Asks Naomi Fry (at The New Yorker). Subheadline: "The singer died in 1971. A new documentary series posits that he faked his death to escape the burden of fame, and is living in hiding."
That prompted me to ask Grok, "What was that movie in the 1980s about a rock star who faked his death so he could live life as an unknown? Maybe something like 'Eddie and the Cruisers.'"
The answer made me laugh: "You're likely thinking of Eddie and the Cruisers, a 1983 film that fits your description perfectly...."
Yes, Grok doesn't know what I'm thinking. I'm enjoying its circumspection. I'm likely thinking of "Eddie and the Cruisers" when I suggest that the movie I'm thinking of is maybe something like "Eddie and the Cruisers." So meticulous. That's what I want from my A.I.
Later in that artificially intelligent conversation, I wrote: "I'm seeing a New Yorker article, 'Why Do We Want to Believe That Jim Morrison Is Still Alive?' That strikes me as the better path for reflection. Not: Is he alive. But: Why do we want to believe that this particular dead person is alive? What if some other famous person really did withdraw from celebrity life and live on as — to coin a phrase — a complete unknown? They'd be looking on as people imagined Elvis or Jim still walking the earth and thinking: What about me? If I were writing a screenplay about this character, which dead celebrity could I choose to portray as the central character who had made himself too unknown and now struggles to return to the world as a somebody but realizes that no one will really care because it's not as though Elvis or Jim returned into the light."
Meanwhile, Jim was brought back to life in a movie, "The Doors" (1991). And now, we see that Val Kilmer — the actor who played him — died yesterday.
Kilmer gave such interesting performances over the years. IMO, Jim Morrison was a drug-addled, waste of space as a person, but he and the Doors did create some interesting music.
I re-watched “The Salton Sea” a few weeks ago - what a wacky movie - in which I thought he’d given an outstanding performance. “Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang” was another interesting movie, where he displayed some comedic chops.
Sooner or later, people "age out" of such speculation and the point becomes moot: Elvis Presley, Adolf Hitler, Martin Bormann, Amelia Earhart, Judge Crater, Percy Fawcett, Ambrose Bierce, Weldon Kees, Arthur Cravan.
And yet, less famous people do go underground all the time.
Ive never understood the fuss about Jim Morrison. I'm very sad that val Kilmer died. Throat cancer is a tough way to go. Kilmer smoked and drank - a bad combo if you want to void cancer of the throat and esposophgus (sic).
Kilmer got into a fight with Brando on "Island of Dr. Moreau", and was one of the actors who stood up to Brando and his antics. Favorite films: Top secret, Tombstone, Heat.
I saw the Doors in 1969. It was not a good show. Felt kinda" ripped off in the parlance of the times. A few months ago.in DeLand, Fl (beautiful little college town) we saw the Dirty Doors, a very faithfull tribute band whose singer looked and sounded just like Jim. The were great and as an added plus the singer was neither drunk or on acid - or both. It was a very good show which wisely did not end with "Light My Fire" but with "Road House Blues"... "🎼🎶 Woke up this morning and had my self a beer...🎶
I believe lots of fans of Tupac Shakur wanted to believe and did believe he was secretly still alive after he was murdered. Though I suspect Will Smith is happy he is no longer with us.
I was a big fan of Beaver Brown, the band that performed the music from Eddie and the Cruisers. I saw them in bars around Boston many times in the late 70’s.
I was shocked when I went to see the film and heard the music. It seemed around have the songs were ones I first heard at Jonathan Swifts in Cambridge in 1977.
I read an interview with John Cafferty and he stated that the believed the inspiration for the was the saga of SMiLE - the lost Beach Boys album.
It must be an ego boost, but they've got ya, ma'am. It's like you can't have independent thoughts anymore without "help" from your computer. It likes knowing every thought that crosses your mind, "How should I load the dishwasher for maximum efficiency?" or "what is the best sexual position to achieve climax efficiently and avoid conception"... but do you really need its help googling "Eddie and the Cruisers" like we all did in the olden days before seniors could hide their dementia behind the artificial assist from the computer. Glad you retired: "computer, what grade should I give this paper?"
Best famous dead person is still alive movie? "Bubba Ho-Tep" Elvis and JFK are still alive in a nursing home in East Texas. Fighting a killer mummy. It's really deeper than that sounds. Lots of subtext. It's based on a Joe Lansdale story, so you know what that means (or maybe you don't).
As a teen I was a huge Doors fan. When stoned I was known to say that I could listen to the Doors 24hrs a day. In the early 80s, my friends and I all thought Morrison lived yet. I thought Billy Idol was Morrison under a new name, both have similar voices and tone.
Rick Beato did an excellent interview of the (two?) surviving members of The Doors about a month ago at Sunset Sound studios, Room 1, where The Doors recorded their first records.
I went to see the Doors at the Pasadena Civic in 1967 but Manzurek came out and said Morrison was "sick" so they couldn't play which was BS because we just wanted to hear the fancy organ part in Light My Fire and who cared about a stupid singer lol.
Anyway the substitute act was the Fifth Dimension who sang Beautiful Balloon while everyone streamed up the aisle and left
It was a horrible movie, wasting such a good story with all the hallucinogenic crap. I hung onto a copy of Oliver Stone's original script (a friend had read for a part) as a reminder what NOT to do when writing a script.
I did see Kilmer in Real Genius at a local hangout a couple weeks ago. Val looked so young that I was shocked to see the movie came out just a year ahead of Top Gun.
I'm sure I saw the Doors movie, but I can't remember a single thing about it.......Val Kilmer's most memorable role was in Tombstone. He was great in that, but the movie itself was just a little above mediocre......I think that flying to a luxury resort, in a private plane, in the company of a supermodel is one of the greatest highs known to man. Brian Jones and Jim Morrison folded with a royal flush hand. Rod Stewart shows the proper way to lead an excessive life.....On the plus side, they did leave a body of work that expressed their talents. I think Amy Winehouse was the saddest casualty among Drugs' War on Musicians. She never got to fully develop her art and her legacy is mostly a vacuum.
Yes, and Billy the Kid survived being shot by Pat Garrett and Curly Bill Brocius was never near Iron Creek, and both outlaws went straight thereafter and were totally law-abiding for the rest of their lives.
Also Adolph Hitler did not kill himself — he and his wife Eva (nee Braun) succeeded in getting safely to Argentina where they quietly raised a family.
That's too bad. Top Secret is one of my favorite movies. I'd heard/read that Kilmer really practiced his Morrison to the extent that it kind of creeped out the real Doors guys.
Just saw Thunderheart a few weeks ago, too. Good B-movie I think.
RIP, Val. In addition to be an apparently handsome guy, as an actor he was one that whenever he showed up on the screen, you instinctively thought, "this is gonna be fun". Kevin Spacey and Gary Oldman are the gold standard of that! Lots of roles and lots of quirks to work with. For me the "Iceman" roll in the original Top Gun was one that impossible not to watch and I don't think anybody else could have done it.
It’s very easy to fake your death and live out an anonymous life, many people of prominence do it. No one has left the building.
What this phenomena demonstrates is how stupidly gullible the average person is. It’s no wonder that the most gifted nation that ever existed is being trashed by mindless slobs for simple greed. The democrats are like the cretins that steal doorknobs and copper pipe from their rented homes to make $35 bucks.
I see that our blog hostess is fast going down the rabbit hole of AI interactions. It is a form of doom scrolling, and just as harmful. Best of luck with the eventual recovery from this malady.
I liked "Light My Fire" enough to buy the album, the first Doors album. I thought a lot before buying an album, because it was about $5 and my allowance was only $2 a week. So I was selective. I listened through once, then regretted it enough to take the album back to the store and ask for my money back. That was hard to believe I could do, because the plastic was off and the record had been played. I never did this for any other record I bought in my entire life. The Doors stands alone. And somehow, it worked, They gave me my money back. And I didn't lie and claim there was some flaw. I told the truth: I didn't like it. The rest of the album was not like "Light My Fire" and a disappointment to me.
Unlike Althouse, I was a big Doors fan from the beginning and ended up owning all of their albums, and even visited Morrison's grave when I was in Paris on vacation. I even had a 4-track tape of the original Doors debut album. Yes, I am so old that I actually owned a 4 track tape player and 4 track tapes before 8 tracks became the norm.
Oh, to be a fly on the wall when young Althouse was listening to "The End" on The Doors' first album. LOL. By the way, "Light My Fire" was written by The Doors' guitarist Robby Krieger, and not Morrison.
"Eddie and the Cruisers," which tells the story of an early-'60s rock star who mysteriously disappeared after a car crash, ENDS with the revelation that he's still alive. It's the follow-up -- "Eddie and the Cruisers II: Eddie Lives!" -- that tells the story of what he had been doing since, leading up to his musical self-reinvention and rediscovery by the world. So I'd say the sequel is a better answer to the question you asked Grok.
Of course, the real mystery was why a musician from the early classic-rock period somehow sounded just like 1980s-era Bruce Springsteen.
We now have an entire group of extremists who firmly believe that Donald John Trump has not lost his mind. His new authoritarian government driven by his dementia has imposed the Smoot-Hawley-Trump tariffs of 2025 at the highest rates ever experienced. With the new country by country rates ,Trump is merely targeting countries that sell more to the U.S. than they buy from it.
History shows that the Smoot-Hawley tariffs of 1930 was disastrous, bringing on the Great Depression. The Don thinks bigger is better so we are headed for the Greatest Depression. NY Attorney General Tisha James dubbed Trump's illegalities as “The Art of the Steal.” Sadly, the American public will pay even more into his personal coffers now as he cuts side deals. As he declines, his egomania doesn't permit the realization that he cannot spend what he already possesses. Perhaps he can arrange to sell his ashes - one grain at a time.
I use Grok multiple times a day now, mostly for practical help. I used it to find the best amplifier to power the speakers on my pontoon boat. I used it to get all the sizing and choice of components to install a laser welding machine to code. I ask it lots of heath questions about diet and medications. I wake up every day with a weird question I can't wait to ask it, and then that happens multiple times per day. Imagine when that capability is implanted right in your head. Everyone can be an expert on everything even as a child. Makes me glad I'm too old to ever see it.
Please use the comments forum to respond to the post. Don't fight with each other. Be substantive... or interesting... or funny. Comments should go up immediately... unless you're commenting on a post older than 2 days. Then you have to wait for us to moderate you through. It's also possible to get shunted into spam by the machine. We try to keep an eye on that and release the miscaught good stuff. We do delete some comments, but not for viewpoint... for bad faith.
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49 comments:
Why do we want to believe Jim Morrison is still alive?
What's with this "we", kemo sabe?
Wow, I haven't thought of "Eddie and the Cruisers" in decades. I loved that movie.
" I loved that movie."
Me too. My link goes to the entire movie on YouTube.
RIP to Mr. Kilmer. He created a handful of iconic roles- more than most realize. More than most actors accomplish.
If Jim Morrison were alive, would he visit his tomb at Père Lachaise?
Kilmer gave such interesting performances over the years. IMO, Jim Morrison was a drug-addled, waste of space as a person, but he and the Doors did create some interesting music.
Carl Hiaasen, the Skink series
There is no we because Naomi Fry herself doesn't believe it.
Jim Morrison did this interview sixteen years ago.
I re-watched “The Salton Sea” a few weeks ago - what a wacky movie - in which I thought he’d given an outstanding performance. “Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang” was another interesting movie, where he displayed some comedic chops.
Sooner or later, people "age out" of such speculation and the point becomes moot: Elvis Presley, Adolf Hitler, Martin Bormann, Amelia Earhart, Judge Crater, Percy Fawcett, Ambrose Bierce, Weldon Kees, Arthur Cravan.
And yet, less famous people do go underground all the time.
Ive never understood the fuss about Jim Morrison. I'm very sad that val Kilmer died. Throat cancer is a tough way to go. Kilmer smoked and drank - a bad combo if you want to void cancer of the throat and esposophgus (sic).
Kilmer got into a fight with Brando on "Island of Dr. Moreau", and was one of the actors who stood up to Brando and his antics. Favorite films: Top secret, Tombstone, Heat.
I saw the Doors in 1969. It was not a good show. Felt kinda" ripped off in the parlance of the times. A few months ago.in DeLand, Fl (beautiful little college town) we saw the Dirty Doors, a very faithfull tribute band whose singer looked and sounded just like Jim. The were great and as an added plus the singer was neither drunk or on acid - or both. It was a very good show which wisely did not end with "Light My Fire" but with "Road House Blues"... "🎼🎶 Woke up this morning and had my self a beer...🎶
I believe lots of fans of Tupac Shakur wanted to believe and did believe he was secretly still alive after he was murdered. Though I suspect Will Smith is happy he is no longer with us.
Jim Morrison? who was that?
some lounge singer from the last century?
or just some drug addicted loser?
You know that it would be untrue
You know that I would be a liar
If I was to say to you
Girl, our straits couldn't be more dire
Can you dig that?
One of my favorites. The "Oh no, I'm back in school" nightmare scene from Top Secret.
I'm your huckleberry!
Grok, who was that President who died but pretended he was alive for four years? And why did so many people want to believe that he was alive?
I was a big fan of Beaver Brown, the band that performed the music from Eddie and the Cruisers. I saw them in bars around Boston many times in the late 70’s.
I was shocked when I went to see the film and heard the music. It seemed around have the songs were ones I first heard at Jonathan Swifts in Cambridge in 1977.
I read an interview with John Cafferty and he stated that the believed the inspiration for the was the saga of SMiLE - the lost Beach Boys album.
It must be an ego boost, but they've got ya, ma'am.
It's like you can't have independent thoughts anymore without "help" from your computer. It likes knowing every thought that crosses your mind, "How should I load the dishwasher for maximum efficiency?" or "what is the best sexual position to achieve climax efficiently and avoid conception"... but do you really need its help googling "Eddie and the Cruisers" like we all did in the olden days before seniors could hide their dementia behind the artificial assist from the computer. Glad you retired: "computer, what grade should I give this paper?"
My first record was the single cut of “Light My Fire”. I loved that song when it came out.
My least favorite part of The Doors was Jim Morrison. It was the music that grabbed me. John Densmore was an underrated drummer.
Best famous dead person is still alive movie? "Bubba Ho-Tep" Elvis and JFK are still alive in a nursing home in East Texas. Fighting a killer mummy. It's really deeper than that sounds. Lots of subtext. It's based on a Joe Lansdale story, so you know what that means (or maybe you don't).
Ficta beat me by more than an hour!
As a teen I was a huge Doors fan. When stoned I was known to say that I could listen to the Doors 24hrs a day. In the early 80s, my friends and I all thought Morrison lived yet. I thought Billy Idol was Morrison under a new name, both have similar voices and tone.
Along the same theme, check out the documentary Searching for Sugar Man. I enjoyed it.
Rick Beato did an excellent interview of the (two?) surviving members of The Doors about a month ago at Sunset Sound studios, Room 1, where The Doors recorded their first records.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dt0Dssqs44Q
In 2017 I was in Paris for the first time, and my wife and I were staying in a hotel not far from the cemetery where Morrison is buried.
Seeing Americans of a certain age, the desk clerk whipped out a map and proceeded to show us the best route to get there.
I guess they get a lot of pilgrims.
I went to see the Doors at the Pasadena Civic in 1967 but Manzurek came out and said Morrison was "sick" so they couldn't play which was BS because we just wanted to hear the fancy organ part in Light My Fire and who cared about a stupid singer lol.
Anyway the substitute act was the Fifth Dimension who sang Beautiful Balloon while everyone streamed up the aisle and left
No mention yet of Andy Kaufman?
It was a horrible movie, wasting such a good story with all the hallucinogenic crap. I hung onto a copy of Oliver Stone's original script (a friend had read for a part) as a reminder what NOT to do when writing a script.
I did see Kilmer in Real Genius at a local hangout a couple weeks ago. Val looked so young that I was shocked to see the movie came out just a year ahead of Top Gun.
I'm sure I saw the Doors movie, but I can't remember a single thing about it.......Val Kilmer's most memorable role was in Tombstone. He was great in that, but the movie itself was just a little above mediocre......I think that flying to a luxury resort, in a private plane, in the company of a supermodel is one of the greatest highs known to man. Brian Jones and Jim Morrison folded with a royal flush hand. Rod Stewart shows the proper way to lead an excessive life.....On the plus side, they did leave a body of work that expressed their talents. I think Amy Winehouse was the saddest casualty among Drugs' War on Musicians. She never got to fully develop her art and her legacy is mostly a vacuum.
Yes, and Billy the Kid survived being shot by Pat Garrett and Curly Bill Brocius was never near Iron Creek, and both outlaws went straight thereafter and were totally law-abiding for the rest of their lives.
Also Adolph Hitler did not kill himself — he and his wife Eva (nee Braun) succeeded in getting safely to Argentina where they quietly raised a family.
Yup. ‘Struth.
That's too bad. Top Secret is one of my favorite movies. I'd heard/read that Kilmer really practiced his Morrison to the extent that it kind of creeped out the real Doors guys.
Just saw Thunderheart a few weeks ago, too. Good B-movie I think.
RIP, Val. In addition to be an apparently handsome guy, as an actor he was one that whenever he showed up on the screen, you instinctively thought, "this is gonna be fun". Kevin Spacey and Gary Oldman are the gold standard of that! Lots of roles and lots of quirks to work with. For me the "Iceman" roll in the original Top Gun was one that impossible not to watch and I don't think anybody else could have done it.
It’s very easy to fake your death and live out an anonymous life, many people of prominence do it. No one has left the building.
What this phenomena demonstrates is how stupidly gullible the average person is. It’s no wonder that the most gifted nation that ever existed is being trashed by mindless slobs for simple greed. The democrats are like the cretins that steal doorknobs and copper pipe from their rented homes to make $35 bucks.
I see that our blog hostess is fast going down the rabbit hole of AI interactions. It is a form of doom scrolling, and just as harmful. Best of luck with the eventual recovery from this malady.
Loved Kilmer as an actor. A great loss.
I want to believe that Soupy Sales is still alive.
The Morrison movie had one of the greatest movie lines, “ but, you’re like, my woman, man!”
I liked "Light My Fire" enough to buy the album, the first Doors album. I thought a lot before buying an album, because it was about $5 and my allowance was only $2 a week. So I was selective. I listened through once, then regretted it enough to take the album back to the store and ask for my money back. That was hard to believe I could do, because the plastic was off and the record had been played. I never did this for any other record I bought in my entire life. The Doors stands alone. And somehow, it worked, They gave me my money back. And I didn't lie and claim there was some flaw. I told the truth: I didn't like it. The rest of the album was not like "Light My Fire" and a disappointment to me.
Temujin said...
RIP to Mr. Kilmer. He created a handful of iconic roles- more than most realize.
“I’m your huckleberry.”
Unlike Althouse, I was a big Doors fan from the beginning and ended up owning all of their albums, and even visited Morrison's grave when I was in Paris on vacation. I even had a 4-track tape of the original Doors debut album. Yes, I am so old that I actually owned a 4 track tape player and 4 track tapes before 8 tracks became the norm.
Oh, to be a fly on the wall when young Althouse was listening to "The End" on The Doors' first album. LOL. By the way, "Light My Fire" was written by The Doors' guitarist Robby Krieger, and not Morrison.
"Eddie and the Cruisers," which tells the story of an early-'60s rock star who mysteriously disappeared after a car crash, ENDS with the revelation that he's still alive. It's the follow-up -- "Eddie and the Cruisers II: Eddie Lives!" -- that tells the story of what he had been doing since, leading up to his musical self-reinvention and rediscovery by the world. So I'd say the sequel is a better answer to the question you asked Grok.
Of course, the real mystery was why a musician from the early classic-rock period somehow sounded just like 1980s-era Bruce Springsteen.
We now have an entire group of extremists who firmly believe that Donald John Trump has not lost his mind. His new authoritarian government driven by his dementia has imposed the Smoot-Hawley-Trump tariffs of 2025 at the highest rates ever experienced. With the new country by country rates ,Trump is merely targeting countries that sell more to the U.S. than they buy from it.
History shows that the Smoot-Hawley tariffs of 1930 was disastrous, bringing on the Great Depression. The Don thinks bigger is better so we are headed for the Greatest Depression. NY Attorney General Tisha James dubbed
Trump's illegalities as “The Art of the Steal.” Sadly, the American public will pay even more into his personal coffers now as he cuts side deals. As he declines, his egomania doesn't permit the realization that he cannot spend what he already possesses. Perhaps he can arrange to sell his ashes - one grain at a time.
"Well, I woke up this mornin'
And I got myself a beer.
The future's uncertain
And the end is always near."
Put your headphones on and crank it up for the Lizard King.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2_X4VTCoEo
(hey, I'm 72 and can do it, so you can too)
I use Grok multiple times a day now, mostly for practical help. I used it to find the best amplifier to power the speakers on my pontoon boat. I used it to get all the sizing and choice of components to install a laser welding machine to code. I ask it lots of heath questions about diet and medications. I wake up every day with a weird question I can't wait to ask it, and then that happens multiple times per day. Imagine when that capability is implanted right in your head. Everyone can be an expert on everything even as a child. Makes me glad I'm too old to ever see it.
Post a Comment
Please use the comments forum to respond to the post. Don't fight with each other. Be substantive... or interesting... or funny. Comments should go up immediately... unless you're commenting on a post older than 2 days. Then you have to wait for us to moderate you through. It's also possible to get shunted into spam by the machine. We try to keep an eye on that and release the miscaught good stuff. We do delete some comments, but not for viewpoint... for bad faith.