"... in some contexts. Mike Pesca, the host of 'The Gist,' a podcast on news and culture... made his argument during a conversation last week with colleagues on the interoffice messaging platform Slack. In a lengthy thread of messages, Slate staff members were discussing the resignation of Donald G. McNeil Jr., a reporter who said this month that he was resigning from The New York Times after he had used the slur during a discussion of racism while working as a guide on a student trip in 2019.... Jacob Weisberg, Slate’s former chairman and editor in chief [said]... 'I don’t think he did anything that merits discipline or consequences, and I think it’s an example of a kind of overreaction and a lack of judgment and perspective that is unfortunately spreading'... Joel Anderson, a Black staff member at Slate... disagreed. 'For Black employees, it’s an extremely small ask to not hear that particular slur and not have debate about whether it’s OK for white employees to use that particular slur,' he said."
ADDED: If a place of business wants to have zero-tolerance rule that says you will lose your job if you ever say the syllables of the n-word, that's one thing. But I don't see how the policy can be, as Joel Anderson suggests, that it only applies to white employees. That's overt and unsubtle race discrimination, and it would, I think, be hard to argue that it's not a violation of statutory law. Would Anderson support a rule that required the firing of black employees who happen to slip into say the word? I don't think I've ever heard anyone push for a rule like that. So I think the employer would be well advised to take the context of the saying of the word into account.
AND: A race-neutral zero-tolerance rule would create a much greater risk for black people. I think it's very easy for white people to avoid ever saying the word. Some just don't think we should be so repressed and sensitive about the word — as opposed to its use as an insult. But if the rule is you'll be fired if you ever say it, regardless of context, white people will abide by the rule.
Posts
215 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 215 of 215Inga said...
Ah, Achilles falls back into his everyone who disagrees with me is a fascist...even if they basically agree with him.Yawn. Sigh.
This person thinks Trump should be censored.
This person agrees with anyone who supports Trump on any platform being censored.
Because they are "lying."
Inga thinks questioning the election is "the big lie" and should get you censored.
But she isn't a fascist.
Discuss.
Inga said...As I said, people want to believe what they want to believe. The Big Lie about the election being stolen is still truth to these people.
This is rich coming from someone who believed that Trump stole the election in 2016 with Russian help. And you were one of the true believers.
“This person thinks Trump should be censored.”
Trump has plenty of platforms to get his message out.
“This person agrees with anyone who supports Trump on any platform being censored.”
You live in a very dark world of your delusional thinking. Trump supporters have platforms to express themselves. Extremists also.
“Because they are "lying."
“Inga thinks questioning the election is "the big lie" and should get you censored.”
No, questioning it isn’t the Big Lie. Declaring that the election was stolen is the Big Lie. You can question it ‘till the cows come home.
Cancel culture has nothing to do with punishing wrongdoers. It is about control. The Woke don't care if Mike Pesca made an innocent mistake, they want to make an example out of a White man in a way that furthers their social, economic and political agenda. If anything, Mr. Pesca's "mens rea" is an active impediment to the realization of their plans.
Most decent people believe that only the guilty should be punished in a manner that is proportional to their crime. We believe that criminals who commit the same crime should be treated equally. And we take mitigating factors into account when we punish. It's pretty obvious that the Woke are deviating from this system of punishment for some reason. What the hell did Mike Pesca do to justify this absolute sh*t storm? The Woke staffers at the Slate are deranged filth.
@Achilles:
But I believe those are bargains made between government and people not between employee and employer, and therefor not relevant to this particular discussion.
...
The fastest way to make sure this does not happen is to get lawyers, HR, and government involved in company/employee negotiation.
The problem with this line of thinking is that "government", "people", "employee", and "employer" are not discrete groups that interact on a voluntary basis. They are a web of overlapping social relationships, organizations, and interactions. "Employers" are a small set of the "people" but still have a much greater influence on "government." They have pushed for policies that strengthen their position and weaken the position of labor. Part of the agenda of the neoliberal reforms was to increase business profits by keeping low-skilled wages down. There isn't a neutral free labor market option. A little more inefficiency in the labor markets may be a small price to pay for a less unequal society.
Inga said...
Trump has plenty of platforms to get his message out.
You are just a dishonest person. Make a list and entertain us all.
You live in a very dark world of your delusional thinking. Trump supporters have platforms to express themselves. Extremists also.
I love the justifications dumb people use to justify their indefensible positions.
No, questioning it isn’t the Big Lie. Declaring that the election was stolen is the Big Lie. You can question it ‘till the cows come home.
But you can't question it on any news media or any major social media platform.
And Inga supports the removal of Parler from AWS.
Inga supports ongoing efforts to shut down Oann, Epoch Times.
Inga supports Disney firing Gina Carano.
But Inga is not a fascist because there are still outlets that haven't been stomped on by her giant corporate masters.
It is entertaining that you think this is a good argument.
J. Farmer said...
The problem with this line of thinking is that "government", "people", "employee", and "employer" are not discrete groups that interact on a voluntary basis. They are a web of overlapping social relationships, organizations, and interactions. "Employers" are a small set of the "people" but still have a much greater influence on "government." They have pushed for policies that strengthen their position and weaken the position of labor. Part of the agenda of the neoliberal reforms was to increase business profits by keeping low-skilled wages down. There isn't a neutral free labor market option. A little more inefficiency in the labor markets may be a small price to pay for a less unequal society.
You need to differentiate between Amazon style employers and the vast majority of companies in the US that have less than 10000 employees.
I think the answer here is to regulate giant corporations differently than you regulate normal sized companies.
With the eventual goal of eliminating giant corporations that have excessive influence doe to their size.
J. Farmer said...
Joe Smith:
The progressive left are fascists.
The closest realization of the fascist ideal is private enterprise, where wage earners must submit themselves to the orders and disciplines of a master. Power flows top-down and is concentrated among a small number of owners and investors."
Well now that J. Farmer has come out so to speak as a nationalist communist Robert Cook isn't the only out communist but at least he isn't the nationalist type.
Inga you cut and paste, assume things as fact when they are not so and then reply with banalities for the most part. While some like Achilles may go to far in the rhetoric on occasion their underlying point still holds.
As for the the infamous N word when does Woodrow Wilson get cancelled? When does FDR get cancelled? Then there is Lyndon Johnson bragging on how he will have the N words voting Democrat for two hundred years by passing the civil rights act. When does he and the poisoned fruit of his vote buying scheme get cancelled?
I'm just gonna leave this here
Nigger. Is that what this whole thing is about? Where is George Carlin's 'Filthy Words. Lenny Bruce?
We watch a dream that was America, that men once dreamt, fade away into the mist of time.
We call each other names. We get angry and reach into our vocabulary that is meant to hurt.
It's not a new thing. It's the pain of melting. American's melt into each other. Damn good at it. We will not appreciate this thing, til' it's gone. Going...going...gone.
Interesting, each side thinks the other has gone stark raving mad.
Of course, there is always this
Gusty Winds said...
If you were in a professional environment, even blue collar factories etc… if you were in a meeting and called a woman a C U Next Tuesday… you’d get fired.
Some gynecologist couldn’t get away with using the C U Next Tuesday term for a vagina just because it’s his favorite. “Hi sweetheart, let’s strap you get in the stirrups and take a close look at that C_nT”
That is true.
And it's true for both men and women.
If you said to the white guy sitting across the table from you to “blow me”, you’d probably get fired.
As a manager, if I referred to a Hispanic employee as a Sp>>>K or and Asian employee as a C>>>nk, even in the third person, I’d probably get fired.
Yep. And it wouldn't matter what your skin color is.
I guess I see N word restriction as all of the above.
Nope. because unlike all those other restrictions, the Left wants there to be a special "anointed" class of people who are allowed to do all those things, and face no punishment.
And THAT is what's wrong, and what you are consistently ignoring.
"Anyone who says the N word gets fired." Great. No problem.
"Any 'white' person who says the N word gets fired. Any 'black' person can say the N word whenever he or she wants, without repercussion"
FOAD.
Stop beating up the straw man, and join the real discussion.
@Achilles:
You need to differentiate between Amazon style employers and the vast majority of companies in the US that have less than 10000 employees.
I think the answer here is to regulate giant corporations differently than you regulate normal sized companies
I agree. We already do this. The government uses various employee numbers and revenue ranges to categorize business according to size, to which differing regulatory and tax policies apply.
@cubanbob:
Well now that J. Farmer has come out so to speak as a nationalist communist Robert Cook isn't the only out communist but at least he isn't the nationalist type.
Regulating the labor market isn't "nationalist communist." It's what every market economy does. All markets are regulated. The "free market" is a theoretical construct; it does not exist in real life. Political borders regulate markets. Municipal zoning and planning offices and building code departments regulate markets.
What "deregulation" means in practice is removing decision-making from the political realm and transferring it to a small group of concentrated private wealth. Unsurprisingly, they have pursued a course of action that has been greatly beneficial to themselves and very disruptive and destructive to another segment of society.
We have an ultra-wealthy elite that is committed to market liberalization and the free movement of capital and people. Globalizing the division of labor is their ultimate end. Thinking that "communism" has any relevance to the current political situation is so fucking out to lunch.
"free market" is a theoretical construct; it does not exist in real life."
They exist everywhere. They are organic. But first. let's define what constitutes a 'market'.
"Any time where two or more people get together for purpose of trade without preconditions or coercion." An absolute auction is a good example. An even better one that we've all experienced is a garage sale. I think we all remember when the personal computer hardware market started and how even as demand ramped up prices kept falling and quality and performance kept getting better. I kept hearing, "It's like the wild west out there." That's because there was no one looking over the producers shoulder telling them what they must do. Free markets do exist. They have to. We experience the 'invisible hand' every day.
(An absolute auction is one where there are no reserves and no bid limits. The auctioneer can cry for an opening bid of a thousand dollars but if you offer up two dollars then that's where the bidding starts.)
Post a Comment