March 30, 2018

If we give immunity from criticism to children — such as David Hogg, et al. — then adults will rely on children to do what adults want done.

I don't know how much the post-Parkland protesters are acting directly from their own hearts — it's politically expedient to see them as saints! — but if they are protected from criticism, it creates a dangerous incentive to adults who want immunity from criticism.

There are so many children around, and it is the way of the world for millennia to seize upon these handy little creatures — they're everywhere! — and use them to do the work adults want done. I'm not saying that's what's already happened with the post-Parkland protesters, just that the kid-gloves treatment of these vocal participants in the public dialogue sends a message to conniving adults that there's a special benefit to using children.

There are consequences.

I'm thinking of the use of minors in criminal activities, which is facilitated by the benevolence of the juvenile court system. The use of children in drug commerce produced a backlash:
During the early 1990s, under a set of faulty assumptions about a coming generation of “super-predators,”* 40 states passed legislation to send even more juveniles into the adult courts for a growing array of offenses and with fewer procedural protections....

This tough-on-crime era left in its wake state laws that still permit or even require drug charges to be contested in adult courts. Scant data exist to track its frequency, but fully 46 states and the District of Columbia permit juveniles to be tried as adults on drug charges. Only Connecticut, Kansas, Massachusetts, and New Mexico do not....
By the way, I was robbed once in my life. It was in Italy, by children who were, obviously, used by adults to ply the old pickpocketing trade. People near me caught the children, and the police came. There was much chatter in the police office, and then the children were let go. I received an explanation in English: "They're children!" But everyone knew that children were used (abused) precisely because the police would let them go.

Meanwhile: "Noor Salman, the widow of the man who gunned down dozens of people at the Pulse nightclub two years ago, was found not guilty by a federal jury on Friday of helping her husband carry out a terrorist attack in the name of the Islamic State" (NYT). Message: Use your women, because their role will not be taken seriously.

So what can we say — as we debate public issues — about the children (and the women)? How much, if at all, can they be criticized? And what is their fate if we treat them as innocents, tiny oracles of emotional meaning? Meaning well and thinking of yourself as a fount of empathy is not enough to keep them on a straight path of goodness and not enough to protect other decent enough people from harm.
_____________

* Here's Hillary Clinton trying to detach herself from her own "super-predators" statement, from 1994, which had become politically inconvenient in 2016:

281 comments:

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JackWayne said...

It bears repeating: there are roughly 100 million gun owners in America, about a billion guns and probably more than a trillion rounds. How is anybody going to roll that back?

DKWalser said...

Inga - I've told you the reasons why the AR15 is popular: It's more accurate, more reliable, lighter to carry, less expensive to shoot, has less recoil, and a quality version generally costs less than a similar quality bolt-action rifle. In short, in terms of desirability, an AR15 checks all the boxes save one -- its NOT a high-power rifle. But, even there, you don't always want or need a high-powered rifle. For many situations, the AR15's cartridge is a better option.

Your approach, saying gun owners don't 'need' and AR15 is the equivalent of telling today's driver that he or she can do just fine with a Ford Model T. It worked a hundred years ago and the same technology is all that's needed today, too. Well, today's drivers 'need' automatic transmission, electric start, hydraulic brakes, safety belts, airbags, and all the other technological advancements 100 years has brought to today's cars. Today's drivers are safer driving today's automobiles than they would be if everyone went back to driving Model T's.

Many of today's shooters prefer an AR15 not because its a style fetish but because its a better rifle for their purposes. The fact you cannot understand that says more about your lack of understanding about shooting than it does about them.

Drago said...

Inga: "NRA promotes this sort of nuttery. That’s why they need to be defanged and they will be...eventually."

Its very helpful when those who are attempting to gut your 2nd amendment rights are open about what they intend to do to your 1st amendment rights.

I think i'll purchase a few extra weapons for my friends and family in anticipation of the lefts inevitable intention to gut the entire Bill of Rights and go full Stasi.

Achilles said...

Message: Use your women, because their role will not be taken seriously.

Absolutely wrong. The message was the FBI hid important evidence because it was embarrassing to the obviously corrupt and partisan people running the FBI.

Big Mike said...

Nate Bethea served as an infantry officer in the US Army from 2007 to 2014, and during that time, he fired thousands of rounds from assault rifles.

@Inga, the fallacy you are employing is called "argument from authority," or argumentum ad verecundiam. And, yes, it is "well known as a fallacy" per Wikipedia (go look it up). When some dingbat makes a blanket statement that the AR is not suitable for hunting, then they are wrong -- chambered in a hunting caliber like .243 Winchester or 7mm Remington Mag or .300 Blackout or .308 Winchester it is perfectly suitable for hunting game (caveat: .243 is not legal for elk in in some areas, or so I understand).

Please stop writing or quoting from people who call the AR platform an "assault rifle." The term is well-defined and explicitly requires the ability to fire in fully automatic mode or in burst mode. Civilian AR platforms are semiautomatic only. They are not assault rifles under the meaning of the term. Period. The two have four things in common -- black plastic forestock and buttstock, a hand grip, a detachable magazine, and buttstock aligned with the barrel to reduce perceived recoil.

When was the first semiautomatic rifle with detachable magazine available to the civilian market? Try 1907 -- the Winchester Model 1907 (Pierce Brosnan's weapon of choice in "The Son"). Semiautomatic shotguns were available for the civilian market even sooner. This. Is. Old. Technology.

As to "horrific wounds," that doesn't strike me as a negative when considering a weapon for home defense. Except that the .223 and 5.56 NATO are not going to overpenetrate no matter what Nate Bethea's unnamed friend says. But if you want truly horrific wounds, imagine what's left of a person's face or chest after being hit by 12 gauge 00 ("double aught") buckshot. Yet even Creepy Joe Biden says a shotgun is a great home defense weapon (the reason why my reference to Creepy Joe is not a case of argumentum ad verecundiam is because truthfully I don't regard him as an authority).

I don't own an AR; like Tom Selleck's eponymous character in "Quigley Down Under," I ain't got no use for one. But I do competitive shooting and between events and practice I probably send 1500 or more rounds downrange a year. Unlike you -- or Nate Bethea -- I do know what I'm writing about.

buwaya said...

"Many of today's shooters prefer an AR15 not because its a style fetish"

To be fair, there is an element of a style fetish. There are all sorts of much more "normal" rifles where there is a cottage industry that makes them look more "tactical". And this usually adds up to more money than a plain AR-15.

This is a Mosin Nagant, a rifle first issued in 1891 -

Tacticool Mosin Nagant

Earnest Prole said...

The message was the FBI hid important evidence because it was embarrassing to the obviously corrupt and partisan people running the FBI.

Zactly.

Rick said...

People who belong to cults and who are fetishists are too firmly entrenched.

Only 20% of the population support Inga's preference but everyone else is in a cult. Left wingers live in their FantasyLand.

Bruce Hayden said...

As for over penetration, the issue is not that .223/5.56 penetrates more than other rifle calibers, but rather, that it is a rifle/carbine caliber in the first place. If you want serious over penetration, try limiting firearms to WW II calibers. Both the M1 Garand and the M1 Carbine shoot .30 caliber ammunition. The M1 Garand, the firearm issued to American infantry then, was for decades after that the preferred firearm for deer AND elk. Much more powerful than .223/5.56. Many states wouldn’t allow hunting with .223 ammunition, because it wasn’t considered humane enough on the theory that higher caliber bullets were more likely to kill and not mame and injure.

During the waning months of WW II, the Germans showed that select fire rifles could be effectively utilized. That there were situations where it was advantageous for its soldiers to have full automatic fire selectively available. The Russians, and their allies, developed the AK-47 for this. The Americans first issued the M-14, essentially a box magazine fed select fire version of the M-1 Garand. It is hard to control in fully automatic fire, and the ammunition weighs quite a bit when used that way. The .223 casing and bullet were developed to answer these needs. They are lower powered that the bullets and shells used in the M-14, making automatic fire easier to control, and lighter, which makes it possible for soldiers and Marines to carry more rounds - which is necessary, because fully automatic fire is capable of expending ammunition at a prodigious rate (approximately 2 seconds to completely shoot and expend the 20 round magazines used in Vietnam, or 3 seconds for the standard 30 round magazines used today).

But note my previous point about modulariy - AR-15s tend to be .223/5.56 caliber because that is a convenient caliber. But there is noting magical about that caliber - AR-15s have been configured In pretty much every caliber between .17 and .50 BMG (used by the M-2 heavy machine gun, utilized during WW II as the primary gun to shoot down airplanes and destroy unarmored or lightly armored vehicles).

DKWalser said...

It bears repeating: there are roughly 100 million gun owners in America, about a billion guns and probably more than a trillion rounds. How is anybody going to roll that back?

It's worse than that for the gun control crowd. For a few thousand dollars in equipment and materials, virtually anyone can make a gun in their garage or apartment. The equipment is less than $2k if you do not need it to be computer controlled, a little more than that for CNC versions. Hobbyists use these milling machines in all sorts of hobbies, from clock making to woodworking. For gun control to be effective, access to these machines will have to be controlled, too.

The point being, the technology used to create many guns is over 100 years old. Without becoming an omni-present police state, how will the government prevent today's citizen from using today's tools to create guns based on 100+ year old designs? A version of the 1911 Colt is still being used by the military today. The AR15 is even easier to make. Most of it can be 3D printed.

Jim at said...

Many of today's shooters prefer an AR15 not because its a style fetish but because its a better rifle for their purposes. The fact you cannot understand that says more about your lack of understanding about shooting than it does about them.

She doesn't want to understand.
She wants to dictate.

buwaya said...

"after being hit by 12 gauge 00 "

I have only seen the effect of this in a shooting range - not that there is much point in making holes on paper this way.

But correct, this would be terrible, and probably just as terrible at massacre-range if the murderer were using birdshot.

Bilwick said...

Inga the State cultist and Mailed Fist fetishist complaining about "cultists" and "fetishists." Irony indeed. How many guns does your beloved Big Brother have in his arsenal , Little Sister? (You could also ask how many people has her beloved State killed, but at this point the total tally is probably beyond computation.*) Guns in private hands, servile creatures like Inga distrust. But in Big Brother's hands? No problem!

*However, an estimated 150,000,000 to 350,000,000 in the 20th Century alone, not even counting war casualties.

Mark said...

Noor Salman . . . was found not guilty by a federal jury on Friday of helping her husband carry out a terrorist attack in the name of the Islamic State" (NYT). Message: Use your women

I got a different message.
Message: It is not the job of jurors -- or the criminal justice system generally -- to deal with terrorist acts of war. If there were factual grounds to charge her, then instead of treating this person like a "defendant," she should properly be treated as a enemy combatant with a ticket to Gitmo.

buwaya said...

"the M-1 Garand"

This would be nearly as terrible in a massacre scenario as an AR-15.
The ammunition is much more powerful and though capacity is only 8 rounds it is quite quick to reload, maybe faster than an AR-15.

The biggest problem with it is my ancient bete noir, its weight.

I only ever shot exactly 16 rounds from one.

Michael K said...

Bruce, logical arguments are wasted on Inga.

People like her are not interested in logical arguments.

I would love to have an M 14 for shooting at the range, or even an M 1 Garand, the best battle rifle of all time in many opinions.

The CMP is making thousands of them available. They are not what I would use for home defense and I have a Colt 1911 in .45 caliber for that.

Most shotguns (I sold mine about 5 years ago after not using them for 20 years) are too long for home defense.

The NRA and gun sales will get another big boost from this latest hysteria.

Michael K said...


"after being hit by 12 gauge 00 "

I have only seen the effect of this in a shooting range - not that there is much point in making holes on paper this way.


I treated a patient with such a wound. The story is in my second book. He was naked in bed with the shooter's wife at the time.

I have probably treat a thousand gunshot wounds or more. The vast majority are pistol wounds.

A few were AR 15-like wounds, probably from AK 47s which are much more popular with the average criminal.

The damage from the shock wave often leads to delayed healing, not the "body parts" described by fools who have never seen such an injury.

Big Mike said...

@Michael K, but folks like me aren't really responding to Inga when we, er, respond to Inga. We are actually writing for the people who may think that she has a point.

But you are right about the NRA and gun sales. Despite Remington's screwups with Marlin rifles and the initial introduction of the R51, they may pull out of bankruptcy yet.

Achilles said...

Inga said...

“An AR15 is a regular gun.”

Oh please. This is a nutty comment, or ignorant, or simply dishonest.

Inga never fails to be one of the dumbest people on the planet.

An ar-15 is absolutely a regular rifle compared to an awesome rifle.(MDR) Or an Origin 12.

You could fit what Inga knows about guns onto a 3x5 card. You have to try to be as stupid and ignorant as Inga.

But remember Inga thinks we deserve to get shot. So there is that.

Achilles said...

Actual link to article about the Origin 12.

Sorry bout that!

Number of people killed by all long guns is less than people killed by hammers and fists every year.

People like Inga are trying to disarm their political opponents so they can persecute and murder them. Period.

MountainMan said...

"Because it’s a fetish."

Wow, what an ignorant statement. Perhaps you should leave the blue bubble you live in and spend some time in flyover country, say on a farm in Kansas or North Dakota, or a ranch in west Texas. Where the nearest law enforcement might be an hour or more away. Where the first responder for any emergency you or your family might encounter is only you. It's why you have in the basement of your home a big gun safe with several types of long guns, a stock of gunpowder and ammunition components, a workbench for repairing and cleaning your guns and loading your own ammunition. So that when your livestock is threatened by predators or you have some idiot trying to steal your pickup truck in the middle of the night you can deal with it. I was just on a blog the other day where some guy related a story exactly like this. Some guy was out is his barn stealing some stuff. When he called the sheriff the reply was "You know how to take care of it. I'll get there when i can." Yet you would want to leave these people defenseless and because they are also usually members of the NRA you think they "have blood on their hands." Please explain to us what any of these people had to do with Parkland.

Achilles said...

Michael K said...

Most shotguns (I sold mine about 5 years ago after not using them for 20 years) are too long for home defense.


See Origin 12 above. =D

A little pricey though.

Michael K said...

The Garand was such an impressive battle rifle that the Japanese copied it late in the war.

Now, that was an assault rifle.

The SG 44 was a real assault rifle, but Inga would no more know that than the woman who turned it in.

Achilles said...

Inga said...

“It does nothing to advance your argument.”

I’m under no illusion that any minds will be changed. I’m expressing my opinion. People who belong to cults and who are fetishists are too firmly entrenched.

Person who supports Stalinist investigations is angry most Americans will not bow to her totalitarian tribe.

We will never allow people like you to have political power again.

Michael K said...

Most of the shotguns I see for home defense are butt ugly but they would be impressive and probably the best option for a woman.

Inga...Allie Oop said...

So says you, where is your data?

“Only 20% of the population support Inga's preference but everyone else is in a cult. Left wingers live in their FantasyLand.”
———————————————
“With momentum continuing to build for greater gun control laws in the country after the shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, 61 percent of Americans say they now believe the AR-15 should be banned.

The Harvard CAPS-Harris survey, conducted online between Feb. 16 and 19, polled 1,934 registered voters and found additionally that 39 percent of people are in favor of AR-15s being sold to adults who can pass a background check.

"The public wants a solution not just to guns but to school safety and that means better mental health programs, greater security and some gun restrictions as well," Harvard CAPS-Harris co-director Mark Penn told the Hill. "They want action on all fronts."“

Inga...Allie Oop said...

“We will never allow people like you to have political power again.”

Hilarious. Delusional.

Drago said...

"Trump has no path to 270!"

"Trump colluded with Russians!!"

"The dossier is real!!"

Hilarious. Delusional.

Big Mike said...

@Achilles, Stoeger makes a nice coach gun -- a side by side shotgun with 20" barrels -- for a reasonable price in 12 gauge for guys (and, yes, you DBQ) and 20 gauge for women.

Big Mike said...

61 percent of Americans say they now believe the AR-15 should be banned.

So we'll change its name to RA-51.

Jim at said...

Most of the shotguns I see for home defense are butt ugly but they would be impressive and probably the best option for a woman.

Eh, not so sure. I've got a Mossberg 12 ga. loaded with buck and it's way too much for my wife to handle.

She took a course just this last Saturday. Women only. She's now looking for a small caliber handgun that fits well, is light and makes her comfortable.

However, if she wants to try out an AR-15 just for kicks? And she likes it? Yet doesn't actually need it?

We'll buy it. Just because.

chickelit said...

Proud to say that Hogg was turned down by several California universities. Even they aren’t stupid enough to take on a nut cases like Hogg.

BTW, what do Fred and Doris Ziffel have to say about their son?

WWIII Joe Biden, Husk-Puppet + America's Putin said...

Polls are data collected from small samples. To say that 60% of Americans want __________ or don't want______ is silly. the samples do not extrapolate out.

WWIII Joe Biden, Husk-Puppet + America's Putin said...

If a lefty media hack proclaims what most American want, based on trumped up polls and small sample data, or just the emotional feels after a traumatic event- you should buy it without any question.

Chuck said...

For women, I recommend a Remington 870 Youth model .20 ga. 18” barrel, 5-round rube.

And/or a Glock.

But the .870 is a great little gun to introduce someone to a defensive firearm.

Bilwick said...

"We'll buy it. Just because." Not so fast, hombre. You'd first better justify your purchase to Little Sister (aka Inga) and that gang of extortionists known as The State



.

Chuck said...

Lol. “Tube,” not rube. You might want to shoot the rubes, but I recommend against it.

buwaya said...

The joke in the right wing sites (Freerepublic say) for many years now is about losing all their guns in "tragic boating accidents".

The compliance rate with any such law would be very low. It certainly is the case in California. There is already a very large black market in banned items, and that's only since this January.

Michael K said...

" She's now looking for a small caliber handgun that fits well, is light and makes her comfortable. "

My wife, who has rheumatoid arthritis, bought a nice little revolver, with a shrouded hammer so it doesn't catch on things, in .38 special. She can work it and took a class to get used to it. I thought she could use my little Walther PPK but she can't work the slide.

My first wife probably still has a highly illegal short barreled shotgun in .410, that was called a "horse pistol." It is just right for a woman. I gave it to her when we were married 50 years ago.

I also gave her a S&W .38 special revolver after her next door neighbor was held up in her driveway.

Bruce Hayden said...

“Eh, not so sure. I've got a Mossberg 12 ga. loaded with buck and it's way too much for my wife to handle. “

Got one with an 18’” barrel that is decently maneuverable inside, and have a long barrel for the rest of the time. Very reasonable still. Have a light attached underneath, and a 5 round side paddle, that has a couple slugs, plus another 3 00 Buck. And a belt/sling that contains maybe another 50 shells in a mixture of bird shot, buck, and slug.

Sure, I would love a magazine fed bullpup style shotgun, but realistically, I woul almost never use it, and the $2600 or so can be better spent elsewhere.

Big Mike said...

Bruce and everyone else -- never own a shotgun with less than an 18 inch barrel. People have been killed by BATF agents over having shotguns with an illegally short barrel.

@Jim at, an AR is a good choice for a woman because the length of pull is adjustable. You might also have her look at pistol-caliber carbines like the Hi-Point. Very light, not very long, but a 9 mm or a .45 ACP coming out of a 16" barrel will hit like something you don't want hitting you. Strangely, the Hi-Point carbine is based on a very unsuccessful semiautomatic pistol design, but in carbine form everyone who has tried it likes it. You can find it in YouTube videos like this one and this one.

5M - Eckstine said...

Don’t use kids as weapons. Gang up on anybody who does.

buwaya said...

"People have been killed by BATF agents over having shotguns with an illegally short barrel."

Randy Weavers wife and son among others.

Michael K said...

"never own a shotgun with less than an 18 inch barrel"

I know. It is an antique and I don't know if she still has it.

The usual self defense shotguns are ugly and have short barrels but legal length.

Bruce Hayden said...

@Big Mike - the shorter barrel is completely stock from Mossberg. I noted the other day that they are still selling essentially the same gun, some 30 years later.

Michael K said...

"Randy Weavers wife and son among others. "

That was the entrapment of him by SATF but the wife and son had nothing to do with shotguns.

The Idaho jury wanted to get Ron Horiuchi , the FBI sniper indicted.

If he was smart he stayed far from Idaho. Also Texas.

Three of the twelve expended .308 Winchester shell cases that the Texas Rangers reported finding in the house were at Horiuchi's position. However, officials maintain that they could have been left behind from the earlier use of the house by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives snipers on February 28, 1993, and that it would be "nearly impossible" to match them to Horiuchi's rifle, as it had probably been rebarreled since that time.[11]

For the five months following the Waco inferno, Timothy McVeigh worked at gun shows and handed out free cards printed with Horiuchi's name and address, "in the hope that somebody in the Patriot movement would assassinate the sharpshooter". He wrote hate mail to the sniper, suggesting that "what goes around, comes around". McVeigh considered targeting Horiuchi, or a member of his family, before settling on a bombing attack on a federal building - choosing to target the Murrah Building.[12]


Bruce Hayden said...

“Randy Weavers wife and son among others. “

Interesting discussion with our former state representative last year. He was at the MT state fair last summer, and ran into a woman with her father at a booth selling crafts. Turns out, it was Randy Weaver and his daughter. She did most of the talking. Apparently they moved over by Kalispell a decade or so ago.

richard mcenroe said...

Busewaya Trump didn't slow the sale of guns. The glut of buying under Obama did that. Folks are less afraid of confiscatory measures now so there's less urge to buy. Ammo sales are still high, though, which should tell you something...

buwaya said...

"For the five months following the Waco inferno, Timothy McVeigh worked at gun shows and handed out free cards printed with Horiuchi's name and address, "in the hope that somebody in the Patriot movement would assassinate the sharpshooter"

And this was when the US Government had a far better image than it does today.
Imagine how many McVeighs will come out of the woodwork should there be a Randy Weaver or Branch Davidian case in this climate. They were playing with fire in the Bundy Ranch standoff, there were hundreds of potential McVeighs all over that area.

buwaya said...

"Buwaya Trump didn't slow the sale of guns."

Imagine what gun sales would have been in 2017 if HRC had won.

Achilles said...

Inga said...

So says you, where is your data?

“Only 20% of the population support Inga's preference but everyone else is in a cult. Left wingers live in their FantasyLand.”
———————————————
“With momentum continuing to build for greater gun control laws in the country after the shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, 61 percent of Americans say they now believe the AR-15 should be banned.


It is my fervent hope than the people who run the democrat party are stupid enough to believe their own push polls they use to keep their faithful idiots like Inga in line.

But they aren't as stupid as her. They will never mention gun control within 3 months of the election. They aren't as stupid as the people that vote for them.

Bilwick said...

Buwaya, thanks for explaining that "tragic boating accident" thing. Someone used that on me at another blog when I stated (honestly and accurately) that I did not currently own any firearms. He wrote something like, "Yeah, right--lost 'em in a tragic boating accident, right?" I didn't know what the heck he was talking about . . . although I did intuit that it had to do with concealing the complete extent of one's personal armory from Inga's pal Big Brother.

Speaking of which, does the renewed call for the serfs to disarm signal that the Trump-is-Hitler meme is officially dead? I often think of William Buckley's statement during the Nixon years that if it were true that Tricky Dick and his henchmen were planning to create a Fourth Reich, surely the traffic in firearms should be increased rather than discouraged. "I for one," WFB wrote, "wish to have a well-stocked armory when the storm troopers come knocking at my door." Even leftists as stupid as Inga or as whacky as Toothless couldn't be so stupid and so whacky as to think Trump a second Hitler, and then want to disarm for him--could they?

MayBee said...

Jack Wayne said...
It bears repeating: there are roughly 100 million gun owners in America, about a billion guns and probably more than a trillion rounds. How is anybody going to roll that back?


Nobody has to have an answer to that question. You just plow right past it, because as long as you are against guns or for commonsense gun control, you don't have blood on your hands. It's all very purifying.

Michael K said...

They were playing with fire in the Bundy Ranch standoff, there were hundreds of potential McVeighs all over that area.

Thank god the jury ended that standoff. I still would like to know the role played by Harry Reid in all that. I have seen rumors about selling the land to Chinese investors but that is supposed to be BLM land.

Bruce Hayden said...

@Dr K - yeh, BLM land apparently leased for solar panels, by apparently a Chinese firm that had hired Reed’s oldest son as their attorney. He was with the biggest firm in the state. At the time I was working in NV, we were the 2nd biggest law firm, so got the 2nd son. It was great. He was into govt relations and lobbying, so had a skybox in the firm’s name at the local baseball stadium, that was available when they weren’t using it for clients. It was sweet. Also they put on the Christmas party. Both our fathers were lawyers, and several of us boys, and all of them were too. We used to joke about it. He was nice - Mormon nice.

Anonymous said...

"Inga said:

"When the bullet leaves the barrel at subsonic speeds to shred bones and organs . . ."

Believe it or not, I'm capable of running at subsonic speeds. And I have a bad knee.

Comanche Voter said...

Ms. Althouse you mean that a good thinking Muslim might persuade a 9 year old girl to wear a suicide vest into an Israeli pizza parlor and blow it up? After all, that's something an adult wants done.

mockturtle said...

Openidname claims: Believe it or not, I'm capable of running at subsonic speeds. And I have a bad knee.

Hell, I can WALK at subsonic speeds!

Michael K said...

Hell, I can WALK at subsonic speeds!

You can probably tear up organs too.

Birkel said...

Inga cites Mark Penn, former Clinton pollster, about guns.

Hilarious. Delusional.

Gahrie said...

Hell, I can WALK at subsonic speeds!

That's nothing! I sleep at a subsonic speed.

Big Mike said...

@Jim at, I forgot one. If you take your wife gun shopping have her take a look at the Ruger PC carbine. The gun was the subject of an article in the February 2018 issue of “American Rifleman.” The length of pull is adjustable from 12 5/8 inches, for a petite woman, to 14 1/8 inches through spacers,. Consequently you need a bit of time to resize it, however. The good thing is that it looks more like a conventional rifle, no pistol grip, no forward grip, so it should escape the gun grabbers wrath for a while. It is chambered in 9 mm, so uses cheap handgun rounds, but it can handle +P loads. Muzzle velocity with +P ammo was measured at 2000 ft/sec, which is, alas, supersonic.

Rick said...

“With momentum continuing to build for greater gun control laws in the country after the shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, 61 percent of Americans say they now believe the AR-15 should be banned.

The Harvard CAPS-Harris survey, conducted online between Feb. 16 and 19, polled 1,934 registered voters and found additionally that 39 percent of people are in favor of AR-15s being sold to adults who can pass a background check.


"Additionally" huh? What an odd coincidence these numbers add to exactly 100%. It's almost like you presented the "no" answer to the question as support along with the yes. I know I'm surprised to discover you don't even understand your own evidence.

Here is the relevant question.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/03/27/one-in-five-americans-want-the-second-amendment-to-be-repealed-national-survey-finds/?utm_term=.a007a9528085

Kirk Parker said...


Inga,

You stupid, mendacious bint: an AR-15 IS a regular gun! These days, as the top-selling rifle, it is THE most regular gun there is.

And I see your unsurpassed ability at cut-and-paste is not matched by the slightest understanding of the content you are thus handling--otherwise you certainly wouldn't have copied that nonsense about 'subsonic' and 'shred'.

J said...

You know every person I see who says the AR-15 is not suitable for hunting is experiencing a failure of experience or imagination.(Or just plain lying).My personal choice for hunting the vermin that is the coyote is an AR-15 with a 2-6X scope.Pretty good for short range woodchucks too.

Big Mike said...

@Jeff, what do you have against woodchucks?

J said...

obnoxious little pests

Hey Skipper said...

Someone on Fox said membership has tripled since Parkland, but I haven't seen any hard evidence backing that up.

I know someone with absolutely no interest in gun ownership who joined after one dose too many of Attention Hogg. I would guess she's not the only person who has done that.


I had allowed my membership to lapse.

"Camera" Hogg motivated me to renew it.


Inga:

The pre-requisite for clear thinking on just about any subject is the ability to state the views of those with whom one disagrees in a way that they would find both fair, and accurate.

I am confident you cannot begin to fairly and accurately depict the pro-2A arguments.

stlcdr said...

I went into Home Depot. They had a wall of hammers, probably 7 feet high by 6 feet wide. Full of hammers! Why would anybody need that many hammers!?

‘Need’ is not an argument and is irellavant...unless you desire a socialist or communist world.

Michael K said...

"‘Need’ is not an argument and is irellavant...unless you desire a socialist or communist world."

Didn't Bernie Sanders give a talk about all the excessive brands of toothpaste on the market ?

SDN said...

"Most of us on the left already understand that the vast majorityof the right are so deeply entrenched, that dissuading them of anything is futile. This is something I think so many of you on the right don’t understand yet. "

Lots of us understand it perfectly. That's why we're buying guns and ammunition. Civil war is coming.

Big Mike said...

Back on Noor Salman, here is an extract from a communication from the jury foreman to the Orlando Sentinel:

“Having said that, I want to make several things very clear. A verdict of not guilty did NOT mean that we thought Noor Salman was unaware of what Omar Mateen was planning to do. On the contrary we were convinced she did know. She may not have known what day, or what location, but she knew. However, we were not tasked with deciding if she was aware of a potential attack. The charges were aiding and abetting and obstruction of justice. I felt the both the prosecution and the defense did an excellent job presenting their case. I wish that the FBI had recorded their interviews with Ms. Salman as there were several significant inconsistencies with the written summaries of her statements. The bottom line is that, based on the letter of the law, and the detailed instructions provided by the court, we were presented with no option but to return a verdict of not guilty.”

Yet another black eye for the FBI.

ZZMike said...

The Left's mantra: "It's for the Children!". Which implies that children are so helpless...

“Why do people need an AR15?" I'm tired of people telling other people what they need. Especially Obama: "At some point, you've got enough money".

In the case of "large capacity magazines", if you're one person against 3 or 4 armed assailants. you need as many rounds as you can carry. OK, it doesn't happen every day - but do you want to be the guy there when it does - with only 6 or so rounds?

Jim at said...

Thanks for the tips/info Michael K, Bruce, Big Mike et al.

She was never around guns growing up but recent events over the last year have caused her to explore the possibilities. It's a good thing.

Bad Lieutenant said...


Fernandistein said...
Francisco D said...
If they have nothing to offer but platitudes, headline quotes and leftist talking points fed to them by pros, they should have the common decency to shut up.

You should probably start your own blog if you want to tell people what to say and how they should to say it.

3/30/18, 12:58 PM


Do you have any other purpose or function here besides snarling and crapping on other commenters? Asking for a friend.

Bad Lieutenant said...

He notes that he's seen the effects the weapons have, and he doesn't want to think the US is such a dangerous place that we need such weapons.


The great thing about America is, or was, that once upon a time, you could think what you wanted to think, and I could do likewise.


He quotes a friend, an Army Special Forces officer with multiple combat deployments: "People who say they need an AR for hunting or home defense often don’t understand the weapon’s ballistics or overpenetration. ARs cause horrific damage to humans; that’s why the military developed them. If you want to shoot an AR so bad, please feel free to join the fight against ISIS in the military."



And if you want to speak freely you can go to work for NBC?


The best reason to have guns is so you can shoot the people who want to take your guns.

Michael K said...

I always have the feeling that these military folks the lefties quote are running for office.

Just a feeling.

Bad Lieutenant said...


Michael K said...
I always have the feeling that these military folks the lefties quote are running for office.

Just a feeling.

3/31/18, 1:23 PM


They could also be weirdos or just guys who like tweaking the media or their fellow man. Look at Etienne talking about executing people, burning bodies and using the heat to generate electricity.

Rusty said...


"The best reason to have guns is so you can shoot the people who want to take your guns."
There it is.

Michael K said...

A useful antidote to a commenter here who keeps denying that mental illness drives many mass shooters.

“The attempt to turn the question of gun violence into a question of mental health is obscene,” writes Adam Gopnik in The New Yorker. Yet in his next sentence, Gopnik concedes: “Of course, people who kill children en masse are crazy. That’s the given.”

Such atrocities should warrant an examination of root causes and their implications. And, yes, such shooters are often crazy. Kennedy states that “only 22 percent” of mass shootings were “conducted by somebody suffering from mental illness.” The actual numbers may be much higher. The shooters in at least three of the four examples that Kennedy cites displayed symptoms of mental illness. But shouldn’t even a rate of 22 percent suggest further review? And shouldn’t the call for further gun control go hand-in-hand with a reevaluation of our treatment of the mentally ill?


An interesting back ground to the campaign against treatment of the mentally ill.

Epsilon Given said...

Inga, you have expressed an interest in how the AR15 became such a popular rifle. It isn't because of an American fetish for guns. It's because Americans are obstinate creatures, and when you tell an American they can't do something, they go and do it.

In 1994, the United States Congress told Americans they can't have AR15s. So for 10 years, Americans bought legal versions of AR15s just to spite Congress. In the process, they have discovered that the AR15 is a pretty nifty gun. Ironically, up to this point, the AR15 was an obscure gun that gun nuts dismissed as a toy.

Now that I've said that, I can't help but wonder: could you explain to us what's so special about the AR15 that makes it a significantly more potent weapon than, say, a 1911 pistol, or a 30-06 lever action rifle?

And what's up with banning guns that have bayonet lugs? When was the last time a bayonet was used in a crime?

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