Said Danica Patrick, on a podcast called "The Sage Steele Show," quoted in "Danica Patrick: 'Emotionally abusive' Aaron Rodgers relationship ‘wore me down to nothing'" (NY Post).
I saw that just as I'm in the middle of listening to Aaron Rogers on a new episode of Joe Rogan. Audio and transcript at Podscribe. I don't think Aaron talks about any of his relationships with women. Does he leave a trail of blood? He doesn't give a clue. He and Joe talk about vaccines, the pyramids, aliens, the Sean Combs trial, transwomen in women's sports. Juicy substantive topics.
Why are men's podcasts so different from women's and why do I only listen to the men's? Part of the answer is that I'm highly skeptical of female empowerment discourse — e.g., "the gift of how much I needed to show up for myself and take care of myself." It's not just that it's superficial and repetitious. I suspect that it's part of the subordination of women, not that it does men any good.
Posts
26 comments:
Why do some women always need support and someone patting them on the back and going "You go girl"? How much of this "I'm strong enough, I'm smart enough, and Gosh darn it people like me" can women do before they get bored?
Women need men to show them where the source of self-esteem is.
"It gave me the greatest gift of how much I needed to show up for myself and take care of myself."
Wow, moving stuff. And deep too. Ya gotta write a NYT article.
So.... Aaron doesn't broadcast deeply personal details from his private life, so that whomever is listening, the thousands or millions of complete strangers, can lick up his tears or enjoy his salacious impulses by proxy? Meanwhile, the 'you go grrll' woman looks for sympathy in a similar setting, from an anonymous audience, for.... what? Unrequited validation?
Oddly enough, she gets more sympathy from me than he does, but less respect for being authentic. It sounds like he treats women like commodities, in other words, he fits the stereotype of that kind of guy. Maybe it wouldn't occur to him to share these things with her, much less an audience.
You seem to have as much use for the “women’s-empowerment movement” as Joan Didion had for the “women’s movement” in the mid-70s. When you’re a woman who’s already empowered by dint of your own work and attitude, it must look silly.
Women are “subordinating” themselves? What in the hell is this “subordination” thing you’re always yammering about, Althouse? Through my life, I’ve sometimes been the authority figure and sometimes the subordinate. That’s human life and nature. You’re supposed to be exempt?
I'm with Shouting Thomas. Who is subordinating women?
Podcasters talk about what they want. If Sage and other women in podcasting want to talk about female empowerment discourse, then they enjoy superficial and repetitious conversations.
We aren't supposed to say it, but some people like being a subordinate rather than being in charge. I've been the boss, and it isn't always better to be responsible for everything.
For chrissake. If Danica Patrick needs an ego massage, all hope is lost.
Also--if she couldn't figure out from the beginning that Aaron Rogers is a complete egomaniac, it can only be because she was blinded by her own egomania.
"It's not just that it's superficial and repetitious. I suspect that it's part of the subordination of women, not that it does men any good."
I read this to mean that women's shows that encourage women to talk about dark experiences as a form of empowerment are actually doing damage. Women have so much more to talk about than that. The "you go, grrl" is confining. A discussion that focuses on someone's weakness just reinforces the narrative.
There is something about the world of XX humans that is asymmetric to the world of XY humans. It's a sort of inwardness that has no opposite in XYville. It's difficult to articulate.
Most of the "deep" shit many women say sounds like they got it from Cosmo. Not saying it can't happen, just that many women I've known weren't interested in having anything profound to say. No interest. Zero effort.
Which was disappointing because when a profound woman has profound insight into something it will floor you, like finding a missing piece to a puzzle youve tried a while to solve.
Rarer than hens teeth, and worth a king's ransom when found.
"Also--if she couldn't figure out from the beginning that Aaron Rogers is a complete egomaniac..."
A significant cohort of women love egomaniacs. When a narcissist meets a narcissist passing through the rye...
One of the mysteries of life is why otherwise sensible young women fall for "bad boys". Of course Aaron Rodgers and Danica Patrick have had careers where being supremely confident in one's self is essential for success. Which makes me wonder how Danica Patrick drove her love life into the corner wall at Indy. As the old song goes, "Ah sweet mystery of life."
Women (and all female animals) are complimentary to males but not at all the same. Merely mentioning "empowerment" discredits a source, as female emotions and physical strength result in patronage at best. When teenage female hormones hit...boybands become a thing and pregnancy easily easily easily happens.
The female bias toward babies and caregiving and relationships and emotions...okay...you've just lost every competition with males who can and will kill you if needed for survival. Check.
Deny hundreds of millions of years of evolution if you well.
Sounds like she's got the same therapist as Michelle.
I take it this is racecar Danica, not mathgeek Danica from a few years back. If racecar Danica has lost her self-confidence and is doubting everything she says and does, then maybe Endurance Extended Warranty isn't the way to save from having to pay unexpected and exorbitant auto repair bills. Snoop Doggy's self-confidence hasn't been shattered, so maybe CarShield is the way to go.
BTW, the UK already has a trans auto racer, so racecar Danica's no longer on the cutting edge anymore.
“The female bias toward babies and caregiving and relationships and emotions...okay...you've just lost every competition with males who can and will kill you if needed for survival. Check.”
“Deny hundreds of millions of years of evolution if you well.”
Exactly. Part of what we, as a. Species, has evolved, over the last 7 1/2 million years, since we genetically split from our nearest relatives, Chimps and Bonobos, is pair bonding , and a dependence, by women, on men. Chimp females really don’t care that much, who the father of this kid is, after being inseminated. But keeping the father around and involved is critical for human females. It’s because of our extremely lengthy dependency on our mothers/parents, which in turn is a result of a combination of walking with an upright posture and our ultimately large brain. So human females evolved to keep their mates around throughout that time, through pair bonding, so the fathers can provide resources and protection to the female and her young children. A good part of this was through sex. As a result, the vagina shifted for frontal intercourse, estrus was hidden, and sexual availability became fairly continuous throughout the estrus cycle. And, yes, on the male side, sexual jealousy, because the guy who is cuckolded spends his precious resources on raising another guy’s children.
So, think of female relationship insecurity as a mechanism to pair bond with a male, and then keep him around until their children are old enough for semi-independence (~4-5?).
Something though that is maybe not as recent in our evolution, is that much of our society is formed and held together by female bonding, with their children, other family members, their mates, and other women. A surprising amount of chimp society is matriarchal. My thoughts are that creating and maintaining relationships was a trait that helped protect females and their children. You see early adolescent girls practicing this fairly constantly for awhile, as they form and break friendships almost nonstop for a couple years, while the boys their age often just hang out with the same small group of guys. It’s something that’s important for females to learn, but not males.
Danica Patrick is the last person who should be complaining about others being abusive. She was universally despised by other drivers, her crew, the media and anybody even remotely associated with her because of the very things she's bitching about now.
Lazarus said:
"BTW, the UK already has a trans auto racer, so racecar Danica's no longer on the cutting edge anymore."
That barrier was broken back in the 60s. The UK had a trans motorcycle racer, Michelle (Michael) Duff.
I worked a pre Emmys party one year in Los Angeles. It was a charity event and actors show up by tickets and then walk around using them on whatever events are available.
I was there on behalf of Chrysler and we had a Pacifica show van. You'd be surprised how many wealthy celebrities wanted that thing.
Anyway, Aaron Rodgers was there with Jon Hamm. They showed up for 30 minutes, slammed a metric ton of liquor, and bounced. Fun times.
Thanks, Kate. That's pretty much exactly what I was thinking.
Anyone else think Aaron Rodgers is infertile? It’s hard to play first in the Era of Brady then in the Era of Mahomes.
Men can also be destroyed by the end of a relationship but those guys usually don't talk about how they need to start taking care of themselves and learn methods of self validation. Those unbalanced, unhinged guys might choose to trash talk women in general, the woman who dumped or cheated on them, or in extreme cases murder the woman or even themselves.
I suppose the difference between women and men who are not self sufficient emotionally is the tendency of men to believe they must be "in charge" or must be "in control" versus women who believe they are "victims."
I think women actually have an easier time emotionally because women can learn to mother themselves, it's part of the female nature to nurture. So it's natural for a woman to figure out why not learn to apply that empathy to oneself? With men I think the natural response to a problem is action -- to be destructive or to rush out an find another partner.
I blame Diana, Princess of Wales. She wasn’t the first woman to bare the details of her private life and most intimate relationships to the world, but she is the one who made it “empowering.”
Post a Comment
Please use the comments forum to respond to the post. Don't fight with each other. Be substantive... or interesting... or funny. Comments should go up immediately... unless you're commenting on a post older than 2 days. Then you have to wait for us to moderate you through. It's also possible to get shunted into spam by the machine. We try to keep an eye on that and release the miscaught good stuff. We do delete some comments, but not for viewpoint... for bad faith.