way to negotiate the despair is with substance abuse and as many inappropriate sex partners as possible. There are so many stars, including Kanye, who have pursued these simple joys and have thus enriched not only their own lives but the lives of all who surround them. Taylor Swift is subversive of that ethos. Perhaps I'm stereotyping here, but my guess is that she doesn't even have belly button bling, much less tats. Ugh. Would you want your son to snort coke off the unjewelled belly of a home-schooled Christian? I think that if Kanye had based his disapproval not on her talent but on her politics he would have won over the crowd. Taylor Swift is Bush in drag, but sadly Kanye did not make that point. Maybe next time.
Life is hard, and the best way to negotiate the despair is with substance abuse and as many inappropriate sex partners as possible.
Words to live by.
Also, I have no idea who Taylor Swift is. I'm going to google her right now (and by google I mean see if there are any nude photos out there).
Also, I will forever love Kanye West because he had one of about five decent songs that were played on the radio when I lived in Europe.
Would you want your son to snort coke off the unjewelled belly of a home-schooled Christian?
Thank you. I needed that laugh.
lyrshe - Harpist with a drinking problem.
What business is it of yours, Althouse, when the president says something off-the-record? You pretend he made some kind of official proclamation. No. He was quoted from an off-the -record remark that may or may not be true.
But even presidents who you hate -- read, Obama -- get to have private conversations, you jackass.
"It's depressing, though, as if it's a noxious spiral that will never end... I guess it started with Nixon.."
It did. It started when Chicago Democrats stole an election from Nixon. That led to Nixon's paranoia which led to Obama feeling that he needed to insult a pop star.
See what I mean? Joseph N. Welch is another example.
Could the outrage be any more trite and manufactured? Is there such a thing as goofy outrage?
It's just embarrassing.
Hey Welch, try taking a bit off the top. The earnestness isn't doing you any favors.
Oh, and if you really want to score points, try to include the phrase, "you, a law professor" somewhere in your posts.
What business is it of yours, Joseph, when Althouse says something about what the president says off-the-record?
Hmmmmmm?
Althouse, a law professor!, should know that off-the-record is de facto hearsay. Therefore, it's not allowed as evidence in a trial. Therefore, she, a law professor!, cannot blog about it.
Got my vote for 2012.
Thank you, Meade, for establishing the causal chain Nixon-Obama.
I accept part of the blame because many of my dead relatives in Chicago cemeteries, including 3 great-grandparents, likely ended up voting for JFK that year.
Hey, Cedarford, look on the bright side. At least your dead relatives didn't vote for some Jew.
If blog posts and comments get you down, try reading them with a smile on your face. It really takes the edge off.
Seriously, Obama is spreading himself too thin.
What is his compulsion to have to comment on everything that catches his attention that is entirely beyond the scope of his Presidential duties?? Why the endless "major speeches"?
Is there preening narcissism involved?
A need never to shut up, lest he lose a shred of the adoration some hold of Black Messiah preaching to his loyal masses?
Is there such a thing as "overexposure" in the thought processes of a community organizer who never really did anything in his life but package himself to others???
(Note, in all this, there is barely a whisper of regret about not picking McCain. That is telling, on just how bad a choice we had in 2008.)
I think it's important that it was off the record. Obviously, he shouldn't reveal nuclear launch codes off the record and express shock that they get out. But a President should feel more constrained to behave with dignity when he's in public, and he should feel less constrained to avoid calling a jackass a jackass when it's before a private audience.
Similarly, there was nothing wrong with Kanye West taking a public position against giving Taylor Swift whatever award she won, but it was gobsmackingly jackassish of him to get on stage in the middle of an awards show to spout off his own opinions.
Context matters.
"Seven Machos said...
Hey, Cedarford, look on the bright side. At least your dead relatives didn't vote for some Jew."
Whereas your dead relatives in Miami, NYC cemeteries probably did, if that makes you feel better...
Yeah, I think I've posted my last "Dammit Althouse you fool!" kind of post. I think I am being goaded into that kind of reaction, which, let's face it, is the kind of blowing off of steam that some of us need. I rue the day they closed the comments on Commentary magazine's site.
I'll also admit I developed some bad habits during the year + of partisan warfare leading up to 08. You see, I was an Obama early adopter-- it was at the 04 convention, definitely, that I wanted the guy to be Prez.
I have a lot invested in Obama... money, time. And so far I have not been let down. I try to be realistic about the edifice of the Presidency and what it can do, and I still feel gratitude and relief EVERY DAY that Obama is the president.
And I have come to regret the waste that hatred of Bush seems to represent-- like psychic waste. Even Cheney strikes me as someone who wholly believed what he was doing was for the common good. Even though I think he was almost completely wrong. This is not big of me or anything like that, I'm just saying this whole experience of being behind your guy 100% and then getting mad about what people say about him... it's a waste of time.
So it's sad-- or it seems like a shame, that we have to go through it again, with the partisans and the parties reversed, because "they" did it last time and now "we" should do it... which has been Instapundit's incessant mantra for months.
Then again, maybe there really is no other way in a two party system with a sports, status and competition obsessed population.
Cedarford -- I'm from the Bootheel of Missouri. My dead relatives are hillbillies.
What I think is funny about this story is that ABC tried to retract a Tweet by one of its reporters.
Also, that a president of the United States thinks he can say something "off the record" and it won't be reported. Moran was just observing an interview Obama was giving to CSPAN. He wasn't bound by any rules or agreements pertaining to whether he could quote what Obama said. But ABC caved anyway. Not something they would do for all politicians, I'm fairly certain.
But Obama calling Kanye West a jackass isn't really "insulting" a pop star. You'd have to be deaf and blind not to know West is a jackass. I doubt there was a single person in America, not even his biggest fans, who thought it was okay for him to grab the microphone away from a teenager who'd just won an award to say someone else should have won. Even West knows he's a jackass. But it keeps him in the news and you know how that goes.
Could the previous comment be stricken and the poster banned?
Is that you moby?
Just saw the post above mine. Althouse is probably asleep, but if you have her phone number, wake her up and tell her to delete it.
Okay, first, get Metlife out of here. At least Cedarford is subtle and occasionally witty.
Second, Montaigne, there's a flip side to what you said, however eloquently and kindly: on the left, there was this idea that Obama was going to come in (from out of nowhere, with no experience) and resolve what are intractable problems like some messiah. It's not going to happen, because of the intractability. And also because Obama simply is not governing in the way he said he would. The issue is going to form the subtext of the 2010 election. The press and the left will call it racism. This will make things worse, particularly in rural areas, exurbs, and the south.
Also, I read someone list all the things that Obama wanted to do early on in his presidency. That person then pointed out that if Obama could do any one of those things, his presidency would be a smashing success. And that's true.
I think John Stodder might be talking to you, Meade.
If Althouse has gone to bed, I doubt Meade is still up fooling around on the internet. They're newlyweds!
Are you jumping ship on Prez Obama too?
No, but: If Obama drops a turd, I'm not going to pretend it's a gold nugget.
So it's sad-- or it seems like a shame, that we have to go through it again, with the partisans and the parties reversed, because "they" did it last time and now "we" should do it... which has been Instapundit's incessant mantra for months.
Let's face it, the harsh words aimed at Bush and now at Obama aren't nearly as abnormal as their supporters might believe. We just have more access to the haters' inner demons. We all know there are people with malignant minds like Metlife's. We just didn't tend to bump into them so often.
It did Bush no good at all for his supporters to cry about the lack of civility, etc. and it will do Obama no good to do so either. The strategy of making Joe Wilson the issue was a big fail (though the Dems don't seem to know it yet.)
Don't they sleep in separate beds, just so one of them can stay up late on the internet?
I'm guessing that nolife is a plant. A true Southerner always capitalizes the S.
Metlife,
Wrong, wrong, wrong!
You're not welcome here.
Your opinion is not welcome here.
Your vile words are not welcome here.
Traditionalguy:
To Washington Post:
Mr Hume:
I've just read your lousy review of Margaret's concert. I've come to the conclusion that you are an "eight ulcer man on four ulcer pay."
It seems to me that you are a frustrated old man who wishes he could have been successful. When you write such poppy-cock as was in the back section of the paper you work for it shows conclusively that you're off the beam and at least four of your ulcers are at work.
Some day I hope to meet you. When that happens you'll need a new nose, a lot of beefsteak for black eyes, and perhaps a supporter below!
Pegler, a gutter snipe, is a gentleman alongside you. I hope you'll accept that statement as a worse insult than a reflection on your ancestry.
H.S.T.
*bows quaintly*
*elaborately salaams Google fu*
Peter makes a good point. Plus, a southern patriot would not use the pronoun our in front of southern patriot. That's a subtle but important step removed from self.
And wouldn't a full-blown racist southerner consider that "southern" is an unnecessary modifier for "patriot"?
Plus he knew how to spell "Hussein."
Good ole boys spell it "Hoo-sane."
Speak of laying a turd and someone does. Probably an agent provocateur, because he created a fresh identity for the occasion.
Ugh. The Mobys are getting disgusting in here.
Cedarford said...
Seriously, Obama is spreading himself too thin.
What is his compulsion to have to comment on everything that catches his attention that is entirely beyond the scope of his Presidential duties?? Why the endless "major speeches"?
Is there preening narcissism involved?
A need never to shut up, lest he lose a shred of the adoration some hold of Black Messiah preaching to his loyal masses?
Is there such a thing as "overexposure" in the thought processes of a community organizer who never really did anything in his life but package himself to others???
(Note, in all this, there is barely a whisper of regret about not picking McCain. That is telling, on just how bad a choice we had in 2008.)
======================
I stand corrected Seven Machos, if you are from Missouri, Democrats use your dead relatives to swing elections to living McCaskills, St Louis blacks, or Jewish attorneys running as judges and prosecutors. But rarely. As the Missouri model is poor inner-city black Democrats
who vote early and often.
It just seems that the Chicago dead are more energetic and motivated to vote than elsewhere. That appears to indicate that if there is ever a Zombie attack...look to Chicago 1st.
All racist ass clowns and pretend-racist-agent-provocateur ass clowns should take note of Cedarford's work. This is how it's done.
Seven Machos, you made laugh out loud and wake my wife.
Plus, it's OK to criticize the President. He isn't God or anything like that.
Metlife, however, is crazy, and I want nothing to with that talk.
And Phosporus, please continue in your usual vein. You are making converts right and left (well, mostly left).
WV: codar, the strong sense that helps me identify the codependent.
In 1960, in Illinois, downstate Republicans were stealing votes just as hard as any Cook County Democrat.
OK, other than maybe a point about Obama's naivete (and there are so many, why waste one here?), Obama didn't insult Kanye. He just made an observation.
Kanye is, in fact, a jackass. This is hardly controversial.
I want to see Sean Hannity start bloviating in Kanye's defense.
Kanye is, in fact, a jackass. This is hardly controversial.
Can't say I know much about Kanye, but have to say his apology on Jay Leno seemed very sincere.
vw: shallin = just shallin.
What about Lady Gaga?
Conservatives like Althouse and her fans gripe about Obama no matter what he does.
Her hero Rush Limbaugh, for instance, called Obama weak during the pirate ordeal and then afterward called him a killer of teenagers.
No pleasing these Obamaphobes.
Althouse, I submit, is worse than Limbaugh in one key area though: she claims she voted for Obama to give her criticism more weight of objectivity than people like Limbaugh. Disgusting.
I don't know this for a fact, of course, but the rampant dishonesty she displays makes it seem far more likely than not.
I say this as a visitor from bloggingheads, btw, a far more interesting site than this ridiculous echo chamber.
If anyone's qualified to talk about pop stars, it's Obama. After all, he's our first pop star president, isn't he?
In 1960, in Illinois, downstate Republicans were stealing votes just as hard as any Cook County Democrat.
I'm sorry, but Cook County Democrats are the gold standard by which other vote-stealing politicians are measured.
This incident has ruined his presidency? Are you peopel for real?
Yeah, that IS a ridiculous claim. For starters, it implies that Obama hadn't already ruined his Presidency prior to making the West remark. :)
I would like to say, to the "Obama was wrong" crowd -- have you actually seen the video of what West did? Seriously, that was one of the most asshole moves in the history of awards ceremonies. George Washington would have called West a jackass for that stunt.
Yes, Obama sucks, but "Kanye West is a jackass" is the right time for his stopped clock this time around.
tone junkie, you come off as tone deaf.
This is not a serious thread. Anyone treating it as serious loses.
Along with the nolife troll.
tone_junkie spat:
"Conservatives like Althouse and her fans gripe about Obama no matter what he does."
You're not exactly delivering breaking news here, buddy boy. People in the party out of power have been (as the kids say) "talking mad shit" about sitting presidents for over two centuries. That's what the opposition does: oppose. I'm pretty sure that the majority of people here are aware of that.
I want to see Sean Hannity start bloviating in Kanye's defense.
Peter Hoh wins the thread!
And tone junkie doesn't understand the uses of hyperbole.
peter hoh,
"This is not a serious thread. Anyone treating it as serious loses."
Yes, that's a common excuse conservatives give when trapped in their asinine behavior -- "Hey, we're just kidding around! Lighten up!"
Fans of Ann Coulter have exemplified this behavior in trying to defend her most outrageous, least defensible remarks -- claimed it's her sense of humor and liberals just don't get it.
No, we get it. We see right through your BS.
Althouse and Coulter have smarts, I'll give them that. But humor? Uh, no.
So, nice try, but you fail.
peter hoh's a conservative?
Peter Hoh -- I welcome you into our elite conservative club.
Also, clearly, this fellow who has dropped in definitely has humor. Unlike Peter and Althouse. I mean, dude, you are a laugh riot. Ever think about quitting your day job and taking this zany show of yours on the road?
Tone Junkie, if you poke around, you might why Blake is incredulous that you called me a conservative.
Blake, catch me in a room full of liberals, and yeah, I get called conservative. Go figure.
Of course, my first vote for a senator went to Millicent Fenwick, so maybe I really am a conservative.
peter--
Same here. I mean, what label gets applied seems to have to do with who I'm talking to
Of course, my first vote for a senator went to Millicent Fenwick, so maybe I really am a conservative.
Well, ya gotta vote for the hotties.
tone_junkie indignantly explained:
"No, we get it. We see right through your BS."
I don't like the sound of them apples, Will. What're we gonna do?
Seven Nutjobs is officially the most bizarre person to comment in this fishbowl.
Nutjobs - if you think it's a nonevent, then comment like it's a nonevent. Don't bring comparisons to events like this into the picture. Being inconsistent like that makes you look like you're revealing a concealed diagnosis of schizophrenia.
"Bush didn't actually say "major league asshole" because it was off the record. Or something."
Well, except that he said it straight into an open mike, in front of a decent-sized crowd of people, with videotape rolling.
And Cheney offered his characteristically sneering follow-up: "Big Time". Thereby giving evidence of corroboration for what Shrub said.
Kind of a bit more out in the open and less gossipy than an off-the-record comment by Obama that was leaked.
Is the mask suffocating you?
Montana had to re-post because the first post wasn't boring and predictable enough.
It's important to get your insults just right and to excise from your attempt at prose anything that might be construed as an original thought, or even a thought that others might like to know about.
"I was amused by Wilson calling Obama a liar, and I'm amused by Obama calling West a jackass."
There are 16.7 million unemployed people in the country. Please tell me that the President of the United States doesn't have time to sit around watching the fucking MTV Music Video Awards.
There are 35 million people relying on food stamps just to keep from starving to death in the country. Please tell me that the President of the United States is too busy solving this problem to start an East Coast/West Coast war of name-calling with fucking rap music stars.
Nine of the nation's top 10 banks are insolvent and "too big to fail." Please tell me that Barack Obama is so busy busting up these massive trusts that he doesn't have time to come to the rescue of damsel-in-distress Taylor Swift.
Isn't Barack Obama married? Brother should be tending his own garden and working to solve the nation's problems. Young white chicks being bullied can wait.
The message I have for Barack Obama is to quit watching fucking television and get the fuck to work on the $1.6 trillion dollar federal government deficit.
We do not need Leeza Gibbons in the White House telling us which rap homey should be getting props and which rap homey should not be getting props.
We need a fucking President.
There's nothing that isn't Barack Obama's business.
Can't say I know much about Kanye, but have to say his apology on Jay Leno seemed very sincere.
Just saw the video with his apology.
Agree he seemed sincere particularly with his comment of his need to examine his life and "how I'm going to make it through the rest of this life,... ."
Best wishes to him on a difficult journey.
The unexamined life is not worth living.
Socrates (Apology)
Actually, Metlife, with his registration eamil and ip address, should be reported to the secret service. Threatening the president is a serious crime, as it should be.
I also wonder if Metlife is actually a lefty troll pulling an Alinsky.
"Obama called Kanye West a "jackass." Which he is, but what business is it of the President's?"
It's another example how he doesn't respect boundaries.
He commented on a minor news item regarding a break-in at Harvard that devolved into race accusations. He pushes health care legislation that interferes with individual choice. He takes over a private car company and tells them who can be at the helm.
Toddlers and sociopaths have no boundaries.
It really is no big deal. Kanye is a jackass. The President just made an observation.
Insulting pop stars? Not exactly.
...and I would think he'd have an opinion on Kanye West because his daughters are likely fans of Taylor Swift. I wonder if they were watching the VMAs.
MM, maybe they were watching after ABDC (although I hope he didn’t let the kids see the monologue because what I saw was not really age appropriate). I like to think that it came out of the knowledge Taylor is still a pretty young girl, maybe it came from a father place, which would make me like him better. I’m a sucker for the father/daughter thing.
Millicent Fenwick
That is the most awesome politician name ever!
Florida, I disagree. Since I don't tend ot like Obama's solutions to things, I'd rather he sit around talking about the dumb things Kayne says.
I guess it just goes to show that even a stopped clock is right twice a day. That must of been one of Obama's times yesterday. I wonder what the other one was?
BO gave another MAJOR address yesterday on Wall Street.
His comment on West made a bigger impression.
Already feels like year seven of BO's administration.
It was an off the record omment: they shouldn't have reported it. Obama *is* allowed to be a human being at times.
And he happens to be right.
IT is a black thing, girlfriend.
Us white folks could never understand.
Pogo, you make it sound like the government took over a thriving business. GM was bankrupt. You would have preferred a bailout that left the senior management in place? Or perhaps you would have preferred that the company be allowed to collapse.
Remember, Forbes wasn't running against Obama. Another big government interventionalist was the other choice. I suspect that McCain would have done something similar, but you wouldn't be using it as evidence of pathology on the part of the president.
"Should the President be insulting pop stars?"
Should the President be insulting policemen?
Should the President be insulting people who go to church and own guns?
Eventually, I'll bet he insults us all. That's all he's got.
I would have preferred that the company be allowed to collapse. Now it's just another pig at the teat of government money.
"Too big to fail."
Ford managed to not get to this point.
My, my, my. Such big, brave words.
The equivalent of "I can't refute you with facts, so I refute you with emotion."
God, what a festering stinkhole of a web site this is. I don't know how you wingnut loons can stand stewing in your own shit like this, presided over by the shit mistress, Ann Althouse.
Of course she's too dishonest to tell you dumb motherfuckers that Obama's remark was made off the record, thus rendering her posed questions ("should the president be insulting pop stars?" and "what business is it of the presidents?") inoperative. And of course you stupid shit-for-brains don't follow the link to find out for yourselves. Maybe the ever-dull Althouse didn't bother reading enough of the story to find out that the comment was off the record, or maybe she's just dishonest.
You're stewing in a cesspool. And you like it!
" Or perhaps you would have preferred that the company be allowed to collapse. "
Yup. Creative destruction.
Now it's just the walking dead, a zombie propped up by taxes, but with no possibility of success, because this arrangement has never worked anywhere. It always fails.
I will give obama credit for calling this west dude what he is--however, obama seems to have no idea what his role as president is--but 50 some off percent voted for this turkey, so we are stuck with him for the next three plus years.
This is what happens when you send a boy to do a man's job. (and for the sensitive liberals out there pissing in your pants right now, boy is a reference to age and lack of experience, so don't lay the racist shit on me--take your racist shit and shove it up your ass)
Well, thanks for posting that twice. We certainly got the message and will shape up right away!
Pogo, that's my preference, too, but we're not living in a country that will allow that kind of creative destruction. We are all about propping up.
Hey, you got tickets to Target Field next year?
Insulter in Chief.
WV: phydecat
Pertaining to cats, or a new kind of cat litter.
Jack jumped over the crazystick.
I was listening to the radio this morning and some ridiculously large number of people, across all demographics, think Kenye was a schmuck, or jackass, or something like that. Obama calls him a Jackass and I think most republicans smiled and nodded in agreement.
Point is, for the most part, Kenye is bringing people together. To call him a jackass.
Of course one divisive exception is...
Phos
> This incident is equivalent in political ramification to the Valerie Plame affair?
You know, life would be so much simpler if liberals could grasp a simple concept. You can mention a thing, even compare one thing to another, without saying that they are exactly the same in every respect. I think that other poster cited Plame for nothing more than the notion that there is no such thing as off the record.
> Ahh. . . so your contention is that Plame was not outed.
As a matter of law, if you drive into Langley 5 days a week, your identity and employment by the CIA is not a national secret. Get a clue.
> Does anyone remember when it became known that Obama's mother-n-law was going to live with them at the White House? Conservatives were OUTRAGED. "This has never been done before!" they cried.
Really? I am pretty plugged in but I never heard of this controversy. I think I remember a few jokes about what kind of hell his mother in law might put him through and maybe it would lead him to nuke a small country, but that’s all I heard: jokes.
> "Never before has an ex=president criticized a sitting president! It's just not done!!" Except that it has been done. Often.
Um, really, who? And democrats don’t count for this exercise.
> Now we have a president who called an entertainer a jackass, off the record. This is of course proof. . . as if Althousiana needs more proof . . . that Obama is unfit for the presidency, because THIS HAS NEVER BEEN DONE BEFORE!!
Quote where she said it was unprecedented. Or for that matter that it proved he was unfit. Sheesh. All she said was that he should be above this sort of thing. And there is something to be said for that. I mean John Roberts’ infamous memo telling the reagan white house that it should be above consorting with Michael Jackson seemed pretty spot on. I think there is nothing wrong with Obama commenting and even saying he was a jackass if asked. But I have to wonder, why does the reporter think his opinion on the subject means a damn anyway? Why do we think the President should even care what happened at the WMAs, period. I mean seriously, if Obama said, “Kenye West? Iran is trying to get a nuke and isreal might try to stop them leading to a pan-mideast war. Russia is sliding back to soviet mode. I am trying to manage a stimulus, push through health care reform, energy reform, and about five other initiatives, plus running one of the most massive bureacracies in the world. I could give a rat’s ass about Kenye West” I would feel about 1,000% respect for him. Not that I blame him for not saying that. Shallow people think that the president should be aware of pop culture for some reason or another, but Anne isn’t wrong to question whether this is such a wise thing.
And next time, before you spin yourself into another hissy fit, remember this. Ann voted for Obama. So maybe not all of her criticisms are meant to be understood to be defcon 1 “he is unfit” but just “shouldn’t he do this/not do this?”
Pogo, that's my preference, too, but we're not living in a country that will allow that kind of creative destruction. We are all about propping up.
Nonsense, that kind of creative destruction occurs every day in this country. Just ask anyone who used to work at Circuit City.
The government took over GM to save the UAW's bacon, plain and simple. If you're not working at a unionized company, don't expect Obama to come in and prop up your job.
John Stodder said...
Just saw the post above mine. Althouse is probably asleep, but if you have her phone number, wake her up and tell her to delete it.
She's busy right now but I told her about it and she will take care of it soon.
Jack, we need MORE off-the-record Obama. This is where we learn how he really feels.
"You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them,... And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
If this was an off-the-cuff remark made in response to a question, I've got no problem with this, much as I didn't have a problem with President Bush's off-hand remark about Joe Klein. How does he know about it? The man's got kids, that's how.
I think a bigger question is why the reporter thought this was an appropriate question to ask the President? They would have never asked President Bush something like this. Every time a black man makes news anymore, they go to Obama to find out what he thinks about it. There seems to be some subliminal racism inherent in this inclination.
Does anyone remember when it became known that Obama's mother-n-law was going to live with them at the White House?
Michelle's Mom lives in the White House? I guess that makes some sense. Somebody has to be around to be with the children.
Even though the Obama remark was 'off the record', it shows that he has a complete lack of consideration of the importance of the position of President of the United States.
He consistantly shown himself to be a petty man. Picking fights with television personalities. Insulting common citizens, some by name and others by implication. Whining that people/Palin is saying mean things about his glorious plans for remaking America.
He is a small petty tyrant. If he wasn't in such a position of power he would be a joke. As the situation is now, however, it isn't funny at all.
If you're not working at a unionized company, don't expect Obama to come in and prop up your job..
Unless you're a Wall Street investment bank. Then you get tens of billions to stay afloat after making the worst bets imaginable, with time still left to hand out those quarterly bonuses. That you and I paid for. You'd think in the million moron march you would see some of that anger and frustration. But no, their anger and frustration is directed at people who are pointing out the people who are robbing and stealing from them! It's a really phenomenon in this country. People out protesting in masses defending the right to get fucked in the ass.
Sal
I don't know. i bet they asked bush how he felt about "boobgate" (janet jackson at the super bowl).
in fact if memory serves, his response was "god bless tivo." (i am making that part up.)
Aaron
By gosh, garage is starting to sound like a tea party type...
STOP THE SPENDING!
garage - Can your phony outrage. Crap like the Wall Street bailouts is exactly what you get when politicians get to pick winners and losers in the private sector.
Healthcare will work exactly the same way, advantaging insiders at the general public's expense. But somehow you still think "The politicians will get it right this time".
No, they won't.
By gosh, garage is starting to sound like a tea party type...
STOP THE SPENDING!
Heh. Actually, I think the tea parties are as much a response to the Wall Street spending, as the GM spending and the stimulus spending, and cap and trade and healthcare reform...it’s a cumulative effect. Wall Street came first and it’s already done. People are concentrating on the things they hope they can still stop.
It’s like in your personal finance, you can’t have everything you want at the same time. You have to pick and choose. Well, to me, Obama chose the stimulus and now we’re broke and there isn’t any money to do healthcare.
Is there an incivility flu going around?
Federer, Kanye, Serena, Joe Wilson, biting protesters, and .. I’m leaving somebody out.. oh yea president Obama.
IMHO Its Obama that has set the tone.
What did Serena do? I totally missed that one.
Obama's not wrong here on the facts, but if there's a problem, it's with the president's apparent comfort level with the White House reporters that he felt he could talk to them the way he probably talks off-the-cuff to Axelrod or Rahm and not have it get out in a world of 4G cellphones, Twitter and the 24/7/365 news cycle.
Obama may want to be Jack Kennedy sitting around the Oval Office BSing with Ben Bradlee under the secure knowledge that nothing he says is going to come out, but no matter how much most of the White House reporters may support him, it isn't 1961 anymore.
I don't believe you folks! Kanye West's clearly inappropriate actions illustrate as never before the impending crisis that is the music awards industry in this country. It is past time for Federal intervention. I call for the immediate nationalization of ALL awards ceremonies. Nip this in the bud.
WV: ploment. This is the moment we have been waiting for. Time to, what, plow?
Healthcare will work exactly the same way, advantaging insiders at the general public's expense,
Healthcare reform legislation opts out on federal employees or members of congress.
They have their own plans.
vw-hetthshi - pig Latin for shit.
He wasn't –– it was an off the record remark. That means it was just a conversation between him and the reporter.
Aaron: I mean seriously, if Obama said, “Kenye West? Iran is trying to get a nuke and isreal might try to stop them leading to a pan-mideast war.....
That's probably the point.
Perhaps Obama just isn't that into this other stuff.
Maybe it's turning out it isn't as easy as he thought it would be?
Everyone was supposed to fall at his feet.
But then, c'mon. If he said "You know I really have a lot on my plate these days...." some of us would be grumbling about how the job was too big for him ;-)
Besides, the press mocked -- mocked -- GWB because he hadn't watched / didn't know what Sin and the City was.
That's why they didn't ask. Ya' think?
Shanna -
Serena completey lost it at the US Open when a judge called a foot fault on her. Swearing, threatened to ram the tennis ball down her throat yada yada yada....
Not a pleasnat sight.
She says she "lost control."
I did not call Kanye a jackass. I called him an asshole.
Thanks JAL. I don't pay much attention to tennis.
Football is a different story!
Firstly, ignoring the drama I missed anyway...
I think that people misunderstand what is unacceptable and why. People fuss a little, but so? People like to fuss. Giving them something to fuss about is a service.
I think I agree most of all with Revenant's first post in all respects.
That said, I somehow completely skipped all previous mention of Kanye West but only now, when Obama mentioned him by name (off the record of not) have I gone back to look at what he is getting called a jackass for. I had no idea whatsoever who he was not even to think that his name sounded familiar... it didn't.
So now I know.
If Obama shouldn't mention people by name this is why not. It's not a particularly *important* reason why not, but that's the reason.
West is a musical artist or something and not some sort of opponent of Obama's so it's not quite the same effect as when Obama calls out an opponent by name or *nudge* *nudge* *wink* *wink* "I won't name names but her initials are... Sarah... Palin" but in the end it can only highlight and promote who ever he talks about.
Seven Machos,
I see from your earlier comment you are from the Bootheel. What part? Though I live in the StL area now, I'm originally from Sikeston.
There is no distinction between on the record and off the record now.
Yes, there is. Off the record is still off the record. If people act as if it is on the record (as Althouse did with the heading to the link), that is not the president's responsibility.
The President did not want to waste a crisis.
Should Althouse be so goofy? Come on. It is rather refreshing to hear Presidents say things off the record.
BTW anyone hear about the things Bush said off the record about Obama, Hillary and Palin? Some former Aide has written a book.
Salamandyr and Seven: also have spent time in the bootheel working on New Madrid Seismic Zone issues. And yes, I know it's pronounced "Hay ti" and New MAD rid. Also have spent some time at Lambert's throwed rolls. Great area, great people.
There is no "off the record" because everything is... gasp... recorded.
This was not "off the record" because it was... gasp... recorded.
When a reporter gives a report and says, "A member of the White House staff agreed to speak off the record and said that Bo piddles on the antique furniture and ate the sofa that once held Margaret Thatcher's backside", the reporter doesn't say... "Benny Anderson, the President's chief dog handler, agreed to speak off the record... bla bla bla... Thatcher's ass... bla bla..."
The way things are today, a whole lot of previously "off the record" youthful indiscretions are being recorded on My Space.
This isn't just something that affects the President.
Hmmm.... Off the record???
And what if Obama had called Kanye West "a major league asshole"?
But I get it-- this was done to Bush for so long that his supporters (broadly speaking) built up a ton of frustration, which it must now be extremely salubrious to vent out.
It's depressing, though, as if it's a noxious spiral that will never end. I think historians will write about this period's "crisis in executive branch legitimacy" or something, with partisans increasingly eroding the whole edifice of the executive branch. I guess it started with Nixon, but maybe it goes all the way back to John Adams.
Why Are We Fighting
Salamandyr and Seven: also have spent time in the bootheel working on New Madrid Seismic Zone issues. And yes, I know it's pronounced "Hay ti" and New MAD rid. Also have spent some time at Lambert's throwed rolls. Great area, great people.
Ironically, I grew up in the town and very rarely ate at Lambert's. I always said, it's good country cooking, but that's what I eat at home. And if I make Mom mad, she'll throw the biscuits!
I liked the Nixon Tapes that were "off the record". Candid shots do more to inform us than the posed ones by the poseurs.
Clearly, this isn't the Kayne West he thought he knew.
Also have spent some time at Lambert's throwed rolls.
My grandfather used to talk about that place all the time. Never been, though.
Sal -- I grew up in The Cape.
I love Lambert's. Took my wife there once. Her comment, based on a nice family in the booth behind her: "Do people really like that?"
As I had set up a Potemkin village for her pleasure.
I miss the barbecue and the hot summer nights and the rolling hills.
Word was it was off the record... so, officially, he didn't say it as the president.
Unofficially, he's right.... West was being a jackass.
I’m not an Obamabot either… Just don’t mind when people call jackasses… jackasses.
ann;
i had similar rash of trolls.
all verizon wireless and 90% from illinois.
check the ip address and see if your is the same.
Ms. Althouse:
Most of your criticisms of Obama have been spot-on, but in this case don't you think after Bill Clinton played the sax on Arsenio casual has been the new normal for politicians?
Laika, you forgot a few.
GHW Bush and pork rinds.
Reagan and flannel shirts.
Carter and sweaters.
Nixon on "Laugh In."
JAL
Agree 100%. Barrack should worry about other things, and so should our press. But right now we have it backwards, expecting the president to know about and have an opinion about everything, and mocking him if he doesn’t.
Still proud of this post after listening to the audio, Althouse?
http://www.tmz.com/2009/09/15/obama-calls-kanye-a-jackass/
Still shrill, Zach?
Still shrill, Seven?
Good, Zach. That was not shrill. More like that, please.
Yes, because you clearly understand the definition of the word. LOL.
Again, will Althouse link to the audio so that her beloved readers can listen to it? Doubtful.
http://www.tmz.com/2009/09/15/obama-calls-kanye-a-jackass/
Zach -- Do you think, in your wildest dreams, that you could create a website that is 0.5 percent as popular as Althouse's?
If so, why not post your link there, instead of shrilly demanding that she participate in your propaganda?
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