"... their penchant for collaboration. But there are troubling signs too—a victim mentality, an intolerance of viewpoint diversity, a distrust of institutions, a wariness about human nature, an aversion to risk, a cynicism about the whole American experiment.... Politically and ideologically, Mosaics are a tsunami-in-waiting. Four million will turn 18 this year. Another four million next year. And so on, for as far as the eye can see. If you’re wondering why the new guard of the Democratic Party has put forward such an audacious agenda this year—wealth tax, carbon-neutral economy, tuition-free college, Medicare for All, universal child care, racial reparations—wonder no more. They’re racing left to keep pace with their future base, which wants leaders who shoot for the moon... The drought in social trust among the young is especially worrisome. In a fast-paced entrepreneurial economy, trust is the grease that keeps the gears from grinding. In an increasingly pluralistic society, it’s the glue that holds the mosaic together. In a self-governing democracy, it’s a rationale for voting and predicate for pragmatic compromise. Why are Mosaics so distrustful?"
From
"They're a Blue Tidal Wave—If They Vote/Today's teens are likely to be even more progressive than the millennials who voted in 2018, but will they show up?" by Paul Taylor (American Prospect).
"Mosaics" is Taylor's word for the post-millennial generation. The idea is that these people "want to live in a society where boundaries of race, gender, and sexual orientation are porous, and everyone is free to be whoever he/she/they wants." It's not about Moses, it's about the
artwork made up of lots of individual tiles...
(Mosaic of female athletes playing ball at the Villa Romana del Casale of Piazza Armerina, 4th century AD.)
By the way — I just learned this — the word "mosaic," for the artwork,
is not derived from the name Moses. It goes back to the Medieval Latin
musaicum ‚ "mosaic work, work of the Muses." It's about
Muses, not Moses.
Posts
189 comments:
Also known as: We are so screwed.
I started reading news magazines when I was eight years old and can’t count the number of times In the intervening fifty years that I’ve read these sweeping generational generalizations. And yet, curiously, Republicans keep getting elected.
Also known as: We are so screwed.
Perhaps. But we can also expect at least some subset of those teens to be mugged by reality.
Until they get jobs and want to buy things.
Then they'll be like every other generation and go "wait, you want to take MY money?".
It’s Madison Avenue sociology. It only suckers the predisposed.
Fun fact: Moses is an Egyptian patronym that means "son of."
"The truth is often avoided because it is ugly and unpleasant. Never appeal to truth and reality unless you are prepared for the anger that comes from disenchantment."
- Law 32, The 48 Laws of Power, Robert Greene
My CO once remarked during an accountability check that the hallmark of adulthood was sometimes putting aside one's personal desires actively to undertake those things people expect of us. If this is true, then forthcoming generations living in a world where they actively expect something...anything to do 'the thing' for them instead of doing it themselves or having it come about by osmosis are going to be very very very disappointed.
Western youth have got some very harsh truths to face, and that is their peers located in pretty much every other part of the world are poorer, in some cases smarter, and much 'hungrier' than they are with a considerably lower threshold for sentimentality for doing the things that need doing to get what they want. Oh, and btw, they will actually DO IT themselves.
And yet, curiously, Republicans keep getting elected.
It's crazy. It's almost as if the younger generations keep growing up and discovering that the like keeping more of their paycheck, and want to live in nice suburbs with good schools.
... their respect for rules ...
???
This is something to celebrate about the young?
If you are the faction making the rules, it must be great!
1. “The youth vote” is always supposed to change things and it never does.”
2. “Victimhood” culture is no longer just a liberal/leftist/minority thing. Victimhood culture is one of the central tenets of Trumpism. Trumpists have few peers in the universe of victimhood. The mainstream media is out to get Trump. Democrats won’t let Trump get anything done. Obama left Trump a nearly insoluble mess. Illegal immigrants are taking middle class jobs from Americans. Mexican criminals and Islamic terrorists are harming everyday Americans. The Deep State controls everything and no one will do anything about it.
Admire these emotions, liberal boomer like yourself.
- passion
- empathy
- celebration
The truth is often avoided because it is ugly and unpleasant.
Well, I'm gonna start telling people that I'm true and see if that helps.
It's either diversity of the individual by virtue of character, or diversity of color (i.e. racism), sex (i.e. sexism), gender (i.e. genderism), etc. Bigotry is a progressive condition (PC).
Democrats are placing bets on redistributive change, selective-child, scientific prophecy, shifted responsibility, progressive prices, regurgitation of single-parent households, and rabid diversity.
Social justice anywhere is injustice everywhere.
In 1972 the young actually sorta had a reason to turn out and vote but somehow Nixon-Nixon! won a landslide. Social Justice Warriors are at the core grifters. Eventually the young get jobs and will see the difference between gross pay and net pay and most who won't be working for government, government contractors or non-profits will realize they have been duped.
Boundaries of color, sex, and gender... and ethics or selective rules (e.g. Pro-Choice).
Their respect for rules???? Bahahahahahahahhahahah!!!
Lately, I've noted a strange obsession of plus 60 year olds with 18-22 year olds. Over-attention of the grand-parent age group towards the teenage age group.
Is it the Boomers getting upset at the new teenagers? Is it just people get cranky and want to say "get off my lawn" to the kids? I don't know, but do not understand the overt negativity and excess attention. Some of the Boomers are acting like it's a new thing, to get annoyed at teenagers. I've wondered if it's a older generation societal panic over teenagers, the 18-22 age group.
> audacious agenda
Lunatic agenda would be closer to the truth. The public world we live in is a product of the media, so I don't know how deep the rot really runs, but I see enough to worry me.
And yet, curiously, Republicans keep getting elected.
Principles and principals matter. Democrats are notoriously Pro-Choice and exclusive. Republicans need to get their ducks in a row.
The idea is that these people "want to live in a society where boundaries of race, gender, and sexual orientation are porous, and everyone is free to be whoever he/she/they wants."
This is not an "idea."
It's a consumer demand for a fully functioning Holodeck.
It's a requirements list directed to hardware and software developers to satisfy that consumer demand.
Don't worry. It's coming. Thanks to capitalism.
It's amusing to see the author praise them for their dedication to diversity, and then follow up describing them as very hostile to diversity. In fact, what he is describing is basic tribalism and a fairly nasty version at that.
...trust is the grease that keeps the gears from grinding. In an increasingly pluralistic society, it’s the glue that holds the mosaic together.
As political scientist Robert Putnam noted, pluralistic/diverse communities are low-trust communities. This seems to be a factor in the splintering of the nation.
Are we witnessing the modern day McGovern movement?
hostile to diversity
People are waking up to the risk of color judgments as a first-order forcing of climate change.
The idea is that these people "want to live in a society where boundaries of race, gender, and sexual orientation are porous, and everyone is free to be whoever he/she/they wants."
The end of this sentence is missing. It should read: "without experiencing any negative consequences."
That's why the demand can only be met thru the Holodeck. Life always has consequences.
I assumed that "mosaic" came from Moses smashing the first draft of the Decalogue. I stand corrected.
Victimhood culture is one of the central tenets of Trumpism. Trumpists have few peers in the universe of victimhood. <
Nonsense but it is helpful to see where you are coming from.
Victims are passive, just like the dolts at Harvard and UW. The Trump voters are determined to do something and that's why 150,000 show up and get to know each other. Ten years ago, it was Tea Party and they were the same. I notice observations that the demonstrators in Hong Kong left the city cleaner than they found it. Interesting.
The young person's epiphany occurs when they look at the various deductions and withholdings on their first pay stub.
Let's face it, the people described do not populate this site.
I thought that "mosiac" came from Moesha.
Nothing says "We care for you, now vote" to young people more than a septuagenarian at the helm.
Is it just people get cranky and want to say "get off my lawn" to the kids? I don't know, but do not understand the overt negativity and excess attention.
No. We are worried about them. I have five grandchildren. How many do you have? Europe is ruled by childless women like May and Merkel. We see how they are struggling with insane colleges and student debt. Many have been mistaught in K-12. They know no history, they are weak in math but they know all about global warming. Not one could diagram an English sentence,
The next great youth revolution will be the revolution against 60s hipsterism.
There is only one way for that to go... back to church or synagogue.
The next Great Awakening.
But the holodeck isnt real, now 4d printing might be.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vae_victis
"Vae Victis!" - "Woe to the vanquished!" - Brennus
"It pays to be a winner" - Unofficial USN Seal motto
"No medals for second place" - USAF Red Flag
These kids don't get it. Mommy and daddy aren't going to make it all better if you can't hack it, both for yourselves and for your nation. The people that want to come into the nation and overwork you for less pay don't care. The robot/algorithim that might take your job doesn't care. Your elected leadership doesn't care. The financial markets don't care, even less so if these imports buy the securities that you won't or can't a afford.
So little Susy, if you can't beat the tranny that the system allows to run in the girls race or keep the system honest by telling the tranny running in the girls race to 'get lost'...they're not going to get lost and they will continue to beat you consistently until the behavior is normalized and you're shut out of the competition forever while they call you a bigot as your complain.
Get it? There's nowhere for you to 'take your marbles and go home' anymore. No open frontier where you can redesign your world with like minded people. The frontier is closed. No more happy valleys. If you won't fight and you won't vote for your interests, no one is going to do it for you.
The Word is stronger than the structure.
They are better described as poorly educated, unenterprising and invertebrate.
I have seen them, and how they are being raised and educated.
One of the most troubling things I see is a healthy distrust of media and information that is projected at them strangely combined with an acceptance of the lies, incompetence, and bias regardless. They seem to realize there is a lot of bullshit, but still accept it anyway. They are so often surprised by facts that are counter to the common narratives. I think a lot of this is due to the containment and censoring of conservative viewpoints by media and academia that insulates them from alternative information leaving them with nothing but those leftist narratives color their world view. Academia is especially complicit in severely mal-educating young people today. They believe so much without question that is provably false with just a little research which they are never offered or encouraged to do themselves. They often have the heros and villans backwards.
This all works good except when these young people actually start doing real work, they find out if you are minimally competent you are the exception. And that includes "giving a crap". Their fellow travelers aren't pulling their weight. Then they start realizing they are paying for free stuff for people who don't want to work.
The problem isn't the kids being kids, it's that today's adults are abdicating the responsibilities of being an adult.
It is why our colleges and social media function on the level of "The Lord of the Flies".
When they are not recreating "Animal Farm" or "1984*."
(*Not the Van Halen album named '1984': if the kids would emulate that then I would have more hope for the future).
I am Laslo.
A generation of Oberlins.
No. Back to Nature, ST.
Back to nature was the hipster movement of the 60s. Remember?
"We've got to get back to the garden."
You're making the hypocrisy argument. That's what fucked up everything in the first place.
There is no arena or institution of humans that is exempt from sin and corruption. Believing that there is was the error.
There is also a terrible testosterone deficit.
Or at least a cultural suporession of masculinity.
Which of course leads to a lack of enterprise, general timidity.
No mention here of the Colleges teaching the 18 to 22 year olds to hate traditional Americans' way of life as an evil that must be exterminated so they can steal their stuff. That was the Obama/Clinton plan that we missed living out by the skin of our teeth. They really had constructed Re-education camps for us.
Let's accept the hypothesis that Millenials are trending more liberal for a moment.
Then let's overlay it with the arc of liberal run countries, states and cities rapidly turning into shitholes. Smart people will notice.
Which trend will dominate?
Not saying we don't know them, saying they are not expressing themselves here.
Nice try Professor. But nobody is buying this bull. The kids are stupid, reactionary punks. And we know that they're getting dumber and dumber. IQ levels have been falling for decades and decades!!! And since studies repeatedly link low intelligence with right-wing beliefs and because conservative ideologies offer structure and order (catnip for stupid people), the hard right has a bright future. The future is TRUMP, TRUMP, TRUMP, TRUMP all the GD time.
Our Professor said... It goes back to the Medieval Latin musaicum ‚ "mosaic work, work of the Muses." It's about Muses, not Moses.
So, you're saying that they belong in Museums?
The future belongs to those who show up for it.
There is opportunity as far as the eye can see for people who want to serve the needs of other people rather than trying to improve humanity.
I'm not worried about the future. Generations Y and Z will have to get real when their parents aren't around to coddle them anymore...unless they want to take direction from Comrade Hogg and Comrade Ocasio-Cortez. I predict the answer will be "no" to that. Most people want to do well for themselves and their families.
In the 1950s and 1960s there were real injustices: separate water fountains for different races; segregated schools; Blacks not allowed to vote; women excluded from or discouraged from certain careers. People in those generations fought against those injustices: they marched, they were imprisoned, or beaten, or even killed. They were heroes. Todays young want to be heroes. They can't find any real systemic injustice, so they have to define injustice down so they have something to fight heroically.
I can't think of anything that would make us a healthier, stronger nation in the future than for young people to get themselves really educated outside of what they are force fed by our culture and institutions. The alternative is also the most depressing possibility I can imagine. People like AOC, Bernie, etc are an exceptionally dangerous and misguided temptation for those not inoculated with enough history and facts. What young people do not know is frightening. Us older folks will not suffer from that - they will, but I do not want them to lose all that has been built for them: the greatest, freest most uplifting nation that ever existed.
Chuckles is sounding more and more like Inga.
Is this what happens when their fantasy of Mueller marching Trump out of the White House in handcuffs explodes?
Mr Wibble said...
It's crazy. It's almost as if the younger generations keep growing up and discovering that the like keeping more of their paycheck, and want to live in nice suburbs with good schools.
How's the old saw go?
While in college; i thought my dad was the stupidest person alive
When i graduated and got a job; i was surprised how much the old man had learned in 4 years
wwww,
I deal with hiring, interviews, trainees, colleges.
Besides our own children, their friends and peers.
Your population quality is declining, subjective on my part, but there it is.
But in my case it is as professional a judgment as you can honestly get.
Laslo said.... Not the Van Halen album named '1984': if the kids would emulate that then I would have more hope for the future).
well, since the song HOT FOR TEACHER is on that album; maybe the kids ARE emulating it?
Also known as: We are so screwed.
Not really. The young have always been left-er that other age groups. Dems present the individuals as statically left so they can claim demographics will overwhelm their opposition. But if these beliefs never changed they would have taken over electorally long ago. In reality we see the far left influence comes from institutional control rather than popular support.
The young are left primarily because they do not understand how society functions. As they gain experience and intelligence many change their minds. This is one reason the left supports artificial environments like academia and government. These can be insulated from reality thus preventing those in them from gaining sufficient experience and intelligence to question the left's ideological tenets.
If the non-left really wants to make inroads it will reform the higher education system. If it were to provide a non-ideological alternative to the far left campus reality of today the overwhelming majority of people would choose it. This would end the left's ability to fund its activists with taxpayer money and force it to contend elections on a fair basis. It could not survive this.
I hope that makes sense, you seem like a good guy, but you sure are awfully concerned with who gets credit, and adding up your winnings while still sitting at the table...
Nope. Did not make sense. You're trying to say those of us from an earlier generation (not baby boom) don't care about kids 18 to 22. My response was that we do care and have the grandchildren to prove it. My grandson, whose games I attended, now thinks he wants to go to West Point. My grand daughters are into sports, one soccer, the other swimming. Two others are too young and live in the Bay Area and I don't see them often. Another is due next month. I am concerned about the terrible education they are receiving. Fortunately my son found a good charter school. My youngest daughter was taught lies at the U of Arizona.
To paraphrase Douglas MacArthur,
There is no substitute for reproduction.
With very rare exceptions, without progeny one might as well never have been.
What you did all your life, the niche you filled, another would have.
All your memories will be gone, irrelevant. Tears in the rain, per the Blade Runner android.
This is an unsentimental world view, but it is correct.
If you're using the Mosaic metaphor, then "tessellated" is a useful word to have in your back pocket.
"I have five grandchildren. How many do you have?"
Our kids are in diapers; we're way too young for grandkids. I'm sorry you worry about your grandkids. Being concerned with one's own grandchildren, because of a particular issue in the family, makes sense. Being worried about the generation as a whole, and obsessing about it in the news media, is a little too much "get off my lawn" doomsday-ish, view of the world.
We do have a 20 year old trusted babysitter. She's great. There's nothing wrong with 18-22 year olds. They are fine. Yes, some teenagers are obnoxious. There's nothing new with that. You all worry too much and obsess overmuch about college students.
I find it reassuring that the hot chicks of ancient Rome played beach volleyball. That's some impressive long-term stability of core values.
"My youngest daughter was taught lies at the U of Arizona."
Our babysitter analyzed various programs at Universities and colleges and decided which one she wanted to attend. She looked at programs that had professional orientations. Even small universities offer economic classes and computer classes. Many offer business classes. Many offer software classes or web-design classes. If interested in Liberal Arts, some Universities retain their Latin programs and others offer at least 1 or 2 years of Greek language. There are language classes in Mandarin offered at many schools. There are biochemistry classes. Many students are economic or business majors.
The majority of students research their professors prior to signing up for classes. Many will drop classes they don't like in the first week and find another class.
"With very rare exceptions, without progeny one might as well never have been.
What you did all your life, the niche you filled, another would have.
All your memories will be gone, irrelevant. Tears in the rain, per the Blade Runner android."
This is true even if one does have progeny. Eventually, the sun will swallow up the earth, and further on, even our sun will die. In the end, it is posited, our universe may collapse in on itself. It will be as none of us ever were...none of the multitudes of life forms throughout the many galaxies.
"I met a traveller from an antique land,
Who said—'Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert. . . . Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk a shattered visage lies, whose frown,
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,
The hand that mocked them, and the heart that fed;
And on the pedestal, these words appear:
My name is Ozymandias
Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair!
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal Wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.”
--Shelley
There’s no respect for rules.
“I believe in making the world safe for our children, but not our children’s children. Because I don’t think that children should be having sex.”
~ Jack Handey
They are grifters. AOC already said she needs a raise.
The mainstream media is out to get Trump.
This is self-evidently true, and has been since the morning after the election.
Democrats won’t let Trump get anything done.
Them, and a lot of establishment Republicans who were getting rich off the status quo.
Obama left Trump a nearly insoluble mess.
Self-evidently true. But only “nearly” insoluble. He’s working on it. After the collusion hoax distraction he will obviously need a second term to finish.
Illegal immigrants are taking middle class jobs from Americans.
You got it wrong (what’s new?) . The problem is that they take entry-level jobs, making it that much harder for working class and lower middle class individuals to enter the work force.
Mexican criminals and Islamic terrorists are harming everyday Americans.
There are 49 gay men in Orlando who would like to agree with you but they can’t because a Muslim terrorist killed them.
"want to live in a society where boundaries of race, gender, and sexual orientation are porous, and everyone is free to be whoever he/she/they wants."
I see that as a race to max intersectional victim status.
gone is:
I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.
But humanity and it’s intelligence is antientropic
One day it is possible that our descendants may become as Gods.
Or figure out what God is.
That will not happen however if there are no descendants of each generation.
Humanity is perfectly capable of wiping itself out, or at least crippling I self for an age, with a meme.
These things are dangerous.
Are you sure those are women?
I'm not sure.
If you’re wondering why the new guard of the Democratic Party has put forward such an audacious agenda this year—wealth tax, carbon-neutral economy, tuition-free college, Medicare for All, universal child care, racial reparations—wonder no more. They’re racing left to keep pace with their future base, which wants leaders who shoot for the moon...
So the Democrats' answer to a generation filled with mistrust of government institutions and American society is to promise things which have zero chance of coming true.
The beauty of leftist politics is there is always another generation which has yet to be fooled even once.
Then they start realizing they are paying for free stuff for people who don't want to work.
Like Cookie!
Those “dreams” are paltry. There is nothing cosmic in them.
There is virtue, beauty and glory without any obsession about social justice or any particular annoyance to any particular sub-group.
The obsessions expressed here are manufactured fashions.
Evil ones, made for evil purposes.
More victimology:
"My youngest daughter was taught lies at the U of Arizona."
Quit. Go to Hillsdale; or George Mason; or Liberty. Or be like Bill Buckley and write the “God and Man at Yale” for the 21st Century.
I swear that the Trumpkins are worse whiners than the Rainbow Push Coalition or the National Action Network or La Raza.
My kids graduated college as fairly liberal people. Their first paycheck deductions made them extreme fiscal conservatives. May this experience affect all 4 million graduates every year from now until the end of time.
"My youngest daughter was taught lies at the U of Arizona."
Quit. Go to Hillsdale; or George Mason; or Liberty. Or be like Bill Buckley and write the “God and Man at Yale” for the 21st Century.
I swear that the Trumpkins are worse whiners than the Rainbow Push Coalition or the National Action Network or La Raza.
Chuck, how does it feel to be thought an asshole by everyone who encounters you?
I corrected the lies and she graduated. By the way, you never mentioned who you clerked for after law school.
My descendants are already smarter than I am.
And they are more transcendental in their achievements than this old technologist.
They are hands-on on the cutting edge.
That is glorious.
I have been in the cathedrals of the future. It’s like watching Columbus’ crew assembling.
My vanity is that we are the pad from which they will launch.
"Quit. Go to Hillsdale; or George Mason; or Liberty. Or be like Bill Buckley and write the “God and Man at Yale” for the 21st Century."
Yeah I'm a little confused. People have choices. Or go to Ave Maria in Florida. Or drop the class and take a better class. Nobody forced their kid to major in something liberal arts-ish. Or choose a language class that has nothing to do with ideology. Calculus, theoretical statistics, multiple computer classes, Latin, Mandarin, all the science classes, reading Homer in Greek. Don't go to a school if you don't like the class choices and the minors/ majors offered.
The majority of students research their professors prior to signing up for classes. Many will drop classes they don't like in the first week and find another class.
The lies were in the general ed course in freshman year. After that, she went to her major classes and had no trouble that I saw. In her freshman course, "US History Since 1877," her finals study guide included the statement that "The Silent Majority" was made up of white people who refused to accept the 1964 Civil Rights Act." No mention of Vietnam or Nixon. In her freshman English Composition class, the instructor, an English grad student, spent the final review session of the class in an hour long rant about Reagan. He was an actor who read lines written for him by others, etc.
Don't go to a school if you don't like the class choices and the minors/ majors offered.
These freshman general ed classes were not optional. Once she got into her major, the problems ended. Besides, who would object to "US History Since 1877 ?
Why do you seem to need to live others' for them?
There seems to be a lot of projection in your comments. I assume you have no children,. or at least any close to you.
Go to Hillsdale; or George Mason; or Liberty.
This is about as profound as "America: Love it or leave it!"
Or be like Bill Buckley and write the “God and Man at Yale” for the 21st Century.
So that's why Yale is free of SJW mobs!
Chuck wrote (quoting Michael): ‘"My youngest daughter was taught lies at the U of Arizona."
I swear that the Trumpkins are worse whiners than the Rainbow Push Coalition or the National Action Network or La Raza.’
Some adults share qualities with “Mosaics,” for example, smug ignorance resulting in an inability to discern between whining and a statement of observable facts. Oh, and let’s not forget pettiness.
When your colleges put nothing but pap and lies into those who would be your leadership class, it is not simply your personal problem.
I am an engineer, and our kids are of that sort too, but I know you need your “liberal arts”, or rather you need the whole of your culture.
Without the why you will never manage the how.
Without perspective you have no judgment.
Nobody forced their kid to major in something liberal arts-ish.
@wwww, no, but students today are forced to take sequences from grievance studies and the (these days badly mis-named) liberal arts. STEM students get used to their professors actually knowing the subjects they teach, and it probably doesn't cross their minds until much later that such is not true about the grievance studies, liberal arts, and social so-called sciences.
We are a social species. Norms and culture are a communal result.
If we don’t live our kids lives for them, others will.
A huge number of others these days are vampires.
More are nullities, already sucked dead.
bagoh20 said...One of the most troubling things I see is a healthy distrust of media and information that is projected at them strangely combined with an acceptance of the lies, incompetence, and bias regardless. They seem to realize there is a lot of bullshit, but still accept it anyway. They are so often surprised by facts that are counter to the common narratives. I think a lot of this is due to the containment and censoring of conservative viewpoints by media and academia that insulates them from alternative information leaving them with nothing but those leftist narratives color their world view. Academia is especially complicit in severely mal-educating young people today. They believe so much without question that is provably false with just a little research which they are never offered or encouraged to do themselves. They often have the heros and villans backwards.
I've noticed the same thing. Young people are aware that, for example, most politicians are generally full of shit. But they choose to believe certain things that certain politicians claim non the less.
For example, the general concepts in any sort of "Green New Deal". Any reasonable, rational person will look at the various proposals put forth under the rubric of a "Green New Deal" and conclude that they're most of them are generally not remotely feasable. But many young people choose to believe the opposite because they may feel like older people must be just lying to them or whatever.
In isolation, one on one, you may be able explain to a young person in basic terms why things like free college and free healthcare are currently completely unworkable concepts (without completely destroying the economy with literal wealth confiscation). But in order to do that you have to build up trust with that young person first. You can't just insult them or lecture them. You have to be persuasive. And I fear it's virtually impossible to undo all the damage that has been done to young people's critical thinking skills any other way other than one on one. But no single person can do that.
The problem isn't the kids being kids, it's that today's adults are abdicating the responsibilities of being an adult.
Yup.
Every generation through time would behave this way if they had adults enabling them. Once adults learned how to exploit the young commercially and politically, society was greatly transformed.
And as an adjunct professor in a school of business, I might add that I was often surprised by how poorly some of the professors understood modern business practices.
You all worry too much and obsess overmuch about college students.
Luckily we have www here to police our attention. It's revealing every comment she makes supports the far left even though she pretends not to be a part of it.
When I was very young, my parents told me that they used to quietly identify other Jews by asking if they were of the Mosaic persuasion.
These freshman general ed classes were not optional. Once she got into her major, the problems ended. Besides, who would object to "US History Since 1877 ?
1) Modern US domestic history? More likely to be ideological then, say, a class on ancient China or Imperial Rome.
2) Switch professors and choose a different class. Read the syllabus and exit the class in the first week. For GE requirements, schools have a large pool of classes to choose from. Or go to the on-line reviews.
2) Switch faculties is another solution. Business Department.
3) Choose a different school. There are lots and lots of schools. Research the requirements before applying to the school.
Our babysitter researched lots of schools before applying. She examined the programs and requirements. She talked to friends about their experiences. I'm sorry your kid had a inferior class/ teacher but a large University offers lots of class choices.
A couple of things:
1. A very interesting, if not depressing article.
2. The author notes that 88% of 12th graders are not proficient in history? Whose fault is that? I lay 100% of the blame at the feet of the education establishment, which votes almost exclusively for Democrats. I cringe when I read their complaints about America - they're nothing but a bunch of ignorant, whiny losers sorely in need of a collective ass whupping. (THE SAME CLEARLY APPLIES TO A HUGE PERCENTAGE OF COLLEGE STUDENTS AS WELL.)
3. The teachers complain that "no one listens to them." NO ONE HAS EVER LISTENED TO HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS! EVER. BECAUSE EVERYONE KNOWS THEY HAVE NOTHING TO SAY WORTH LISTENING TO. BECAUSE THEY ARE IGNORANT, WHINY LOSERS.
4. I predict that as a group, history will show that Mosaics lead unproductive and miserable lives, forever bitter, always drawn towards socialism and wholly unable to provide for themselves. And they'll deserve every second of it.
5. I have long considered myself a libertarian because neither party speaks to me or represents my values. I am ultra-liberal on many issues and ultra-conservative on others, at least by contemporary standards. I did not vote for Trump - but I wish I had. I will never be a Republican, but I will never again vote for a Democrat.
6. I'm actually disappointed in myself that this article made me so angry; Ill take time and reflect on that and report back if I learn anything. I don't think I am the problem, but I am open to the possibility I might be wrong.
Chuck Channeling Schumer bleated: ‘2. “Victimhood” culture is no longer just a liberal/leftist/minority thing. Victimhood culture is one of the central tenets of Trumpism. Trumpists have few peers in the universe of victimhood. The mainstream media is out to get Trump. Democrats won’t let Trump get anything done. Obama left Trump a nearly insoluble mess. Illegal immigrants are taking middle class jobs from Americans. Mexican criminals and Islamic terrorists are harming everyday Americans. The Deep State controls everything and no one will do anything about it.’
No factual basis for any of those observations by Chuck, right? How does his verbalized psychosis differ from what an indoctrinated “Mosaic,” AOC or a Democrat candidate for POTUS might say?
I rest the case I stated at 10:55.
This garners bemusement.
"Luckily we have www here to police our attention."
You are more then free to spend your time panicking about the nation's teenage population. For myself, I've wondered about the complaining. It comes across, almost, like panic for the 18-22 year old population. Maybe all older generations feel that way about teenagers. Maybe it's something else going on.
I know people in this age group and I think they are capable of managing their lives and their choices. They're fine.
For a fine example of a privileged young man - representative of any entire class of similar creatures - that has just been sentenced to prison for his political smugness and 110% certainty of righteousness...
I give you Jackson Cosko, freshly sentenced.
https://dailycaller.com/2019/06/19/dem-staffer-kavanaugh-doxx-prison/
Read. the. whole. thing.
"Much to admire...their passion...their zeal." Yeah, for being pig-headedly sadistic. I hope someone shanks him over a cigarette debt for 'toilet wine'.
The article emphasizes how much browner today's youth are. That matters. Culture counts. Even NYC voted against suicide and elected a Republican - Giuliani. The browning of our youth has mostly been by illegal entry of browns from south of the border - where the culture is to keep going further left no matter how bad the outcome. There is a reason Dems encourage illegal immigration. The want voters who will keep voting Dem no matter how bad things get - see CA, Detroit, Chicago.....
Lots of bad advice today from questionable sources
‘2. “Victimhood” culture is no longer just a liberal/leftist/minority thing. Victimhood culture is one of the central tenets of Trumpism."
Yes. It's one of the greatest applications of political Jiu Jitsu ever pulled off. Using the Democrats primary weapons of grievance and identity politics successfully against them has driven them over the edge.
Except that Trump voters don't see themselves as victims so much as disenfranchised citizens who's government has ceased to represent them honestly and that is actively working against their interests and undermining their civil rights, which is the truth.
Fascists always admire the "zeal" of the young. They know it can be manipulated by emotional appeals that ignore reasoning and history.
You are more then free to spend your time panicking about the nation's teenage population.
I would of course be free to do that. One sign I have chosen not to is that I don't. In fact your insistence campus antics are about the "teenage population" is absurd. Student activists are pawns playing roles (victims) so their faculty and administrator allies can advance policies they cannot justify on the merits.
Maybe it's something else going on.
Again we see your effort to protect the activists by implying paying attention to their impact is prurient.
"mosaic of facts"..a SanctiComey construction/deflection.
C'mon Chuckles. The Nevertrumpers are the kings of perpetual butthurt.
Young people are distrustful because older, whiter people have borrowed huge amounts of money to subsidize their Social Security and Medicare, and young people will be stuck with the bill.
Rick,
I am talking about this concern about the "generation" as a whole not simply about campus whatever. I will say this: the "student protesters" are a tiny proportion of the generation. Our babysitter is not interested in politics. I've gotten no impression that her friends are interested. They are perfectly normal. There is a full scale panic about this age group and I find it strange.
I do wonder if it's simply a cranky "get off my lawn" attitude. Or if grandparents have a tendency to cranky attitudes towards teenagers. (To some extent this is understandable.) Or maybe people are upset their own kids aren't having grandkids.
And yet they want to expand the spectrum of "free".
I'm sorry your kid had a inferior class/ teacher but a large University offers lots of class choices.
I don't think the first assertion is true. I'm certain the second isn't.
I've always considered that a politically active protest stage is a valuable part of the college experience. University administrations used to help the students channel these tendencies, or at least keep them from getting out of hand, until the cares of real life force people to moderate their attitudes and actions.
Today's kids are no more "admirable" than any other generations' kids. The only thing that's changed is that university administrations have failed in their obligations to mold these passionate minds into something more positive and productive.
Time will still do its part and Republicans will continue to get elected by people who were liberal in their youth. But the univeristy system may never recover from this betrayal by its own faculty and staff.
"They are perfectly normal. There is a full scale panic about this age group and I find it strange."
Normal in the sense that they will largely vote Dem..with Dem offerings pushing ever Leftward.
Again we see your effort to protect the activists by implying paying attention to their impact is prurient.
Oh, I missed this. Nope, wasn't thinking that. Was wondering if the concern came from personal experience. Parents upset their kids weren't getting married and having kids. A grandkid who joins a band instead of getting a job. A granddaughter who dates men who would be bad husbands. Grandson who plays poker on the weekend and won't save his money.
The panic makes more sense if it's driven by personal experience. If one's family's kids and grandkids are doing great, why panic? If all the neighbour's kids and grandkids are doing great, why panic?
"Normal in the sense that they will largely vote Dem..with Dem offerings pushing ever Leftward."
hello! stop panicking, 18-22 year olds don't vote. They vote in tiny tiny proportions. That's not going to change.
"Maybe it's something else going on. "
Its something else going on.
The content of US education has changed enormously since I started paying attention, spurred when our kids were born. It started when we were looking at pre-schools. And it continued, going deeper and deeper, over the 20+ years of our involvement in the kids education.
It went to me acquiring a hobby, a sort of busmans holiday, of evaluating educational statistics and databases, and following controversies, and then to the nature of curricula and how this was changing. And a large number of SF School board meetings.
Besides which I have been hiring or participating in hiring for decades, visiting colleges (I have been to nearly every significant college in CA at one time or another; I recommend Cal Poly engineering, if you can get in).
subsidize their Social Security and Medicare, and young people will be stuck with the bill
Social Security is fixed and manageable. Medicare, and especially Medicaid, have prices unhinged from costs a la education and related. The disparity is liberal and progressing.
There is a full scale panic about this age group and I find it strange.
Except there is not a full scale panic. There are ten commenters pointing out this trend has always existed. If anything for three decades or so the left has been irrationally exuberant over the exact trend you're now claiming others are panicked about. It's kind of revealing their exuberance over something which you say doesn't exist never triggered a comment but a nonexistent panic does.
I do wonder if it's simply a cranky "get off my lawn" attitude.
Do your parents speak like this? Presuming not let's apply your own standard to your own comments and conclude you are irrationally panicked about boomer/GenX panic.
"The panic makes more sense if it's driven by personal experience."
The panic makes more sense if it is NOT based on personal experience, but independent and professional observation.
This all works good except when these young people actually start doing real work, they find out if you are minimally competent you are the exception. And that includes "giving a crap". Their fellow travelers aren't pulling their weight. Then they start realizing they are paying for free stuff for people who don't want to work.
My four grandchildren are all working now and it's amazing how their outlook has changed. One could argue that reality, e.g, responsibilities of career and family, puts a damper on idealism and social activism. Climate change doesn't loom quite so large when you're concerned about paying next month's rent.
I don't think the first assertion is true. I'm certain the second isn't.
A large University? A major University?
University of Arizona. Let's say you don't want to major in the sciences, or business. Or computer science. Or Aerospace and Mechanical Engineering. or Biological or Biomedical Sciences. Or Epidemiology and Biostatistics. Let's wade into the Liberal Arts. Can a student take a non-ideological class? Why yes, there are plenty of language classes. The student could spend all of her time learning multiple languages. Latin. Greek. Ancient and modern Greek.
The College faculty and students engage in scholarship, teaching, and learning for French, Italian, German, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, Latin, Greek (modern and ancient), and English as a Second Language in COH’s core departments and programs. The Critical Languages Program makes learning over 20 other languages, like Hindi, available on an individualized basis to students with special interests.
The Department of Spanish & Portuguese has the 11th largest number of PhD’s in Spanish in the US.
The German Studies Department offers the first Joint Ph.D. Program (with the University of Leipzig in Germany) in Transcultural German Studies.
Universities house medical departments. They are doing advanced research in diseases. Undergrads can can take classes in pharmacology, epidemiology, biostats. They can then apply to med schools or apply to work for pharm corporations. The options are immense for students.
"I deal with hiring, interviews, trainees, colleges.
Besides our own children, their friends and peers.
Your population quality is declining, subjective on my part, but there it is.
But in my case it is as professional a judgment as you can honestly get."
Perhaps, but I also know a heap of extraordinary young people, notably more capable and accomplished than the peers of my youth. Maybe I was just hanging out with a lot of ne'er do wells back then, but I don't share the pessimism about the current crop. Every generation has a shit load of wastage and lumpenproles. On the whole, I'd say the ones that shine bright in this generation shine brighter than they did in my youth.
I never thought that the word "mosaic' had anything whatsoever to do with Moses.
Why would anyone?
"Do your parents speak like this?"
No. They are not panicked at all. Nor my in-laws. Mostly they like to play with their grandchildren. We all don't talk about politics much, and I've never heard them talk about teenagers as a generation. They don't appear to be worried about the younger generation or teenagers. They might mention a friend or relative's child and what they're doing. Every once in a while they worry about drinking -- but only after a incident. A friend's son fell off his frat balcony. Broke bones but he's ok.
It's good to hear there's no panic. I get a different impression reading comments and articles like the one posted.
I never thought that the word "mosaic' had anything whatsoever to do with Moses.
Why would anyone?
Upper-case M, Mosaic Law, refers to the law of Moses.
The worst case in US education, and it has been visibly deteriorating over twenty years, are Schools of Education. Many have always been rubber-stamp outfits handing out teaching certificates to anyone who can draw breath, but there have been some, at least, that tried to do more. These are still around and still try to do more, but the "more" is something other than what it was.
Note - the "Best" in the US, and what its obsessions are - not maximizing educational attainment, but "Social justice". This is the best, and the rest are far, far worse.
UCLA Dept Education
If you want to have a look at where US teachers get their BA's (most entering an Ed School or teaching cert program have BA's), well, we can go into that swamp too. Much of this exploration takes a strong stomach.
"It's good to hear there's no panic. I get a different impression reading comments and articles like the one posted."
You should panic. I would say it would be an entirely sober and prudential move to burn down your universities. Other than Science and Engineering colleges of course.
No. They are not panicked at all.
So by your own standard you are irrationally panicked. Please take care of yourself.
Chuck, when Trump went beyond the big-time to the YUGE time my first thought was he was a Democrat; using Democrat tactics, and using them well and I was apalled. The Sgt nailed it: Trump is taking what works for the Democratic party and beating them around the head and shoulders with it. I didn't understand the tactics are separable from the theology and 'We're better than that" is not only meaningless, it's a lie.
Let's wade into the Liberal Arts. Can a student take a non-ideological class? Why yes, there are plenty of language classes.
4W sounds like one of the U of A faculty with the "Black Lives Matter" signs on their lawn. Nice homes but limited understanding of the world. As it happened, my daughter majored in French and wanted to live in France, which she loves. I would have preferred she major in Accounting and she later agreed that would be been better. She graduated 11 years ago. I think it is worse now.
Even "languages" are not independent of politics.
And the core of the liberal arts was philosophy, history and literature, often part of languages, especially the classics. You read Caesar in Latin (back in the day, this reading of Caesar was from what we now would think of as Middle School).
That is the "why" of education. The sine qua non. The rest is career training. There is nothing wrong with career training, but it is not what education was, which is to acculturate the leadership of your society.
" I didn't understand the tactics are separable from the theology "
They aren't.
Its the ancient question of whether ends justify the means.
This is a question that pops up all over classic literature, of modern classics like "The Prince", throughout Christian ethics, political ideology, etc.
But the uneducated have not been taught to think, and in these days even the educated cannot think.
The other question is what is justified in order to survive. Sometimes confused with the first.
Wow, I grew up in the late 70s to late 80s (born in 1966). There were confident predictions made by progressives then about the coming blue wave of young people then, too. I suspect this has been a thing for a long, long time.
I've always considered that a politically active protest stage is a valuable part of the college experience.
I was an anti-war organizer and student senator as a college freshman. It was a great learning experience in many ways.
10 years later I was supporting Ronnie Rayguns.
Life is a learning experience for those with the desire and ability to do so. Some just don't have it and some do.
It is simply hilarious that Chuck of all the commenters can complain about Trump voters claiming to be victims. This is the same Chuck that laments with nearly every comment about how badly he is treated here, and complains to the blog host about it constantly.
The Dems are trying to say that totalitarian control over the economy and speech will result in economic and social justice for all; and I agree with those who think its scary how many Millennials do not seem to know how dangerous totalitarianism is and how badly it runs economies. But the majority of the next generation is coming from those who had three or more children and from Latino Catholic immigrants and both are conservative as groups. (The Latino Evangelicals are even more conservative.) There should be an Education Archipelago which helps this oncoming majority resist lefty intersuck by defining sites where its members could find college-level material to resist the media and the universities and their lefty intersuckism at a college-level. Education is a lifetime project.
Commencement speakers always tearfully tell the graduates that they are the last hope for civilization, etc., and so forth, though they are not. In fact, they are indistinguishable from last year's crop and next year's to come, but they swallow this BS their elders tell them and sally forth to "change the world."
This is why journalists no longer report what they see, but feel called upon to write agit-prop for the "brave new world" to hasten its arrival.
Mosaic can be used as the opposite of melting pot
"want to live in a society where boundaries of race, gender, and sexual orientation are porous"
Except that gay is gay and can't be changed, and black ain't white, and check your white privilege.
"and everyone is free to be whoever he/she/they wants"
Except a cisheteronormative white male, or an anti-tranny female athlete, or a deplorable Trump supporter. Then you must be shunned and excluded.
There's nothing exceptional about 4 million U.S. kids getting one year older. It happens every year.
Shorter Chuck: Saying someone lied makes you a whiner, except when I do it, which is just about all I post here.
By the way — I just learned this — the word "mosaic," for the artwork, is not derived from the name Moses. It goes back to the Medieval Latin musaicum ‚ "mosaic work, work of the Muses." It's about Muses, not Moses.
It comes from the word, "mo".
As in, "I need mo' of dem little pieces to finish da picture!"
Blogger Yancey Ward said...
It is simply hilarious that Chuck of all the commenters can complain about Trump voters claiming to be victims. This is the same Chuck that laments with nearly every comment about how badly he is treated here, and complains to the blog host about it constantly.
I’m no victim!
You worthless shit heads can’t hurt me. How can you possibly victimize me? And I don’t want anything from you. Not community, not friendship, not votes, and not even your purchases through an amazon portal.
You hate me, for my criticism of Trump. Be assured; the hatred is mutual.
My criticism of Althouse comment-moderation was that she professed that there were rules but she never enforced them. Certainly not in any meaningful way, and certainly not consistently. Just this morning, the comments page under Althouse’s post on the Trump campaign kickoff rally featured more than a half a dozen comments that called me out by name for personal insults. On a page where I had not offered a single comment. A better blog would weed those commenters out. And then we all might devote more attention and substantive arguments to issues.
But I’m no victim. Any falsehood written about me, I can answer. And I can largely ignore the obviously unhinged commenters like Drago.
I don’t care to bitch about things I don’t like. I can fight. I’m not going to break into any tears over s disagreement, or a fight:
https://reason.com/2006/12/29/grande-conservative-blogress-d/
The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...
"And yet, curiously, Republicans keep getting elected."
I'm old enough to remember when places like NJ, CT, and CA were swing states.
Lifelong self-educator here. As others have noticed, it is not that hard to find ways to learn about things that interest you. (That most people are not interested in anything important is another matter.) But it's not recent technology that has made it so.
The USofA should be proud of the system of public libraries and publicly-accessible university libraries it has built; there is nothing else like it. There's ideological nonsense aplenty in the field, but the people who work in such places do more to educate all of us than any group or profession mentioned so far.
Narr
So there!
Even "languages" are not independent of politics.
sure. But they don't spend much time in Latin or Mandarin class talking about modern US politics. It's quite possible to attend a major university and not take "ideological" classes. The internet allows students to review classes and it's quite possible to switch majors. I noted they offer accounting at that University. But, no - I don't got a sign on my lawn, I've never been to Arizona and I NEVER talk politics on facebook. Besides it's a lot more fun to talk about other stuff.
Students can attend Arizona and go into Engineering, or med school or become fluent in several languages or sign languages and become a interpreter. Students can train in pharmacology or to work with physically disabled children or kids who need speech pathology. It's a huge University. It's not a small community college with limited class selection. It's not Oberlin where 1/3 of the students are music majors at the Conservatory and the size of the school is smaller then a lotta high schools. It's a major University with LOTS of choices.
The majority of students research their professors prior to signing up for classes. Many will drop classes they don't like in the first week and find another class.
Go to Hillsdale; or George Mason; or Liberty. Or be like Bill Buckley and write the “God and Man at Yale” for the 21st Century."
So people can avoid the propaganda if they tiptoe through school spending more time studying the prospective faculty than the subjects. No one opposed to educational indoctrination thinks this is an acceptable circumstance. This an excuse for those looking for any reason to justify not challenging the left dominance of academia.
They Don’t Trust People. ...among the young, there’s something else even more daunting: They also don’t trust other human beings. Just 24 percent of Mosaics say most people can be trusted. Together with the young adults of the millennial generation, they register the lowest scores for interpersonal trust in the half-century that this topic has been explored by the General Social Survey.
Want to experience life in a low-trust society? You're about to get your chance.
Blogger Big Mike said...
“The mainstream media is out to get Trump.”
This is self-evidently true, and has been since the morning after the election.
“Democrats won’t let Trump get anything done.”
Them, and a lot of establishment Republicans who were getting rich off the status quo.
“Obama left Trump a nearly insoluble mess.”
Self-evidently true. But only “nearly” insoluble. He’s working on it. After the collusion hoax distraction he will obviously need a second term to finish.
“Illegal immigrants are taking middle class jobs from Americans.”
You got it wrong (what’s new?) . The problem is that they take entry-level jobs, making it that much harder for working class and lower middle class individuals to enter the work force.
“Mexican criminals and Islamic terrorists are harming everyday Americans.”
There are 49 gay men in Orlando who would like to agree with you but they can’t because a Muslim terrorist killed them
You just did what the Left loves to do. A crazy person commits a mass killing, and you impose your own political ideology on it. The Left did it with McVeigh, and with the kid who assassinated the members and pastor of the AME church in Charleston.
I’m more than happy to advocate for stronger immigration laws including severe penalties on employers who knowingly hire illegals. But before enacting those laws, I want to talk earnestly with one of our party’s strongest constituencies, that being the Chamber of Commerce. I don’t want to throw a bunch of money at stupid fences and unionized border patrol officers when the answer is to dry up the attraction (employment) at the source. And if there is a good case that jobs cannot be filled with current US citizens, then we need those people here and not excluded or deported at some ghastly cost.
As for “no collusion,” I bought the Mueller Report. I bought it through the Althouse Amazon portal.. I didn’t exonerate Trump. I think it calls out for an impeachment investigation.
The mainstream media has attacked every Republican President; Trump is only unusual in being such a dumbass in response.
You read Caesar in Latin
They still read Ceasar in Latin. They read Homer and Euripides in ancient Greek. They go on digs to find ancient Roman mosaics.
Nobody has to tiptoe anywhere at a major University. It seems to me it's a family issue if a student decides to choose underwater basket weaving vs. studying Latin or accounting. The person to talk to about it is the grandson/ granddaughter or whoever is choosing underwater basket weaving.
Economics and accounting and pharmacology are very popular majors. Talk to people in that generation. They are not all majoring in underwater basket weaving.
And that's been the excuse for 30 years,
"The USofA should be proud of the system of public libraries and publicly-accessible university libraries it has built; there is nothing else like it. "
Library usage has collapsed. Especially university libraries it seems. The Internet is a superior source for a great deal, leaving libraries to serious scholars working archives that are not yet in digital form. But that's a small subset of the general public or even university students.
"Nobody has to tiptoe anywhere at a major University"
Yes you do. Watch what you say even in a serious discussion even in a serious classroom.
Even in a dorm. Even person-to-person.
And especially online.
The atmosphere is of self-censorship.
The potential harm to careers is high on their minds.
But were at Bradbury's time with the shells, we dont need to burn books if they lay untouched
But before enacting those laws, I want to talk earnestly with one of our party’s strongest constituencies, that being the Chamber of Commerce.
The Chamber of Commerce has been a boat anchor for the GOP for twenty years or more.
Buwaya,
Nobody has to tiptoe to find a multitude of classes in numerous majors in several different faculties in any flagship University. Your comments make it sound like you are only aware of tiny community colleges with five majors. You'd never know major medical and nursing schools are connected to Universities. Or that Universities host researchers who conduct archeological digs in Israel and Greece and Italy. Or that the Universities fund research in immunology and biology that pushes medical research in diseases that could afflict any family. You sound like you want to burn down the Library of Alexandria.
Socially: thousands and thousands of students attend major Universities. Lots of clubs, lots of socializing choices. Students get into a LOT more potential trouble sending naked pictures to boyfriends or posting pictures of drinking on-line. Very few students are involved in politics.
"I'm No Victim" Chuck immediately complains about being attacked in a comment where he claims he is no victim. Just a jaw-dropping lack of self awareness.
Chuck, you are practically the only commenter who gives a shit about the commenting rules being enforced or not enforced. In fact, I can't think of even a single other commenter who as complained to Althouse about enforcing the rules- we other commenters just don't seem to care one way or the other. Even Inga doesn't complain in the way you do.
"And especially online.
The atmosphere is of self-censorship.
The potential harm to careers is high on their minds."
you gotta talk to more 18-22 year olds.
You wouldn't believe what they are putting on-line. It's a HUGE problem. They are NOT worried about their careers, but they should be. Naked pictures, drunk pictures on instagram and social media. Potential harm to their careers is not on their mind. Politics is not on their minds either.
The view of this generation is strange. They are not a bunch of political activists. They are, however, teenagers, doing teenage things, but with the internet capturing all of it.
"Nobody has to tiptoe anywhere at a major University"
...
The potential harm to careers is high on their minds.
Not limited to sociopolitical topics. In fact, there have been conflicts between factions of the progressive kind, the liberal kind, and others. Dissenting from the scientific, social, political, ethical, or semantic consensus invites witch hunts and warlock trials. This is the age of weirdness... again, and again, and again.
Librarians and archivists do their best to provide good water; we can't make the beasts drink, and that's in large measure because the environment we operate in is obsessed with money and credentials. It's interesting to me to see people here approach the issue from different places but with a similar POV: money and credentials uber alles.
Which attitude only reinforces the notions that old-fashioned humanities studies are either pointless or subversive, that knowledge is equivalent to and coterminous with what is available online (increasingly for a price), and that a college-educated person can't damn well be expected to keep developing -themselves- ever after.
Narr
Classrooms are over-rated; I'm going to the pool
No I've learned more literature and other subjects since I left university, the problem is the malware or mind arson.
Carrington Event-- Nature's reset button
Nobody has to tiptoe to find a multitude of classes in numerous majors in several different faculties in any flagship University.
I think I have 4w figured out. She is an assistant professor of Gender Studies at someplace like Oberlin .
You wouldn't believe what they are putting on-line. It's a HUGE problem. They are NOT worried about their careers, but they should be. Naked pictures, drunk pictures on instagram and social media.
Pixels are forever. I can picture a forty-something matron two decades hence running for PTA president, and someone associated with her opponent quietly shows her some pictures from her teens and twenties and asks whether she would rather withdraw or would she rather her kids and the kids' classmates see what Mommy looked like naked back when she was younger. Back in my day -- fifty plus years ago -- there weren't cheap digital cameras or expensive but ubiquitous iPhones around, but there were Polaroid cameras so the women from my high school and college classes could have posed naked ("nude" is too dignified!) but didn't. I had a girlfriend whose prior boyfriend tried to talk her into posing for him, but she didn't bite and I suspect that some did but relatively few when compared to today.
@Michael K., whoever she is, she is miles away from reality in every possible direction.
"You wouldn't believe what they are putting on-line. It's a HUGE problem. They are NOT worried about their careers, but they should be. Naked pictures, drunk pictures on instagram and social media. Potential harm to their careers is not on their mind. Politics is not on their minds either."
I speak mainly to young men in technical fields. THEY are not sending naked pictures of themselves out, they tend to be very serious people and they are worried about their careers. Their obsessions tend to be along the lines of computer games. A lot of them are AFRAID of their required gen-ed classes, besides despising them. They aren't political either, but know all about the socio-cultural and career risks.
wwww: "...wasn't thinking this..."
The above is universal truth.
At best wwww was emoting this.
At worst it's just old fashioned, unthinking, repetitive mush.
Not lies because that requires thought.
I've been hearing this "Liberal young people are the wave of the future" all my life.
Reagan was supposed to be swamped in 1980 by all the young Boomers who just got the yote. If Mosaics are liberal its not because they're young, its because a huge percentage of them non-white and sons/daughters of Immigrants. Its demographics not generational.
OK, wait.
Their respect for rules?
Say what?
More like, their insistence on making up new rules for everyone else as they go along.
And “ ‘a society where boundaries of race, gender, and sexual orientation are porous’ ”?
So Rachael Dolezal and Elizabeth Warren are their intellectual leaders, then?
Chuck protests: You hate me, for my criticism of Trump.
No, rather it's because you are a clueless prick.
It's interesting how Democrats don't really believe in Democracy. They seek voters they can corrupt and manipulate:
The Black Block enslaved to the Left through dependency on the Welfare State.
Soon to be replaced by Latinos imported from failing states, easy to enslave through "free" perks and as a bonus, they are more prone to tolerate corruption in their leaders.
Now youth, too ignorant and inexperienced to understand the complexity of life and it's issues, a naivete that any snake oil salesmen could exploit.
And then the Leftist MSM, who are more about keeping information from the electorate than they are about informing them.
The Democrats don't really believe in Democracy.
Chuck: You worthless shit heads can’t hurt me. How can you possibly victimize me? And I don’t want anything from you
Will someone take Chuckie out for a poop so he quits barking for attention.
Leash your pets at Althouse, wth happened to that sign?
Nobody has to tiptoe anywhere at a major University.
If you truly believe that, you need to get out more.
Yancey Ward said...
Chuck, you are practically the only commenter who gives a shit about the commenting rules being enforced or not enforced. In fact, I can't think of even a single other commenter who as complained to Althouse about enforcing the rules- we other commenters just don't seem to care one way or the other. Even Inga doesn't complain in the way you do.
How soon that memory fades on Althouse's policy change (for a short period) that required that responses be approved by our host. I don't know if there was a banning of some who spent time bad-mouthing long-time posters like Chuck - but posts returned to near normality responses mostly directed at the issue at hand with mean personal attacks disappearing.
The fact that Chuck and I believe that Individual 1 is a criminal is supported by the man's illegal activities throughout his life. There simply is nothing there to honor but much to fear, so say what you believe but leave Chuck's opposite view out of your comments. If personal attacks and ridicule is "all you got, you got nothing." And just because Inga doesn't complain about your insults doesn't mean that you don't owe her an apology as well.
This is the reason democracies always die... you reach a point where people think they can vote for free stuff forever and end up killing themselves in the process... Personally, I think we need to move to a system where only people who pay taxes and/or have served in the military or civilian service should be allowed to vote... Freeloaders shouldn't get a say...
Ah, polaroids. I have some still, mementos of decades.
Narr
They stir me yet
The Poor Mans LLR Chuck gadfly: "The fact that Chuck and I believe ...."
LOLOLOLOL
Too too funny.
And getting funnier.
Every. Single. Day.
Adam Schiff Cuckholster Chuck: "As for “no collusion,” I bought the Mueller Report. I bought it through the Althouse Amazon portal.. I didn’t exonerate Trump. I think it calls out for an impeachment investigation."
LOLOLOLOL
Chuck the "lawyer"....
Chuck the "LLR".....
It just doesnt get any funnier than that.
Recall the story about Robert Kennedy running for president and addressing a group of college students? He's telling them all of the wonderful things he'll do: eradicate hunger and disease, help the poor, build houses, provide healthcare, assist the elderly, achieve this and that....
The students cheered and applauded.
"And you know who is going to pay for all of this? Who's going to do it? Who's going to sacrifice?" he asked. "You and you and you and you" he replied pointing to the students.
Suddenly it got quiet.
Once again, as always, LLR Chuck has positioned himself to the far left of his fellow leftists/dems.
Unexpectedly, naturally.
The fact that Chuck and I believe that Individual 1 is a criminal is supported by the man's illegal activities throughout his life.
"Show me the man and I will show you the crime" You would get along well with Beria, gaddie.
"THEY are not sending naked pictures of themselves out, they tend to be very serious people and they are worried about their careers."
err.....you're not the target demographic. Ask your 20 something kids if they've heard of indiscreet photos being circulated in their age group.
Michael K,
LOL! I had two friends who went to the music conservatory at Oberlin. One is now a Cantor. Haven't seen either for about 10 years. Neither posts political stuff on Facebook. I never got the impression they were all that interested in politics. Both were obsessed with music.
I'm a lot closer in age to this generation then you all. If you all want to panic about the younger doomed generation, be my guest. But I will tell you this: college students are a lot less political then you think, and (to Buuwaya) they are a LOT less discreet about the pictures they post and send then they oughta be.
Uh oh.
The handlers let LLR Chuck's hero, Sleepy Creepy Slow Joe Biden, off the leash for 15 minutes and Joe gives us this incredibly racist comment:
Edward-Isaac Dovere
✔
@IsaacDovere
Tonight at a fundraiser in NYC, Biden recalled serving with a major segregationist Mississippi senator: “I was in a caucus with James O. Eastland ... he never called me boy, he always called me son.” He imitated the drawl. “At least there was some civility. We got things done”
2,028
7:36 PM - Jun 18, 2019
In Slow Joes defense, this incredibly racist and dumb and tone-deaf comment is only slightly worse than "LLR Chuck's racist "Department of Black People" comment which Chuck at first passionately defended then, after pushback, denied he had said then, after being exposed, then tried to put those words into Trumps mouth!!
I can only imagine the degree to which gadfly worships Chuck, which only encourages Chuck's astonishing narcissism.
If you all want to panic about the younger doomed generation, be my guest.
I'm not panicked. You are another to project your own fantasies. My grandson wants to go to West Point. Two granddaughters are into sports. I do have a leftist (trial lawyer ) son whose family is a mess. That is their problem as he does not want advice from me.
If anyone is panicking it is you.
If anyone is panicking it is you.
? The topic of the blog post is all about older generation angst towards 18-22 year olds. I'm glad your grandkids are doing well. Congrats the admit to West Point!
My kids are toddlers. I'm sure I'll have plenty to panic about when they get older. But I'm not worried about their generation as a group.
Nor am I but I do worry about the kids who go to these leftist academies like Oberlin and probably Harvard and Yale although the pathology seems to be in Humanities and not in STEM.
I am very unhappy, unlike you, with K12 education. My grandson, not yet admitted to West Point, was having trouble with 4th grade math. Common Core again. The teacher told my DIL that she could not do the problems, either, and suggested she teach him at home using traditional methods.
Fortunately, they found a good charter school. The teachers' union, of course is furious.
Funny what comes back to me. I was no math whiz, but my younger brother (who probably had a higher IQ than I) was one of the first victims of the New Math. It fell to me to try to help him figure it out, which I could only do by reading his arithmetic book.
I caught on and helped him do so, but wondered why on earth anyone thought this was some advancement in pedagogy. Later he mastered math earlier and farther than I ever did, and became an accountant (like our father had been).
I think this must have been about 1965/66. I was about three years older.
Narr
Good thing he didn't need me for ALG II
"I am very unhappy, unlike you, with K12 education"
You keep making these random assumptions about me. First you assumed I am a feminist, when I hate the anti-natalist approach of that ideology. Now you're randomly assuming I like K-12 education in California.
I wouldn't send my kids to California public schools. I have friends in California who recently put their kids in a very expensive high school, due to the poor public schools. Other friends moved from California to Vermont ten years ago, in large part because of the schools in California.
I would send my kids to New Trier and other schools in specific northern Chicago burbs. But New Trier is not California pubic schools. Much of this analysis of schools is specific to localities and states. The situation in California is not identical to the situation in Winnetka or Highland Park, Illinois.
To be clear: there is a very small proportion of 18-22 year old students who are obnoxious and activist. But the much, much larger population 18-22 year olds is perfectly normal, largely a-political, and no reason to get upset. They are more interested in sports and music and hobbies then politics.
Fortune 500 companies are getting better results from Texas a and m and univ of Illinois Iowa Wisconsin than from the ivies, perhaps Cornell. Also univ of wash Seattle but you have to be carefully
Carefully selective for swim.
How soon that memory fades on Althouse's policy change (for a short period) that required that responses be approved by our host. I don't know if there was a banning of some who spent time bad-mouthing long-time posters like Chuck - but posts returned to near normality responses mostly directed at the issue at hand with mean personal attacks disappearing.
Geez it wasn't that long ago. The personal attacks disappeared because Chuck and Inga couldn't get their troll postings through moderation.
Couldn't comment yesterday when this thread was moving forward but what I found fascinating was the suggestion at the end of the OED entry that perhaps mosaic < musaeum < musaion (or whatever the Greek form/s is/are) temple to the Muses is, while correct, ultimately derived from some unknown word 'in an oriental language', nothing necessarily to do with the Muses (which possibility the OED article for museum doesn't mention at all).
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