Said Jenny Brackett, an assistant administrator at UW Medicine, quoted in
"A failed freezer forced an overnight dash to give out more than 1,600 doses of the coronavirus vaccine" (WaPo).
“URGENT: We have 588 DOSE 1 MODERNA appointments available Jan. 28 11 p.m. to Jan. 29 2 a.m.,” Swedish Hospital tweeted at 10:59 p.m. Pacific time with a link to book slots, limiting sign-ups to those in high-priority groups already cleared to receive the vaccine.
At UW Medical Center-Northwest, people like Brackett called out for people 65 and over, walking up and down a queue of hundreds that snaked through hallways and then spilled outside.
“I was a little worried that the line maybe would not be too thrilled,” she said. “You know, that I am letting others go first. But that wasn’t the response I had at all. Actually, the crowd kind of cheered.”
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83 comments:
Why aren't they giving the shot round the clock, 24 hours a day to begin with?
I think the priority system is flawed from the outset. All comers works best, particularly since the first to show up will be the spreader population, and that kills the disease the fastest right when it's spreading.
Immunizing somebody who never goes out has no effect on the disease at all.
This is what we get for trusting government to do this - spectacular, albeit predictable inefficiency. If we had someone like Walgreens or CVS (or both) doing it and letting them profit a bit, the results would be dramatically different.
Blogger rhhardin said...I think the priority system is flawed from the outset. All comers works best,
If the supply is unlimited, this is correct—you do outreach for vulnerable populations, but also vaccinate as many as you can without concern for priority. And in a month or two, it will be fair to start complaining that they are not doing this (because most states won’t be).
But now, when supplies are limited, we have to focus the vaccines on where they’ll do the most good.
Here's the important question.
Did the people cheer because of a sense of fairness - (liberals) or because of a respect for our elders (tradition) - (conservatives?
Probably it was both, clapping for different reasons.
The vaccines do the most good if they're put where the spreaders are. Old people are safe at home, neither contracting the disease nor spreading it.
The problem is exponential spread, not shut-ins.
Since Biden has said he expects to be able to vaccinate 300 people by the end of the summer, yes, that's what he said, and he repeated it, I don't expect to be eligible for a couple of decades at that rate. With the successes that have been happening concurrently in the realm of therapeutics, by the end of the summer I expect how many doses of vaccine are available to be largely moot unless the government puts its thumb on the scales and refuses to approve the treatments.
I'm betting that half the state will be vaccinated before I am called for my turn. And I'm betting that younger liberals and progressives, in particular, are jumping the line based on what I've heard. Causing the death rate to drop would open up the state and the death rate will not drop till the older people, who are 80 to 90 % of all deaths, are vaccinated.
Vaccine distributors have to keep people under observation for at least fifteen minutes because there are instances of allergic reactions or fainting. This requires a large room for social distancing. And there has to be a freezer for the vaccine. This limits the number of places that can distribute. Distributors make appointments for members of the prioritized groups. But if some of these people don't show up then the extra doses are distributed at the end of the day. These end-of-day distributions are going to people on the internet who are monitoring distributors for these opportunities. This has been going on in Wisconsin since day one. Better to use vaccines than waste them but, by this means, scarce vaccine shots are going to younger people who are not likely to get very sick. Then there are the special opportunities for hospital donors, politicians, and their relatives. In short, there's a gray area and obscure motions within it.
If we are going to debate the priority system, everyone should be given an antibodies test and those with antibodies should go to the end of the line. The top priority for getting the vaccine should then be those most likely to catch the virus and spread it (super spreaders). I doubt if there are many superspreaders in the 75+ age group.
After that, they can play their game any way they want. I think if they would have started with my 1st 2 steps, the virus would have been under control in 6 weeks.
My priority is to stop or at least slow the spread, theirs is to save lives. I think my way does both and theirs doesn't.
A process that is complicated, inefficient and has preferences based on expert guidance. The same experts that put in place the lockdowns. Can’t imagine there’d be a better way to do it.
RichAndSceptical said...
Here's the important question.
Did the people cheer because of a sense of fairness - (liberals) or because of a respect for our elders (tradition) - (conservatives?
I’m sure you’re right that there were lots of different motivations for the clapping (for instance, most were clapping simply because others were clapping); just to be clear, though, sense of fairness is also a conservative tradition and respect for elders is also a liberal (though perhaps not leftist) tradition.
It's a great story. Rhhardin is correct, but it's not politically possible. AFAIK, the vaccination centers are staffed mostly by volunteers. The pharmacies are also going to be in the mix as it rolls out.
Complaining isn't going to speed up the process. Volunteer to help out is the best way to make it better.
Like Mom said about the Great Depression: "Back then, you had to be happy with the little things."
A failed freezer
I wonder what really happened.
rhhardin said...
The vaccines do the most good if they're put where the spreaders are. Old people are safe at home, neither contracting the disease nor spreading it.
The problem is exponential spread, not shut-ins.
You reduce hospitalizations and deaths by protecting the people who are most likely to be hospitalized and die. Your assumption that the people who advocate for themselves to get an early vaccine will be the biggest spreaders is unfounded. People in nursing homes, where the first round is focussed, are the most dangerous spreaders and the most vulnerable victims.
"we have to focus the vaccines on where they’ll do the most good."
I would argue we have to get needles into arms as quickly as possible, and not dither about "focus".
Older people are getting covid and dying. These deaths are driving the panic. Vaccinate the older people. Deaths will die down to mere fraction of what they are now. That's what is rational. But the news media isn't covering that story. It isn't part of what they think the blue boobies should know. So people are scared who have no reason to be. And, especially in blue states, blue boobies are damaging economies with lockdowns and social distancing and, also, they are diverting vaccines to younger people who don't need them.
The vaccines do the most good if they're put where the spreaders are. Old people are safe at home, neither contracting the disease nor spreading it.
The problem is exponential spread, not shut-ins.
The problem with your theory, which has been put to the test and found wanting in the real world, BTW, is that the experience, the actual experience, in Israel shows that vaccinating the elderly drives down hospitalizations rapidly. In Israel it looks like the vaccine is working as promised.
The following comment is not aimed at rhhardin, who probably has a dozen IQ points on me at least, even if he is a little set in his ways.
If any of you deniers out there are going to claim that the Israeli experience is due to “seasonality” please explain to me why then the curve is discontinuous. If it were seasonal and natural, the curve would be continuous. Outside interventions produce discontinuous curves. If you don’t know what I am talking about, you are probably not qualified to comment on this in public, but, as we know, it’s a free country, blather away.
The new Johnson and Johnson vaccine is about 65% effective and if given out in massive numbers to low risk of hospitalization populations, the pandemic will collapse. Save Moderna and Pfizer for people like transplant patients, whatever their age, who are at 20% risk of dying if they catch it, or people over 55, where the risk curve starts to bend upwards.
"Older people are getting covid and dying. These deaths are driving the panic. Vaccinate the older people. Deaths will die down to mere fraction of what they are now.”
IT was deemed more important to get Joe Biden elected kleptocrat in chief. They actually delayed the vaccine by six weeks or even more in service of this goal, so wherever we are in six weeks? That’s where we would be today, except that the deaths didn’t matter as much as the fact that the Democrats wanted control of the government again.
Anybody wants to call bullshit on the six week delays? I have the receipts and will post them on request.
In Hartford, CT they are reportedly running a 10-line drive-up vaccination program in the UConn football stadium parking lot. 75 and older.
Aside from the chaos of having a lot of confused 80-year olds and their 60-something offspring driving into a 10-lane parking lot, it seems like a relatively efficient way to get a lot of people done with appropriate distancing.
"Anybody wants to call bullshit on the six week delays? I have the receipts and will post them on request."
Not calling BS...is that really necessary? Post them please.
rhhardin said... The vaccines do the most good if they're put where the spreaders are. Old people are safe at home, neither contracting the disease nor spreading it.
The problem is exponential spread, not shut-ins.
OMG...you are using logic and common sense. What is wrong with you? (/sarcasm)
We are supposed to be in an emotional panic and do whatever the gubbmnit says.
Speaking as a person who is in a low population area. In a location with zero cases. Who doesn't go to big gatherings...10 people in the local grocery store is a crowd. Who spends most of her time at home, especially now with snow on the ground.......I don't plan to rush to get vaccinated.
I'm going to wait to see what happens to everyone else before I jump onto the leaky boat.
They set up Fenway and Gillette out here to do mass innoculations
Paco Wové said...
"we have to focus the vaccines on where they’ll do the most good."
I would argue we have to get needles into arms as quickly as possible, and not dither about "focus".
Curious that you managed to not include the part where I directly address your argument.
“But now, when supplies are limited, we have to focus the vaccines on where they’ll do the most good.”
But if we all get the COVID vaccine will people start dying from Flu and Pneumonia and Cancer again?
The best part about 2020 is we found the cure to Pneumonia.
We should make sure we don't lose that.
"I'm going to wait to see what happens to everyone else before I jump onto the leaky boat."
I think that line might be longer than the vaccine line.
“But now, when supplies are limited, we have to focus the vaccines on where they’ll do the most good.”
Which is in the areas and for people who are out and about, working, spreading the Covid-flu. Not on old people who are safe at home and have minimal contacts.
Personally, I think everyone should get to decide for themselves based on their OWN levels of activity, exposure risks, geographic determinations, ability to minimize contacts and health conditions.
Herding people into a group of 800 strangers, to stand in line for hours for a vaccine that is still somewhat experimental, for a virus that has a 95% to 98% rate of recovery seems to be a pretty stupid tactic.
Me:"I'm going to wait to see what happens to everyone else before I jump onto the leaky boat."
I think that line might be longer than the vaccine line.
Yes. And I can wait comfortably at home, read a book, bake a cake, watch the snow fall outside, enjoy looking at the birds on the feeders, play on the internet, work in my garden, sew a quilt, watch some movies on Netflix, take a nice long nap.
You do you.
As with extended warranties, I'm always leery of anything aggressively marketed.
When 2021 sets a record for Cancer deaths, will we talk about why?
Yipee! Leaky Boat?
Public health officials have said over and over that they do not know if COVID-19 vaccines prevent spread
Pfizer did not test human subjects to see if those vaccinated could get and spread the infection, but when they tested primates, vaccinated animals still got COVID-19 despite being vaccinated
I can wait!
Virtue signaling is now more important than life itself
Dust Bunny Queen said...
Herding people into a group of 800 strangers, to stand in line for hours for a vaccine that is still somewhat experimental, for a virus that has a 95% to 98% rate of recovery seems to be a pretty stupid tactic.
In any sample group of 800 strangers that can actually stand in a line for more than 30 minutes the recovery rate will be a limit approaching 100%.
"Freezer
[MODERNA] Vaccine may be stored in a freezer between -25°C and -15°C (-13°F and 5°F)
...
Refrigerator
Vaccine vials may be stored in the refrigerator between 2°C and 8°C (36°F and 46°F) for up to 30 days before vials are punctured. After 30 days, remove any remaining vials from the refrigerator and discard following manufacturer and jurisdiction guidance on proper disposal."
I wonder what really happened.
The vaccine is only going to make a marginal difference.
Roughly half the US population isn’t susceptible in the first place.
Of the remaining half, probably 25-ish million are known cases, and at least 75 million more have been infected.
Assuming those 25 million cases don’t get vaccinated, ⅔ of the shots will be wasted.
Winnie Xi Pox will have nearly run out of people to infect before there are enough vaccinations to make a difference.
(36°F and 46°F)
That's very close to the daily termperature range in Seattle; They could've stored the vaccines by putting them outside.
“But now, when supplies are limited, we have to focus the vaccines on where they’ll do the most good.”
The vaccines aren't the only limitation. Time is limited also, because vaccine doses can go bad if not used quickly. In an ideal world, we could create and execute vaccination plans with lots of 'focus'. In 21st century America, bureaucratic attention to 'focus' apparently gets a lot of wasted vaccine that would have been better going into anybody's arm, instead of in the trash.
In New York, what the UW people did (enabling queue-jumping) would be a crime.
What do you mean 'Old people are shut in's'. I and my neighbors are all in their 70's. We are not cringing behind the curtains, afraid to go out. We are out and about.
It is better to go by age, a true criteria for getting and possibly dying that to go by Race.
Any complaints from you about prisoners getting first in line?
Piss off, quit bashing us OLD People.
"UW" is not University of Wisconsin but that other imposter university, I presume. Can't tell for sure because of the WaPo paywall.
University of Washington, where that other fraudster, chris murray works,
A failed freezer
I wonder what really happened.
——————-
A leaky refrigerant line?
tim in vermont said...
...the actual experience, in Israel shows that vaccinating the elderly drives down hospitalizations rapidly.
Is this supposed to be some big revelation? Of all the age cohorts (children, young adults,... nursing home patients), which ones are being hospitalized after contracting COVID? The elderly, so OF COURSE immunizing this particular group is going to have a big effect on hospitalizations. And that's great as far as it goes. So now, following this guideline, we have a bunch of nursing home people who are (relatively) safe from contracting COVID, but the rest of the population not so much. Maybe that somewhat younger population is not being hospitalized as frequently as the elderly, but they may suffer from other serious complications of the disease.
You know what else would drive down hospitalizations? Immunizing the people who come into contact with these elderly nursing home and quarantined folks. If the elderly population never comes into contact with someone who is contagious, then they can't contract the disease. (Also, since they are 'quarantined', the elderly are not spreaders.)
Both scenarios drive down hospitalizations significantly. The second scenario also drives down the disease in the front-line essential worker population who need to be healthy to take care of the elderly, and not be quarantined at home for two weeks.
In a perfect scenario, everyone would be immunized within a very short period of time. In the situation that we are discussing of a slow roll-out, turning essential worker 'spreaders' into non-threatening workers on behalf of the elderly is a two-for-one.
My alma mater, University of Woke.
Discovered this week that I really did have Covid last summer (antibody test). Wasn't very sick, especially considering how immunocompromised I am. Probably exposed to a low viral load, which makes sense since I am pretty careful.
In Wisconsin, they just opened up group 1B, which is adults GTE 65. Group 1C (not yet open) is immunocompromised people. Seems backwards to me.
""UW" is not University of Wisconsin but that other imposter university, I presume. Can't tell for sure because of the WaPo paywall."
Oh! That's why the place names didn't make sense.
I wonder what really happened.
——————-
A leaky refrigerant line?
Well, per CDC instructions, the Moderna vaccine can be stored in a regular refrigerator for a month, or, in the case of Seattle and its temperatures at this time of year, even just put outside the building, so there were very easy solutions to a "failed freezer" problem.
I'm guessing that it was just a publicity stunt.
“I think the priority system is flawed from the outset. All comers works best, particularly since the first to show up will be the spreader population, and that kills the disease the fastest right when it's spreading.”
Exactly right. But having politically weaponized the panic of old folks, the Donks have to stick to the Kabuki, regardless of how many bodies they stack.
I got on a waiting list yesterday and they asked me what my race is. So that’s going to be another exploitable source of hysterics as vaccination moves forward. Mind you, that might not be a bad thing. Probably the very quickest way to arrest the spread of Covid would be to vaccinate first-generation Hispanics and urban Blacks first. Can’t say that aloud, natch.
But, in fairness, this was always going to be a clusterfuck, no matter who oversaw it. But that doesn’t mean their faces shouldn’t be ground in it.
“My alma mater, University of Woke”
At least the next round of riots won’t turn into another super-spreader....
800
1600
588
Which is it?
In any event, this is how the ideas of "privilege" and lack of "equity" come up. Very few people actually follow Tw*tter. It favors the elite over the socially disadvantaged.
In other news in Joe Biden's police state, now it is not just state and local governments issuing orders controlling personal behavior, now the CDC has just seized the reins of authoritarian power to issue, not a guidance, but an ORDER mandating that every person in every corner of the country, no matter how remote and unaffected, wear a mask when on a public conveyance.
https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/masks/mask-travel-guidance.html
Before you usual suspects do your usual thing, note that this really isn't about the masks, it is about an unelected federal agency dictating to private citizens what they can and cannot do under the guise of "emergency" powers.
You know, since the time of a guy named Julius, the danger of emergency powers has been well known.
I think that this is the third story I've read about a freezer failing with Covid vaccine in it. It's strange how a fairly common occurrence can repeatedly become national news just because it's Covid related.
Over 65-Washingtonian here who has been trying to get an appointment for the past week (Inslee opened up Phase 1b to those over 65 on Monday). I can tell you that it's one big clusterfuck and completely dependent upon who you know and the underground rumor mill.
Instead of focusing on big mega- sites, the vaccine is being distributed in small (1000-2000 at a time) all over the state. So, on Tuesday, the mega drive-in site in Wenatchee opened up for appts on Wednesday and Thursday. They were filled within hours. One person reported that they refreshed the Wenatchee page every 1/2 hour beginning Tuesday morning and the minute it opened up she was able to snag spots for her elderly parents. Local Costco's opened up on Thursday - all appts filled w/in hours.
Friday morning, the news reported a new mega drive-in site in Arlington (about 45 minute drive from where we live). However, the Arlington web page opened up sometime on Thursday (that is, BEFORE the news), so by the time I read about it, the two-day (Friday and Saturday) appts. were filled.
Accordingly, when we are home, my husband and I are sitting on our computer, refreshing certain pages every hour or so, hoping to hit the jackpot. We also have asked friends and family to let us know if they hear anything. Based on my FB feed, the people who got an appt. all knew in advance when a certain Costco - or Fred Meyer - or local clinic - was receiving their supply and appts. would be opening up.
If they ran the mega-sites 24/7, they would vaccinate a huge share of the over 65 population within days. But instead, it's going to take weeks/months.
Oh, and of course, it's all Trumps fault somehow.
Kathryn, look at the potentially bright side: No one, and I mean NO ONE, knows what, if any, long term effects there could be with this very new and hitherto untried type of vaccine. If I get one at all, it will be the Johnson & Johnson version. Less effective, supposedly, but also less risky.
Oh really
https://dossier.substack.com/p/silencing-dissent-how-social-media?r=6a3x3&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&utm_source=twitter
"Swedish Hospital tweeted at 10:59 p.m. Pacific time "
Because Pacific time gives the best context.......
By the way, with limited doses available, maybe testing for 'Ronabodies first would be helpful.
I know..crazy talk.
the Johnson & Johnson version --
produced from the remains of an intentionally killed innocent human being.
OK, Mark, maybe the Astra Zeneca version [chimpanzees]. Then I get to hear from the PETA members of my family.
loudogblog said...
I think that this is the third story I've read about a freezer failing with Covid vaccine in it. It's strange how a fairly common occurrence can repeatedly become national news just because it's Covid related.
This is kinda like that tragic boating accident I had with all of my guns.
It is almost as if anything the Government is involved in is corrupt.
I love that story about the WI pharmacist who intentionally left vax sit out.
They waited to test the vax to determine whether it truly was spoiled before considering punishment.
The line was filled with young people. College age. For a vaccine against a disease that has a 99.7 percent survival rate.
What a stupid time to be alive.
kind of cheered
WTH does that mean.
This story exemplifies the terror that reporting on COVID has engendered.
AZ vaccine is also produced from the unethical abortion-derived cell line.
Don't worry. The new and improved theologians over in Rome have decreed that it is OK to be connected to evil if it is remote enough for their tastes (your conscience doesn't count) and the goal is preferable enough. Sounds to me like utilitarian, ends justifies the means, outcome determinative BS to me, but what do I know, having the audacity to think for myself.
Oh, I did forget to mention that those new and improved theologians said that if you take the just-a-little-evil vaccines, be sure to say, "I object!" and write a sternly worded letter to the pharmaceutical.
The new and improved theologians over in Rome
Theologians in Rome? Who knew?
For the record, Mark, I'm not planning to get any COVID vaccine.
While I'm sorta of in the higher risk group, I have no intention of racing out and getting vaccinated. Perfectly willing for others to be the Guinea pigs. Social Distancing and whatever has been working so far, no reason it can't work for another month or two.
Besides the higher risk group I'm in, has a 99.5% survival rate. If an old, fat guy like trump can survive it, I can.
The over 65 crowd is at risk, but even then, the death rate goes up with age, and a 65 y/o is at less risk than a 75 y/o. And then there are the co-morbidities (obesity, heart disease, COPD, etc) which REALLY make a difference. I hope they aren't just prioritizing by age.
"Immunizing somebody who never goes out has no effect on the disease at all."
Obviously, those at zero risk won't be helped by a vaccination. 0 x whatever is still zero.
But if we immunize the groups who clog up the Intensive care units first, we're way ahead in the game. After all if healthy groups give each other the disease it matters little.
At UW Medical Center-Northwest, people like Brackett called out for people 65 and over, walking up and down a queue of hundreds that snaked through hallways and then spilled outside.
Your crystal is flashing!!
I'm late to this comment party but any adult should be able to figure out that at least part of, if not the complete story is bullshit.
Here is a thread from Stephen McIntrye examining the political pressure put on the FDA to delay approval, which they did by suspending the testing of samples, resuming them again the day after the election
https://twitter.com/ClimateAudit/status/1334164012297310210
You know what else would drive down hospitalizations? Immunizing the people who come into contact with these elderly nursing home and quarantined folks.
Yeah, if we had enough vaccine to go around and every old person was locked away in a nursing home. Believe it or not, lots of elderly people live at home normal lives. My grandmother lived at home by herself until she was 94.
I am just curious, have you done the math on your idea? We have done real world implementations of Israel’s model, and it works. There is no perfect solution, and right now the perfect is the enemy of the good.
"The vaccine is only going to make a marginal difference.”
I bet there will never be enough evidence to convince you otherwise. As the pandemic recedes, you will say it was its natural course. You are very predictable.
Looks like in the real world the Pfizer vaccine might be 99.6% effective
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9199645/Two-Pfizer-doses-99-96-effective-research-Israel-suggests.html
Use 24/7 media to induce unrelenting fear and panic and yes, the citizenry will show up in droves when the "cure" is suddenly available.
I'm not convinced the vaccine didn't precede the virus, if you get my drift.
The Moderna vaccine has to be refrigerated, and it goes bad after 30 days. That's one major reason we're seeing supply shortages, I suspect. The logistics are a nightmare. I'll bet they've already had to destroy a lot of doses.
The Novavax vaccine lasts for six months, so an EUA for that vaccine should happen asap. It was tested in UK and had 96% efficacy on the original strain, plus 85% efficacy on the mutation strain, for an overall efficacy of 89%.
Funny the college-age kids driving their Subaru WRX's with full mask on, all alone. What are the going to catch, infected exhaust fumes? Ignorance prevails in daily life.
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