August 11, 2019

The end of art: "We have so many mentally deranged people out there. We do not want a movie that will give them any ideas."



I'm objecting to the big proposition: There are so many mentally deranged people out there, so let's censor anything that will give them any ideas.

I wish people would listen to what they are saying.

Now, maybe there's a nuanced smaller proposition that isn't the antithesis of freedom of speech. Is there a very particular sort of person (as opposed to the "mentally deranged people," which could be millions of us) and a very particular sort of graphic presentation (as opposed to whatever gives "any ideas")?

This reminds me of the anti-pornography movement of the late 80s and early 90s. The assertion was: Ban all graphic depiction of sex because it is causally connected to rape:
Robin Morgan summarizes this idea with her often-quoted statement, "Pornography is the theory, and rape is the practice."

Anti-pornography feminists charge that pornography eroticizes the domination, humiliation, and coercion of women, and reinforces sexual and cultural attitudes that are complicit in rape and sexual harassment. [Catharine] MacKinnon argued that pornography leads to an increase in sexual violence against women through fostering rape myths. Such rape myths include the belief that women really want to be raped and that they mean yes when they say no. Additionally, according to MacKinnon, pornography desensitizes viewers to violence against women, and this leads to a progressive need to see more violence in order to become sexually aroused, an effect she claims is well documented.
There's very little enthusiasm today about banning pornography, even with a heightened awareness and activism about rape. Why? I'd guess it's because pornography is so important to the people who consume it, because it's so widely and easily available that it can't be stopped, and because real-life experience doesn't seem to bear out the the causal connection. But it's possible that we actually care about freedom of speech.

These days, the issue is violence, specifically gun violence, and the would-be censors are talking about movies and video games. But they haven't been talking about government regulation. They're just using speech against speech. And that's how free-speech works. There's outrage expressed in social media, and the big corporation voluntarily withdraws the film: "Universal Scraps 'The Hunt' Release Following Gun Violence Uproar."
The studio's decision came a day after President Trump took aim at the film, saying it was "made to inflame and cause chaos." The story follows a group of elites hunting "deplorables" for sport.

The studio's Saturday announcement came a day after President Donald Trump took aim at the film — though he didn't name its title — and Hollywood, saying on Twitter, "Liberal Hollywood is Racist at the highest level, and with great Anger and Hate! They like to call themselves “Elite,” but they are not Elite. In fact, it is often the people that they so strongly oppose that are actually the Elite. The movie coming out is made in order to inflame and cause chaos. They create their own violence, and then try to blame others. They are the true Racists, and are very bad for our Country!"
Now, many people speak against Trump's speech, and they argue a causal connection to violence. They would like him to voluntarily shut up. But he won't.

To state the obvious: The speech we hear is the speech of those who speak. Silence only creates better conditions for the speech of those who speak to be heard.

Just last night, Meade and I were talking about the old adage, "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything." You don't hear that one too much anymore, perhaps because all the people who live by that rule are invisible.

IN THE COMMENTS: John Henry quotes something that I brought up in the conversation Meade and I had last night — the famous counter-aphorism attributed to Alice Roosevelt Longworth, "If you don’t have anything nice to say, come sit next to me." I said it was something she had emblazoned on a throw pillow. So let's read what Quote Investigator has to say about it:
The earliest evidence located by QI was published in a magazine profile of Alice Roosevelt Longworth titled “The Sharpest Wit in Washington” published in “The Saturday Evening Post” issue of December 4, 1965. Interestingly, the expression was not spoken; instead, it was embroidered on a pillow. Also, the word “good” was used instead of “nice”....
We walked to Mrs. Longworth’s upstairs sitting room, where she often reads until six o’clock in the morning. Books were piled everywhere on the tables and on the floor, and contemporary newspaper clippings were strewn on the side tables. Coyote skins were lying on the backs of two large, comfortable chairs, and on one of the chairs was a pillow with the words, IF YOU CAN’T SAY SOMETHING GOOD ABOUT SOMEONE, SIT RIGHT HERE BY ME.
So it's not "nice" but "good," and it's also specifically "about someone."
Longworth definitely popularized the expression, and she may have crafted it. There is no substantive evidence that Dorothy Parker employed the saying though it has been attributed to her in recent decades....

In July 1966 the popular syndicated columnist Earl Wilson printed an instance of the saying with the word “nice” instead of “good”... "Hope Diamond was invited to a society dinner where the hostess said. 'If you can’t say anything nice about anyone, sit next to me.'"...

In 1986 the columnist Liz Smith writing in “The San Francisco Chronicle” discussed a forthcoming novel by Gore Vidal called “Empire” which included a fictional version of Longworth: "… the famous Alice Roosevelt, who eventually, as Mrs. Longworth, came to be known as the creator of the expression: 'If you can’t think of anything nice to say about anybody, come right over here and sit by me!'"...

In 2007 USA Today published a review of a biography about Alice Roosevelt Longworth, and the accompanying picture showed Longworth sitting next to message-bearing pillow....

It's kind of the motto of Twitter, no?

ADDED: Here's the Disney version of the original aphorism:



ALSO: gilbar connects "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything" to my oft-repeated aphorism "Better than nothing is a high standard." I'd already thought of the similarity, but there's a very important difference. I never said that only niceness is better than nothing! Many uncomfortable and even cruel things are better than nothing. And it should be noted that I did not say you should only speak when what you have to say is better than saying nothing. I don't believe that. Sometimes it's your turn to speak, and you shouldn't clam up and be taciturn, even if you believe that "better than nothing is a high standard" and you know you're not going to hit the high standard. Also, it's worth noting that the proposition — "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything" — does not mean that if you do have something nice to say, you should say it. Some of that nice crap is too boring or phony to be worth saying.

147 comments:

AlbertAnonymous said...

Relax Professor, no one is talking about taking away your speech. We’re just talking about some common sense speech control. How could anyone disagree with that....

gilbar said...

You make a good point
The Hunt would have been a Different Movie, if they were raping the deplorables before killing them

Howard said...

Real normals can't get an erection for a deplorables. Somebody desperate enough might roll the Trumpster in flour and aim for the wet spot

gilbar said...

, "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything.
Better than nothing is a high standard.

Michael K said...

Blogger Howard said...
Real normals can't get an erection for a deplorables. Somebody desperate enough might roll the Trumpster in flour and aim for the wet spot


Howard is so disappointed that The Hunt is not coming to his favorite theater. Maybe he can get the DVD and self abuse at home.

traditionalguy said...

Hollywood arranged to cancel this one itself. The Hunt's problem was that it was more of a cover up. It replaced the traditional hunted and sacrificed animals with the Deplorable everyday American citizens. The European Aristocracy privilege has been hunts of stolen children on secluded estates. But that gives away the store right when the Epstein Island Saga is already blowing their cover. Evil Privilege is as ugly as it gets.

Mr. Forward said...

What I learned from Netflix.
If you are an assassin, it’s really hard to retire.

Matt Sablan said...

Honestly, I just don't think they thought the movie would make money, and this was a good way out.

John henry said...

If you don't have something nice to say about people come sit next to me.

Alice Roosevelt

Bill, Republic of Texas said...

But why this movie was cancelled. Hollywood makes hundreds of very violent movies every year and most of them around gun violence.

My guess is the movie had 1 or 2 sympathetic deplorable characters and Hollywood thought that was 1 or 2 too many.

Or it really was obscene political violence pornography and went too far even for the psycho haters in Hollywood.

Fernandinande said...

These days, the issue is violence, specifically gun violence,

All violence is relatively low right now, and pretending that it's bad "these days" is just a scam. And deaths from "mass murders" and mass shootings are still statistically insignificant.

The funny thing is that almost all the variation in murder rates over time is due to the relatively very high black murder rate; the white murder rate decreased almost monotonically over the past 30 years or so.

Amadeus 48 said...

This whole controversy is a sign of our times, where the protocol appears to be “ready, fire, aim”.

What do you think this movie was about? I don’t know, but this is what I predict:

A bunch of rich, heartless globalists have a secret hunting preserve where elaborate hunts are conducted with human prey. The prey are people with ugly, anti-social attitudes: homophobics, neo-Nazis, nationalists of various stripes, and anti-abortion activists. Included in this batch of deplorables is a smokin’ hot blonde victim of identity theft who happens to be former military and is a killing machine. In civilian life, she has all the right attitudes, but she has been mistakenly or evilly included in this batch of prey, probably by RUSSIANS. Over the course of one hour and 40 minutes she sorts things out. All of her fellow prey deserve to die and do die, together with the hunters and Hillary Swank.

Now you don’t need to see the movie.

Kevin said...

Silence only creates better conditions for the speech of those who speak to be heard.

The media is shouting to ensure the President can’t be easily heard.

They’re deathly afraid people might hear what he says without distortion or filtering.

whitney said...

You know what other adage you don't hear anymore, 'life's not fair'

Temujin said...

I'm a deplorable and after watching 2 trailers, I would have wanted to see the movie. From what I saw, and I could be wrong- it made both sides look bad and bloodied. Sure it's extreme.

If we've reached the point (and we might have) where a movie like this has to be removed for fear that our 'citizens' are so incapable of resisting the allure to go 'hunting' those who disagree, then we are all deranged. We've all turned into James Hodgkinson so quickly I barely had time to finish my breakfast.

If we've reached that point, we need to look fast and hard at what our schools and internet are doing to the minds of this country. We've always been a country loaded with guns. We've never had to fear ourselves on this level before (not counting slavery and Jim Crow, of course). Not in modern times.

Also- the movie was partially written by Damon Lindelof, who also wrote the HBO show "The Leftovers" a few years ago and I though that was very unique, creative, and well written.

Fernandinande said...

My guess is the movie had 1 or 2 sympathetic deplorable characters and Hollywood thought that was 1 or 2 too many.

My guess is that the cancellation is part of an advertising campaign. (30% confidence, ±70%)

Howard said...

Doc Mike has developed a masturbation fantasy fetish. It's proven science that latent homosexuality expresses itself more overtly during the early stages of dementia.

Fernandinande said...

If the cancellation is not part of an advertising campaign, it's from fear of (bogus) lawsuits.

rhhardin said...

The Hunt looked from the trailer like it had an unbearably stupid plot. Same thing over and over to feature length. shoot run hide shoot run hide shoot run hide.

No car chases to make it interesting.

Narayanan said...

I got impression from trailer that in The Hunt - The Deplorables strike back! and win(?)

It wasn't clear though if Deplo have been disarmed!?

Opportunity to national conversation thwarted.

Side note : Sci-fi by Elizabeth Moon : The Hunting Party.

narciso said...

I remember when they were making a fuss over Walker texas rangers, same people who were inspired by tarantino.

Howard said...

Blogger Fernandistein said..."these days" is just a scam. And deaths from "mass murders" and mass shootings are still statistically insignificant.

Now that's a winning strategy, go with that as the lede.

traditionalguy said...

The Dems and their Media arm preach gun control to protect this Elite Hunt Privilege from Deplorables. They remember well what the rabble of Deplorables did to the British Empires Officers and troops on April 19, 1775 on their return march from North Bridge in Concord, Massachusetts to Lexington and Boston. They have never gotten over it. And that was only the first of 1100 engagements in 8 years where the weapons that the British wanted confiscated killed the SOBs.

Annie C. said...

Making the movie was dumb. Cancelling the movie was dumb.

On the other hand, at least it's not a remake of Home Alone.

Was the idea for this film influenced by the popularity of Game of Thrones? Is it an SJW wet dream?

rhhardin said...

The question is did it have tits. How strong is the woke movement these days.

Fernandinande said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Fernandinande said...

Now that's a winning strategy, go with that as the lede.

I choose facts over truth, so to speak.

"during 2017, mass shootings made up 0.7 percent off all homicides." It's actually around 2-3% since they used the rather bogus "Mother Jones" database.

Darrell said...

Damon Lindelof is a nut and a weirdo. You can catch the new HBO Watchmen if you want to see him ruin a story.

Fernandinande said...

Game of Home Alone.

Enlighten-NewJersey said...

Because one can yell “fire” in a crowded theater does’t make it any less deplorable when someone does and causes people to be trampled to death in the panic to get out. This is true even if the purpose was to make art or a movie of the action. Just because you can do something legally doesn’t mean you should and it’s perfectly legal to tell someone to knock it off, that’s free speech too.

policraticus said...

This seems like bullshit . John Wick 3 came out on May 17th and has made over $300 M. If violence is so triggering, where are the calls for it to be pulled from theaters and the profits used to toughen gun control?

It has nothing to do with the violence depicted in The Hunt, it has to do with the movie's purported plot. Decadent members of the coastal One Percent kidnap average down at the heels Americans (Deplorables, if you will) and release them somewhere in Croatia where they intend to hunt them for sport. Things go sideways when, quel surpise, it turns out that the Deplorables know a thing or two about self defense, fire arms, and combat tactics. That, at least, is what I got from the trailer.

The idea that it is being pulled because Fox viewers were offended or because blue checkmark twitter have their hair on fire over gun violence in movies is laughable. It isn't a movie that I'd watch. Maybe it is a terrible film that was going to be an embarrassment and lose even more of the studio's money. That doesn't seem implausible. More plausible is that a movie where ordinary, ignorant rubes from no account red states usually seen only from 30k feet, get the better of sophisticated elites who are no doubt lining up behind Warren, Harris or Buttigieg sends the wrong message. No one among the Woke wants the hoi polloi to leave the theater with the thought, "You know how it seems like the good and the great seem to hate us? How they are happy to use our most vulnerable daughters as sex slaves? Yeah, I bet the would hunt us for sport, if they could. But we'll show them. Trump 2020!"

EdwdLny said...

"If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything." The libs then, would have nothing to say. More seriously though, the efforts at shocking the public with vile and hateful speech too often over rides common decency and sense. As far as the movie, it will turn up again before very long. The inexpensive PR precludes it from being shelved for very long. That old adage, there is no bad publicity, or words to that effect applies.

jaydub said...

To me the problem with this movie is that is just one more step in the othering and dehumanizing of us "deplorables" who had the audacity to vote for the elected candidate. At one time we could have an election where the WH changed hands without tens of thousands of pussy hatted marxists trying to disrupt the inauguration, with the FBI/CIA/DOJ staying neutral, with the press displaying at least a modicum of non partisanship, without 90% of the federal government employees trying to obstruct the president's every move, without the judge-shopped courts intervening in every executive order, without celebrities incessantly trashing the president, without the opposition party in congress pushing for impeachment even before the inauguration and without a single offense specified, by the opposition party declaring themselves to be resistance gorillas, without the resistance encouraging their followers to harass and intimidate members of the administration and supporters wherever they are found, without a congressional softball team being shot up, without the opposition party doxxing and threatening donors and supporters of the president's party, without a three years long persecution of the president based on trumped up garbage put forth by the election's losing candidate, without comedians holding up the severed heads, and without an opposition party storm trooper cadre such as ANTIFA. This has no more to do with free speech than does yelling "fire" in a crowded theater. It's time to put a stop to the bullshit because enough is enough. I spent 26 years in the military, but never owned a personal firearm. I just bought three. This latest outrage may just be the hill to die on.

Shane said...

How easily and frequently "we" is quietly converted to what is always meant: "me/I".

"WE have so many mentally deranged people out there. WE do not want a movie that will give them any ideas. I'm happy that they decided to pull it. If that makes ME stupid..."

Laslo Spatula said...

I have no problem with the movie coming out.

I do feel it let's a bit more of the mask slip, though: despite whatever 'twist' that inevitably will occur at the end that negates the wish fulfillment of the preceding minutes, it is still an 'us vs. them' where the 'them' deserve what they get, just not as obviously as the hunting analogy.

My take: after the film comes out, replace 'deplorables' with 'illegal immigrants' or 'homeless' and see if the scales of drama still balance.

I am Laslo.

Jeff Brokaw said...

The fact that Hollywood green-lighted this movie in the first place is the far bigger issue, and tells us it could not possibly have been respectful of “the deplorables” in any way, despite protests that it was actually critical of the other side. Come on.

Hollywood hates everything about all of those people, remember? Nobody in Hollywood would go forward with a project that helps Trump in any possible way in 2019. That’s laughable.

Laslo Spatula said...

The film may be a metaphor for America, but the closest film metaphor for Hollywood is "The Human Centipede."

I am Laslo.

Fernandinande said...

Decadent members of the coastal One Percent kidnap average down at the heels Americans (Deplorables, if you will) and release them somewhere in Croatia where they intend to hunt them for sport.

That's almost the plot of "Hostel"; "a mysterious group that tortures and kills kidnapped backpackers" in Slovakia.

rhhardin said...

Some 50s TV show was my hate-it format. The hero was wounded and had to make it up several flights of stairs. It was a full show of groaning and working up the stairs, the same set used for every landing of every floor.

They still make movies like that. Gravity (2013) being a recent instance. But it can be anything, stuck in a desert without water, ..., that goes on and on to feature length.

Lurker21 said...

Annie C. said...
Making the movie was dumb. Cancelling the movie was dumb.


Agreed. Making a fuss over the movie was very dumb and doesn't do those who started the fuss any credit, but if it came out, it's not like the picture would have made the world a better place.

The controversy does give a lesson about the "culture of complaint." People are so used to complaining about things that they miss distinctions in tone and don't see that not everything is directed against them.

Is this the "End of Art?" People's attitude to Hollywood is like their attitude to Washington DC. Washington puts out so much BS and hypocrisy that people don't believe anything coming out of the capital anymore, and Hollywood peddles and recycles so much schlock that people can't take talk about art very seriously when it comes out of Filmtown.

Laslo Spatula said...

I am waiting for the film about Harvey Weinstein where the twist at the end is that his victims come forward and ask for Harvey to receive mercy, because all of their lives have been better, richer and more glamorous since their encounters with him.

Kinda like "An Officer and a Gentlemen" with Harvey as a metaphorical tough-love drill instructor of Hollywood boot-camp.

I am Laslo.

Fernandinande said...

I read about one racist movie where some big well-fed white Americans killed a whole bunch of dinky Japanese people using a secret weapon.

Danno said...

This movie only reinforces that the elite hate anyone they consider deplorable. This attitude can only make the fly-overs even more amenable to the idea that the only good elite is a dead elite.

Maybe someone should turn off the electrical power to the elite cities for a few weeks. It might be less bloody than an all-out war.

rhhardin said...

Newer hate-it variant: the distant disaster being averted diverted with a million political and psychological difficulties, one for each episode. Salvation (2017-2018)

You're hooked on armageddon and all you get is psychological breakdowns and power plays.

On DVD at least you can skip to the last disc and verify that you did well to skip to the last disc.

Ignatius Acton Chesterton OCD said...

AA: “I’m objecting to the big proposition: There are so many mentally deranged people out there, so let's censor anything that will give them any ideas.”

I agree completely.

That said, if you consider the “wisdom” if these so-called “red flag” laws, they are also a big proposition I completely disagree with.

In terms of practical application of American law, “red flag” laws are a nightmare. For such laws to work, due process would have to be “expedited.” Yep, the trolls, wizards and fairies who make the court system work — with their banker’s hours, holidays, vacation days, slothful pace of proceedings, etc. — they’re going to be at your beck and call when it’s time to take your nephew Timmy’s weapons. Yeah, it’ll be like emergency dentistry when you wake up at 3:00 AM with an excruciating abscess.

There is no way to implement these genius “red flag” laws without ignoring due process in taking someone's rights. Aside from the Salem-style hearsay and incentives for anti-gun nut-jobs to make shit up, how are the courts going to identify “red flag” standards of “insanity, derangement or otherwise?” Insane. I object to the big proposition here. It’s empowering the most emotionally sensitive and fragile t9 be deputized to take people’s rights because something doesn’t feel right — a “red flag.” Give me a break.

And let’s be clear: this is not a “Do Not Fly List” where you deny someone boarding an airplane. Someone would have to go to the person’s house and take their weapons. Any volunteers?

“Red flag” advocates don’t care about these considerations. They see them as “common sense gun laws.” If only sense were so common.

The reasoning is the same. And the practical expediting of due process is a ridiculous figment of every “red flag” advocate’s imagination. It’s magical, enchanted government. It simply does not exist. It’s as stupid as censoring “The Hunt,” and as damaging to the rights of the great multitude of non-deranged people out here.

It’s time that rational adults started treating the First and Second Amendments the same.

rhhardin said...

The Hunt II will be better.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

Isn't the Hunt specifically about democrats hunting Republicans?

Let the leftwing hate fly free.

elkh1 said...

There may not be "so many" deranged people, but there are enough that every time a mass murder occurred, it was perpetrated by a deranged person.

There are "so many" fascists calling themselves anti-fascists, they attack people with impunity. They don't need any ideas, or what they consider "tacit approval", or a playbook to justify what they are already doing.

No, we don't need stupid movies to justify vicious people's contempt for the law, contempt for other people's life and liberty.

Fernandinande said...

Game Of Hunt Alone II: the dead people return as zombies.

Leland said...

I don't care if the movie is played or not. When you break it down; it is no more horrible than other horror movies, and those who would seek inspiration from such a movie will find it another movie.

My issue is this movie was being put out by Hollywood at the same time many members of Hollywood were claiming Trump was inspiring violence. Further, the description of the movie is similar to an event held by E. Jean Carroll along with her friend Lisa Birnbach called assassin. These were people recently claiming Trump committed rape in a store.

And if that wasn't deranged enough; the current elite story of the movie is Trump supporters should be embracing the movie because while they are being hunted; they end up being the heroes. To me, it is like saying the Jews should be happy about WWII because ultimately the Nazis lost.

Make your movies, put them out there, but stop with the absurd attempts at gaslighting. We see what's going on and are bored with it.

Michael K said...

That, at least, is what I got from the trailer.

Not what CTH script says. The Elites accidentally kidnap another elite, who wins in the end. The Deplorables are all dead. Happy ending, you know.

rhhardin said...

Disaster movie, they're escaping, the child runs off. This is for the women in the audience.

Tiring formulas. We can't think of anything to do with these 30 minutes.

Fernandinande said...

I wonder if "Hostel" lead to an outburst of deranged people not staying in hostels. It could happen!

rhhardin said...

Horror movies don't work. I see the set and the camera work. Oh this is supposed to be scarey.

There has to be a plot good enough so that that doesn't happen.

Fernandinande said...

We can't think of anything to do with these 30 minutes.

If they'd take off the fake glasses and get out of the fake rain they might be able to think better fake thoughts.

Jeff Brokaw said...

I agree with the argument that we should all be tolerant enough of ideas we don’t like and let all speech into the public square.

However, there is so much polarizing stupidity in the public square now, worthless crap that contributes nothing of value except more polarization... and the majority of that is encouraged and manufactured by our institutions (media, social media, Hollywood, DC, academia)... I think push-back against those institutions is not just a good idea, but mandatory because they are the biggest problem for free speech absolutists right now.

Matt Sablan said...

"Isn't the Hunt specifically about democrats hunting Republicans?"

-- If the leaked script is real, then no. It is about Democrats having their lives ruined by ignorant, lying deplorables on the Internet and getting revenge, only to find out that the only survivor -- the deplorable who is the best with the guns and the fighting and the survivalism -- is actually an elite that they mistook for a deplorable. So, in the end, everything is the fault of the lying deplorables who couldn't take a joke, and the victor is the only sane elite. It's just like in all those old TV shows and movies where the hippie peacenik who "doesn't like guns" does a whole bunch of trick shots better than the Army or police professionals even though they've never touched a weapon before.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

SO --Deplorables Bad. Deplorables BAD!

Hitlery lives.

pious agnostic said...

“We are each of an unsocial, taciturn disposition, unwilling to speak, unless we expect to say something that will amaze the whole room, and be handed down to posterity with all the eclat of a proverb.”

- Jane Austen, Pride and Prejudice

Matt Sablan said...

Really, I don't think there's any political motivation of "Trump Bad!" It's a pretty standard narrative. The bad guy feels slighted, goes crazy, and tries to murder all the people they feel slighted them. Normally, the good guys who win are the ones who slighted them the least or in a way that was deserving, or sometimes, they just "got the wrong guy."

The script was a relatively quick read, and honestly, it feels pretty unpolished. If the leaked script is the real script, I can believe they pulled it for fear of it sucking.

Lucien said...

One quote attributed to Lincoln is: “Nothing is often the best thing to do and almost always the best thing to say”. Which aligns with “Better than nothing is a high standard.”

Michael K said...

It's proven science that latent homosexuality expresses itself more overtly during the early stages of dementia.

Whatever you say, Howard. Were you the subject ? Asking for a friend. I did not realize self abuse was homosexuality, though. I guess you do it different.

Your Deplorable killing fetish will have to wait until Warren or Biden get into office. I'm sure they will show it in the White House like Wilson and "Birth of a Nation." Of course, that assumes facts not in evidence,

Matt Sablan said...

"That doesn't seem implausible. More plausible is that a movie where ordinary, ignorant rubes from no account red states usually seen only from 30k feet, get the better of sophisticated elites who are no doubt lining up behind Warren, Harris or Buttigieg sends the wrong message."

-- Except they don't. In fact, given the leaked script, for the most part, the deplorables are easily taken out by the elite hunters, except for the one who is actually a sane elite. It really is just a bad script.

mikee said...

"They are the true Racists, and are very bad for our Country!"

When Trump tweeted, about the Squad, that the vile anti-American lies of the Left "...will not be allowed to go unanswered" he won the 2020 election.

Matt Sablan said...

(Also, wasn't there a terrible Predator movie where terrible people were dropped on a planet and hunted by said Predators? It's basically that, but imagine if the one survivor turned out to be a secret Predator.)

Murph said...

In the way-way back, so long ago that kids actually read things on paper, I remember reading a short story for school English class titled "The Most Dangerous Game," about an island where humans were hunted by .. someone whom I can't remember much about.
Others here also have found similar plots in movies: so, the generic plot of humans hunting humans is not new by any means.
Given that the basic premise then is well-used, and that the "twist" [if you will] is the political aspect of the participants, I'd suggest that the commenter who suggested that the movie was designed to further de-humanize "deplos" is probably on target.
Whatshisname Castro did the same thing in an indirect way when he published names and addresses of Trump contributors, didn't he? He put figurative targets on them for use by "hunters" who might do them harm.
It's one of the left's preferred tactics, isn't it: a variation on Alinsky's 13th Rule?

Johnathan Birks said...

I'm a little surprised Ann didn't point out the wording of that Hollywood Reporter article. Trump didn't just criticize the film, he "took aim" at it. Like with an AR-15.

Rusty said...

Release it. Let the market place decide if it's any good.
Who knows. Maybe the left leaning beta males will jerk off to it and leave the rest of us alone. Only weak willed people are triggered by things like this.

Birkel said...

Hollyweird: Give up your guns.
Also Hollyweird: We are making a movie about hunting Deplorables.

Deplorables: Sod off, swampy.

Fernandinande said...

mentally deranged people

Rather than "red flag" behavior, be on the lookout "red hat" behavior.

Can Of Cheese for Hunter said...

OT: Warren's Ferguson lie should end her campaign.
Yeah - her lie is THAT bad.

Elizabeth Warren’s Ferguson Lie

buwaya said...

Pious agnostic, thanks for the bit of Austen.

Eclat is a good word. Nice and compact.
I will have to remember to use it.

Laslo Spatula said...

"Eclat is a good word. Nice and compact."

I thought 'eclat' was a group of eclairs.

I am Laslo.

Sebastian said...

"I wish people would listen to what they are saying."

And I wish headlines were accurate!

"for the most part, the deplorables are easily taken out by the elite hunters, except for the one who is actually a sane elite"

Whoa. Are we sure this is not a comedy? Like, a joke played on progs? I mean, "elite hunters," "sane elite," "deplorables are easily taken out"--that's funny stuff.

Bob Boyd said...

I don't believe the movie release was cancelled out of any sense of decency. You're telling me they only just thought of that?
More likely it was cancelled because of pressure and pleading from the Dems who knew it would hurt them, not help them, in 2020.

Matt Sablan said...

Sebastian: I'm not convinced the leaked script is the real script, that's how bad it is. To give you an example, one hunter warns the other that the soda he's about to drink is poisoned. He thinks she means it is LITERALLY poisoned to kill the people they're hunting. And she says no, it just has a bunch of terrible chemicals and sugar in it.

Like, I don't want to believe this is a real script. But, I've seen what really does get produced. So, shrug?

Bob Boyd said...

I thought 'eclat' was a group of eclairs.

I thought it was a cross between an eclair and a bearclaw.

Matt Sablan said...

... now I want a pastry.

Birkel said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Birkel said...

├ęclat

It has an accent.
Give me some freedom fries.

Seeing Red said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Matt Sablan said...

Just remember though: there was no issue releasing The Hunger Games and Battle Royale.

#Consistency. At least The Running Man had the evil government just be Over The Top Evil and didn't try and make it seem like any analogue to a real government ever.

Seeing Red said...

“The Hunt” is what happens when your Right to Bear Arms is taken away.

You’re turned into prey.

Seeing Red said...

And as my wise daddy said, The Second Amendment is there to protect the First.” Thats how important it is.

Man hasn’t changed. People who consider themselves your Kings are trying to realize it.

Darrell said...

And as my wise daddy said, The Second Amendment is there to protect the First.” Thats how important it is.

It protects ALL the others. Even the ones we don't like.

stevew said...

"We have so many mentally deranged people out there. We do not want a movie that will give them any ideas."

Truth in opposition to the facts. Certainly the people that have committed the high-profile shootings are mentally deranged but it is pretty well documented that most weren't incited by movies, politics, and speech. Sane people don't commit such acts. The only exceptions I can think of are the guy that shot up the softball game and nearly killed Rep. Scalise, and maybe the Giffords shooting.

Agree it was a dumb movie premise, equally dumb to be outraged about it, and doubly dumb to discontinue showing it. There's no shortage of dump social and political speech these days.

Beth B said...

Something I found interesting, I posted the official trailer of "The Hunt" on my Facebook page, in order to discuss it with my friends. Facebook promptly took it down for "nudity and sexual content." I appealed for a second look, since there is absolutely no nudity or sexual material in the preview. They immediately rejected it a second time, again on the grounds of nudity and sexual material.

I hadn't posted the trailer with commentary spinning some Trump-themed conspiracy theory. I posted it, noting it was the controversial movie people were already talking about all over the internet. Apparently, Facebook thought it was more important to preemptively silence the conversation of their members before anything too controversial could be said about the film, or at least keep them from having enough information to judge for themselves how they might feel about it.

Again, it wasn't censored because of violent content. They used the bullshit excuse that it was sexual material, which makes me wonder exactly what kind of physical reaction their team had to the idea of hunting down humans for political reasons. I find myself much more concerned that our social media masters are busy censoring the kind of content people can talk about on their platform in order to shape opinion. That seems much more insidious to me than a movie studio deciding to cut their losses once they figure out their "edgy" film is about to land like a turd in a punchbowl.

Gospace said...

The movie release was cancelled because it was going to bomb at the box office.

The brouhaha is to pretend it was cancelled from political pressure by the evil Trump and his deplorable supporters.

Some people, somewhere, have seen the full movie. It must be really bad for this decision to have been made. Sometime due to contractual obligations, a movie is released and shown in one theater for one showing. This movie isn't even getting that.

Bob Boyd said...

@Beth B

They know best. Just ask them.

Seeing Red said...

We have Truth behind us, Steven. Isn’t that what it’s all about?

Gospace said...

I didn't read what Bob Boyd said before I posted before. He may have a point:

More likely it was cancelled because of pressure and pleading from the Dems who knew it would hurt them, not help them, in 2020.

That would be a reason Hollyweird would cancel a release.

I vaguely recall that much to the surprise of Hollywood, The Hunger Games was perceived as an anti-liberal films. A movie where the deplorables are forced to fight and kill each other for the entertainment of the elite.... And in the end- all politicians turn out to be power hungry bad people.

Darrell said...

Kinda like "An Officer and a Gentlemen" with Harvey as a metaphorical tough-love drill instructor of Hollywood boot-camp.

Surely you mean Hollywood booty-camp . . .

jimbino said...

I say, "If you don't have something disagreeable to say, don't say anything at all." All conversation bereft of talk about religion, sex and politics would eventually drive me to mayhem and suicide.

bagoh20 said...

This is exactly the way free speech is supposed to work. It's a freedom, not a mandate. The people who used their free speech to come up with the stupid idea for the movie heard the free speech of those who disliked it, including people on their side. They voluntarily decided to not speak the dumbness, because it was an embarrassing hypocrisy for them. That was their self-interested decision. That's how free speech works. It doesn't mean you say everything you think of, it means you are free to say what you want to. They decided they didn't want to, and it took the free speech of others to show them their potential mistake. Stopping it wasn't so much an own-goal by the Right, but preventing an own goal by the Left. We help everyone, because we love. Both sides should be interested reducing the violent rhetoric, which is overwhelmingly from the Left.

I don't think the movie makers here give one shit about this movie causing violence against deplorable. Rather, they care how that would make them look. Good call.

Seeing Red said...

I vaguely recall that much to the surprise of Hollywood, The Hunger Games was perceived as an anti-liberal films. A movie where the deplorables are forced to fight and kill each other for the entertainment of the elite.... And in the end- all politicians turn out to be power hungry bad people.

My kidread the books and was excited to see the 1st movie.

I hated it. I tried to explain why, but until they more extensively covered history in HS she didn’t get it. Then she understood the parallels.

I haven’t changed my opinion. They want EUtopia but they always wake up in Lord of the Flies.

Earnest Prole said...

If words are violence then we must suppress them, by violence if necessary.

Seeing Red said...

Hollyweird is once again sending mixed messages. Can’t stop “Toxic Masculinity” if you keep churning out John Wick and F&F-type movies.

And women were supporting in The Marvel Universe.

Stu Grimshaw said...

Of course the movie stunk on ice. It had a late September release date. Hollywood always puts their low-budget turds into the sept-oct release window.

If the controversy hadn’t killed it before release, word of mouth would have killed it soon after. It wasn’t going to be a hit, so it wasn’t worth giving Trump a talking point.

Paul said...

I prefer we re-open insane asylums and those, after a mental evaluation with DUE PROCESS, who are schizophrenic, are put into the asylums.

In the 1950s that was done till they discovered the awful lobotomies they were doing on patients. They went to far releasing all the inmates!!!

A balance must be sought.

Gahrie said...

There are so many mentally deranged people out there, so let's censor anything that will give them any ideas.

I wish people would listen to what they are saying.

Now, maybe there's a nuanced smaller proposition that isn't the antithesis of freedom of speech.


Now apply this to gun rights.

Wince said...

"If you can't say something good someone, I'll sit right here on your face."

Rusty said...

Jimbino @ 9:59
You might want to visit one of our lovely national parks before you off yourself. I hear Yosemite is beautiful this time of year. You just might change your mind about killing yourself.

Known Unknown said...

I called 2016 The Hunger Games election.

Bill Peschel said...

They can't help hating Trump. It really screws with their brains.

The wife and I saw "Get Out" and thought it was pretty sharp.

They dodged a bullet, though. In the special features, they showed a bunch of alternative endings. The scene was always the same, just one line changed. It looked like they tried alternative punchlines, some improvised, to see what worked.

One of them was a Trump joke, as in, "those people [who captured us for their experiments] were Trump voters."

Good call not using it, considering the people in question were wealthy liberals who flaunted the "we're all equal" beliefs the same time they were destroying the minds of the black folk they captured. But they tried.

Seeing Red said...

Then there’s the Castro brothers.

Dust Bunny Queen said...

bagoh20 said I don't think the movie makers here give one shit about this movie causing violence against deplorable. Rather, they care how that would make them look. Good call.

Exactly this.

It is all about how it would reflect back on them (the movie makers and funders). Who cares about the Deplorables or whether the movie would speed up the coming civil war.

MacMacConnell said...

I would pay to see The Hunt, it sounds like a deplorable Red Dawn.

El Supremo said...

Who needs a dangerous movie like that? Speech as powerful as a nationally distributed movie should only be in the hands of trained government movie makers.

rcocean said...

Just more Left-wing cant. MSM critics/writers and Hollywood are so tedious and dishonest. When they censor and blacklist - its A-ok, because they're fighting "fascism" or "racism" or whatever. Tres Noble. When society pressures them so they can't release a piece of filth its: "The Death of Art!" "Freedom under siege!" "Freedom - or Art dies!"

BORING!

rcocean said...

Whenever I hear a Hollywood commie talk about "Freedom of expression" i reach for the vomit bag.

El Supremo said...

I would guess that few leftists would go see this. It would be embarrassing to say you did. Probably more deplorables would see it, just for the irony.

William said...

Hollywood seems totally oblivious as to how damaged their brand is. The executives at Enron or big pharma don't routinely rape their subordinates or bribe their kids' way into college, but that's SOP in Hollywood. When Hollywood produces a big budget movie about evil practices in the corporate world, I can't help but notice who's producing it.

effinayright said...

Laslo said:

My take: after the film comes out, replace 'deplorables' with 'illegal immigrants' or 'homeless' and see if the scales of drama still balance.
**********************

Or Lubavitcher Jews.

hstad said...

"If you don’t have anything nice to say, come sit next to me." Similar to many like quotes throughout history. Yes AA-Meade, it’s especially good advice if the comment is purely malicious, derogatory, negative and serves no purpose, except to make the recipient feel bad.

However, like all things aphorisms it is to simple. The Positive Pollys of the world would love to have everyone be nice and respectful at all times. Great examples for the k-3 age group. Real problem solving involves discussing problems, and designing solutions. Problems are negative by nature, and discussing problems can't avoid that negative aspect. To not just be complaining, and to be solving problems, one should bring solutions as well. Solutions are what makes problem solving a positive process.

rcocean said...

Just in case anyone forgets. Mel Gibson was an academy award winning director and a box office star. When he tried to make "Passion of the Christ" No one in Hollywood would fund it. the New York times started attacking the picture 24/7. No one wanted to distribute it when it was completed. Eventually, when Gibson's lawyers started talking lawsuit, a movie chain RELUCTANTLY distributed it. It then made a Billion dollars. Then the distributor tried to screw over Gibson and he had to go legal to get his money from them.

Usually Hollywood copy cats successful movies, Not in this case. Later Gibson was blacklisted for 10 years. Hollywood has NEVER believed in freedom of speech or been against Blacklists. The only question is who's getting suppressed.

rcocean said...

When Alice heard FDR was seeing Lucy Mercer again, she supposedly said "Good for him. He needed to have some fun. After all, he was married to Eleanor".

Her nickname for FDR in college was "feather-duster".

effinayright said...

Unknown said...
I would guess that few leftists would go see this. It would be embarrassing to say you did. Probably more deplorables would see it, just for the irony.
*************

Greater irony: a mass shooter enters the movie theater and slaughters the deplorable audience.

Aurora, CO redux.

rcocean said...

Gossip in the Corporation often results in people filing - or wanting to file - HR complaints. 95% of these are women vs. women. Men don't give a damn. And neither do I, since I always never get involved.

William said...

To its credit, Hollywood never produced movies with hateful stereotypes of Jews and blacks. The blacks were portrayed as good natured simpletons, but they weren't hateful or thuggish. The Jews were usually portrayed as humane and kind. They don't seem willing to extend the same courtesy to the Daughters of the Confederacy or evangelical Christians.....Hollywood has always presented stereotypes and nowadays they stereotype people who believe last year's stereotypes as stereotypes. If you deviate one click from political correctness, then you are evil not just in this deviation but in every aspect of your being. It is, for example, possible to be against gay marriage or in favor of letting the Robert E Lee statue stand without being totally depraved and wicked in all other aspects of your existence.

Lurker21 said...

Leland said...

To me, it is like saying the Jews should be happy about WWII because ultimately the Nazis lost.


That actually happens a lot. Jews didn't complain about Schindler's List or Defiance, the Daniel Craig movie about Jewish partisans.

Because the Nazis lost.

Michael K said...

I would pay to see The Hunt, it sounds like a deplorable Red Dawn.

No, scan the script at CTH. The heroine and survivor is an "elite" who was kidnapped by mistake. She ends eating caviar in the private plane. All the Deplorables are dead.

Michael K said...

The Jews were usually portrayed as humane and kind.

Who do you think was making those movies ? read "An Empire of Their Own."

readering said...

Maybe Hunt can eventually be released as a double feature with I love you daddy.

Murph said...

Gahrie said...
Now apply this to gun rights.
8/11/19, 10:15 AM


I had the same thought, but couldn't think how to frame the parallels.
Thanks for getting it done so simply & clearly.

rcocean said...

"To its credit, Hollywood never produced movies with hateful stereotypes of Jews and blacks."

To bad Marlon Brando didn't get that message. He got in quite a bit of trouble - 1990s - when he said the opposite. BTW, no one loved "people of color" more than brando. And I mean "love" in every sense of the word. Average white people? Couldn't stand 'em.

rcocean said...

"The Jews were usually portrayed as humane and kind." In the 30s and 40s Hollywood went out of its way to keep OVERTLY Jewish characters/movies from being portrayed. MGM Head Louie b. Mayer supposedly got up in a movie screening and yelled at the Producers "NO MORE JEWS!". Jewish Actors were OK, as long as they had "American" names and were't overtly Jewish.

Further, under the Hayes Code "antisemitic statements/characters" were verboten. After the Code went away, Hollywood more or less kept that part of the Hayes Code.

Jim at said...

I wanted the movie released.
Strip the masks off these assholes.

Have everybody see just who they truly are and act accordingly.

Jim at said...

Hollywood hates everything about all of those people, remember? Nobody in Hollywood would go forward with a project that helps Trump in any possible way in 2019. That’s laughable.

Exactly. Some people (mainly NeverTrumpers like Allahpundit) were poo-pooing our outrage because a 'deplorable' wins in the end. Bullshit.

Find me the last time Hollywood put out anything that paints conservatives in a good light.

There's a reason I haven't set foot in a movie theater since Saving Private Ryan hit the screens, and it ain't because of the prices.

mockturtle said...

Just because you can make a movie doesn't mean you should.

Spaceman said...

Lefties always wuss out when things get sticky. It would take fortitude to go ahead put this movie on the street. Much safer to dox Trump supporters and boycott businesses.

And I will say Hollywood does a great job of glorifying how hip it to slaughter the multitudes with guns. Armalite needs to sue them for portraying their products as weapons of wanton evil. I also call for Hollywood to immediately cease using assault weapons as a means to pretend kill people as being cool and exciting, while peddling so-called entertainment. I stopped going to these killfest movies a long time ago

readering said...

If you like Tom Hanks and don't have an aversion to animation try Toy Story 4 (sic).

readering said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Big Mike said...

policraticus (8:21) has the best argument — only after Hollywood put the trailers out and started seeing feedback from outside their bubble, did they see feedback that said that it made those deplorables ready to walk through fire and crawl over broken glass to re-elect Trump. They had expected pushback from the hicks from the sticks, but because those producers live in a bubble they didn’t expect that it would help Trump back when they green-lighted it.

Nichevo said...

That's almost the plot of "Hostel"; "a mysterious group that tortures and kills kidnapped backpackers" in Slovakia.

Or of "Hard Target." Perhaps they pulled the movie because John Woo and Jean-Claude Van Damme threatened to sue.


Howard said...
Real normals can't get an erection for a deplorables.

That the best you can do, Howie? You must have stuck on your clown nose with Krazy Glue instead of spirit gum this time. Come here, I'll pull it off for you.

Earnest Prole said...

Later Gibson was blacklisted for 10 years.

It's so difficult to say why, though it may possibly have had something to do with this:

"Mel Gibson made anti-semitic remarks after being pulled over for drunk driving, having a blood alcohol level of .12. After being pulled over, Gibson berated the police, calling them 'motherfuckers' and saying he would 'fuck them'. The police report also said 'Gibson almost continually [sic] threatened me saying he "owns Malibu" and will spend all of his money to "get even" with me.' Gibson went on to say 'Fucking Jews... the Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world,' and then he asked the deputy: 'Are you a Jew?' He also is reported to have referred to a female police officer as 'sugar tits.'"

readering said...

If you can handle a lot of violence, his recent turn in Dragged Across Concrete with Vince Vaughn is a fine dirty cop/heist flick.

Lydia said...

Re Jews in movies. The biggie that stands out is David Lean's 1948 Oliver Twist. Mind-boggling that he and Alec Guinness thought the depiction of Fagin in that film was a good idea.

SweatBee said...

Kira Davis of RedState has a new podcast on spotify titled "Just Listen To Yourself" where she spells out the implications of the platitudes that people like to spout. The only one I listened to was about de Blasio and Sanders rhetoric re: taxing the pants off the rich.

mockturtle said...

Lydia: but faithful to the novel, yes?

Jim said...

I found out that anti-pornography zealots are very extreme. One apparently contacted a young woman actress to attempt to persuade her not to appear in any more pornographic videos. I can sympathize with that somewhat, when you have a very nice young woman not being given respect. The problem is the anti-pornography zealots are part of the new, left-wing puritanism. This is a freedom of speech issue for one thing and what is happening now for free beats the bad old days when you paid a subscription to get access to the same material (I am sorry to say that a long time ago, I did such a thing). But then there was USENET which gave free access to material and we have just moved on from there. The main problem with the anti-pornographic zealots is that they are censoring material. The material may be nasty or offensive, but we can learn more about people than we knew before (such as drug addicts and prostitutes) and we are better for it, because we need to know more about what is happening, good and bad.

Nichevo said...

He also is reported to have referred to a female police officer as 'sugar tits.'"

I LOVE 'sugar tits!' That's been my go-to ever since I heard it. Poor Mel.

madAsHell said...

latent homosexuality expresses

Great name for a rock band.

Maybe you can get a motel room with the woman that wants to share her secret...."You know, gravity is just a theory!!"

n.n said...

All the Deplorables are dead

For social progress, of course. Life deemed unworthy of life... is a leftist past, present, and progressive legacy.

madAsHell said...

Did you know that gravity is just a theory?

Skippy Tisdale said...

"a Progressive need to see more violence in order to become sexually aroused"

Simply capitalize the letter P and it really makes sense.

Skippy Tisdale said...

"Rather than "red flag" behavior, be on the lookout "red hat" behavior."

Why do you assume that all people wearing red hats are Bloods, Fernandistein? Are you just afraid of the Bloods or is it all black people in general.

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