December 21, 2020

"Across the United States, many areas with large populations of Latinos and residents of Asian descent, including ones with the highest numbers of immigrants, had... a surge in turnout and a shift to the right, often a sizable one."

"The pattern was evident in big cities like Chicago and New York, in California and Florida, and along the Texas border with Mexico, according to a New York Times analysis of voting in 28,000 precincts in more than 20 cities..... [T]he red shifts, along with a wave of blue shifts in Republican and white areas, have scrambled the conventional wisdom of American politics and could presage a new electoral calculus for the parties.... And over all, Mr. Trump, whose policies and remarks were widely expected to alienate immigrants and voters of color, won the lion’s share of the additional turnout....  ... Mr. Trump lost ground in white and Republican areas in and around cities — ultimately leading to his election loss — he gained new votes in immigrant neighborhoods.... 'The Latino conservatives feel a lot of momentum,' said Geraldo L. Cadava, a professor at Northwestern University and author of a book on Latino Republicans. They had argued that Mr. Trump could win Latino voters, not with the Bushesque strategy of moderation on immigration, but with a Reaganesque message of personal responsibility and hard work, he said.... Ruy Teixeira, a senior fellow at the liberal Center for American Progress, said he worried before the election that Democrats’ focus on racial justice issues came at the expense of outreach about easing the lives of hard-pressed workers. 'In general, it suggests that Democrats’ theory of the case — that their electoral problems were all about race rather than class — was incorrect.'"

123 comments:

wendybar said...

The immigrants know who was actually helping them, and not lying to them like they've been lied to for many years now. They actually woke up. The Propagandists in media and the white liberals have been lying for years....and the fraud is the butter on the buns...we all know they cheated.

mockturtle said...

As we discussed yesterday, it only makes sense that immigrants have a stronger appreciation for the freedoms our country was founded upon and a wish to preserve them that is greater and more urgent than that of the rest of us.

daskol said...

In this Era of Psephelogic Improbability, Trump can expand his reach among minorities nationwide, and among all groups except maybe white males, and lead a GOP wave increasing their Congressional representation and their hold on statehouses nationwide, and still somehow lose to that wiliest of all American politicians in modern history, super Joe Biden, who fashioned electoral victory for himself despite the ascension of the Trump GOP. After 47 years in the public sphere, who realized Joe had such political aces still up his sleeve?

daskol said...

How did Joe do it? We'll be studying this for generations, as we re-write the book on American presidential elections. The NYT is on the case.

Stephen said...

For another article making essentially the same set of points seee here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-election-democrats-losses/2020/12/20/b5b2cec4-3ff5-11eb-8db8-395dedaaa036_story.html

daskol said...

And he did it all from his basement, barely breaking a sweat in this most improbable and fantastic campaign. It's one for the ages. I mean, they'll study it, but nobody but Joe could have pulled this off, our singular political talent of this and perhaps all generations.

Bob Smith said...

All those white folks think Daddy Joe is gonna buy them a new bicycle for Christmas.

Achilles said...

The country did not choose blue.

The people who counted ballots after kicking poll observers out chose blue.

Wince said...

[T]he red shifts...

The Doppler Effect.

Ruy Teixeira, a senior fellow at the liberal Center for American Progress, said he worried before the election that Democrats’ focus on racial justice issues came at the expense of outreach about easing the lives of hard-pressed workers. 'In general, it suggests that Democrats’ theory of the case — that their electoral problems were all about race rather than class — was incorrect.'"

Race and other divisions were meant by Democrats to take everyone's eyes off class.

If Biden gets in, let's see what happens to the price of a gallon of gas.

Kai Akker said...

More hefty anal-O-sis from NYT. More Ruy. So good!

daskol said...

Improbable Joe. Joe the unlikely. Joe "seabiscuit" Biden. Just plain no malarky Joe, we Americans gotta have him.

Stephen said...

It's clear how Biden did it. With both sides turning out a lot more voters, he made big pickups in the suburbs and exurbs among educated voters. He also did better with seniors. That was enough to beat Trump's better performances in rural areas and with Hispanic voters and/or voters of color.

Freeman Hunt said...

I've always thought that people trying to buy votes from immigrants with offers for more government handouts must not know many immigrants. You're talking about people who packed up and relocated to an entirely different country for opportunity!

Lucid-Ideas said...

Other than black America, fewer groups have more to lose than continuing with this constant generational importation of the next lowest bidder demographic than legal immigrants.

Legal immigrants should and maybe they are seeing that and I hope they realize how much it disadvantages them. I could care less about black Americans though, as a plantation demographic their consistent voting for such replacement is less than they deserve.

Wince said...

Notice, after every recent presidential election, there's been a politcal consultant taking a victory lap in the media: Rove. Axelrod. Parscale.

Telling us what he did, how he did it.

Except this one. The election where the winner got the most votes ever.

Achilles said...

Stephen said...

It's clear how Biden did it. With both sides turning out a lot more voters, he made big pickups in the suburbs and exurbs among educated voters. He also did better with seniors. That was enough to beat Trump's better performances in rural areas and with Hispanic voters and/or voters of color.

You can keep saying this all you want.

Nobody is buying it.

Nobody wanted Joe Biden. It is a lie. There is no chance Biden wins in a real honest transparent election.

Zero.

Joe Smith said...

Even though Hispanics seem to love socialism (or at least socialism lite) in government, Asians don't.

Maybe they're figuring out that they don't want the same type of government that they had before they came here...

Too bad Californians that move to Colorado, Texas, AZ, etc. haven't come to the same conclusion...

"...but with a Reaganesque message of personal responsibility and hard work..."

I haven't known very many lazy Asians or Hispanics, especially Mexicans.

Dave Begley said...

It really is very Third World-ish to realize we didn't have an honest election for POTUS.

daskol said...

I wish Warren Zevon were alive so he could write a ballad called "Improbable Joe."

wendybar said...

It's clear how Biden did it. With both sides turning out a lot more voters, he made big pickups in the suburbs and exurbs among educated voters.

I wouldn't call them educated, I would call them indoctrinated...but you do you...

Joe Smith said...

"Nobody wanted Joe Biden. It is a lie. There is no chance Biden wins in a real honest transparent election."

The first clue is a drooling empty suit getting more votes than the Anointed One®

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Ruy Teixeira, a senior fellow at the liberal Center for American Progress, said he worried before the election that Democrats’ focus on racial justice issues came at the expense of outreach about easing the lives of hard-pressed workers. 'In general, it suggests that Democrats’ theory of the case — that their electoral problems were all about race rather than class — was incorrect.'"

Nice to know he's occasionally capable of recognizing reality

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Stephen said...
It's clear how Biden did it. With both sides turning out a lot more voters, he made big pickups in the suburbs and exurbs among educated voters. He also did better with seniors. That was enough to beat Trump's better performances in rural areas and with Hispanic voters and/or voters of color.

Really?

And in which States did that actually happen, according to the County / Precinct voting data (not the polls, which are trash)?

Examples, please

Michael K said...

Blogger Stephen said...
It's clear how Biden did it. With both sides turning out a lot more voters,


But the Trump voters were real. The Biden voters were paper ballots counted multiple times. Why the chicanery about closing the counting places ?

LYNNDH said...

With some Dems are saying that Black Americans should have their votes counted twice because it would be a form of reparations alienates Hispanic and Asian voters.

J. Farmer said...

It is unsurprising that the Democrat's big move to the left on racial matters would have this effect. Latinos and Asians have very little desire to indulge blacks behaving badly. Despite efforts like "rainbow coalition" and "people of color," in terms of America's racial problems, there are only two races: blacks and non-blacks. Young black men, representing only a few percent of the total population, produce a tremendous amount of social pathology.

The Democrat's answer to this problem is to blame white men. The share of power in this country held by white men has been declining for decades ad has never been as low as it is now. Since the late 1960s, our society has exerted a huge amount of political, financial, and cultural effort to remedying racial disparities. And yet, over this same time period, black social mobility has been pretty much flat. The black middle class has relied on affirmative action in public hiring for a lot of its foundation.

Most tragically, neither the "systemic racism" left or "personal responsibility" right has an answer to the biological component of the problem. Acknowledging this presents big challenges to the worldview of both sides. Consequently, the issue has driven a huge wedge between white Americans. The "social justice warriors" on one side and the "deplorables" on another. Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right.

Birkel said...

Those immigrants recognize how poorly the Leftist Collectivist promises hold up against reality.
They escaped places run by the people Democraticals prefer.
And the party Althouse prefers.

Also, this exposes how unlikely it is that Biden received as many actual votes as are claimed.
But Democraticals stole the election fair and square, just like back home (for those immigrant escapees).

PJ said...

Immigrants are not under the illusion that Venezuela (or Hong Kong) could never happen here.

Lucid-Ideas said...

@LYNNDH

Maybe Hispanic and Asian democratic voters haven't gotten the message that minorities were not created equal, there's definitely a hierarchy. It's ok though, they should be used to taking the back seat to blacks. They are, after all, voting for it.

Birkel said...

Also, the country did not vote for Democraticals.
The House swung toward Republicans.

Sure, Michigan was stolen from John James.
And Arizona has rejected Martha McSally twice.
But that is not "going Blue" by any stretch.

Elliott A said...

Mr. Trump lost ground in republican areas but got 95% of the republican vote. He won Ohio and Florida by yuge amounts and Joe Biden got 15 million more votes than Obama. The article is misdirection, and it is not working.

Nonapod said...

These days I find articles like this somewhat annoying, not because I don't believe them, but because 1). they're framed within the general conceit that this was an honest and fair presidential election which I am extremely dubious of and 2). they feel like a weak concession or an appeal to journalistic legitimacy. In this case it feels like NYT is attempting to pretend that they still have some sort of legitimacy by writing a story that isn't favorable to Democrats "See! We're not just shills for a single political party! A negative story about Democrats proves we're still honest!".

iowan2 said...

Most tragically, neither the "systemic racism" left or "personal responsibility" right has an answer to the biological component of the problem

You need to help me out with the biological problem.

Maybe if you provided your solution, I could understand the problem.

boatbuilder said...

The idea that any "educated" purportedly Republican white male would vote for Joe Biden over Donald Trump on the basis that Trump is "a boor", or "a con man," or a "phony," or a "big spender" [I feel like Chris Farley doing that routine...] or any of the many and varied reasons that are put forth by the National Review types strikes me as both improbable and, if true, "Sad" as The Man Himself would say.
Are you really voting for Joe Biden--Joe Biden fer chrissake!--and the Democrat Party because you don't like Trump's image, or character, or methods? Really? You, a grown, educated man? Is that really how you make decisions?
And if you really think that we would be better served in the areas of international affairs, military matters, intelligence, finance, civil rights or anywhere else by having the Dems back in charge, what the hell is wrong with you?
If there really are enough of those people to account for the purported election result, then we are indeed well and truly screwed.

Francisco D said...

Dave Begley said...It really is very Third World-ish to realize we didn't have an honest election for POTUS.

We have never had an honest election. Urban areas have been producing fake Democrat votes since I was a kid in Chicago. It is well known.

However, the question in this election is whether the fraud was so great as to produce the unusual results we are seeing.

I have no doubt that millions of fake mail in votes were counted. Were enough of those votes produced to turn the election? Probably.

daskol said...

The margin of fraud has been expanded so much that we've moved into flamethrower territory. You can fix the gentlemanly fraud of previous elections by campaigning hard and holding the line on election practices enshrined in state constitutions and legislations. But it seems the only way to fix this kind of fraud may be with a flamethrower, a lot of them.

Chuck said...

Biden did not win the election based on massive minority support, or massive minority turnout. We know that, based on the close attention paid to Detroit/Michigan, Philadephia/Pennsylvania, Milwaukee/Wisconsin, and even Maricopa County/Arizona.

The way that Biden won, was with a massive flip away from Republican/Trump in the major suburbs. Among educated nominal Republicans.

The complete triumph, of the Lincoln Project.

Jim said...

The NYT has become a parody of Pravda. In fact, Pravda was at least honest that it was a propaganda tool for the Soviets.
Really hard to read this blog anymore, when the news 'sources' are so slanted. It is shameful how corrupt the NYT, WP, Vanity Fair have become.
Seems like this blog is in a rut, recycling slanted news, as real news. Kinda sad. But if you are on board with the leftist narrative, then it all makes sense.

Francisco D said...

Most tragically, neither the "systemic racism" left or "personal responsibility" right has an answer to the biological component of the problem.

The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform. Affirmative Action (which is currently morphing into hard quotas) is not the answer.

Spiros said...

The Biden campaign was tremendously anti-Semitic and anti-White (or "anti-racist"), yet it still won enough Whites to coast to victory. Biden was super, super popular among Whites who mailed in their votes.

unknown said...

“Latinos and residents of Asian descent”

That’s odd language.

J. Farmer said...

@Francisco D:

The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform.

I have no objection to that, but how exactly can we do that?

Carol said...

Lots of dummies vote for the candidate who is mas famoso, and likely to win in their minds.

Not saying immigrants are all dumb, but my theory is as valid as the personal responsibility motive routinely projected onto them.

J. Farmer said...

iowan2 said...

You need to help me out with the biological problem.

Maybe if you provided your solution, I could understand the problem.


I have no solution. The problem is vexed. On average, blacks have lower IQs and more disruptive behavior patterns than whites. Both of these are big contributors to the black-white "gap" in terms of criminal justice, educational attainment, and income. The discrepancy in disruptive behavior is evident at the pre-school level and persists throughout schooling and early adulthood. This is the so called "school to prison pipeline."

DanTheMan said...

>>The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform.
> I have no objection to that, but how exactly can we do that?

Double the size of Congress?

Darrell said...

This is why Trump won in a landslide. No Republican voted for Basement Joe and Kamala Hoaxy.

n.n said...

"Most tragically, neither the "systemic racism" left or "personal responsibility" right has an answer to the biological component of the problem"

You need to help me out with the biological problem.


Women, including trans/homosexual females, and trans/neo-females are not only politically congruent ("="), but are gender (i.e. physical and mental attributes) equivalent. Babies... fetal-Americans evolve from a worthy state, not conception, and under the Pro-Choice religious/ethical dogma, can be selected and/or cannibalized/redistributed for progress. Diversity of colors, not individuals. Minority of groups, not people. All of these are forward-looking conditions of systemic bigotry. As for wealth disparity, not everyone will enjoy a beachfront estate in paradise or some upscale haven.

I Callahan said...

It's clear how Biden did it. With both sides turning out a lot more voters, he made big pickups in the suburbs and exurbs among educated voters. He also did better with seniors. That was enough to beat Trump's better performances in rural areas and with Hispanic voters and/or voters of color.

To the tune of 18 million more voters than for the first black president in the history of the United States?

No. Freaking. Way.

n.n said...

The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform.

According to SNHU, the world equally distributes talent, but not opportunities. That said, the answer is comparable to medical reform: progressive prices vs progressive costs. Also [catastrophic] [anthropogenic] immigration reform in lieu of emigration reform. Diversity of colors, not people. Life deemed unworthy of life (e.g. Planned Parenthood, Planned Parent). Elective, transnational wars/terrorism/coups without borders and other forward-looking solutions.

Affirmative Action (which is currently morphing into hard quotas) is not the answer.

Affirmative discrimination under diversity dogma normalized by the moderate, politically congruent "center".

mockturtle said...

Bottom line: Biden didn't really win.

I Callahan said...

He won Ohio and Florida by yuge amounts and Joe Biden got 15 million more votes than Obama.

This is another great point. Ohio is similar to Michigan and Pennsylvania, although less liberal - manufacturing cities, farming rural areas, similar philosophies. Yet I'm supposed to believe that Trump LOST these two states while winning Ohio by a high margin?

I'll repeat: No. Freaking. Way.

Nonapod said...

The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform.

That's unlikely. It's pretty apparent that as a civilization we're slowly moving away from economies based around large numbers of no-to-low skill jobs. The continued advances in automation, robotization, and narrow artificial intelligence assure a gradual end to the repetitive, tedious, and often dangerous labor that has defined so much of human experience for thousands and thousands of years. In fact eventually even moderate and higher skill jobs won't be safe.

n.n said...

To the tune of 18 million more voters than for the first black president in the history of the United States?

Yes, urban smoothing, Planned Parent/hood, immigration reform, and diversity were selected instead of revitalization, rehabilitation, reconciliation; human rights; emigration reform; and civil rights. Progress: one step forward, two steps backward.

Bruce Hayden said...

“ Most tragically, neither the "systemic racism" left or "personal responsibility" right has an answer to the biological component of the problem. Acknowledging this presents big challenges to the worldview of both sides. Consequently, the issue has driven a huge wedge between white Americans. The "social justice warriors" on one side and the "deplorables" on another. Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right.”

Well, we can start by ending the War on Poverty financial incentivation for fatherless child rearing. If black (or other ethnic group) women know that they will be working out of the home 40-50 hours a week to keep their kids fed and in clothing, they are going to be much less receptive to requiring that the fathers for their kids stick around and help out. And that will go a long way to civilizing the young black males who are the bulk of the violence problem in this country.

Inga said...

Just as I said before the election...

2018 saw a shift to Democrats in the suburbs because of a revulsion for Trump and I said in 2020 it would happen again in an even bigger way. It did. Trump lost by 7 million votes.

Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...

The Blue Wave of former GOP voters who died or left the state before the November election.

narciso said...

and your udba garbage doesn't mean a thing,

Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...

"Reaganesque message of personal responsibility and hard work....

Obama-Bidenesque message personal irresponsibility and government dependency...

BUMBLE BEE said...

Livin the Dream...

Francisco D said...

J. Farmer said...The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform.

I have no objection to that, but how exactly can we do that?


The manufacturing jobs that are performed overseas by cheap labor need to come back here, like the textile industry. We will pay a lot more money for items produced here, but will it be more than we spend on social welfare and crime?

Trump seemed to be moving in that direction.

rhhardin said...

Latinos and Latinas.

Gunner said...

Ungrateful, pretend-conservative White Women like the McCain mom and daughter need to be pandered to next time.

Achilles said...

J. Farmer said...

I have no solution. The problem is vexed. On average, blacks have lower IQs and more disruptive behavior patterns than whites. Both of these are big contributors to the black-white "gap" in terms of criminal justice, educational attainment, and income. The discrepancy in disruptive behavior is evident at the pre-school level and persists throughout schooling and early adulthood. This is the so called "school to prison pipeline."

This is the question that will dominate all societal arrangements over the next couple of decades.

The first mass dislocation that will be impossible to ignore is the end of the Truck Driver occupation. It is the largest employer in 30sih states.

We just wont need Truck drivers in 10 years.

Doctors and Lawyers are going to be replaced not long after. Nurses will be needed longer than almost everyone but even they will get replaced at some point.

At some point there just isn't anything for non CS/Engineer labor.

rhhardin said...

Residents of Asian descent means slanty eyes.

J Melcher said...

Stephen said...
It's clear how Biden did it..., he made big pickups in the suburbs and exurbs among educated voters...

Uhm, Stephen, help me explain how educated voters failed to even vote down ballot for any candidate from either party.

The big pickups ( Hummer H2 sized ) were in urban core districts where strangely undervoted ballots favored Biden but no other senator, congress critter, mayor, alderman, or dog-catcher.

These may be "educated" voters but if so it's a serious indictment of the US education system.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

A few targeted Blue cities... became fake math blue.

rhhardin said...

Beat the meth labs into math labs.

J. Farmer said...

@Bruce Hayden:

Well, we can start by ending the War on Poverty financial incentivation for fatherless child rearing.

That happened over 20 years ago when AFDC was replaced with TANF. The role welfare benefits played in the rise of out-of-wedlock births is most likely quite exaggerated. Black illegitimacy rates were much greater than white rates even before the war on poverty was launched. The advent of oral contraception, abortion, no-fault divorce, and the decline of shotgun marriages all likely played a bigger role in the increase.

Black homicides account for about half of all homicides in the US in 1960, and the black homicide rate was was about eight times that of the white rate. These gaps have persisted up until today. This is pretty suggestive that differences criminal offending cannot primarily be attributed to the increase of out-of-wedlock births.

Mike of Snoqualmie said...

Baseless Biden made big pickups in the Democrat election worker class. They'd do anything for him, and they did. In their parlance, "honest election" doesn't mean what everyone else thinks it means. To them, an "honest election" is one where the Democrat candidates wins by a tiny margin after overtaking the Republican's candidate's huge lead.

J. Farmer said...

@Francisco D:

The manufacturing jobs that are performed overseas by cheap labor need to come back here, like the textile industry. We will pay a lot more money for items produced here, but will it be more than we spend on social welfare and crime?

But again, how do we get them to "come back here" if they can be more profitably produced overseas?

Achilles said...

J. Farmer said...

That happened over 20 years ago when AFDC was replaced with TANF. The role welfare benefits played in the rise of out-of-wedlock births is most likely quite exaggerated. Black illegitimacy rates were much greater than white rates even before the war on poverty was launched. The advent of oral contraception, abortion, no-fault divorce, and the decline of shotgun marriages all likely played a bigger role in the increase.

Black homicides account for about half of all homicides in the US in 1960, and the black homicide rate was was about eight times that of the white rate. These gaps have persisted up until today. This is pretty suggestive that differences criminal offending cannot primarily be attributed to the increase of out-of-wedlock births.


None of this matters.

Focusing on this aspect of the problem only exacerbates the underlying issues our country faces in fixing our societal arrangements.

We have to focus on fixing the underlying structures of our society and applying them equally to all who live here.

There is no answer that starts with treating some races differently than other races that produces a good result.

Achilles said...

I should say none of that matters if you want a good result.

If you want something other than a good result then by all means focus on race and racial differences.

Temujin said...

Ruy Teixeira is the guy who co-wrote a book that came out about 20 years ago, "The Emerging Democratic Majority, which said that the changing demographic in this country- going from predominately white to predominately POC, meant a permanent Democratic majority. I knew he was wrong then and as time has shown, I was right.

To assume that you know how a person thinks, acts, votes because of the color of his/her skin is something you can get away with for short blips in time only. But, in the end, people are individuals. And they will think for themselves eventually. They'll make decisions based on rational self-interest. Decisions that are best for them and their families. Not what's best for The Party.

Ruy- and most of the media and Washington still do not get this. Most disappointing of all is that the Republican Party, which should get it, does not. Trump voters get it.

Clyde said...

The country chose red, top to bottom. The fraudsters changed to top to blue. The out-of-place Biden "win" at the top of the ballot while his party was flayed down-ballot is as odd as an Easter Island statue would be in downtown Atlanta or Detroit or Milwaukee or Philadelphia.

Temujin said...

And the Democratic Party cannot even fathom that individuals will make decisions based on rational self-interest. Hell, they don't even like the word 'individual'. Give them the statist collectivist creeps.

Mike of Snoqualmie said...

Fix the black family problem, fix the black crime problem. Seventy percent of black kids are born out of wedlock. How would you like to be a black kid and know that your father doesn't give a rip about you? That would make anyone angry. A father is essential to getting kids to grow up socialized. Without the father, the kids grow up feral, and the crime rates show this.

Ray - SoCal said...

Interesting who is backing Biden won by getting more voters in the comments...

I wonder what the real numbers are for Trump among all groups, especially Blacks.

This article mentions GOP poll watchers were often White, where vote counters were Black in suspect areas. My gut feeling is this article has a lot of truth in it:
https://www.unz.com/article/electoral-fraud-in-black-and-white/

One good benefit of this election fraud is it made Trump into a martyr.

So is Trump going to make the GOP into the workers and small business party, vs the Party of the elites, the Democrats?

Michael K said...

On the matter of "low IQ jobs," there are lots of jobs that do not require college level IQ. Sadly, there are millions of kids trying to prove that wrong. In the 19th century, the US used protective tariffs to allow industries to grow sheltered partially from competition. It worked.

Now, we have a little different problem. Due to mercantilist behavior by China and theft of IP and corruption by US political leaders, lots of jobs that do not require high IQ have gone elsewhere, not just China. Protective tariffs, which Trump was trying to analyze, may be the solution. We spend billions on welfare supporting people who might be able to support themselves of protected from
"vulture capitalism" and mercantilism.

The social consequences from "The Great Society," which I recommend for Farmer, will be harder but we have to start somewhere. The idea of a "basic Income" has been disproven in Britain, which has social chaos among whites.

Michael K said...

My gut feeling is this article has a lot of truth in it:
https://www.unz.com/article/electoral-fraud-in-black-and-white/


I posted a link to that article a couple of days ago and was instantly accused of racism by Lawyer Uhr.

Greg The Class Traitor said...

Ray - SoCal said...
Interesting who is backing Biden won by getting more voters in the comments...

What's amusing is how they spew the BS, then disappear when asked for numbers.

Let's consider GA:
Biden "outperformed" Clinton by 32.4% outside of Dekalb and Fulton counties (that's Atlanta metro area).

He "outperformed" Clinton by 35.2% in Fulton County (73.5 to 26.5)

But he "outperformed" Clinton by 47.3% in Dekalb (84.1% to 15.9%).

If he'd only "outperformed" Clinton in Dekalb by as much as he "outperformed" Clinton in Fulton, he'd have over 25k fewer votes, and wouldn't have been able to steal the State.

It's truly amazing the way minority, including black, voters moved to Trump. EXCEPT in those few keen cities where they had to go the other way, in order for Biden to "win".

J. Farmer said...

@Mike of Snoqualmie:

Fix the black family problem, fix the black crime problem.

Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of good reasons to believe thus. The out-of-wedlock birth rate doesn't really explain the crime trends of the last half-century. But even if it were true, we don't really know how to "fix the black family."

mockturtle said...

I value my mechanic and my plumber more than I value my accountant or my attorney. It's not hard to find another of the latter but bloody difficult to replace the former. YMMV.

Greg The Class Traitor said...

I could understand someone saying "Joe Biden has been granted the victory, we need to operate on that basis." You can be an honest person, and be rule bound enough to do that.

But you can not be an informed and honest person, and also believe that Biden clearly and honestly won.

Because there are too many open questions for him to have "clearly won".

So, if you do NOT want 70 million+ Trump voters to believe that they have been disenfranchised, you NEED to have investigations going that those voters can trust. Ones that will, before the 2022 elections, be able to say "yes, he won honestly", or "no, he didn't , and these are the changes that need to be made to stop the vote stealing in the future."

It is the refusal of the Republican Establishment, and the Judicial branch, to do that, that is going to light the fuse.

Because "yeah, you got screwed, and now you're out of luck because there's nothing we're willing to do to protect you" also says "if you want justice, you're going to have to get it for yourself."

And once you've told people that, you no longer have the slightest shred of a moral leg to stand on when they decide to go out and get that justice for themselves.

By Any Means Necessary

mockturtle said...

It's up to black families and individuals to 'fix' their situations when they need fixing, just as it is white families'. Social engineering never works and only serves to create more self-serving bureaucracies and---just as bad!---SJWs.

J. Farmer said...

@Achilles:

We have to focus on fixing the underlying structures of our society and applying them equally to all who live here.

There is no answer that starts with treating some races differently than other races that produces a good result.


I take your point, but that's why I think it's a vexed problem. Think about weight classes in boxing or gender-segregation in sports. The purpose is to make competition fairer by reducing the advantage of physical differences. That said, I agree with you that affirmative action for blacks is corrosive to social equality.

pacwest said...

2018 saw a shift to Democrats in the suburbs because of a revulsion for Trump and I said in 2020 it would happen again in an even bigger way. It did. Trump lost by 7 million votes.

A shift in the suburb vote from Trump to Biden would indicate Trump receiving less votes than 2016.

While revulsion of Trump *may* have been the possible explanation for his loss of a lot of votes it would have to have been coupled with an equally high turnout for Biden due to Trump's record numbers. As others point out the enthusiasm for Biden would have to have been much higher than for the light bringer himself. Not very likely since there was absolutely no indication of that pre-election. None. Couple this with the documented voting irregularities and it's not hard to understand why many, myself included, believe that the reason for Trump's loss was massive vote fraud on the part of the Democrats.

I'm Full of Soup said...

If true, the Dems will be in favor of building a big damn wall and Voter ID.

Jim at said...

2018 saw a shift to Democrats

It's hilarious how you think you're some sort of prognosticator by constantly referring to 2018 ... while never, ever - not even once - making any comparison to 1994 and 2010.

Is it because Clinton and Obama lost more seats than Mr. Revulsion and therefore blows your narrative to shit?

Darkisland said...

Blogger daskol said...

but nobody but Joe could have pulled this off,

That's Doctor Joe to you, peon.

For you to refuse to call him by his rightful title is racist, or sexist, or classist or somethingist.

Dr Harris said so this morning.

(Just don't call him president. That's something he and Dr Hilary have in common. Neither will ever be president)

John Henry

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

"The left impeached the President for trying to expose a crime, and then committed election fraud to replace him with the person who committed the crime."

Achilles said...

J. Farmer said...

I take your point, but that's why I think it's a vexed problem. Think about weight classes in boxing or gender-segregation in sports. The purpose is to make competition fairer by reducing the advantage of physical differences. That said, I agree with you that affirmative action for blacks is corrosive to social equality.

My 4 year old daughter is in the other room crying right now. She wants to play and she wants to win. She doesn't understand the not winning every time thing.

Part of the issue with the meritocracy is what to do with the people, like my 4 year old who is pissed she can't beat her mom and a 7 year old at a reading comprehension game, that do not understand their place in a meritocracy.

Too many of them turn to the government for redress. They want things are decided tribaly instead of on objective metrics.

The only way to have winners and losers accept the results of a game is for the rules to be agreed on in advance and have those rules applied fairly.

This is why the entire system has to be cruel and colorblind.

Churchy LaFemme: said...

Ruy Teixeira is the guy who co-wrote a book that came out about 20 years ago, "The Emerging Democratic Majority, which said that the changing demographic in this country- going from predominately white to predominately POC, meant a permanent Democratic majority. I knew he was wrong then and as time has shown, I was right.

Just setting all that aside, when a country has a two-party system in general the parties will gravitate to about a 50/50 position. Their positions will change as necessary to avoid an electorial lockout.

Is that still better than a parlimentary system where parties mean something and every government is a shaky coalition? I don't know, but in general I would say it has worked better for us than the Italian system has worked for Italy..

J. Farmer said...

@Michael K:

Now, we have a little different problem. Due to mercantilist behavior by China and theft of IP and corruption by US political leaders, lots of jobs that do not require high IQ have gone elsewhere, not just China

I agree with you about the structural challenges, but I disagree that China and corrupt US political leaders are the cause. The policies that set the stage for globalization were implemented at the end of the Carter administration and the beginning of the Reagan administration. The variety of reforms that are collectively identified as "neoliberalism." These ultimately were a response to the slowing of the post-war economic boom in the late 1960s. The answer was financialization and trade liberalization. This allowed US businesses to keep costs down by suppressing wages at the bottom, and the profits earned by foreign exporters flowed into Wall Street in search of high rates of return. This allowed the US to basically financialize its budget and trade deficits. It was this system that began to unravel in 2007 and unleashed the Great Recession.

J. Farmer said...

@Achilles:

Too many of them turn to the government for redress. They want things are decided tribaly instead of on objective metrics.

Has any society in human history ever established a social hierarchy "on objective metrics" rather than tribally? The problem with meritocracy is that it essentially recreates an hereditary aristocracy. You don't earn your genetic endowment or early social environment anymore than you earn being the child of nobility. Social stratification became much more meritocratic in the second half of the 20th century, and the effects on social cohesion are not encouraging. We've produced a wealthy elite who believ3e they've earned their success and that the lower classes are losers who won't take personal responsibility. This elite exerts tremendous influence on our politics and culture.

Michael K said...

I disagree that China and corrupt US political leaders are the cause. The policies that set the stage for globalization were implemented at the end of the Carter administration and the beginning of the Reagan administration.

The relationship was fairly open at first. The real corruption began with Clinton and Loral plus the appearance of Xi. Boeing was one of the first big American manufacturers that had to locate in China to sell then product. IP theft has been a feature ever since. Reagan had the USSR to worry about and I don't recall much about China then. Bush of course was ambassador and may have established a relationship.

Michael K said...

We've produced a wealthy elite who believ3e they've earned their success and that the lower classes are losers who won't take personal responsibility. This elite exerts tremendous influence on our politics and culture.

Agreed. The irony is that, just as they assumed superiority, the quality of education collapsed. They are miseducated and don't know it.

Lucid-Ideas said...

@Mike of Snoqualmie

"Without the father, the kids grow up feral."

They grow up feral with fathers, sometimes including their encouragement and active participation. Oh yeah, and mom too.

Bob Smith said...

Makers and takers.

J. Farmer said...

Michael K:

Reagan had the USSR to worry about and I don't recall much about China then. Bush of course was ambassador and may have established a relationship.

Reagan implemented US-China normalization. In 1983, the administration agreed to nuclear cooperation, arms sales, loosening of export controls on technology, and to generally support China's modernization efforts. Zhao Ziyang became the first Chinese Premiere to visit the USA in 1985.

The Vault Dweller said...

Part of the issue with the meritocracy is what to do with the people, like my 4 year old who is pissed she can't beat her mom and a 7 year old at a reading comprehension game, that do not understand their place in a meritocracy.

One of the best things about having kids participate in sports is eventually they lose, and they learn to deal with it. If the kid isn't athletic or interested in sports, then getting them involved in some other competitive activity does wonders. Heck, even playing tag as a kid probably helps a bunch. Teaching kids to value procedural fairness over equitable outcomes is how to protect America's future.

Mr Wibble said...

One of the best things about having kids participate in sports is eventually they lose, and they learn to deal with it. If the kid isn't athletic or interested in sports, then getting them involved in some other competitive activity does wonders. Heck, even playing tag as a kid probably helps a bunch. Teaching kids to value procedural fairness over equitable outcomes is how to protect America's future.

That used to be the case. Unfortunately sports have been corrupted as well. Too much money at stake, and too many parents who see it as their kid's ticket to a good future.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

China inched out of communism... but they just cannot make it. The power structure at the top won't let it happen.

Freeman Hunt said...

"The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform."

We have these now, and they go unfilled. Try to hire out simple jobs lately? Yow! My yard guy pays top dollar for people to help him, and he can't get steady employees anymore.

Francisco D said...

Protective tariffs, which Trump was trying to analyze, may be the solution. We spend billions on welfare supporting people who might be able to support themselves of protected from "vulture capitalism" and mercantilism.

There is no way in the world I would haver agreed with that solution ...

...five years ago. Now I think that is the price we need to pay to give the lower IQ and dysfunctional folks motivation to join the economy in a productive manner.

People need the dignity of productive work. (says the guy who retired after working his ass off for 50 years).

J. Farmer said...

@The Vault Dweller:o

Heck, even playing tag as a kid probably helps a bunch.

I think that is undoubtedly true. Sports and games are present in every known culture. I suspect that it grows out of similar motivations to roughhousing, which is present in all mammalian species.

Teaching kids to value procedural fairness over equitable outcomes is how to protect America's future.

"Equitable outcomes" is a chimera, but inequality can pose a serious risk to social cohesion. And it isn't exactly clear what "procedural fairness" in terms of society as a whole. If you look at America's demographics, we are essentially a microcosm of the global north-south divide. Americans of northern European, Ashkenazi Jewish, and Asian extraction will dominate the ruling class, and Americans of native or African extraction will form a permanent underclass. You see this same racial caste reproduced in Latin America. It's hard to imagine a society arranged in such a manner to cooperate effectively. Overcoming ethnic nepotism is no small challenge.

J. Farmer said...

@Freeman Hunt:

We have these now, and they go unfilled. Try to hire out simple jobs lately? Yow! My yard guy pays top dollar for people to help him, and he can't get steady employees anymore.

He's going to have to pay topper dollar. That's how wages at the bottom rise. The reason the US business community is enthusiastic about neoliberalism is because it allows them to keep wages low by outsourcing work and importing cheap migrant labor, legally or otherwise. "Jobs Americans won't do" is really "Jobs Americans won't do for low wages and shitty working conditions."

The famous labor leader Cesar Chavez correctly noted in the early 1970s that illegal immigrants were relied on to break strikes and avoid demands by agricultural workers for better pay and working conditions.

Michael K said...

The reason the US business community is enthusiastic about neoliberalism is because it allows them to keep wages low by outsourcing work and importing cheap migrant labor, legally or otherwise. "Jobs Americans won't do" is really "Jobs Americans won't do for low wages and shitty working conditions."

Yup. I spent about five years reviewing workers comp claims in CA. 1/3 of the claims were submitted by illegals. I would review the files. Many of them did not even speak Spanish. One reason for the number of claims they had filed was the lack of safety equipment. I knew a guy from sailing who was a claim adjustor for SCIF, the state insurer. He said the roofers were the worst. The workers would get a rope for a safety belt.

Michael K said...

Reagan implemented US-China normalization. In 1983, the administration agreed to nuclear cooperation, arms sales, loosening of export controls on technology,

Oh, I know but Reagan had a Cold War to win and China was not on the "Middle Kingdom" thing that Xi has begun. He is getting serious pushback from Australis, which in spite of loony libs running Melbourne, still has some common sense. Biden, of course, will offer no resistance.

h said...

WOuldn't it be interesting if the upshot of relaxed restrictions on immigration from Mexico and Central America is that the voting population of the US no longer supports Roe v. Wade?

I know other commenters have noted that this is by Texiera who wrote the highly influential book which posited that (a) immigrants vote Dem. (b) immigration is increasing, so (c) there is an unavoidable shift towards Dems over the net decades. I think he realizes that conclusion (c) hasn't come true (or at least come true as fast as he expected), so like an honest social scientist, he is asking himself "what was wrong with my original analysis?" And he has settled on (a) as being wrong, or not as true as he expected. So those who think "he was wrong before, so now he is discredited," I would say: Give him credit for recognizing and analyzing his past mistakes.

h said...

Francisco D says: "The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform." Let's recognize that the Democrats are working toward this objective. Unfortunately, there aren't enough elective offices available to make much of a dent in low-IQ unemployment.

Achilles said...

J. Farmer said...

@Achilles:

Too many of them turn to the government for redress. They want things are decided tribaly instead of on objective metrics.

Has any society in human history ever established a social hierarchy "on objective metrics" rather than tribally? The problem with meritocracy is that it essentially recreates an hereditary aristocracy. You don't earn your genetic endowment or early social environment anymore than you earn being the child of nobility. Social stratification became much more meritocratic in the second half of the 20th century, and the effects on social cohesion are not encouraging. We've produced a wealthy elite who believ3e they've earned their success and that the lower classes are losers who won't take personal responsibility. This elite exerts tremendous influence on our politics and culture.

There are always going to be advantages to being wealthy and starting off ahead. No system will ever be fair. And that is the first thing that has to go is the idea of Fair. Your position that meritocracy creates a hereditary aristocracy is partly true. There is no way around that.

The key to getting everyone to buy into the system is to give everyone the perception that if they work hard and do the right things they will have at least a decent shot.

This starts with school choice and heavy policing of low income neighborhoods. It also includes changing all government incentives to promote childbirth in wedlock.

But before this even starts and why it probably wont happen is that we need to go to square zero which is to reduce the military age population of the group that is keeping these people poor through nasty policies by thirty percent.

Robert Cook said...

"Nobody wanted Joe Biden. It is a lie. There is no chance Biden wins in a real honest transparent election.

"Zero."


So you say, but no one from the Trump side has produced proof to the contrary. It's not that anyone wanted Biden; it's that so many DID NOT WANT Trump.

I didn't want Trump but I couldn't stomach voting for Biden, so, once again, I voted Green Party.

Michelle Dulak Thomson said...

Francisco D,

The answer is to create well paying jobs that require less IQ to perform. Affirmative Action (which is currently morphing into hard quotas) is not the answer.

The difficulty with this is that if these "low-IQ jobs" actually do pay well, they won't go to low-IQ people, but to lazy higher-IQ people. The only way we have ever made this work is by putting the wages of menial labor so low that no one would perform it who could do any better. Of course, we've also lumped into "menial labor" a lot of things that aren't, to the point that people think of skilled trades like construction, electrical work, plumbing, arborists' gigs, &c. as stuff any idiot could do, and then find ourselves surprised when the actually-available idiots turn out not to know anything about, say, HVAC. And, since we're the ones attempting to hire them, of course neither do we :-)

(Apologies for the "we/them" setup there. I'm speaking primarily for myself, a decently educated person with even an engineering degree from a top school, but appallingly little knowledge about how ordinary household machinery works.)

There are actually very few jobs out there that can literally be done by anyone, and many of those turn out to be relatively "high-status," e.g., receptionists, who need to know a lot less than your everyday grocery-store clerk. The DMV and the Post Office (the in-store workers, not the drivers) also come to mind.

J. Farmer said...

@Achilles:

There are always going to be advantages to being wealthy and starting off ahead. No system will ever be fair. And that is the first thing that has to go is the idea of Fair.

I think there is certainly truth to this, and I am very sympathetic to a lot of what you wrote in your comment, but I was describing a slightly different problem--ethnic nepotism. That is, the tendency for ethnic groups to privilege members of the group over non-members.

The northern European cultures of England, Germany, Netherland, and Scandinavia is probably the most individualistic in the world. Its ability to suppress the clannish impulse makes it a big outlier. By contrast, Irish, Italian, Chinese, and Jewish immigrants all came from much more clannish cultures. This behavior, which they would have considered a normal part of doing business, invoked resentment among WASP Americans, especially to the degree it permitted Irish immigrants to outmaneuver WASPs in establishing and controlling political machines. Probably the most emblematic example of this phenomenon was JFK's defeat of Henry Cabot Lodge, Jr. in 1952 for the US Senate. It effectively ended the prominent Lodge family political dynasty and marked the ascendancy of the Kennedy family.

chickelit said...

I saw this shift first hand in my very last job in California where I worked closely with Latino truck drivers. But their votes were offset by their spouses and by mostly white female Trump-loathers who run the politics.

Francisco D said...

The difficulty with this is that if these "low-IQ jobs" actually do pay well, they won't go to low-IQ people, but to lazy higher-IQ people.

I agree with you Michelle, but there are a limited number of high IQ lazy people looking for jobs. They mostly work for bureaucracies like the government. (Many of our trolls fit that description). Manufacturing enterprises have objective ways to evaluate performance. The lazy ones are the first to go. The dumb ones who work hard are the ones you need.

I'm Not Sure said...

"Manufacturing enterprises have objective ways to evaluate performance."

Dr Ray Stantz:
Personally, I liked the university. They gave us money and facilities, we didn't have to produce anything! You've never been out of college! You don't know what it's like out there! I've *worked* in the private sector. They expect *results*.

effinayright said...

Lucid-Ideas said...
@Mike of Snoqualmie

"Without the father, the kids grow up feral."

They grow up feral with fathers, sometimes including their encouragement and active participation. Oh yeah, and mom too.
*********************

Fathers, no fathers. It makes no difference at all.

SNORT

n.n said...

Fathers, no fathers. It makes no difference at all.

Men are disposable. With progress, women are, too.

Tina Trent said...

Not Georgia, Ann. We have the highest immigration rate ofSouth Asians in that history of the world. They live conservative but vote hard dem. Ditto.secone generarion S.E. Asian and Mexican.

Tina Trent said...

Sorry for the typos. $60 Amazon pad. Inserts errors.

SGT Ted said...

"And over all, Mr. Trump, whose policies and remarks were widely expected to alienate immigrants and voters of color, won the lion’s share of the additional turnout..."

When reality overrides the Democrat-media complex narrative.

n.n said...

Pro-Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness, without diversity and other classes of bigotry for all People... Persons and our Posterity, selectively.