February 16, 2020
Trump's performative religion, as interpreted by Joe Rogan.
Watch the whole thing... there are many interesting leaps of speculation. What's more likely — that Trump is sincerely religious or that Trump is "banging" Paula White?
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108 comments:
OH, both
Paula's got nothing on Melissa. Dayum. I would totally make several mixed race WMAF babies with, Just sayin.
Trump thinks they like the ritual and it's not in the way and there's no point in being an asshole about it. Never heard of Paula White, but I wouldn't have picked Melania either.
Bill Clinton had the extra large Bible under his arm and is likely to be banging Paula White, is my final judgment.
The prayer ritual is no different from the national anthem or the pledge. Go along or somebody will yell at you.
Derrida rebelled in public prayers as a kid by silently saying his own.
At least they acknowledge that Obama did the same "performative religion" act that they say Trump is doing. On the other hand, it's not unheard of for people to become more religious as they get older.
Strictly speaking performative is just one kind of language, not a particularly shallow mode. Like saying "I do" at a marriage is perfomative.
What if George W Bush was actually the one who was faking it and he's just a way better faker?
What's more likely — that Trump is sincerely religious or that Trump is "banging" Paula White?
What's most likely is that people have nothing better to think about than this.
I'd be VERY surprised if Trump is doing any other woman while President. That would be terrible judgment of the sort he does not make. It would put himself in a position to be blackmailed, something that Bill Clinton stupidly ignored. Like him or hate him, one must admit Trunp is street smart.
An actor praying in a scene is not praying. There's no performative owing to "infelicitous conditions." Yet he goes through the motions.
J.L.Austin invented performatives to show that language wasn't the sort of thing that always had a truth value. He was worried about calculating morality and wanted to show it wasn't possible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felicity_conditions
wiki knows everything.
I don't find Joe Rogan very compelling. His stream of conscientiousness sounds like he's high. Oh wait, he probably is. That's why they call it dope.
Someone's channeling prurient Howard Stern lite.
Don't bother following Searle links. He misread Austin completely.
Paula White is the Faith Hill performer of Mississippi Pentecostal Christians. But would making her plain and ugly be any better? What if Trump and God like to see talent and beauty in Christian Believers who speak for God. But assuming that " being religious clones" is what God wants in His Church is ignorance of Christianity. All Trump wants is to be a winner, so he accepts the offer of the winning God.
Joe Rogan is unwatchable for the opposite reason that Ted talks are unwatchable, except for sharing a deep know-nothingism.
God rejects the prodigal son when his old tweets come out.
Trump’s WWE experience allowed him to campaign effectively and win.
Rogan think that "traditional religious" people are more comfortable with each other and have a different way of behaving then, but doesn't seem to consider that "everyone else", that is, modern non-religious people, do exactly the same thing.
Don't think Trump is at all religious, but evangelicals are an integral part of the coalition he built. Since he's delivered on his promises to them, they won't question his faith.
Of course, neither Obama or Bill Clinton were religious, but they needed to appear to be church goers for political purposes. Carter and George W were truly religious.
"What if George W Bush was actually the one who was faking it and he's just a way better faker?"
What if everyone in the world is faking whatever religion they are manifesting and we're all just on a continuum of fakery, even those of you who come into the comments to argue oh no, not you, not you and your friends and loved ones?
Joe Rogan shouldn’t have come out in support of Bernie.He no longer occupies that third space and now folks wonder what Joe REALLY thinks.(Whereas before it was all about Joe getting the guest to say what he/she really thinks.)
Rituals are good and simply showing up is 90% of the game. It is difficult to grasp why there is so much mind reading going on.
So what if he shows up in church in his Sunday Best; everyone else is.
It is fine to be so LAIC; but, little more anthropology is required here. Pagentry and the Durbar are well known devices of class and religion.
The devote might say, "Only God knows what is in the heart of Donald Trump."
He's Shaw's Andrew Undershaft made flesh.
In my very catholic grade school everyone knew Father Lucas had a thing for altar boys. I said so long to religion and God then.
In my later years, especially after the death of my previous husband, I have found myself looking for God.
Recently, I learned that at least three boys that Father Lucas preferred committed suicide.
Trying to come to grips with both religion and God is like trying to backpack the AT. There are jagged or slippery rocks everywhere.
What Wilber wrote in his comment at 8:01.
I think of Donald Trump as not being devout in the sense that he is afraid of the Lord's wrath should he miss a Sunday church service (or mass), but that he nevertheless looks at Christianity is a good philosophy for supporting the downtrodden through charity and generally being kind to one another. He is more tolerant of homosexuality than some Christians, but he comes across to me as being intolerant of the sort of homosexual who reflexively hates all Christians because of the attitudes of a certain type of Christian. And that's a good thing.
I am also inclined to agree in part with Amexpat's comment regarding evangelical Christians. Evangelical Christians have reason to feel hoodwinked by people who outwardly expressed devotion to Christian ideals, then ignored their concerns and sometimes even stabbed them in the back.
"What if everyone in the world is faking whatever religion they are manifesting and we're all just on a continuum of fakery, even those of you who come into the comments to argue oh no, not you, not you and your friends and loved ones?"
Mark 9:24
Immediately the father of the child cried out and said with tears, “Lord, I believe; help my unbelief!”
Who? Never heard of her.
It’s actually kind of profound how many people don’t understand or are repulsed by the basic transactional nature of Trump’s character. It speaks to now insulated from reality our society is that “If you do X for me, I’ll do Y for you” and vice versa strikes people as so alien and incomprehensible.
Mike
It's reported (Scott Adams, et. al.) that Trump went to Norman Vincent Peale's church as a kid ("The Power of Positive Thinking"). It stands to reason he would be attracted to a type of "Prosperity Gospel".
Watch the original at around 7 minutes. The guest drank two energy drinks and weighs about 105 lbs.
I don't know who Paula White is or whether Trump is having sex with her--though I highly doubt he is having sex with anyone anymore--but I don't buy for a second his attempts to feign religious feeling or belief. His attempts to appear so are transparently counterfeit.
@Annie C., you have my sympathies. If you really want it, there's a church out there for you. I'm personally happy with my atheism -- pace stephen cooper, the universe makes no sense mathematically if there's an omnipotent God who cares for each human -- but you are searching for something and I hope you find it.
Like him or hate him, one must admit Trunp is street smart.
Really?! Seems to me, Trump thinks he is above the law and thinks he can't be touched. That is the opposite of "street smart".
—At least they acknowledge that Obama did the same "performative religion" act that they say Trump is doing. On the other hand, it's not unheard of for people to become more religious as they get older.—
My dad once joked you go to church as s child because your parents take you. You fall away as you grow up but you go back when you get older because you’re hedging your bet. Lolol
My dad did the whole dying, light, tunnel and after that he had no fear of death. He heard a voice telling him it wasn’t his time yet and back he went into his body. He just wasn’t ready to go when he went from cancer.
"I would totally make several mixed race WMAF babies with, Just sayin."
Hello 4chan.
The imagination is a wonderful gift.
Really?! Seems to me, Trump thinks he is above the law and thinks he can't be touched. That is the opposite of "street smart".
@Freder, you have Donald Trump confused with Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden. Except that neither Clinton nor Biden could be touched, except by the voters having the last word. The voters will have the last word on Donald Trump -- and the House Democrats.
...only Rogan would look at Paula White and see Sir Oliver Humperdink.
We probably should look back on this time as the "Kayfabe Era" of American politics. Seeing this aspect is a major element of Trump's ascent.
The real joke is this, though. Through it all, Trump is the shooter. It's how he's gotten to where he is today. The genius is making it look like he's on script when he's just riffing.
And they call HIM the moron. Translation guide below:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oliver_Humperdink
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kayfabe
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoot_(professional_wrestling)
"His stream of conscientiousness "
That's as funny as Rogan saying irreverent instead if irrelevant.
Pearls from Hardin on this thread. Seriously, this is his wheelhouse. Too bad he is speaking in telegrams, because I expect many will miss his points.
What if the atheists are faking it, and in their hearts are actually believers?
What Big Mike @8:50 AM said.
“Really?! Seems to me, Trump thinks he is above the law and thinks he can't be touched. That is the opposite of "street smart".”
Sure sounds like that came from a Democrat. Talking about being above the law - Andy McCabe was just let off the hook for committing the exact same offense that he set up Gen Flynn for by lying. He lied under oath three times, and to federal officials several times. All that Flynn did was maybe, but probably not, lie about his talk with the Russian Ambassador that the FBI has an illegal transcript of (the recording was legal, just probably not the deminimization). The current theory is that McCabe was let off from very obvious felonies because trying him would expose too much dirt in all three branches of government (including that James Wolfe got off from an obvious Espionage Act conviction based on dirt he had on his bosses, the chair and vice chair of the SSCI). In short, our government is so corrupt that it can’t be prosecuted, but instead, the only people who can be, or the ones who threaten the power of those corrupt insiders.
If trump were actually so far above the law, the Dem House wouldn’t have needed to impeach him for nonimpeachable noncrimes, and could have used real crimes instead.
Derrida rebelled in public prayers as a kid by silently saying his own.
2/16/20, 7:57 AM
That's not a rebellion, that's perfectly acceptable behavior.
Are horny Christians bigger hypocrites than greedy Marxists or environmentalists with opulent lifestyles? They certainly catch more flack when they fall from grace.
Left Bank of the Charles said...
What if the atheists are faking it, and in their hearts are actually believers?
2/16/20, 9:26 AM
Sure...what's their payoff?
Is Jeff Rogan a Christian and what about the character he's talking to? I'm not interested in hearing non-Christians talk about someone's Christian beliefs. Sorry.
@rhhardin - Matt 6:6
I was raised as Catholic, but I have no belief in personal immortality and I've seen no evidence of divine providence in human affairs. Still, we don't know what 90% of the matter and energy in the cosmos is all about. And that's only this cosmos. There might be an infinity of other cosmos....So, all in all, I would say agnosticism rather than atheism is the safer bet. I don't know if God exists, but the wish to believe in God certainly does. Maybe it's an even safer bet, if you have spiritual needs, to channel your spiritual needs into some religion that been around for a few generations and seems to work for its followers. Avoid scientology if you can.
Rogan is self-refuting at times, which made me generally interested in the first three minutes. "Christians think in very narrow streams! But they also love Trump, who is unpredictable! Showing up in a suit and tie, that's predictable!" Forgetting that Trump is almost always in a suit for public occasions is pretty strange and is a clear sign of bizarrely mixed messaging, particularly when the business casual shirtsleeves-rolled-up style is the most predictable thing about white male politicians. Rogan's knowledge of wrestling and kayfabe- both critical aspects of the constructed "Trump" persona- is vital to understanding the phenomenon. But the fact Joe Rogan manifestly isn't tuned into mainstream evangelical beliefs makes his attempt to be an authority on Trump's spiritual style unconvincing at best.
I think there are three reasons Trump isn't sleeping with Paula, and has a relatively genuine Christianity now. First of all, his wife. Sex scandals can enhance your brand when you're bedding a smoking hot mistress while staying loyal to your merely attractive (but loyal!) wife. As Hugh Grant could tell you, going the reverse route merely invites scorn. Given Melania's ability to weather an intense storm of really creepy criticism, and her obvious attachment to Catholicism, I would say it's much likelier that she's had considerable influence on her husband, rather than just being a trophy wife.
Secondly, Trump doesn't have to dip his pen in the company ink (unlike Bill Clinton). He has more than enough magnetism and cold money to get whoever he wants. This is not a man who settles, to put it mildly. It's likelier that he'd live with his ex-wives in the White House, as they obviously still care for the man if they resisted the massive pressure/ money to accuse Trump of rape, cannibalism, etc. He doesn't because that's just not normal for most Americans, convenient as it might be.
Thirdly, and most importantly, Donald Trump has made some very valuable acknowledgements of Christianity in general and evangelicals in particular that no other Republican would dare. By personally attending the March for Life, Trump absolutely gave them the legitimacy of the Presidency- and invited comparisons to the Bush family, who never attended them in person. His policy victories are so many, even left-wing sources acknowledge them. And the wide-stance chuckservative faction of the Republican Party HATES this. They scream like vampires doused with holy water when Trump's clear political commitment to evangelicals shines. The only ones who hate it more are those who make denying Christ an open cornerstone of their identity.
Hey, did you know Mike Bloomberg is rumored to be sinking $2 billion into the presidential race? Wow, that's a lot of money. He must really feel a sense of urgency.
What if everyone in the world is faking whatever religion they are manifesting and we're all just on a continuum of fakery, even those of you who come into the comments to argue oh no, not you, not you and your friends and loved ones?
What if everyone claiming to be doing deep philosophical/psychological thinking on the nature of other people's religious beliefs is really just spinning a self-flattering self-faking rationalization of their juvenile resentment of a certain religion not giving them everything they want, and not validating everything they want validated?
I grew up with people who, by all outward appearance, took their faith very seriously indeed, but I never had any religious faith myself, not even as a child. After all these years, damned if I can think of any method by which I can verify another person's faith, can *really* know another's heart on this score.
By their actions? No. To believe that a sinner by sinning demonstrates that he doesn't *really* believe in the existence of God shows a peculiar misunderstanding of basic human nature. And to believe that someone is "faking it" because they demur from this or that dogma of one's boutique theology is just laughable solipsism.
"What if everyone in the world is faking whatever religion they are manifesting and we're all just on a continuum of fakery, even those of you who come into the comments to argue oh no, not you, not you and your friends and loved ones?"
This is just a restatement of your "if you really believed you would act in this way" argument. To which I always reply:
"We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[c] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it."
Romans 7:14-20
Atheism is logically untenable.
Timing is everything, via Lucianne:
The Chosen' series about Jesus defies Hollywood norms
By Monica Showalter
Hollywood has always had a problem with America's Judaeo-Christian culture, particularly now, putting itself at odds with a large part of its audience.
Read more: https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/02/the_chosen_series_about_jesus_defies_hollywood_norms.html#ixzz6E8NiZLKr
Follow us: @AmericanThinker on Twitter | AmericanThinker on Facebook
This crowdsourced $10million to get this made.
I have never,c never believed that Trump is truly religious. I believe he is using his "religious feelings" to pander to the evangelicals.They ar4e such idiots and so narrow minded that they eat it up, totally ignoring the fact that he is a serial cheater, and is probably cheating on his present wife, and that he constantly lies to all of the American people, to our everlasting detriment. He also, serially, demeans his opponents by pointing out and making fun of, things they have no control over, height, weight, sexuality, etc.
So if people actually think that his religious fervor is true, I've got bridge for you in Brooklyn I'd like to sell you,
Vicki from Pasadena
Then there’s the ‘lil commie Petey.
I really don’t think Trump gas “religious fervor.”
Of course, to some even mentioning religion is “religious fervor.”
Until we can agree on the baseline definition, it doesn’t matter.
Has not gas.
victoria: They ar4e such idiots and so narrow minded that they eat it up, totally ignoring the fact that he is a serial cheater, and is probably cheating on his present wife, and that he constantly lies to all of the American people, to our everlasting detriment.
That evangelicals are making an intelligent and rational choice in their own self-interest by voting for this particular man among the many others whose morals don't align with their own, has been adequately explained a thousand times over, on this blog and elsewhere. They aren't "ignoring" anything; you're ignoring an enormous number of things.
How much of a narrow-minded idiot do you have to be to still be peddling this stupid non-observation about evangelical voters?
How can you not feel positive about the future knowing that our nation still attracts the best and the brightest from all over the world.
Well I think at its root it's quite obvious that every religious person is faking it because religion is fake.
Please explain to me how the belief in God and the belief in Santa Claus are different
Look at it this way, Vicki.
Look at all the feminists who supported The former-rapist-in-chief’s personal peccadillos while in office and were willing to put him back In the building attached to the enabler.
Annie C.,
Breaks my heart when people lose faith/leave the church because of the failings of the men within the church (both the pedos and those transferring them around instead of expelling them). I hope you find a way to turn back. There’s a lot more good there.
Re-read the parable of the prodigal son. Says so much about being able to turn back no matter what, and to be welcomed. But that older brother really has a tough time with it. He has everything and doesn’t realize it/can’t see it through his own sense of righteousness.
Great lessons. Just keep turning back to God and his church.
St. Nick?
totally ignoring the fact that he is a serial cheater
ignore, forgive potayto, patohto
John 8:7
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
Or was a serial cheater and stopped.
"What if everyone in the world is faking whatever religion they are manifesting and we're all just on a continuum of fakery......"
This is nonsense. Now if you are stating that some people are liars about their faith that is a logical statement and true. Lying because they profess the opposite of what they think. That has no bearing on the validity of the belief. So if you rally believe in something regardless of whether it is true or not , you may be misguided but you are not a faker.
And to say everyone is astounding, it includes you. Are you saying you are a faker?
I think it's highly unlikely that agnostics and atheists are actually secret believers. Furthermore, I suspect that the vast majority of voters agree with me about that. Voters care more about authenticity than they used to; Trump's election is evidence of that. Trump did not pretend to be a great Christian and still won most of the conservative Christian vote in 2016 and will do even better with that demographic in 2020. The era of politicians loudly proclaiming their religion may finally be over. We'll know for sure when acknowledged atheists win some elections.
Well I think at its root it's quite obvious that every religious person is faking it because religion is fake.
Explain martyrdom.
I am so bored by this topic I didn’t read Althouse’s post or any of the comments.
Annie C,
Father Lucas had a thing for altar boys because he wasn't a Christian, but a homosexual that lusted after young boys.
I feel so sorry for the ones who committed suicide, but let's face it, Father Lucas killed them because of his sexual perversion.
I hope you find God.
I think Trump is sincere inasmuch as he recognizes the historical significance of his position and recognizes spirituality as a means to a positive end.
It's not surprising that a guy like Trump especially would try to draw religious inspiration once he stepped into public office.
Trump hasn't been swimming in that safe narrow band of politics, Rogan describes, his entire life.
Trump needed to freshen the water in his fish tank.
Everyone has a faith (i.e. a trust, a logical domain outside of a limited frame of reference). Everyone has a religion (i.e. behavioral protocol), including "ethics" or relativistic religion. Everyone has a "god", a philosopher, many a God that is extra-universal, while others mortal gods. As for Trump, he does not conflate logical domains in consensus with modern belief systems. He seems to recognize individual dignity, intrinsic value, and inordinate worth of human life as articles of faith, not emergent by virtue of force.
Martyrdom is mental illness.
Left Bank of the Charles said...
What if the atheists are faking it, and in their hearts are actually believers?
Nobody is more of a religious fanatic than your standard atheist.
Nichevo said...
Sure...what's their payoff?
A sense of superiority over other believers.
Theirs is the only true faith.
“Martyrdom is a mental illness”
I am sure that the students at Communist Martyrs High School* agree with you.
*classic reference. See Firesign Theater
'we're all just on a continuum of fakery......"
As Alan Bloom said in "The Closing of the American Mind" the 60s liberals replaced something with nothing.
Sad when atheists with a mind (at least in their mind) get to be 67 years old. Even happens to the best of them , Eccl 1.
but I don't buy for a second his attempts to feign religious feeling or belief. His attempts to appear so are transparently counterfeit.
Is this supposed to be some recent revelation that is unique to Trump? If so you're not paying attention. Does anyone buy the Barack blunting a roach and heading to church when he was a kid? Bill & Hill? The Kennedy's should have been excommunicated- Catholics make an exception for the powerful...
...but it's an act of genuflection pols think is necessary. Kind of like when lefties pretend for the NRAers. Can I get me a huntin' license here?
Howard said...
Martyrdom is mental illness.
2/16/20, 1:25 PM
A Polish priest imprisoned at Auschwitz volunteered to take the place of another prisoner who was condemned to die in a standing cell. A horrible way to die. Prisoners could neither sit nor stand up straight and they slowly died of thirst and hunger. The priest died. The other prisoner survived the camp.
The priest, whose name escapes me, was eventually canonized.
According to Howard, he was mentally ill. Because in Howard's world, I guess nothing is more important than self-preservation.
Otto said...
"What if everyone in the world is faking whatever religion they are manifesting and we're all just on a continuum of fakery......"
When I go to church, I suppose there are probably some people there who are unbelievers dragged to church by their families. The thing is, I don't know which ones they are. I am not gifted with the ability to see into the souls of others and know where they are spiritually.
There are times when even very devout people, like Mother Theresa, have had doubts. It causes great anguish. Sometimes they lose faith. Sometimes they are able to work their way though their doubts and end up with even stronger faith. It's more than a bit cynical to dismiss their spiritual struggles as fakery.
@exie....devil. I think your valid comment at 2:02 are directed towards Ann.
Otto, yes, it is. Sorry.
I suspect Trump believes God is real, is the creator of everything, stays hidden and only gets involved when asked. Whether you call that being religious or phony is another matter entirely.
Rogan's comments were repugnant but I have no problem with him expressing himself.
Atheism is logically untenable? As an atheist, formerly Presbyterian, isn't God taken on faith?
I like to talk about religion and the religious like to talk to me because I'm not an asshole atheist. Buddhists are atheists. My appreciation of Jesus, a great teacher and founder, is much like Buddhists towards their guy.
And, of course, I really love the contributions of Christians and Jews to Western Civilization. As an atheist, I'm still open towards a sign from God. It doesn't have to be trimming by bushes with fire.
I don't have any "problems" with religions or Gods, unless they really suck.
…trimming my bushes with fire. I used to be a good proofreader. There's a job category down the historical tube.
Milwaukie guy said...
Atheism is logically untenable? As an atheist, formerly Presbyterian, isn't God taken on faith?
How did the first strand of DNA form and tell the first proteins to form a nucleus?
I am genuinely curious on what the current theory is for how life began.
That’s the first time I ever listened to four-plus minutes of Joe Rogan. I did it at your insistence, Althouse. In Joe Rohan terminology, “I fucked up, I trusted you,” Althouse.
I’d call it a complete waste but I did it mostly during a commercial break in the golf tournament.
My favorite line was that Trump is clearly faking his religious posturing “but nobody calls him on it.” Nobody!?! There must be a lot of other Althouses out there, all avoiding George Conway’s columns.
The Althouse blog used to be one of the first things on my bookmark list that I would click on. Now, the first thing for me is the link to George Conway’s Twitter feed.
According to the gulag memoirists, the only people who didn’t succumb morally in the Soviet camps were the believers in God. See Gary Saul Morson, How the Great Truth Dawned in the September 2019 The New Criterion.
Chuck, you are a strange man, assuming you are not a paid troll. You need to get out more.
How did the first strand of DNA form and tell the first proteins to form a nucleus?
I am genuinely curious on what the current theory is for how life began.
I go with we don't know yet rather than Divine Providence.
Achilles: You could start with "The Selfish Gene" by the infamous Richard Dawkins. (See Chapter 2, "The Replicators".) It is only a theory, but at least motivates the idea that the origin of life might not necessarily involve magic (though I would not claim that it proves this). I imagine there may be other ideas out there.
Obviously, this is a tough problem because there are no time machines available to allow us to go back and look. And it does appear that whatever took place, took place over time periods vastly longer than the existence of the human species, much less civilization. Which means that even if we could observe it, it would appear to us that nothing at all was going on even if we persisted in doing so for generations.
Even if a theory complete enough to be testable emerges, it wouldn't be feasible to run the experiment in the kind of time frame in which it appears that might have occurred in nature. So, if something is done to "speed up the process", any conclusions are open to the criticism that the experiment was unnatural and is thus unconvincing. So, that's a problem we would have, even if we had a complete theory, which we don't.
None of this is a strong argument for throwing up our hands and invoking mumbo-jumbo like special creation or intelligent design. That is an abdication, or postponement, not a satisfying solution for many people. Sometimes the only sensible attitude is one of humility about what how much we may ever understand about Nature, even while we slowly plug away at it.
Wrong on all counts Wednesday. The priest wasn't a martyr he was just a stand-up guy. A martyr is someone who dies for God because God told him or some other guy told him that God said to do it. When you volunteer to sacrifice yourself for your fellow man for the greater good that's not being a martyr, that's just taking one for the team. That's okay sweetheart no one here expects you to understand what motivates men to do things;^)
How did the first strand of DNA form and tell the first proteins to form a nucleus?
Unknowable by way of science (a near-domain philosophy and practice). Chaos (e.g. "evolution") constrains our knowledge and skill beyond a limited frame of reference. That said, we can speculate, we can infer, we can observe patterns, then indulge in the art and faith of plausible.
the only people who didn’t succumb morally in the Soviet camps were the believers in God
Faith is an external, inaccessible, incorruptible, logical domain. None more than God, an extra-universal entity, a religious/moral philosopher, who set the "universe" in motion, and men and women on Earth, a proving ground, to prove their mettle.
What if everyone in the world is faking whatever religion they are manifesting
AA, that's a dumb comment. You've heard of Christian martyrs. It's a major reason that Christianity spread so far and so fast--all the early disciples clearly were willing to die for their faith.
I think the 9/11 bombers had a bad faith. But it would be kind of ridiculous to insist they were faking it.
"A martyr is someone who dies for God because God told him or some other guy told him that God said to do it."
You don't think his religious devotion had anything to do with it? While non-religious people are capable of self-sacrifice, when believers do it, it is because they are motivated by faith:
"Greater love than this no one hath, namely that one should lay down his life for his friends."
That's OK, Howard, nobody expects a leftist to understand why decent people do things.
Again, an atheist claims to be able to see into the hearts of others and "know" what motivates them.
For people who don't believe in God, you claim some very godlike powers.
Martyrdom is mental illness.
Okay, but if martyrdom is the purest essence of faith, now you have to explain why billions of people are pretending to be mentally ill.
Consider the possibility that religious people have a faith that you do not share.
Who cares what Trump really believes. And thanks Victoria for the input. What church do you go to?
Eisenhower didn't have a religious bone in his body and never went to Church. Then he became President, and went to Church every Sunday, just to set a good example. JFK also went to Church, although his actual faith is unclear.
Who on the Democrat Side is a Christian? Obama? Haha. Clinton? haha. Or maybe Bernie will be our new Pope. Haha.
Implicit in the all these bad faith criticisms is that TRump is somehow "Fooling" those evangelicals because he's going to do, what exactly?
Trump has marched in a DC Pro-life protest, the first President to do so. He's supported religious liberty and appointed Judges that are NOT anti-Christian. He's tried to push social conservatism to extent he could.
But that's all fake because...uh...he's not REALLY a christian. Okey-dokey.
I believe that Dylan fans are faking it for a sense of belonging. Baseball fans, too.
Trump has marched in a DC Pro-life protest, the first President to do so... But that's all fake because...uh...he's not REALLY a christian. Okey-dokey.
The science affirms that he is. However, an expended frame of reference may demonstrate otherwise. The former is objective. The latter is an article of faith. Perhaps a hypothesis of the plausible, albeit improbable.
Consider the possibility that religious people have a faith that you do not share.
A faith, yes, and religion that normalizes inordinate worth (e.g. women and children first).
For people who don't believe in God, you claim some very godlike powers.
Mortal gods, [secular] religious philosophies, conflation of logical domains, and accompanying acolytes, are common throughout the world and human history.
"Mortal gods, [secular] religious philosophies, conflation of logical domains, and accompanying acolytes, are common throughout the world and human history."
And none are a match for a good blaster.
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