December 5, 2024

"Those who could face exposure include such members of Congress’ Jan. 6 Committee as Sen.-elect Adam Schiff (D-Calif.) and former GOP Rep. Liz Cheney of Wyoming."

"Trump has previously said Cheney 'should go to Jail along with the rest of the Unselect Committee!' Also mentioned by Biden’s aides for a pardon is Anthony Fauci, the former head of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases who became a lightning rod for criticism from the right during the Covid-19 pandemic.... The president himself, who was intensely focused on his son’s pardon, has not been brought into the broader pardon discussions yet, according to people familiar with the deliberations. The conversations were spurred by Trump’s repeated threats and quiet lobbying by congressional Democrats, though not by those seeking pardons themselves. 'The beneficiaries know nothing,' one well-connected Democrat told me about those who could receive pardons...."

From "Biden White House Is Discussing Preemptive Pardons for Those in Trump’s Crosshairs/The nomination of Kash Patel, who has vowed to pursue Trump’s critics, as FBI director has heightened concerns within the president’s inner circle" (Politico).

233 comments:

1 – 200 of 233   Newer›   Newest»
RideSpaceMountain said...

After hearing about this and the whole CEO shooting in NYC, it would be just terrible if that person or people like them started stalking the J6 select committee and Fauci and others. Just terrible. Don't do that!

Caroline said...

Joe Biden identifies as The Sun King.

Jamie said...

Sure. Let's all come right out and admit that Biden isn't doing anything of his own device.

RideSpaceMountain said...

"Apres moi, less nappy time and wandering off into the distance when surrounded by world leaders."

Yancey Ward said...

I, for one, hope Biden does pardon them- nothing will more certainly testify to their guilt.

Joe said...

No one's above the law. LOL

Wince said...

Nah, there's no "Deep State."

The president himself, who was intensely focused on his son’s pardon, has not been brought into the broader pardon discussions yet, according to people familiar with the deliberations. The conversations were spurred by Trump’s repeated threats and quiet lobbying by congressional Democrats, though not by those seeking pardons themselves.

Left unsaid is the "exposure" and need for the pardons was "spurred" by their repeated threats, falsehoods and, most significantly, actions against Trump.

Big Mike said...

+ 1

Big Mike said...

Except top Democrats

Jamie said...

But articles like these will prove to be effective battlespace preparation: "They were not pardoned because they're guilty - they were pardoned because Trump's administration would otherwise be able to hound them to the ends of the earth! See? The thought process has been clearly laid out for you. Everything we said about Trump's being Hitlerian is being borne out."

Plenty and aplenty of people will believe it and nothing will shake their belief.

Thanksgiving was pretty rough in my husband's family and there's no relief in sight.

Paddy O said...

In some ways this could be a win. If the perception of revenge is off the table, a substantive review of rhe J6 committee and other very shady actions could be more fruitful and still result in significsnt consequences. Schiff might not be criminally charged but the Senate could restrict and censor him, yes? And civil suits. Plus as many as Biden pardons there are hundreds who participated who wont be named. Shine the light into the shadows and expose the corrution. It would devastare reputations and create a push against this happening again.

mikee said...

Then call them before Congressional committees to testify about their actions, get them on perjury if they open their yaps and lie or contempt if they don't
tell the whole truth, and send 'em to jail for that. Make it open ended, with the first question being, "Please tell us everything you know about the Resistance, the actions of elected officials, FBI, CIA, DOJ, and any other federal agents to harm President Trump in his first term." That's a sure perjury conviction for any of them.

ThatsGoingToLeaveA said...

How about generous Joe goes ahead and pardons all registered Democrats just for fun!

Yancey Ward said...

To issue an effective pardon, Biden will have to specify which crimes for which he is pardoning them pre-emptively or he will have to give them the blanket pardon for all crimes committed during a given period. Hard to spin such a thing- much like the left couldn't spin the Hunter Biden pardon.

Howard (not that Howard) said...

I hope he does this. It will just cement in normie minds that they illegally tried to keep Trump from the presidency.

narciso said...

only among the stupid, and they already have their votes, now keep in mind this is jonathan martin who bought this argument, a premier hack of the highest order, who crawled his way to the Times and back,

wendybar said...

So, then they are telling us they are all "guilty as hell, free as a bird", as Unrepentent Domestic Terrorist Bill Ayers said in a New Yorker interview that came out on 9/11/2001 of his bombing of federal buildings....

Proves once again, that Trump was right, and his supporters in the DC gulag should be released immediately and sue the bejesus out of all of these corrupt Politicians who fouled our country for too many years.

Peachy said...

Is this possible as a work-around for actual prosecution? or keeping that horror show lying liar fraud Adam Schitt-D off of all committees.

Quaestor said...

"Après nous, le déluge." That was the Sun King's great-grandson, Louis XV. Although he spent an unheard of sum of money on Versailles, Louis XIV died leaving the French coffers more or less well-stocked. It was No. 15 who really broke France, though it was his son who paid the bills with his head.

Peachy said...

A committee investigating the Jan 6th committee is still warranted. No matter what.

rehajm said...

…apparently bottom Democrats, too..

Michael Fitzgerald said...

Dirty fucking rat Democrat Party members pardoning themselves before they can be indicted! We're going to have to go outside the law to punish all the traitors and criminals in government. Hunt them down like Mossad tracking the murderers of their people. Hang every single Party member who gets pardoned, starting with Biden's piece of shit son and finishing with the Big Guy" himself.

Jamie said...

And far too many people will be unswayed. The comments on X are instructive.

I'm not saying these people shouldn't be investigated or called upon to testify, simply because some large swath of the country will believe it's a witch-hunt. By all means, they should be. I'm just cynical about my fellow Americans right now.

robother said...

No one knows better how the federal criminal justice system can be used to grind down someone than Shiff and Cheney.

Quaestor said...

Those aren't Trump critics, they're would-be Trump assassins. They've never criticized Trump. Rather, they've conspired to destroy him quite literally with their Russia-Russia-Russia lies.

Duty of Inquiry said...

I would think the 'speech and debate' clause would make the members of the J6 committee immune from prosecution.

Gusty Winds said...

Fauci gets a pardon for crimes against humanity?? Wow. That some fucking Biblical Power there.

Leland said...

What exactly does the left think it is going to happen if they pre-Pardon all these people? There is still plenty of reasons for Trump to push for investigations, and if he wants to do that, he will. It won't matter if he can send them to jail, because the issue is knowing the truth behind these events.

It could well be that the investigations are useless and come up with nothing, but then a pardon wouldn't be necessary. If the investigations do turn up something, it will show that these people should be held accountable, but the left protected them from accountability. If that is the outcome, it will be clear that these officials abused their power, attacked innocent people for asking questions, and their final abuse is to protect themselves from justice. I'm sure that will go well for Democrats. It will be fine.

narciso said...

Their actions, not their speech, obstructing justice, destroying evidence, false inprisonment, that is prima facie prosecutable,

RideSpaceMountain said...

富不过三代 - "Wealth doesn't go past 3 generations"

Not just wealth, but also heads attached naturally to their bodies apparently.

Aggie said...

No, they're just over there, to the side of it. Protecting their Democracy

Peachy said...

No one is above the law! they said.,

Except all corrupt democrats. The modern democrat party is a sh*t show.

Scott Gustafson said...

It would be interesting to know if any of the potential recipients would accept a pardon. I presume all of them claim to have done nothing wrong.

Bob Boyd said...

"Those who could face exposure..."

Exposure is exactly what they're worried about. And the domino effect. The WH isn't doing this out love for these people. They know if one goes down, they all go down.
But what about all the staffers and the career people who had to have been involved. What happens to them? They have to be wondering.

AlbertAnonymous said...

“ one well-connected Democrat told me ”

So, again, NOT a journalist’s scoop but rather a “planted” story by a Washington reporter who carries water for the Dems. “Sure you can plant your narrative driving propaganda in my newspaper…”

Bob Boyd said...

Show me the man and I'll show you the pardon.

Aggie said...

If this is the course this administration takes, pardoning everybody for their membership in the club, then the strategy for Trump is clear: He should pardon himself and everybody in his cabinet in advance, on his first day of office, for any future crimes, real or imagined. And every time he appoints somebody new, blanket lifetime golden pardons for them, too. Let's make Lawfare obsolete, eh?

mindnumbrobot said...

The conversations were spurred by Trump’s repeated threats ... 'The beneficiaries know nothing...'

Yeah, right. I'm gonna call bull$hit.

RideSpaceMountain said...

We'll see if the old axiom "someone always eventually turns state's evidence" remains true in the forthcoming administration.

RCOCEAN II said...

Amazing how the MSM/DNC press lies and asserts things without evidence. "Oh, Biden and those to recieve pardons, don't know nothin' about nothin" - why its their "friends" working in secret (and the pages of NYTs) trying to get them pardons.

The problem before was that the Garland "objective" "Rule of Law" DoJ wouldn't prosecute people who lied to a Republican congress or been held in contempt. Garland/Biden WOULD go after those who lied to the Pelosi led Democrat House. Or asserted "executive privilage".

Hopefully, Trump's DOJ will also start holding trials outside of DC, since in 93 percent democrat DC, its impossible for a Republican to be found innocent or a Democrat to be found guilty.

My name goes here. said...

The lawfare waged against Donald Trump must be met with in-kind actions by the incoming administration. Tit-for-tat with forgiveness is the only way forward, it is the only method that creates "civility" in the long term. If Trump does not zealously pursue parity with those that would come up with creative interpretations of laws to generate convictions against him for no reason other than offending Nancy Pelosi/Chuck Shumer/Barack Obama/Planned Parenthood/etc. then the next Republican President/Senator/Representative/Governor will face the same.

Eric Holder said he was Barack Obama's wingman. The Obama DOJ found reasons why the Contempt of Congress against Holder was not really something that could be prosecuted. In 2009 Obama fired the Inspector General that wanted to recommend charges be brought against Kevin Johnson, a friend of Obama for destruction of subpoenaed emails in relation to Johnson being ineligible to receive federal grant funds because of previous misuse.

I want Trump to have his DOJ act the EXACT SAME WAY. I want the prosecution on Trumped up charges to be brought against the entire Russia gate operation. I want the clearances revoked from the 51 shills that said Hunter Biden's laptop was Russian misinformation. Then I want the same FBI raid with cameras that was used at Mar-a-Lago to seize classified documents with photos leaked of their houses. I want the state state governments to come up with new legal theories about how tax and loan documents are filed by all of those parties involved and I want them to be audited from asshole to appetite in that direction. I want every one of these creatively political revenge prosecutions to have their arrestees (even when they voluntarily agree to surrender themselves like Roger Stone) to have their house raided (again with advanced notice leaked to media so the cameras can be there) for the arrest.

In short, I want the EXACT SAME actions by my side that are allowed and encouraged by the other side. So yes, I want Adam Schiff, Liz Cheney, and all the others involved in the farce they perpetuated to be treated the EXACT SAME as Trump was treated. I want it to continue until someone that "counts" on the left Obama, Pelosi, Clinton (either of them), Garland to get in front of a camera and say that what they did (the lawfare) and how they did it (maximum leaked media humiliation) were wrong when they did it and it is wrong when Trump does it. Then, and only then, will I be ok with us returning to "norms". Because until that happens the way the DOJ (and the state equivalents) treated Trump IS the norm.

Bob Boyd said...

If Trump is really Hitler, a pardon would be like the pretty, pink parasol Wily Coyote puts up right before the giant boulder lands on his head.
But of course, they know Trump will respect the law, unlike themselves.

Skeptical Voter said...

The rats scuttle off the sinking SS Joe Biden, clutching a pardon in their greasy little paws.

robother said...

Hunter's team has shown the Deep State world that Joe Biden no longer cares about his legacy, and can be talked (or bribed) into a full pardon for anyone (particularly if, as I expect, his final pardon will be for himself).

Big Mike said...

If there were no stupid Americans there would be no Democat Party

stlcdr said...

Why would any of them require pardons for 'crimes' they haven't committed, but also before there's even a prosecution for these non-crimes?!

Or did they actually commit crimes? Or, their prosecution for non-crimes is an actual crime? Or, their prosecution of non-crimes is not a crime, but will be treated as such by the incoming administration, so are pre-pardoning?

Whell, why don't we just ignore the pardons and send them to jail, anyway? Or, just pardon everyone for everything going back to each persons birth?

I'm imagining the Oprah meme - 'you get a pardon, and you get a pardon!'

What a farce.

My name goes here. said...

You are correct it could be a win. Schiff and Cheney could be impeached, tried and removed from office and prevented from ever holding office again. (Yes this can happen to Cheney even though she is not a sitting member of Congress now.) With a pardon in the form a blanket immunity every single one of these people can be compelled to testify, there is no fifth amendment protection. When under oath they could be questioned to get to allof the players involved in the sham that was the J6 committee and the media shenanigans that Schiff played during the Russiagate controversy.

Bob Boyd said...

Clearly the Democratic Party actually is an organized crime syndicate.

Tank said...

If they've done nothing wrong, they have nothing to worry about.

Or so I've been told.

Peachy said...

Pre-pardons. Prior to necessary comeuppance and retribution. They are dirty fucking assholes.
It's time to stop playing their game. Prosecute them anyway.,

rehajm said...

RIP ‘No one is above the law’…

mindnumbrobot said...

I guess we now know the backup plan if the lawfare and attempted assassinations didn't work, AND Trump managed to win the election. Biden just hand's out pardons like Oprah giving away cars. "You get pardon! You get a pardon! You get a pardon!"

Saint Croix said...

I love the pardon idea. That is way, way better than trying to prosecute multiple people in the Justice Department. Let there be no jail time. But also, please, let them self-identify as a criminal gang.

Saint Croix said...

There was a rumor a week or two ago that Mayorkas has been asking for a pardon.

Shoeless Joe said...

If it wasn't for Trump destroying our precious norms none of these people would have broken the law to stop him. It's his fault Democrats need to issue mass pardons before Trump institutes his new reign of terror.

Saint Croix said...

I think that's a horrible idea. Much, much better for Biden to use his pardon power to allow the bad guys to escape justice. That will expose them as criminals, much more obviously than if Trump were to pursue them.

Saint Croix said...

You can't pardon people for future crimes.

Saint Croix said...

Agreed.

Freder Frederson said...

Sounds like you are advocating lynching not only Biden's son, but Biden himself. Do you know that threatening assassination of the president is illegal ,a href="https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title18-section871&num=0&edition=prelim">(USC 18 Section 871), punishable by five years in prison?

Either you or Althouse should remove your post.

RideSpaceMountain said...

"You get a pardon! And you get a pardon! And you too! Everybody gets a pardon!"

Saint Croix said...

It's really moronic to think Republicans are going to be in power for life. Quit acting and talking like Democrats do in secret. You're embarrassing. We're not a one-party state and Trump is not, and has never been, a fascist. Shut up and sit down.

Bob Boyd said...

Lawfare bullies love that the process is the punishment. They like breaking people financially, threatening to do the same to their kids. They like to see fear in people's eyes.
Now it's, "Godfather, protect me!"

Peachy said...

All efforts to makes Adam Schitt's life miserable - should be used.

Myorkas - yeah - he was impeached, but that was stopped-cold by Chuck Schumer. The GOP would never stop something like that. Because they are dumb and phony with their one-sided virtue. (I'm looking at you McConnell, Graham, Collins and holier than though hack Merkowski)
The GOP needs to start playing by the left's rules.

Freder Frederson said...

And apparently Donald Trump, who is currently accepting bribes from foreign nationals and not even bothering to hide it any more. Our mainstream media has barely covered it.

Freder Frederson said...

Sorry, screwed up the link

Freder Frederson said...

I'm not saying these people shouldn't be investigated or called upon to testify, simply because some large swath of the country will believe it's a witch-hunt. By all means, they should be. I'm just cynical about my fellow Americans right now.

Apparently, you have a different standard for investigating Trump.

Leland said...

In response to both above, pardoning these people makes it more imperative for Trump to investigate and shields him from the claims he is doing so just to put them in jail. Trump would have the argument of doing so to bring sunlight on the truth. Besides, a pardon wouldn't protect security clearances nor would it protect the livelihoods of those found complicit. They may not face a loss of liberty or their lives; but they can be made pariahs for committing gross acts against the American people and then receiving protection from a corrupt President. This is what the left wanted for Trump, and now they are laying the table for it to happen to them. Blanket pardons will make it much worse for them while protecting Trump.

Michael Fitzgerald said...

Freder Frederson
Sounds like you are advocating lynching not only Biden's son, but Biden himself. Do you know that threatening assassination of the president is illegal ,a href="https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title18-section871&num=0&edition=prelim">(USC 18 Section 871), punishable by five years in prison?

Either you or Althouse should remove your post.
12/5/24, 9:46 AM
LOL! Kiss my ass.

Levi Starks said...

It’s nice to see such an open admission that lawfare is exactly that.

Bruce Hayden said...

No. The lynching would spare the Bidens. Start with Garland and work down through the DOJ and FBI, including Smith and Bratt, add in the tops of several other departments like SECDEF, and make sure to include Nancy Pelosi, Schiff, Cheney, their J6 committee, and even include some of the Capital Police.

henge2243 said...

Our George Costanza presidency continues...

"The president himself, who was intensely focused on his son’s pardon, has not been brought into the broader pardon discussions yet"

They only wake him up for the important meetings. I have to wonder, what does the euphemism "intensely focused" mean? We now know that "sharp as a tack" meant "dull as WNBA Pre-season".

Freder Frederson said...

So, fighting fascism by Biden justifies fascist acts by Trump? What the hell is your problem. I know that I can the least shred of integrity by most of the commenters on this site, but hopefully Althouse will have enough integrity to condemn Trump's use of lawfare as forcefully as she did the charges against Trump.

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

This seems like a truly BS use of his pardon power, exceeding even the way out of bounds one he gave is son already. We've quickly gone from "no one is above the law" to "all my friends and family and party loyalists are above the law."

And the ever shrinking national media is cheering every stupid step along the way. The astute David Winston election analysis (non-hot link below) really should be required reading in DC.

[cut and paste this:] https://www.winstongroup.net/wp-content/uploads/2024/12/Winston-Group-2024-Post-Election-Analysis.pdf

donald said...

Would anybody be surprised if the Biden Administration pardoned everybody involved in their corrupt dealings?

Michael Fitzgerald said...

Saint Croix
"I love the pardon idea. That is way, way better than trying to prosecute multiple people in the Justice Department. Let there be no jail time."
Yeah, that'll show 'em, huh? No jail time...
"It's really moronic to think Republicans are going to be in power for life." This isn't about "power for life", idiot. This is about punishing the guilty, the wicked, and the evil. When you let those people go free with no consequences for their crimes, they continue committing the crimes, like, say, Hunter Biden.
"Quit acting and talking like Democrats do in secret" In secret? Like the secret places of Morning Joe, MSNBC, ABC News, The View, CBS News, WAPO, etc?
"You're embarrassing" Says the weak bitch advocating for letting criminals go free because otherwise it's unsettling. Weak fucking bitch.
"We're not a one-party state and Trump is not, and has never been, a fascist" Again, moron, it isn't about a show of power, you fucking dipshit. It's about punishing wrongdoing so that it the wrongdoing stops and is not repeated against other innocents. I have been reading your comments and observing your misguided morality for years. You are a fucking weak bitch who has a malfunctioning moral compass. Too fucking scared of upsetting others to do what's right.
"Shut up and sit down." Kiss. My. Ass.

Freder Frederson said...

Bruce, aren't you an attorney? You must be a really crappy one. Otherwise you would know advocating the murder of the attorney general or other government official is also illegal. And if you actually attempt the assassination your looking at 20 years in federal prison. I guess Trump could pardon you, but what would that mean for the rule of law in this country?

tolkein said...

I'm going to quote extensively from Matt Taibbi's Substack piece "Pardon Me, But This is Bullshit".
The Politico piece by Jonathan Martin might be the first of the era that needs to be read entirely between the lines. White House officials are “carefully weighing” preemptive pardons really means White House officials already decided, but are publicly floating the idea. Pardons for “those who’ve committed no crimes” means those who’ve committed crimes. “Could suggest impropriety” is would admit impropriety. Criticism from “the right” is criticism from all. It goes on:
Martin went on to say the discussions were spurred by “quiet lobbying by congressional Democrats,” though “not by those seeking pardons themselves,” because as one “well-connected Democrat” put it, “The beneficiaries know nothing.” (But we want it published. The beneficiaries know everything.) Martin added, “some congressional Democrats… are uneasy about the idea of being granted a pardon they’re not seeking.” (They’re not uneasy about pardons they are seeking.) “I would urge the president not to do that,” said Schiff. “I think it would seem defensive and unnecessary.” (Bullshit and no he doesn’t.)
Even the threat of retaliation could prove costly to individuals because they’d be forced to hire high-priced lawyers to defend themselves… Some Biden appointees… are already considering taking the best-paying jobs next year in part to ensure they have the resources to defend themselves against any investigations.

As opposed to the lower-paying jobs they planned on taking? And “considering”? They already took them.

Have they any shame at all?

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Cool!
Then they get called before Congress, and get forced to testify about everything they did, with no 5th Amendment protection.

And so we get video of the J6 Committee talking about all the coverups, all the lies, all which gets played in political commercials about why you can't ever vote for a Democrat

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

He is certainly acting as if he truly fears apeiron Trump, the unstoppable force, finding where the bones are buried.

Freder Frederson said...

And where is there any evidence that Trump respects the law?

Christopher B said...

Matt Taibbi fisks the Politico report.

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

Please Freder share with us the investigation of Trump that went untried, so that we may be as wise as you.

hombre said...

This isn’t about “Trump threats” it’s about Biden criminality. Biden can use the specter of Trump threats for mass pardons of Trump’s “political enemies” to obscure the pardons of the Biden Crime Family including himself. His lies about Hunter provide a clue.

Dogma and Pony Show said...

The Supreme Court would likely invalidate any pardon that purported to apply to crimes not yet committed. I think that would be at odds with the Founders' understanding of the nature and scope of the pardon power under common law.

Original Mike said...

Jim Biden is sure to get a pardon, yet he's done nothing to draw Trump's ire. I'm looking forward to the excuse for that one.

My name goes here. said...

Freder, It would be great for Althouse to point out when Trump uses lawfare, and it will be great when she condemns it. But as to my point above, she is not one of the people that "count". The way they treated Trump is the norm now. The aggressor sets the rules. All I want is for Trump to follow their rules. Hard. Until they come out of the woodwork and say "uncle".

There was a time when the VAST legal profession was self governed to the point where bringing charges against Trump the way they did, and gathering evidence the way they did was considered so far beyond what was considered normal and acceptable that the legal profession held itself in check. During those times, Althouse would have been one (of many) voices that "counted".

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

And actual assassins at least twice, both who have mysterious ties to our vast Intelligence Community, and who both spouted Democrat talking points about Trump.

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

Does that cover destruction of Public Records, which is a felony under the FOIA?

Freder Frederson said...

We've quickly gone from "no one is above the law" to "all my friends and family and party loyalists are above the law."

That ship sailed in Trump's first term. You conveniently ignore the fact that Trump pardoned his daughter's father-in-law (and there is no doubt that he was guilty of the crimes he was charged with including trying to extort his brother-in-law by paying a prostitute to seduce him and recording the encounter).

Aggie said...

It's unreasonable to think that voters are going to conclude that the pardoned Democrats are really criminals. Democrat voters will decide to provide comfort to their mindset. They'll conclude that Joe has granted these politicians justifiable protections as a form of noblesse oblige, that that it's completely normal under the toxic circumstances that they had absolutely nothing to do with, because the Orange Man is literally Hitler.

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

Pardons will almost guarantee investigations, prosecutions where applicable, and even sentencing. The record can speak for itself. Pardons don't stop the process, they stop the punishment from being applied after the process has concluded. For verification, just watch what happens at Hunter's sentencing hearing. That judge is hopping mad at the "press release" that Biden issued "in lieu of a pardon" (in the judge's own words).

Michael Fitzgerald said...

Thank you, My Name Goes Here! This comment is 100% correct. And naturally this inarguable truth is jumped on and opposed by limp dick Leland, libtard Freder, and this asshole: "Much, much better for Biden to use his pardon power to allow the bad guys to escape justice." How morally confused can a shithead get?

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

More than any evidence Biden does.

Aggie said...

Founder's Understanding snort - tell that to old Joe's team.

Then issue them weekly, like a hall pass. Draw them up, and leave the date blank. Why not treat them with as much gravity and respect as the present administration is treating them?

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

Yet a pardon won't stop the procedural part if we want to carry it out. Nor does it stop civil suits brought by the DOJ.

Clyde said...

The guilty fleeth when no man pursueth.

Howard said...

Hell haveth no furious anger to the degree of a full Monty Trump worshiper. Schadenfreude isn't enough of a dopamine hit. You victims suffering from a weird male version of battered wife syndrome feel the need for revenge, bloody or otherwise, so you can feel whole again.

If the Trump administration decides to follow your Draconian advice it will assure lead to the ultimate failure of achieving The wider goals of a secure border ending wars cutting government waste ending the regulatory bureaucratic industrial complex.

What was that old saying about biting off your nose to spite your face?

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

And Jim's wife, and Valerie Joe's sister, and all the grandchildren who had CCP dollars deposited into their accounts by Hunter. The list is long. Only about six weeks left to cover it all.

Bruce Hayden said...

Think of this - newly elected Senator Schiff having his top secret security clearance revoked because of his abuse of classified information. What happens to his dreams of sitting on the powerful Senate Intelligence Committee? Of even heading it or being the Ranking Member, and effectively controlling who gets to run the CIA, NSA, etc? Justified loss of a security clearance has cost Senators membership on that committee before.

Moreover, most, if not all, of those 51 still retain their security clearances. It’s a perk of their previous job, and it allows them to financially exploit their former positions. Without security clearances, no one with one can really talk to them, and they are not authorized to retain (outside their heads) and classified information, or receive any from any of their old colleagues. And everyone knows this.

This is part of why the FL documents case was a Bridge Too Far. While these 51, plus perps like Schiff and Cheney (and likely Cheney the elder), the Clintons, Obama, etc, retain their security clearances, to get the case to work, the FJB WH ordered Trump’s security clearances revoked. Then, when they raided MAL, and conveniently found (supposedly) classified documents, he could be tried for violating the Espionage Act. (Except that the DOE didn’t get the memo quickly enough, so Trump still had their Q (equivalent to TS) clearance when the indictment was filed - another reason that case wasn’t going to trial anytime soon).

MacMacConnell said...

Biden should rent Madison Square Garden on Jan. 15th. He should invite the CIA, State, FBI, DOJ, White House staff, etc. ....... It could be a televised event hosted by George Clooney with late night host and Oprah. At the end of the show Oprah and Joe Biden will tell them all to look under their seats for their gifts.

Mason G said...

"But what about all the staffers and the career people who had to have been involved. What happens to them? They have to be wondering."

What happened at Abu Ghraib? Were the leaders held responsible? How about the worker bees?

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

Democrats (31%) are now the third party in America, behind Republicans (35%) and Independents (34%), based on party self-ID of actual voters in 2024. America has seen how Democrats govern and found it wanting.

Michael Fitzgerald said...

You said it. The limpdicks on this comment board advocating for Biden to pardon everyone because "That'll show 'em" are fucking delusional. When have party members been anything other than rabid, vicious partisans.
Do the idiots advocating for pardons really think jitbags like Freder and Cook and chuck/rich are going to be persuaded to fair-mindedness because their team was given pardons? They spend their days excusing and defending the criminals, illegals, rapists and assassins among their kind, but they'll definitely change their way of thinking if we just let them get away with it... Idiots.

Ampersand said...

Here in California, 56 percent of the voters just decided to elevate Adam Schiff to the Senate. That says everything you need to know about "our democracy" and "nobody is above the law". Pardoned or not, this guy will skate.
The best you can hope for is revelation of the truth.

Dogma and Pony Show said...

Here's something I think Trump REALLY ought to do: He should revoke the Presidential Medal of Freedom that Obama awarded to Biden. He can do this by executive order and there's not a thing Biden or anyone else can do about it. In the order, he can list a long series of the shameful things Biden has done while in office, including his pardon of Hunter and any other corrupt pardons Biden issues between now and Inauguration Day.

Revoking the award wouldn't come close to remedying all the bad things Biden has done, but it would send a powerful message. So why NOT do it?

Aggie said...

Yes, I think there might be some that are still drunk on election results. Closing borders and cutting spending and preserving tax cuts are priorities. There is plenty of room for other nuanced responses, though. The levers of government are not all gigantic, requiring a re-direction of resources on a grand scale.

For instance, you could immediately cancel all security clearances for that long list of troublemakers on Day 1, and formally forbid contact with people that work in classified areas on a policy level. If you suspected that there was any retained information, why there's always a nice armed pre-dawn raid to seize electronics and documents. Small teams, short list of 51 of the worst offenders. Then there are the internal policy shifts about communications chains and ruthless punishment of leakers. You could revoke clearances for those still in office that have been associated with leaking in the past - pending formal reassessment, which could take a long time. Starving information flow and stomping leaks wouldn't take many manhours, but would pay handsomely I think.

Bob Boyd said...

Who's we?

Freder Frederson said...

The cover up of the Khashoggi murder. Saudi Arabia gifting Jared Kushner $2 billion, violations of the emoluments clause (e.g., using his hotel in DC to launder bribes, charging market rate--not government rate--when his security detail stayed at his properties). Misuse of his foundation for self-dealing (you are obsessed with the Clinton foundation while ignoring worse behavior by Trump).

If you would like more examples, I could go on.

I could go on.

Jaq said...

That's a pretty good description of how the Democrats took Hillary's loss. Game theory says that if you don't use some tit for tat, you end up having a huge tat shoved right up your...

Anyway, that's what the people gaming out nuclear war escalation scenarios say, and it appears to be accepted wisdom after many experiments.

Still, I think that Trump showing them that the trials all backfired was a pretty reasonable response. but there is a lot of evidence on that laptop that a lot of real crimes, with real victims, were committed by Biden Père et Fils.

Peachy said...

Freder - Now tell us about Biden family corruption and Ukraine.

RideSpaceMountain said...

That is just petty enough that you know the dems would do it if the shoe was on the other foot, which is exactly why Trump should do it.

Make them live by their own petty rules.

Freder Frederson said...

You want to deprive 51 people (probably a whole lot more than that) of their security clearance simply because they had an opinion that differed from Trump's.

I guess we can throw your defense of "absolute free speech" out the window.

Mason G said...

If there are no serious consequences for what the Democrats have done, what, aside from guilty consciences, is there to stop them from doing it again the next time they get a chance?

Freder Frederson said...

Sorry, I don't give credence to Russian disinformation.

Earnest Prole said...

You know you’ve lost your soul when you start fantasizing about murdering your fellow citizens.

Peachy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Lem Vibe Bandit said...

They are discussing a heretofore unprecedented type of pardon and the president is not in on the discussion? 😏

Peachy said...

Fauci OKed torturing beagles, too. Yeah - a bullet is too nice. Too quick.

Virtue!

Peachy said...

Poor baby Freder. It's a chat room. Don't pee your pants - corruption supporter.

Bob Boyd said...

Trump will be issuing pardons of his own one these days soon, Freder.
He's not planning a thousand-year reich. He's not really Hitler. That's just scare-mongering for people operating on their emotions. You get that, right?

Peachy said...

Freder - The Biden family grift scheme isn't Russian Disinformation - you freak.
OMG. Drink more koolaid.

wendybar said...

You mean Trump is doing what Democrats and Republicans have ALWAYS done??/s Is it different that Trump is doing what the Bidens just got away with?? Why don't YOU prove it Freder. You talk big, you lie big, and you run and hide when asked to provide proof of your delusion.

wendybar said...

HEAR, HEAR!!! My name....I agree 100%

Peachy said...

Freder subscribes dutifully that all negative information about any Democrat - is "Russian Disinformation!"
Even though it is obvious and real (and Hunter was just given a pass back to 2014) - that the Biden family set up shell companies to hide their Ukrainian- Burisma family grift.

gspencer said...

'The beneficiaries know nothing,' one well-connected Democrat told me about those who could receive pardons...."

I don't believe that for a minute. Biden's been a grifter his entire political life. Initially he pandered to the credit card companies and their usurious wet dreams. These companies along with 000s of other national corporations have used Delaware as their state of incorporation because of DE's very favorable corporate laws.

To think that Biden would not be out there selling pardons is to ignore the nature of this repulsive person.

Mary Beth said...

accepting bribes from foreign nationals

Someone into crypto bought crypto? It's hard to guess why the news media doesn't want to cover that.

Big Mike said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

Weak sauce. Gee the impeachment committee shoulda hired you. By the way, "you are obsessed with the Clinton foundation" must be addressed to someone else, and has ironic overtones given your obvious and outsized Trump obsession. But yeah, the Clintons raped Haiti and redirected government contracts to do it.

Dogma and Pony Show said...

"Why not treat them with as much gravity and respect as the present administration is treating them?"

Because I'd kind of like to get back to being a nation of laws. I don't want the U.S. to become South Africa. Wallowing in stupid petulance is not how we make America great again.

narciso said...

Trying to make people accountable is bad, thanks for that bit of insight

Bruce Hayden said...

Of course not - which may be a problem. FJB seems to have a Short Timer’s attitude these days, which means that he seems more willing to tell his handlers to FO. He’s sayings now that he shouldn’t, and doesn’t seem to give a shit. They want him to do this to protect them, but why should he? He’s on the way out. His legacy (good, and, arguably, mostly bad) is set.

Nice said...

I always thought Pardons were based on crimes already committed. Now it seems wrong-doers secure a Pardon in advance of the wrongdoing. So, the Pardon has now become an Authorization, permission granted to go forward.

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

December 12, Delaware Federal Court judge Noreika has her say.

(The judge I refer to above is the LA judge who accepted the guilty plea for tax evasion and is scheduled to sentence Hunter December 16. He also is the one who wrote the scathing rebuttal to the pardon, pointing out it was long after Hunter was sober that he skipped payments and Hunter admitted in his plea that he had the funds but chose not to pay his taxes.)

Freder Frederson said...

You mean Trump is doing what Democrats and Republicans have ALWAYS done??

What Trump is doing is unprecedented. He has not signed an ethics agreement with the GSA. So until he does so, he can accept money from any one for his inauguration and pocket the money. So, while what he is doing is a grey area, it does allow him to ignore rules about accepting money from foreigners.

BG said...

What guilty consciences??

Freder Frederson said...

So, being in a chat room indemnifies you from federal law?

Leland said...

You know you’ve lost your soul when you start fantasizing about murdering your fellow citizens.

Is that you, Taylor Lorenz?

Narayanan said...

81 million co-conspirators??? how long to print up that many copies ?

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

I suppose when Trump's appointee runs the USSS they could just reduce the personnel guarding Joe and his family. Obviously Freder endorses that move since he hasn't condemned it. If such personnel reduction happens coincidental to a murderous nutjob stalking Joe that would just be a no-fault mistake, like Butler, PA was, right? Like the golf course in FL was, right? Just a big oopsie. No one fired. No one demoted. Just like Joe's admin did it.

Narayanan said...

can they all get 007 status?

lonejustice said...

Well, Trump awarded Fauci with a Presidential Commendation for his work on Covid, so he's got that going for him.

Peachy said...

It's illegal to wish corrupt democrats dead?

Goetz von Berlichingen said...

Republicans should start impeachment proceedings against FJB and make it very broad, pulling in Fauci, the Biden Crime Syndicate, Shitty Schiff, and others as material witnesses/participants. CONUS doesn't allow pardons for those involved in impeachments.
Goetz von Berlichingen

Breezy said...

It would serve them right to be left exposed to indictments. Just desserts from Biden.

Freder Frederson said...

This has not been true since the Nixon pardon. Unfortunately, nobody was interested in determining whether Ford violated the constitution for pardoning Nixon for all crimes, whether he had been charged or not. Now we have to live with the consequences of that failure to push back.

Trump also pardoned alleged war criminals before they had their court martial.

tolkein said...

Freder, that's not what the article said. Bet you hoped we'd just take your word. The Independent, once a respectable newspaper, is now a leftist rag.

gilbar said...

serious Question..
is there? (was there? (WILL there be?)) ANYTHING as sleazy as this?
EVER?

This would be like President James Buchanan pardoning his Secretary of War Floyd (who had sent HUGE amounts of guns and ammo down to southern arsenals that were COMPLETELY undefended before resigning his commission and becoming a General Officer in the CSA)
Of course, EVEN Buchanan never did such a thing..

Extra Serious Question: WHO is the most worse, most vile, most EVIL President EVER?

tolkein said...

Freder, which alleged war criminals? Alleged by whom?

Mason G said...

Exactly.

Narayanan said...

can pardons ensure they can retain fruits of crimes?

tommyesq said...

To be fair, at least a third of those 81 million are already dead and do not need a pardon.

WWMartin said...

Do any of the proposed pardonees (sorry for the neologism) have any information that could threaten Joe Biden? If not, that seriously reduces the incentive and the likelihood they will get the pardons.

gilbar said...

just to be clear..
There is NO "double standard"
There is (and Always Will Be) Only The Single Standard*

The Single Standard* Democrats can do WHATEVER they want, and "the rule of law" is the Democrats RULING

Freder Frederson said...

Freder, that's not what the article said.

Technically, you are correct, the article never calls the payment a bribe. But if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck.

Goetz von Berlichingen said...

Biden can be impeached even out of office, I believe. I suspect that a legal case could be made to revoke any pardons for individuals who were part of the activities that led to the impeachments. That brings FHB back into the picture.
Goetz

Freder Frederson said...

<a href="https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-issues-pardons-service-members-accused-war-crimes/story?id=67055490>Sheesh, you haven't been paying attention</a>

Goetz von Berlichingen said...

Gilbar - Worst? Obama. Then Jeff Davis. Then Buchanan. Then Wilson.
Goetz

Enigma said...

"Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest" -- King Henry II regarding the soon to be assassinated Thomas Becket (Year 1170)

Freder Frederson said...

He also pardoned three murderers who worked for Blackwater.

ga6 said...

Howard wants closed borders? Who knew.

Peachy said...

but yet - you cannot name the crimes with any sort of specificity of accuracy. . We can articulate Biden family crimes with ease.

Readering said...

Hunter Biden is not being sentenced following his pardon.

Hassayamper said...

Hang every single Party member who gets pardoned, starting with Biden's piece of shit son and finishing with the Big Guy" himself.

Chill, Winston. Let's let things play out, and not hand ammunition to our enemies.

Some of these people are going to be thoroughly ruined by the civil lawsuits for fraud, official oppression under color of law, and so forth. Trump is not going to grant them qualified immunity, either. And if they refuse to testify he'll get them for criminal contempt of court/contempt of Congress, and if they lie, they will go down on perjury charges, and if they destroy documents they'll face obstruction of justice charges.

Vigilante violence will take the heat off these scumbags and diminish the chances of systemic reform that will destroy the Left's chances of ever doing this stuff again.

Butkus51 said...

Peter O'Toole. And Richard Burton as Beckett. I wasnt expecting to like that movie. Just happened to come across and watched. A few days after Lawrence of Arabia.

Freder Frederson said...

We can articulate Biden family crimes with ease.

You can articulate them but you have no proof.

And I articulated some the crimes above.

Clyde said...

They seem to be shifting from pardons to indulgences.

Hassayamper said...

I think that would be at odds with the Founders' understanding of the nature and scope of the pardon power under common law.

So would pardons for unnamed and unknown past crimes, I suspect, if it ever goes to the USSC. And maybe even for those (like Ford's pardon for Nixon and Jimmy Carter's pardon for draft dodgers) for known or accused crimes not yet fully adjudicated.

I think it would be healthier for the country if malefactors had to go through their entire trial and sentencing before a pardon could be issued. Especially if their crimes were committed while they were drawing salary from the taxpayers.

Michael Fitzgerald said...

One would think that in our current condition of defunding the police then watching crime skyrocket, the people cheering on Pardons and Reconciliation would simply open their eyes to the cause and effect, amend their opinions to one of common sense.

Paul said...

"Big Daddy" Biden is waiting for his 10 % before he gives any pardons..

narciso said...

Kushner who was prosecuted by windbag Christie who gave us Chris Wray,

Original Mike said...

"You can articulate them but you have no proof."

The House Committee on Oversight and Accountability has established through banking records the receipt and distribution to Biden family members of over $20M from foreign entities in Ukraine, Russia, China, Romania, and Kazakhstan. This isn't a hill you want to die on.

Howard said...

Hi Karen 🙋

Saint Croix said...

Michael Fitzgerald, I don't for a second believe that you're a Republican, or a Trump voter. You stink of a phony scam artist and an unemployed leftist, typing from his mama's basement. Again, be quiet, and let the adults have honest discussions.

Aggie said...

"Because I'd kind of like to get back to being a nation of laws...."

I understand your point, but I am also well aware of its practical limits. The consent of the governed for a nation of laws must also include the participation of the governors, in good faith, from both sides. There's not a whole lot of that on the ground right now, is there? How would anybody propose such a return when the opposition is implacably violating its norms in the most cynical way possible, and shows no sign of change - even in defeat?

Saint Croix said...

No. They'd only be immune for their speech. It's not a blanket immunity. Destruction of public records would be a crime, and you could charge them with that. Might have to impeach them first, not quite sure.

Howard said...

No one in their right mind wants a closed border. Sensible people want an appropriate filter mechanism.

Ann Althouse said...

Do not go boldly....

Big Mike said...

@Peachy, right the second time.

I subscribe to Matt Taibbi's substack. Here's what he has to say:

They’re laughing at us now. From Politico:

"White House officials… are carefully weighing the extraordinary step of handing out blanket pardons to those who’ve committed no crimes… [worried] it could suggest impropriety, only fueling Trump’s criticisms, and because those offered preemptive pardons may reject them… mentioned by Biden’s aides for a pardon is Anthony Fauci, the former head of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases who became a lightning rod for criticism from the right during the Covid-19 pandemic."

If Anthony Fauci gets a “blanket” pardon, he’ll wrap himself and sleep in it. Plan B was living under an assumed name in Argentina, dressed in the Anthony Hopkins vacation suit from Silence of the Lambs. Throughout the pandemic the NIAID head showed he was willing to do anything, from shuttering schools to lying to Congress to making private campaign stops at intelligence agencies to urge investigators off his path, to keep the ick of scandal off his person. He won’t reject squat.

The Politico piece by Jonathan Martin might be the first of the era that needs to be read entirely between the lines. White House officials are “carefully weighing” preemptive pardons really means White House officials already decided, but are publicly floating the idea. Pardons for “those who’ve committed no crimes” means those who’ve committed crimes. “Could suggest impropriety” is would admit impropriety. Criticism from “the right” is criticism from all
.

[Emphasis in the original}

West TX Intermediate Crude said...

Joe Biden is actually playing 4 dimensional chess here.
He says he is pardoning Hunter, and puts out the famed press release, but does not sign the official paperwork to effect the pardon. Hunter goes to prison, as the judge sticks strictly to the law.
Hunter then tries to blackmail his father by revealing all the details of Joe's involvement in Hunter's crimes.
Joe then tells the country that they should pay no mind to Hunter's accusations; after all, he's a convicted felon, no better than that other guy (the orange one).
Joe then pardons himself, this time signing the papers for real, and lives out his life with his share of the proceeds of Hunter's corruption over the past decades.
Maybe Joe does the same "press release pardon" for Schiff, Fauci, and all the other Democrats who screwed him out of the second term he so richly deserved.

chuck said...

Do they get a "I Was Pardoned" sticker?

Saint Croix said...

I think all the lawfare against Trump backfired spectacularly.

I think if Trump acts like Democrats -- a really moronic suggestion -- it also will backfire spectacularly.

You don't arrest people to affect elections. You arrest people because they committed crimes. It's a sad day when people think we should act like Democrats. No, they are shit-for-brains, and losers. We are better than they are. Full stop.

The Middle Coast said...

Weird case re: Cheney et. al., huh? A congressperson lies to Congress, future Congress refers to DOJ for perjury, but the president pardons. What’s left for Congress to do? Have witnesses give up their right to a pardon if they are convicted of perjury? There is a jail cell somewhere on Capitol Hill, right?

Saint Croix said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mason G said...

"No, they are shit-for-brains, and losers."

Okay. Say that's so. But still... if there are no consequences of any significance (for example, "Let there be no jail time"), they have accomplished at least a portion of their goal at little to no cost to themselves (Their actions make them look bad? So what? They don't care what you think and their supporters will go along with whatever they do just like always.) True- they didn't stop Trump, but on the other hand, have clearly shown others who might not have Trump's resources and resolve what can be expected next time should anyone dare interfere with their plans for ruling the country.

What is the incentive for them to do otherwise?

Leland said...

You still don't get it Saint Croix. Trump isn't interested in arresting Democrats. He made that clear during the election when he talked about the "lock her up" chants and the fact he didn't pursue Hillary. However, he is interested in showing the public how corrupt the Democrats really are.

Here's what you are missing. If Biden doesn't pardon these people, then yes, arrests and other measures may be necessary. If Biden pardons them, then Trump will be free to pursue the investigation without the claim you are making that he's acting like Democrats.

Besides, you are still wrong about the point of investigations. It isn't to affect elections. It is to enact the appropriate policy. The government has claimed it needs various powers that it has abused. That abuse needs to be shown, so those powers can be stripped from those that so willingly abuse them. Again, no arrests or jail time is necessary. What is necessary is removal of power that they abuse. Pardons will simply make it easier.

Also, the lawfare against Trump only backfired because Trump went through the trial. We all saw the evidence, and the evidence backfired because it was obvious bullshit:
Trump raped E. Jean Carroll? Nope, jury said he didn't, but the judge tried to pretend he did, and the whole thing is based on her story and no physical evidence.
Trump defrauded banks? Nope, banks said they got paid everything back, and Appeals Court is likely to toss the ruling.
Trump ran a racket in Georgia? Nope, it now appears the DA was running the racket and taking trips on the taxpayers.
Trump committed election interference? Looks like that case is going to get tossed.
I can go on but the point in all cases is the trial exposed the truth, and the truth showed where the actual corruption lied. It is possible that a trial of the people the left wants to pre-pardon will show they were clean, in which case, I hope it does. I rather find out I was wrong about how corrupt they are. But I doubt that's what we will find.

Lem Vibe Bandit said...

This could also serve as a distraction from the other democratic preoccupations like finding a scapegoat for the Biden Kamala debacle.

My scapegoat candidate list is short. Obama, Pelosi, Biden and Kamala.

n.n said...

We should be wary of forward-looking redistributive/retributive change that will progress as an Ouroboros process that will consume us all. Make amends with the persecuted, prosecute the criminal, and strive to mitigate future recurrence.

Saint Croix said...

People don't cheer after pardons. It makes them mad. That's why Ford lost the election in 1976, people were mad about his blanket pardon of Nixon.

Nobody's cheering the pardon of Biden's son. Haven't you noticed?

There's a Republican Senator out in South Dakota who apparently thinks the head of the FBI, Wray, is great and should stay in office. If Biden pardons Wray for crimes committed at the FBI, that opinion will no longer be tenable. Trump's going to fire him either way. But the pardon -- and the perception that Wray might have done some criminal shit at FBI -- will make it easier to confirm Patel and clean up the bureau.

Any pardons that Biden does of high-ranking Democrats will strengthen Trump and make his crusade easier to accomplish.

Antiantifa said...

Adam Schiff and others are already being sued by people involved in the J6 hearings because Schiff and others walked out of closed-door hearings and told reporters various people said things, incriminating things, they never said. Schiff did not apparently realize the transcripts would later be released and prove he made these statements up. People lost jobs. Some lawyers involved had to defend against attempted disbarment as a result of these lies. It is not just Trump going after them. It would be a terrible abuse of the system to give them all blanket pardons.

tcrosse said...

I beg your pardon. I didn't promise you a rose garden.

Freder Frederson said...

I can go on but the point in all cases is the trial exposed the truth

Too bad the juries disagreed with your assessment of the evidence.

Saint Croix said...

if there are no consequences of any significance (for example, "Let there be no jail time"), they have accomplished at least a portion of their goal at little to no cost to themselves

What did they accomplish? Seriously. If they had simply ignored Trump, the loser of the 2020 election, then that would have been the end of him. I don't think he would have been the nominee. But they could not leave him alone. I'm of the strong opinion that all the lawfare and criminal attacks on Trump made him stronger. So that's the #1 lesson: commit lawfare against your political opponent and watch yourself get booted out of office by the American people.

It's insane to try to impeach somebody multiple times. If Trump acts as Democrats did, it will weaken him, and make him look petty and vindictive. It will make him look like Democrats. Take the high road, Mr. Trump!

It's hard to prosecute your political opponents and look good doing it. I'm not saying nobody in the Biden administration committed crimes. They probably did! But it will be a hellish thing trying to prove it. And the quest for vengeance will harm what should be his #1 goal -- shrink the federal government and drain the swamp.

I think a bunch of Biden pardons will be an acknowledgment that his administration was criminal and corrupt. And it will make Trump's job a lot easier. And a lot of dark, secret shit might come out in the open, since a pardon means you can no longer plead the 5th.

Bruce Hayden said...

“ Bruce, aren't you an attorney? You must be a really crappy one. Otherwise you would know advocating the murder of the attorney general or other government official is also illegal. And if you actually attempt the assassination your looking at 20 years in federal prison. I guess Trump could pardon you, but what would that mean for the rule of law in this country?”

I remember when so much of (your) left was giddy with the possibility of killing Trump and others, esp if he could be imprisoned and then Epsteined. So, are current government officials the only ones this applies to? Great. String up Fauci. He retired quite (extremely) handsomely. If that were indeed the law, then I could just modify my post by suggesting that they be strung up after they cease to be public officials. Which would be the case anyway.

But that isn’t how this works. Advocating the death of anyone, absent more, is pure speech. Which puts it at the core of the 1st Amdt. We see these days, with our Mother Country, why this is so necessary, as they continue to ratchet up limitations on politically disfavored pure speech. Because, it’s a small step between speech police and thought police.

For speech, under the 1st Amdt, to be criminally actionable, there must be something more. Often, that means some Actus Rea. Something well beyond mere public demand, that increases the likelyhood that that person will be killed. Such as a conspiracy to commit the killing, aiding and abetting it, etc.

John said...

Bribes for pardons is likely the Biden family's only chance at real cash from here on out.

donald said...

Jesus, I didn’t even think about selling them.

Josephbleau said...

“For the good of the state, and at my command, the bearer of this pardon has done what they have done.”

Mason G said...

"What did they accomplish? Seriously."

Seriously? Ok- here: They showed people what to expect if you get in their way. Do you think there is anybody who's paid any attention at all who doesn't understand what they'd be up against if they chose to threaten Democratic rule?

"If they had simply ignored Trump, the loser of the 2020 election, then that would have been the end of him. I don't think he would have been the nominee. But they could not leave him alone. I'm of the strong opinion that all the lawfare and criminal attacks on Trump made him stronger."

They used the same lawfare against others. How strong is Rudy Giuliani looking these days? As I already noted, most people don't have the available resources to defend themselves against the sort of attacks that Trump has.

"So that's the #1 lesson: commit lawfare against your political opponent and watch yourself get booted out of office by the American people."

If they had managed to scare Trump off (or kill him), do you suppose it's possible the election might have gone a different way? With everything that's actually happened, the idiot Democrat candidate still managed to get 75 million votes.

And now, here's my question for you: If there are no consequences for Democrats aside from losing an election, why do you think they won't go back to 'business as usual' as soon as they think they can get away with it?

Ralph L said...

When my doctor pushed me again in September to get a vax booster, somehow I ended up saying "Fauci belongs in prison" quite grumpily. Doc didn't like that.

John said...

Buchanan, Wilson, and Biden are neck-and-neck, but Joe still has a few weeks.

Josephbleau said...

No matter the jibber jabber, mass pardon of your political subordinates is not tenable politically. No common supporter of a political party will allow themselves to be identified with such corruption. No such supporter will allow Beiden to treat them as stupid toadies.

What would be better is for these noble public servants to wait until Trump unjustly persecutes them and then become heroic martyrs. That is how you develop followers.

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