This comment isn't without merit - though it isn't really about gender. It's about vanity. But there isn't anyone asserting that it should be covered by insurance or the government.
that comment was, surprise, made. by a woman. Most of us can, through experience, deduce pretty much everything else about her. Men and women like her tend to talk in the approved way, using the 'right' words and phrases-mostly supplied by MSNBC or CNN. I do feel sorry for her. Interesting that comments made about her comment are mostly negative. Perhaps there is some daylight at the end of the NYT tunnel vision.
"What libs describe as "empathy" is actually narcissistic projection, the objects of their sollicitude only exist in their minds as toys, not actual people with their own thoughts and feelings. They are quite literally incapable of empathy, properly defined (being able to put yourself in others' shoes.)" - Pascal-Emmanuel Gobry
Yawn. Tell them to revisit this when men over 50 don't have to jump through ten thousand hoops for TRT unlike the way the medical profession has been handing out estrogen to 13 year olds like candy.
I haven't tried to follow the link, and won't, but is there any indication in the article that the people getting their limbs lengthened are all straight? Or disproportionately straight? Or did someone just make that part up? I'm pretty sure there are quite a few gays in America who wish they were taller than they are.
Probably if women didn't front and center height so publicly, men wouldn't worry about it so much. Yeah, the guys probably need therapy more than surgery; this is not so much male vanity as male despair.
I think it would make more sense if instead of saying “straight folks,“ it said cis people. These guys are undergoing drastic and painful surgery in order to conform to a stereotype of the gender they identify with which is the same gender they were assigned at birth. Whether you identify with your biological sex or not, you might want to undergo surgery that makes you look more like the gender you identify with.
Just going straight by the odds based on NYTs readership the comment in the NYTs is probably a woman that only sleeps with guys 6 feet and over on dating apps.
Gender refers to sex-correlated attributes (e.g. sexual orientation). Trans indicates a state or process of divergence (e g. homos, sims). Also, social. A drag. And humane. Will no one abort this 'burden' is a Planned rite
Cis and straight are liberal judgments and labels applied by persons in the trans spectrum and political congruent activists to rationalize their Pro-Choice religious choices under the Diversity umbrella.
Height is weakly correlated with sex, but the female sex trends shorter and the male sex taller. There is a strong correlation between physiological structure and sex, to ensure reproductive rights are a viable choice for the female.
Leg lengthening is kind of nonsexual, but breast augmentation would fit this better. It affirms your true gender, the one evident in every cell of your body from fetus till long after death. "Affirm" confirms or augments what is already apparent. Which is the opposite of how it's used in the trans universe where "gender affirming care" actually tries to change the sex that was, is, and will always be. The use is meant to deceive, which is standard for the progressive revised lexicon. Honest wording would just call it "gender changing care", or "transition care", but being accurate or honest seems to be avoided at all costs in that world.
"Cis and straight are liberal judgments and labels..."
"Normal" would be most accurate, honest, and traditional. I thought progressives liked being different and specifically not normal.
normal /nôr′məl/ adjective 1) Conforming with, adhering to, or constituting a norm, standard, pattern, level, or type; typical. "normal room temperature; one's normal weight; normal diplomatic relations." 2) Functioning or occurring in a natural way.
I've long held that women get work done mostly to move upward within the feminine competitive sphere - not to please or attract men, not per se.
But men don't get work done to compete with other men - they do it to attract women. And this gruesome procedure takes commitments of time and rather significant pain. They bolt rods to your legs, externally, so you can wait for your bones to grow together. Ugh !
Unfortunately there is a lot of scientific backing for the theory that height is advantageous in both professional and personal life. They even calculated how much extra a year a man has to earn to compensate for each inch of height.
The commentator who mentioned breast augmentation hit it right on the head. It is people trying to make themselves more attractive to potential sexual partners, not people mutilating or removing the equipment they were born with. There's a reason "tall, dark and handsome" has the word "tall" in it.
What if a trans person wanted tallness surgery along with appendage addition surgery (whatever it is really called) at the same times. Would we then call this surgery for straights? Just because it is a straight who asks for it does not make it a straight -only surgery. (admitting now that I read nothing by the Prof's post)
I am 5 foot 7 inches. When men shake my hand they routinely look past me. In one office where I worked the tallest man in the group was chosen as the leader, but he didn't lead; he worked on his own projects and barely knew what his group was doing. Routinely our politicians openly insult short people. We have always elected the taller of the two presidential candidates. That is why I think Newsom has an excellent chance. He is very tall.
"The commentator who mentioned breast augmentation hit it right on the head. It is people trying to make themselves more attractive to potential sexual partners, not people mutilating or removing the equipment they were born with."
I think this stature-lengthening procedure and breast augmentation surgery are both mutilating the person's natural body. Breasts have a function and function is sacrificed just to get a look that either impresses other people or makes the person feel more confident and powerful. The same with height.
By the way, a 5'5" man who adds 3 inches all to his thighs is going to look out of proportion. I can't believe your legs will function properly with the thighs so out of proportion to the lower legs.
The stature-lengthening procedure requires that the man go without WALKING for 6 months. What kind of society respects a man who voluntarily disables himself for that long and spends lavishly on the process? How could you respect a man who did that? Is a woman supposed to find him attractive because he's 3 inches taller when she knows he spent his time and money like that? And what about those freakishly long thighs? This isn't attractive!
2. Indulging vanity that reveals more about the person and fashion than any medical need (e.g., Michael Jackson, the infamous Jocelyn "Catwoman" Wildenstein, and the Asian "Superman" guy).
This line of attack inadvertently makes "gender affirming care" sound like the worst and most vain forms of cosmetic surgery, for the changes can never be functional. A fake penis can't include functional testicles. Fake boobs don't produce milk. Etc. Longer legs, while likely misguided if not done to correct clubfoot or mismatched leg length, are at least functional.
'I'd like to be normal' reminds me of ‘The News from Lake Wobegon where all the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average.’
In the real world, "normal" isn't a single number, it is a range.
Just to correct a misunderstanding, breast augmentation doesn’t impact the natural functions of a woman’s breasts. Most women can still breastfeed and receive stimulation from them. It’s a surprisingly simple surgery, all things considered. Not in any way comparable to something like this (disabling for an extended time period) or surgery that impacts the use of sex organs.
The stature-lengthening procedure requires that the man go without WALKING for 6 months. What kind of society respects a man who voluntarily disables himself for that long and spends lavishly on the process? How could you respect a man who did that? Is a woman supposed to find him attractive because he's 3 inches taller when she knows he spent his time and money like that? And what about those freakishly long thighs? This isn't attractive!
It is sad to watch women act like this.
But it is really society as a whole. The scientific data is overwhelming and shows that men are judged first on height in almost every way. They get promotions first, they get bigger tips, women specifically filter on dating apps. The army is particularly discriminating with tall men ending up in leadership positions.
If a man spent 6 months working out so hard he couldn't walk most of the time everyone would laud him and nothing would really change for him.
But with this surgery if he is 6 feet tall women will actually notice him on dating apps.
As I recall, Augustine promises that quite a few of the saved will have an improved body in Heaven. First, everyone will have a body aged about 32--the age of Christ when he was crucified. So those for whom aging didn't go well will be back to something better. Next, those who didn't make it to age 32, including those killed in utero, will get a 32 year old body, and presumably some kind of consciousness to match, that they never had. And then: people with severe disabilities, including I think those who are grotesquely ugly, will have a more beautiful body than they ever had. One question: if ugly people are more or less brought up to average, does this still leave stunningly beautiful people, making the rest of us stare, croaking instead of speaking, with dry mouths, and so on? At any rate, it makes sense that Christianity promises a pretty good body in Heaven. You might say Catholics have the guts to get into these issues more than anyone else. Today's ambitious people, as is often the case, want at least some of these results RIGHT NOW. Modern science in general promises a life both more comfortable and longer, without waiting for Heaven.
"Well well well, if it isn’t gender-affirming care for straight folks."
Well, let's see: 1: Are insurance companies forced to pay for it for anyone who simply claims they "need" it? 2: Are those who oppose it attacked and told they are committing "genocide"?
No, and no? Then No.
Dear lefties: there's an important phrase and action you need to learn: 1: I was wrong 2: The STFU
Ann Althouse said... By the way, a 5'5" man who adds 3 inches all to his thighs is going to look out of proportion. I can't believe your legs will function properly with the thighs so out of proportion to the lower legs.
I have short legs. By which I mean when I sit down, I am "eyes to eye" with men who are 5" taller than I am when we're both standing. So getting this surgery would make me "more proportional", not less.
For women, "those legs go all the way up" == "my she has nice long legs" is a compliment, not a criticism. From what I understand it's less of a source of praise for men, so it may be more of an issue.
Judge and Cable (2004) — One of the most frequently cited studies (Journal of Applied Psychology): Each additional inch of height is associated with about $789 more per year in earnings (controlling for gender, age, weight, etc.).From 5'9" to 6'0" = 3 inches → ~$2,367 more per year.
He’s got legs, he knows how to use them He never begs, he knows how to choose them Titan-yum frames, wondering how to feel them Would you get behind them if you could only find them? He was so small, now he’s so tall Yeah, it's alright He’s got hair just like Gavin Newsom It’s a blow and set, try to undo ‘em Everytime he’s dancing he knows what to do Everybody wants to see if he can use it He’s so tall, but his wiener’s so small The boy just ain’t right CC, JSM
South Park, Season 9, Episode 1, titled "Mr. Garrison's Fancy New Vagina". 20 years ago. Mr. Garrison undergoes gender reassignment surgery to become Mrs. Garrison, and Kyle gets a "negroplasty" - lengthening his legs so he can be a better basketball player.
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71 comments:
This comment isn't without merit - though it isn't really about gender. It's about vanity.
But there isn't anyone asserting that it should be covered by insurance or the government.
who pays for this?
is it like gender-affirming care, that insurance companies MUST pay for?
or is it like regular plastic surgery; that the patient pays for?
Also; can 7 year olds be given it?
What an unkind and no-thought comment from the NYTimes commentariat.
And this kind of surgery is gross too.
"Well well well, if it isn’t gender-affirming care for straight folks."
Meh. Whoever said there wasn't mental illness amongst straight people?
What does this have to do with genital mutilation of minors?
No one ever said readers of the NYT were bright.
does the time strive for the stuoidest takes,
It's not as though it will prevent propagation of the species.
that comment was, surprise, made. by a woman. Most of us can, through experience, deduce pretty much everything else about her. Men and women like her tend to talk in the approved way, using the 'right' words and phrases-mostly supplied by MSNBC or CNN. I do feel sorry for her.
Interesting that comments made about her comment are mostly negative. Perhaps there is some daylight at the end of the NYT tunnel vision.
“Good surgeons know how to operate, better ones when to operate, and the best when not to operate.”
—Origin unknown
“Stay away from any surgeon who is not the best.”
—Me
And don't let a short doctor try to make you taller.
Give them more height through surgery. Or give them a talk show. Or make them a news reporter. CF: George Steph, Bill Maher, etc.
"What libs describe as "empathy" is actually narcissistic projection, the objects of their sollicitude only exist in their minds as toys, not actual people with their own thoughts and feelings. They are quite literally incapable of empathy, properly defined (being able to put yourself in others' shoes.)" - Pascal-Emmanuel Gobry
Measure once, cut twice. Wait, no. Cut once, measure thrice. Hmm. Let me try that again. Oh never mind.
Yawn. Tell them to revisit this when men over 50 don't have to jump through ten thousand hoops for TRT unlike the way the medical profession has been handing out estrogen to 13 year olds like candy.
This should be beneath even the Times, coming as it does in the wake of the transgender murders in Canada and at the high school hockey game.
"But its risks have made it controversial."
What risks? Does it make you want to go shoot a bunch of kids at a "gun free zone" school?
At some point, those words made sense to her
I haven't tried to follow the link, and won't, but is there any indication in the article that the people getting their limbs lengthened are all straight? Or disproportionately straight? Or did someone just make that part up? I'm pretty sure there are quite a few gays in America who wish they were taller than they are.
Probably if women didn't front and center height so publicly, men wouldn't worry about it so much. Yeah, the guys probably need therapy more than surgery; this is not so much male vanity as male despair.
There is no real comparison between someone wanting to be taller and turning children into eunuchs.
The benefits you gain from being taller are widely studied and measured.
Women are particularly ruthless when choosing men based on their height.
People can pretend there is no reason to have this surgery done but that is just stupid.
I think it would make more sense if instead of saying “straight folks,“ it said cis people. These guys are undergoing drastic and painful surgery in order to conform to a stereotype of the gender they identify with which is the same gender they were assigned at birth. Whether you identify with your biological sex or not, you might want to undergo surgery that makes you look more like the gender you identify with.
It still doesnt make any sense,
Just going straight by the odds based on NYTs readership the comment in the NYTs is probably a woman that only sleeps with guys 6 feet and over on dating apps.
Still stupid if she used “cis people.” (Probably more stupid.)
O Mike nails it.
Next.
Gender refers to sex-correlated attributes (e.g. sexual orientation). Trans indicates a state or process of divergence (e g. homos, sims). Also, social. A drag. And humane. Will no one abort this 'burden' is a Planned rite
Scalping would ensure Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion or death. At least it's not Capitol punishment processed with liberal license. Progress.
Cis and straight are liberal judgments and labels applied by persons in the trans spectrum and political congruent activists to rationalize their Pro-Choice religious choices under the Diversity umbrella.
Height is weakly correlated with sex, but the female sex trends shorter and the male sex taller. There is a strong correlation between physiological structure and sex, to ensure reproductive rights are a viable choice for the female.
Perfect example of the Leftist habit of pretending they don't know what the Right is actually saying.
Leg lengthening is kind of nonsexual, but breast augmentation would fit this better. It affirms your true gender, the one evident in every cell of your body from fetus till long after death. "Affirm" confirms or augments what is already apparent. Which is the opposite of how it's used in the trans universe where "gender affirming care" actually tries to change the sex that was, is, and will always be. The use is meant to deceive, which is standard for the progressive revised lexicon.
Honest wording would just call it "gender changing care", or "transition care", but being accurate or honest seems to be avoided at all costs in that world.
"Cis and straight are liberal judgments and labels..."
"Normal" would be most accurate, honest, and traditional. I thought progressives liked being different and specifically not normal.
normal /nôr′məl/
adjective
1) Conforming with, adhering to, or constituting a norm, standard, pattern, level, or type; typical.
"normal room temperature; one's normal weight; normal diplomatic relations."
2) Functioning or occurring in a natural way.
Doesn't pigeonhole very well, does it?
I've long held that women get work done mostly to move upward within the feminine competitive sphere - not to please or attract men, not per se.
But men don't get work done to compete with other men - they do it to attract women. And this gruesome procedure takes commitments of time and rather significant pain. They bolt rods to your legs, externally, so you can wait for your bones to grow together. Ugh !
Fake boobs are much, much easier.
Unfortunately there is a lot of scientific backing for the theory that height is advantageous in both professional and personal life. They even calculated how much extra a year a man has to earn to compensate for each inch of height.
Women just aren't worth having your legs broken for. Especially those who would be swayed by such a stunt.
The commentator who mentioned breast augmentation hit it right on the head. It is people trying to make themselves more attractive to potential sexual partners, not people mutilating or removing the equipment they were born with. There's a reason "tall, dark and handsome" has the word "tall" in it.
What if a trans person wanted tallness surgery along with appendage addition surgery (whatever it is really called) at the same times. Would we then call this surgery for straights? Just because it is a straight who asks for it does not make it a straight -only surgery. (admitting now that I read nothing by the Prof's post)
I am 5 foot 7 inches. When men shake my hand they routinely look past me. In one office where I worked the tallest man in the group was chosen as the leader, but he didn't lead; he worked on his own projects and barely knew what his group was doing. Routinely our politicians openly insult short people. We have always elected the taller of the two presidential candidates. That is why I think Newsom has an excellent chance. He is very tall.
"The commentator who mentioned breast augmentation hit it right on the head. It is people trying to make themselves more attractive to potential sexual partners, not people mutilating or removing the equipment they were born with."
I think this stature-lengthening procedure and breast augmentation surgery are both mutilating the person's natural body. Breasts have a function and function is sacrificed just to get a look that either impresses other people or makes the person feel more confident and powerful. The same with height.
By the way, a 5'5" man who adds 3 inches all to his thighs is going to look out of proportion. I can't believe your legs will function properly with the thighs so out of proportion to the lower legs.
The stature-lengthening procedure requires that the man go without WALKING for 6 months. What kind of society respects a man who voluntarily disables himself for that long and spends lavishly on the process? How could you respect a man who did that? Is a woman supposed to find him attractive because he's 3 inches taller when she knows he spent his time and money like that? And what about those freakishly long thighs? This isn't attractive!
Cosmetic surgery falls into two broad areas:
1. Correcting scars, birth defects (e.g., clubfoot; cleft palates), and addressing functional needs.
2. Indulging vanity that reveals more about the person and fashion than any medical need (e.g., Michael Jackson, the infamous Jocelyn "Catwoman" Wildenstein, and the Asian "Superman" guy).
This line of attack inadvertently makes "gender affirming care" sound like the worst and most vain forms of cosmetic surgery, for the changes can never be functional. A fake penis can't include functional testicles. Fake boobs don't produce milk. Etc. Longer legs, while likely misguided if not done to correct clubfoot or mismatched leg length, are at least functional.
https://people.com/where-is-jocelyn-wildenstein-now-8645335
'I'd like to be normal' reminds me of ‘The News from Lake Wobegon where all the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average.’
In the real world, "normal" isn't a single number, it is a range.
There is a frankenstein element but thats apart from the chimera stupidity
Weevil: “ I'm pretty sure there are quite a few gays in America who wish they were taller than they are.”
Yes, it sucks being the shortest bear in the leather bar.
Literally.
I am not Laslo. CC, JSM
Just to correct a misunderstanding, breast augmentation doesn’t impact the natural functions of a woman’s breasts. Most women can still breastfeed and receive stimulation from them. It’s a surprisingly simple surgery, all things considered. Not in any way comparable to something like this (disabling for an extended time period) or surgery that impacts the use of sex organs.
That's stretching a point. Bahaha. See what i did there?
What is a tall man?
People have way too much time on their hands. May I make a suggestion?
Ann Althouse said...
The stature-lengthening procedure requires that the man go without WALKING for 6 months. What kind of society respects a man who voluntarily disables himself for that long and spends lavishly on the process? How could you respect a man who did that? Is a woman supposed to find him attractive because he's 3 inches taller when she knows he spent his time and money like that? And what about those freakishly long thighs? This isn't attractive!
It is sad to watch women act like this.
But it is really society as a whole. The scientific data is overwhelming and shows that men are judged first on height in almost every way. They get promotions first, they get bigger tips, women specifically filter on dating apps. The army is particularly discriminating with tall men ending up in leadership positions.
If a man spent 6 months working out so hard he couldn't walk most of the time everyone would laud him and nothing would really change for him.
But with this surgery if he is 6 feet tall women will actually notice him on dating apps.
Women just don't believe the things they say.
AA @ 5:29
Indeed.
male vanity projects. run.
I bet we would see less of Mead out on the lake if he was 4'3".
I mean there would be literally less of him to see.
According to Achilles, white privilege is a myth but Tall privilege is real.
White privilege is something white leftists feed themselves - as an emotional fiction to soothe their own white guilt.
If a man spent 6 months working out so hard he couldn't walk most of the time everyone would laud him and nothing would really change for him.
Tell me about it, I've been doing it for 40 years. . . . .
I am, however, pretty ace at carrying heavy things up stairs.
I am often normal. But typically only when I am standing at attention. Normal to the floor.
But really, who cares what the floor thinks?
As I recall, Augustine promises that quite a few of the saved will have an improved body in Heaven. First, everyone will have a body aged about 32--the age of Christ when he was crucified. So those for whom aging didn't go well will be back to something better. Next, those who didn't make it to age 32, including those killed in utero, will get a 32 year old body, and presumably some kind of consciousness to match, that they never had. And then: people with severe disabilities, including I think those who are grotesquely ugly, will have a more beautiful body than they ever had. One question: if ugly people are more or less brought up to average, does this still leave stunningly beautiful people, making the rest of us stare, croaking instead of speaking, with dry mouths, and so on? At any rate, it makes sense that Christianity promises a pretty good body in Heaven. You might say Catholics have the guts to get into these issues more than anyone else. Today's ambitious people, as is often the case, want at least some of these results RIGHT NOW. Modern science in general promises a life both more comfortable and longer, without waiting for Heaven.
White leftists assume blacks are too stupid to have ID.
that is insulting and racist - straight up.
"Well well well, if it isn’t gender-affirming care for straight folks."
Well, let's see:
1: Are insurance companies forced to pay for it for anyone who simply claims they "need" it?
2: Are those who oppose it attacked and told they are committing "genocide"?
No, and no? Then No.
Dear lefties: there's an important phrase and action you need to learn:
1: I was wrong
2: The STFU
Just take the L, morons
Oh, and :
3: Does it completely destroy your ability to live a normal life?
Because we can't install a real penis in a woman, or a real vagina / womb in a man.
But you can actually lengthen someone's legs, and they can learn how to use those legs.
Which is to say that a "trans woman" will never be a real woman, but a "trans 6 foot tall" person actually is 6 feet tall
Ann Althouse said...
By the way, a 5'5" man who adds 3 inches all to his thighs is going to look out of proportion. I can't believe your legs will function properly with the thighs so out of proportion to the lower legs.
I have short legs. By which I mean when I sit down, I am "eyes to eye" with men who are 5" taller than I am when we're both standing. So getting this surgery would make me "more proportional", not less.
For women, "those legs go all the way up" == "my she has nice long legs" is a compliment, not a criticism. From what I understand it's less of a source of praise for men, so it may be more of an issue.
Judge and Cable (2004) — One of the most frequently cited studies (Journal of Applied Psychology): Each additional inch of height is associated with about $789 more per year in earnings (controlling for gender, age, weight, etc.).From 5'9" to 6'0" = 3 inches → ~$2,367 more per year.
So, how much does the surgery and recovery cost?
Howard said...
According to Achilles, white privilege is a myth
That's because in an America with "affirmative action" / "DEI" (so, US post 1964 Civil Rights Act) "white privilege" is a myth.
"According to Achilles, white privilege is a myth but Tall privilege is real."
So you think that you're dissing Achilles with that?
"If a man spent 6 months working out so hard he couldn't walk most of the time everyone would laud him and nothing would really change for him."
I just got back to the gym after a 6 month layoff due to a back problem. At 69, it really hurts. Nothing works anymore.
"Well well well, if it isn’t gender-affirming care for straight folks."
The person saying this is affirming she (I am certain this is a woman) discriminates men based on height.
He’s got legs, he knows how to use them
He never begs, he knows how to choose them
Titan-yum frames, wondering how to feel them
Would you get behind them if you could only find them?
He was so small, now he’s so tall
Yeah, it's alright
He’s got hair just like Gavin Newsom
It’s a blow and set, try to undo ‘em
Everytime he’s dancing he knows what to do
Everybody wants to see if he can use it
He’s so tall, but his wiener’s so small
The boy just ain’t right
CC, JSM
South Park, Season 9, Episode 1, titled "Mr. Garrison's Fancy New Vagina". 20 years ago. Mr. Garrison undergoes gender reassignment surgery to become Mrs. Garrison, and Kyle gets a "negroplasty" - lengthening his legs so he can be a better basketball player.
Post a Comment
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