Write Bruce Ackerman and Gerard Magliocca (in The Washington Post).
Legislation already proposed by Democratic Reps. Debbie Wasserman Schultz (Fla.) and Jamie B. Raskin (Md.) would grant special jurisdiction to a three-judge federal court in the District of Columbia to determine, within three months, whether Trump’s involvement in the assault on Capitol Hill amounted to an “insurrection.” The panel’s decision would receive automatic Supreme Court review.
This is urgent business. If Congress does not move quickly to enact the Schultz-Raskin proposal, the issue of Trump’s political future will drag into 2024, when the next election will rev into high gear and courts will be inclined to let the voters decide.
Yes, hurry up! Wouldn't want to leave it to the voters to decide. Democracy is at stake.
You know, I wish Trump would go away. But these efforts to subvert the democratic process using the courts and the 14th amendment are not the way to make it happen. I know there's a tremendous fear that if allowed to run for President, Trump might win. But if you give into that fear and look for some way other than fighting him politically, you are blatantly displaying your mistrust of democracy.
Posts
134 comments:
While you’re at it, torpedo Kari Lake too!
What is WRONG with these people
These Dems are much more optimistic about Trump's chances in 2024 than most conservatives are.
They've never trusted Democracy. That's why they needed to "fortify" it back in 2020. Why they needed to censor discussions of COVID and the Hunter Biden laptop. Why they spent two years investigating Trump over Russian collusion which the FBI knew was bogus from the beginning.
C’mon Man, Ann: nothing shows how much one is committed to Democracy and the Rule of Law more than banning one’s strongest opponent from even running for office!
Is criminal prosecution required? Until he is convicted of the specific crime of "insurrection" he is innocent of any crime.
How could he possibly be prevented from running because of insurrection if he is not guilty of it?
Or have we gone full fascist now where as John Brennan of the Cia said
"People are innocent, you know, until alleged to be involved in criminal activity"
John Henry
You know Althouse, you vote for these people. You support them with subscriptions.
And the person who is taking them on...you want to go away.
"Democracy" only "works" when it produces the results that rather hard-core leftists want. This is particularly true of those people -- perhaps 25 percent of the population -- for whom "the state" is their functional religion. Thus court decisions like Dobbs are "anti-democracy", even though its very essence was to put the issue into the hands of voters, where it has always belonged.
People NEED To REALIZE.. That an assault on the democrat Party, is an assault on DEMOCRACY!!
No One! Not ANYONE, has ANY right to deny the Party ANY Thing it desires.
You EXIST to SERVE THE PARTY.
The living constitution, Clearly states; that Any attempt to usurp the Party is TREASON
"The panel’s decision would receive automatic Supreme Court review." That'll work.
"you are blatantly displaying your mistrust of democracy." Where in the world did you get the idea that these people believe in democracy?
You know, I wish Trump would go away.
Me, too. But his opponents are worse.
But these efforts to subvert the democratic process using the courts and the 14th amendment are not the way to make it happen.
It's enough for me to root for him to win again, then change the constitution so he can run and win and again, over and over, until he's older than Strom Thurmond. Trump eternal.
One of the lawyers here will know more but it does not seem like a 3 judge panel is a "trial" to which our president emeritus would seem constitutionally entitled
It seems to explicitly be a way to avoid a trial. It seems like a kangaroo court.
It seems fascist, like something mussolini would do to a political enemy.
John Henry
The truth has always been that even a conviction of Trump would not prevent him from being President.
Everyone know that truth. But the process is the goal. Not some outcome.
Democrat voters crave the act of being lied to, on a never ending conveyor belt of lies.
I’d like Trump to stand down, although I agree most with his policy positions.
He’s too old. He showed no ability to counter the Democrats’ lawfare assault, so I don’t expect him to do any better given another chance. It seems like every one of his bureaucratic underlings undercut him and tried to sabotage him. This doesn’t happen to a competent CEO.
At some point, you have to consider that this might be indicative of incurable weaknesses.
Trump obviously would have won in 2020 in a non-sabotaged election. I don’t have any personal loyalty to any politician, so redressing that wrong is not on my agenda.
It's been a race to the bottom to see who can turn out the most low information voters for a while now. Trump turned the thing into professional wrestling lite and sent that into overdrive. That may be what passes as democracy these days, but I don't trust it and I can't imagine the founders would have either (I might even go so far as to say that it objectively produces bad results).
Decades of "absolute," "urgent," and "end of the world" messaging on the left destroyed moderation and critical thinking. This dates back at minimum to the 1980s shift in documentaries from facts to blatant propaganda (i.e., Michael Moore's "Roger and Me"; Al Gore's "An Inconvenient Truth"). This happened against a backdrop of incoherent hate speech laws (Who determines hate versus consequential actions? Is hatred of Nazis and murderers bad hate? Etc.), and demands for tolerance of alternative viewpoints even when they fully contradict one another (e.g., "TERFs" versus transgender rights; protecting children against sexual exploitation versus supporting "minor attracted people," etc).
From the Democrats, the one-time "science" party...
Trump correctly called BS and precipitated widespread mental snapping on the left. You truly can't have it all, and even rude, crude, backward Trump was right sometimes. Affected people must process and resolve all this or they'll spend the rest of their lives tilting at windmills and then dying in misery.
(That being said, it still seems to be the worst system, except for all the others (although I'm not sure why I feel the need to qualify that when Trump's cult is so heavily rooted in mistrust of democracy).
I have no fear that Trump might win.
He is a gift to the democrat party.
If Biden's win was "real" - then what are they worried about?
An old crooked lying plagiarist hair sniffing dementia patent beat Trump.
If the left cheat to win - what are they worried about?
The dems can Chicago-the vote and cheat to win forever.
---But if you give into that fear and look for some way other than fighting him politically, you are blatantly displaying your mistrust of democracy. [AA]
An epic understatement at this point, Madame Hostess.
Be careful, Mister Blue. This phase you're going through...
Raskin is also using his J6 Committee press to agitate for the repeal of the Electoral College. The undeniable fact that this would be unconstitutional except by amendment, as well as the irony that this makes him an "election denier," is obviously lost on him.
The big donors are already deciding on 2024 and they are abandoning Trump. That’s what will stop him. Again, as Ann said, democracy will be speaking….and the votes are being cast in dollars.
It's always playing to the outrage segment of your base instead of persuading the other side. The clickbait industry depends on it.
Bruce Ackerman: This is urgent business. If Congress does not move quickly to enact the Schultz-Raskin proposal, the issue of Trump’s political future will drag into 2024, when the next election will rev into high gear and courts will be inclined to let the voters decide
What an arrogant asshole this guy is. Corrupt swap creature.
Althouse wrote: You know, I wish Trump would go away. But these efforts to subvert the democratic process using the courts and the 14th amendment are not the way to make it happen.
But this is exactly why people who wanted Trump to "go away" chose to ignore the obvious 2020 voter fraud that installed Biden and fulfilled their wish. Even when it took place in their own backyard...(ballot harvesting in the park, Madison, WI). Now it's baked in and it's worse than it was. What happened to election day voters in 2022 Maricopa Co. AZ was blatant and corrupt, and our compromised courts proved once again they do not provide relief.
Anybody that chose to look the other way in 2020, has to live with the same consequences as those that wanted to address the fraud. Texas vs PA was a chance at the time, but the Supreme Court cowered. Now we have a federal gov't completely unaccountable to the voters and the people...selling us out to the WEF, UN, and WHO. Welcome to liberal utopia. We're probably fucked. It's fun, isn't it???
You can't wring your hands now and pretend to support a "democratic" process that you watched get flushed down the toilet in 2020, using COVID lies as its catalyst. Sorry. You fucked up. All because of Trump hatred, and disdain for the working class voters that support him. For many people, liberal women in particular, calming their sensibilities is more important than the process, the outcome...or democracy.
Enjoy your never ending proxy wars. They're here to stay. Don't forget to get your mRNA booster!! Stay home, save lives!! Rock on!!!
Shouting T - I agree.
"Double secret probation, sir?"
...would grant special jurisdiction to a three-judge federal court in the District of Columbia to determine, within three months, whether Trump’s involvement in the assault on Capitol Hill amounted to an “insurrection.”
"And that foot is me."
It’s been true for decades that truth in advertising laws could and should be used to force the Democratic Party to change its name.
The best thing that has happened to Dems is losing the House. Four years of unfettered progressivism would make a return to Trump seem positively nostalgic.
Shouting Thomas said...Trump obviously would have won in 2020 in a non-sabotaged election. I don’t have any personal loyalty to any politician, so redressing that wrong is not on my agenda.
But it was a sabotaged election and Trump did win. It's just make believe to pretend we can go back to 2016 when and actual vote count and outcome surprised the corrupt establishment and elected Trump CONSITUTIONALLY. 2016 That's the last "real" Presidential election you will ever see in your lifetime.
This can't be redressed, or addressed...so here we are. It's time to "move on". As Americans we will spend the rest of our lives pretending we live in a democracy. Really, been pretending since November 22, 1963.
It’s Easier To Fool People Than To Convince Them That They’ve Been Fooled
“I know there's a tremendous fear that if allowed to run for President, Trump might win.”
Yes, I’m pretty certain that the Democrats will march out their paramilitary Brownshirts, BLM, to torch our cities again. They will undoubtedly sabotage the 2024 election. They will seek to punish us with economic sabotage. Dems might even set loose another pandemic.
So, yeah, I’m tremendously fearful… of what our Nazi Party, the Democrats, will do.
The Dems got smart. A criminal case against Trump would tear the nation apart and make him a martyr.
But how does a federal court have jurisdiction to decide this? A declaratory judgment isn't the right procedure.
2 primaries, 2 generals and counting
In any court case, the first issue is always jurisdiction.
The left get off on their addiction to Trump. that is the incurable disease.
Democracy Dies in Democratic Defecation…
you are blatantly displaying your mistrust of democracy. [AA]
You're supposed to mistrust democracy. History and our Founding Fathers tell us it always fails. That's why our Founding Fathers created a republic that included several features designed to limit or negate democracy. Our republic has become weaker and weaker as we have eliminated these protections and become more democratic.
Begin by repealing the last three Progressive Amendments.
Trump cannot have a legitimate second term unless there is a judicial determination that he did not engage in insurrection. This expedited process would serve his interests too, except that he is not interested in legitimacy.
Trump would very effectively go away if people simply ignored him, which makes me wonder exactly how interested all the folks who continue to make him the center of the political universe are in stopping him.
When the Democrats have lost Ann Althouse, ………
Btw, I think it's a _good_ thing if some liberals are saying that we should not be trying to put our political opposition in prison on trumped-up charges, whatever their reasons. It would be nice if they understood that doing so would destroy the Republic, but I'll take what I can get.
"Legislation already proposed by Democratic Reps. Debbie Wasserman Schultz (Fla.) and Jamie B. Raskin (Md.) would grant special jurisdiction to a three-judge federal court in the District of Columbia to determine, within three months, whether Trump’s involvement in the assault on Capitol Hill amounted to an “insurrection.”
So, a Star Chamber then.
WaPo piece is behind the paywall.
Can someone tell me how these guys deal with jurisdiction?
And automatic SCOTUS review? What's that about?
Is it all in the bill?
It's not even clear that, for purposes of Section 3 of the 14th Amendment, Trump has ever been "an officer of the United States." Depends on how that term is defined. This point was analyzed just a year ago by Tillman & Blackman in the NYU Journal of Law & Liberty. If their argument is correct, then a court might quickly determine that the case for barring Trump from seeking government office cannot even be pursued.
I want Trump to go away. I agree with many of his issues. He hand a wonderful opportunity. He blew it.
He is a low class billionaire. I equate him with some gazillionaire athlete. Has money, but no class.
While I believe in democracy and the voters deciding, I am "law and order" and believe in "rule of law".
These hoodlums in Chicago and San Francisco, I want them in court and tried. Maybe Trump should be treated likewise.
I maintain that Trump will not win the 2024 R nomination and that if he did win the R nomination he will lose worse than he did in 2020.
Peggy Noonan wrote "When Character was King" about Ronald Reagan. No such book will be written about Trump.
"[C]ourts will be inclined to let the voters decide." Letting voters decide didn't seem to be a problem for the Washington Post, et al. as it concerned suits filed by the Trump campaign after the 2020 election, just as, for the same people, it was a problem after the 2000 election.
Oh Goodie! A blatant admission that "democracy" is not the goal of the dems. Isn't that why the founders set America as a constituyional Republic? Something said about "keeping it"?
Ready for the Night Rallies?
Insurrection! - Amazing - not a single armed protestor.
There was a leading Democrat who not long ago said something something if they win we all hang…and they probably should. Best not to risk it….
"these efforts to subvert the democratic process"
It's prog MO: subverting democracy to save "our democracy." Been that way since, oh, Woodrow W at least.
This is urgent business. If Congress does not move quickly to enact the Schultz-Raskin proposal, the issue of Trump’s political future will drag into 2024, when the next election will rev into high gear and courts will be inclined to let the voters decide.
The Babylon Bee has Bruce Ackerman's number:
Democrats Warn That American People May Tamper With Next Election
POLITICS
Jan 23, 2020 · BabylonBee.com
WASHINGTON, D.C. - In his opening statement at Trump's impeachment trial, Rep. Adam Schiff reminded the Senate of their solemn duty and the gravity of just what it is they will be discussing at the trial.
Schiff warned that if Trump is not impeached, the American people may have a chance to tamper with the next election.
"If President Trump is not impeached, the American people might get a say in who is president," Schiff said gravely. "We simply can't allow that to happen. We must diligently defend our electoral process against electoral outcomes we do not like. If that means seizing power through a sham impeachment trial, so be it."
"When the Founders wrote that founding document thing, they never imagined there would be electoral outcomes that Democrats did not agree with."
They've never trusted Democracy.
Not true, they do trust democracy to arrive at the result desired by the electorate. Their problem is that they know that the electorate does not want them.
Is criminal prosecution required? Until he is convicted of the specific crime of "insurrection" he is innocent of any crime.
How could he possibly be prevented from running because of insurrection if he is not guilty of it?
It doesn't matter. Wait until mid-2024, then announce that he's ineligible via the proposed sham "court." States will fall into line to keep him off the ballot, and the courts will drag out the process until the election is over. If SCOTUS finds in December of 2024 that Trump was unconstitutionally denied a spot on the ballot, whatareyagonnado?
WaPo should tell us more about their knowledge in the death of Democracy.
When the Democrats have lost Ann Althouse, ………
Assumes facts not in evidence...
You know, I wish Trump would go away. But these efforts to subvert the democratic process using the courts and the 14th amendment are not the way to make it happen. I know there's a tremendous fear that if allowed to run for President, Trump might win. But if you give into that fear and look for some way other than fighting him politically, you are blatantly displaying your mistrust of democracy.
I hope he never goes away. He's a necessary evil. Like the medieval fool, he speaks the truth. But unlike the fool he acts on it. It isn't the fear of Trump that dives this insanity. It's the fear of those that voted for him. The people that are doing this to Trump are afraid of you. You vote the wrong way for the wrong people. I don't trust democracy either, Ann. Democracy is the mob. Democracy is special courts, lynchings. The absence of the rule of law.
What we are seeing, by the left, is the brute force of "democracy". The comic fumbling of this administration and its agencies and the brute force of suppression if you dare say anything out loud. Stalin's Russia was a democracy. The Stolypin cars were filled to bursting with people who were democratically tried and convicted.
Sometimes as I read this blog I think; Who here would run down to the "Offices of the Organs of State Security" to turn you in for wrongspeak? Who here would happily engage in painful interrogation? Who here would gleefully shove you, with a cattle prod, onto the Stolypin cars?
I know what YOU mean by 'democracy, Ann. But to the usual suspects it means fascism.
You know, I wish Trump would go away.
Yes, we know. But have you have ever articulated why for the edification of your readers? Is it because, as an elitist professor at an elitist university you are appalled that plumbers and trash collectors and and hair dressers and toxically masculine working men who get dirt under their fingernails made out relatively well during his term of office, partly at the expense of limousine liberals living in high tax locales claiming the SALT deduction on their taxes?
Or is it the same as with Elon Musk — the New York Times told you to hate Donald Trump, so like one of Pavlov’s dogs you respond to the bell?
"I know there's a tremendous fear that if allowed to run for President, Trump might win." So -- Back to cheap gas, low inflation, and a rock-bottom unemployment rate?
Ann, I totally agree with you on this point. Trump can only be diminished at the ballot box. Us Democrats should give him and his followers more shellackings in the upcoming elections. That is the only thing that hurts them.
"But if you give into that fear and look for some way other than fighting him politically, you are blatantly displaying your mistrust of democracy."
More like contempt for democracy.
I hope he never goes away. He's a necessary evil. Like the medieval fool, he speaks the truth. But unlike the fool he acts on it. It isn't the fear of Trump that dives this insanity. It's the fear of those that voted for him. The people that are doing this to Trump are afraid of you.
We've been saying for six years that Trump is the symptom, not the cause. The political and managerial class have so badly fucked up the system that they were given, that they spent their lives trying to get in charge of, and Trump was the backlash. The problem is that they haven't learned a damn thing. Hoping that Trump will just go away is like hoping that if you just don't talk about Pop's drinking, Suzy's infidelity, or Tommy's latest criminal behavior, it will somehow no longer be a problem. Until the political/managerial class are willing to admit their mistakes, reverse course on their idiotic policies, and show some humility and respect moving forward, you're going to keep getting Trump, or someone worse.
"I know there's a tremendous fear that if allowed to run for President, Trump might win."
You fear the voice of the people acting in, like, a democratic way in choosing the president?
I'll ask Pratt House to send out asap an application form for your membership to the CFR.
At most, Trump was insurrection-ish.
Worst insurrection ever.
More shots fired into Biden's juice port.
Release ALL the footage.
The Democrats have already won with you, Professor. Why do you not welcome a candidate who has the support of half the country (actually more, but not essential to my argument). By filling the news with how bad Trump is, they hope many like you just get worn down and give up on democracy.
I’d like to see you list all the unconstitutional actions Trump took as president (I think none) and compare to a similar list for Biden. Then we’ll see who is the real threat to the rule of law.
MSM: TrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrump
MSM: Why can't Trump go away? We're so tired of him.
MSM: Oh wait, did you hear what Trump did/said?!
TrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrumpTrump
Going the pedo route
ok
THe Liberal/Left wants to win. By any means neccessary. They live in the real world of power, not principle. They use words as weapons, and use them to gain power to change society.
What the center-right wants, I have no idea.
Going the pedo route
ok
Where are you from,charles? Not the US apparently.
The govt has to prove guilt. Pedjt does not have to prove his Innocence
Take your fascism back where ever you came from.
John Henry
Election Denier Jaime Raskin can kiss my ass. HE is the problem. Him and all the other liars that can do whatever they want in Congress with no consequences. Fuck them all. I wish a meteor would fall upon DC while they were in session. Wouldn't bother me in the least. THEY did this to me.
And how do you decide someone has engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the United States or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof? By holding a genuine real trial before a jury and convicting them of the same. A legislature cannot vote a person haa done so. A single judge cannot declare it so. Requires a trail and conviction. Now impeachment and conviction on those charges would certainly count since that is a trial. But they've already impeached him twice and he's been found not guilty twice. Do they think theyll be successful in a third attempt while he's out of office? I inderstand there are many legal schoars who think someone who isn't currently in office can still be impeached and tried, and others who scoff at the idea...
A traial and conviction are a prerequisite for use of the 14th amendment. Possibly an open admission of having done so would be good enough without a trial, but I don't see that happening.
People trying to stop Trump from running are likely foreign assets trying to influence our elections, said no one ever.
(I heard the latest Substack "America This Week," with Matt Taibbi and Walter Kirn)
"Wouldn't want to leave it to the voters to decide"
Quaint notion, that. Especially with exposure of guvmint censoring public discourse while dismissing concerns over a deep/administrative state.
Fortunately, that only applies to....Truuuuuuummmmp!
Gusty Winds (Runnin' on Empty) said...
It’s Easier To Fool People Than To Convince Them That They’ve Been Fooled
A line also applicable to all the Althouse threads discusing the dreaded covid.
What Gusty Winds said @ 8:20 AM
You are missing the point imo. They are perfecting the steal and the ability to destroy republicans at will.
Political Junkie: "I want Trump to go away. I agree with many of his issues. He hand a wonderful opportunity. He blew it."
Once again, as always, the entire GOPe that worked against every Trump 2016 agenda item AND fully and knowingly cooperated with their democratical allies in the Russia Russia Russia hoax AND the weaponization of the federal govt against the republican base gets a Full Pass.
Trump: the greatest Get Out Of Jail Free Card in the history of politics for the corrupted and coopted DC bureaucrats uniparty.
No wonder the McConnells and Romneys and Ryans et al sell out the republican party every chance they get...they are incentivised to do it by the purposeful blindness of the "educated" and non-icky republicans who just want the mean tweets to end.
Yeah, that Trump needs to leave otherwise the GOPe leadership wont be able to effectively fight for (wink wink) the republican base!
If I was on that panel, I'd say it is political question of the purest sort and decline to decide. Summary dismissal. No oral argument.
Rusty at 9:24 sums up my thoughts, except I don't think Trump should go away. He performs a critical service to the country by just forcing the Left to invest significantly in the blind hatred that keeps them distracted from more dangerous activities.
Just what we need, a three-judge panel to enforce the narrative.
Is this a Bill of Attainder? More specifically, given the Sixth Amendment, requiring a trial by jury (not by a panel of three judges) is this not unconstitutional by that means as well?
I wish we'd just reelected the bastard. People could still blame him for everything, but the country would be in better shape than it is now.
I'm wondering what we are going to do about the neighbors who put out signs and banners telling us that Biden was decent, competent, and compassionate. Impeachment? 14th Amendment? Lawfare and endless nuisance suits?
We don't need no stinkin juris - diction, Dave! --Your DNC
It's weird, and unsettling to see the tag 'Jamie Raskin' snuggled in between 'Democracy' and 'Law'.
Some day these people deserve to see an actual insurrection, so they know how wrong they got it this time.
Using a faked up insurrection charge by politiciized Justice dept using Dem rigged DC jury is a true insurrection. Trumps only insurrection was winning Hillary’s rigged election and restoring a Pro American Presidency. Oh yeah, he was rude too.
'...you are blatantly displaying your mistrust of democracy.'
Called being a Democrat...
When it got to the Supreme Court, cooler heads there would likely ask the question which many people know but has been steadfastly hidden from the general populace by the Demedia:
"Did President Trump offer to supply thousands of National Guard troops to protect the Capital and Capital Building?" Which would probably get a quiet "Yes". Then the second question: "Was that support refused by the Mayor of DC and the Speaker of the House, respectively?" Which should once again elicit another quiet "Yes".
If the TDS afflicted proponents refuse to acknowledge the truth, I assume Trump people will be there with the evidence.
Anyone else hearing anything about this?
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRqoUoTa/
The 2 have been pushing this proposal for a year. Session with Democratic majorities ends in days. Their proposal ends with it.
Nevermind on the tik tok link. It went "private" when I tried to view it again.
Temujlin:
Raskin's son was a law student; I think at Harvard. He committed suicide while in law school and at about the time of the second impeachment.
Whenever I see him on TV or see his name in print, I think about that. Incredibly sad.
Left Bank of the Charles said...
Trump cannot have a legitimate second term unless there is a judicial determination that he did not engage in insurrection
**********************************************************************
A classic Ipse Dixit.
EXACTLY Temujin!!! EXACTLY. The little snowflakes would melt.
"I don't care how you do it, just get his goddam name on the front page!"
- Perry White IV
Blogger Lurker21 said...
I wish we'd just reelected the bastard. People could still blame him for everything, but the country would be in better shape than it is now.
Boy, is that the truth ! Border secure. No war in Ukraine. Inflation at 2% and gas at 2 dollars a gallon. The Democrats would not be destroying the country and attacking agriculture. Maybe even the climate hysteria would cool a bit (pun intended).
Drago - Your reply did not address any of the specifics I raised. Your response sounds quite unhinged and juvenile. You act as though a Republican can win a general election for president just by running as a right wing Republican. You are so far off base I wonder if you are a George Soros funded pajama boy, trying to get Trump to be the R nominee and then go down to ignominious defeat.
Raskin's son was a law student; I think at Harvard. He committed suicide while in law school and at about the time of the second impeachment.
Whenever I see him on TV or see his name in print, I think about that. Incredibly sad.
Raskin is a scumbag, and I would assume that his son was as well. Good riddance.
Political Junkie...No, he isn't. He is just sick and tired, like the rest of us are, of voting for people who cave to the Progressives every time. WHAT have the Republicans DONE for their constituents, except spit in their faces..EVERY SINGLE TIME??
Keep your head in the sand. They aren't ever going to win again unless they fix the fraud, and the Mitches in your party don't want ANY part of that. They like being in the minority. Same perks...less work. Congratulations. YOU can have it.
Political Junkie said...
"I want Trump to go away. I agree with many of his issues. He hand a wonderful opportunity. He blew it.
He is a low class billionaire. I equate him with some gazillionaire athlete. Has money, but no class."
Political Junkie said...
"Drago - Your reply did not address any of the specifics I raised. Your response sounds quite unhinged and juvenile. You act as though a Republican can win a general election for president just by running as a right wing Republican. You are so far off base I wonder if you are a George Soros funded pajama boy, trying to get Trump to be the R nominee and then go down to ignominious defeat."
What specifics? You're just venting. You don't like Trump because he's so middle class. Got it.
I bet cancer patients wish chemo would go away. Our government is very sick. It’s corrupt, consumes way too much money, violates people’s rights, and murders thousands of people all over the globe every year. Trump is an ugly solution to an even uglier problem. But it proscribing Trump for our government means we have to be willing to tolerate the side effects, which I’m not sure we’re willing to do. Yet, not proscribing Trump signals that we thought most things were fine before he showed us the swamp or we’re fine with the swamp so long as it only hurts other people.
Forget the trial or judicial panel.
Uncle Joe can declare Trump a seditious traitor by judicial order and have him executed.
How about being hung, drawn and quartered? The progressives would love that.
Blogger Left Back at the Charles said...
Trump cannot have a legitimate second term unless there is a judicial determination that he did not engage in insurrection. This expedited process would serve his interests too, except that he is not interested in legitimacy.
*****************
Riiiight. Unless a court finds Trump innocent (w/o actually formally charging him with a crime) he remains guilty of insurrection.
Don't you hold yourself out as a lawyer? Did you graduate from the Somerville Upstairs Law Emporium?
Democracy Dies in Deluge of Duroc Defecation
Criminal prosecution should be used to put Biden away for opening the border to millions of invaders.
"When millions of men, women and children get human trafficked from all around the world a cross our southern border illegally, Democrats say NOTHING.
When Texas Governor sends them to Democrats, Democrats call it human trafficking.
How fake and insufferable are these folks??" - AnOmaly
THIS is the REAL insurrection. And the Republicans just signed the bill to authorize more money to process these illegals into our country (not send them back, as they should be saying) as we are going bankrupt, trying to support and hand over billions to Ukraine to fight a war we have no reason being in.
Rogan O’Handley
@DC_Draino
·
20h
Remember when we discovered John McCain was working with the IRS to target Tea Party groups with audits and gov’t harassment to destroy that populist movement?
Just imagine what Mitch McConnell and Lindsey Graham are doing behind the scenes to help destroy the MAGA movement…
Political Junkie: "Drago - Your reply did not address any of the specifics I raised. Your response sounds quite unhinged and juvenile."
I'm sorry that your GOPe heroes have been fully exposed. You will just have to deal with that.
Further, you were fully exposed with this little gem: "While I believe in democracy and the voters deciding, I am "law and order" and believe in "rule of law". These hoodlums in Chicago and San Francisco, I want them in court and tried. Maybe Trump should be treated likewise."
Yeah, you're really a "law and order" guy who simply wants Trump railroaded thru a Soviet "judicial" kangaroo court.
No doubt because you are so deeply "principled".
As for your "specifics", you had none. It was only the standard GOPe/dem (but I repeat myself) talking point "specifics" we've heard for years: Trump is basically yucky and you don't like him and you are happy to blow up all legal precedence and constitutional rights to rid yourselves of him.
Gee, you really are a unique little flower.
Then you go off with this moronic hot take:
PJ: " You act as though a Republican can win a general election for president just by running as a right wing Republican."
Uh, no. Nice try....except not a nice try actually. More a "failure" try really.
My point remains the same: the only viable future for the republican party is as a diverse working class/middle class family focused party that embraces America First principles in economics and foreign policy.
Right now, the ONLY candidate pushing that across the board, with all his faults, is Trump.
I'll be quite pleased to see better candidates push those same policies...but I'm still waiting for them.
And then you finish with this little flourish:
PJ: "Peggy Noonan wrote "When Character was King" about Ronald Reagan. No such book will be written about Trump."
Morgan Freeman Narrator Voice: Peggy Noonan is a democrat who pushed the Adam Schiff-ty faux impeachment lies on the American Public in her columns.
So much for "character".
"You know, I wish Trump would go away."
Do you remember the last time you saw him live or in a recently recorded interview.
He is always at his best in person, but he has been disappeared.
This forces people to judge him based on the image of Trump created by the media.
You can see some of the results in these comments.
You are so far off base I wonder if you are a George Soros funded pajama boy, trying to get Trump to be the R nominee and then go down to ignominious defeat.
Another blank profile spouting off.
Use the 14th on Biden... or 25th... or whatever...
Trump is not president, Biden is, and he needs to go.. now.
Last time I saw Trump, he was wearing a super-hero outfit with bulging muscles.
They come up with this stuff because the DoJ, in a Democrat administration, won’t charge him with insurrection.
Drago said (in response to Political Junkie)...Trump is basically yucky and you don't like him and you are happy to blow up all legal precedence and constitutional rights to rid yourselves of him.
A softer way to say it is "I wish Trump would go away". This allows one to circumvent owning or supporting any constitutional or democratic destruction while at the same time hoping that the constitutional and democratic destruction actually works in killing its target.
None of this has ANYTHING to do with "rule of law". This along with "we live in a democracy" is simply another modern make-believe phenomenon in America.
Democrats will always look to a process they can corrupt, DOC, special prosecutor, three judge panel, etc. Trouble is, they corrupt everything.
"He's not one of the club, therefore he must be expelled from the premises. Forcefully, if necessary, and the doors barred to his re-entry."
"Isn't that a bit extreme? Is there no good in him at all?"
Glares. "He Is NOT One of the CLUB. MUST I repeat myself?"
------
Personally - I'll all for busitng up the DC establishment at this point. They've taken it upon themselves to do far too much 'for the good of the country', and we're suffering thereby.
The Democrats’ behavior is how you get more Trump. Not Trump – Trump; but a competent doppelganger with a better hairdo.
Tommy Bloom Raskin committed suicide on December 31, 2020. He was 25 and a second-year law student at Harvard.
Dave Begley- I just read that Jamie Raskin has been diagnosed with Diffuse Large B Cell Lymphoma. I don't wish anyone to be diagnosed with any form of cancer. I wish him a true and sound recovery.
I just don't see him as a stalwart of democracy or law.
Hunter Biden's tax payer funded Hooker: "Last time I saw Trump, he was wearing a super-hero outfit with bulging muscles."
What were the GOPe-ers doing the last time you saw them?
"You are so far off base I wonder if you are a George Soros funded pajama boy, trying to get Trump to be the R nominee and then go down to ignominious defeat.
Michael K: "Another blank profile spouting off."
Political Junkie's real problem is that I'm so on target and apparently, he/she/xe doesn't much care for that, particular in terms of criticizing the GOPe-er sellouts.
"Our democracy" has taken on a particular meaning unaffiliated with any pre-2016 definition or understanding of the word.
Disqualification under the 14th amendment has never required a criminal conviction. It’s ahistorical to assert that it does. It’s a factual question, like the other qualifications to be President. Let’s say the electors select someone who is not a natural born citizen or has not been a resident of the United States for 14 years or who is under the age of 35. Is that person the legitimate President of the United States?
"Yes, hurry up! Wouldn't want to leave it to the voters to decide. Democracy is at stake."
Wrong! Rule of Law is at stake and our court system requires that law violators face trial and punishment. We already know he broke the law in more ways than he can ever be tried - so Jack Smith simply needs to present already available hard evidence to the already impaneled DC Grand Jury for review. Then the DC Circuit can send him off to jail for security violations with a conviction that would outlast TFG.
What were the GOPe-ers doing the last time you saw them?
Passing a Democratic Party $1.7 trillion spending bill.
Progressives: "Trump is a clown. A fool. An idiot. He's beyond incompetent".
Also progressives: "Trump is such a threat to win an election that he needs to be banned from running. Or even better, imprisoned.
Mason G: "Progressives: "Trump is a clown. A fool. An idiot. He's beyond incompetent".
Also progressives: "Trump is such a threat to win an election that he needs to be banned from running. Or even better, imprisoned."
progressives/dems/GOPe-ers.
"We already know he broke the law in more ways he can ever be tried."
No.Gadfly. No we don't. But do go on. Lecture the rest of us on the rule of law.
Left Bank of the Charles said...
Disqualification under the 14th amendment has never required a criminal conviction.
So where's your historical list of everyone who was disqualified under the 14th amendment without a convicrion? I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for it.
Joementia is totally owned by China and his family has sold out the country in his name. The Federal guvmint has conspired to censor discussion of it.
Gadfly: "But Truuuuuummmmp!!!!"
To be fair, he's on his 8th anal injection of MRNA juice. Those LNPs have crossed the BBB and rotted his brain. It's a miracle he can type.
You're assuming these people actually care about democracy.
You're assuming these people actually care about democracy.
Mr. Wibble,
"Until the political/managerial class are willing to..."
Some kind of Blogger error ended up removing 'seppuku' from the end of your list there.
“So where's your historical list of everyone who was disqualified under the 14th amendment without a conviction?”
The vast majority of adherents to the Confederacy who were disqualified under the 14th amendment were not convicted of insurrection, up to and including Jefferson Davis and Robert E. Lee. Congress removed the disqualification for a number of individuals, none of whom had been convicted of insurrection. In some cases there were judicial challenges to asserted disqualifications, but these did not result in convictions or acquittals, the proceedings were civil in nature.
Let’s remember, Barack Obama had to prove the legitimacy of his being President twice. First, when Republican John Roberts botched the administration of the oath of office and he had to retake the oath. Second, when he had to produce his birth certificate to counter Trump’s embrace of birtherism. My point is that Trump’s second-term aspirations would benefit from an expedited judicial determination. Otherwise, the question would linger over the primary, the general election, the electoral college, the inauguration, and the four years in office.
As things are, the Republican Party has a major disincentive from nominating someone who could be disqualified from taking office instead of a viable candidate. I suppose its primary voters might have an incentive to do so, if their goal was to blow up the party.
Even with the show court element, this would essentially be a bill of attainder.
What is it about Trump you all despise so? Mean tweets? Some sexist barroom reference to grabbing a woman’s privates? You pearl-clutching hypocrits!
For heaven’s sake, Bill Clinton got BJ’s from an intern in the Oval Office & is
probably on an Epstein list!
I just don’t get it.
Joe Biden lies constantly about easily disprovable things & has his entire life.
Trump’s been subjected to uniformly false accusations by significantly flawed people & none
of It sticks.
It disgusts me to see elements of our government working ceaselessly to exterminate a former
President.
Tell me what it is that you hate so much about Trump that is noteworthy beyond your own nuanced model of life.
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