Writes Janice Turner in "Porn apologists are running out of excuses/The pop star Billie Eilish will be an inspiration to many young people in rejecting grotesque images of sexual violence" (London Times).
Here's Eilish's song on the subject:
December 18, 2021
"Billie Eilish began watching porn aged 11 to be cool, 'one of the guys.' But the brutal, abusive scenes she encountered gave her nightmares and in her first sexual relationships..."
"... she complied with acts she hated 'because I thought that’s what I was supposed to be attracted to.' Porn, she said this week, 'destroyed my brain.' Yet already Eilish, who only turns 20 this weekend, is being censured for her 'anti-porn tirade.' Her lush voice, dark lyrics and seven Grammys can’t save her from being branded a Swerf (Sex Worker-Excluding Radical Feminist), a slur applied to any woman who dares challenge the global sex trade. For a decade the supposed progressive position on pornography has been that it is liberating and 'sex positive.'... In her recent book 'The Right to Sex', the Oxford professor Amia Srinivasan describes teaching her students the work of 'second wave' feminists Andrea Dworkin and Catharine MacKinnon, who argued that porn writes the script for male oppression. Srinivasan assumed undergraduates would find their position as outdated and repressive as she did. Instead they were electrified, agreeing with 1970s feminists that porn objectifies women, ignores female pleasure and, like Eilish, that it groomed them into sex acts they didn’t enjoy. Srinivasan reflects that at 36 she only encountered porn as an adult, while 'sex to my students is what porn says it is.'... A generational shift is under way.... Younger people, whose childhoods were defiled, will agree with Billie Eilish who says with a fearlessness born of pain: 'As a woman, I think porn is a disgrace.'"
Writes Janice Turner in "Porn apologists are running out of excuses/The pop star Billie Eilish will be an inspiration to many young people in rejecting grotesque images of sexual violence" (London Times).
Writes Janice Turner in "Porn apologists are running out of excuses/The pop star Billie Eilish will be an inspiration to many young people in rejecting grotesque images of sexual violence" (London Times).
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“'sex to my students is what porn says it is.'.”
If true, that’s a societal disaster.
swerfs, terfs, perfs....
Womb people NEED to realize that they are put on earth to please penises... Nothing more
Just watch the movie, it will explain
She’s right, you know.
Life is so hard. l still believe that all the make up, moods &transfigurations used by many are a form of armor to protect thin skins and hide true self. It’s quite the wrong method, usually- and the years spent searching for our souls underneath the cover(s) is even more confusing.
The question is: how to make straight the crooked paths we walk- would we even want to? Porn always strikes me as desperation. When I was preteen, my dad had a “calendar”- yes? There was one woman- so beautiful- bared breasts open to the world for all. She had the saddest eyes I’ve ever seen and that’s what I remember.
Pron is not for 11-year olds. It's nice how the fragmentation of the woke fetish cult eventually hits everybody with guilt. It's a religious belief that is based on the insane concept of original sin. That's what makes it so ridiculous.
Porn doesn't objectify women. They remain mysterious, just anonymous. One pussy is as good as another for the purpose at hand.
It does bring down the demand for actual women, the solution being more easily obtained in porn. Women could counter it by making themselves more pleasant, I suppose.
In 1972 I was at the University of Texas and enjoying the sexual freedoms for women that were bulging out across our generation at the time. For a hoot, my boyfriend of the moment and I went with some friends to a porn theater in downtown Austin.
The thing is, whatever I saw in those 40 minutes or so caused me to not be able to touch my boyfriend for about 3 weeks. Whatever I saw took all the joyful carbonation out of the equation.
That is, I can relate to this relentlessly entertained generation.
So now perversion and degradation are Progressive? That's quite a brand you're building, folks.
"Billie Eilish began watching porn aged 11 to be cool"
In what circles or families is it "cool" for 11-year-olds to watch porn?
"But the brutal, abusive scenes she encountered"
But porn is more than that, no?
"... she complied with acts she hated 'because I thought that’s what I was supposed to be attracted to.'"
I call BS. I thought women had agency?
"Porn, she said this week, 'destroyed my brain.'"
I call BS again.
"porn objectifies women"
But not men?
"ignores female pleasure"
It may fake it, and focus on male pleasure, but entire categories of porn depend on the production of female pleasure.
"it groomed them into sex acts they didn’t enjoy."
I call BS. I thought women had agency?
Pornography degrades and objectifies women. Like abortion it is a gift from feminists given to men who wish to exploit women sexually.
"penchant for wearing baggy clothes" - Billie Eilish has adopted her own version of bagism.
And then, of course, there is the journalistic hack of claiming that Trump, or in fact anyone to the right of AOC, claimed something "without evidence", which somehow is not to be applied by rule to anyone on the left.
And then, of course, there is the journalistic hack of claiming that Trump, or in fact anyone to the right of AOC, claimed something "without evidence", which somehow is not to be applied by rule to anyone on the left.
Another reason why PARENTS should not let kids use a computer without a parent present. What do you EXPECT curious kids to look up when sex is so prevalent in this country. Just watch TV commercials.
The problem is that porn- for both men and women- is a Big Business. There is a number that has been tossed around for a decade that, globally, porn is a $97 Billion dollar business. Again, this is a number that has been tossed around for years (much like the old 47 million uninsured for heath coverage). No one really knows how much, but if we're talking $97B or $150B or just a paltry $50B, we're talking a lot of people making a lot of money.
That's hard to stop. That, plus sport sex or professional sex is considered the world's oldest profession. All this adds up to a very daunting task for university classrooms to dismantle.
That said, they've been pretty damned successful in dismantling Western Civilization, so I could see this grow and see these people remove porn from circulation. But to do this, they have to get the women of porn to stop. They just may not want to do so.
Anyway, it all seemed so much easier in the 70s. But then, I was not involved in sex trafficking.
Ick.
Isn't this giving swerfs and terfs too much credit? How many of them are just sex worker or transsexuals exclusionary moderate feminists?
The Politburo won't be satisfied until everyone is a "female-exclusionary radical feminist" FERF.
In traditional science, you start with a “null hypothesis” along the lines of “this thing doesn’t happen and nothing about it is interesting”.
There is nothing outside of pop culture called "traditional science."
Most science, as it appears in peer reviewed research, consists of curved lines in a graph. The research explains what gives the curve its shape.
Love, respect, romance?
Not cool! - says the woke/cancel freak-show left intersectional porn freaks.
I sympathize with Eilish.
Porn, like drugs, is corrosive and addictive. It takes a healthy part of human activity and turns it into shit.. or worse. And there is no bottom... there is no "it can't get any crude or worse."
As Max California said in the movie 8mm, "There's things that you're gonna see that, that you can't unsee. They get in your head and they stay there." And he warned him, "If you dance with the devil, the devil don't change. The devil changes you."
Yeah, 9 years ago was the "Gonzo" phase of things, so I can see that messing with kids brains. Not this current Stepsister thing is any better.
When I was a kid there was Nugget magazine and Dwaine Tinsley era Hustler, which also wasn't good for the psyche.
I’m continually amazed at how Progressives always have a great new dehumanizing derogatory term and acronym! ready to hurl at any allies who dare to deviate from the stupid schemes to ruin young minds.
I am heartbroken for Eilish and for many others in her generation who suffer the ravages of mind pollution. I cannot imagine growing up in these times of readily available pornography. I regret the one or two horror movies I’ve seen since I have a visual memory. It takes years to get unwanted images out of my head.
Science is showing that our physical brains are shaped by our thoughts. Depending on what we allow into our minds and habitually “feast” on, our brains show up as flourishing or diseased trees on brain scans. I now have some idea what Jesus meant when He said that if your eye is bad, your whole body is darkness. He said that it is better to throw it out (metaphorically speaking), than to allow it to pollute the whole person. Hope is to be found in redemption, in taking what was ruined and disqualified and making it new. (See Ephesians 2:1-7 and Romans 12:1-2)
It's the usual over-generalizations from a crowd that won't admit that they're fundamentally anti-sex, not anti-porn. This is equivalent to wanting to ban all television because the violence in Squid Game horrified you. The fact that she saw something at age 11 that she shouldn't have is not the rest of the world's problem. Plenty of kids see Se7en or Pulp Fiction too young, and no one is calling for an overall ban on crime movies.
The suggestion that she thought she needed to model her own behavior based on what she saw in pr0n is complete nonsense. She would have seen thousands of movies and TV programs growing up. She didn't watch Home Alone and decide to hang paint cans in her stairway. She didn't watch the Black Widow and think she needed to learn martial arts. She didn't watch The Devil Wears Prada and decide to wear high fashion. There are a million kids' cartoons aimed at assuring girls that they can be smart, resourceful leaders; how did all of those influence her behavior?
Much more likely: there was something negative happening with her family/friends, or clinical depression was setting in, and she was lonely and lacking role models or confidants. She tried to fill the gap with men, and lacking guidance with relationships, she started having sex too soon, before she'd established enough trust with her partners, and she wound up feeling used. It's sad, but it's a tale as old as time, and pr0n is not the problem.
Hilarous that people in the global sex trade that exploits women for $$, now have some sort of Feminist ideaology to support what used to be criminal behavior. Very convient for them.
Most pornography is "sex positive" but a very weird kind of sex. If you are to believe porn, women don't have orgasms and don't care. What makes a satisfying sexual experience for them is having a man (or two or more) deposit his semen on some of their body parts.
As a 51 year old, I give very little credence to the categorical statements made by 20 year olds, especially famous ones.
That said, she might be watching the wrong porn. It's not all violent (that is, if you retain a definition of the word violent that hasn't been distorted over the years to define things that are intrinsically not violent, like speech or silent, as violence).
And that said, is porn pretty much the acting out of male fantasy? Yep. But what is the fantasy? I don't think it's specifically men and women having sex. I think the fantasy is the woman being really into having sex. A willing partner who's always ready to go. For many men, that's not reality, for many reasons. Imagining a world where it is, that's attractive.
And THAT said, where the hell were Eilish's parents? Had they not heard of parental filters? Even further, does no one have 'the talk' with their children anymore? You would think parents who wanted to educate their own children about sex would incorporate porn into the discussion.
And finally, when are young women going to say, "No. I don't want to do that?" We talk so much about empowered women and girls these days. This is not part of that? Being empowered can't depend on men denying their sexuality. Some girls are going to start having to do the heavy lifting, even if that separates them from the in crowd.
If men could see women's fantasies, would they be bored? A lot of women cannot handle men's sexuality. But with pornography found in every classical civilization, the notion that it will be dropped by the rising generation today looks unlikely. More likely, someone will try to ban it. Good luck with yet another prohibition.
Eilish's breathy little girl voice and the song lyrics don't remotely match the columnist's pitch -- which I have to take from the excerpts provided, as the article was cut off on the site. In the singer's unhappiness, what is the first thing the lyrics tell us she did? She resorts to pornography. OK, it's not a realistic love scene..... LOL. It's a male fantasy, probably of dominating some woman and being treated as though his sex partner is his sex slave. We can hope, can't we?
Meanwhile, I looked at the lyrics of the song to try to understand the words Eilish mews in her plaintive-little-kitten persona. Forgive me for thinking she might have dropped some other lines, like
Please molest me now / But don't tell me how...
Little girl trying to deal with the big bad world. Guess it's an old, old story to which many teenagers will always be receptive. But it says very little to an adult. Or at least to this adult.
There are a lot of personal issues that can be resolved successfully through therapy.
There are a lot of sex trade issues that can be resolved with violence against the perpetrators.
Younger people, whose childhoods were defiled, will agree with Billie Eilish who says with a fearlessness born of pain: 'As a woman, I think porn is a disgrace.'"
Maybe, but isn't it mostly those same young people who turn to Onlyfans to sell pornography of themselves? Or maybe not! Maybe it's women in their 20s selling themselves and girls in their teens recoiling in disgust. Or, most likely, you have people in every camp in every generation, and it's just a matter of which perspective is anointed the "feminist" perspective. Similar to abortion, where polling looks roughly the same for men and women, but being pro-abortion is considered the "feminist" position. Or also, nowadays, the "radical" feminist position, as extremists (trans activists or pro-sex work activists) try to relabel everyone else as radical.
As a male, I am thankful that I didn't grow up with the internet, and I often wish it didn't exist now.
I don't have any children, and it is unlikely at my age that I ever will, but if I did, there would be no internet in the house.
I sort of agree -- most of this stuff is very graphic and aggressive and seems to be an unpleasant way to spend your time. And the women are getting younger.
But there is evidence that more porn means less sexual assault (especially of children). This appears to be happening in Japan and Denmark...
The pendulum swings.
That is all it ever does.
At some point we will grow up.
I don't claim to be an expert on the subject; but I'm old enough to have lived through the Porno Chic era, then the age of home videos,and then into the proliferation of free porn on our home computers and cell phone; so I would say I have had the same exposure to porn as any straight male Baby Boomer. And through the years I kept hearing about how porn involved "violence against women." Not saying it doesn't exist, and probably does on the Dark Web; but I've never encountered it. The women all seem willing, even enthusiastic, participants. The one exception I can think of is a rape scene circa 1980, and that was to establish a particular male character as a villain. (This was when there were actual "adult" movies you had to go to a theater to see, and it being the Porno Chic Era, was on playing in an art house in Greenwich Village; so there was at least a token attempt to establish character, motivation, etc.) Where all this brutalizing anti-woman porn was hiding, I don't know.
Well good for her then.
When I heard the new expectations for first dates, I was glad to be out of the dating market. Not gonna happen dude.
I feel so sorry for girls now.
Porn =/= Grotesque Images of Sexual Violence.
What part is hard to understand?
There has been plenty of evidence to show that many women and men were taken advantage of by the porn industry, but that doesn't translate to the screen. I wonder what films she was watching that showed women being abused so badly. Most of the porn I have seen attempts to portray the women as wanting (and enjoying) the sex as much as the men. I actually went to college with a woman who became a porn star. Her screen name was Summer Knight. She, and her husband, made lots of porn videos in the 1990s. She learned HTML and ran her own web site to make more money. Then, after she had enough cash to retire early, she disappeared.
Tag check. "Feministm"?
Brutal abusive scenes
Grotesque images of sexual violence
Sure, if that's what you go looking for, that sort of stuff is out there. But, if you don't go looking for it, chances are you won't find it. Unless, of course, you consider all pornography to be brutal & abusive & consisting of sexual violence because of whatever ideology of feminist sexuality you subscribe to, e.g. that all hetero penetrative sex is by definition rape, it's all for the "male gaze", etc, etc. In which case, it's everywhere, but then you're just legislating the language.
Here's the more likely scenario: Eilish, like many other women, actually found herself attracted to the "dark side" because it's real common for women to enjoy sexual submission. I can also imagine how enjoying submission can set one up for abuse by a sexual partner, and that abuse would bring shame, anger, and regret along with it.
I know some readers, especially the women, are going "Oh yeah...?!" at about this point, but I have 4 words for you: Fifty Shades of Gray. The largest selling pornographic book for women in history, avidly consumed by women around the world, is all about submission. And the ladies bought it up like there was no tomorrow.
No sort of pornography just leaps off the computer monitor screen & types in a URL on your keyboard. You have to go looking for it. The question is -- why did Eilish? Why does anyone?
Srinivasan reflects that at 36 she only encountered porn as an adult, while 'sex to my students is what porn says it is.'...
Can somebody explain to me why this is true in this wonderful Progressive age? I mean, don't they get sex education in the schools anymore? Aren't their parents teaching them what sex is/isn't about? Or are they too worried about offending some fetishists who might not vote for Biden in the next election?
Don't discourage pornography. Don't encourage it. Temper its progress. Self-moderation is a virtue of the individual and society. That said, men and women are equal in rights and complementary in Nature/nature. Reconcile. #HateLovesAbortion
"Srinivasan assumed undergraduates would find their position as outdated and repressive as she did."
There are some things so insane you need a graduate education to believe them.
The verb "pervert" means to use something for a purpose it was not intended for. Thus there can only be perversion when there is intention. If sexual desire has no purpose, then it cannot be perverted. But it has a purpose, if only in the evolutionary sense. The male orgasm is necessary for reproduction. The female orgasm is not.
The arguments of McKinnon and Dworkin against porn led me to develop my thinking about free speech and the First Amendment more. They seemed to be saying that porn had a message about the proper roles of women and men that was dangerous because it was implicit and persuasive.
To me it seemed self-evident that whatever they though was being advanced implicitly could be stated explicitly, since nothing could be more central to the political ordering of a society than the way one half dealt with the other half, and their complaint seemed focused on persuasiveness. (although they might well have sought to bar someone from saying openly that women ought to be submissive to, and sexually subjugated by men).
I then formed the idea, that I still have, that freedom to speak an idea entails freedom to speak it in its most persuasive form. It won't do to say the First Amendment protects your right to espouse naziism, but only if you have a clumsy speaker who stutters, instead of someone with the oratorical skills of Hitler. Press freedom does not mean that speaking unorthodox truths can only be printed on hand cranked mimeographs, rather than electronic printing presses, etc.
In what circles or families is it "cool" for 11-year-olds to watch porn?
Clearly, it's not a family thing.
It has to do with the peer group, or in this case, what she imagined the peer group to be and what she imagined it was thinking.
If Billie thought her parents thought it was "cool" for her to be watching porn, she wouldn't have watched it.
Porn degrades both male and female.
And what was her Vogue photo layout other than soft core pornography?
Porn for 11 year olds is bad hard to believe people object to that. But it's where we are.
Seven year old "transgenders" celebrated on TV? Hard to agree to that. But it's where we are.
Morbidly obese women are healthy because of fat shaming is hard to agree with. But that is where we are.
Inmates may not be in charge of the asylum but they control the HR department.
I don't want to see grotesque violence*, with or without sex. Pron to me is a beautiful woman enjoying herself and others. Pain and humiliation hold no place.
It is truly sad though, that Eilish and so many other young women are so foolish.
I too ask "Where were her parents?" This is the sort of story that makes me glad my only child was a son.
It has echoes with the Christmas Complainer a few days ago.
*I don't even have the war-movie stomach I used to. Old softie.
Younger people, whose childhoods were defiled, will agree with Billie Eilish who says with a fearlessness born of pain: 'As a woman, I think porn is a disgrace.'
Try saying that after watching some classic 'big bush' porn from the 1970s.
11? Wow- that's gonna leave a mess.
YH- "you have to go looking for it". Not always. The other day my daughter and I were discussing a classmate of hers from 8th grade, a really smart kid, wondering what she was doing now. I did a web search on her name and came up with several porn videos. Poor kid has the same name a "star".
Some wanna explain to me why you can go and Bing Images and see (or so I'm told!) literally thousands of naked young women posing for selfies, legs spread wide apart?
Who's the audience for that? Doesn't it foster and encourage the "Male Gaze"---only it's changed to "Hey, look down here!!"
Wymyn can't be taken seriously.
I have a more libertarian view of porn than Billie Eilish, but her opinion is no less valid. The world is full of people who disagree with me on a whole range issues, yet I manage to get through my day without giving them a second thought. Maybe, just maybe, people should be allowed to disagree with us without our wanting to go to war with them over it.
I had a similar problem after seeing a James Bond movie at too young an age. In my experience, it just doesn't pay to have a fist fight atop a moving train. And it never works out when you drive ninety miles per hour on city streets, especially on those narrow streets in picturesque European cities. But what are you going to do. Kids are imitative and pick up on this behavior when they see it on the screen.
She was ELEVEN. Not a teenager, not an adult. A mere child who didn’t know enough to make an informed choice to consume or abstain. Letting the world become awash in filth and then blaming her for being damaged by it—this is why people hate Boomers.
Repost from TheNewNeo.com, where folk here could go for usually more politics, but Neo also does music & dance, a bit. (I came here from her blogroll - remember trying out links?)
Neo made a comment earlier this year that she hadn't even heard of Billie Eilish - I had, and have heard more from her. Althouse has a nice YT of a recent anti-porn song, and she apparently has come out against porn, which is causing some pro-porn folk to be against her.
https://althouse.blogspot.com/2021/12/billie-eilish-began-watching-porn-aged.html
There's a really really cute "reaction video" style of Billie giving the "same interview", as she sees clips of herself in 2017, 18, 19, 20, and now 21 (she's 20).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wNsZEqpKUA
A couple months ago I saw, at a Slovak bookshop (in their English section), a book by Billie - lots of pictures and fluff. Thought of mentioning it here, but then forgot since I'm doing more watching of others (Fantasy Intellectuals) so less to comment. Next time I went there, the book was gone/ sold. Recently read that she has millions of followers (and her interview show numbers), but the book sold quite poorly - followers doesn't yet mean certain book sales.
My favorite song time is exactly those danceable 80s synth pop, and I was listening to "alternative" rock, as college radio. (KFJC, 89.7, 12345 Los Altos Hills [Silicon Valley, Foothill Junior College] Now YT offers me similar playlists:
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=eRQ3irjdpDw&list=RDAMPLRDTMAK5uy_mVNeBBFwty5UdrYVbVfr9rb8E2KJYKkFE
(Not sure if others can see these)
Tho I often prefer mostly blues guitars & piano (jazzy, easy listening) while I'm busy blog reading, and some commenting.
I'm going to repost this comment at Althouse, as many of those readers might be interested, and it occurs to me that Twitter is quite a bit like Multi-Player commenting. Your comment to one could be seen by all others, and the algorithms might well push it to be seen by those most likely to be interested in it.
Blogs can't do that.
--
it's too bad there isn't more interblog commenting possible. Tho I already don't always read all the comments, too many.
So she intentionally goes to something forbidden, that all the sensible people in her life tell her not to do, because she wants to be brave! and free! and modern! and not bound by outmoded expectations! And then it harms her, which she has to work hard to get out of and feels she might not ever be able to leave completely behind her.
I was that person myself, at 13 or so, so I don't want to come across as a never-never-never person. Yet I came to accept that maybe it was I who had made the miscalculation
Billie Eilish was exposed to intensely degrading and violent pornography at age 11 that made her submissive to the degrading desires of men around her. Her musical career began at age 13.
Think that's a coincidence? Then you're a terrible fool.
She hosted SNL last week and seemed pretty well adjusted.
Her music still sux though.
Having worked in the industry (on the technical side) I'm probably more familiar with the content than most people. There is some dark stuff out there but generally you need to go looking for that. Its not going to be on he main page of most sites.
I'm assuming based on her comments that she was seeing was stuff like anal sex that she then engaged in and did not enjoy. A lot of porn can be brutally mechanical and emotionless since guys are okay with that in porn, they are supplying their own internal thoughts and the porn supplies the audio/visual component. If there are emotions involved, it's enthusiasm from the women involved. I can see why women think the lack of emotional content seems dehumanizing but its because they value that component while guys don't as much.
Women are an important audience for porn, representing @ 30% of the market and are more likely to pay for what they like but because they are a minority, the home page of most porn sites is not tailored to them. Usage research shows that they actually really like gay porn (just as straight guys like lesbian porn) and BBC (Big Black CXXX) categories. There's a reason why those categories tend to have more stories and emotional content.
On the free porn sites, you have to search for any porn containing violence or brutality. They show the most popular videos first and they are not the brutal ones.
I think porn producers have been so desensitized that it makes it very difficult for them to put out a product with any feel for what sex actually should be. Yeah, it should be heightened in porn, just like all movie experiences try to be heightened from real life, but instead, it ends up degraded.
so this person with mental issues got started with porn? any other questions.
I know some readers, especially the women, are going "Oh yeah...?!" at about this point, but I have 4 words for you: Fifty Shades of Gray. The largest selling pornographic book for women in history, avidly consumed by women around the world, is all about submission. And the ladies bought it up like there was no tomorrow.
There is an entire genre of publishing nicknamed "bodice rippers" published by companies like Harlequinn Romance that exploit this demand.
I don't know the cause and effect order, but I do know that younger women these days are being confronted by regular requests/demands for sexual practices that were considered fringe until recently, and that are prominently featured in porn. If nothing else, these are practices that would not be introduced into brand-new relationships. We're talking anal sex for sure, and a lot of "rough" handling, degrading moves like being spat upon, and choking.
I can't believe the hostility of some of the comments here referring to women needing to take agency. Yes, they should, absolutely. Of course communication would ideally be open, honest, and ongoing from all parties.
But how is a naive young woman to know what's "normal" or "expected?" One way I know about the current climate is by reading a lot about the sanctions being brought against male students on campuses. I come from a place where I am mostly against these procedures, which are usually witch-hunts and that involve unprovable he said/she said situations. However, when you read the underlying facts, you see over and over that quick casual hook-ups that often involve anal sex and multiple partners are common. There just aren't THAT many young women who REALLY want to have anal sex with a relative stranger, or who are really turned on by a couple of roommates joining in the "fun."
I think these women are doing this because they feel like it's expected. I can only hope that they at least recognize after trying it that it's actually an empty experience that can be physically and emotionally painful.
As to the contribution of porn, whether or not these practices are "the first thing" that one would typically come across when surfing porn, you sure don't have to go down a lot of layers to get this type of content.
I watched the video.
Washed out color, whiny vocals, barely discernable tune and lyrics . . . is there such a thing as feminist pron pron?
Rollo said...
The Politburo won't be satisfied until everyone is a "female-exclusionary radical feminist" FERF.
Follow wins the thread, by telling the truth.
Is there anything that the "real feminists" support that doesn't make the lives of actual women worse?
Howard,
G. K. Chesterton is on record as saying that original sin is the only part of Christian theology that can really be proved. I have to say I agree with him.
@Althouse, can I assume from the tone of this post that you're straining for your "cruel neutrality" but can't quite get past your wish to support your radical feminist sisters Dworkin and MacKinnon?
I'm going to further assume that the difference between a desire by modern radical feminists to censure porn and comparable efforts to censure porn in the 1960s is that in the 1960s the effort to censor hard core porn was lead by those evil conservatives while today the effort to censor hard core porn is led by virtuous feminists.
I do note that 11 is typically the age when youngsters are in the fifth grade, and in Fairfax County Public Schools (FCPS) the youngsters have already been taught for over a year about what happens to their bodies during puberty and basic sex ed (a.k.a. "family life education"). Is it too much to ask sex ed (sorry, FLE) teachers to explain to youngster that porn is fiction??? And that the women on the screen are acting, and paid (in money or drugs) to say lines like "please put it up my butt" (or words to that effect)? And that even "Playboy" in its heyday claimed that both partners should be comfortable with what they are doing together. Is that too much to ask?
Because the whole effort to censor porn collapsed in 1964 when Potter Stewart described porn as "I know it when I see it." It's not that porn won, but that censorship lost. As it deserved to.
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