"... which calls for an 11-story, 1.68-million-square-foot structure that would house up to 4,500 students, 94 percent of whom would not have windows in their small, single-occupancy bedrooms. The idea was conceived by 97-year-old billionaire-investor turned amateur-architect Charles Munger, who donated $200 million toward the project with the condition that his blueprints be followed exactly.... McFadden disagreed sharply with what the university has described as 'Charlie’s Vision'... ... '[T]he "vision" of a single donor, the building is a social and psychological experiment with an unknown impact on the lives and personal development of the undergraduates the university serves.'... The project is utterly detached from its physical setting, McFadden goes on, and has no relationship to UCSB’s 'spectacular coastal location.' It is also out of place with the scale and texture of the rest of campus, he said, 'an alien world parked at the corner of the campus, not an integrally related extension of it.'"
Elsewhere, the same newspaper explains that the windowless rooms will have "artificial windows modeled after portholes on Disney cruise ships."
I see the Disney porthole combines camera views of the spaces around the outside of the ship with images of Disney characters — such as Aladdin flying on his magic carpet — popping up intermittently, maybe every 20 minutes or so:
So I'm thinking the Munger fake windows could have views of UCSB's spectacular coastal location and — popping up intermittently — a professor looking like he's pressing his nose up against the glass.
But, really... what do you think of the "social and psychological experiment" known as "Charlie’s Vision"? People sleep in those inside staterooms on cruise ships. If you're committed to using your room just as a place to sleep and to store your things and you'd like for yourself and others to be forced out into the common areas, it might work well!
I thought bedrooms had to have a window as a second point of egress in an emergency, by law.
Also, since the money has to be spent on the boondoggle, it seems like the university actually comes out ahead if the *don't* accept it. It's not like he's paying them to do something stupid, but at least they have this giant stack of cash to spend on good stuff. They never actually see the giant stack of cash. Just the something stupid they have to do.
I spent 3 years at UCSB after dropping out of high school. Most of my time I was outdoors unless I was sleeping. It's a beautiful campus and I'd hate to see it disfigured by a large, windowless solid block. Storke Tower is bad enough as it is, but at least it has a bell and a clock. Still, the rest of the campus is lovely. No reason to mar it beyond what has been done already. T
Nuclear subs w/bunks for ~115 provide the CO & XO a windowless bedroom/office, with a shared head in a combined ~250 sq ft. It's also an alternate passageway/secondary Damage Control Center/Radcon Decontamination station & extra bunk in the XO's Stateroom for senior riders. Sometimes for 4 months, submerged. Nobody gets a porthole. But sometimes, if you're at Periscope Depth & nothing is going on, a qualified nuke coming off-watch (6 hrs), might stop by Control & get a little "Periscope Liberty".
After 2 years of students being locked in their dorm rooms for fear of some horrible disease that might make them sniffle for a few days, this seems like the wrong time to claim students don't really need windows if all they're going to do is sleep (and boink).
Still, if the point of no windows is to achieve some exterior effect and students can have screens that exactly reproduce what they would see through a window, then maybe it's not such a big deal. Otherwise the building is not awful and the dorm designs are close enough to the communal living arrangements of current dorms.
Charlie Munger does a lot of the talking at the famous Berkshire Hathaway meetings and has somewhat of a cult following. He has done very well for himself and is (in my humble opinion) a brilliant man.
As far as the "experiment," small dorm rooms for underclassmen are the norm. My daughter just entered college as a freshman and her room is quite small, for example. Any student who is spending a lot of time in their dorm room is missing out on the college experience. So it seems like a good idea to me. Plus $200M is a lot of money, especially for a public university like UCSB. Kind of a di*k move for him to tie the money to following his blueprints exactly, though, given that he is not even an architect.
It is one thing to spend 5 or 6 nights in a cabin at sea vs. 3 or 4 months in a cubicle that is your only private space in a stressful environment. As for me, I paid the extra for a room with a view. Next time I think I am going for the balcony!
UCSB must be one of the most naturally beautiful campuses, the ocean actually goes into the campus. This would be instantly a building for exposing class differences. Maybe that's the point, keep the lower poorer class at ucsb to know their place as windowless functionaries.
I figured it was just a matter of time before someone decided an LCD screen was a "window."
But in any case, the basic concept of "dorm" is that it's not so much "home" as a place to sleep. And therefore there could at least be an option for students who want minimal housing at a minimal price.
Charlie and Warren are big celebs in China and Hong Kong.
I know those two guys love their money, but the American system is where they made their money.
The Chinese culture is just fucked. There is no other way to describe it. They have no respect for the individual. The government keeps slaves. The government suppresses freedom. The government executes political prisoners and then sells their organs. The CCP is a criminal organization and it should be condemned and shunned. Munger should wise up and do the right thing. Call them out.
Between all the firings for covid, twitter crimes and quitting because of principles we're going to have to rely on all those illegal immigrants separated from their kids to spend that 'settlement' money and keep the economy afloat...
When I went to UCSB in the late 70's to early 80's, most of the newer buildings and other architectural features were done in mid-century modern Soviet brutalism. I enjoy looking at the texture of the concrete wait by the plywood forms. The psychology building was completely without windows.
Mike Rowe recently had a podcast with his friend Rico Colantoni. Rico talked about this time he painted his bedroom black. It didn't take him long to feel the emotional toll it had on him. But the home is in California, so maybe it is just California.
"...porthole combines camera views of the spaces around the outside of the ship with images of Disney characters", previews of coming Hate Week events, or highlights of recent announcements from Big Brother.
It wouldn't surprise me if some students thrived in this type of building, but there has to be a large number of students who would be driven over the edge by it.
Cruise ships are not a good analogy. People spend a week or so on cruise ship, but generally not a semester.
The key issue is value, which will affect supply and demand. If this were some type of pinnacle of cost efficiency, then potential students might accept the deviation from normal accommodations. If the price is the same as other residence halls and it is deemed less desirable, then students will avoid it and the construction would have been a waste.
I also doubt that $200m will be the total. The university will be kicking in almost as much, since that is only $119 per sq. ft. If it fails, the university will be out the excess over $200m.
Munger may have optimized the efficiency, but if efficient isn't desirable, it must make up for it in reduced board cost in order to attract tenants.
If I read the floor plan correctly, there are windows in the pods: but they only look out from the common area in each pod. The 8 bedrooms in each pod are without windows. There's probably no way to structurally provide every bedroom with its own window, which gives rise to endless feuding and resentment between the more and less privileged students in the pod. As someone who slept 10 of my pre-college years in a windowless basement bedroom in my parent's house, I don't think this is any great deprivation.
I see many projects done hereabouts because the money is "free" or nearly so. ..Hand laid brick sidewalks in an unincorporated part of the County with about 2,000 residents. ..Concrete sidewalks going in against the curb on heavy traffic roads, rural mailboxes on posts smack on the sidewalk centerline. ..Hand laid brick sidewalks to "revive and enhance the downtown area" (where diagonal parking already creates a choke point on the Hurricane Evacuation Route) raising the sidewalk to well over a foot above the road surface.
But the money is free, or nearly so - grant from the feral gummit with some matching local funds. AND the project provides JOBS.
Maybe this is a secret program to enlist students who can survive this experiment into a deep space exploratory mission. Unfortunately there are likely to be some casualties, suicides and similar collateral damages.
What is the point? Why would a college take this money for this specific purpose if it ends up ruining the beauty of the campus, and possibly the mental health of a good number of its customers? It seems psychotic to even consider accepting this “gift”.
UCSB is an okay campus. Certainly the setting is nice, being on the ocean, but it is not close to the SB city center, and the architecture is uninspiring. It feels remote and boring. USC or UCLA are much better campuses IMO.
Charlie Munger is a polymath. While he is educated as an attorney, for him that was just the beginning. For instance, as his younger self he understood that psychology was of great importance in life and business but that he was unlearned in it. So, in typical Munger fashion he purchased a group of psychology books and texts and taught himself.
He has often emphasized the importance of worldly wisdom. His thesis is that one need be educated in as many subjects as possible, and turned himself into a learning machine. One of his children described him as a book with feet. His interest in psychology for instance has informed him on business practices, especially in the methods, good and bad, of motivating other people and of the damage done by personal emotional taints.
Charlie also takes delight in telling professionals in other fields that they are wrong. So he believes that he has the authority to design a dorm even though he has had no professional training in architecture.
Charlie Munger and his partner, Warren Buffett, have built one of the largest corporations in the world. They have not done that with lazy, conventional business practices. They were able to do this only because they intentionally thought differently than others. If they had not been original thinkers – for instance, designing buildings with no professional training – very few would even know of these two individuals.
The building is budgeted at $1.5 billion and Charlie is only giving $200 million of that. Charlie cannot force the university to do anything at all. If they don’t like the design, use the $1.3 billion of other monies to construct what pleases them and tell Charlie to pound sand. That is as simple as all get out.
And the design has some good ideas. Food, bed, plenty of common space and a place for a proper assignation. What more does a college student need?
People sleep in those inside staterooms on cruise ships.
Generally not twice. Turns out people generally spend many more hours in those inside staterooms than they anticipate — and sometimes 24 hours a day in the event of the ship being hit with a norovirus outbreak. Consequently experienced cruise vacationers regard having booked an inside cabin as a mistake. Moreover, if the traveler discovers that his or her inside cabin is a mistake, then it is only a mistake for a week +/- a few days and not for a whole semester.
I am trying to imagine who would want to live in s room with zero natural light ever reaching their room. On your way out the door can you look out the window to see whether it is raining? Or whether it is warm enough for shorts?
That Munger is old and rich doesn’t mean his ideas are uniformly good.
Hammond X. Gritzkofe said... I see many projects done hereabouts because the money is "free" or nearly so.
back in The Bad Old Days, when democrats controlled the Iowa State Houses; some democrat (probably Michael Gronstal) said, about some scheme... "It's Free Money, We HAVE TO take it"
The deal was something where; if Iowa spent a few Thousands of Dollars on a worthless project... the Feds would chip in MILLIONS (think it was Rainforest Dome viability studies or such)
I couldn't help but think that: A) The Millions WEREN'T "free money". *I* was a citizen of the USA, and that was MY Money B) The Thousands were REAL money.. REAL IOWA STATE TREASURY money C) The project (what it was), was a COMPLETE WASTE
So the demos wanted to use Thousands of my state's money; to snaggo MILLIONS of my country's money, and throw ALL that away on a useless project, that the people proposing SAID was useless.... And, we should do this; 'cause it will be Free Money
When I went to UBC from 95-99, I survived on Cdn$0.16 packs of Mr. Noodles. I was so poor, I just needed a place to crash and study, and couldn't possibly have cared less whether I had a window or whether my housing blended with the university's surroundings.
Hell, the UBC governors didn't care whether the university buildings blended with the surroundings either given their preference for Soviet style architecture.
The UBC law school I went to was in a concrete bunker, the Curtis Building, built shortly after WW 2. It wasn't pretty, but then I was there to study and get a law degree, etc., not to worry about how the building fit with Pacific Spirit Park.
The building has windows in the common spaces but the individual rooms with beds are windowless
There are a variety of reason why a room has to have a window to be called a bedroom according to every building/renting code in the country that I have seen.
Most prisons are required to have windows to the outside in cells.
If they do this they are going to find out real fast that humans with no external view do not fair well mentally.
The rooftop has no outward view--why? The donor's vision is that the small windowless bedrooms would "force" students to get out into the common spaces.
1) The 8 bedrooms are organized into a suite. Oh, I thought, so that will have windows and a comfortable common living room, so that's not so bad. I wouldn't mind so much having a private bedroom if I also had a larger room with some sunlight and a couch. Nope. No windows, and nothing that looks like a living room to me---just a kitchen and a large dining room table. One bathroom for 8+ people. 2) If having no window "forces" students out of their own room, doesn't that very premise prove the oppressive inhumanity of this design?
You certainly wouldn't want to live anywhere near someone whose personal hygiene was questionable. Unless the HVAC Systems in those windowless rooms were stellar. Also: How would you ventilate pot smoke? If no one smokes, and everyone bathes and washes super-regularly, this might work. Otherwise: Stench City.
given the amount of crazy that happens within common areas of the universities nowadays, this project seems to be intentionally trying to punish students who'd prefer not to be part of that
McFadden: As a design solution and a campus building, however, the project will long outlive the circumstances of its origin and will impact the life of the campus and the lives of its students for multiple generations.
As is true for most durable buildings.
Most interesting about the article is that there is no quote or information from Charlie Munger. Not even a " ... couldn't be reached for comment."
My alma mater, UCSB has only grown in stature and size since my time there. My wife works on the campus.
It’s a former Marine Corps base and there are still a few military buildings. Some of the buildings from the Sixties were brutal, but the newer ones have brought new life to the campus. And much of that is the result of generous gifts from locals like Munger.
Still, the potential of the campus site has barely been tapped. It still needs a signature structure. This likely isn’t it.
My alma mater, UCSB has only grown in stature and size since my time there. My wife works on the campus.
It’s a former Marine Corps base and there are still a few military buildings. Some of the buildings from the Sixties were brutal, but the newer ones have brought new life to the campus. And much of that is the result of generous gifts from locals like Munger.
Still, the potential of the campus site has barely been tapped. It still needs a signature structure. This likely isn’t it.
Munger Hall is straight out of a science fiction novel where everyone lives in concrete apartments, never sees the Sun and Earth's population is 40 billion. The seas are toxic waste dumps and rain is a witches brew. Only two exists for 4,500? It's a fire trap.
The J Edgar Hoover building is a classical style compared to this monstrosity. Why does the school want to concentrate the student body into one building instead of creating 45 100-student buildings with beautifully landscaped grounds between buildings? They must be really hard up for money to accept Munger's $200 million "donation."
Althouse noted: There are 2 bathrooms for 8 people.
I stand corrected. I'd followed the link that showed a 3-D mock-up and couldn't see the toilet in the one side. It does seem that there may be only one shower room.
My version of this experiment would have three options re different living/housing situations. The living/housing options that are being compared must cost the same amount and the options must be in the same location (say a thirty mile radius, or so). IOW you can’t compare these small Munger living quarters v living in a custom twelve thousand square foot waterfront house on ninety acres (with a helipad and helicopter, stables and dressage arena, and other such stuff). So pick one location and pick one budget number, then run the experiment.
Starting w/ equivalent costs/location, the experiments should look at what happens to:
1) people that are in the tight living situation that Munger likes
2) people that are in a max space and windowed situation for the same dough as the tight spots
3) people that have complete freedom to bounce between the tight living and max space living situations. Obviously these folks are enjoying a living situation that costs twice as much as is required by the folks that only live in either the tight places or the open places. But it’d be interesting to monitor this third category of people so we could see where they choose to spend most of their time. How much time do they spend in each type of living situation? Do they mostly stay in one type of living situation w/ breaks at the other type? Close to 50/50? A ton of questions, solutions and innovation could flow from looking at this third category of the experiment.
IMHO.
P.S. Anyone comparing living in a small place to being in jail should be embarrassed. FYI, in a jail cell you can’t leave.
BTW, Will the Munger rooms be isolated from each other and from shared spaces such that the kids can bone w/o sonically invading neighboring kids’ space?
And it’s not just sound re biz time: playing loud music or videos would also be annoying to others, but this could be very satisfying for the person playing such. IOW, people in small spaces may be a lot happier than people in larger spaces if the small spaces are well insulated and deeply (ha) separated from other peoples’ spaces. Maybe thinking about achieving the perception of having private space is more important than counting square feet.
/Cockroach Central/ properly called Imperial Security Building was designed by Lord Dono Vorrutyer has no windows and also partially underground.
Vorkosigan Saga books by Lois McMasters Bujold.
Bujold is the daughter of the famous Robert Charles McMaster, an Ohio State University welding engineer professor who edited the Nondestructive Testing Handbook.
It's college. Boy meets girl. But (from the illustration) the beds are very narrow -- maybe 30" wide. Too narrow for boy and girl to spend the night together. Sad.
/Cockroach Central/ properly called Imperial Security Building was designed by Lord Dono Vorrutyer has no windows and also partially underground.
Vorkosigan Saga books by Lois McMasters Bujold.
Bujold is the daughter of the famous Robert Charles McMaster, an Ohio State University welding engineer professor who edited the Nondestructive Testing Handbook.
MUNGER GRADUATE RESIDENCES Located on Central Campus, the Munger Graduate Residences are designed specifically for graduate and professional level students from all U-M schools and colleges to actively engage in a transdisciplinary community. Transdisciplinary living brings a diverse mix of graduate and professional students from various fields together to live, study and build a culture of collaboration. You’ll join other graduate students in a furnished apartment with 6 or 7 single-occupancy bedroom suites, each with a private bathroom. The suites also include a very large kitchen, dining room and community space.
When you live in Munger, you’ll become part of a unique community of thinkers, designers and doers. Through everyday interactions and organized Munger programs, you’ll inhabit an environment that asks you to grow, adapt and thrive. You’ll leave here with a once-in-a-lifetime experience that gives you unprecedented preparation for the diverse and rapidly-changing professional world.
---------- they would be well prepared to get on space ship and leave for GalaxyQuest if provided single-occupancy bedroom suites, each with a private bathroom.
It's so big it will depend on a lot of complex systems working just to get hot water working all the time, plus electricity plus air conditioning plus broadband. Does California seem like a place that will be able to keep complex systems running? Embrace simple and small and on the ground floor, something a Guatemalan can fix and a candle can light, close to nature and the exits.
I'd think any 'modern' student would also know that any screen that can show you a camera view of the outside world is also likely to have a pinhole size camera showing you to someone else. What a great way to monitor your students. Build it right into the the structure of the room.
CA , earthquake fault zone etc. --- structural integrity better with / without windows?
Well, during the Loma Prieta (1989) earthquake in San Francisco (which burned up a whole city block in the Marina district and dropped an elevated freeway across the Bay in Oakland), not a pane of glass was lost from any of the skyscrapers in the Financial District.
But, really... what do you think of the "social and psychological experiment" known as "Charlie’s Vision"? People sleep in those inside staterooms on cruise ships. If you're committed to using your room just as a place to sleep and to store your things and you'd like for yourself and others to be forced out into the common areas, it might work well!
1: People sleep in those inside staterooms because that's all they can afford. As students aren't currently living like that, it's clear that's not an issue here 2: The inside staterooms are for a week or less, not for 3+ months 3: It's very left wing: let's destroy everyone's private space! Because n one should ever be able to go off and be alone! You must always be with the People, comrade! 4: I get a lot more studying and homework done in a room by myself, that I've set up the way I like, rather than in a "commons" room set up the way someone else likes, with lots of talking, noise, etc.
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97 comments:
I thought bedrooms had to have a window as a second point of egress in an emergency, by law.
Also, since the money has to be spent on the boondoggle, it seems like the university actually comes out ahead if the *don't* accept it. It's not like he's paying them to do something stupid, but at least they have this giant stack of cash to spend on good stuff. They never actually see the giant stack of cash. Just the something stupid they have to do.
"Why oh why can't Munger just give us the 200 million with no strings attached so that I can spend it the way we want to?"
That is basically the complaint, isn't it?
I'm not against this. One more nail in California liberals' coffin.
Guilty as charged: I didn't read to the very, very end...
"If ... you'd like for yourself and others to be forced out into the common areas, it might work well!"
If you want to be forced outside, more power to you. Fuck people who want to force others to do things.
Can you imagine if somebody offered to leave a giant, unsightly pile of junk in your yard, and you said "OK, as long as you pay for it"?
I spent 3 years at UCSB after dropping out of high school. Most of my time I was outdoors unless I was sleeping. It's a beautiful campus and I'd hate to see it disfigured by a large, windowless solid block. Storke Tower is bad enough as it is, but at least it has a bell and a clock. Still, the rest of the campus is lovely. No reason to mar it beyond what has been done already. T
I am 100% certain that Munger would be the first person to volunteer to live inside one of these Windowless apartments despite being a Billionaire.
Nuclear subs w/bunks for ~115 provide the CO & XO a windowless bedroom/office, with a shared head in a combined ~250 sq ft. It's also an alternate passageway/secondary Damage Control Center/Radcon Decontamination station & extra bunk in the XO's Stateroom for senior riders. Sometimes for 4 months, submerged.
Nobody gets a porthole.
But sometimes, if you're at Periscope Depth & nothing is going on, a qualified nuke coming off-watch (6 hrs), might stop by Control & get a little "Periscope Liberty".
Shades of The Big U!
"you'd like for yourself and others to be forced out"
Sure, cuz that's what rooms are for, forcing people out.
Munger is from Omaha and I've heard him speak many times at the BRK meeting.
Charlie is outspoken. Also a long-time real estate investor. His first investment was in an LA apartment building and he said landscaping is critical.
Charlie is, of course, fucked in the head with this idea. No windows? Whack.
Charlie is also a big admirer of China, Chinese companies and the whole Chinese society. Which, again, is totally fucked.
Creighton is building a new dorm and, I can assure, all the student rooms have windows.
Sounds like another opportunity for a billionaire to force people to do things their way.
After 2 years of students being locked in their dorm rooms for fear of some horrible disease that might make them sniffle for a few days, this seems like the wrong time to claim students don't really need windows if all they're going to do is sleep (and boink).
Still, if the point of no windows is to achieve some exterior effect and students can have screens that exactly reproduce what they would see through a window, then maybe it's not such a big deal. Otherwise the building is not awful and the dorm designs are close enough to the communal living arrangements of current dorms.
Charlie Munger does a lot of the talking at the famous Berkshire Hathaway meetings and has somewhat of a cult following. He has done very well for himself and is (in my humble opinion) a brilliant man.
As far as the "experiment," small dorm rooms for underclassmen are the norm. My daughter just entered college as a freshman and her room is quite small, for example. Any student who is spending a lot of time in their dorm room is missing out on the college experience. So it seems like a good idea to me. Plus $200M is a lot of money, especially for a public university like UCSB. Kind of a di*k move for him to tie the money to following his blueprints exactly, though, given that he is not even an architect.
It is one thing to spend 5 or 6 nights in a cabin at sea vs. 3 or 4 months in a cubicle that is your only private space in a stressful environment. As for me, I paid the extra for a room with a view. Next time I think I am going for the balcony!
UCSB must be one of the most naturally beautiful campuses, the ocean actually goes into the campus. This would be instantly a building for exposing class differences. Maybe that's the point, keep the lower poorer class at ucsb to know their place as windowless functionaries.
Cells in a reeducation camp.
Yah all that 'community' stuff is overrated. There's good reasons we don't all live in 60s style communes...
What do such rooms make me think of? Dying in a fire.
The Disney portholes sound like they come from the same sci-fi satire as that Zuckerberg video.
Tim said...I paid the extra for a room with a view. Next time I think I am going for the balcony!
Worth every penny.
I figured it was just a matter of time before someone decided an LCD screen was a "window."
But in any case, the basic concept of "dorm" is that it's not so much "home" as a place to sleep. And therefore there could at least be an option for students who want minimal housing at a minimal price.
Charlie and Warren are big celebs in China and Hong Kong.
I know those two guys love their money, but the American system is where they made their money.
The Chinese culture is just fucked. There is no other way to describe it. They have no respect for the individual. The government keeps slaves. The government suppresses freedom. The government executes political prisoners and then sells their organs. The CCP is a criminal organization and it should be condemned and shunned. Munger should wise up and do the right thing. Call them out.
4500 students with 94% lacking any view to the outside world AND only TWO exits?
Sounds like a recipe for another Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire.
But hey, who needs windows or exits? It's just like a CRUISE SHIP!
Between all the firings for covid, twitter crimes and quitting because of principles we're going to have to rely on all those illegal immigrants separated from their kids to spend that 'settlement' money and keep the economy afloat...
When I went to UCSB in the late 70's to early 80's, most of the newer buildings and other architectural features were done in mid-century modern Soviet brutalism. I enjoy looking at the texture of the concrete wait by the plywood forms. The psychology building was completely without windows.
So I'm thinking the Munger fake windows could have views of UCSB's spectacular coastal location and — popping up intermittently
You mean.....kinda like CNN at the airport???
Mike Rowe recently had a podcast with his friend Rico Colantoni. Rico talked about this time he painted his bedroom black. It didn't take him long to feel the emotional toll it had on him. But the home is in California, so maybe it is just California.
A lot of good ideas come from gazing out a window.
Remember, windows are the eyes of the soul.
'Nobody gets a porthole.'
But everybody gets a screen door...
"...porthole combines camera views of the spaces around the outside of the ship with images of Disney characters", previews of coming Hate Week events, or highlights of recent announcements from Big Brother.
Looks absolutely terrifying. See the Typical Residential Floor Plan on page 5 of this presentation:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IgEAYCEphg6x6WDQ8NQGuILqN31SA6LP/view
It wouldn't surprise me if some students thrived in this type of building, but there has to be a large number of students who would be driven over the edge by it.
Cruise ships are not a good analogy. People spend a week or so on cruise ship, but generally not a semester.
The key issue is value, which will affect supply and demand. If this were some type of pinnacle of cost efficiency, then potential students might accept the deviation from normal accommodations. If the price is the same as other residence halls and it is deemed less desirable, then students will avoid it and the construction would have been a waste.
I also doubt that $200m will be the total. The university will be kicking in almost as much, since that is only $119 per sq. ft. If it fails, the university will be out the excess over $200m.
Munger may have optimized the efficiency, but if efficient isn't desirable, it must make up for it in reduced board cost in order to attract tenants.
Is it okay, if we call the virtual portholes... telescreens ???
I'll Assume that you won't be able to turn it off, or down???
LONG LIVE BIG BROTHER!!
If I read the floor plan correctly, there are windows in the pods: but they only look out from the common area in each pod. The 8 bedrooms in each pod are without windows. There's probably no way to structurally provide every bedroom with its own window, which gives rise to endless feuding and resentment between the more and less privileged students in the pod. As someone who slept 10 of my pre-college years in a windowless basement bedroom in my parent's house, I don't think this is any great deprivation.
I see many projects done hereabouts because the money is "free" or nearly so.
..Hand laid brick sidewalks in an unincorporated part of the County with about 2,000 residents.
..Concrete sidewalks going in against the curb on heavy traffic roads, rural mailboxes on posts smack on the sidewalk centerline.
..Hand laid brick sidewalks to "revive and enhance the downtown area" (where diagonal parking already creates a choke point on the Hurricane Evacuation Route) raising the sidewalk to well over a foot above the road surface.
But the money is free, or nearly so - grant from the feral gummit with some matching local funds. AND the project provides JOBS.
Maybe this is a secret program to enlist students who can survive this experiment into a deep space exploratory mission. Unfortunately there are likely to be some casualties, suicides and similar collateral damages.
What is the point? Why would a college take this money for this specific purpose if it ends up ruining the beauty of the campus, and possibly the mental health of a good number of its customers? It seems psychotic to even consider accepting this “gift”.
If it doesn't work as a dormitory, it can always be repurposed as a maximum security prison.
UCSB is an okay campus. Certainly the setting is nice, being on the ocean, but it is not close to the SB city center, and the architecture is uninspiring. It feels remote and boring. USC or UCLA are much better campuses IMO.
Perhaps Charlie Munger is really an aspiring Guy Grand.
"Did I hear you say there must be a catch,
will you walk away from a fool and his money?"
Next week he goes to Sothebys shopping for the perfect nose.
John Henry
why does UCSB need 4500 student dorm rooms.
I blame Trump. Get that architect out of here. Get’m out.
I don’t see how this passes any municipal code. If it does, change the code. Too risky for sleeping areas.
From the outside the building is quite good looking. Nothing odd looking at all.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IgEAYCEphg6x6WDQ8NQGuILqN31SA6LP/view See page 21
The building has windows in the common spaces but the individual rooms with beds are windowless
The psychology building was completely without windows.
Explains a lot. Was that your major ?
Charlie Munger is a polymath. While he is educated as an attorney, for him that was just the beginning. For instance, as his younger self he understood that psychology was of great importance in life and business but that he was unlearned in it. So, in typical Munger fashion he purchased a group of psychology books and texts and taught himself.
He has often emphasized the importance of worldly wisdom. His thesis is that one need be educated in as many subjects as possible, and turned himself into a learning machine. One of his children described him as a book with feet. His interest in psychology for instance has informed him on business practices, especially in the methods, good and bad, of motivating other people and of the damage done by personal emotional taints.
Charlie also takes delight in telling professionals in other fields that they are wrong. So he believes that he has the authority to design a dorm even though he has had no professional training in architecture.
Charlie Munger and his partner, Warren Buffett, have built one of the largest corporations in the world. They have not done that with lazy, conventional business practices. They were able to do this only because they intentionally thought differently than others. If they had not been original thinkers – for instance, designing buildings with no professional training – very few would even know of these two individuals.
The building is budgeted at $1.5 billion and Charlie is only giving $200 million of that. Charlie cannot force the university to do anything at all. If they don’t like the design, use the $1.3 billion of other monies to construct what pleases them and tell Charlie to pound sand. That is as simple as all get out.
And the design has some good ideas. Food, bed, plenty of common space and a place for a proper assignation. What more does a college student need?
Paul
People sleep in those inside staterooms on cruise ships.
Generally not twice. Turns out people generally spend many more hours in those inside staterooms than they anticipate — and sometimes 24 hours a day in the event of the ship being hit with a norovirus outbreak. Consequently experienced cruise vacationers regard having booked an inside cabin as a mistake. Moreover, if the traveler discovers that his or her inside cabin is a mistake, then it is only a mistake for a week +/- a few days and not for a whole semester.
I am trying to imagine who would want to live in s room with zero natural light ever reaching their room. On your way out the door can you look out the window to see whether it is raining? Or whether it is warm enough for shorts?
That Munger is old and rich doesn’t mean his ideas are uniformly good.
Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...
I see many projects done hereabouts because the money is "free" or nearly so.
back in The Bad Old Days, when democrats controlled the Iowa State Houses; some democrat (probably Michael Gronstal) said, about some scheme...
"It's Free Money, We HAVE TO take it"
The deal was something where; if Iowa spent a few Thousands of Dollars on a worthless project... the Feds would chip in MILLIONS (think it was Rainforest Dome viability studies or such)
I couldn't help but think that:
A) The Millions WEREN'T "free money". *I* was a citizen of the USA, and that was MY Money
B) The Thousands were REAL money.. REAL IOWA STATE TREASURY money
C) The project (what it was), was a COMPLETE WASTE
So the demos wanted to use Thousands of my state's money; to snaggo MILLIONS of my country's money, and throw ALL that away on a useless project, that the people proposing SAID was useless.... And, we should do this; 'cause it will be Free Money
Democrats SUCK SH*T
I think I would find off-campus housing.
When I went to UBC from 95-99, I survived on Cdn$0.16 packs of Mr. Noodles. I was so poor, I just needed a place to crash and study, and couldn't possibly have cared less whether I had a window or whether my housing blended with the university's surroundings.
Hell, the UBC governors didn't care whether the university buildings blended with the surroundings either given their preference for Soviet style architecture.
The UBC law school I went to was in a concrete bunker, the Curtis Building, built shortly after WW 2. It wasn't pretty, but then I was there to study and get a law degree, etc., not to worry about how the building fit with Pacific Spirit Park.
Ann Althouse said...
The building has windows in the common spaces but the individual rooms with beds are windowless
There are a variety of reason why a room has to have a window to be called a bedroom according to every building/renting code in the country that I have seen.
Most prisons are required to have windows to the outside in cells.
If they do this they are going to find out real fast that humans with no external view do not fair well mentally.
The rooftop has no outward view--why?
The donor's vision is that the small windowless bedrooms would "force" students to get out into the common spaces.
1) The 8 bedrooms are organized into a suite. Oh, I thought, so that will have windows and a comfortable common living room, so that's not so bad. I wouldn't mind so much having a private bedroom if I also had a larger room with some sunlight and a couch. Nope. No windows, and nothing that looks like a living room to me---just a kitchen and a large dining room table. One bathroom for 8+ people.
2) If having no window "forces" students out of their own room, doesn't that very premise prove the oppressive inhumanity of this design?
What do such rooms make me think of? Dying in a fire.
Leave it to Freeman Hunt toil inject practicality into this discussion. Well done, ma’am! Yes, how does this architecture pass building code?
Eight people. One toilet. One shower.
You certainly wouldn't want to live anywhere near someone whose personal hygiene was questionable. Unless the HVAC Systems in those windowless rooms were stellar.
Also: How would you ventilate pot smoke?
If no one smokes, and everyone bathes and washes super-regularly, this might work. Otherwise: Stench City.
I suspect students will spend most of their time in the room on a computer or a phone or using the bed. I suspect many won't miss a widow.
given the amount of crazy that happens within common areas of the universities nowadays, this project seems to be intentionally trying to punish students who'd prefer not to be part of that
McFadden: As a design solution and a campus building, however, the project will long outlive the circumstances of its origin and will impact the life of the campus and the lives of its students for multiple generations.
As is true for most durable buildings.
Most interesting about the article is that there is no quote or information from Charlie Munger. Not even a " ... couldn't be reached for comment."
Now that the design for the pods is complete, can we move on to the catering of the bugs?
Now that the design for the pods is complete, can we move on to the catering of the bugs?
I wouldn't go on a cruise ship either. They don't look seaworthy at all compared to QE2.
Container ships, too. I don't get how those stay upright.
My alma mater, UCSB has only grown in stature and size since my time there. My wife works on the campus.
It’s a former Marine Corps base and there are still a few military buildings. Some of the buildings from the Sixties were brutal, but the newer ones have brought new life to the campus. And much of that is the result of generous gifts from locals like Munger.
Still, the potential of the campus site has barely been tapped. It still needs a signature structure. This likely isn’t it.
My alma mater, UCSB has only grown in stature and size since my time there. My wife works on the campus.
It’s a former Marine Corps base and there are still a few military buildings. Some of the buildings from the Sixties were brutal, but the newer ones have brought new life to the campus. And much of that is the result of generous gifts from locals like Munger.
Still, the potential of the campus site has barely been tapped. It still needs a signature structure. This likely isn’t it.
There are 2 bathrooms for 8 people
Munger has already built a dorm like this behind the West Quad at the University of Michigan.
"94 percent of whom would not have windows in their small, single-occupancy bedrooms"
And will be occupied by whites. Probably not too far fetched to think that the privileged 6% will of course be black.
Munger Hall is straight out of a science fiction novel where everyone lives in concrete apartments, never sees the Sun and Earth's population is 40 billion. The seas are toxic waste dumps and rain is a witches brew. Only two exists for 4,500? It's a fire trap.
The J Edgar Hoover building is a classical style compared to this monstrosity. Why does the school want to concentrate the student body into one building instead of creating 45 100-student buildings with beautifully landscaped grounds between buildings? They must be really hard up for money to accept Munger's $200 million "donation."
The idea was conceived by 97-year-old billionaire-investor turned amateur-architect Charles Munger
No, the idea was infringed by Munger after being conceived by people who design jails and prisons.
Kids in cages?
isaac asimovs caves of steel, is not supposed to be aspirational
How old is Charlie Munger, again? 97? Born in 1924?
2 entrances? Meets fire code?
Universities will do anything for money.
Key word: Forced.
Charlie Munger’s grandfather was a federal judge in Lincoln who was appointed by TR.
Althouse noted: There are 2 bathrooms for 8 people.
I stand corrected. I'd followed the link that showed a 3-D mock-up and couldn't see the toilet in the one side. It does seem that there may be only one shower room.
According to the article, the building is expected to cost 1.5 billion.
My version of this experiment would have three options re different living/housing situations. The living/housing options that are being compared must cost the same amount and the options must be in the same location (say a thirty mile radius, or so). IOW you can’t compare these small Munger living quarters v living in a custom twelve thousand square foot waterfront house on ninety acres (with a helipad and helicopter, stables and dressage arena, and other such stuff). So pick one location and pick one budget number, then run the experiment.
Starting w/ equivalent costs/location, the experiments should look at what happens to:
1) people that are in the tight living situation that Munger likes
2) people that are in a max space and windowed situation for the same dough as the tight spots
3) people that have complete freedom to bounce between the tight living and max space living situations. Obviously these folks are enjoying a living situation that costs twice as much as is required by the folks that only live in either the tight places or the open places. But it’d be interesting to monitor this third category of people so we could see where they choose to spend most of their time. How much time do they spend in each type of living situation? Do they mostly stay in one type of living situation w/ breaks at the other type? Close to 50/50? A ton of questions, solutions and innovation could flow from looking at this third category of the experiment.
IMHO.
P.S. Anyone comparing living in a small place to being in jail should be embarrassed. FYI, in a jail cell you can’t leave.
Is this how the billionaires see all the little people?
Prediction - if built - it will be town down in 10-14 years.
BTW, Will the Munger rooms be isolated from each other and from shared spaces such that the kids can bone w/o sonically invading neighboring kids’ space?
And it’s not just sound re biz time: playing loud music or videos would also be annoying to others, but this could be very satisfying for the person playing such. IOW, people in small spaces may be a lot happier than people in larger spaces if the small spaces are well insulated and deeply (ha) separated from other peoples’ spaces. Maybe thinking about achieving the perception of having private space is more important than counting square feet.
I dunno.
It’s time for eye exams- this guy and Biden both- such unrealistic futuristic sight…
Don't go in there,,, it's the Matrix.
CA , earthquake fault zone etc. --- structural integrity better with / without windows?
Japanese may be intrigued and interested.
/Cockroach Central/ properly called Imperial Security Building was designed by Lord Dono Vorrutyer has no windows and also partially underground.
Vorkosigan Saga books by Lois McMasters Bujold.
Bujold is the daughter of the famous Robert Charles McMaster, an Ohio State University welding engineer professor who edited the Nondestructive Testing Handbook.
It's college. Boy meets girl. But (from the illustration) the beds are very narrow -- maybe 30" wide. Too narrow for boy and girl to spend the night together. Sad.
/Cockroach Central/ properly called Imperial Security Building was designed by Lord Dono Vorrutyer has no windows and also partially underground.
Vorkosigan Saga books by Lois McMasters Bujold.
Bujold is the daughter of the famous Robert Charles McMaster, an Ohio State University welding engineer professor who edited the Nondestructive Testing Handbook.
MUNGER GRADUATE RESIDENCES
Located on Central Campus, the Munger Graduate Residences are designed specifically for graduate and professional level students from all U-M schools and colleges to actively engage in a transdisciplinary community. Transdisciplinary living brings a diverse mix of graduate and professional students from various fields together to live, study and build a culture of collaboration. You’ll join other graduate students in a furnished apartment with 6 or 7 single-occupancy bedroom suites, each with a private bathroom. The suites also include a very large kitchen, dining room and community space.
When you live in Munger, you’ll become part of a unique community of thinkers, designers and doers. Through everyday interactions and organized Munger programs, you’ll inhabit an environment that asks you to grow, adapt and thrive. You’ll leave here with a once-in-a-lifetime experience that gives you unprecedented preparation for the diverse and rapidly-changing professional world.
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they would be well prepared to get on space ship and leave for GalaxyQuest if provided single-occupancy bedroom suites, each with a private bathroom.
Althouse noted: There are 2 bathrooms for 8 people.
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SanFranciscans can advise on how to achieve that special ambiance
Althouse noted: There are 2 bathrooms for 8 people.
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SanFrancisco-ans can advise on how to achieve that special ambiance
It's so big it will depend on a lot of complex systems working just to get hot water working all the time, plus electricity plus air conditioning plus broadband. Does California seem like a place that will be able to keep complex systems running? Embrace simple and small and on the ground floor, something a Guatemalan can fix and a candle can light, close to nature and the exits.
Munger: Hey McFadden, what do you think of my building design?
McFadden: There's no windows.
Munger: It's a radical new concept.
McFadden: There's no windows.
Munger: It's a social and psychological experiment.
McFadden: There's no windows.
Munger: There's gonna be these porthole things...
McFadden: Charles, how do you spell windows?
Munger: W-I-N-D-O-W
McFadden: You forgot the F.
Munger: There's no F in windows.
McFadden: That's what I keep telling you. There's no F'ing windows!
I'd think any 'modern' student would also know that any screen that can show you a camera view of the outside world is also likely to have a pinhole size camera showing you to someone else. What a great way to monitor your students. Build it right into the the structure of the room.
CA , earthquake fault zone etc. --- structural integrity better with / without windows?
Well, during the Loma Prieta (1989) earthquake in San Francisco (which burned up a whole city block in the Marina district and dropped an elevated freeway across the Bay in Oakland), not a pane of glass was lost from any of the skyscrapers in the Financial District.
But, really... what do you think of the "social and psychological experiment" known as "Charlie’s Vision"? People sleep in those inside staterooms on cruise ships. If you're committed to using your room just as a place to sleep and to store your things and you'd like for yourself and others to be forced out into the common areas, it might work well!
1: People sleep in those inside staterooms because that's all they can afford. As students aren't currently living like that, it's clear that's not an issue here
2: The inside staterooms are for a week or less, not for 3+ months
3: It's very left wing: let's destroy everyone's private space! Because n one should ever be able to go off and be alone!
You must always be with the People, comrade!
4: I get a lot more studying and homework done in a room by myself, that I've set up the way I like, rather than in a "commons" room set up the way someone else likes, with lots of talking, noise, etc.
It's a hideous, shitty idea
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