Althouse: "A little more than a year after its opening, a Far East Side Madison low-income housing complex has been declared a chronic nuisance..."

May 13, 2020

"A little more than a year after its opening, a Far East Side Madison low-income housing complex has been declared a chronic nuisance..."

"... and its owner could face fines and other charges if it doesn't make changes to improve quality of life and public safety there.... In its April 9 notice declaring the property a nuisance, the city points to three of the most serious incidents: a 4-year-old accidentally shot in the foot on Feb. 26; a tenant's nephew shot in the leg outside the tenant's apartment on March 17, and an argument between two tenants over loud music that escalated into a physical fight on March 31.... The six-building, $20.3 million project received $11 million in financing from the Wisconsin Housing and Economic Development Authority and $5.4 million from insurance giant UnitedHealthCare, but no city money. It has 28 two-bedroom and 66 three-bedroom units, all of which are reserved for families making 60% or less of the county's median income.... In a March 17, 2019, column in The Capital Times, Ellen Sexton, CEO of UnitedHealthcare Community Plan of Wisconsin, touted the Harmony's proximity to Downtown and on-site amenities including a community clubhouse with a library, computer lab and meeting space, fitness center, playground, picnic area with grill and private garages.... Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

The Wisconsin State Journal reports.

144 comments:

I'm Not Sure said...: "Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening..."

Probably politically incorrect to notice, but...

"It has 28 two-bedroom and 66 three-bedroom units, all of which are reserved for families making 60% or less of the county's median income..."; 5/13/20, 2:12 PM
JackWayne said...: “Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

Or no one in charge of Virtue Signaling made sure that the tenants received the signal.; 5/13/20, 2:16 PM
Mattman26 said...: "inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants"

I guess what we're looking for is low-income people who don't act like low-income people. Got it.; 5/13/20, 2:17 PM
Mike Sylwester said...: I'm surprised that racism has not been blamed yet.; 5/13/20, 2:18 PM
DRP said...: This vaguely reminds me of the Canadian newspaper a few years ago that couldn't find any links or causes to a specific hate crime when the perpetrators were all Islamic men under the age of 50.; 5/13/20, 2:18 PM
Michael E. Lopez said...: "...but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

Because it's up to the *Landlord* to sit residents down and say, "Shooting kids isn't the sort of thing that we're supposed to do."

But you're a monster if you suggest that maybe certain groups among the disadvantaged don't actually have the social graces necessary for a successful life in society.; 5/13/20, 2:19 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: The complex isn't a nuisance.

The people inhabiting it are.

Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening Section 8 never works out how it was intended. /facepalm

Gee...I wonder why?; 5/13/20, 2:20 PM
Char Char Binks, Esq. said...: If you subsidize human turds, you get more human turds. Madison will soon become just another shithole city.; 5/13/20, 2:20 PM
RK said...: "...wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening"

I know why.; 5/13/20, 2:22 PM
CWJ said...: "...but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

People shoot one another and get into fights because management didn't tell them not to do so. Clearly inadequate.; 5/13/20, 2:23 PM
Ray - SoCal said...: Apartment Management 101:

Dammed if you do, damned if you don’t.

Good news:
At least they don’t have a discrimination lawsuit!; 5/13/20, 2:24 PM
donald said...: Serves me right.; 5/13/20, 2:25 PM
Ken B said...: This thread could be 🔥; 5/13/20, 2:25 PM
pious agnostic said...: Very sad.; 5/13/20, 2:28 PM
WisRich said...: Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."
----------

So it's not the tenants fault for fighting and shooting each other, it's the Landords for not setting the proper "expectations".

WOW; 5/13/20, 2:28 PM
Sebastian said...: "wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants"

So we are assuming, aren't we, that the tenants couldn't set decent expectations for themselves--no shooting! no fighting!-- without being told to do so by adequate management.; 5/13/20, 2:28 PM
hawkeyedjb said...: Who, exactly, are the tenants who need to have expectations set? Are they all 14 years old?; 5/13/20, 2:29 PM
Michael K said...: Why Obama's plan to fill suburbs with section 8 housing was not popular.; 5/13/20, 2:30 PM
John Cunningham said...: A triumph for "Diversity and Vibrancy."; 5/13/20, 2:30 PM
John Cunningham said...: A triumph for "Diversity and Vibrancy."; 5/13/20, 2:31 PM
ccscientist said...: Set expectations for tenants? Are you kidding? That would be racist!!! If a landlord tries to do anything to make tenants behave, they will be guilting. I wouldn't be a landlord for any reason or $.; 5/13/20, 2:31 PM
n.n said...: Negative incentives and positive reinforcement.; 5/13/20, 2:32 PM
gspencer said...: Each of the three incidents mentioned by the City is tenant-caused. Yet the landlord is deemed to have created the nuisance!

Yet again, and again, and again, . . . the responsible are being blamed for the problems caused by the irresponsible.

No wonder John Galt wants to self-isolate.; 5/13/20, 2:33 PM
MayBee said...: So this is the manager's fault how?; 5/13/20, 2:36 PM
Jim Gust said...: Right, it's all management's fault. They never told the tenants to not commit crimes and to keep the music down. How were the tenants supposed to know how to behave themselves if they don't have management right there to keep an eye on them?

I worked for a public housing authority a long time ago. The tenants require continuous adult supervision. They are low income for a reason.; 5/13/20, 2:38 PM
TheDopeFromHope said...: By saying that management “didn’t set expectations early on“ for the tenants, she’s declaring them less than human.; 5/13/20, 2:39 PM
Lucid-Ideas said...: I was a young homeowner. I got pre-approved for my first mortgage shortly after 02, with a DOD backed line of credit...so it wasn't all me.

I recall my neighbor being an omnipotent moral busybody. I didn't understand it at the time, but now I do. I thought he was a 'Karen' (aka Robert). What he really was a guy trying to protect the value of his investment.

'Projects' should be an instantaneous symbol to get the F out. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.; 5/13/20, 2:39 PM
bobby said...: " . . . but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

If we've reached the point where people need to be told by their landlords that they ought not shoot other people on-site, and if they're not told this then the shootings are the fault of the landlord, we might as well pack it in, we're done as a society.; 5/13/20, 2:39 PM
Bushman of the Kohlrabi said...: "Far East"

If the WH press corps was covering this they'd assign an Asian reporter who could best cover the racist owner angle.; 5/13/20, 2:40 PM
rehajm said...: East Lake is a good example of the success of razing low-income housing and creating mixed-income neighborhoods. Low income residents see their neighbors going to work every day, begin to buy in and gain a stake in their own well being.

Sounds like Madison now has the low-income housing. That's the first step...; 5/13/20, 2:42 PM
Dave Begley said...: I'm sure that the tenants signed a lease and received rules. In those rules, the tenants were told not to play loud music and not to get into fights. The tenants were told to obey the law and behave themselves.

Attorney Jennifer Zilavy should blame the tenants; not the managers.

I also note that United Health Care received federal tax credits for funding the Low Income Housing. And some big Milwaukee law firm got a fat fee for handling the matter.

The above is reality.

Wondering if Jennifer Zilvay was an Althouse student at the University of Wisconsin.; 5/13/20, 2:43 PM
Big Mike said...: It has 28 two-bedroom and 66 three-bedroom units, all of which are reserved for families making 60% or less of the county's median income.

In other words, people who are unlucky and need a break, and people who routinely make very bad decisions and aren’t going to change. Let me know if there’s ever been a housing project that didn’t eventually become pretty much 100% the latter, regardless of the mix when they started. But liberals are incapable of learning.; 5/13/20, 2:44 PM
Unknown said...: Clearly they need more money, a study, and programs.; 5/13/20, 2:45 PM
mandrewa said...: "...a community clubhouse with a library, computer lab and meeting space, fitness center, playground, picnic area with grill and private garages..."! Wow!

And this is low-income housing! What a privileged place Madison has become. For most of the world that sounds like a great place to live. For most of the United States even that's not bad.

Why is the landlord being held responsible for the bad behavior of his tenants?

There's a belief system where this all somehow makes sense and I imagine that the belief system goes something like this: Any disproportionate bad behavior by a certain group, like those that are in income-assisted housing, isn't their fault, because after all they are just as good as everyone else, and therefore any difference that occurs must be the fault of someone else.; 5/13/20, 2:46 PM
Dave Begley said...: The name of the apartment complex is Harmony.

It looks very nice.; 5/13/20, 2:48 PM
I'm Full of Soup said...: Back of the envelope says the 94 units cost an average of $200,000 to build. Would have made an interesting social experiment to instead offer the 94 families a check for $200,000 if they agreed to be ineligible for govt assistance for the rest of their lives.; 5/13/20, 2:51 PM
rhhardin said...: Pick a residency criterion that doesn't correlate strongly with antisocial behavior.; 5/13/20, 2:51 PM
Dave Begley said...: It looks much nicer than where my daughter lived in Madison. She lived close to downtown. One night some guy attacked her car and broke out her window. Scared the hell out of her. A drunk or homeless person. She wasn't happy about having to pay for a new window. The cops did nothing.; 5/13/20, 2:51 PM
gspencer said...: "Far East Side Madison"

Surely Gary Larson doesn't live there!

Given that most of the tenants are clients/dependents of the Democrat Party a more appropriate name would be "Far Left Side Madison."; 5/13/20, 2:51 PM
Bill, Republic of Texas said...: Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

That must be it.; 5/13/20, 2:53 PM
Temujin said...: "...but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

Yeah. That's one possibility. Here's another. Maybe the government should quit funding the building of these horrendous towers of despair in the cities. There has never been a story of these things being anything but a center for crime and crap. There has to be a way to build housing for lower income people without creating something so dangerous for them to live in, that just making it through each day without getting shot is the goal.

You can layer in all the "on-site amenities including a community clubhouse with a library, computer lab and meeting space, fitness center, playground, picnic area with grill and private garages", add in "various services and programs such as health and nutrition classes, higher-education courses, financial training and after-school activities" but frankly that sounds like something to attract Millenial females who grew up in the suburbs more than black or Hispanic single parent poor families with multiple kids. Expectations were not set? Well hell- the stuff you put out there may mean something to your niece, but if the culture is something very different and a person is just trying to get enough money to buy enough food to feed yourself and two kids, a meeting space and nutrition class might not be a priority. Ducking gunshots will.

Not sure what the answer IS. But I know the answer is NOT building more of these towers in the mold of Cabrini Green.; 5/13/20, 2:53 PM
Jim Clay said...: And how exactly is the owner supposed to stop any of that? Without, of course, discriminating by credit score, education level, income, or, heaven forbid, race.; 5/13/20, 2:54 PM
The Godfather said...: Does the management have the right to evict trouble-makers? That ought to solve the problem.; 5/13/20, 2:55 PM
Rick said...: Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

This makes total sense if you just start with the premise that the tenants cannot be at fault since Dem constituencies are not responsible for their themselves. Imagine going through life understanding someone must manage you or you'll shoot a 4 year old. No wonder freedom sounds so scary to these people.

I'd never vote for a party which supported this but I guess some people think the check is worth anything.; 5/13/20, 2:56 PM
BarrySanders20 said...: Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility.

Perfect line, hope she delivered it earnestly.; 5/13/20, 2:58 PM
Anonymous said...: It's a state-sponsored poor-house, they they blame the management company for the resident standards?

These people deserve each other.; 5/13/20, 2:58 PM
pacwest said...: Get better tenants. Don't get sued for getting better tenants.; 5/13/20, 3:00 PM
Michael The Magnificent said...: Cue Captain Renault.

We're all shocked!; 5/13/20, 3:01 PM
Roger Sweeny said...: Gooly, gee. If only the tenants had been told that expectations were that they would not shoot people or try to settle disagreements about music with physical fights, none of those bad things would have happened. How could management have missed that?; 5/13/20, 3:02 PM
CJinPA said...: "The reason is poor management. What a lack of planning." - Things you say but don't believe.

"There's a reason some people have low incomes." - Things you believe but don't say.; 5/13/20, 3:02 PM
David-2 said...: Yes, management failed by not "setting expectations": "We firmly discourage all tenants from shooting toddlers in the building." Also they caused this situation by not providing the nutrition courses they promised. Sue the bastards!; 5/13/20, 3:05 PM
MadisonMan said...: touted the Harmony's proximity to Downtown

It's on the far east side of Madison (it's on the other side of the Interstate!), but also close to Downtown? How's that work?; 5/13/20, 3:06 PM
YoungHegelian said...: but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility.

Oh, that's right. That's the problem alright. "Expectations weren't set".

What? You gotta tell people "Hey, assholes, don't shoot little kids; just don't shoot anybody, okay?". As if people who need that explained are going to abide by any sort of rules.

I'll be happy to take bets on the state right now of those common areas. Right now, I'm guessing 5 to 1 on "Trashed" is the right answer.

Whatever may be the answer for low income housing, putting all those kinds of people together in a huge building is a recipe for trouble. All is takes is a few miscreants to make it hell for everyone. I mean, this is Chicago's Cabrini Greens all over again, and we know how that worked out.; 5/13/20, 3:13 PM
David53 said...: Is this a joke? Fake news? Is management supposed to tell tenets they are not to shoot each other?; 5/13/20, 3:16 PM
PatHMV said...: "Inadequate management that didn't set proper expectations for tenants early on"? What the heck does that mean, and what did they expect the landlord to do to manage the behavior of its tenants? Is that the general expectation for low-income housing, that the property manager is responsible for policing the behavior of its residents?

If so, will the people currently upset defend the property manager if it starts to evict people for "quality of life" nuisances? Is the government paying the property manager to provide social work services to the tenants?

It seems problematic to declare an entire apartment complex full of low-income residents a "nuisance" based on the activities of a small number of the residents.; 5/13/20, 3:16 PM
bagoh20 said...: It seems that people assaulting and shooting each other is not the fault of anyone doing the actual assaulting and shooting. It's the landlord's fault. He probably prefers having that kind of thing, becuase it make him rich or something.; 5/13/20, 3:21 PM
Luke Lea said...: As Steve Sailer once observed, the worst thing about being poor is having to live around other poor people.; 5/13/20, 3:21 PM
Gospace said...: a 4-year-old accidentally shot in the foot on Feb. 26; a tenant's nephew shot in the leg outside the tenant's apartment on March 17, and an argument between two tenants over loud music that escalated into a physical fight on March 31...

None of which the owner did or is responsible for- but the owner faces fines.

I'll bet if we took a tour of all the occupied less than one year apartments, most solid middle class people would be horrified at their current physical condition of the brand new interiors.

Academics and liberals will blame the owners, not the occupants, for the condition.... Personal responsibility? The tenants? Totally not a factor- it's the evil capitalist owners.; 5/13/20, 3:24 PM
tommyesq said...: So these folks need to be told that the expectations of the tenants included not shooting other tenants' children?; 5/13/20, 3:25 PM
wild chicken said...: The problem with being poor is having to live around other poor people.; 5/13/20, 3:30 PM
stutefish said...: I've never lived in an apartment complex where the landlord made any special effort to set my expectations re: shooting my neighbors, leaving guns lying around, playing loud music, or getting into fistfights.

I don't really see this as a landlord problem, except insofar as he has mysteriously rented out his property to a large number of garbage people.; 5/13/20, 3:31 PM
Jersey Fled said...: Gee, who woulda thought that might happen.; 5/13/20, 3:31 PM
Leora said...: My experience leads me to believe that management decided not to or was not allowed to screen out applicants with prior criminal convictions.; 5/13/20, 3:32 PM
wild chicken said...: These low income places always have names with "Commons" or "Flats."

Why is that.; 5/13/20, 3:34 PM
wild chicken said...: Anyway, these problems obviously can be blamed on Management.; 5/13/20, 3:36 PM
steven bailey said...: Kicking single moms and their kids out solves 90% of problems in public housing. Every involved party knows this, some see it as a problem, some as a meal ticket. No politician is going to run on the platform of kicking single mom out of public housing.
Works though.; 5/13/20, 3:46 PM
Todd said...: Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

a 4-year-old accidentally shot in the foot on Feb. 26; a tenant's nephew shot in the leg outside the tenant's apartment on March 17, and an argument between two tenants over loud music that escalated into a physical fight on March 31

LOL. Was I not supposed to do that? If ONLY you said something!?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RvNS7JfcMM; 5/13/20, 3:47 PM
Oso Negro said...: It’s probably a great place to score drugs; 5/13/20, 3:48 PM
Mr Wibble said...: wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

Why should they? It's not like they'll be able to kick anyone out if they don't behave.

My dad and stepmom spent a lot of time and money building a beautiful house on a hill overlooking a river. Then the city announced that a light rail line and "affordable housing" were going to be constructed nearby. Dad and stepmom sold their place and got the hell out of there.; 5/13/20, 3:50 PM
Howard said...: Oh goodie. You haven't posted a troll for racists in a while.; 5/13/20, 3:54 PM
BUMBLE BEE said...: Who could have guessed?; 5/13/20, 3:54 PM
The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...: “Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."”

Yeah, not setting expectations. That’s the ticket.

Really, Althouse. What do you expect to be said about this that hasn’t been said everyday since LBJ was in office?; 5/13/20, 3:57 PM
Tom T. said...: How explicit should one have to be in establishing the expectation that residents should not shoot at children?; 5/13/20, 3:59 PM
steve uhr said...: I have always relied on management when I rented to tell me not to let my children handle loaded firearms. Thank God for landlords.; 5/13/20, 4:00 PM
Tommy Duncan said...: "Harmony".

Since this is in Madison the cause of the violence and gunfire must be poor management of the facility. That management failure appears to cause otherwise peaceful, productive and law abiding residents to turn violent.

Perhaps there are too many violent Norwegian renters due to the failure of the facility managers to discriminate against that demographic group.; 5/13/20, 4:00 PM
The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...: Oh, East Madison. Well, what did they expect?; 5/13/20, 4:07 PM
FullMoon said...: I blame the parents; 5/13/20, 4:11 PM
Grant said...: I’m eagerly waiting for comments to be released from moderation. So many possibilities, but I’ll just say: you can lead a horse to water...; 5/13/20, 4:15 PM
whitney said...: it's amazing how blind people are. Smart people too. They just refuse to see what's right in front of them; 5/13/20, 4:20 PM
cubanbob said...: What's the managing company supposed to do? Not rent to criminals, drug addicts, alcoholics, the mentally disturbed and screw ups that are a significant segment of the low income housing market? If the managing company had refused the aforementioned group they would be looking at being sued for discrimination.; 5/13/20, 4:25 PM
Michael said...: Goes with the territory. Fining owner won’t fix the problems.; 5/13/20, 4:27 PM
Otto said...: Was happening in NYC during the 50s. What's so special about Madison? Human nature doesn't change due to the physical environment. Insanity Is Doing the Same Thing Over and Over Again and Expecting Different Results.; 5/13/20, 4:28 PM
William said...: Fish gotta swim, birds gotta fly …; 5/13/20, 4:30 PM
tcrosse said...: No comment.; 5/13/20, 4:36 PM
Enlighten-NewJersey said...: Yes, it's the new housing complex that's a nuisance and not the residents causing the disturbances and violence.; 5/13/20, 4:40 PM
Kevin said...: "... and its owner could face fines and other charges if it doesn't make changes to improve quality of life and public safety there....

So the landlord shot two people and was playing his music at an inappropriately loud level?

Otherwise, it's people other than the owner who need to be making the changes.; 5/13/20, 4:41 PM
DMaxO55 said...: I like the blame on management for not setting reasonable expectations: Like "don't shoot guns on the property."; 5/13/20, 4:41 PM
DMaxO55 said...: I like the blame on management for not setting clear expectations: Like, "Don't shoot other people."; 5/13/20, 4:42 PM
George Grady said...: Yes, I'm sure the problem is the management and not the tenants. The management just needs to set the right expectations, and problem solved!; 5/13/20, 4:43 PM
Narr said...: Unexpectedly!

We have a few like that around here.

Narr
Been out . . . anything important happen?; 5/13/20, 4:44 PM
Narr said...: Unexpectedly!

We have a few like that around here.

Narr
Been out . . . anything important happen?; 5/13/20, 4:44 PM
Heartless Aztec said...: A housing project is just a mirror held up to the tenants that live there.; 5/13/20, 4:45 PM
GatorNavy said...: Character counts; 5/13/20, 4:54 PM
Tomcc said...: It's very important to set expectations with tenants. Incentives matter.; 5/13/20, 4:55 PM
Bob Smith said...: I’m shocked, shocked I tell you.; 5/13/20, 4:55 PM
Geoff Matthews said...: "Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy, who has been handling the nuisance complaint, wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening but pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

Is this called laws?; 5/13/20, 4:58 PM
Eleanor said...: Does a landlord need to spell out he doesn't want his tenants to shoot each other?; 5/13/20, 5:05 PM
WK said...: George: Was that wrong? Should I have not done that? I tell you I gotta plead ignorance on this thing because if anyone had said anything to me at all when I first moved in here that that sort of thing was frowned upon, you know, cause I’ve lived in a lot of housing developments and I tell you people do that all the time.; 5/13/20, 5:09 PM
Doug said...: How does the owner propose to disarm the residents who have guns? This is the owner's problem to fix?; 5/13/20, 5:11 PM
Roy Lofquist said...: "A cargo cult is a belief system in a relatively undeveloped society in which adherents practice superstitious rituals hoping to bring modern goods supplied by a more technologically advanced society."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult; 5/13/20, 5:12 PM
Mark said...: It's never been good in the projects.; 5/13/20, 5:18 PM
Danno said...: Blogger David53 said..."Is this a joke? Fake news? Is management supposed to tell tenets they are not to shoot each other?"

In a place as full of lib-taards as Madison, normal thinking or common sense isn't all that common.; 5/13/20, 5:34 PM
Tomcc said...: Here's a thought experiment: perhaps the good citizens of Madison, by way of Jennifer Zilavy, should be re-thinking the definition of "nuisance". It's a racially charged word in this context, right Howard?; 5/13/20, 5:39 PM
narciso said...: in other news

https://twitter.com/ScottWalker/status/1260695770417807369?s=20; 5/13/20, 5:43 PM
Automatic_Wing said...: The main problem with being poor in America is that you have to live around other poor people.; 5/13/20, 5:43 PM
Doug said...: Clearly they need more money, a study, and programs.

You forgot awareness.; 5/13/20, 5:44 PM
RK said...: This whole effort gave a lot of lefty Madisonians warm fuzzy feelings for a long time while it was being developed. Imagine, a library and computer lab! Social problems solved! Sadly, it didn't work out, but I'm sure the next one will.; 5/13/20, 5:45 PM
Doug said...: Oh goodie. You haven't posted a troll for racists in a while.

You just made it about race.; 5/13/20, 5:49 PM
Rob said...: It is the fault of management. They should have rented to rich people.; 5/13/20, 5:53 PM
William said...: Not all lower income people are low class. They should do better screening. Or are they allowed to screen tenants? It used to be you were able to discriminate against people with felony convictions, but maybe that's gone now.....Maybe they should build a project for only intact, working families. That might be an incentive for couples to remain intact working families. And if such families with the passage of time are no longer lower income let them continue to live in the projects. It might serve to diminish some of the shame of living in the projects if not everyone there was a loser....Drug convictions or weapons charges should be cause for eviction. Not everyone deserves to live in the projects or those low security federal prisons.; 5/13/20, 5:53 PM
The Godfather said...: All the comments here are reasonable, and the commenters are right to be p-o-ed at what the government officials were quoted as saying (the officials have undoubtedly said different things, but those were NOT for publication because the officials aren't fools) but unless you've actually dealt with landlord-tenant issues you don't know how easy or difficult they are, depending on the legal environment. I representing landlords in the District of Columbia for decades, but NOT on eviction matters. That was a speciality I respected, but didn't want to get involved in. But I was in a position to advise my clients on how to deal with tenant problems, and "setting tenant expectations early on" was very important -- if you could convince the tenants that if they stepped out of line they'd be in BIG TROUBLE, i.e., they would be evicted. But in DC, and perhaps also in Madison, there were all sorts of options that troublesome tenants could use to delay proceedings and increase the landlord's costs, if they were able to find a knowledgeable pro-bono lawyer. So too often the savvy landlord cuts a deal, drops a case, gives the tenant a "favorable moving reference" -- or just gives up and lets the troublemaker stay. And the troublesome tenant is still a troublesome tenant, whether in the same community or the next one.

I hope running one of these projects pays well, because otherwise it's not worth it.; 5/13/20, 5:53 PM
Spiros said...: "Low income tenants" are pieces of sh*t. But these landlords make very good money. For example, my sister has a medium sized complex outside of Nashville. The rate of return on her investments is an unbelievable 20%. I'm in the same business and I get 5 or 6%. But I deal with normal people. She deals with trash. In one of her units, a homeless man was invited in to do drugs. The homeless man used a hammer to kill another drug addict guest. In another unit, two teenagers smoking dope got into such a heated argument that one bit the index finger off the other. One of her disgruntled tenants bought a garden sprayer and used it to spray every surface in his apartment with canola oil. Barbecues in bathtubs! It goes on and on.

In attempt to improve the area, she hilariously tried to create a playground with basketball hoops and picnic tables! The tenants threw bricks through the glass blackboards and hammered the tables into bits. They then set the broken up wood on fire and congregated around the bonfire. Imagine setting pressure treated wood on fire. What a bunch of dummies!!! They also threw bedroom doors in the fire. And, oh my God, Covid 19 has destroyed these people's precarious mental states. They are seriously disturbed. Anyways, these are White people. WHITE people!!! Not Blacks or Mexicans or whatever. You Americans are much closer to the Third World then you realize.; 5/13/20, 5:59 PM
n.n said...: I'm surprised that racism has not been blamed yet.

Allegations of diversity and other classes of bigotry are not always a politically congruent choice, and are, in fact, suboptimal (e.g. Harvard et al diversity policies) artifacts of the Progressive Church. People are not so green and the collateral damage is visible, despite activists and for-profit non-profit efforts to influence and distort perception.; 5/13/20, 6:01 PM
Fernandinande said...: Assistant city attorney ... wasn't sure why the property began seeing problem so soon after its opening

It's a complete mystery other than it's the fault of white men.; 5/13/20, 6:01 PM
n.n said...: A triumph for "Diversity and Vibrancy."

Character before color. We should be wary of indulging liberal license to normalize color judgments.; 5/13/20, 6:03 PM
bagoh20 said...: We need two types of government housing: Low income, and another that's just "low values" housing. Maybe a third one that's "no values" That would be the fun one.; 5/13/20, 6:09 PM
Yancey Ward said...: I toured the area on Google Street View. Looks like the video was done during the building phase from about 2 years ago. Appears to have been farmland previously. A mixed development of single family homes, some of what look like multifamily homes (4 unit housing), and the Harmony apartments, which aren't more than two floors. The Harmony units were probably required by the city/county before approval was given for the rest.

Just my opinion- I wouldn't buy a home in this subdivision or any subdivision with such mandated low-income housing, especially not if I had children. Call it racist if you want to, but I bet you would buy a home there either.; 5/13/20, 6:16 PM
BoatSchool said...: According to a 2012 article Jennifer is “good at putting out fires.” Smokey the Bear she isn’t!!!; 5/13/20, 6:16 PM
BoatSchool said...: According to a 2012 article Jennifer is “good at putting out fires.” Smokey the Bear she isn’t!!!; 5/13/20, 6:17 PM
Yancey Ward said...: And, yes, this is a story that ignore the obvious, and contorts itself endlessly in trying to feign surprise and incomprehension about what the problem is. For what its worth, the blogpost quoted section doesn't give you the full picture- here is what you read when you go to the link:

"Madison police responded to 42 calls at the property between late October to mid-April, according to a remediation plan submitted by the property's owner, Milwaukee-based Royal Capital Group, on April 30."

That is a lot of police calls for a 100 unit complex.; 5/13/20, 6:19 PM
Michael K said...: If the WH press corps was covering this they'd assign an Asian reporter who could best cover the racist owner angle.

The owner and manager are probably Asian.; 5/13/20, 6:29 PM
NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...: Michael K said...

Why Obama's plan to fill suburbs with section 8 housing was not popular.

I wouldn't say that. I bet it was hugely popular with the urban gentrification crowd.; 5/13/20, 6:30 PM
AllenS said...: Sounds like the Far East Side Madison low-income housing complex could use a good community organizer. It would be a good job for Barack Hussein Obama. What could possibly go wrong?; 5/13/20, 6:34 PM
Ironclad said...: One of the things you learn as an engineer is that if you cannot clearly state the elements that define a problem, you have no hope of understanding or fixing it. Otherwise it’s just random chance with effort.

Howard made a stab at it earlier - he can’t bring himself to say it, but his message indicted that anyone suggesting that one particular group might be at the root of the problem would be branded a racist, so don’t go there!

But it’s an undeniable fact ( look at FBI Crime database as facts) that a very age specific demographic is involved proportional to their population as a massive spike in the records. But is anyone suggesting “ flattening that curve” to reduce the level of antisocial behavior?

Maybe they can get the good Dr Fauci to classify it as an epidemic, then the left can move to lock it down. But don’t hold your breath.; 5/13/20, 6:37 PM
Banjo said...: This is clearly a case of the bigotry of high expectations.; 5/13/20, 6:51 PM
BUMBLE BEE said...: "I'll kill anybody who gets in the way of me killing anybody". Yellowbeard

Sounds like a lot of second and third generation of white college grads set this housing up. Folks that grow up in cracker land suburbs are usually the hardest hit. Not that this has happened in any other projects, anywhere else eh? Didn't Daniel Patrick Moynihan predict this shit 60 years ago? (Hint... rhetorical question); 5/13/20, 6:51 PM
BUMBLE BEE said...: Isn't Robocop prescient?; 5/13/20, 6:54 PM
n.n said...: these are White people. WHITE people!!! Not Blacks or Mexicans or whatever. You Americans are much closer to the Third World then you realize.

Diversity breeds adversity. #PrinciplesMatter oh, also #HateLovesAbortion and #BLM; 5/13/20, 7:03 PM
SGT Ted said...: "inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants"

I guess they forgot to tell them not to act like lowlife criminal shitbags.; 5/13/20, 7:06 PM
D.D. Driver said...: ♬ I stood in line, down at the County Hall
I heard a man say, "We're gonna build some new apartments for y'all!"♬; 5/13/20, 7:15 PM
SGT Ted said...: The Government is using crack-house laws meant to hold absentee landlords in privately owned home neighborhoods accountable to punish a live-in manager of a publicly funded development that is having to deal with the obvious consequences of the very people that the Government created the housing for.

Government: "Here's some money. Go build a housing complex for those criminal scumbags over there."

Government: "Hey, how come there are criminal scumbags in that housing complex committing crimes? We're going to punish you for that."; 5/13/20, 7:20 PM
Steven said...: Chronic poverty is not a circumstance, it's a behavior pattern.; 5/13/20, 7:37 PM
Jay Vogt said...: Well you can blame ACC Management for inept tenant education if you want, but they have no money. And you can't blame the main lender, WHADA because, you'd have no chance. Me? . . . . . I'd blame the next lender, UnitedHealthCare for not properly underwriting the loan and building appropriate covenants for the borrowers. I mean, they've got the money.; 5/13/20, 7:38 PM
Char Char Binks, Esq. said...: Spirits, maybe the tenants thought basketball hoops would attract Blacks.; 5/13/20, 8:05 PM
Oso Negro said...: @ Yancey Ward - We have a place here in Galveston known as "Sandpiper Cove". It has about 192 units and runs about three police calls a day. But that is down from past years. Dunno who owns it now, but it used to be owned by a nice white family who lived in a nice white suburb in Illinois. There's your racial angle, Howard. Fucking white liberals who farm the poor.; 5/13/20, 8:29 PM
n.n said...: Chronic poverty is not a circumstance, it's a behavior pattern.

Mostly, yes. The difference can be observed in poor areas of town, where the homes and land are tended, even beautified by their residents.; 5/13/20, 8:31 PM
Achilles said...: People voted for unicorns.

They got unicorns.; 5/13/20, 9:00 PM
Narr said...: Cabrini-Green it ain't--not in terms of style; not even Great Society lovers defend Cabrini-Green anymore. One criticism of the C-G style of course was that it was brutalist and antihuman and yadda yadda, so how could you expect the inmates to like it?

Fast forward and all that's changed is the style--the inmates don't like it. Maybe the problem lies deeper.

Back when I was a teen I spent many a Friday evening riding with my Uncle Jimmy ("the slumlord") as he collected rent from the ten or a dozen small houses in [redacted]town he owned. He knew that if he wasn't waiting for some of his tenants--tenants who had jobs-- when they got home neither he nor, in some cases, the wife and kids, would see a dime.

Uncle Jimmy and I would not miss a meal, but some of those kids would. He faced some mean drunk tenants on occasion too.

If a tenant missed too often or caused too much trouble, he gave them their walking papers.

Narr
That was never fun; 5/13/20, 9:04 PM
Michael K said...: NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...
Michael K said...

Why Obama's plan to fill suburbs with section 8 housing was not popular.

I wouldn't say that. I bet it was hugely popular with the urban gentrification crowd.

Who didn't live anywhere near it. Sorry I was unclear. Try to squat on Nancy Pelosi's private street.; 5/13/20, 9:09 PM
Bunkypotatohead said...: "CARES Act Section 4024(b) prohibits landlords of certain rental “covered dwellings” from initiating eviction proceedings or “charg[ing] fees, penalties, or other charges” against a tenant for the nonpayment of rent. ... It also bars those landlords from issuing a notice to vacate during the 120- day period"

Good luck getting rid of the the miscreants.; 5/13/20, 9:36 PM
RichardJohnson said...: Assistant city attorney Jennifer Zilavy... pointed to inadequate management that didn't set expectations for tenants early on as one possibility."

Had management verbally set expectations, such as "No shootings," I suspect management would have been called "racist" for not assuming that its tenants would be on their best behavior.

BTW, most tenant-landlord contracts include certain expectations regarding behavior. My HOA's attorney informed a landlord that as his tenant had numerous times disturbed the peace of the complex, the landlord was going to be fined for any subsequent violations. As the tenant was on a month-to-month contract, he was gone within a month.

I suspect that one problem with this complex was that tenants were repeatedly violating the terms of the lease, but suffered no consequences from them. Had management tried to enforce the behavioral conditions of the leases, it's a good bet management would have been called "racist."; 5/13/20, 9:43 PM
285exp said...: wild chicken said:

“ These low income places always have names with "Commons" or "Flats."

Why is that.”

It’s the Tragedy of the Commons; 5/13/20, 10:01 PM
Freeman Hunt said...: If these places are going to be nice, there has to be a robust power to evict people.; 5/13/20, 11:08 PM
walter said...: Blogger Howard said...
Oh goodie. You haven't posted a troll for racists in a while.
--
That's funny. I checked this out just to see how long it would take you to verbally clench your sphincter.; 6/6/20, 3:08 PM