"How do you signal your own values and political beliefs on your dating profile? Are you intentionally leaving off any beliefs? If so, which ones and why? Are there lines you won’t cross when it comes to dating someone who disagrees with you on a politically charged topic — such as, abortion, vaccinations, gun control, climate change, immigration or President Trump? How important are a person’s politics when you’re dating or beginning a relationship? Do you refuse to date outside of your own political party or identity, or are you rolling your eyes at all of this?"
The NYT asks its readers.
This reminds me of the time — back in 2004 — when I did a "normblog profile." One of the questions was "Do you think you could ever be married to, or in a long-term relationship with, someone with radically different political views from your own?" My answer was "Sure, if he wasn't an ass about it."
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94 comments:
Sure, if he wasn't an ass about it."
that would rule out most WaPoo and NYT's commentators, wouldn't it?
Well, I guess that explains a facet of your relationship with Meade...people are really missing out when they limit who they allow into their lives simply based on politics.
The thought would have never crossed my mind until the last few years.
I'm married, so the question is hypothetical for me. But it would surely be a most important consideration for me now. I find leftists - American leftists, anyway - so utterly insufferable I actively avoid them. I find their compulsive "the personal is political" behavior so off-putting that I would rather be alone than have to spend time with them.
Tolerance is the requirement. Any one who puts their popular ideology ahead of the romance is the one to be avoided. They do not respect you.
Put me in the "eye rolling at all of this" cohort. Of course, mrs. stevew and I have been together since before we married in 1980. We met in college and were not particularly interested or invested in politics. Those were different times, as I recall most folks were not so passionate about their favored political team. And you could have engaging and spirited discussions about the candidates (Reagan, Carter, Anderson) and not storm out of the house in a huff.
If politics and politicians are the first and foremost focus of your existence I can see how this would be important. Are there really that many people for which this is the case?
I'm 70.
Despite all the cheerleading articles you read on the internet, dating at 70 is ridiculous.
Old men and old women are not sexy. We have some other great attributes, but sexy is not one.
I gave internet dating a brief shot. I cannot adequately describe the horror of this experience. When we are young and relatively unscarred, it's possible to entertain some romantic illusions about the opposite sex. Not so for beaten up, disillusioned, physically disintegrating seniors.
Some of the old hags did denounce the president. I can't imagine they were getting a lot of dinner dates.
Sure, if he wasn't an ass about it.
Yep but only works if you're not an ass about it either...
When they list President Trump last it reminds me of that old show where there was a character who was a therapist and the tag line she always got around to at the end was “Do you have any SEXual problems?”
...ass meaning imbedding politics into every social situation, dragging him to the marches, pissing everyone off at Thanksgiving. To lefties these are deal breakers...
“Do you have any SEXual problems?”
Dear John
I just say that they are all fucking scum, which I honestly believe, and leave it at that. I don’t go on dating sites, I prefer the old fashioned way of chatting up women in chance encounters, getting phone numbers. I may not have a date every weekend that way, but I am thinking that this improves the quality, so I have never run into one who babbles on about politics. I had one who commented on a Trump bumper sticker and I used my “they are all fucking scum” line, and that ended the discussion of politics, but if she had brought it up again, that would likely have been the end of it. I still see her from time to time.
"Are there really that many people for which this is the case?”
If you write for the New York Times, it’s clearly the case, the rest of us? Yeah, there are a few. I live in a heavily Jewish community and Jews are preponderantly very liberal, so they prattle on a lot, but not that many of them can’t have a civil discussion and keep friendships. I just have zero interest in discussing politics with anybody I am dating before it gets truly serious. At that point, I suppose if they are going to insist on watching Colbert every night before going to sleep, or whatever it is that they watch, it. might become an issue.
Politics are for the voting booth and the internet. IRL is for more important stuff.
This seems connected tangentially to the story of the celebrity who won't date "woke" women.
On Plenty of Fish and OK Cupid, I see woke women all the time mentioning President Trump disparagingly and saying that his supporters shouldn't bother contacting them. Seems to me, then, that if you don't want "wokies" bothering you, simply post a profile picture of yourself wearing a MAGA hat...
I suspect that you are unlikely to meet someone of the opposite political spectrum - internet/long distance dating excepted.
If you live in the city, you are most likely a liberal and to the left of the political spectrum. In the country, the right.
Years ago, probably more than 20, I used to subscribe to the New York Review of Books. One time, I was skimming the classified ads in the back page and noticed the "personals." There was a column, "Women seeking men." That was back when the NYRB still thought there were two sexes. Anyway, I saw several ads describing the woman as"fun loving, etc." Each ended with "No Republicans."
What fun those must have been. I dropped my subscription soon after that.
I wouldn't expect a woman to share political beliefs. Women think differently, right to emotion with nothing abstracted away. So their planning isn't big and they tend left.
Look at Althouse. Really smart and a complete dope about politics.
"Do you think you could ever be married to, or in a long-term relationship with, someone with radically different political views from your own?"
Sure, as long as she doesn't vote for that crooked ass Hillary.
Usually you can bend somebody’s politics after a while to something more reasonable though. Most liberals have never heard any of the counter arguments. They only go really off the rails when they isolate themselves.
“Sure if [he or she] wasn’t an ass about it”
So pithy and spot on. Words to live by, but large chunks of America have lost touch with this eminently sensible idea.
"My answer was 'Sure, if he wasn't an ass about it.'"
Good answer, and a practical point of view.
Being an ass about it describes American politics today, completely.
That’s the main problem we have today, I always say. I can deal with differing opinions, it’s the contempt and ad hominem that turns me off.
I only see young women and most of them don't follow politics except they've been told that Trump is bad in some way. They like me despite my political views, which they have no idea about because I don't discuss that subject when I am with them. Who wants to hear that shit when you have a plethora of interesting subject matters to bring up (who just got out of jail, for example)
THEOLDMAN
About 15 years ago, I met someone online and we hit it off well in emails, then around the third or fourth exchange, just before proposing an in-person meeting, I said, "You'd probably find me conservative by New York standards."
That was it, I never heard from her again.
Granddaughter: Grandpa, why do you see young girls?
Me: Because I don't want to get married again.
Granddaughter: I don't understand.
Me: Women closer to my age want to get married. I don't. Young women don't want to marry ME.
Granddaughter: (Light comes on). Oh, I get it now.
Checking your normblog profile, I am reminded of nina's blog, which I've not visited in years. Things have changed for her. What beautiful grandchildren.
Come to think about it, being an ass about anything is a dating deal breaker. Amiright?
46 years married in March (Bragging, not complaining!)
My wife and I have different political views especially about local politics.
I don't remember specifically discussing it but early on we basically agreed not to discuss politics. When one of us gets really annoyed by one boneheaded politician or the other we do sometimes vent and the other just says "Yes, dear." and lets them go without paying any attention.
When we got married she was very religious. Still is. I tried to go to church with her a few times but really didn't like it. She never nagged, never even invited me to come to church, we just went our separate ways. Kids were very involved with the church and I raised no objection, figuring it couldn't hurt and might help.
After about 15 years or her quietly setting the example, I woke up one Saturday with an urge to go with her. Been going every Sabbath ever since. Doesn't hurt, does a lot of good.
John Henry
Wasn't there an episode of Curb where Larry turned down a opportunity to have Sex with some actress because she was a Bush supporter.
How twisted does one have to be to turn down sex, not a relationship, just sex, on the basis of politics?
John Henry
I am reading Amity Schlaes latest book "The Great Society"
When Nixon got elected, he asked Daniel Patrick Moynihan to work for him. DPM was a tenured professor at Harvard at the time. The other faculty was REALLY upset not that he accepted, not that he was considering taking the job, but that it had even been offered.
Upset to the point where they told their kids not to talk to his kids.
What a bunch of sickos.
John Henry
All of this is by way of saying that "Sure, if they aren't an ass about it" is a pretty good response.
Pretty much the way I feel.
John Henry
I was kind of surprised that it’s not that hard to date younger women, but I still prefer women roughly my age.
I've been divorced for about two years now. Dated some younger women, some my age. You don't talk politics until after sex. And then you should see the look on their faces when they realize they just slept with a Trump voter, and actually had a great time.
Swear this is true. I was Laying in bed next to a 35 year old who refereed to Chick-Fil-A as "Hate Chicken". Phone rang, it was my brother. When I hung up she asked, "Who was that?". I replied, "It was Donald Trump. He just wanted to tell my I was doing a fantastic job and that I was making Wisconsin Great Again."
I refused to date Gwyneth Paltrow because of her politics.
I refused to date Brie Larson because of her politics.
Wait a minute, Aunty Trump is a man?
"Sure, as long as she doesn't vote for that crooked ass Hillary."
A sense of humor is vital:)
"Wait a minute, Aunty Trump is a man?"
That depends on what your definition of the word "is" is.
I refuse to date Gwyneth Paltrow because of all the wierd stuff I might find in her vagina.
John Henry
The coded message to the NYT readers is that they should be doing this.
If it were "frowned upon" by the left, the NYT would write articles about shaming people who do.
I don’t date lefty chicks. Crazy I can handle - I’m actually a big fan of crazy and the crazy/hit matrix. 10/10 is the goal for me, and I’ve dated quite a few who hit that mark.
Ignorance is a whole ‘nother deal. Possibly the sexiest girl I’ve ever seen in person is a Bernie girl. And she has a ginormous crush on me. (Not bragging - I’m a handsome and sexy motherfucker. And humble!!) But it’s not gonna happen.
And here’s why: what if we’re going at it and she’s getting close - and at that moment, she screams out: ‘Seize the means of production!!’ I can’t risk that. Seriously.
After about 15 years or her quietly setting the example, I woke up one Saturday with an urge to go with her. Been going every Sabbath ever since. Doesn't hurt, does a lot of good.
This made my day, John Henry.
‘crazy/hot matrix’
The only asses I know are Democrats.
It would depend on how far different we are and on which topics. Plus, as Althouse said: Don't be an ass about the differences.
My husband and I agree mostly on all issues, but we do have areas of disagreement. I don't try to change his mind and he doesn't try to make me change to his point of view. It would be pointless to try anyway, since both of us are not going to be in the mood for a lecture or persuasion.
We will have discussions where I will say what I think about "X" and why. Not that I am right and He is wrong. Just...here is what I think. Take it or leave it. Not arguments. Rational adult discussions that don't last very long.
We agree to disagree.
Our biggest disagreement is that I love Calves Liver or Chicken Livers and he wants to barf at the thought of eating liver. :-D I can never persuade him that it is good. So. I eat it if/when he isn't home. Problem solved.
Aunty Trump is a woman, a character. I think that her drag on the cigarette causes me to write shorter, more pithy posts.
Shouting Thomas I'm 70.
Despite all the cheerleading articles you read on the internet, dating at 70 is ridiculous.
Well...dating at 70 versus dating at 20, you are doing it for somewhat different reasons. IMO it is more about finding someone who you feel compatible with, who you can enjoy being around and for good company and not just for the wild monkey sex. Just. Not. Just.
Part of that compatibility is, of course being congruent in political, religious and other important self selected attributes.
We have a friend-couple who met on E Harmony at the age of about 60. They have been married now for 15 years. Would never have met each other, except through the internet. Computer profiles, assuming you aren't lying, are actually a pretty good way to start out the dating process being compatible. Saves a lot of time.
There's a big difference between being "a character" and "having character".
You didn’t just assume my gender.
If they a signaling their political beliefs before the date, then they will likely be an ass about those political beliefs. When I was dating, I looked for signals they wanted to have sex.
My body, my choice.
Aunty Trump said...
I just say that they are all fucking scum, which I honestly believe, and leave it at that. I don’t go on dating sites, I prefer the old fashioned way of chatting up women in chance encounters, getting phone numbers. I may not have a date every weekend that way, but I am thinking that this improves the quality, so I have never run into one who babbles on about politics
Did I assume your gender? Yes, yes I did.
Don't be an ass about it also applies to people that you, for the most part, agree with. That doesn't pertain to my wife, but with my In-laws it's all politics all the time. It gets exhausting.
Reading all the comments on the different ALthouse posts today, I was saying "meh." Until I got to this one.
I reminds me of why I love this crowd so much.
John henry said...
Sounds like you two had the right priorities. (Or, priority: the family.) Great to hear.
I once dated a feminist. Once.
We worked in the same field and she liked The Simpsons, so it was worth a shot. It was the 90s, when it was getting cool to profess ambivalence about ones sexual orientation. I said there was no way I could contemplate sex with a man, not even at gunpoint, I'm just not wired biologically for that.
"That's not TOO homophobic," she replied. We didn't date for too long. Also, she didn't shave down there. Said in India the hairline from the privates to the belly was called "The Road to Pleasure."
"Do you screen potential dates or partners for their political beliefs? If so, how?"
Yes. By never, ever sleeping with a leftist woman - even the good looking ones!
They are woke and toxic.
A question/issue that never comes up if you date foreign women.
My advice is don’t argue. When tempted, just say You’re such a right-winger or You’re such a left-winger and leave it at that. Say it in a nice or humorous way.
I was divorced 10 years ago and started dating women on Match.com.
I paid attention to the section in which women described their politics as liberal, conservative or some other position. I did not discriminate on that basis. It helped me to prepare for the first date. (I described myself as having libertarian views).
A small minority of women wrote "No Republicans", but they didn't have to. Their profiles showed them to be obnoxious twits.
I met my wife five years ago on Match and we married a year ago. She described herself as liberal, but she is really a Life Long Democrat with many moderate common sense views. She votes Democrat most of the time because she believes in the honesty of the mainstream media. It is understandable but frustrating. So we rarely talk politics.
It’s not something you have to do if you’re on Facebook.
Bothe the far right and far left are “self screening”
When tempted, just say You’re such a right-winger or You’re such a left-winger and leave it at that. Say it in a nice or humorous way.
That's what I say to my left wing kids. They describe me as "to the right of Attila the Hun."
When we met and married in the '80s, my husband self-described as a liberal and I as a conservative. (He joked, "I love you despite your despicable political views, dear".) Now we both self-describe as deplorables.
The interesting thing is that fundamental political views haven't changed much for either of us in the time between then and now.
For most of human history, it was taboo to mate outside your faith. If you run into somebody who is so committed to their politics that it overcomes sexual attraction, you may be dealing with a religious fanatic rather than a political one.
Most of my best lifelong friends are Trump supporters just like you people. I think this whole great divide is way overblown just like everything else in the fake news media onslaught of 24 hour internet access to drivel
Doc Mike deserves a gold star 4 raising up his progressive children right in spite of his own Cro-Magnon right wing opinions.
I used to have a good friend who was far left (I'm hard right). He cut off all contact because I supported Trump.
I've run in circles that are usually more left-leaning, so I learned to keep my mouth shut to keep the peace.
This sounds like another offshoot of men won’t date woke/feminists.
John henry said...
Upset to the point where they told their kids not to talk to his kids.
What a bunch of sickos.
John Henry
1/24/20, 7:12 AM
Well, remember that old saying: Conservatives think liberals are misinformed but liberals think conservatives are evil.
Hard to build a live with someone when they think you are evil.
Howard said...
Doc Mike deserves a gold star 4 raising up his progressive children right in spite of his own Cro-Magnon right wing opinions.
Only half, Howard. The other half are Neanderthals. My most right wing son is the only one who owns his house. Also the only one without a bachelors. Total is five and three step kids. The two lawyers are lefties, of course, sort of like Chuck but not as obnoxious.
My ex-wife was a lot more liberal (not leftist, liberal) than I was, but we agreed on many issues as well. Our political differences didn't contribute to our eventual divorce, though. My current girlfriend responded to a Tinder profile which included the warning (I live in Portland, OR after all) "I am not a liberal. if that's a dealbreaker, better to know now."
We haven't discussed politics at all, but I know at least that she isn't a progtard who can't abide the idea of Trump voters even existing, much less dating one.
For me, it's a question of emotions, passion, love. And I think it's a physical attraction. There's enough animal in me that I respond to the smell of a woman. If she's right, she's right. If she's not, I don't feel it.
I've dated liberal women. My first girlfriend was Jewish. We really came from different worlds. I had a passionate love for her.
Some people want to date people who are similar to themselves. Same jobs, same beliefs, same religion, same politics, same everything. That always seemed kind of weird to me. Like when Brad Pitt dated Gwyneth Paltrow and they got the same haircut. Just creep me out, why don't you. I like opposites, damn it.
It's a good idea before you have sex to have a discussion about an unplanned pregnancy, and what you would do. And if you're not ready for that discussion, you're not ready to have sex.
"I wouldn't want to belong to any country club that would have someone like me as a member", so the old joke went. And I wouldn't want to date any female that decided she only wanted left-wingers. Talk about odd.
Of course, that's all part of the Crazy Hot chick analysis. How hot does she have to be before her lunacy becomes unbearable?
"I wouldn't want to belong to any country club that would have someone like me as a member", so the old joke went. And I wouldn't want to date any female that decided she only wanted left-wingers. Talk about odd.
Of course, that's all part of the Crazy Hot chick analysis. How hot does she have to be before her lunacy becomes unbearable?
"My answer was 'Sure, if he wasn't an ass about it.'"
The problem is that I am that obnoxious about it. Imagine being married to Chuck ARM, or, shudder, Inga. Constantly parroting left wing propaganda by the MSM as gospel truth. I could probably handle a life long Democrat who kept quiet about her politics and her voting, and allowed the occasional political rant by yours truly. Now, when I rant, my partner tells me to shut up, she is bored, and she well knows how how much Democrats, and their propaganda arm, the DNC, are lying POSs. Just don’t lecture her on it. She isn’t stupid, and don’t try to school her on that subject. Which is fine, because she routinely shuts down our conversations on those grounds - that I am trying to school her on some topic or another. Interestingly in her previous marriage, she was the political one, and was flabbergasted that her ex actually voted of Obama. He had a business to run, girlfriends to bed, etc, and didn’t have time for politics. In reality, he was pretty conservative politically, esp having been an entrepreneur from the age of maybe 14, but never gave it enough thought, and, thus let the MSM decide his vote for him.
My previous GF, a tree hugging activist attorney (worked for the EPA before Justice Gorsuch’s former step father took it over, under Reagan, then moved to working for the state of TX), mostly we didn’t talk politics, but when my liberal brother, and his even more progressive wife, joined us for dinner, it was unbearable. The entire dinner involved “shrub” (Bush 43) jokes, and insider smirks about this faux political scandal or another involving Republicans. And then I broke her heart by moving to AZ, leaving her behind. A lot to like about her (for example, she, just like my mother, was second in her class in HS, swore that that wouldn’t happen again, and it didn’t, both valedictorians of their large state universities that they attended). But I couldn’t accept her politics, or that she wouldn’t accept my flying back to CO every other weekend to parent my kid (my partner wouldn’t even give a guy who wouldn’t do that a first date with her). I really liked her, but those were deal breakers. And after that, any whiff of progressive orientation in the women I was dating made it a last date. I could keep my mouth shut during dating and if she couldn't, I was out of there.
So now, my partner lets me fill out her absentee ballots, telling me that I know how she wants to vote, and I do. We are not quite to the place where she allows me to sign her ballots, but maybe with a bit more practice forging her signature, she will.
Boy, there are going to be a lot spinsters on the Left, or a lot liars.
“That's what I say to my left wing kids. They describe me as "to the right of Attila the Hun."”
That is what my mainstream Republican parents said of me. My next brother is maybe even more conservative than I, or at least more libertarian (I gave him a Hayek book he wanted for Christmas this year), but isn’t as vocal about it as I am. So I was the Attila the Hun member of the family. The next one is the liberal married to the fire breathing progressive mentioned above, and the youngest a non-political LLR who sometimes taunts me about supporting Trump after the MSM accuses him doing something horrible, like putting babies in cages, etc. He is just riling next up. I think.
Bruce Hayden said...
So now, my partner lets me fill out her absentee ballots, telling me that I know how she wants to vote, and I do. We are not quite to the place where she allows me to sign her ballots, but maybe with a bit more practice forging her signature, she will.
1/24/20, 11:41 AM
If she routinely votes Democrat, you both should just save your time/effort on completing the absentee ballot. The DNC and their minions are more than happy handle it for you...
“ Boy, there are going to be a lot spinsters on the Left, or a lot liars”
Definitely a lot of spinsters. Probably a lot of liars too.
“If she routinely votes Democrat, you both should just save your time/effort on completing the absentee ballot. The DNC and their minions are more than happy handle it for you...”
She doesn’t. That was my GF in TX, a bit over 20 years ago. Both of us claim never to have voted for a Democrat in our lives (maybe, on my part - I may have voted for a Democrat state representative who I knew personally and liked, several decades ago). She lets me fill out her ballot because it is just like mine. Which means that I get to vote twice, and our votes don’t cancel each other’s out. Which is why she can get me to shut up about politics. I would be preaching to the choir, and she finds that boring. We are both very happy with the situation.
Politics and religion aren’t important topics for me.
I could be married to anyone as long as their political and religious beliefs aren’t central to their lives.
I once dated a young woman whose father was a former B-52 crew member (navigator, IIRC).
He still had his SAC crewcut at about 55 years of age, and was extremely intimidating.
He told me to take care of his daughter on our date.
I did.
Does this count as determining a political viewpoint before dating?
I like this avatar because it keeps me from over using exclamation points.
I also once had a girlfriend, back in the ‘70s, who when having a cigarette, would get a twinkle in her eye, crack a smile while taking a drag, and say funny stuff while exhaling.
Haha. I'm guessing some commenters might dispute that you held to your normblog profile. Not me! (you're great Meade!)
You had me at breasts, pussy... hat. If it were only that simple.
The amount of time people spend absorbed in politics far, far outweighs the impact it has on our day-to-day activities.
Get a life already.
He told me to take care of his daughter on our date. I did.
"I've got a .45 and a shovel."
I've had casual relationships with people who drink the Statist Kool Aid, but I could never marry one, or live with one. There's something about someone wanted to use force on me and steal my stuff that's a real turn-off.
"How important are a person’s politics when you’re dating or beginning a relationship?"
In the past, not so important; now, critically important. Progressivism poisons everything, even love. One day you're great, the next you're a white nationalist transphobic racist. Progs can't help but be an ass about it. The hot-crazy matrix needs amending.
So: if your date lines up slightly to the left of Mayor Pete, measure carefully.
John H:
"I refuse to date Gwyneth Paltrow because of all the wierd stuff I might find in her vagina."
Even if you can smell it ahead of time?
Not on the dating market. But, if I were, I would not date anyone "woke".
She wants to disagree with me, and debate it? Awesome!
She wants to put on her "moral superiority vagina hat"? FOAD.
more of the same,
https://theothermccain.com/2020/01/24/why-does-victoria_spratt-hate-men/
I'm contra most relationships - I'm a Trump supporter, he is a diehard Democrat (NOT a Lefty, but...more Dem by heritage and habit).
For him, like with most on the Left, their sense of being a 'good person' is intimately tied to their vote choice. Only one time, when Anderson was running, did he not vote Dem. Couldn't vote Jimmuh (even he could tell that he was a dunderhead), couldn't bring himself to vote GOP. So, we agreed to waste our vote. So, indirectly, we were responsible for Reagan's election. It still tickles me.
I carefully avoid talking about politics at home. The funny thing is, when he expresses opinions, he is generally somewhat conservative. It's just the label. He has bought into the belief that Republicans are EVIL, and their supporters are:
- Racist
- Evil, or
- Stupid
Or, all 3. It just kills him that I won't say "yes, dear" and vote his way. I don't put up signs or bumper stickers, seldom say much to him, but, it still bothers him.
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