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December 8, 2020
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152 comments:
I'm guessing the object on the right is Martian poop.
Rand Paul: There's no evidence that lockdowns change coronavirus trajectories.
A pretty big deal going at the USSC. Texas is suing four other states because of those states' election behavior. Several other states have now joined Texas as plaintiffs.
What's super note-worthy is that the case is filed using the USSC's original, not its appellate, jurisdiction.
Court has ordered the four states to respond by Thursday afternoon.
Case has potential of exploding the Democrats' fraud.
Hope AA has a post on this in the morning.
Bilwick said...
I'm guessing the object on the right is Martian poop.
"Psalm Psoop!
...that's what I got a handful of when I grabbed the pup's tail, joking, naked, in the alley, after tripping on the throw rug, after my shower"
Ann, whatever happened to thise little doodle mice you used to draw and share with us?
Thanks Wisconsin for Ron Johnson. What an idiot.
China Joe was out walking around without his walking-boot. Like there was no hairline fracture at all in his foot. Imagine that.
https://freebeacon.com/democrats/bidens-epa-frontrunner-worked-to-ban-gas-powered-cars/
Are they out of their frickin' minds?
https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2020/12/blacks-are-wary-of-covid-vaccine-why-is-that.php
How curious
https://mobile.twitter.com/ClimateAudit/status/1336499302592557056
Ron Johnson is there to balance out the morons like Liz Warren.
Very interesting
https://mobile.twitter.com/ProfMJCleveland/status/1336433347803967490
And chris dunce cap murphy.
According to president elect Biden he’s nominating a guy named bakaria for the Health and Education.....you know the thing.
Gonna be fun
Becerra, hes so dumb...youd have to water him.
Happy Safe Harbor Day everyone.
I didnt know he swung that way
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-chinese-spy-swalwell-other-politicians
I too would like to read AA on the Texas lawsuit. It looks pretty good to me, but maybe there is an argument the legislature has delegated the authority. They did pass laws after all. That seems a stretch to me, since passing a law involves the governor's signature, and so is not an exercise of the legislature's sole power, but maybe. And *can* legislatures delegate such authority?
Hard to deny Texas has standing isn’t it?
I read the TX Bill of Complaint. Brilliant legal work. Part of the beauty of it is that it solely presents federal constitutional law questions; no fact questions.
Texas cites Marbury and The Federalist.
I really think it is a winner. My highest praise for the Texas lawyers.
I wrote a blog piece on it. Go to my Twitter feed and there is a link. @DavidDBegley1.
Yes in deed david begley
https://mobile.twitter.com/RealSaavedra/status/1336508693815291905
Surprise
https://mobile.twitter.com/GrabienMedia/status/1336444123163877377
The Texas case is a loser. Perhaps the Court will speak with his one voice as they did today with the Penn suit. A 9-0 decision might begin the healing process.
The Texas lawsuit is bullshit. Texas doesn’t have standing to challenge other state’s election procedures.
"… begin the healing process."
You just don't get it, do you?
Of course they do, fraud injures their rigt to cast a vote.
David Begley said...
I read the TX Bill of Complaint. Brilliant legal work. Part of the beauty of it is that it solely presents federal constitutional law questions; no fact questions.
Texas cites Marbury and The Federalist.
I really think it is a winner. My highest praise for the Texas lawyers.
I wrote a blog piece on it. Go to my Twitter feed and there is a link. @DavidDBegley1.
Noted. Bookmarked.
Texas electors can cast their votes however they want.
No state has interfered with that right.
They have no particularized injury.
This lawsuit is bullshitZ
Imagine that the USSC overturns the elections in those 4 states.
Imagine all the lefties here, who insisted for the last 4 weeks that judges, *no matter how partisan or conflicted*, were the last word on the elections.
Imagine the lefties' infinite hypocrisy as they scream themselves raw saying the election was stolen from them.
That's going to be some delicious schadenfreude.
(Bonus schadenfreude: that it would be Ted Cruz, whom Chuck claimed was his choice in the 2016 primary, that kept Trump in office for four more years. Heh. Hehehehe. Heheheheheheheehhe.)
Today, for the first time in the history of the Republic, one of the sovereign states, on behalf of their citizens, filed a substantive suit against other states seeking relief against the WRONGDOING on the part of those other states which resulted in the criminal nullification of the votes of the honest citizens in the suing state.
Let that sink in, Texas just said that there are states out there who broke the law and tried to criminally steal an election.
Imagine a country where Democrats and Republicans aren’t partisan nut jobs.
We planted rice & indigo, settled this country grand..
Cites Marbury? Well that's it, then. AND the Federalist, you say?
Contract law have you heard of it:
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/christopher-nolan-rips-hbo-max-as-worst-streaming-service-denounces-warner-bros-plan
Original mike. I was being sarcastic. Where have you been?
When Asked if Dem Rep. Swalwell Had Intimate Relationship with Chinese Communist Spy and Honeypot, His Office Said ‘No Comment – It’s Classified’
Gee, I wonder if Swalwell got one of those Hunter Biden foot fucks?
Re Wisconsin, Texas argues that Wisconsin state courts misinterpreted an arguably ambiguous Wisconsin law re the legality of drop boxes. Trust me. SCOTUS won’t at the behest of Texas rule that the Wisconsin state courts misinterpreted a Wisconsin statute
But of course
https://babalublog.com/2020/12/08/castrophiliac-verrmont-senator-leahy-defends-cuban-government-again-on-issue-of-sonic-attacks/
I was so fucking angry when I heard about the SCOTUS Penn decision. Whatever way they decide is one thing. But to give absolutely no reason & to be summarily dismissive as they were?
Have our betters absolutely lost their minds? Do they actually think you can take the political views of 79 million citizens and just say "Fuck you. You assholes don't count. We don't even owe you an explanation".
I'm sorry, this is the way to civil war. The Deplorables don't have to get armed. They already are. The way out of this is for the Democrats to say "We understand you're mighty pissed off. But let's move on & then we'll investigate this voting business together & let's see what comes of it. If we lost fair & square, then even after inauguration, we'll pack up & go home". Not to pretend like butter wouldn't melt in their mouths & of course they're innocent as baby lambs. Who believes that about Atlanta & Philadelphia politics, even in the best of circumstances?
Otherwise, here's what happens --- sometime in the Biden admin, if it becomes clear by continuing research that, yes, the voting was rigged, what does the Biden admin do? If they don't resign, it's civil war. Do you know what's 1% of 79 million? It's 790,000. 790,000 is one hell of a large guerilla army, especially if it can count on the support of tens of millions of a sympathetic population. Do you know where most of the military bases in the US are? In Red States. How long until an army unit (made up mostly of sons of the Deplorables) turns, and the guerilla army then access to a military armory or two?
I know the liberal mindset. I'm surrounded by them. They think they're so fucking charming that someone else (soldiers, police) is going to die on the barricades for them. No, they're going to be doing the dying for themselves. As for a "muscular" liberal response, well, maybe they'll find their Leon Trotsky. But, probably, they'll respond just like they responded to Islamic terrorism --- by caving.
mccullough said...
Texas electors can cast their votes however they want.
No state has interfered with that right.
They have no particularized injury.
This lawsuit is bullshitZ
mccullough said...
Sadness, in some places yes they were forcibly removed.
So now that you have contradicted yourself?
The laws of the election were broken.
If you do not follow the rules of a process there is no process. The states being charged by Texas broke laws.
Period.
Readering
And a whole bunch of other SCOTUS cases. Even cites a recent Gorsuch case and noted how PA blew off Alito’s Order to segregate ballots.
You should read the whole thing. It is exceptional.
Standing will not be an issue.
I was so fucking angry when I heard about the SCOTUS Penn decision. Whatever way they decide is one thing. But to give absolutely no reason & to be summarily dismissive as they were?
Apparently the suit will be heard, just not on an expedited basis. Of course that probably moots it, but it's technically still on.
Also, the lack of explanation by the SCOTUS can only feed conspiracy theories that they were either 1) bribed or 2) intimidated, even perhaps by threats of violence.
Just a bad move all around.
YH. Let me know where and when the war begins. See you there loser.
mccullough said...
Imagine a country where Democrats and Republicans aren’t partisan nut jobs.
Sounds...
communist.
YoungHegelian said...
Also, the lack of explanation by the SCOTUS can only feed conspiracy theories that they were either 1) bribed or 2) intimidated, even perhaps by threats of violence.
Just a bad move all around.
They denied the petition for injunctive relief. Not cert. They have not made a ruling.
As far as I can determine the case is still active before the court.
@steve,
Let me know where and when the war begins. See you there loser.
Actually, I'm right in the middle of an area that the Rebels want to raze to the ground, i.e. the DC area. I will mostly likely be collateral damage. Even if I should survive, my finances will be a ruin.
You an asshole, Uhr. You think this is a joke. You think that once this starts, some White Knight will arise and save all the Good Liberals. Well, maybe, but unlikely. But ask yourself --- just how many armed Taliban held the Coalition armies off for 20 years?
Together again:
https://mobile.twitter.com/ChuckRossDC/status/1336061430886506498
@sadness/Churchy,
As far as I can determine the case is still active before the court.
That's not the way Mark Levin was talking this evening. He was talking as if it was a dead letter, and Texas was up next. He's supposedly the constitutional scholar...
I want to write about me. You guys and your hoity-toity legal theories, meh.
2020 is too too weird, actually, and I can honestly say that as the year has progressed I've read a lot of very important and enlightening things first right here. But I digress.
Yesterday I reserved two books at the u library to pick up, and went over to get them today.
The campus sprawls, and though the parking capacity is for thousands of vehicles, even with skeleton staff and virtually no students commuting the gates remain down to protect the vast empty spaces from soiling by stray retirees who might have business in one of the fine empty structures. Leave aside the prized right-by-the-door (or at least pretty close) spaces reserved for the creme de la creme of our (quite) pedestrian campus.
The gate for the lot closest to where I needed to go was down of course, with the intercom broken of course, but I was able to call Parking and explain myself enough for them to let me through.
A few minutes to walk around to the west side of the library, where two sets of automatic doors challenge the slow or hesitant when they work at all. Swipe my ID per taped-up instructions, red light as expected (it's not like I need automatic access anymore, though I had 24/7 for decades). I nudge my face up to the glass doors to peer inside the dim lobby.
Gradually I discern a still figure, a slim male in a leather coat and hat, taking a siesta at a small table just inside, past the electronic security gates.
I wave, with no result. I rap gently. Last time, a few months ago, I had to knock pretty loudly to get the attention of someone at the circulation desk, but this guy was sitting about eight feet away, not 30. I rapped louder, and gestured at the circulation desk when he looked up.
He came to one of the automatic doors and when it opened I waved my card and started to say they were holding some books when he said--
"Did your card work?"
'No, but I didn't expect i--'
"Don't work, you gotta take it to Security in--" he was in turn pointing vaguely in the direction of one of the security outposts, a good mile round trip on foot or driving and having to park again . .
'No, I'm not doing that. I'm getting the books they have for me.'
"You gotta have a ID."
'I'm an emeritus professor' [not that he knew what that meant I'm sure] I said, not very politely, 'I worked here for 20 years, and I'm getting those books!'
I sidestepped him and strode to the circulation desk even as I spoke, and he warned, "If you gonna just push on in, I'm gonna call the [campus] police."
I didn't bother answering, asked the girl at the desk to get my books and gave her my ID and name. I'm not sure how much, if any, of the conversation she heard--what with plexiglass everywhere and everyone masked, probably not much. The library checkout system still loves me anyway, regardless of the front doors. Two rereads; books that shaped me.
It took less than a minute, and I was aware that Cerberus was off to the side talking in a low voice to someone, but couldn't make out the gist, or if he had a device or not.
Strutting even more on the way out than in, I wished him a good day.
Mine was certainly fine at that moment. At my age one has so few chances to overbear with physical bulk, and even pull rank. It will be interesting to see if a required incident report is filed. They used to put that stuff online, but I haven't looked recently.
Narr
There's bark in the old dog yet
I’m the asshole? You’re the one who wants to destroy the republic because your guy lost. We have a system for deciding who wins. The loser doesn’t like it so they are then free to start killing their fellow citizens? Fuck you asshole.
@steve uhr,
We have a system for deciding who wins.
Reading comprehension isn't your strong suite, is it, Steve?
In case you haven't noticed, a large fraction of the population, including 30% of Democrats, think the election was rigged. Perhaps, it would behoove our betters, in the spirit of comity & to restore faith in the electoral system, to pledge to investigate the issue & act according to the findings, even if it's to their disadvantage. But, no, they're acting like "How dare you suggest we could have cheated!" Because, of course, there's been absolutely no unbelievable government shenanigans in the last 12 years, has there?
Do our betters want to avoid civil war? Then, actually govern.
I never said trump should not exercise his rights to challenge the results in court. I never said that there was no fraud. How would I know. I do know that the courts have rejected his claims. It’s over. Deal with it. In a non violent way please.
"The Spy Who Loved Me"
Blogger steve uhr said...
The Texas case is a loser. Perhaps the Court will speak with his one voice as they did today with the Penn suit. A 9-0 decision might begin the healing process
Blogger steve uhr said...
I’m the asshole? You’re the one who wants to destroy the republic because your guy lost. We have a system for deciding who wins. The loser doesn’t like it so they are then free to start killing their fellow citizens? Fuck you asshole
And your guys were cheating-ass motherfuckers and Texans are pissed about it. YOUR GUYS broke the system. Texas has taken legal action to set things right. I would say the Supremes are about in the position of the Taney Court. You want healing? We'll see, won't we?
YoungHegelian - the PA controversy is still an active controversy - the case is not a dead letter, but there was no injunctive relief because a court cannot grant injunctive relief to a party in a different case simply because they plan to take up the same controversy with respect to a party that has filed a different case, which it appears the Supreme Court intends to do with respect to the TEXAS, not the PA, case.
Something most people do not know about the late Justice Ginsburg is that her husband was a better lawyer than her - he excelled in the very well defined part of tax law that involves corporations adjusting to new tax regulations - she, in turn, tried to excel in a similarly specific field of law ---- it is called choice of law ---- hard to explain exactly what that is ---- back in the day, when Althouse had a tab you could click on for legal posts, it would have been easy to find a thread where people cared ---- anyway, "choice of law" is a real thing, but not relevant to what is happening right now. What is happening right now is that the PA case which people are worried about is not a dead letter, but injunctive relief cannot issue in that case because there is another case in which injunctive relief is viable, and as such, the plaintiffs in the PA case, having separate standing from the plaintiffs in the Texas case, have (a) lost standing for injunctive relief to the extent such relief is based on the premise that their case will be heard and will be successful, but also (b) have no reason to complain about that rejection, because every argument they could present will be heard in the other case, and any relief they could have obtained will either eventually be obtained, or if it is not, injunctive relief would have been unnecessary - which is sort of the standard for whether or not injunctive relief issues (issues is a verb here, not a noun ---).
Hope that helps. Unlike Althouse, I was not at the top of my class, but I guarantee you that I know why not a single Supreme Court Justice signed off on injunctive relief in the PA case.
If I was not clear, sorry, reread my comment and hopefully you will figure out what I was saying.
That being said, absent actual individuals working for Dominion, or absent dozens of pollwatchers being indicted for criminal contempt, things pretty much look dismal right now for 2020, but they look spectacular for 2022 or 2024, because the USA will never again let the people who did what they did in 2020 get away with it again.
Thanks for reading.
steve: Bullshit. The PA Supreme Court throwing out the case because it "wasn't filed in a timely manner"... less than 3 weeks after the election, when anytime before the election it would've been no standing.
If the fraud evidence had actually been admitted, actually been reviewed, then maybe you could say the system did what it was supposed to.
But basically saying "you can only litigate election fraud between Nov 3rd and Thanksgiving was a pure bullsbit play and you know it. No one on your side would respect something like that (and the difference between us is *we would never ask you to*). Your "system" is not acceptable. Sorry not sorry.
steve uhr - you have no idea what you are talking about.
Not a single court has ruled on the substance of a single claim of fraud.
There is nothing pending before USSC from Kelly. Response required to opening motions in TX suit. But unprecedented. Among other problems, sovereign defendants generally not required to have truncated deadlines in trial court. And USSC sends original jurisdiction cases to special masters to sort out. Inauguration day will have come and gone. Of course, quick dismissal on numerous grounds easy.
@steve,
Deal with it. In a non violent way please.
It's not me you have to tell that to. I'm "collateral damage", remember?
But, I see the arrogance in your reply. "Oh just get over it"? Do any of the rulings make sense to you, Steve? Or do they just seem to be peremptorily dismissive? Do you think that the SCOTUS did the right think in giving absolutely no explanation at all for its ruling? Once again, after 12 years of the government being weaponized against them, why should Conservatives/Trumpies trust that the government will treat them fairly now? Even the courts. No one has been punished for what happened to Conservatives under the Obama admin & what they did to the Trump administration.
The laches arguments in PA are based on the fact that the supposedly unconstitutional law went unchallenged in earlier elections applying it.
There was a case two weeks before the election, it spliit 4/4 then because ginsburg wasnt on the court. Stop talking out of your hind quarters.
Readering - your response, had you put it down on a bar exam, would have led to you not passing the bar. Try harder.
Remember, just get over it was what we Dems were told in 2000.
I stopped passing bar exams in 1992 after 3.
@Readering,
Remember, just get over it was what we Dems were told in 2000.
But, Gore dragged the thing out until Dec 13th. Also, both parties reviewed all of the ballots & finally, after an open re-count and the intervention of a full case before SCOTUS, Gore finally admitted he lost. Not by much, but he still lost Florida, and thus the election. It was a comprehensible single point of failure.
If the Gore vs Bush had occurred after 8 years of a Reagan admin that did everything to the Democrats that the Obama-ites did to Conservatives, Democrats would have been even angrier than they were about the resolution. There would have been rioting.
I didn’t make myself clear. Whatever the basis for the ruling, and even if most or all legal experts think the courts got it wrong, it’s over. You sue, lose, appeal, lose, petition for cert, petition denied, or petition granted and you lose for the third time, game over. No different than a football game where the result depends on a penalty call. Doesn’t matter if call was right or not. Game over.
Blogger Qwinn said...
Imagine that the USSC overturns the elections in those 4 states.
Imagine all the lefties here, who insisted for the last 4 weeks that judges, *no matter how partisan or conflicted*, were the last word on the elections.
Imagine the lefties' infinite hypocrisy as they scream themselves raw saying the election was stolen from them.
That's going to be some delicious schadenfreude.
(Bonus schadenfreude: that it would be Ted Cruz, whom Chuck claimed was his choice in the 2016 primary, that kept Trump in office for four more years. Heh. Hehehehe. Heheheheheheheehhe.)
I voted for Kasich in the 2016 Michigan primary. Enthusiastically.
As for schadenfreude; imagine what you want, about Texas winning this cockamamie Supreme Court case. It’s not happening. And when Biden is sworn in, you’ll be one of the prime objects of my laughter.
steve: You don't get to appeal to "them's the rules of the game" when the entire POINT of the suits is that the rules were rigged. By the very courts you pretend aren't conflicted in their adjudication.
@steve uhr,
No different than a football game where the result depends on a penalty call. Doesn’t matter if call was right or not. Game over.
You mean like Dred Scott, Plessy vs Ferguson, or Korematsu? Does the conscience go to sleep because a court tells it to? is that what citizenship is, submission to un-elected judges?
Kasich? Huh. I honestly thought you'd claimed Ted Cruz before. But (despite your long proven history of lying about everything) I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on that one. Cruz is far too conservative and honorable for a far leftist like you to support. A dessicated plant like Kasich is far more believable as one of your heroes.
Keep Hope Alive. Looking forward to Althouse's expert legal opinion on the merits.
you started failing bar exams in 1992?
come on, address the issues.
The issue is this ---- do you really think it is not an excessive strain on the court system if (a) the court system rejects evidence that a candidate who won by several hundred thousand votes or more in each of several states was disqualified because courts refused to adjudicate claims of fraud of several hundred thousand or more fraudulent votes or (b) the courts do adjudicate those claims and reverse the criminal results?
What other options do you see? Either the courts ignore the overwhelming evidence of criminality, and Biden is inaugurated, or the courts address those claims and find for Trump ..... either way, the fact remains, there was an attempt to inflict dictatorship behavior in a free country which will not stand for such behavior. Do you really know which outcome you prefer, even after your 3 bar exams before you stopped passing bar exams?
This is not a normal election, this is not 2000 with a few disputed chads, and your 3 bar exams are useless if you do not understand that.
“The Texas case is a loser. Perhaps the Court will speak with his one voice as they did today with the Penn suit. A 9-0 decision might begin the healing process.”
Last week Begley was praising the Kelly PA suit. Every week presents a better suit to Begley and the hangers on. Every week/day they get shot down.
Sadness,
It’s not up to Texas to enforce other states laws.
They have no legal right to have other states enforce their own laws any more than a voter in California has a right to make Georgia follow its election laws.
It’s not contradictory to point this out.
Trump filed a shitload of lawsuits in these states. He had a legal right to do so. He had standing.
He lost the cases so far.
Georgia did a hand recount of ballots for Trump. He gained a few more votes but he still lost.
People will believe whatever they want.
25% of Americans believe 9/11 was an inside job by the federal government.
66% of Dems believe Russia changed vote tallies in states to steal the election for Trump in 2016.
People who are fervent Trump supporters have a very hard time understanding that more people hate Trump than like him. That the results of the election are not surprising in the least.
So they concoct conspiracy theories. Or believe conspiracy theories concocted by others.
Trump knows he lost. He knows he is just bullshitting people. It’s just a game to him, the GOP, and the Dems.
I didn't like all the things that Trump said, but I admired the way he said them. His policies were demonstrably successful. I was glad to vote for him and I'm sorry he lost. That said, life goes on. I don't think my life was especially worse or better under Obama than it was under Bush. My life hasn't even been that much changed by the current plague. I don't think that I will rejoice in the sayings of President Biden or in his policies, but I don't watch cable news and so will be oblivious of most of it. In any event, Biden at this time is only mildly addled and his confused ramblings are far easier to take than Hillary's cackles. There's a parallel universe where, just about this time, Hillary is rejoicing in her reelection and all of Hollywood, including Harvey Weinstein, is competing for invitations to the inaugural ball.....You win some, you lose some and life goes on.
@mccullough,
66% of Dems believe Russia changed vote tallies in states to steal the election for Trump in 2016.
Which got investigated by a special prosecutor for two years, and found nothing. I'm sure the Trumpies will accept a Special Prosecutor investigation costing millions & millions of dollars & extending for two years. Is the Biden Admin offering one?
People who are fervent Trump supporters have a very hard time understanding that more people hate Trump than like him. That the results of the election are not surprising in the least.
Than you haven't looked at the numbers. It's not a black swan event. It's a fucking flock of black swans.
McCullough, in the Kelly PA case there was no separate filing for certiorari (as you claimed in the other thread ) the filing for the injunction included the request for certiorari as a whole. The filing as a whole was denied.
Georgia hand-counted potentially fraudulent ballots without checking to see if they were fraudulent, mccullough. You are not kidding anybody, anyone reading what you said can see you are a lying hack.
Inga, you are embarrassing yourself.
You do not know how things will play out, and even if they play out your way, you will have described them from a position of complete ignorance.
You can do better than that. It is important to be honest.
YH,
I’ve looked at the numbers.
With mail-in voting, turnout was massive. Trump got more than 11 million votes than last time. He turned out every possible eligible voter willing to vote for him.
So was this a result of fraud? No president ever has increased his vote total by over 10 million votes. It must be fraud, right?
It could not be that with mail-in voting, even Trump got more people to vote for him? Impossible, right? Can’t be done?
Must have been fraud.
That’s the level of reasoning here.
Picking on Inga from a position of ignorance!
Readering, Stephen Cooper is a loon. I pretty much skip every one of his comments, too long, too loony and probably just some guy engaging in creative writing for shits and giggles.
@mccullough,
That’s the level of reasoning here.
Actually, reasoning more like this. Sadly, you need the video to get the full flavor, but it's short.
Coop,
Were the fraudulent ballots in Georgia counterfeit? Did the Chinese manufacture them? The Russians?
Or were they genuine blank ballots that were filled out by five year olds, who are not eligible to vote?
Or is it that the signature on the voter registration did not match the signature on the application for a mail-in ballot, as determined by the Handwriting Experts Hired By the State of Georgia?
Or is it that the signature on the return envelope with the mail-in ballot was missing?
Fraudulent ballots sounds like a cop out, Coop.
And why do you think that there weren’t more fraudulent ballots cast for Trump than Biden in Georgia? Pennsylvania? Wisconsin? Arizona? Michigan?
Trump increased his vote total by 18% over 2016.
That is unheard of.
It’s A Black Swan Event.
Must have been massive fraud in favor of Trump.
YH,
Trump’s most fervent supporters cannot comprehend that more people hate Trump than like him.
That’s the only metric that mattered.
mccullough -
tell me how many ballots would have to have shifted from Trump to Biden or a third party candidate for the election to be invalid.
Don't tell me how many ballots actually shifted - you have no idea of that fact - tell me how many ballots, theoretically, it would take to have changed the election.
After you get that number right, then you can spout off with your idiotic generalizations and maybe get something less than zero respect. Right now, you are lying about what you think you know.
Inga - you are wrong about me.
Inga,
The application for injunction was combined with the petition for certiorari, which is common practice.
The application for an injunction was denied. There has been no ruling on the petition for certiorari, which if you read it also requests prospective declaratory relief.
So you were wrong. Again.
mccullough said...
Sadness,
It’s not up to Texas to enforce other states laws.
If the laws were broken then the process is fraudulent by definition.
You admitted the States broke their own laws.
The election was fraud by your own reasoning.
And the 14th amendment is pretty clear on what the federal government's responsibilities are when a state breaks laws.
Mc Cullough,
Tweet from Steve Vladimir.
“Kelly asked the Court to treat his application for an injunction as a petition for certiorari *in the alternative,* and that’s what was denied. There’s no separate filing, and so #SCOTUS’s denial of the application means that there is nothing else pending from Kelly at the Court.”
Steve Vladeck.
Coop,
You are now changing your position.
What does “shift a vote” mean?
It sounds like you are asking how many people who voted for Biden would you need to have voted for Trump to change the outcome of the election?
Sadness,
The states break their own laws everyday.
Texas is breaking its own laws by filing this bullshit lawsuit.
Again, there is nothing pending before SCOTUS regarding the Kelly PA case.
“I mean, Kelly still has 141 days to file an actual petition for certiorari. But insofar as Ellis is saying there’s a petition actually pending before #SCOTUS *now*, that’s ... not accurate.”
Steve Vladeck tweet
Think of this nationwide
https://mobile.twitter.com/ShelbyTalcott/status/1336408700995690505
Vladeck didn’t read Kelly’s filing.
He’s a lazy law professor who whiles away the day on Twitter.
Well, if petition for certiorari, no response necessary. If court inclined to accept it must request a response from respondent. In other words, the application did not interest the Court enough to request a response.
And when Biden is sworn in, you’ll be one of the prime objects of my laughter.
@Chuck, that’s why I think there really will be warfare. You’re planning to taunt angry people, and in fact you already are taunting angry people. Not a smart move. C Ditto readering (with or without the first letter capitalized). Ditto steve uhr and Inga. You’re like Southern firebrands on the eve of the Civil War, imagining that the other side won’t fight. Fools.
From the Volokh Conspiracy, David Post responds to statistical nonsense in Texas AG Ken Paxton's lawsuit:
"Expert analysis using a commonly accepted statistical test further raises serious questions as to the integrity of this election. For former Vice President Biden to win these four States collectively, the odds of that event happening decrease to less than one in a quadrillion to the fourth power (i.e., 1 in 1,000,000,000,000,000^4). See Decl. of Charles J. Cicchetti, Ph.D."
Wow! What a bombshell this is! Odds of Biden having won GA, PA, WI, and MI are 1,000,000,000,000,000 to the fourth power to 1! For the mathematically disinclined, 1 quadrillion to the 4th power is 1 with 60 zeros after it. Long odds indeed! It's about equivalent to being dealt several trillion or so royal flushes in a row. There's proof of fraud for you!
Spoiler Alert. It's total nonsense—I know it's early in the 2020-21 Term, but I'm putting the odds at getting anything more ridiculous in a SCOTUS filing at about 3 quadrillion to 1.
Baptisia, I’m guessing Baptisia australis although there are many others. Hard to tell without seeing the plant and flowers. One of my favorites in our garden. Looks like asparagus coming up, then blooms crazy blue and leafs out showing its obvious heritage as a pea. Forms those seed pods, first green, then drying to black. The stems make great rattles once the pods have dried. Cut it back to the ground in November and start the process over in the spring. Given the quantity of seeds, it’s a surprisingly unaggressive reseeder. Highly recommended. We had problems one year with a moth that likes peas and gave us hundreds of hungry caterpillars threatening to strip the foliage, but we removed them all manually as they emerged and the moths didn’t return the next year or thereafter.
Just in case you needed a break from the nyah nyah.
Tidiness is overrated.
Ken Paxton, Attorney General of Texas, had to file with the Supreme Court because his only friend, Donald Trump needs for him to do so and AG Paxton needs a pardon to cover some serious criminal actions and what better way to get Trump’s attention?
Paxton is under indictment for stock fraud and is currently being investigated by the FBI for bribery and abuse of office. The bureau is probing allegations that Paxton broke the law by using the attorney general’s office to serve the interests of a political donor.
To add insult to injury, all the top staff members in his office have resigned because they believe he is guilty. But he may be able to get Ted Cruz to present his case to the Supremes in the unlikely event that this late filing will even get a hearing. If you noticed, Ted wasn't needed for the Pennsylvania case that was refused yesterday.
Paxton is certainly looking after Paxton because he got an "atta boy" tweet from Trump.
All of my posts were dictated by a sexually voracious Chinese spy promoting alternative medicines.
WI, MI, GA and PA have until 3 pm on Thursday to respond.
I think it’s very unlikely that the TX lawsuit gets the remedy it wants even if its argument prevails. First, standing is a stretch—the courts are pretty strict on this point and have found against plaintiffs in the past who had a much more direct injury. But if they survive standing and the court accepts their argument that the states did not follow the constitution, there is still the problem of what to do about it.
IMO, the most likely result is that the court holds that the silence of legislatures of MI, WI, GA, and PA acts as ratification after the fact. There’s plenty of historical support for that kind of reasoning—the aggrieved parties are those state legislatures and they have not objected. Therefore, the court will not overturn the elections.
Part of the problem I’m seeing with right-wing procedural objections to the conduct of the election is that they ignore the true party of interest—the voters—and under-rate the seriousness of their request—that the will expressed by the voters on election day be thrown out because of “misdeeds” by a group of mere processors handling those votes.
mccullough said...People who are fervent Trump supporters have a very hard time understanding that more people hate Trump than like him.
People who are fervent Trump haters have a very hard time understanding that lots of people who don’t like Trump still voted for him because his policies were successful and he made people’s lives better.
YoungHegelian said...
I know the liberal mindset. I'm surrounded by them. They think they're so fucking charming that someone else (soldiers, police) is going to die on the barricades for them. No, they're going to be doing the dying for themselves. As for a "muscular" liberal response, well, maybe they'll find their Leon Trotsky. But, probably, they'll respond just like they responded to Islamic terrorism --- by caving.
12/8/20, 10:26 PM
Let's do a little bit of breaking down the numbers. First off, the idea that 1% of Trump supporters are ready to go guerilla is flatout delusional. Yes, I know you were making a point, but trust me- I don't think I'm in the most hardcore 1% of Trump supporters, and I'm a complete right-wing extremist. You don't want to know what the top 1% of them are saying right now. Anyways, as for the left:
1) Police. When the NYPD endorses Trump in a cycle, that points to a level of hostility among the rank and file that should by itself shock Pelosi and Schumer to the negotiating table. It doesn't matter how many political whores and commissioners the Dems can staple to Joe Biden's side: when the officers are willing to flip off their own public to support a hated incumbent, that's a sign that the LEOs are likely to turn the guns on the Dems instead of on Trump.
2) Soldiers. No doubt a substantial number of officers are Biden supporters, overt or covert. But officers don't actually do the work. Enlisted men, usually white, are the important part of all military branches. That said, the constant threat of officers sabotaging "their" men is one that might get a lot of people killed, which is why I suspect the military will simply refuse to back either side as they get wracked with desertions and equipment "losses." Bear in mind that LEOs have quite a bit of military surplus themselves, where they're not former veterans.
3) Criminals. Gangs like MS-13 have considerable experience with destroying the legitimacy of established governments, have vast financial and kinetic resources which could pose a serious threat. However, they're also aware of the threat from vigilantism in Mexico- that is, from enraged but poorly-armed locals with a shared genetic background. If things go loud, Heritage Americans will be ready to fatally torture anyone who likes tacos too much, and I believe most ethnic gangs realize this. It's quite possible that the various organized criminal groups simply decide to sit this one out rather than risk total extermination. Judges won't be around to protect and coddle them, while the LEOs would LOVE to deal with their problems without political correctness tying both hands behind their back.
4) Students. Most soft liberal arts students are NOT prepared kinetically, mentally, or physically for siege or urban warfare. And that's putting it very mildly. They live in urban cloisters that have relentlessly removed the tools and mindsets they would need to endure civil conflict, much less thrive in it. Their political indoctrination makes them very susceptible to liberal support, of course, and whispers about total forgiveness of student debt are designed to cement their loyalty. (It'll never happen because it would explode the entire liberal education system, but that's not important to this argument.) Young attractive women might enjoy throwing Molotovs at rallies where they have guaranteed political cover, but that morale will drop like a rock in actual conflict- particularly when they feel the iron grip of consequences grabbing them by the...
tim maguire said...
"mccullough said...People who are fervent Trump supporters have a very hard time understanding that more people hate Trump than like him.
People who are fervent Trump haters have a very hard time understanding that lots of people who don’t like Trump still voted for him because his policies were successful and he made people’s lives better."
They continue to just not get it. Which is why I don't think that mccullough is an honest broker.
Althouse. Is that a subtle suggestion that we're soon going to be taken over by pod people?
Howard said...
Keep Hope Alive. Looking forward to Althouse's expert legal opinion on the merit
Sarcasm, right? The Hostess rarely ventures an opinion on which she might have expertise on. Requests for her to do so fall on deaf ears.
Why is Chuck still here?
On standing, MA was allowed to sue because other states were supposedly polluting its air.
Howard said...
"Keep Hope Alive. Looking forward to Althouse's expert legal opinion on the merit"
You say to yourself," At least Howard isn't like Chuck."
And then...............
Rusty said...At least Howard isn't like Chuck."
There are 2 Howards on here. It's confusing--I don't know how tell them apart except by tone.
Maybe she's been talking to the Israeli general about the aliens? Pod people would seem to fit right in to the scheme of 2020.
Disappointing and upsetting as it is, I do not see a path to success for the re-election of Donald Trump. He needs people of character to commit to upholding the Constitution and principle in the face of real threats of physical violence to them and their loved ones. There appear to be very few, if any, such people involved in the dispute.
Didn't mean to spy on your favorite president, didn't mean call your president illegitimate, didn't mean to say he was a Russian operative, didn't mean to impeach him, didn't mean to have the FBI and CIA go after him.
"...... let the healing begin."
Hampering forgot about the Trump/Guiliani clown show about Obamas birth certificate.
We have just been following the path tread by the Donald during Obamas time.
His tweets for those 4 years are a mirror of what you call unfair. Grow some balls, dude.
that the will expressed by the voters on election day be thrown out because of “misdeeds” by a group of mere processors handling those votes.
I agree with your assessment about the lawsuits in play right now. The courts are always going to kick this can down the road as much as they can. Even Bush v. Gore was decided on very narrow grounds.
The problem is "the will expressed by the voters" can't be determined by this election. That's what an election is supposed to do, but the counting of this election (and I would say every election for the past 40+ years) has hardly been transparent.
Brian said...The problem is "the will expressed by the voters" can't be determined by this election. That's what an election is supposed to do, but the counting of this election (and I would say every election for the past 40+ years) has hardly been transparent.
That's the argument, of course. But elections are how we traditionally determine the will of the voters. Throwing out the the election means throwing out the will of the people as determined our usual method of determining it. That's a problem we can't get around so easily.
Everyone pretending that all we need to throw out the result is a few questionable pictures and some affidavits are kidding themselves. They have been and, without more, will continue to be, disappointed.
"Hampering forgot about the Trump/Guiliani clown show about Obamas birth certificate."
-- It was foolish of them to believe Hillary Clinton's conspiracy theory, and I wish they hadn't.
Blogger tim maguire said...
Rusty said...At least Howard isn't like Chuck."
"There are 2 Howards on here. It's confusing--I don't know how tell them apart except by tone."
The one who has made a career of being a virtue signaling dickhead.
"Part of the problem I’m seeing with right-wing procedural objections to the conduct of the election is that they ignore the true party of interest—the voters—and under-rate the seriousness of their request—that the will expressed by the voters on election day be thrown out because of “misdeeds” by a group of mere processors handling those votes."
-- To be fair, the Texas (and other) law suits are saying that the true party of interest (the voters) are being *defrauded,* but various courts have claimed voters *didn't have standing* to sue, so we've been playing motte and bailey trying to find out when was the right time to sue, who has the golden ticket to sue, etc., etc. Remember: The same style of suit in different jurisdictions was rejected as "too early, wait for X," and then also, "too late, shouldn't have waited for X." Essentially, the question is: "What WAS the party of interest's actual decision," and Texas is saying that by not following the rules as outlined, and breaking the various laws and not adhering to the Constitution, that the voters' interests were not listened to, while the other states, I guess, are saying, that the only way to keep the voters' interests in mind was to break the law, or that they technically didn't break the law, and that evidence of fraud, etc., isn't enough to undermine their authority in determining what the voters wanted.
Basically, a bunch of elite, rich people, are arguing over what the voters actually wanted, and whether or not there was voter fraud is the current argument for determining which way they should assume the voters voted, since there's honestly, if the allegations are true, no way to tell WHAT the voters wanted.
There is only one Howard and he confuses you because he has what are apparently conflicting opinions that are not necessarily tied to a single ideology.
(For example: Stickygate in New York and Georgia finding extra votes they didn't count the first time GREATLY concern me about their *ability to actually handle voting.* Will either of those examples change the election? Well, Stickygate could change the House election there. But, even if you don't think election fraud is widespread... election incompetence clearly is.)
"that’s why I think there really will be warfare. You’re planning to taunt angry people, and in fact you already are taunting angry people."
-- It's what I expect from Democrats. Remember when John McCain showed up after the election to try and work with now President Obama only to be told, "I won?" I don't think there will be warfare, because people on the right are used to this sort of dismissive treatment. Honestly, it is probably good for most people, when they're growing up, to get into a few fistfights because you learn: "Ouch. Saying mean things has consequences," and "Sometimes people hurt you physically if you hurt them in other ways," both important lessons for dealing with people. Too many people expect to be able to hurt others freely, and I'm not saying I approve of violence; I'm saying, these idiots are going to eventually poke the wrong bear.
as determined our usual method of determining it.
Elections only work if there is confidence in it. That's why elections should be transparent. Saddam Hussein had elections in Iraq and got 100% of the vote, but that was hardly "the will of the people". Shouldn't those elections have been thrown out?
Our system provides for a "no confidence" vote in the election through the process of Congress certifying. This process is not throwing out "the will of the people". I don't think this Congress is going to do that, nor do I think the courts are likely to try and mandate Congress to do anything.
Elections are not automatically the "will of the people". It requires transparency for confidence.
Brian said...Elections only work if there is confidence in it.
People saying things like that, but it's not good enough. What I'm saying is there is a high bar and there is a reason for that high bar. You aren't saying, "we clear that high bar," you're saying "the bar should be lowered."
Well, fine. You are welcome to make that argument, but if you can't do better, then you're going to be disappointed.
Blogger steve uhr said...
The Texas case is a loser. Perhaps the Court will speak with his one voice as they did today with the Penn suit. A 9-0 decision might begin the healing process.
steve loves that 5 Democrat PA supreme court. You know, the one that changed election rules. As for healing, talk to the Lincoln Project which is now attacking the GOP Senate candidate in GA.
You lefties have a lot to answer for and it will be years coming.
I see the bedpan commando is now a legal expert, along with professor gadfly and lefty Mark.
Too much powerhouse thinking for me.
As my black second husband used to say, "A man may have the right to call me a n***er but I have the right to beat the shit out of him". And he did, a couple of times.
GOP Texas Governor changed the election rules. Madness.
Dueling may have been a better way of handling these personal insults. Would love to see a duel between Ted Cruz and Chuck Schumer. :-D
Big Mike said...
@Chuck, that’s why I think there really will be warfare. You’re planning to taunt angry people, and in fact you already are taunting angry people. Not a smart move.
12/9/20, 1:55 AM
Charles Randall is a particularly rancid pile of vomit, and I don't doubt his charming attitude is going to see him castrated by someone, but well-deserved brutality does not by itself make for a war. For instance, Uday Hussein tortured his way across that country for years, and we've already established that the American people are far more lazy and submissive than the people of Iraq. However, a man like Donald Trump still holds the power of the presidency, and the media failed to control his message even in the context of a peaceful election. I can't believe people are still saying "militia aren't effective" after the examples of Iraq and Afghanistan, and it is most likely that the majority of the fighting will be handled by professional units as Antifa melts into the background...
... but similar militia violence is what drove most Loyalists into Canada.
You aren't saying, "we clear that high bar," you're saying "the bar should be lowered."
Nope, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that elections that aren't transparent can't reflect the "will of the people". This election may be sufficiently transparent such that any errors are minimal. Or it may not. We have systems to adjudicate that. But we should all strive to WANT the most transparent election possible. Otherwise future elections will be suspect as well.
If one side can cheat eventually both sides will. And if nobody can trust the results, then we as a society lose the republic. The four boxes of liberty: Soapbox, Ballot box, Jury box, Ammo box.
Note I haven't said anything about Trump here. I don't think all of the allegations necessarily rise to the level. I do think that all the "stop talking about all these instances, you haven't met the bar" makes it easier for fraud going forward.
Brian said...
You aren't saying, "we clear that high bar," you're saying "the bar should be lowered."
Nope, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that elections that aren't transparent can't reflect the "will of the people".
Yeah, you are saying that. "Elections that aren't transparent" don't count? Try unpacking that claim. Think carefully about what you are really saying and what its implications are.
Read again what I said, please. I said that elections that aren't transparent can't be the "will of the people" because you don't know if the election result was the "will of the people" or just cheating.
I provided an example. Iraq's election wasn't transparent, was it the will of the people? An extreme example, but my point remains.
I never said if an election is not transparent then the election should be overturned. I just said you can't use the narrative of "will of the people" to bash challenges.
Again, I don't think anything will change. Courts are going to have a high bar for any action (as they should). I will also note that Congress is under no such restrictions. They could, theoretically, overturn the presidential election for any reason they'd like. There were arguments for Congress to do just that in 2017. But there is a high political price to pay for such an action (as there should be).
We have a system for deciding who wins.
You and yours destroyed the system, asshole.
Now you get to see what comes next.
mccullough - what I was asking was - how many votes do you think criminals supporting Biden produced in swing states, and how much proof of their criminality would be necessary to establish that they stole enough votes to change the result?
Answer - less than 100 thousand in a nation of more than 300 million.
The evil deception from the left will not go well when people understand those numbers.
"that’s why I think there really will be warfare. You’re planning to taunt angry people, and in fact you already are taunting angry people."
One commenter writes this with zero sense of irony, and then others lap it up. Amazing. Not one commenter who's signing on to this said anything remotely like that only four years ago, when your glee at "owning the libs" overflowed your cups.
The shoe! It is on the other foot!
I mean, what sort of treatment of the “other side” did these boards really model, after November 2016. It was a cacophony of taunts.
I’m sure “Big Mike” was all, “hey, let’s not taunt angry people.”
Harrogate, you don't consider nearly four years of impeachment attempts to be 'warfare'? The constant attack on our President by the MSM? Surely you're not serious.
Mockturtle,
You don’t consider the “own the Libs” screeching a taunt of people who were angry And hurt they had lost ? Surely you’re not serious.
I didn’t support impeachment. Nor did I cry “Russia!”
But I sure watched y’all gloat and mock (heh) ad nauseum.
As for persistent attacks on the President by media types? There never would have been a Trump without the media treating him like some icon since the 70s and then airing his every rant in the Runup to his win. His attacks on the media and its attacks on him benefited both parties.
And through it all, the GOP got a hell of a lot out of the last four years. But still you want to be the victims here.
This is how you get more dismissals.
Yes Harrogate.
It was coattails without a coat!
"I'm not joking!"
If I'da known there was so much taunting going on I would have started coming here in 2016.
I bet there was some great taunting! There are some talented, even world-class taunters here, and I suppose many of the older ones have taunted their last taunt . . .
Narr
Dauntless taunter
harrogate - more than half of Americans believe that Biden would have lost, if he had not been supported by criminal cheating.
Such a thing has never happened before in this country.
Think about it.
S. Cooper, first of all what people “believe” isn’t the basis for making it so. A lot of Americans believe in angels, too.
Trump lost. You are acting like the Dems did in 2016. You don’t wanna think about why you lost. You want to deny you lost, instead.
Think about it.
harrogate: "And through it all, the GOP got a hell of a lot out of the last four years. But still you want to be the victims here.
This is how you get more dismissals."
An interesting legal theory.
Cases will be adjudicated based on the perception of how much a political party has taken relative advantage of its political position in recent years.
In what lawbook or treatise might I find this novel theory fully explicated?
harrogate: "I mean, what sort of treatment of the “other side” did these boards really model, after November 2016. It was a cacophony of taunts."
Indeed it was. The left/LLR-left/democraticals asserted republican voters were treasonous traitors, Putin had video of hookers whizzing on beds at Trump's behest, Trump was an illegitimate President who only won due to Putins intereference, the entire Trump family was a criminal enterprise, Trumps campaign team were all russian assets, as was Trump himself, etc.
You lefty cats really outdid yourselves.
Drago,
There’s no need for legal terminology. There was an election and the President lost. He and his party and supporters all were about “fuck your feelings” for a good long ride, then you lost.
So to recap. Trump lost. And Republican citizens are owed exactly the same concern for their feelings are are citizens of any other party. You don’t get it both ways.
What really seems to be falling some of you is the extent to which Trump’s caterwauling is being ignored and dismissed. So keep caterwauling. That’s how you get more dismissals.
Also, find one example anywhere, where I supported the “Muh Russia!” narrative or supported impeachment.
Good luck with that.
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