May 27, 2020

"According to a recent Qualtrics study, a majority of surveyed Americans now say they won’t return to the office unless their company makes wearing face masks mandatory."

"Mask-Wearing Needs to Be Easy, Understood and Expected/Persuasion works better than compulsion" by Angela Duckworth, Lyle Ungar and Ezekiel J. Emanuel (NYT).

Didn't anyone notice the flaw in that statement?!

It assumes that everyone works in an office!

The survey question was actually "Before returning to work, I want my company to require... a mask all of the time." It was the NYT that changed "work" to "office." What blindness!

Notice that in the question, each respondent would be thinking about his own workplace, with whatever conditions of indoorsiness and crowding that existed there. They were not saying what they thought the rules should be in other workplaces.

I used to work in a law school, and within that workplace, I had my own office, and also a classroom. I wouldn't call the whole building "the office," only my own room. And if I were working alone in my office and had the door closed and was subject to a university-wide rule that I had to keep a mask on, I'd think that was crazy — or just an example of bureaucratic rule that's written in a bluntly simple form so everyone would get the message that it's mandatory — rules are rules, no exceptions.

During office hours, during class time — that would be different. But how awful it would be to need to wear a mask when your role is speaking to other people and communicating! But the #1 message to be communicated now is: I am trying as hard as I can not to spread a sometimes-deadly disease. And we're all saying it constantly, forced to say it. Fortunately, I am retired, so this scenario is merely imaginary for me.

But I should be clear. I've been harping on the use of the word "office" — an unwitting mistake that no one corrected — and the cultural bias it betrays. There's a lot more to this op-ed, and the key point is that that compulsion is the wrong way to proceed:
It is human nature to adhere to social norms. When uncertain about what to do, people tend to look around and copy what other people are doing.... How do we create a social norm of mask-wearing when, in fact, so many Americans are doing exactly the opposite? One common mistake is drawing attention to the lack of compliance. For instance, highlighting littering as a commonplace problem can inadvertently lead to more littering because it strengthens the perception that littering is the norm. Instead, in press releases and public service announcements, officials should emphasize that the clear trend in this country is toward universal mask-wearing.... 
I agree that compulsion isn't going to work. Something they don't say is that if you force people to do something, they get rebellious. It's much better to get them to feel that they have a choice and that they're choosing this thing you'd like to make them do. I'm sure the op-ed writers thought of that point, but to say it is to encourage rebellion, and they're inside the project of manipulating opinion, and that project is not furthered by getting people to see the manipulation.

127 comments:

Drago said...

I stopped reading when I saw "Ezekiel J. Emanuel"

John Borell said...

I work in an office environment and also have a private office with a door.

If the social norms are to wear a mask in the hallways, I'll do it.

I'm not wearing a mask when I'm alone in my own office.

And I still don't think everyone wearing masks is really going to do much, but whatever.

Mandating masks is the wrong way to go. People will rebel, of course.

And shaming people for not wearing masks when your camera crew is not wearing masks will make people rebel all that much more quickly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lg1G6bPJxNE

jake said...

I wonder if they'd "allow" me to keep my job and work remotely if I did not want to be forced to wear a mask to provide for my family? My body, my choice.

AlbertAnonymous said...

Karens of the World Unite!

MayBee said...

Great catch.


I want to scream every time someone on Facebook or Twitter says we are on lockdown because our governor "just wants to keep us safe". The benevolence of locking us down, welcome by the people who say they won't go to the office unless face masks are mandatory.

Sebastian said...

"officials should emphasize that the clear trend in this country is toward universal mask-wearing"

No manipulation to see here. Except that they'd be lying to effect coercion, but we the sheeple would swallow that, no prob.

Question for the Karens of America: how do masks help the entire population of healthy people under 65 who are at no personal risk?

Temujin said...

Expected/persuasion. Mandatory and persuasion are not typically the same thing.

And speaking of compulsion, Ezekiel Emanuel is a compulsive liar. I don't say this lightly or just to toss slander on the article. He's got a history of using false information, partial facts, and outright lies, to push an agenda. His mantle is 'Science!', but his actions are those of a con-man with a goal.

The most stunning thing in my life, that I just cannot get over or understand, no matter how old I get, is how many of the people parading around as our experts, or leaders, or sages, are truly con men and con women. Many of them are smart, but crooked, and know how to manipulate. Others are just flat-out dumb. Yet the media keeps going back and back for more to these same sources who purposefully lied or manipulated data previously. They go back to them as the experts whom we should listen to.

What we need to start doing, en masse, is check the sources, and laugh them off the stage if we know them to be preeners. Paraders. Frauds. Ezekiel Emanuel is a fraud who likes to hear his own voice. Fortunately or unfortunately, it eliminates this article and places it in the propaganda pile.

MayBee said...

Oh!
I also do wonder about this. I've noticed my Facebook friends/relatives who have been the most avid Stay At Homers!- hashtags and frames for their profile pictures saying Stay At Home with flowers and swirls- are all finding reasons why *they* can go out and mingle.
One Stay At Home!-er's daughter graduated from college, and suddenly there were photos of them all over town with family members and boyfriends posing with the grad. I mean, it's fine to me, but technically agains the Stay At Home! orders.

Another Stay At Home!-er did a lot of #WeStayHomeForXXX. because XXX has diabetes. But suddenly I noticed all their family photos were labeled as being taken up north, where they don't have a home of their own. Which means they are renting something, which again is illegal in our Stay At Home state.

People find ways to break the rules they supposedly believe in, because it works for them.

Expat(ish) said...

I reject that social norm.

-XC

Fernandinande said...

I tried to figure out what "Qualtrics", the originator of the non-randomly sampled survey, does or produces...

"Empower everyone to gather experience insights and take action

Start your Experience Management journey with the right foundations. Hunt down and fix broken experiences across the business with a single System of Action for everything from customer insights to market segmentation."

Dave Begley said...

With stuff like this, I think America is descending into a new Circle of Hell. I'm calling it "Karen's Circle."

Leland said...

I was already starting to work from home more often before COVID. Now it is generally accepted to do so. In that time, I'm become accustomed to wearing shorts at home. So where is the NYT poll on whether businesses should mandate wearing of shorts before returning to work?

Clyde said...

A lot of mask-wearing comes down to risk assessment: Are you going to be spending a lot of time around people where it will be difficult to stay six feet or more apart? Or are you in your own space with good ventilation where people will seldom, if ever, come that close to you more than briefly? If it's the latter, you don't really need a mask. I'm in that situation, so I don't normally wear one, although I keep some cloth masks out in the car in case a situation comes up where social distancing isn't possible. So far, we have not had any cases (that I've heard about) at my mail processing and distribution center.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

...officials should emphasize that the clear trend in this country is toward universal mask-wearing....

In other words, officials should lie to the public.

Wa St Blogger said...

If you work in an "at will" state, you might find your job is being filled by someone less neurotic than you.

If fear of death keeps you from working, then you should avoid commuting. Contact Soros and see if you can get paid being a blogosphere provocateur and never have to risk infection by going outside your bubble.

Lucid-Ideas said...

Everytime this 'mask' stuff comes up it reminds of the Puerto-Rican gay couple in Seinfeld, "Who! Who won't wear da mask! Do chu wanna wear da mask or do chu wanna get hurt...because if chu wanna get hurt, I can hurt chu!"

The mask is going to become the 'bra' of an entire generation a la the 60s. Wearing one shall become a sign that one enjoys the flavor of shoe-leather, while ditching it a sign of one's liberation from the Karenigarchy. I mean after all, they don't really do anything and not wearing one - especially if one has an enjoyable face - can be quite enjoyable for oneself and for others.

Don't wear the mask man. The mask is for squares.

Lucien said...

Scary to think that poll might be accurate. What scared, scared sheeple.

TreeJoe said...

When you are young and learning the history of things like burning witches at the stake/drowning witches to see if they float, buying indulgences in the church, mob rule type stuff, you say "I could never do that!"

And then you see modern mask-wearing and shaming and claims of "follow the science" and surveys with majorities believing masks should be required and you say....

Nope, mob rule not tied to science is very much in existence.

TWO MONTHS ago masks were being recommended against and MOCKED by "experts" and media outside of very specific situations.

And we haven't even defined what a mask should be - is it just a cloth covering? A ventilated covering? A filtering covering of a certain rating? Washable?

Is it just a codpiece for the face?

Michael K said...

I think it is nice of Democrats to self identify by wearing masks all over the place.

Makes it easy to ignore what they say,.

Bart Hall said...

This "mask theatre" is one of the most preposterous things I've encountered in a very long time. From the data we already have we know several things--

a) Mortality rate is no higher than 0.25%, which is typical of normal seasonal flu.

b) Because of spotty, narrow, incomplete, and sometimes incompetent testing we don't even have a reliable denominator for calculating metrics as basic as morbidity and mortality, let alone transmissivity.

c) Morbidity and (especially) mortality are concentrated in a very narrow segment of the population, primarily obese, diabetics, or the aged. Many people are probably asymptomatic, which is why the denominator isn't any good.

d) Evidence increasingly suggests that asymptomatic people generally do not transmit the disease, and that it does not survive particularly well on surfaces.

Corona should be treated like any other pathogen -- wash hands regularly and well; if you're sick , stay home; if you're vulnerable, avoid tightly crowded situations. IOW ... basic hygiene and **normal** precautions.

hiawatha biscayne said...

Paper masks don't prevent the spread of viruses. Says so right on the side of the Amazon box.

Roy Jacobsen said...

But is it all Kabuki?

https://www.newsweek.com/surgical-cotton-face-masks-ineffective-blocking-sars-cov-2-particles-when-covid-19-patients-1496476

AustinRoth said...

Not only no, but F no! This is the result of years of enabling the “I must feel safe at all times” movement. We are becoming a nation of pussies.

Jupiter said...

That's a lot of masks.

hombre said...

The “office” bit is a class thing isn’t it?

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

Yay more shaming and screaming mobs! Let’s keep it up America! Don’t stop now!

JPS said...

"Persuasion works better than compulsion."

Yes, and the preferred persuasion technique of some masking fans toward people who don't wear them is, "I hope you get it and die!"

Mike (MJB Wolf) said...

So we're still going to pretend this WuFlu is some supervirus, even with all the evidence it does not spread easily, or asymptomatic, or affect young people. Where is the Press outlet willing to help calm and inform the public rather than inflaming them?

Yancey Ward said...

Don't you know that speaking spreads death? What we need is mandatory use of sign language- if we don't do that, then no one should be working.

Cheryl said...

I have quite a few thoughts about this article and mask-wearing in general. The prevailing argument for general mask wearing is that it's to protect you from me, in case I have it and asymptomatically transmit the virus to you. It's charitable (and virtue-signaling.) But just yesterday I read two separate studies, one of around 150 people, the other 450 people, that showed that in NO case was there asymptomatic transmission. Not one. That is significant.

The research turns the mask argument around...I wear a mask to protect ME from YOU, because I assume that you are too stupid to know that you are sick, or too selfish to isolate yourself knowing you are sick. And while not charitable, it does assume a defensive posture, and probably a correct one for certain populations like students in a university classroom where attendance is compulsory. My mono-infected son was not given ONE pass for missing class last fall at his university. The response from his professors was that if you are too sick to come to class you need to withdraw...in late November. (Guess who didn't withdraw and ended up with his one and only B as a physics major?)

Further to the university setting, I can't imagine being a student and having to attend a lecture given by a professor wearing a mask. I have realized in the last few weeks how much I depend on facial expressions for visual cues, and a lecture given behind a mask would be horrible.

I'm interested in other people's thoughts about this. I think the real answer is lots of research about actual transmission and robust treatments, not hanging our hopes on a working vaccine.

Fernandinande said...

It was the NYT that changed "work" to "office." What blindness!

Not necessarily; the survey itself switches back and forth between "office" and "work". It's very poorly written and I'm having a bad UX!

E.g. Page 2:

"Before returning to work, I want my company to require / ensure the following:"

First answer: "Hand sanitizer ... in the office."

Kylos said...

Also, the question did not ask if they "won't return", but rather if they "want" their employer to mandate masks.

DarkHelmet said...

It's important to listen to Zeke Emmanuel.

And then do the opposite of what he advocates.

You will seldom go wrong following this simple guideline.

hombre said...

Interesting how the mask conversation is so often about “to protect myself from others” rather than “to protect others from myself.”

We’ve come a long way, baby. Soon we will all be Democrats.

narciso said...

Dr death panel look how cuomo has a commodated him.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/cuomo-gave-immunity-nursing-home-180046545.html?soc_src=community&soc_trk=fb

hombre said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
stlcdr said...

The 'majority of surveyed Americans' is not the same as 'majority of Americans'.

Nonapod said...

I don't know where they're getting their info, but I know in the rural area I live (upstate NY) mask wearing is not 100%. I went to Home Depot yesterday and masks were only being worn by perhaps 85% of the customers.

Rory said...

"I'm calling it "Karen's Circle.""

I believe that's in the Fifth Circle.

narciso said...



One who speaks truth to power

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/cuomo-nursing-home-scandal-10000-deaths-worse-coming-betsy-mccaughey

MadisonMan said...

The number of times I am within 6 feet of someone at work is approximately zero times daily. Occasionally there are meetings where I will sit next to someone. A few times each month. I have my own office, too. With a door I can shut. I will not be wearing a mask while in my office. That's just stupidity.
Mask Theater is Security Theater on Steroids. I will don a mask if a business establishment wants me to, especially if it's a small business that has just re-opened.

Sally327 said...

My company provided health insurer has various programs to encourage walking. The program includes giving you a fitness watch to count your steps and you earn money based on how much you walk, up to a $1000 / year.

Perhaps the government needs to come up with a similar program to encourage mask wearing, some way to incentivize compliance. Make it worth our while. The idea that we're doing it for our health and that of others, it's too abstract a concept to hold up over the long term. And hoping that we're going to give in to social pressure, I don't think that will work either, it's too easy to dodge the scolds, make up some excuse or smile and say oh yes, of course, I'll remember next time.

But knowing the government, it will probably start handing out fines and jail time to the non-compliant. And then we'll have other issues, such as can we penalize the poor in this way, who can't afford a mask. We'll need a program for that, subsidized masks for the indigent.

Anyway, if we lived in Iran this would only be a problem for men. Which is something I smile about, in a weird, ironic kind of way, how "observant" Muslim women have this problem sorted out already.

Bob Boyd said...

they're inside the project of manipulating opinion, and that project is not furthered by getting people to see the manipulation.

Too late. They've engaged in so much ham-handed, blatantly dishonest, self-serving garbage behavior they've destroyed their credibility. They are widely resented and despised. No one trusts them.

The only people they can manipulate now is one another.

frenchy said...

Implied in ought to be common sense. You need to wear a mask when you come within range of other people. If you are in a classroom at the lecturn, you don't need to have a mask on, but all those students out there sitting side by side do; alone in your office, of course not, but if someone comes in, both should be wearing one, but for sure the entering one, etc. But I guess people DO need to be micromanaged.

Bob Boyd said...

they're inside the project of manipulating opinion, and that project is not furthered by getting people to see the manipulation.

The mask is off.

AlbertAnonymous said...

The Illinois Governor’s order got spanked by a federal judge. The judge’s ruling is dead on balls accurate. Recommended reading for all:

https://docs.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/19997671/ruling.pdf

Fernandinande said...

The 'majority of surveyed Americans' is not the same as 'majority of Americans'.

The goofy survey also switches back and forth between "people" and "employees".

Chris said...

Ford requires anyone who is in the office to wear a mask. If that stays the norm. I don't want to go back.

MacMacConnell said...

If I lived in a North Eastern death camp like New York I'd probably wear a mask. I don't so I won't. The Democrats are scared to death things will get back to normal and the economy will open back up and boom. Bad times only serve Democrats and China.

jaydub said...

I always wear a mask because it protects me from vampires as well as Wuflu, and we have about the same number of vampires as we have Wuflu cases in my county. Anywho, I don't have the plague and my blood hasn't been drained from my body, so don't try to tell me the mask doesn't work. Next week I'm going to start going naked as I'm told that will promote social distancing in the local population.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

poll 180 people and fill in the blank for the other 300 million.

Poll this.

pacwest said...

I'm not sure about a lot of things going on during this pandemic scare, but of this one thing I am sure. If you have to rely on physical labor to earn your daily bread you are beneath me. My job requires no manual labor. I am superior.

walter said...

In the discussions I encounter about the new embrace of "work at home", I'm not hearing about the likely resultant increase in err.. work(ers) abroad.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

frenchy, can you link to studies (not to news articles) that back up your assertions? I’m particularly interested in why students who are not coughing and sneezing “need” to have masks on while sitting in lectures.

MadisonMan said...

but if someone comes in, both should be wearing one, but for sure the entering one

Why?

Bruce Hayden said...

I am glad that I am no longer working in a large law firm. Making things worse, it tended to be the big liberal firm in the cities it had offices in. Mandatory virtue signaling doesn’t sit well with me. Never did, but this has gotten worse as I aged, on a par with my hearing. At least there, I had a private office. Not always the case - Bay Area tech companies like HP put everyone in cubicles, regardless of job function, including its attorneys. I interviewed with them and said “no way”.

I think though that Ann has a good point. This is discussed from the point of working in an office. Because they probably don’t know anyone in their mega bubble who doesn’t. Or who doesn’t have a white collar type of employment. The reality (I.e. science) is that blue collar jobs are likely more dangerous in terms of COVID-19. Doesn’t matter.

Gk1 said...

"Further to the university setting, I can't imagine being a student and having to attend a lecture given by a professor wearing a mask" This. There is no way this is going to work.

Last year my daughter had attended junior college to get her prerequisites out of the way before transferring to a state college and we have just been informed the California, UC Davis school system is going to continue online learning into the fall semester but her junior college will resume normal classes with wearing masks being up in the air.(Sounds like it will be optional) Why on earth would you pay an average of 25k a semester to do online courses? Are these people insane??

stevew said...

I'm not going to be going to the office then. What will they do, fire me?

Yancey Ward said...

"I'm calling it "Karen's Circle."

Wrath, whichever one that is.

MayBee said...

If there is not widespread a symptomatic spreading of other viruses, I doubt there is of Covid.

Bob Smith said...

“ It was the NYT that changed "work" to "office." What blindness!”

Harummph. Everybody I know works in an office. Why would I want to associate with some truck driver. I mean really.

JAORE said...

Lots of people will find that while their JOB is important to the company, THEY are not.

Doug said...

Retired now, but if I were returning to a workplace that mandated masks, I would decline to participate. If the employer terminated me, I would lawyer up.

Thistlerose said...

Not going to happen. If you have worn a mask for 8 hours you would know that people are just looking for ways to stop wearing them. They are hot, smell bad after a few hours and make communication very difficult. Were I live most people are not that afraid of catching the virus. People want their lives back and the government and busybody's to stop trying to control everything they do. I may be lucky that I live in an area where they made rules but they were never enforced but from reading about what the weekend looked like in Wisconsin the people up there are acting the same.

Michael said...

The masks are pure theater. If you pass through a shedding donor the virus now resides happily on your mask n the nice wet and warm fabric. Breathe in, breath out. The longer the better to create a heavier viral load.

I will have a no mask rule in my office. Quit if you don’t like it.

ConradBibby said...

A few weeks back a joke went around equating all the anti-covid measures to a "30-day free trial of socialism." I have come to the view that this is exactly what it is for a lot of white liberals. This is their subconscious way of testing their own tolerance of and ability to conform to the kind of state control over all things that they have implicitly advocated for but have never really been subjected to in practice. You can see the pride in faces of millions of Karens who are proving their own mettle by conforming in every way to what the totalitarian state requires. Their masks are like a red badge of being a pinko.

DanTheMan said...

>>Before returning to work, I want my company to require... a mask all of the time.

Before returning to work, I want my state to require all drivers on the road to go 2 mph at all times.


#StaySafe

Larry J said...

I returned to working in my office 4 weeks ago. I estimate about 5-10% of my coworkers in this building have returned as well. If it's safe enough for me to go to a grocery or hardware store, it's safe enough to return to the office. That's based on my examination of the statistics for COVID infection in my county. We have a population of over 350,000 and have averaged from 2-4 new cases a day for weeks now. We only had 4 verified COVID deaths and the last one was over a month ago. We're the third most populous county in the state and have the second lowest infection rate. If I lived in an area with a much higher infection rate, I'd reconsider my opinion.

My company's policy is that we should continue to work at home unless we're working in one of the production areas. I came back to the job in part because my office chair at home was killing my back. My chair at work is much more comfortable and I have a better working environment with few distractions (and less temptation to snack). We wear a mask when we leave our office for one of the common areas and we wash our hands a lot. It seems to be working.

TheOne Who Is Not Obeyed said...

Apparently those in power have solved the problems of jaywalking, speeding, passing in no passing zones, littering, calls to numbers on the do-not-call list, and mixing recyclables with garbage, and are ready to solve the next compliance issue.

Michael said...

This is madness. Progressives are already doing their best to abolish or absorb the Church, the family, and the schools. Now they want to do away with basic human interaction. NOTHING OUTSIDE THE STATE. And on the flimsiest of pretexts. What they clearly want is an all-powerful government and an otherwise atomized society where people just do as they're told. There can be no intervening institutions; de Tocqueville is so 19th Century.

Charlie Currie said...

Christmas burkas will be hot sellers on black Friday.

I predict the Christmas burka will replace the Christmas sweater.

bagoh20 said...

Since most transmissions happen at home, shouldn't that be where they are required?

There may be an actual safety dividend from this masks at work idea. It would eliminate the need for lipstick which is generally put on while driving to work, an activity much more deadly than the virus.

PM said...

In SF, tech's stupid relaunch of the 1920s typing pool will finally fizzle out leading, once again, to offices with doors that allow private apologies to a co-worker about last night's behavior with the hope of hearing 'no, that was fun.'

bagoh20 said...

The division of America into two nations continues: One lives, loves, explores, fights and builds things, and the other just sucks up oxygen, and tofu from inside their tiny government-supplied hole. Can't really say I'm gonna miss ya.

The best thing we could do for this country is to ban masks at all polling locations, and have free beer.

deepelemblues said...

The clear trend?

I'm out in rural areas, suburban, and urban all the time. 2 weeks ago the rural folks were maybe 25% wearing masks. Suburban, 75%. Urban, near 100%. Anyone who walked into a store without a mask was called out and they would leave immediately.

Yesterday it was about 10% rural, maybe one third suburban, maybe 50% urban. Lots of people going into stores without masks and no one batted an eye. At least in a ~100 mile radius around my home, the trend is very clear in the direction of people not wearing masks.

bagoh20 said...

Is there anything the left does not want to ruin? Seriously, just give me one enjoyable or useful activity that they wouldn't try to ban or regulate the fun out of as soon as they saw people enjoying it.

bagoh20 said...

The masks are disappearing out here faster than free pizza. It's not safe to come out, and probably never will be.

Danno said...

Hasn't Ezekiel hit the magic number of 75? If so, he should off himself in the spirit of social good.

tcrosse said...

The Telegraph has revealed The #Covidiocy Chronicles, celebrities making fools of themselves thanks to the Corona virus.

Abdul Abulbul Amir said...

If you are speaking in front of a class, a mask hides facial expression and greatly disadvantages lip readers. If the front row is more than 6 feet away a mask will do little other than diminish the learning experience.

I'm Full of Soup said...

Zeke's predictions on March 27, 2020 were NOT spot on. Why is he still considered any kind of an expert?

:Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel, former White House adviser for health policy, told MSNBC on Friday that at its current rate, the coronavirus outbreak could infect 100 million people in the U.S. within about four weeks.

“I think the front lines actually tell you what’s happening at the front lines, and politicians and people in Washington don’t want the country to panic,” Emanuel told “Morning Joe” co-host Mika Brzezinski, according to Raw Story. “I mean, I think our Republican administration would have — what you’re seeing is major rationing in the country. Rationing is a word that they have used to beat up Democrats, but the fact is we are seeing rationing in parts of the country, and you have mentioned some of them, primarily in New York — but it’s not going to be exclusively New York.”


“This is not a virus that is just going to stay confined to New York,” he added. “Right now, if you look at the numbers we probably have a million COVID-19 cases in the country, and if this is doubling every three to four days, that means that we’ll have 100 million people who have COVID-19 in about four weeks. That’s a frightening thought.”

White House coronavirus task force coordinator Dr. Deborah Birx on Thursday said at a press conference that, “When people start talking about 20 percent of a population getting infected, it is very scary but we don’t have data that matches that based on the experience,” adding, “There’s no … reality on the ground where we can see that 60 to 70 percent of Americans are going to get infected in the next eight to 12 weeks.”

I'm Full of Soup said...

Jaydub at 9:12AM has an excellent plan and funny too!

n.n said...

Don't forget the goggles. That said, a mask is not a viable choice for people who bear the burden of strenuous labor, especially in warm climates with a greenhouse effect (i.e. limited air flow).

NCMoss said...

Matching bubble-wrap would be a nice accessory; because science!

n.n said...

NYT unwittingly reveals its inner diversitist (e.g. classicist).

I'm Full of Soup said...

Here is how I judge the so-called experts. If you have no formal training in a field or have not worked for many years in it yet you are used frequently as an expert voice, I refer to you as a hobbyist. Nothing wrong with having hobbies.

Some of my designated hobbyists are Al Gore, Bill Nye and Michael Moore.

bagoh20 said...

The character of our people has been diminished, our trust has been fractured, and even our immune systems have been weakened. I don't think this whole charade was possible if not for TDS. In the coming months, we will learn that masks were not helpful, possibly even damaging, the virus was not unusually dangerous, and most of what we did at great cost was unnecessary, or counterproductive, yet half of us will learn nothing from the entire tragedy. They will continue to value the opinion of the same people who lied to them about it all, or just got it wrong. Rachel Maddow and Morning Joe will still have an audience of imbeciles tuning in to suck up the next scam.

Iman said...

Hmmm... you note the dishonesty displayed by the NYT, but it will still be your go-to...

Sam L. said...

Welllll, it's the NYT, which I despise, detest, and distrust 100%!

Big Mike said...

Lots of people will find that while their JOB is important to the company, THEY are not.

@JAORE, +1

Mr. T. said...

Ill bet money thatb says everyone the NYT interviewed were government employees.

Colonel Mustard said...

So, if a mask is an effective barrier to an airborne virus, how is it possible for a fart to pass through two pair of pants and a shirt tail?

Unknown said...

Yea, right. Stop that paycheck ( like so many others have had happen ) and you'll see how quickly they run back.

Pianoman said...

Yes, there will be rebellion against stupid arbitrary rules. Masks have morphed overnight into virtue-signaling devices to prove you're part of the Karen Klub. No thanks.

One of the theaters that I play for has decided to run a musical during the month of July. They're going to cut the audience size in half, and require everyone to wear masks for the entire performance. Imagine having to wear a mask indoors in a theater for 2 1/2 hours just to see a musical.

They haven't said yet whether they're going to bathe my piano in Purell or not. I guess I'll find out later this week. If so, I'll probably pass on this show.

I've put up with the Total Fear And Terror for two months, and I'm done with it. I aim to misbehave.

PuertoRicoSpaceport.com said...

OT But has anyone seen any comments from Shouting Thomas in the past week or two?

Are you OK, ST?

Sure hope so.

John Henry

Gk1 said...

It seems like another campaign misstep for Biden to go out in public wearing a mask and making that a tribal sign for all democrats they need to wear masks.

First of all it makes him look very frail and elderly (he really should be wearing one) Secondly this is increasingly becoming unpopular and will become a badge of shame. Irish democracy is already taking over now. Imagine it in August?

The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...

The poll is more about milking working-from-home for office workers and milking Uncle Sucka’s overgenerous unemployment for the min-wage crowd, than it is about wearing masks. The average workplace could either require or forbid masks with pretty much the same amount of groaning from the staff.

BobJustBob said...

“In my study of communist societies, I came to the conclusion that the purpose of communist propaganda was not to persuade or convince, not to inform, but to humiliate; and therefore, the less it corresponded to reality the better. When people are forced to remain silent when they are being told the most obvious lies, or even worse when they are forced to repeat the lies themselves, they lose once and for all their sense of probity. To assent to obvious lies is...in some small way to become evil oneself. One's standing to resist anything is thus eroded, and even destroyed. A society of emasculated liars is easy to control. I think if you examine political correctness, it has the same effect and is intended to.”
― Theodore Dalrymple

I'm Full of Soup said...

Recently, ST was threatening to take a break from the internet, this blog and commenting. Which he does periodically. I'm sure he is fine.

hiawatha biscayne said...

that's right. no ST. i pretty much always enjoy reading what ST has to say.

Yancey Ward said...

It would be nice to see a list of those being curated out of the comments section. I also had noticed Shouting Thomas had not commented in several days.

stan said...

Your students are at greater risk dying while driving to school. If healthy, they're at greater risk of dying from getting hit by lightning.

Because science.

Arashi said...

Well I for one think that everybody, and I mean everybody, must be forced to wear a full plague doctor suit, including the plague doctor mask, upon leaving the house. Failure to do so must be punished by the application of the instant death penalty and forfeiture of all property from the individual and their family. I mean, if it saves one childs life and results in only democrats being elected, it will be worth it. </sarc

I currently wear a mask when shopping, but then I am in the greater pugetopolis and here the theater of the absurd of mask wearing has been going on for awhile. Since I am in the over 65 age group and do not want to get into ignorant confrontations with the karens out and about I will continue to do so for awhile longer. The King county area may be required to wear them when out once we go to phase two of the re-open plan put forward by our idiot gov inslee, but since he is basing his plan on dog knows what (and he won't tell anyone) and insists that each phase will take at least three weeks, but longer if necessary, a particular county may never move forward. This will last, of course, until November 4, 2020 and the anticipated sweep of the elections by the all democrat slate.

This is not what I spent my time in the military defending and it certainly is not what I expected retirement to look like. And based on every rational report coming out recently, the lockdowns need to end as they have truly done nothing bu destroy the economy. If China had planned an economic attack on the world, they could not have had it go much better.

PB said...

Lemmings.

Gospace said...

In my current job, I work all by my lonesome for 8 hours. A few moments talking with the guy I relieve at the beginning of shift, a few moments talking with my relief at shift's end.

Worked part time for years in a big box. Had to pick up some things there the other day. Employees required to wear masks. Talked with a few my age- 60 and up. All agreed that mask wearing was nonsense.

Looking at comments on Facebook seems the Everyone must wear masks! brigade is >90% female. And innumerate. Completely unable to understand that life is full of trade-offs. If it saves one life! is the rallying cry. Thing is- mask wearing for everyone doesn't save lives. Not at all. It's virtue signalling, nothing more, nothing less.

Had one comment she's got COPD. Don't I care about her life? Umm, I am not responsible for her health. In fact, in her case, she has COPD from a lifetime of tobacco use. So really, no, in her case, I really don't care. There's no reason I should experience the least tiniest bit of discomfort because she destroyed her lungs voluntarily. I don't have a lot of sympathy for anyone with lifestyle diseases. I get less sympathetic when they demand I change my life because of them.

hstad said...

According to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics more than half of all jobs required outdoor work.

Achilles said...

People read history books and they ask things like "How could the German people and their entire society embrace Nazism?"


And now everyone knows how the pernicious tyrants seize power.

They seize it using fear.

Wa St Blogger said...

I predict the Christmas burka will replace the Christmas sweater.

As well the ugly burka parties over the holidays. Contest would end in a tie.

FullMoon said...

Next, do survey of how many want to wait for vaccine before leaving home.
Then, hold them to it.

Jim at said...

Thank gawd I left the office in 2001 and never looked back.

Saves me the trouble of dealing with these lunatics.

donald said...

I’m in Ventura. I was walking on the beach Monday morning and these two ladies walking by me showed me a wooly bully. I said, that’s nice and one of them asked where I was from (My accent). They weren’t wearing masks, they were beautiful and the more beautiful one and I are gonna take it on down the PCH on Saturday. She thinks masks are stupid. We’re perfect for each other. Perfect.

TheOne Who Is Not Obeyed said...

"Looking at comments on Facebook seems the Everyone must wear masks! brigade is >90% female. "

The whole COVID "stay safe" response is a result of the feminist take over of our culture and its concomitant emphasis on safety and security over risk and attainment. Most health care workers are women, most government workers are women, women benefit greatly (the most?) from welfare state resource transfers, women are dominant in education, and most large companies are tuned in to the demands of their female work force in a way they are not to their men.

Women are more risk-averse than men, and more of the jobs that can be done remote are done by women than by men. Women are more collaborative than men, and women are more likely than men to attempt social control of others who are seen as "breaking the rules".

We've been told for years that once women were in charge, government would work better and public policy would be better. It's quite clear from the whole "panic first" response that this is untrue.

Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...

Methinks the purpose of the Quality Tricks survey is "60% said they would be
uncomfortable voting at a polling place." The rest is just window dressing. We will see that number again.

SIXTY PERCENT OF AMERICANS DEMAND VOTING BY MAIL. WITHOUT MAIL AND INTERNET BALLOTING, A MAJORITY OF AMERICANS WILL NOT ACCEPT THE ELECTION RESULTS.

bagoh20 said...

I just visited the Wisconsin Dept. of Health Services site, and among its list of recommendations is no mention of wearing a mask.

I'm Not Sure said...

"We've been told for years that once women were in charge, government would work better and public policy would be better."

When this producer launched a women-only TV company she thought she'd kissed goodbye to conflict...

Gradually, what had started out as a daydream - wouldn't it be great if there were no men where I worked? - turned into an exciting concept. I decided to create the first all-female production company where smart, intelligent, career-orientated women could work harmoniously, free from the bravado of the opposite sex.

...

Though I will not absolve myself of all guilt, I believe the business was ruined by the destructive jealousy and in-fighting of an all female staff. Their selfishness and insecurities led to my company's demise. When I needed the so-called 'Sisterhood', believe me, it just wasn't there.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1168182/Catfights-handbags-tears-toilets-When-producer-launched-women-TV-company-thought-shed-kissed-goodbye-conflict-.html

Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...

Something strange about that QualityTricks survey. The questions are presented as "What would [someone else have to do to] make you feel comfortable?"

My analyst, my angst counselor, my psychiatrist, my masseuse, Ann Landers, and Marriage Encounter are in agreement on one point. Your feelings are your own. Own them. Your feelings are created by you. Not some other person.

We are each responsible for our own health and safety.

Howard said...

You said it... Lemmings. On the popular right wingnut dominatrix blogs like Althouse, anti-mask dupes are virtue signaling fealty to PDJT.

Michael K said...

Though I will not absolve myself of all guilt, I believe the business was ruined by the destructive jealousy and in-fighting of an all female staff. Their selfishness and insecurities led to my company's demise. When I needed the so-called 'Sisterhood', believe me, it just wasn't there.

Nursing is a female dominated profession. Most nurses that I have talked to would rather work for a male and I have advised any number of men to go into nursing. They quickly become managers, Lots of former military corpsmen and so on.
.

Brian said...

I work from home for a large fortune 500 company. Have worked from home long before Covid. So I guess I don't have an opinion on the poll itself.

An interesting side note, however, is that there were rumors that my company was going to move all employees to a small set of physical campuses in a few cities across the country. When discussed at all, it was supposed to bring about better working across teams. The rumor was that it was actually designed to surplus mostly older, more highly compensated employees while limiting age discrimination lawsuits. Older workers being less likely to move across the country late in life.

This whole pandemic may end up delaying that a little while longer. Hard to say your job is in an office when everybody is still working from home.

Hammond X. Gritzkofe said...

"There Are 3 Things We* Have to Do to Get People Wearing Masks" (NYT Opinion article headline)

Whatever happened to
..tell 'em what yer gonna tell 'em;
..tell 'em;
..tel; 'em what ya told 'em.
as guidance for good writing?

Not until the sixth paragraph, near half through the article are, are three "things" obliquely mentioned.

And yes, upon seeing Ezekiel J. Emanuel as opinion writer, the BullShit flag scurried to the top of the mast and commenced violent agitation.

*Calls to mind a Warren Beatty line from a best forgotten California Gold Rush flick: "What you mean 'we?' You got a turd in your pocket?"

BUMBLE BEE said...

I'm told that it is important to not have tuna fish for lunch if you're expected to wear a mask for an afternoon meeting. Duly Noted.

Michael K said...

Zeke would love the Connecticut woman who spit in the guy's face because he was walking "the wrong way" in a supermarket aisle.

I would have slugged her.

cubanbob said...

Howard said...
You said it... Lemmings. On the popular right wingnut dominatrix blogs like Althouse, anti-mask dupes are virtue signaling fealty to PDJT."

Howard have you ever looked in the mirror?

n.n said...

Catfights-handbags-tears-toilets-When-producer-launched-women-TV-company-thought-shed-kissed-goodbye-conflict

Her mistake was to indulge diversity that is preached by the Progressive Church (PC). That said, men and women are equal and complementary.

Michael K said...

Howard said...
You said it... Lemmings. On the popular right wingnut dominatrix blogs like Althouse, anti-mask dupes are virtue signaling fealty to PDJT."


Howard, reach into your pants and see if your balls are still there. I know they are tiny but try to find them.

funsize said...

Arashi, lol @ pugetopolis. I live there too.

It's just beyond parody now.

SensibleCitizen said...

A strange consequence of my own personal mask revolt is that I've stopped wearing a helmet when I ride my bicycle. I guess out of some principle that I can't actually articulate. Weird because it was an organic decision -- not thought through at all.