March 7, 2019

Trump is right where he wants to be at this time point in his narrative arc.



(Just a hypothesis, but think about the long view leading up to the election and Trump's awareness of himself as theater.)

222 comments:

1 – 200 of 222   Newer›   Newest»
mccullough said...

It will be interesting to see which of the Dems Trump picks to be his opponent in the general election.

“The United States will never be a Socialist Country.”

So far the Dems are taking the bait.

And Trump has the Progressive Coffeee King out there defending Capitalism to the Wokeables and getting attacked to scare the shit out of the Soccer Moms. The Times Columnists are helpless. They see the strategy but the Wokeables demand purity. Intersectionality demands Socialism.

AJ Lynch said...

I noticed the LA Times and this Connecticut paper basically put out almost identical stories. I guess they were both on the same conference call with the DNC and CAP which gave them their marching orders.

AllenS said...

Pretty sure that "Swamped" relates to the invasion at the border from illegals. Don't tell Howard.

Sebastian said...

"Trump is right where he wants to be at this time point in his narrative arc.

Trump is always where he wants to be.

But the important practical question remains where the swing voters in swing states are.

The left, the MSM, and the deep state are helping him in a way, but it will be up to the Althouses to decide whether they have gone too far--far enough to override nice women's moral qualms about mean man Trump.

Mr. Majestyk said...

Is this why Trump keeps appointing boobs (Sessions) and swamp creatures (Rod Rosenstein, DOL Secretary Alex Acosta, and now Jessie Liu for the number 3 position at Justice (who as Vice President of the National Association of Women Lawyers signed a letter to Senators opposing Alito's nomination to the Supreme Court))?

traditionalguy said...

This is the Trump as the victim movie. When will they ever learn. I expect he has more movies set for release soon that will make Charles Bronson look like the nice guy compared to the Trump.

We have been seeing a continuous run of Academy award performances out of him.

tcrosse said...

This is Trump as the good guy in a professional wrestling match, where the bad guys are throwing all their dirty moves at him. Just as it looks like he's finished, he rises from the canvas and kicks ass.

Nonapod said...

In any story, any narrative arc, a hero need villians, forces arrayed against them. Trump has the entire Democrat party, most of the news media, most of Hollywood, no small number of Republican politicans, the anti-Trump "conservatives", and the DC Deep State apparatus... not to mention all the Foreign opponents, North Korea, Xi Jinping's China, and Putin's Russia... all rooting for him to fail. It feels like we're approaching Act III in the narrative structure of this story.

Chuck said...

Normally, Drudge headlines pay at least a passing nod to the actual content of the linked story.

With the current headline as Atlhouse linked it, "SWAMPED" is not a theme of the Washington Post multi-authored piece that Drudge linked to the CTPost online site. (Thanks Matt Drudge! None of your readers could have read it from behind the WaPo paywall.)

But I didn't see "swamp" or any reference to "the swamp" in the story. That part is pure Drudge editorializing. Pro-Trump editorializing. Blaming The Swamp, for Trump's multiple legislative failures.

By what account has Trump ever been a great, or even a decent, "negotiator" as President? His two biggest successes for conservatism have been the Supreme Court nominations; both pushed through by brute force of a bare majority in the new era of SCOTUS confirmations (with no filibusters). That is Trump's unprecedented advantage over past presidents.

Trump couldn't negotiate health care reform or a replacement to Obamacare. Trump got a tax bill, but again only as a pure simple-majority measure as budgetary reconciliation.

Trump hasn't negotiated immigration reform. Trump hasn't negotiated an infrastructure bill. Trump hasn't yet negotiated much of anything in terms of an international agreement yet; the new NAFTA deal is a remarkable example insofar as it was a negotiation that changed so little of what Trump had criticized as the worst deal in history.

And most recently, Trump "negotiated" his way into a corner with a federal budget shutdown, and in the end got less money for a wall than if he had done absolutely nothing and instead let Mitch McConnell negotiate for him.

This is Drudge's editorializing, blaming The Swamp for the failures that were objectively reported in the WaPo story.

Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...

The dying Clinton corruption machine refuses to let go.

EDH said...

Trump is the last man on earth against the socialist "family" and the swamp creatures.

The Omega Man

If you remember, in the end the Omega Man is eventually swamped, betrayed and dies in his own blood in the shape of a crucifix.

Humanity ends.

gilbar said...

tcrosse said...
This is Trump as the good guy in a professional wrestling match, where the bad guys are throwing all their dirty moves at him. Just as it looks like he's finished, he rises from the canvas and kicks ass.


I've preferred to think of Trump as Nature Boy Rick Flair. He's a villain; but he's OUR Villain! Plus, he has the figure four leg lock, which CANNOT BE BEAT!

Laslo Spatula said...

"The Omega Man"

Ah! One of Heston's late-60s/early-70s Dysfunctional Pessimistic Future films!

They sound like they should be a trilogy:
Planet of the Apes
The Omega Man
Soylent Green

But there are, in fact, FOUR of them.

Because everyone forgets "Beneath the Planet of the Apes."

Heston isn't the main star of that -- he is only in the beginning and end, agreeing to that only if they killed his character so he wouldn't have to deal with any more sequels.

So they kill his character. But not before his dying gesture: his bloody hand pushes the button of the Doomsday Bomb, and the Earth is obliviated to a cinder. Fuck You, Apes and Freakshow Mutants!

Moses, AND he blows up the world: Chuck, our nation turns its lonely eyes turn to you.

I am Laslo.

Meade said...

"But I didn't see "swamp" or any reference to "the swamp" in the story. That part is pure Drudge editorializing. Pro-Trump editorializing. Blaming The Swamp, for Trump's multiple legislative failures."

Every [citizen], in every [state], now has a decision to make. Either you are with us, or you are with the [swamp].

gilbar said...

EDH said...
If you remember, in the end the Omega Man is eventually swamped, betrayed and dies in his own blood in the shape of a crucifix. Humanity ends.


Or, DOES IT? there's the bottle of serum (made from his OWN Blood), just waiting there; to become the sacrament (representing, i assume; Ivanka Trump),that will SAVE HUMANITY

The question is: Will they make the sequel ?

Nonapod said...

"I was really good at being a bad guy; I like that role. Not being bad to people— just talking bad." - Ric Flair

traditionalguy said...

Marco Rubio says Maduro's police state run with foreign soldiers help is not a legitimate government. But it is actually a Mafia Gang stealing everything that it can take.

Trump's movies have slowly brought to light that the One Party Swamp that has governed for cash bribes in DC for the last 30 years is only a Maduro redux.

gilbar said...

Nonapod said...
"I was really good at being a bad guy; I like that role. Not being bad to people— just talking bad." - Ric Flair


See? it fits! plus, the Figure Four Leg Lock! Let's see you get out that!

Birkel said...

Imagine that. Recalcitrant radical Leftists won't give Trump anything. And Paul Ryan was more worried about maintaining his K-Street credentials than passing legislation supported by conservative voters. And Cocaine Mitch is a big government Republican.

And Trump suffers the blame.

The movie reference, or entertainment reference, is missed by those who blame Trump for everything. Those people have painted themselves into corners. Every criticism, especially unfounded ones, make Trump more sympathetic to the viewing public.

Althouse tracks the thread. Others are willfully blind. #sad

narciso said...

Theres actually a novelization of the Taylor story, that intercuts the two films pit now.

narciso said...

Actually hes more like gulliver, or giant man if were looking for metaphors.

JayDee77 said...

Where will the forthcoming assassination attempt fit in the narrative?

Laslo Spatula said...

If Hollywood would fund me I'd be glad to make a 'Planet of the Apes' film that tells the story from the point-of-view of Nova.

The Nova-bathing-naked-in-a-pond scene would be necessary for character development.

The camera might linger on her body, but only because it represents the view of the army gorillas hidden in the bushes, as they are looking on at her with bewilderment and cross-species lust.

I am Laslo.

johnhenry100 said...

Blogger Chuck said...

(Thanks Matt Drudge! None of your readers could have read it from behind the WaPo paywall.)

Wow. Just Wow!.

Drudge has had 29,450,380 unique visits in the past 24 hours. Do you really think that "none" of them have a sub to the WaPo? Are you really that stupid? Why, yes. Yes you are as demoed by countless notes here.

In the second place the Drudge headline link doesn't even go to WaPo. It goes to the Connecticut Post and no paywall

https://www.ctpost.com/news/article/Not-my-fault-Trump-struggles-to-defend-his-13668725.php

And in the 3rd place, when I go to WaPo and look for the story, it is not even behind the paywall. I got full access to read and even download to Pocket.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/not-my-fault-trump-struggles-to-defend-his-record-amid-setbacks-on-immigration-trade-north-korea/2019/03/06/19ab2ca4-4026-11e9-a0d3-1210e58a94cf_story.html?utm_term=.8b9a14820100


Trump couldn't negotiate health care reform or a replacement to Obamacare.

You keep saying this as if repeating it will make it true. I guess it could be true to someone who thinks that the only way to reform healthcare or replace Obamacare is another govt health program.

In reality, the reform of healthcare is coming along just fine. So is the replacement of Obamacare with the free market. Just because you stick your head up your ass and go "Neener, Neener, Neener, I don't see nuffink!" doesn't mean it is not moving along nicely. Probably much better than if Congress had passed some new healthcare act.

You really should not even try to participate here Chuck. You are just too stupid. Not even entertaining in your stupidity like Inga and Squeamish are at times.

Just boring.

Don't you have the unique distinction of being the only commenter ever asked by the host to leave? Then not leaving?

So I guess that is something

John Henry

Kay said...

Laslo Spatula said...
Because everyone forgets "Beneath the Planet of the Apes."

Heston isn't the main star of that -- he is only in the beginning and end, agreeing to that only if they killed his character so he wouldn't have to deal with any more sequels.

3/7/19, 9:22 AM


Heston’s character traveled to the Planet of the Apes with 3 other crew members in the first movie. I never understood why the Americans searching for him in the second one are ONLY looking for him.

Ficta said...

"None of your readers could have read it from behind the WaPo paywall." Huh? The link goes to the CT Post not the WaPo. And, anyway, you only need to know the magic words: "outline.com/" to read the Washington Post, if that's something you're into.

Meade said...

"With the current headline as Atlhouse linked it, "SWAMPED" is not a theme of the Washington Post multi-authored piece that Drudge linked to the CTPost online site."

As Althouse linked it? What link are you referring to?

J. Farmer said...

Trump certainly has a certain carnival barker charisma, but I have to say that the view of him as some kind of master strategist and negotiator seems to me little more than a PR gimmick. This guy has gotten rolled by Paul Ryan and John Bolton for fuck's sake.

Limited blogger said...

Can the Democrats maintain a constant state of panic for 2 years?

gilbar said...

Laslo Spatula said...
If Hollywood would fund me I'd be glad to make a 'Planet of the Apes' film that tells the story from the point-of-view of Nova.


That would Actually Be SO COOL! I think that we should hear her thoughts (as narrator, if you know what i mean?)

And Obviously, she'd Need to Bathe; Nova is a good clean girl; and good clean girls take LOTS of Baths

Achilles said...

The masks are off.

The Democrats and Republicans were working together to screw our country during the obamabushclintonbush years.

Now the Republican Party represents it’s voters and the Romney bush cuck wing is cast out but they are still stabbing us in the back with the current block of traitors still holding on.

They are still fighting for the people that own them. The same people that own the uniparty own the media and the swamp. The billionaires have no reason to stop fighting as long as their tools bear the brunt of open borders free trade endless wars agenda.

Michael K said...

Good essays on Trump from the POV of an Anthropologist.

Worth reading. (Not you Chuck)

https://zeroanthropology.net/2016/05/04/why-donald-j-trump-will-be-the-next-president-of-the-united-states/

and

https://zeroanthropology.net/2016/11/17/trump-and-anthropology/

Nobody mentions that his minor in college was Anthropology.

gilbar said...

Dr Mike, how long did it take the snow to melt in Tucson? Are they still skiing on Mt Lemon>?

buwaya said...

Re "Omega Man"
The last man, holding out against the mutants.
Thats a great analogy for Trump in Washington.

mezzrow said...

I've preferred to think of Trump as Nature Boy Rick Flair. He's a villain; but he's OUR Villain! Plus, he has the figure four leg lock, which CANNOT BE BEAT

Like Naitch, he's Custom Made. He can't help it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1LcJ6N9vwo

Kevin said...

Trump is surrounded and outnumbered like the 1st Marine Division at the Chosin Reservoir.

“All right, they’re on our left, they’re on our right, they’re in front of us, they’re behind us…they can’t get away this time” -- Chesty Puller

Chuck said...

It is a now nearly-daily theme with Rush Limbaugh; that Trump is the One Man standing between American freedom and an American socialist state.

As if Mike Lee, Ted Cruz, Jim Inhofe, Jeff Sessions, the Heritage Foundation, the American Enterprise Institute, the American Manufacturing Association, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, ALEC, National Review, Rupert Murdoch, Fox News Channel and the Wall Street Journal had never even existed.

This is moonbattery. As I have written before and expect to write again in the near future, as William F. Buckley founded the modern conservative movement in the late 1950's and the early 1960's, he was faced with a difficult problem; what to do about the John Birch Society elements of the movement. The Birchers had been accusing President Eisenhower of being a communist sympathizer. Much like today's "Deep State" allegations, the Birchers seriously thought that vast percentages of federal government employees were communists or communist sympathizers. They were, to Buckley's description, "nuts." Had Buckley not banished them and won control of the Movement, it could never have become what it is today.

That is where we are today. Principled conservatives versus the nutball wing of conservatism.

https://www.nationalreview.com/2017/06/william-f-buckley-john-birch-society-history-conflict-robert-welch/

Nonapod said...

I have to say that the view of him as some kind of master strategist and negotiator seems to me little more than a PR gimmick.

I don't believe he's exactly a master strategist. He's an effective demagogue who is able to get his various opponents to reveal their true nature. He's very good at manipulating the national discussion.

As for his negotiating skills, I think he's more willing to try unconventional approaches, more willing to take certain risks than a typical President. He has demonstrated he's more willing to "walk away" than settle for what might be a bad deal for what could be interpreted as a short term political win. Whether that makes him a master a negotiations is in the eye of the beholder I suppose.

Birkel said...

"...rolled by Paul Ryan..."

READ: A constitutionally elected member of an Article I institution could not be swayed by anything to disregard his own financial well-being paid for by K-Street lobbyists.

Or: Trump couldn't overturn an entire system devoted to the enrichment of compliant politicians and their benefactors.

Some people refuse to see the obvious.

Chuck said...

Meade said...
"With the current headline as Atlhouse linked it, "SWAMPED" is not a theme of the Washington Post multi-authored piece that Drudge linked to the CTPost online site."

As Althouse linked it? What link are you referring to?


Funny that you caught that. I started to write that Althouse linked to the CTPost online site. As she customarily links things in her blog posts. I wrote it that way, and then checked myself; it was Drudge, not Althouse, who chose the link. I started to edit myself to make it clear that it was a Drudge link and not an Althouse-selected hyperlink.

My garbled sentence then was only half-right. I should have (and meant to) drop the Althouse reference.

If I could re-edit my comment, I would. I am a bit like Althouse, insofar as I try to write carefully, but sometimes would like to edit after I hit the "publish" button. Althouse has that ability on this site, and if I had it I'd edit it.

It was Drudge's link, as I correctly wrote. It was not Althouse's link as I incorrectly wrote.

;-)

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

READ: A constitutionally elected member of an Article I institution could not be swayed by anything to disregard his own financial well-being paid for by K-Street lobbyists.

Sorry, but can you please explain what Article I has to do with Trump becoming a pitchman for the Paul Ryan legislative agenda during the first year of his presidency?

Birkel said...

The US Chamber of Commerce is one mechanism by which Republicans are bought. Most, like Paul Ryan, stay bought.

The Chamber is not conservative. They are part of the problem.

I enjoy people pretending The Long March failed. They announce themselves idiots.

rcocean said...

The Never trumpers sing only one tune: Orange man bad.

Jonah Goldberg had a particularly bad column about trump's cpac speech. Trump's been POTUS for over 2 years and Goldberg is still insinuating Trump is "just like Hitler". Pathetic.

Birkel said...

There is no link.
There is a screen cap.
Or does my url look different than others?

MadisonMan said...

The question is: Will they make the sequel ?

I don't see how you can make a sequel when The Omega Man was the last man. Omega is the end of the alphabet. Did he die next to a copy of Seuss's On Beyond Zebra?

J. Farmer said...

@Nonapod:

As for his negotiating skills, I think he's more willing to try unconventional approaches, more willing to take certain risks than a typical President. He has demonstrated he's more willing to "walk away" than settle for what might be a bad deal for what could be interpreted as a short term political win. Whether that makes him a master a negotiations is in the eye of the beholder I suppose.

Agree about the unconventionality (one of the reasons I gave him a shot as president), but I don't think it has bore much fruit. And the "walk away" is hardly unconventional; it's the oldest cliche in negotiating tactics. It's right up there with "ask for more than what you want so you can negotiate down to what you really want." That's 101 stuff. And I am not sure what "bad deal" Trump has yet to really walk away from. He's walking away from negotiating tables, not deals.

rcocean said...

Why Trump has surrounded himself with people with disagree with him is beyond my understanding. Nor do I understand why he let Roy Moore go down to defeat. And why would you trust Paul Ryan? Water under the bridge now.

Meade said...

"It was Drudge's link, as I correctly wrote. It was not Althouse's link as I incorrectly wrote."

Thanks for clarifying.

eric said...

I've become very disillusioned with Trump lately. He has been very disappointing on the border. He's basically giving Democrats votes for decades to come.

But, what other choice is there? Even though he is letting me down on the border, there is no alternative.

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

The Chamber is not conservative. They are part of the problem.

All the more foolish of Trump for trying to hitch his wagon to their star.

rcocean said...

McConnell and his gang, aren't politicians, they're businessmen. They provide legislation in exchange for $$$. Its that simple. Mitch isn't going to do anything on immigration until someone bribes him. Or outbids the Koch Brothers and the Chamber of Commerce.

Chuck said...

I'll add this as well, Meade...

Since Althouse didn't link to the Drudge link, the gist of her post is essentially "pure Drudge." That is, she made the editorial decision to just have the "SWAMPED" headline speak for itself, independent of any reporting.

This of course is her absolute editorial right as the proprietress of her own blog. An editorial decision. It makes the "Drudge" aspect of this blog post all the more important. The feeling of Trump being swamped by The Swamp. Put upon, by corrupt Washington special interests and insiders.

I think it works to a great extent as long as the audience is ignorant and uncurious, about how things really work in Washington and why. "Trump versus The Deep State" is a simplistic argument about something that is immensely complex.

I know that Althouse abhors "boring." That's okay. What I abhor is "simplistic."

Birkel said...

Sure, J Farmer. Trump tried to play ball with Ryan, who undoubtedly lied to and betrayed the president. Article I is relevant because that means Ryan had actual power within the system and Trump could only persuade the bought and paid for Ryan. But Trump could not bribe Ryan directly and had no system to bribe Ryan, as K-Street interests do.

The status quo is highly valuable to those who currently benefit. They will fight to maintain their ill-gotten advantages.

Meanwhile, Ford abandoned plans to build their new plant in Mexico and is instead building near Detroit. The Chinese will not be able to leverage Mexican trading interests. The replacement of NAFTA is a threat to the status quo. My prediction: Congress will avoid ratification as punishment to Trump. I hope I am wrong.

Achilles said...

Dickin'Bimbos@Home said...
The dying Clinton corruption machine refuses to let go.

The Clintons are awful criminals. They should e in jail.

But they were just cogs.

As long as you focus on them you don’t see the real problem.

Nonapod said...

And the "walk away" is hardly unconventional

It is unconventional if it's never done. To be fair, I don't know all the history in grueling detail of the US/North Korean various agreements and negotiations over the past 6 decades, so maybe the Presidential "walk away" is not unprecedented.

He's walking away from negotiating tables, not deals.

For most cases that seems to be a distinction without a difference. Any hypothetical deal requires a starting point obviously.

J. Farmer said...

@rcocean:

Jonah Goldberg had a particularly bad column about trump's cpac speech. Trump's been POTUS for over 2 years and Goldberg is still insinuating Trump is "just like Hitler". Pathetic.

These nepotistic, princeling Beltway journos like Jonah Goldberg and John Podhoretz are useless to read when it comes to understanding the current climate in American politics. There has been a fundamental shift, and they don't have a clue.

Seeing Red said...

700 jobs to Michigan.

With what’s going on in Mexico, Detroit could be safer. That’s very sad for Mexico and those who live on our southern border.

Michael K said...


Blogger gilbar said...
Dr Mike, how long did it take the snow to melt in Tucson? Are they still skiing on Mt Lemon>?


The road to Mt Lemmon was finally opened last week. It was closed for a week. We still see some on the peaks around us but it was 88 yesterday and 81 predicted for today.

What it looked like a week ago.

Meade said...

"That is where we are today. Principled conservatives versus the nutball wing of conservatism."

No, this is where we are today: Self-regarding "principled" establishment conservatives willing to compromise with socialists and Democrats in their quest for governmental power versus the Americans who support Trump and who will vote for him in 2020 because they want to keep the nation great — that is, economically prosperous, at peace with other nations (through strength), with secure national borders and immigration that is legal and, first,in the interest of Americans.

brylun said...

Just a point of clarification with Paul Ryan: There is no mention of Paul Ryan taking a K Street job on his Wikipedia page. And I don't remember seeing any news story reporting Ryan taking a K Street job. Anyone have any updates on Mr. Ryan?

Gospace said...

Chuck- the John Birchers were correct about that. A large percentage of U.S. government employees were- and are- communists or communist sympathizers. And until the Berlin Wall came down AND the Soviet Union collapsed, an even larger number were convinced the Soviet Union was going to eventually be on the winning side of history.

It's not a stretch today to believe that a large number of government employees are anti-American, in particular, the State Department. It seems all to often their actions are to look out for the interests of international organizations and other countries at the expense of the United States and our interests. The exact opposite of what they should be doing.

Ann Althouse said...

Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck.

Birkel said...

It is not Trump v The Deep State.

It is Trump and average Americans v trillions of dollars of foreign and domestic enterprises that depend on the status quo of 2016.
Large corporations and their CEOs did quite well under Bush and Trump but the nation lagged with ~2% annualized GDP growth.
That led to middle class stagnation, a loss of manufacturing, stagnant wages, and decreasing American optimism for the future.

But maintenance of the current structure is valuable to moneyed interests.
Now we are returned to the 3% annualized GDP growth of the 20th century amid de-regulation and optimism.

It is not a man but a system that rewards one relatively small group more than the vast majority of people.
Trump is the embodiment of that fight against a corrupt system.

Meade said...

"Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck."

Boring. I want to read the blog called The Enormous Power of Meade.

Birkel said...

Here I am following Althouse's rules and now I am asked that hypothetical?
That seems unfair.

Ann Althouse said...

To paraphrase Benjamin Disraeli, if I want to read a good blog, I will write one.

Ann Althouse said...

(My last comment is dedicated to Meade.)

Birkel said...

Meade,
Is that a phallic joke?

J. Farmer said...

@Nonapod:

To be fair, I don't know all the history in grueling detail of the US/North Korean various agreements and negotiations over the past 6 decades, so maybe the Presidential "walk away" is not unprecedented.

The "walk away" strategy was most prominently tried in 2002 when the Bush administration walked away from the Agreed Framework and allowed it to collapse. The North reacted by expelling inspectors, abrogating the NPT, reopening their plutonium reactor, and developing several nuclear warheads. The Bush administration, through the subsequent six-party talks, managed to negotiate a watered down version of the original Agreed Framework around 2005.

For most cases that seems to be a distinction without a difference. Any hypothetical deal requires a starting point obviously.

And I fail to see what Trump gained by walking away at Hanoi except to make the NoKo's more reluctant to sit down again.

Birkel said...

People with goals antithetical to yours: Should we imagine a successful resolution of differences?

Questions generally answered by whether one side is willing to kill 20-30% of the adult male population of the other side.

Birkel said...

Bank robbers and cops.
Is a solution possible.

Two year olds and parents.
Can an accord be reached at meal time?

Ann Althouse said...

On the question of what "swamped" refers to... I didn't click on the link. My comments in the post are based entirely on the Drudge graphic and the impression it makes just knowing generally what's been going on in the country. I interpreted it to mean Trump has a lot of troubles and they are building up all around him and there seems to be no way out. If this were a movie, this would be a point about where Trump is in relation to November 2020 and reelection. His position right now — swamped — looks like we're in a hero narrative in which he wins reelection.

When I saw what I saw at Drudge, I thought: Drudge wants to help Trump, so what's the theory that it helps Trump.

I don't need details at any link. But I was influenced by having just read the headline at the top of WaPo: "Trump losing ground on top priorities, casts blame on others/President Trump’s recent setbacks on immigration, trade and North Korea are complicating his planned reelection message as a can-do president who is making historic progress."

Molly said...

(eaglebeak)

Don't want to read a blog about Chuck's anything, but very much appreciate the euphony in the words "Immense Complexity"

Achilles said...

J. Farmer said...

Sorry, but can you please explain what Article I has to do with Trump becoming a pitchman for the Paul Ryan legislative agenda during the first year of his presidency?

How can we be obtuse and smug today?

There were about 50 cuck traitors like Ryan who sandbagged the first 2 years then “retired.”

Trump tried to take out Obamacare through legislation and those several dozen cuck traitor republicans who ran for years on repealing Obamacare betrayed their voters.

Those same swamp things wrote the Democrat budget and dared trump to shut down the government.

Their Democrat allies refused to work on immigration.

Now they are suing him for national emergency declarations.

I am curious just what you think Trump should be doing differently.

Nobody likes a peanut gallery champion.

traditionalguy said...

A can do President President Truman still won the 1948 election by running against the GOP controlled "Do Nothing Congress." Harry gave them the hell they deserved, rhetorically. Trump may actually arrest several of them for Treason and give them all expense paid Cuban Resort Vacations.

Sebastian said...

"the blog called The Enormous Power of Meade"

But will it have a comments section? Where we can marvel at the way the Enormously Powerful Meade got Chuck to shut up and leave?

Nonapod said...

J. Farmer said...The "walk away" strategy was most prominently tried in 2002 when the Bush administration walked away from the Agreed Framework and allowed it to collapse.

The history of the whole "Agreed Framework" is messy and up to interpretation. But no matter your position on it, it underscores the difficulties of the North Korea problem has presented for any administration. One of the biggest difficulties has always been that any agreement (good or bad) made by one administration could be undone by another. A fact that no doubt the leadership of North Korea is aware of.

In fact it means that the North Korea problem may not be (currently) solvable by any US President. This is because any agreement made by a US President today has to be something that can't easily be undone, undermined, or otherwise abrigated by a future President from a rival party. It has to be something that basically denuclearizes Korea in such a way that it can't be easily reversed. It has to be something that a future President won't even want to mess with. And honestly, I'm very skeptical that such a thing could even be achieved at this point in time.

nob490 said...

J. Farmer: These nepotistic, princeling Beltway journos like Jonah Goldberg and John Podhoretz are useless to read...

I couldn't agree more. Trump has his flaws, surely, but these two dopes -- who I used to enjoy reading -- have gotten beyond smug and condescending. They like to smirk and spout their Hayek and Locke, noses in the air, just too smart for our own good. They're unpleasant and take inordinate pleasure when they see evidence of DJT struggling.

Princeling is such a fine word choice here.

narciso said...

Well the framework was nonsense on stilts, that was breached when aq Khan was allowed into the country, he had imput into the Iranian and Libyan nuclear programs

Meade said...

"But will it have a comments section?"

I doubt it. Blog commenting is for pussies.

Yancey Ward said...

"Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck."

A book best understood by first graders.

Yancey Ward said...

It is amusing to consider that Trump is both the new Hitler and powerless all at the same time.

AJ Lynch said...

"Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck."

Nah- I would rather get audited by the IRS. Or be forced to read an Andrew Sullivan awakening or be enlightened about Trump by another tedious Jonah Goldberg column.

tcrosse said...

"Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck."

Regrets. I was planning to have the Hells Angels pull my teeth out with Vise Grips.

nob490 said...

Yeah, no thanks. Like tcrosse, I'm scheduled to have my gums removed.

J. Farmer said...

@Achilles:

I am curious just what you think Trump should be doing differently.

I don't think he should have spent the first year of his presidency being a pitchman for Paul Ryan's domestic agenda. Especially considering it was antithetical to what he ran on.

narciso said...

Did the bulwinkle gig fall through?

traditionalguy said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Otto said...

@meade -wow that was great!
I guess my wife was right, opposites make for a good marriage.

traditionalguy said...

Against all odds, HST used his Presidency to push through the UN a recognition of the existence of the Jewish State of Israel in 1947. Against all odds, DJT used his Presidency to push through the recognition of Jerusalem as the Capital of the Jewish State of Israel in 2017.

No wonder the much hated President Trump is being hatefully attack from all of the sides in DC in 2020 in the same way that the much hated President Truman was attacked from all of the sides in DC in 1948. It's a spiritual war.

J. Farmer said...

@Nonapod:

And honestly, I'm very skeptical that such a thing could even be achieved at this point in time.

I agree that North Korea is a particularly difficult problem but still one that is amenable to positive developments. But progress cannot be made until the US tempers its unrealistic demands. For the North Koreans to hand over their weapons and dismantle their facilities (in essence, abandon their core security concern of the last several decades) in exchange for sanctions relief is tomfoolery. They'd have to be suicidal to take such a deal.

J. Farmer said...

@narciso:

Well the framework was nonsense on stilts, that was breached when aq Khan was allowed into the country, he had imput into the Iranian and Libyan nuclear programs

No it wasn't, but that is the standard hawkish line. Jeffrey Lewis has a concise and broad defense of the Agreed Framework at 38 North.

Michael K said...

versus the Americans who support Trump and who will vote for him in 2020 because they want to keep the nation great

Another interesting take on Trump.

So yes, they vote for the guy promising to put things back the way they were, the guy who'd be a wake-up call to the blue islands. They voted for the brick through the window.

The short version.

narciso said...

High priests of arms control dont impress,

Unknown said...

Now, the enormous power of mead, perhaps..

Unknown said...

I really used to enjoy Goldberg as well. I certainly never expected what happened there.

And while I have recognized NPR's bias for decades, I used to be able to at least listen to them. No more.

J. Farmer said...

@narciso:

High priests of arms control dont impress

Who cares who said it? Was the information right or wrong? What was incorrect about the argument?

buwaya said...

"For the North Koreans to hand over their weapons and dismantle their facilities (in essence, abandon their core security concern of the last several decades) in exchange for sanctions relief is tomfoolery. They'd have to be suicidal to take such a deal."

The more basic fact is that it is not up to the US to make such a change. The only way anything will lead to a productive negotiation is for the NK regime and the country itself to have a change of heart of some sort, whether through greed or despair or loss of faith. Everything has been waiting on that.

The same was true with respect to the Soviet Union. Beyond fighting off their attempts to expand, especially through subversion, and to deter their more overt threats (those tank-fleets in Eastern Europe really did exist), the only thing to do was wait. Reagan and Bush were there when the Soviets eventually did lose faith and break.

US and SK politicians have been beating each other over the heads for decades over something they have no real way to change.

Birkel said...

Defenses of Democratics pipe dreams of corralling Beijing's pet... tell me the one about the hook handed fellow and the couple at the drive-in too...

Tell me about the autonomy North Korea enjoys to make its own decisions.
Client states as imagined by crazy people.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“No, this is where we are today: Self-regarding "principled" establishment conservatives willing to compromise with socialists and Democrats in their quest for governmental power versus the Americans who support Trump and who will vote for him in 2020 because they want to keep the nation great — that is, economically prosperous, at peace with other nations (through strength), with secure national borders and immigration that is legal and, first,in the interest of Americans.”

Don’t forget that Democrats and even socialists are American too and are as invested in keeping the nation great, as Trumpists claim to. We knew the nation was always great despite its warts and never need to be made great again by the likes of a Trump.

Chuck said...

Michael K said...
versus the Americans who support Trump and who will vote for him in 2020 because they want to keep the nation great

Another interesting take on Trump.

So yes, they vote for the guy promising to put things back the way they were, the guy who'd be a wake-up call to the blue islands. They voted for the brick through the window.

The short version.



More substance to what I was writing yesterday; how both the Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez wing of the Democratic Party, and the Trump wing of the Republican Party seem to want more "brick through the windows" guys. Two sides of the same disreputable coin.

I don't think we mainstream Republicans and Movement Conservatives will ever be in either of those camps, since -- I'd like to think and I hope -- we are the guys who own the windows. And, we've got principles about little things like hurling bricks through windows.

J. Farmer said...

@buwaya:

The only way anything will lead to a productive negotiation is for the NK regime and the country itself to have a change of heart of some sort, whether through greed or despair or loss of faith. Everything has been waiting on that.

I think it is very unlikely that the North Korean nuclear genie can be put back in its bottle. But successful diplomatic engagement can gain important concessions from the North, and we should be pursuing those in good faith. The ineffective maximum pressure campaign to force the North's into a deal they would never accept has thus far gone nowhere.

Drago said...

Ann Althouse: "Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck."

According to victoria, none of us males are that adventurous.

Plus Chuck's content would be equivalent to every other lefty site's content, so nothing unique there.

If I want to know what Chuck is thinking I'll just pull up any recent transcript of Joy Behar.

narciso said...

That is the truth, there isnt any appreciable dissident movement there, the best would probably the spymaster who has been the go between for seven years, that's their andropov.

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

Tell me about the autonomy North Korea enjoys to make its own decisions.
Client states as imagined by crazy people.


The old "China can make North Korea do whatever it wants" argument has been debunked over and over. Yes, the North is a client state of China, and yes China exerts a great deal of influence over the North. However, why is this so? For one, the North provides a useful buffer against the western-backed south, which would otherwise be right on China's border. If China exerted the kind of pressure that could collapse the state, it would not only be faced with potentially pulling in the South (and thus the US), but it would have a chaotic failed state right on its borders with all the headaches that implies (e.g. millions of poor, uneducated North Koreans pouring into China).

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“On the question of what "swamped" refers to... I didn't click on the link. My comments in the post are based entirely on the Drudge graphic and the impression it makes just knowing generally what's been going on in the country. I interpreted it to mean Trump has a lot of troubles and they are building up all around him and there seems to be no way out.”

That’s how I interpreted your screenshot of the drudge headline.

IMO Trump’s troubles are all of his own making and his chickens are coming home to roost.

Howard said...

Framed in an oversized hall to signal to his marks he is their Christ

Rick said...

Don’t forget that Democrats and even socialists are American too and are as invested in keeping the nation great, as Trumpists claim to. We knew the nation was always great despite its warts and never need to be made great again by the likes of a Trump.

Strange these Socialists keep asserting their desire to fundamentally transform America then right? I wonder who is telling the truth about what socialists want: triumphant socialists who think there's no longer a need to hide behind incrementalism or someone who provably lies about everything she believes and supports?

Tough question.

Howard said...

Halo not hall

Birkel said...

Corporatists love the current situation and are planning to keep it that way.

North Korea is a client state. Any discussion that assumes they have free will to make decisions is buggered. The train Kim rose to each of the summits stopped in China on the way. Marching orders were given and well-received.

Howard said...

Donald promised to drain the swamp he is now drowning in

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“According to victoria, none of us males are that adventurous.”

Why always bring other commenters into discussions and threads that have nothing to do with their comments on a different thread on a different day? This is just childish. Why don’t you TRY not to do that. Althouse has indicated she doesn’t even want us naming other commenters by name. Why do you think you are exempt?

Birkel said...

Ha! Now we have an allegation that North Korea is not a failed state. Meanwhile the people are three inches shorter than 60 years ago.

Failure has an interesting definition.

buwaya said...

" we are the guys who own the windows."

No, you don't. I live here among the people who really do own the windows.

Birkel said...

To be fair, Althouse said she didn't want us naming other commenters in disagreements.

That leaves asking for clarification, quoting people, and agreement as acceptable instances to name people.

Drago said...

Inga The Forgetful: "Why always bring other commenters into discussions and threads that have nothing to do with their comments on a different thread on a different day?"

Because that topic was fun, playful, full of mirth and humor.

I'm sorry that eludes you. Perhaps another hoax dossier would provide a nice 'pick me up' for you. Some 'backdoor' mailing and blog strategizing with your lefty teammate Chuck?

Good luck with that.

Seriously, all the best.

Birkel said...

East Germany on 11-8-89: not failed?
East Germany on 11-9-89: failed?

Meade said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Chuck said...

I really enjoyed reading this:

Meade said...
"That is where we are today. Principled conservatives versus the nutball wing of conservatism."

No, this is where we are today: Self-regarding "principled" establishment conservatives willing to compromise with socialists and Democrats in their quest for governmental power versus the Americans who support Trump and who will vote for him in 2020 because they want to keep the nation great — that is, economically prosperous, at peace with other nations (through strength), with secure national borders and immigration that is legal and, first,in the interest of Americans.


It is Meade making himself clear; and he clearly thinks differently than I do, and has none of my party political affiliations and he clearly likes something very significant about Trump.

That's fine. I don't expect people to agree with me; I just want people to be clear, to try to understand issues in all their complexity and to choose sides.

It's a refreshing post from Meade because it doesn't get my "Cruel Neutrality Bullshit" tag. It's honest and clear. More Trump.

This is good.

Birkel said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

Ha! Now we have an allegation that North Korea is not a failed state. Meanwhile the people are three inches shorter than 60 years ago.

Failure has an interesting definition.


A "failed state" is one where centralized government authority has broken down. Think Somalia, Afghanistan, or Libya. North Korea is an economic basket case, but its government is in full control of its territory.

Birkel said...

Failure as defined by people not enjoying the successes.
Gotcha.

Chuck said...

Ann Althouse said...
On the question of what "swamped" refers to... I didn't click on the link. My comments in the post are based entirely on the Drudge graphic and the impression it makes just knowing generally what's been going on in the country. I interpreted it to mean Trump has a lot of troubles and they are building up all around him and there seems to be no way out. If this were a movie, this would be a point about where Trump is in relation to November 2020 and reelection. His position right now — swamped — looks like we're in a hero narrative in which he wins reelection.

When I saw what I saw at Drudge, I thought: Drudge wants to help Trump, so what's the theory that it helps Trump.

I don't need details at any link. But I was influenced by having just read the headline at the top of WaPo: "Trump losing ground on top priorities, casts blame on others/President Trump’s recent setbacks on immigration, trade and North Korea are complicating his planned reelection message as a can-do president who is making historic progress."


So satisfying; this is exactly what I was trying to articulate about my interpretation of the main Althouse blog post. I'm glad I understood it exactly as you intended. Even without any lengthy writing on your part. Just your display of the graphic was all that was needed!

And now I'm thinking, Meade wants to help Trump too!

Drago said...

"Eddie Haskell republican Chuck: "That's fine. I don't expect people to agree with me;"

Nonsense!!

Every single far left and lunatic leftist on this blogsite is in complete agreement with you and they all defend you passionately.

Because you are the Truest Of The True Conservatives.......(wink wink)

Meade said...

"Don’t forget that Democrats and even socialists are American too"

Then why don't you self-identify as Americans? Ah, but you say, you do? I mean American first, instead of last, only after you identify by party, race, ideology, ethnicity, areligion, gender, classs, sex, age, and so on...

For us, our American identity comes first before all others. I hope one day you'll decide to join us — one American nation with malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right...

Birkel said...

Not praising Meade twice.

Meade said...

"And now I'm thinking, Meade wants to help Trump too!"

And by Trump, I assume you mean our democratically elected president of the United States, President Donald J. Trump.

Absolutely. I want to help him help us keep America great. Don't you? Because if you do not, I clearly see you as choosing to be a part of the problem.

Drago said...

One would expect a greater economy of words by our LLR's in support of the lefty policy outcomes they so clearly desire.

I suppose none of them happen to be marketing people.

Something along the lines of "Open Borders 'R' A-OK" would be much more effective in terms of communications.

How about "Make America Democrat Controlled Again" is also a keeper.

How about something historical?

"Once you accept the Lefty-geld you never get rid of the lefties" (thats a Billy "Cap'n Bill" Kristol subreference)

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

Failure as defined by people not enjoying the successes.
Gotcha.


"Failed state" has had a specific meaning since the phrase was first introduced a few decades ago. That it's not what you think it should mean is beside the point. I know you like to get hung up on semantic minutiae, but the point remains that North Korea, for all its backwardness and brutality, has a functioning state that exerts total control over its territory, and thus is not a failed state.

If the North Korean government collapsed, and there was no effective centralized control within the country, then you could describe North Korea as a failed state. If North Korea became a failed state, it would be a significantly bigger problem for the world, and is something China considers pretty much a nightmare scenario. As we have seen repeatedly over the last couple of decades, when you collapse a government, you end up with violent anarchism within the country and massive refugee outflow into neighboring countries. This is not a scenario China wants to find itself in with North Korea and is willing to go to great lengths to prevent it. And that is precisely why China takes such a role in underwriting the stability of the NoKo government.

J. Farmer said...

@Meade:

Absolutely. I want to help him help us keep America great. Don't you? Because if you do not, I clearly see you as choosing to be a part of the problem.

Of course that all depends on what "help him" means. Who is a better model for "helping" Trump, Sean Hannity or Ann Coulter? I see one side of help as holding Trump's feet to the flame and reminding him of what got him in office in the first place, and I see another as essentially being a Trump spin doctor and primarily concerning oneself with defending him against "fake news" or the "the left." I suppose every president needs both, but I am pretty certain in the kind of help I'm interested in.

Gospace said...

Inga...Allie Oop said...
IMO Trump’s troubles are all of his own making and his chickens are coming home to roost.


I can actually agree with this. Trump's troubles are of his own making. How dare he run against the anointed one and have the temerity to actually WIN! Didn't he know he was supposed to lose? That's what all the polls showed.

If he hadn't won, he wouldn't have all these troubles!

unkirked said...

Sorry Mr. Meade. I don't believe in God either. And I don't believe as your 21st Christianity does, that God believes in America. I just believe in me. I self-identify as "the greatest person ever."

Meade said...

"Who is a better model for "helping" Trump, Sean Hannity or Ann Coulter?"

I don't know. But neither is part of either the so-called Resistance nor NeverTrump. Therefore I consider them allies.

Meade said...

"I just believe in me."

Okay. Yoko and thee? And that, I suppose, is reality.

wildswan said...

I've never been able to believe that Paul Ryan is is a K Street boy. He did not support Trump as I would have wished but he was part of Walker's Wisconsin reforms which were similar to those of Trump. When he came back to Wisconsin after he was no longer speaker he did a phone call on Mark Belling in which he said that while he was Speaker, the House passed 15 major bills - drafted, sent to committee, passed in House, to sent to Senate. These bills enacted the reforms Ryan wanted passed and so he felt his job was done. The Senate shot them down so it looks like no achievement. But I think Ryan is one of the good guys. He ran from Trump in a way I wish he hadn't but he was Speaker trying to control the House so it would pass legislation, so maybe that is why. Speaker Ryan didn't really get who Trump was or maybe he would have worked on Trump's agenda not his own; but that's a lot to expect from someone who had a career in politics before Trump ever got in. It's like investing in Xerox or Apple before they were big or selling your jewels to finance Columbus.

Drago said...

Inga The Super Duper Forgetful: "Why don’t you TRY not to do that."

You mean I should TRY to adhere to the wishes of Althouse and Meade?

Si, for instance, if Althouse or Meade asked me to stop posting on this blogsite you think I should do as they ask?

Please, why dont you share your thoughts on that "hypothetical".

Should be interesting.

unkirked said...

"And that, I suppose, is reality."

Certainly. As far as I can see.

J. Farmer said...

I don't know. But neither is part of either the so-called Resistance nor NeverTrump. Therefore I consider them allies.

Fair enough.

Drago said...

What time is the next anti-semitic Women's March?

Will they have even more Farrakhan fangirls in attendence?

Inga, you seem rather well informed on this anti-semitic/anti-Israel Hatefest group. Do you have inside info to share?

Michael K said...

we are the guys who own the windows. And, we've got principles about little things like hurling bricks through windows.

"Imagination is funny."

wildswan said...

As for Trump having a "bad week": in that same week Hillary said she wasn't running and then she said when I say I'm not running I don't mean I'm not running. Meaning? Possibly meaning that she is slinking around the candidates' circle like a wolf around a buffalo herd, waiting to pull the weak members down. Ilhan has continued her anti-semitic comments. Two stories about Occasional showed that her mother moved to avoid New York taxes and her campaign worked out of Tennessee for the same reason. A dozen stories about Pelosi suggested that she had lost control of the party to Occasional - not that I believe that! But the party is now supporting socialism. And Bernie of the Three Houses feels that he should lead the movement he fought for it in 2016 while Occasional feels she is Boss because she has suggesting taking away everyone's furnace and car and replacing them with a solar panel and a bike. Out in Iowa, pocahontas is racing across the Great Plains, still under fire from the First People.

So this was Trump's bad week?

Chuck said...

Meade said...
"And now I'm thinking, Meade wants to help Trump too!"

And by Trump, I assume you mean our democratically elected president of the United States, President Donald J. Trump.

Absolutely. I want to help him help us keep America great. Don't you? Because if you do not, I clearly see you as choosing to be a part of the problem.


It would be interesting to check with President Donald J. Trump on how that worked during the Presidencies of Reagan, GHW Bush, Clinton, GW Bush, and Obama.

Did he think it his duty as a prominent American to help democratically elected presidents do their best for the nation?

The only U.S. President I can think of citizen Trump helping was... Bill Clinton.

narciso said...

Now we know who the leaker:
https://dailycaller.com/2019/03/07/john-kelly-worked-for-hillary-clinton/

Meade said...

"The only U.S. President I can think of citizen Trump helping was... Bill Clinton. "

I imagine I speak on behalf of nearly all Americans who self-identify first and foremost as "American," Chuck: If you care to keep looking back and re-litigating who was a "true conservative" and who wasn't, hey, knock yourself out. I... don't... care.

I'll start with current rising incomes for working middle class Americans and paraphrase a former Clinton advisor: It's the economy, stupid.

Chuck said...

I imagine I speak on behalf of nearly all Americans who self-identify first and foremost as "American," Chuck: If you care to keep looking back and re-litigating who was a "true conservative" and who wasn't, hey, knock yourself out. I... don't... care.


Barack Obama was never a "true conservative" or even a self-identified conservative. It isn't about conservatism at all.

But Donald Trump didn't just fail to make himself useful to Obama (and as someone who did everything he could to oppose Obama in two elections and try to help elect McCain, and then Romney, I'd argue that Trump had no duty to help Obama); Donald Trump actively fought the weirdest low-grade warfare against Obama that we've seen in Presidential politics in perhaps 100 years. Trump went with the "Birther" claims. It wasn't just weird; it was disgraceful and destructive. Trump was wrong all along, of course. And more than just wrong, he was borderline sociopathic, with his phony claim about having personally dispatched his own investigators to Hawaii, who were finding things "they can't believe" about Obama.

Birkel said...

Yes, all the finest people got together and decided what terms mean. For all times, amen.

Those same self-defined elites have fucked up nearly everything into which they could lay their grubby mitts.

So you'll excuse me if I don't believe the inhabitants of the "central(ly) controlled" state of North Korea who have tasted bark soup believe they are living in anything but a failed state.

You are using the terminology of people who believe all the things you allege you think are failed policies. What does that make you?

gilbar said...

Meade said... Then why don't you self-identify as Americans?

hope you don't mind that I self-identify as Iowan
an Iowan that (like 3 of my Great Great Grandfathers) believes in a Permanent Union

Birkel said...

I reject the orthodox view of American interventionism and so forth.
I do so with the terminology of those who hold the views I reject.

Making sense of the world is hard.

Kevin said...

I don't think we mainstream Republicans and Movement Conservatives

Those are the people who could neither repeal nor replace Obamacare, given eight years to construct a strategy and two with both houses of Congress and a willing President.

They are the equivalent of the architects of California's train from nowhere to nowhere, and have removed themselves from the realm of serious discussion.

Birkel said...

"Not one of our people, Muffy" and other stupid defenses of Democratics.

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

You are using the terminology of people who believe all the things you allege you think are failed policies. What does that make you?

Nope. Not going down that semantic rabbit hole with you. Nice try, though. Forget the phrase "failed state" if you wish.

A state is not defined by its ability to provide provisions to its citizens. It is defined by its monopoly of legitimate force over a defined area of territory. This is true in a place like North Korea, which exercises total political control over its territory. This is not true in places like Somalia or Libya, where pieces of territory are controlled by various armed factions. If you do not understand the differences, then you don't understand differences.

Birkel said...

Mainstream Republicans =/= Movement Conservatives

93% approval rating for Trump amongst conservatives.

And should be or.

Birkel said...

"...legitimate force..."

Good one. It comes from the barrel of a gun?

Or the consent of the governed?

The language you have learned is designed to thwart the very things you allege you want.

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

Good one. It comes from the barrel of a gun?

Sometimes

Or the consent of the governed?

Sometimes

The language you have learned is designed to thwart the very things you allege you want.

The language I've learned is the same as yours: English. You're starting to sound like a post-modernist, Birkel.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“Don’t forget that Democrats and even socialists are American too"-me

“Then why don't you self-identify as Americans? Ah, but you say, you do? I mean American first, instead of last, only after you identify by party, race, ideology, ethnicity, areligion, gender, classs, sex, age, and so on...”

What? Do Americans now have to identify themselves in a certain order or way in order to be considered fellow Americans?

“For us, our American identity comes first before all others. I hope one day you'll decide to join us — one American nation with malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right...”

I’m every bit an American as you and for you to say I’m not is not only insulting it’s ridiculous. My daughter who serves in the military is an American who has called herself a “German American” many times. Are you seriously going to discount her as being a fellow American? She was an American serving with the Marines in Afghanistan when she was under fire from the Taliban in the Camp Leatherneck/Camp Bastion attack. My daughter has done a German American presentation when the Navy held its Heritage Days. No one thought she wasn’t an American. My daughter is still a German American who serves in the Navy as a Chief. I’ll let my daughter know someone here considers her to not be a fellow American and see what she has to say about such an ignorant comment. Really to discount your fellow Americans because they don’t identify themselves the way you think they should is un-American.

J. Farmer said...

American republicanism is indeed based in universal values but is very clearly not universal. It is a miracle it is has survived as long as it has, and you could not make a case that it really hasn't, that is has been fundamentally altered in all sorts of ways and ultimately transmuted into something else entirely. The fact of the matter is that a smattering of people in Northwest Europe and Northeast Asia (and their diaspora) have managed to obtain an impressive standard of living and personal freedom and autonomy. We should be very grateful for it and do everything we can do nurture it. But acting as if it is some kind of baseline that the rest of the world (with just the right help) will be able to develop to is a pitiful fantasy. And a lot of bad policy has been motivated by that very fantasy.

Birkel said...

No, I sound nothing like a postmodernist.

I read like somebody who recognizes the semantic games played by those who wished to change the nature of debate more friendly to themselves. The co-opting of language is imperative for all Leftists. Orwell saw it. Carrol saw it. Tolkien saw it. Lewis saw it.

But then they were dealing with less sophisticated authoritarian Marxists. So I grant they were easier to detect back then.

Counter:
If I object to terminology created by those who hold views contrary to my own, I become what I do not approve?
That's just poor work.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“Absolutely. I want to help him help us keep America great. Don't you? Because if you do not, I clearly see you as choosing to be a part of the problem.”

“Only I can do it!”
Trump

The Cult of Personality is pervasive.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

Oh, BTW, my daughter also has called herself Jewish American, does that make her not a fellow American?

Narayanan Subramanian said...

https://vorkosigan.fandom.com/wiki/Maple_mead

Birkel said...

Yes, we have found a point of agreement. American republicanism was overwhelmed by the authoritarian impulses of FDR and his love for the ideas that gave us Hitler and Uncle Joe Stalin. He crashed the separation of powers between the federal and state systems beyond recognition.

His collectivist policies gave us exactly the sort of economic stagnation that such policies generate anywhere they are implemented.

And The Long March through the institutions had barely commenced back then.

Birkel said...

(not to J Farmer)

If nobody can believe the boy who cried wolf after so many false cries, why should one further cry change things?

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

Yes, we have found a point of agreement. American republicanism was overwhelmed by the authoritarian impulses of FDR and his love for the ideas that gave us Hitler and Uncle Joe Stalin.

I see US history through a much different gestalt. I think US republicanism was probably doomed the minute the decision was made to import sub-saharan African slave labor into the country. Which leads me to my second point...

He crashed the separation of powers between the federal and state systems beyond recognition.

I think the Civil War and its aftermath were far more consequential in that regard. Also, with the rapid industrialization and rise of huge interstate corporations, a more powerful centralized state was likely inevitable.

Birkel said...

That's because you don't know the Supreme Court cases between the Civil War and 1936.
We cannot have this conversation, accordingly.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

Ooooo, “gestalt”. That’s a German word. Be careful. Only American words allowed.

Jim at said...

Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck.

What? And miss scrolling past and ignoring his posts here?
Not a chance.

Drago said...

Inga: "Oh, BTW, my daughter also has called herself Jewish American, does that make her not a fellow American"

You will have to take that up with the democrats who think the guy who called jews "cockroaches" is, like, totally cool.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“Maybe some of you would be interested in reading a blog called The Immense Complexity of Chuck.”


Maybe this blog should be called “American Althouse”.

mccullough said...

Most people understand Trump’s Birther stuff was comedy against Obama.

Trump was a Merry Prankster.

Although it predates Obama, the Woke “You Caanot Say or Even Think” stuff accelerated during his presidency. Comics were lame. Most of the comics were Obama fanboys and fan girls. College Campuses became Asylums. Even Corportate America started devolving into the Wokeplace bullshit.

Trump’s birtherism was amusing theater. It was a small hobby for him. But it is good for the country that the guy with the birther routine and grab them by the pussy was elected.

Just as it’s good that Governor Coonman didn’t resign over his Blackface Costume and his Klasman date.

People need to relax and laugh. Charles Barkley should have a late night show and Colbert should retreat to some remote Woke Monastery.

Obama was and is mockable just like Trump and Bush and Clinton.

College Campuses and Corporate America are run by cowards. They really need to be grabbed by their pussies.




Drago said...

Inga: "Maybe this blog should be called “American Althouse”"

LOL

Inga wants to defend Chuck, but she is uncertain what the best way to go about that would be....and it shows.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“You will have to take that up with the democrats who think the guy who called jews "cockroaches" is, like, totally cool.”

Since she’s half Jewish and a Democrat, I doubt she’d call herself a cockroach, nor would I. That would be people like you.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“Inga wants to defend Chuck, but she is uncertain what the best way to go about that would be....and it shows.”

No. I’m making fun of Meade.

Drago said...

Inga: "Since she’s half Jewish and a Democrat, I doubt she’d call herself a cockroach, nor would I. That would be people like you"

This is the part of the conversation where Inga pretends to know nothing at all about what is happening within the democrat party ranks regarding clear, unmistakable anti-semitism from the left/dems.

LOL

There is nothing more predictable than Inga's feigned ignorance about what the lefties are doing.

Drago said...

Inga: "No. I’m making fun of Meade."

LOL

Uh huh.

Drago said...

We have clear anti-semitism/anti-Israel/anti-Jewish comments and sentiments expressed by leaders of the rabidly anti-semitic Women's March as well as democrat representatives in Congress.

Inga goes full Sgt Schultz and she knows nothing about it. At all.

LOL

Drago said...

LLR Chuck, you'd better step up here. Team Left pal Inga is in dire need of some "strong conservative" guidance from a "True Conservative" like yourself....(wink wink)

Meade said...

"No. I’m making fun of Meade."

Okay. Heh heh.

Ironically, your jokes are routinely on yourself. And what makes them even funnier is—you don't seem to get them.

Birkel said...

Raul Emmanuel knows what's up.
Hillary will be the "only adult in the room" in three months.

Birkel said...

Drago,
Would you please play by the hostesses rules?
I have adopted them and I hate rules.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“Okay. Heh heh.

Ironically, your jokes are routinely on yourself. And what makes them even funnier is—you don't seem to get them.”

Your comment was ridiculous and you really owe your fellow Americans an apology.

Trumpism has gotten you in it’s clutches. How sad.

Is THIS what the Althouse blog has come to?

Disgraceful.

Drago said...

Birkel: "Drago,
Would you please play by the hostesses rules?"

I feel kind of bad for Mead with that line.

Not to worry Meade. I still think of you as host, or alternatively, a "hostess" who doesn't menstruate.

Meade said...

"hope you don't mind that I self-identify as Iowan"

An Iowan American? Strikes me as unnecessarily redundant but, okay.

Drago said...

"Is THIS what the Althouse blog has come to?"

It beats the hell out of becoming like the anti-semitic/anti-jewish/anti-Israel Women's March and democrat freshman chick's caucus.

Meade said...

"I still think of you as host, or alternatively, a "hostess" who doesn't menstruate."

I am post manopausal. Please check you agism. Thank you.

Drago said...

"I am post manopausal. Please check you agism. Thank you."

Egads.

I will immediately self-report.

Drago said...

David Duke endorses Ilhan Omar.


David Duke
@DrDavidDuke
Dr Duke & Eric Striker: By Defiance to Z.O.G. Ilhan Omar is NOW the most important Member of the US Congress! https://davidduke.com/thursday190131-4/ …

123
10:35 AM - Mar 7, 2019

Meade said...

"I will immediately self-report."

There. That's the kind of rule following we appreciate around here. Gold star!

Drago said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Drago said...

"There. That's the kind of rule following we appreciate around here. Gold star!"

That's wonderful encouragement and all, but, uh, where's my fish?

Drago said...

It can be disconcerting for some well known commenters on this blog when the lefty talking points run out or the many many many incongruities of insane leftyism are laid bare and other more "conservative-y" supporters are not around to pick up the slack.

We wish them all a hasty recovery.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“It can be disconcerting for some well known commenters on this blog when the lefty talking points run out or the many many many incongruities of insane leftyism are laid bare and other more "conservative-y" supporters are not around to pick up the slack.”

What’s disconcerting is what Trumpism has done to formerly normal intelligent people.

Birkel said...

You mean like Democratics who now openly support anti-Jewish rhetoric?
Means they should arm themselves.

Drago said...

"What’s disconcerting is what Trumpism has done to formerly normal intelligent people."

Somehow, some commenters are still unaware of the open anti-semitism of the Women's March leadership and the complete capitulation of the House Democratic leadership in addressing open anti-semitism amongst freshman democrat representatives.

I wonder how long our ever-forgetful, ever-history-resetting lefties can continue the charade that nothing is going on before their very eyes.

Let's pay close attention now....

Drago said...

David Duke certainly knows which way the wind is blowing in congress.....

Arashi said...

Drago - How long till the left blames DJT for the Duke endorsement?

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

That's because you don't know the Supreme Court cases between the Civil War and 1936.
We cannot have this conversation, accordingly.


The Progressive movement had been well underway for four decades before 1936. But that's not my point. As I said, I think the problems are much more deep rooted and much more fundamental and go far beyond an overly broad interpretation of the commerce clause.

Drago said...

Arashi: "Drago - How long till the left blames DJT for the Duke endorsement?"

Team Left is no doubt huddling up with Team Left/LLR's to formulate just such a response.

Birkel said...

You are partly correct.
First was undermining individual freedom and liberty.
But I doubt you've given it much thought.

J. Farmer said...

@Birkel:

You are partly correct.
First was undermining individual freedom and liberty.
But I doubt you've given it much thought.


Like any good conservative, I am highly skeptical of the Enlightenment. The US Constitution is an attempt to reconcile a contradiction. How do you have individual rights and democratic governance? How do you stop 51% of the people from oppressing the other 49%? The Founders attempted to create a government that would square that circle, and I think it failed. Pretty much from the beginning. As for democracy, I accept Robert Michels' iron law of oligarchy.

Birkel said...

I see that I was correct.

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