Althouse: "At the White House on Wednesday, President Trump suggested that if a football coach at the high school, Aaron Feis, had been armed, he would have saved even more lives than he did..."

February 25, 2018

"At the White House on Wednesday, President Trump suggested that if a football coach at the high school, Aaron Feis, had been armed, he would have saved even more lives than he did..."

"... perhaps even his own, because rather than simply shielding students from gunfire, he could have drawn his weapon, fired and killed the assailant — putting a tidy end to the rampage. This is absurd. More likely, had Mr. Feis been armed, he would not have been able to draw his weapon (a side arm, presumably) quickly enough to stop the shooter, who with an AR-15 would have had the coach outgunned. Even if the coach had been able to draw his weapon — from where? his athletic shorts? — any shots he managed to fire would have risked being errant, possibly injuring or killing additional students. As some studies have shown, even police officers have missed their targets more than 50 percent of the time. In firing a weapon, Mr. Feis would have only added to the carnage and confusion...."

From "I Was a Marine. I Don’t Want a Gun in My Classroom" by Anthony Swofford (NYT).

546 comments:

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MeatPopscicle1234 said...: And for the historically impaired, as recently as the late 80's / early 90's, shooting clubs were a "mainstay of American high-school life..."

https://www.nationalreview.com/2013/01/gun-clubs-school-charles-c-w-cooke/

All these hysterics about schools having to be 100% gun-free zones because "someone might shoot their eye out" is ridiculous and ignores that its only within the last few decades that this became the prevalent state of affairs, brought on by continuous assault against gun-rights by the radical left.

Our parents and grand-parents seemed to be able to deal with the "quelle horreur" of firearms permeating everyday life just fine... I'm pretty sure adding professionally trained armed guards to schools will not result in the myriad of imaginary disasters the left keeps assuring us will happen if a single gun, even in the hands of a good guy, somehow gets on campus...

Catalogs and magazines from the 1940s, ’50s, and ’60s are packed full of gun advertisements aimed at children or parents. “What Every Parent Should Know When a Boy or Girl Wants a Gun,” one proclaims, next to a picture of a young boy and his sister excitedly presenting a “Rifle Catalog.” “Get This Cowboy Carbine with Your Christmas Money,” suggests another. It was placed widely in boys’ magazines by the Daisy Manufacturing Company of Plymouth, Mich. All a teenager needed do to be sent a rifle was send a money order for $2.50 and tick a box confirming they were old enough.

In one cartoon from the 1950s, two boys discuss a rifle in front of their father. “It’s safe for him to use, isn’t it, Dad?” the first boy asks. “Sure,” Dad responds. “Pete knows the code of the junior rifleman.” Back then, Pete almost certainly did. As John Lott Jr. has noted, once upon a time,

it was common for schools to have shooting clubs. Even in New York City, virtually every public high school had a shooting club up until 1969. It was common for high school students to take their guns with them to school on the subways in the morning and turn them over to their homeroom teacher or the gym coach so the heavy guns would simply be out of the way. After school, students would pick up their guns when it was time for practice.

That is, if they handed them in at all. Up until the ’70s, especially in rural areas, it was commonplace to see kids entering and leaving their school campuses with rifle bags slung lazily over their backs. Guns were left in school lockers, and rifles and shotguns were routinely seen in high-school parking lots, hanging in the rear windows of pickup trucks. A good friend of mine is from North Dakota. His father was telling me recently that in the late 1960s he would hunt before school and then take his rifle — and his bloodstained kills — to school to show his teachers. He and his friends would compare their shooting techniques in the school grounds. Nobody batted an eyelid. In North Dakota, school shootings were non-existent; in the country at large, they were extremely rare.; 2/25/18, 12:56 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Even speech laws have time place or manner restrictions. Repubes can't even deal with those. And if anything speech protections should have much greater leeway than guns. After all, an incarcerated inmate can basically say whatever he wants and it doesn't harm anyone else's rights. But the way these Repubes operate, you'd think they'd start standing up for the gun rights of all the Americans they've put behind bars.

Repubes think guns are more important than kids. That's just all it comes down to. Guns over kids. With every massacre their freedom-loving funny bones feel tickled.

Maybe they can turn this place into Beirut or Somalia by the time they're done with it. Just warlords and oligarchs in charge of everything. And private prisons, too. At least pirates have the decency to confine their hostage taking to the high seas. There's nothing like the profit motive when it comes to incentivizing the relinquishing of an American's rights.

But hey - what about those guns? They sure are purdy. They keep us free. Free from going to a classroom that's not got all the warm fuzziness of a heavy lockdown-style institution. Schools should be like prisons. Moar security. Wayne Sloppy-Shooter LaPierre said so.; 2/25/18, 12:56 PM
Clyde said...: Congressional shooter James Hodgkinson had a semi-automatic rifle when he shot up the Republican baseball team's practice last June, and theoretically had the Capitol Police guard team "outgunned," but they and the Alexandria Police still shot and killed him before he managed to murder anyone. Hodgkinson was a left-wing "activist" and Trump-hater, like some here in our comments section.; 2/25/18, 12:57 PM
MeatPopscicle1234 said...: The 2nd half of my previous post was meant to be a block-quote... its taken from the link I provided and is not mine...; 2/25/18, 12:58 PM
Quaestor said...: Welcome to fucking Columbia.

Better Columbia than fucking Venezuela, the ultimate destination of TTR's socialist anti-Constitutional wet dreams.; 2/25/18, 12:58 PM
wwww said...: Now, if you had a weapon, what is the answer?

Did you misunderstand me?

I would MUCH rather capture Redoubt # 10 at Yorktown with no bullets and bayonets fixed then go up with a bayonet against an A-15.

I'd choose that in 1781 before the invention of antibiotics. I'd rush the fortifications with only an espontoon, rather then go up against an A-15.

The A-15 is powerful. It destroys organs. If there's nothing left to repair, it doesn't matter if you have antibiotics.; 2/25/18, 12:59 PM
bagoh20 said...: I bought a Colt AR-15 this week. Went shooting with my stepson yesterday. We have assorted rifles, and handguns. Here in Vegas, we just take a short 10 minute drive out of town, and there are places with all kinds of people shooting for fun. In that environment, even with an AR-15 in hand, you do not feel powerful at all. You certainly would if not for all the other guns, but with them there you just feel equal, and in fact, a little powerless. You are outnumbered, and you can only shoot one direction at a time. If you were the bad guy, your gun would be no value, in fact, the only smart thing to do would be throw it down and put up your hands. I wish these shooters had that feeling in our schools.

Coming from L.A., this place is a culture shock, and in a good way for me. I see people in stores and customers coming into my business all the time with a gun openly displayed on their belt. I assume many others have concealed ones. You are allowed to drive around here with a loaded handgun on the front seat of your car, or on your person in view. Yet, it is not a dangerous place, and certainly less dangerous than Compton, CA where I worked previously. There I felt like a helpless baby sheep among wolves, becuase I knew only the bad guys were armed, and if I was, I'd have more to fear from the cops than the criminals. I could not be safe from either side.

It's probably not understandable for most people, but the open display of guns and the knowledge of how many people are armed here in Vegas makes me feel safe, even when I'm not armed, which is nearly all the time.; 2/25/18, 12:59 PM
gadfly said...: @Lexington Green said...
Trump's proposal for qualified and trained volunteer adults in schools to be armed is an obvious and overdue idea.

Arming teachers is hardly a Trump idea. A very quick google search turns up this article "Should Teachers Be Armed?" from March 12, 2001. The author, Dr. Michael S. Brown, concludes:

In theory, at least, this proposal is easy, cheap and safe. Individual participation is strictly voluntary, no money must be spent and no rights need be sacrificed. The primary obstacles are political. Police chiefs and school security officials will fight to protect their turf. Liberal teachers will fight to protect their pacifist ideology. There will also be resistance from the hard core anti-gun lobby which will never admit the deadly results of the gun-free zones they have created.; 2/25/18, 12:59 PM
langford peel said...: I guess it is true that they have really lowered the standards for the Marines.; 2/25/18, 12:59 PM
Gospace said...: Of course he doesn't want a gun in his classroom.

Until about a nano-second after he realizes someone is shooting at him.

A gun free zone is a killing field. Allowing teachers and school employees to be armed doesn't create a hard target. A group of terrorists could certainly take any school down. But- it would discourage all deranged individuals who would be facing uncertainty about being confronted. Unless they're intent on committing suicide by cop.; 2/25/18, 12:59 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: It already is expensive. The deputy who hid outside the building made $80,000 a year in a school district where the average teacher salary is under $50,000. (He ought to decline his pension out of shame, and if he doesn't, the county should go to court to cancel it anyway. Failure to show up in the most consequential moment of your career should have consequences.)

Wow.

This is like how universities pay their athletic coaches more than the professors and then wonder why higher education in this country is a joke. Well, it serves a different purpose. And the Repubes want schools to serve their purpose of collecting sitting ducks for the shooters they arm so well. Like I said, it makes them feel free. Bleeding kids, freedom-loving Repubes. More massacres = more warm freedom feelings for Repubes. You know that's how they feel. It's where their warm spot is. Making us like Afghanistan is something they feel more sentimental about than keeping kids from getting gunned down. They just don't love the kids - at least, not in a non-Taliban way. They love their guns.

Guns over kids. It's the Republican values system at work. No denying it any more.; 2/25/18, 1:01 PM
Quaestor said...: Hodgkinson was a left-wing "activist" and Trump-hater, like some here in our comments section.

Hodgkinson had no idea what real gun control entails. Thankfully.; 2/25/18, 1:02 PM
Etienne said...: Marines can't drink alcohol until age 21. Legally.

About their third year of enlistment, and usually after they are no longer eligible to deploy because of PTSD, and weight problems.; 2/25/18, 1:02 PM
officiousintermeddler said...: Swofford’s claim of expertise arises from the fact that 30 years ago, he served in the Marines for 3 years. There are over 22 million other military veterans who can make at least as good a claim. I’d be willing to bet that most of them don’t share Swofford’s opinion. In war, every soldier who is armed and sent into battle “adds to the carnage and confusion,” yet experts seem to agree that the more armed soldiers you have on your side, the better.; 2/25/18, 1:02 PM
deepelemblues said...: Reminder #345728190 that to those whose writings appear in the NYT and to the NYT's target audience, the common man and woman is a dangerous idiot that is only to be feared, controlled, and held in absolute contempt.; 2/25/18, 1:04 PM
traditionalguy said...: Samuel Colt's invention was the true Peacemaker in the 1860-1880s. Two Walker Colts shot 12 times in the same time a US Calvary man could one shot from his Army rifle. That matched up better with the bands of Indian Light Calvary fighting them who could each shoot 6 arrows a minute.

The Comanches of today are roaming to raid and kill Convenience Store clerks for money and leave no living witnesses, but a handy Glock 17 still stops them.; 2/25/18, 1:05 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Quaester said this:

Better Columbia than fucking Venezuela, the ultimate destination of TTR's socialist anti-Constitutional wet dreams.

But then, he also said this. To his senator:

F*** you, Kay. You and Lord Zero have put us this position with your profligate spending on key interest groups (people who mostly don’t pay Federal taxes, btw) at the expense of hard-pressed middle-class people like me who can’t even afford a new car (and can hardly find a decent and cheap used car thanks to “Cash for Clunkers”, thank you very much, Barack Hussein Obama) If you think the sequestration, a mere 2.4% of last year’s record spending of 3.6 X 10^12 USD is tough now (one must realize how f’ed we really are when deficit spending is more easily handled using scientific notation), what will you say when the interest on the federal debt becomes the biggest line item in the budget… Budget? What the hell am I thinking, there hasn’t been a budget resolution brought to the Senate floor in almost four years -- in direct contravention of the Budget and Accounting Act of 1921 and the Congressional Budget and Impoundment Control Act of 1974, I might add. Fortunately for you and Harry Reid these two federal laws have no sanctions clause so you’re in no danger of the leg irons and orange jump suit awaiting me if I stray one iota from the laws you like to impose on the little people (you remember, the people whose duty is to pay up and shut up?). But I digress, the fact is the sequestration is minuscule in relative terms to what little people like me have to endure in this low-to-no growth economy your lord and master promised to solve in his first term, not to mention the creeping inflation that makes it nearly impossible to travel or even afford to eat. I’ve pared back my lifestyle at least 150% from the Bush days, therefore I don’t see why a bunch of smart people with fancy degrees can’t make do with 97 cents where you had a dollar before. Don’t knock it before you try it, you might even discover the Government can live a bit more cheaply and still not actually starve (I’ve learned Spaghetti-Os three nights a week helps make the occasional meal out with friends more affordable.)

So that tells you all you need to know about how sane he and his approach to public policy is.

Definitely the kind of guy to be deciding on gun policy and providing a sane understanding of global politics.; 2/25/18, 1:05 PM
Gospace said...: The Toothless Revolutionary said...
Even speech laws have time place or manner restrictions. Repubes can't even deal with those. And if anything speech protections should have much greater leeway than guns.

Wow. Speech laws? Oh, you mean free speech areas on campuses and strict times when free speech can be practiced, and permits required by proper authorities, and nothing allowed to be said anywhere that might offend someone or be racist or sexist or..., all laws and rules and regulations established by liberals who can't stomach dissent! Prior to the recent modern era, about the only restriction on free speech was that you couldn't falsely shout FIRE! in a crowded theatre.; 2/25/18, 1:05 PM
Quaestor said...: I bought a Colt AR-15 this week.

Have a skilled gunsmith check the gas block. Colt has acquired a reputation for slipshod QC.; 2/25/18, 1:07 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Lot of nostalgia here for a time that has passed. We have to deal with reality. Lot's of things have changed. I didn't do shit at school, still got into a good college. Try doing that today. Things change.; 2/25/18, 1:09 PM
Etienne said...: Quaestor said...Welcome to fucking Columbia

Columbia is a river Einstein. Colombia is the country named after a mass killer.; 2/25/18, 1:10 PM
Quaestor said...: Even speech laws have time place or manner restrictions.

Gun laws already on the books restrict the carrying of firearms much more than the few laws affecting the 1st Amendment restrict speech. The fact that TTR is ignorant of this surprises me not at all.; 2/25/18, 1:12 PM
wwww said...: "You act as though you think these teachers would have to be able to clear rooms like in the battle of Fallujah."

You're actings as if a teacher, in a room, has a clear sight of the shooter.

I'm saying these things happen very quickly. To be effective at stopping the shooter, you need a single point of entry with a armed guard that can stand ground under fire. You need someone who can press a button to send out an alert to the school and police.

A teacher, in a room, would have to get to a lockbox very quickly. The other option is to have a loaded gun at all time on one's person. Not safe with lots of students, particularly elementary age students.

In the event of a shooter, the teacher has to shut and lock the door, to secure the room. That same teacher is not going to have time to leave the classroom and hunt the shooter.

This shooter pulled the alarm and students ran into the hallways. So, you've got civilians running all over the place. It's not a clear shot. Some commenters are acting as if this takes place on Gettysburg battlefield and not in hallways with twists and turns. Meanwhile, the bullets can penetrate the walls.

These shooters study each other. They read about what works and and what is less effective. Pulling a fire alarm with students running in the hallway, is going to be more, not less likely, in the future.

These shootings happen very quickly. There's little time to be running into another room to get a gun.

I'm not necessarily opposed to the idea.

I doubt its effectiveness. Given:

1) the inability to have a clear shot to the shooter (more similar to Fallujah and urban fighting then Gettysburg),
2) the compressed time in which these shootings occur, and
3) the speed needed to get the gun.

The shooters often kill themselves pretty quick in these attacks. They study each other's attacks. Expect each attacker to improve on their tactics of the last shooter.; 2/25/18, 1:12 PM
Etienne said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 2/25/18, 1:12 PM
langford peel said...: Liberals are all about restricting freedoms that are guarantied by the constitution. They want to restrict speech as witness the college speech codes. They want to confiscate all of the guns. Don't be fooledinto thinking that is not their goal.

They want a cowed and silent populace that is ruled by the elite.

Unfortunately for their socialist dreams that does not lead to Utopia.....it leads to Venezuela.; 2/25/18, 1:12 PM
Etienne said...: I bought a Colt AR-15 this week

I bought 400 shares of Index funds. Winning!; 2/25/18, 1:12 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Wow. Speech laws? Oh, you mean free speech areas on campuses...

Those aren't laws, dummy.

And if trolling Repubes can't pay for the security permits to maintain public order when they incite and demean community standards then that's their problems. Even obscenity laws still operate to keep your red state public square from looking like the Castro. You people are simply retarded. I guess the next right-wing freedom project will be to parachute famous die-hard Trump supporter David Duke into a West Bank Jewish settlement and have him lead a holocaust-denial festival.; 2/25/18, 1:13 PM
bagoh20 said...: At the range, my stepson and I were talking about the current anti-gun hysteria sweeping the country and about the coverage on TV. First, it's amazing to us how ill-informed some people on TV are about guns. I'm no expert by any means, but people with strong opinions about it often don't even know the basics, let alone statistics and how guns work in society. They are simply scary foreign things, that are bad.

We both have very liberal friends that hate, or fear guns. Most tolerated us, but admitted it was hard becuase we have guns. It was almost a deal breaker as friends for some. Some of these people have been convinced to go shooting with us or others. We could not think of a single person who maintained their anti-gun enthusiasm after being exposed to them and having the mystery dispelled. Some became virtual gun nuts themselves afterward, some apologized for their former assumptions about us.

This discussion in our culture would be easier and more fruitful if people knew even a little about what we are discussing. It's alright to not know, but that lack of knowledge should temper opinions a little, especially the hate.; 2/25/18, 1:15 PM
Unknown said...: First, if you follow the POTUS prescription you must select only self-motivated individuals who are willing to train continually for the entire course of their [armed] service.

Secondly, weekly firearms practice is necessary, IMHO, in order to become competent at hitting the target which may be stationary or, most likely, moving.

Thirdly, your candidates must be constantly trained to make "kill shots". This means deliberately taking a human life. It also means shooting the perpetrator in either the "golden triangle" (i.e. the eyes, nose and mouth) or in the upper central torso (heart, throat and lungs) or in the back of the head or torso if you are approaching from the perpetrator's rear flank.

Fourthly, fireaarms training is invariablly expensive to perform on a weekly basis. just using training rounds will require expenditures that easily surpass the acquistion cost of a semi-automatic pistol. A bi- weekly two hour practice period four times per month will run inexcess of $600.00 to $1000.00 per month per shooter. Who is funding this cost.

Five, the liability insurance cost for the school, the school district and the state / city/ county government will be increased because of the exposure increase brought about by well-trained civilians wielding fire-arms in a "law enforcement or security role. Again who pays for this increased cost?

Six, Extensive background checks will be required in order implement and operate this security enhancement proposed system change. Issues of privacy, cost and liabilty all attend this risk increase. Cost issues are not only represented by monetary charges but bypolitical costs as well. Political capital is being spent by putting this proposal ito action. Failure is a possible outcome and the political costs maybe high.

Seven, what will the political class do if the students, teaching staff and other [3rd] parties are injured or killed in a schoo- room fire fight?

Eight, the cross training burden expense in dollars and time for school districts will require changes in: employment rules, job manning objectives, Title XI procedures, hiring practices, healthcare benefits (e.g.long term PTSD, STD and LTD benefits for injured employees, income maintiance costs for the injured, school construction standards ( bullet proof (e.g.walls and doors), ammunition and firearm storage facilities, burglary system upgrades regarding off-hours theft risks, perimeter security enhancements to prevent or retard or contain armed intruders), increased life insurance benefits and improved mass cassuality death benefits.

Nine. Armed intruders may choose to take students and school staff as hostages; and engage in media driven public executions in order to display their "power". How will the government and school authorities respond to a room full of third graders being executed ( one by one) on the national news?

Ten. The perpetrator may switch from guns to explosives. What do we do then?; 2/25/18, 1:16 PM
langford peel said...: Of course liberals think our Constitution is a dead letter written by dead white men.

Something to be ignored at best or destroyed at worst.

You will start hearing them rant in one...two....thr.......; 2/25/18, 1:16 PM
John henry said...: Blogger The Toothless Revolutionary said...

You infrastructure-destroying debt-raisers don't pay them anywhere near enough already.

Bullshit, Squeamish.

Despite all the moaning, teachers get damn paid well. Around $50m annually in WI with benefits better than most any other job. And for working about 1,300-1,400 hours annually. Including off hours prep time. (a typical 40 hour week is 2,080 hours per year) That's about $37/hr.

Not bad for a semi-skilled job requiring little real education or training.

Let them learn a skill like shooting and give them an extra $1/hr or so to carry a pistol.

John Henry; 2/25/18, 1:17 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Gun laws already on the books restrict the carrying of firearms...

Obviously not enough. And the manner of firearms restricted is way too narrow.

Although maybe it would be nice to carry a flamethrower or bazooka. And a few RPGs.

Not to aim at anyone in particular. Just Republicans in the voting booth. And while taking NRA contributions.

You know. Clear and present dangers.; 2/25/18, 1:18 PM
deepelemblues said...: TTR meltdowns are always hilarious; 2/25/18, 1:18 PM
Etienne said...: If Cruz could have got laid when he was 16, I think a lot of his problems would never have become so challenging.

So I blame the girls and probably the queers and tranny's.

Make love, not war.; 2/25/18, 1:19 PM
Anonymous said...: "My point was that the impulse is to scatter, which makes it easy for the shooter"

This^^^^^^ is just plain stupid. Scattering is the only smart thing to do if there are a bunch of you. Gathering together into one large mass makes it easy for the shooter. This moronic idea of your to mass everyone and charge is, well, ....childish.

Only if proximity to the shooter is very close (experts claim that a person can close in on a shooter and be inside the shooter's ability to react only out to the distance of 21') does the 'gang attack' have any chance to succeed. In that case you better hope the shooter has a rifle and not a handgun. A rifle is hard to move in tight spaces...and, generally speaking, there are plenty of handguns that have much more stopping power than an AR15's .223. There are about 10 states that don't even allow .223 caliber for deer hunting...not powerful enough.

Really, really, dumb. Would you advise your child to do that?

Maybe the school should create a Varsity 'Forlorn Hope' squad to do as mock suggest.; 2/25/18, 1:19 PM
Sheridan said...: Dear Ann - may I suggest you initiate a standard poll for every blog post you write regarding hot-button issues such as this one. That poll would ask your readers to respond to several questions. 1) before reading the post, did you form an opinion on the topic based on the subject matter alone; 2) after reading the post but before you read any comments did that pre-formed opinion (assuming you had formed one)change; 3) after reading the comments did you a)finally form an opinion; b)reaffirm your opinion; c)change your opinion.

I'm interested in reducing the "opinion oscillation" effect that detracts from identifying and implementing best policy. I enjoy no intellectual insights or subtleties. My life in business proceeded along a path of policy, data, decision-tree analysis, risk assessment, contingency formulation, policy/product deployment and re-analysis (ad infinitum). Good decisions, good opinions developed from applying a business method (frankly, similar to the scientific method)that was tested and refined continually.

Second Amendment arguments aside for the time being (and I'm an NRA Benefactor Life Member so I've got skin in that game)all I want to hear now are emotion-free, implementable ideas about good practices (not perfect practices) that we can deploy to keep our kids safe at school. The political fights will occur after we reach a majority agreement on those good practices. There should be many good practices, not just one and those practices must be interlinked so that if one practice fails the entire system doesn't collapse. And this "system" we create together must adapt and change as circumstances require.; 2/25/18, 1:20 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: I bought a Colt AR-15 this week. Went shooting with my stepson yesterday. We have assorted rifles, and handguns. Here in Vegas..

You two dipshits are obviously in the wrong place. You should have been at the Route 91 Harvest Music Festival. On October 1st at 10:05 AM. Your contributions to society would have been greatly improved.; 2/25/18, 1:21 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: bagoh20 said...
We could not think of a single person who maintained their anti-gun enthusiasm after being exposed to them and having the mystery dispelled.

This is BS. I have shot guns and rifles. I have hunted on a family members farm. My son used to shoot semi-regularly at a range. We are both anti-gun by your standards. There is no mystery, they are machines designed to kill.; 2/25/18, 1:21 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Not bad for a semi-skilled job requiring little real education or training.

Hilarious.

John's vision for America: The uneducated educating the uneducated.

It really does describe the Republican philosophy of knowledge quite well.; 2/25/18, 1:22 PM
Quaestor said...: Columbia is a river Einstein.

Yeah, I misspelled Colombia. And you spliced a comma, Etienne. Columbia is also a city, and a district, and a province. As for your mass killer slur, take it up with the Colombians, who, being 90% either Mestizo or Amerindian, are descended at least in part from the alleged victims of Cristoforo Colombo yet seem less concerned about that than you are, ironic given that you probably have no standing in the case.; 2/25/18, 1:24 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Unfortunately for their socialist dreams that does not lead to Utopia.....it leads to Venezuela.

Or Western Europe. Or to a variety of non-anti-social/non-sociopathic places all around the globe.

But remembering that apparently little-known-fact would require the Republican brain to gain admission to something called "knowledge."

Next thing you know they'll be telling us how the murder and gun death rates are much higher everywhere else.

To be a Republican basically requires you to be a stupid, sociopathic cunt. Seriously, these twats love guns more than they do people!; 2/25/18, 1:25 PM
John henry said...: You know what happened to "peaceful productive citizen" in Germany, Poland, Russia, China and so on? What they got as a reward for being "peaceful, productive citizens"?

Death.

In large numbers. Around 100mm in the 20th century alone.

Or as the Israeli guard, survivor and former resistance fighter in Vonnegut's Mother Night called the "peaceful productive citizens" briquets.

Americans are not briquets. Not willingly or "peacefully" anyway.

European mileages may vary.

John Henry; 2/25/18, 1:26 PM
Anonymous said...: Eric Landgraaf's comment. Here's the TL:DR - 'I've tried nothing and I'm all out of ideas'.

"Ten. The perpetrator may switch from guns to explosives. What do we do then?"

Despite the inanity of that statement, it's already been done.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster; 2/25/18, 1:26 PM
Narayanan said...: Sheriff Israel is (Republican turned) Democrat, won re-election in 2016.; 2/25/18, 1:26 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Second Amendment arguments aside for the time being (and I'm an NRA Benefactor Life Member so I've got skin in that game)all I want to hear now are emotion-free...

You know. Because having any emotional connection to America's kids would violate the cold-blooded, Patrick Bateman sociopath standard that runs the Republican/NRA psyche.

The kids are units of production, don't you get it? They are practically inanimate and deserve just as little consideration.

The guns are more important. For those things Republican emotions run deep.; 2/25/18, 1:28 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: The people exist for the benefit of the guns.

New NRA motto.; 2/25/18, 1:29 PM
madAsHell said...: Bring back the Rifle Club.; 2/25/18, 1:30 PM
mockturtle said...: We are both anti-gun by your standards. There is no mystery, they are machines designed to kill.

And by what means would you choose defend yourself and your family if a murderer broke into your home?; 2/25/18, 1:30 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: We're feeling too emotional about the children.

Need to be more cold-blooded about this, say the Republicans assembled here.; 2/25/18, 1:30 PM
rcocean said...: "This is like how universities pay their athletic coaches more than the professors and then wonder why higher education in this country is a joke."

No. There's no correlation between "Paying athletic coaches more than Professors" and academic quality.

You're just jealous that someone who provides a valuable service (like a football coach) gets paid more than some Left-wing hack teaching "Marxist Gender studies" .; 2/25/18, 1:30 PM
langford peel said...: It is quite amusing to see the progressives demand more gun laws when they refuse to obey immigration laws.

If national gun control laws are enacted can you declare yourself a sanctuary city for gun owners?

After all guns will do the work that police officers refuse to do.; 2/25/18, 1:31 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: John said...
Not bad for a semi-skilled job requiring little real education or training.

People with this attitude are uncompetitive with the Chinese. It's that simple.; 2/25/18, 1:31 PM
John henry said...: Blogger The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Guns over kids

You racist fuck.

John Henry; 2/25/18, 1:31 PM
Michael K said...: There are already states, 18 I think, that allow teachers to be armed.

The key factor in this case was the school district policy to ignore and conceal student behavior problems. There are quite a few school districts with similar policies.

It will be interesting to see if the next school shooting is in one of those schools.; 2/25/18, 1:31 PM
rcocean said...: Higher Education is a Joke because the Professors are a Joke.

When Stan Fish and Larry Tribe are your big intellectuals...

I mean, fuck.; 2/25/18, 1:32 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: ...a valuable service (like a football coach)...

Hahahaha. Playing football is "valuable."

So I expect to see you out on the blacktop lecturing black parents that they're sending too many of their kids to school and not enough onto basketball courts and rap music studios. That's really where their economic futures lie.

Dumbass.; 2/25/18, 1:32 PM
John henry said...: Blogger The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Even speech laws have time place or manner restrictions.

Examples, Squeamish?

Other than fraudulent speech, and not even much there, our right to speak is as close to absolute as you can get.

John Henry; 2/25/18, 1:33 PM
Sheridan said...: TTR - guns in schools may not be a good practice if other practices are determined to be more effective and safe. There must be many dozens of actions that can be taken that do not include guns. Some of those actions have been discussed in these many comments. The 2nd Amendment debate should occur outside the framework of safe schools policies.; 2/25/18, 1:34 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: It is quite amusing to see the progressives demand more gun laws when they refuse to obey immigration laws.

It's quite boring to see the regressives confuse issues.

I mean, they do it all the time.

They just can't stick to the point.

Can't follow a point.

Just get all abstract about how guns are more important than people and why can't the rest of the country see the logic of that very important priority of theirs?; 2/25/18, 1:34 PM
Jim at said...: By all means, let's focus on everything BUT the complete and total failure of the Broward County Sheriff's office.; 2/25/18, 1:34 PM
exhelodrvr1 said...: wwww,
Stop with the straw-man arguments.
"n the event of a shooter, the teacher has to shut and lock the door, to secure the room. That same teacher is not going to have time to leave the classroom and hunt the shooter."

No one is saying they would. No one is expecting the armed teachers to react like Bruce Willis.

How many staff are at the high school (faculty, admin, maintenance, etc.)? For a school with 3000+ students, I'm guessing 150? If 10-20% of them were armed, that would be 15-30. It seems very likely that of that group, during an event that lasted 6-7 minutes, at least several of them would have been in a position to use a weapon.; 2/25/18, 1:35 PM
mikesixes said...: Mark said...
Well, if a quick internet search doesnt find it then it can't be true!

I guess Mark and I don't have the same Internet:
http://rense.com/general95/sch-shootings-stopped.html; 2/25/18, 1:36 PM
mockturtle said...: TTR loves to accuse Republicans and conservatives of all manner of violent sins, but the only one here who threatens actual violence is The Toothless Revolutionary, himself. The conclusions to be drawn are obvious. TTR is either:
1) A paranoid psychotic brewing up for his own shoot out.
2) An ineffectual pussy nursing a revenge fantasy.
3) A garden-variety troll of the not-too-bright sort whose doing his level best to assure the re-election of Donald Trump.

Quaestor, I though we had established that he is a teen-aged boy living in his mother's basement. Of course, that could encompass all of the above.; 2/25/18, 1:36 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: TTR loves to accuse Republicans and conservatives of all manner of violent sins, but the only one here who threatens actual violence is The Toothless Revolutionary, himself.

Oh yeah! That was really an actual threat and in no way a joke.

And you would know the difference because the serious letters that you email to your senator would be laughed off by any congressional aide as the ramblings of a lunatic nutcase.; 2/25/18, 1:36 PM
bagoh20 said...: "You should have been at the Route 91 Harvest Music Festival. On October 1st at 10:05 AM. Your contributions to society would have been greatly improved."

That might be true. Some incoming fire might have helped, but it is definitely true that you showing up with your fully automatic 300 page single-spaced ad hominem-laced dissertation would be of no value under any situation.

The fact is that the only thing that did stop that shooter, like most, was the approach of armed men, leaving the shooter no choice but to die now or soon. Either way, only guns stop gunmen.; 2/25/18, 1:36 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Blogger rcocean said...
Higher Education is a Joke because the Professors are a Joke.

Yet the Chinese elite will do pretty much anything to ensure that their kids can get into a US university. They prefer ones without a Div 1 football team.; 2/25/18, 1:37 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: A garden-variety troll of the not-too-bright sort whose doing his level best to assure the re-election of Donald Trump.

Hilarious.

Concern troll ("please don't make us vote for Trump!") admonishes against actual trolling.; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
Jim at said...: Guns over kids. It's the Republican values system at work. No denying it any more.

Know what, Ritmo? Fuck you.

Maybe someday you can push your ass away from the keyboard and act on your big mouth.

I sure hope so.; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
Quaestor said...: Although maybe it would be nice to carry a flamethrower or bazooka. And a few RPGs. Not to aim at anyone in particular. Just Republicans in the voting booth.

TTR loves to accuse Republicans and conservatives of all manner of violent sins, but the only one here who threatens actual violence is The Toothless Revolutionary, himself. The conclusions to be drawn are obvious. TTR is either:
1) A paranoid psychotic brewing up for his own shootout.
2) An ineffectual pussy nursing a revenge fantasy.
3) A garden-variety troll of the not-too-bright sort who's doing his level best to assure the re-election of Donald Trump.; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
n.n said...: They don't need to carry. They could have a weapons locker. The goal is, after all, to mitigate the risk of a lunatic opening an abortion field. That said, they should not advertise that they are low risk, viable targets for an elective abortion, let alone an abortion field.

Is the Democrat dream of depriving people motivated by violence in their urban jungles, notably diversitists?

An analogous argument to gun control is abstinence only education, which may work if women and men understood biology and were capable of self-moderating, responsible behavior. Actually, the numbers are not comparable. Whereas Planned Parenthood et al is accomplice to elective abortion and recycling of around one million human lives in America alone annually under the Pro-Choice Church's selective-child doctrine, elective abortions and fields open with guns number in the thousands, including suicides (i.e. self-abortions) and criminal (i.e. illegal) activity as first-order causes.

Anyway, risk management. Do we trust ourselves? Do we trust the People? Our Posterity?; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
wwww said...: We could not think of a single person who maintained their anti-gun enthusiasm after being exposed to them and having the mystery dispelled.

It depends by what you mean by "anti-gun." If you mean raising the age limit of semi-automatics to 21 and better background checks? Then, yep -- I'd say you are mistaken.; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
JAORE said...: Many are ignoring the deterrent effect of NOT being a gun free zone.
The huge number of CCW permits and dearth of accidents bodes well for civilian carry.
A teacher does not have to hunt down a shooter to save the kids in his/her class. Barricade the door, shot the bad guy if he comes in.

But, more relevant to THIS shooting:
When the cops actually entered the building, CRUZ DISCARDED HIS WEAPON and left by blending in with the students. He was apprehended away from the school

Do you think he would have tried the attack if he thought there might be numerous guns already in the school?; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
Etienne said...: What they got as a reward for being "peaceful, productive citizens"? Death.

Is it better to lose your life to violence, or is it better to become violent as well? The Bible is firm on this.

A Vietnamese man once said: "The Americans can rape me, but I will not give them the satisfaction of my becoming a rapist as well."; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Some incoming fire might have helped, but it is definitely true that you showing up with your fully automatic 300 page single-spaced ad hominem-laced dissertation would be of no value under any situation.

Except to an educated republic. With a sense of humor.

Which is something you resoundingly abhor.; 2/25/18, 1:38 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Maybe someday you can push your ass away from the keyboard and act on your big mouth.

And maybe someday you can stop letting the NRA do your thinking for you and open your mouth with some actual thoughts of your own.

But I doubt it. The risks for you are too high.; 2/25/18, 1:40 PM
langford peel said...: "Or Western Europe."

So we should be Germany or Sweden or even England?

Over run by mudering and raping immigrants who don't shoot children. They groom and rape them. While the police do nothing.

Based on the Democratic Coward County Sherrifs Department that is the preferred position of the progressive hive.

No thanks.

We want to keep our guns and our freedom of speech.; 2/25/18, 1:40 PM
Quaestor said...: Hilarious.

It's Number Two. (An ineffectual pussy nursing a revenge fantasy, in case it slipped whatever serves you for a mind.); 2/25/18, 1:41 PM
n.n said...: the only one here who threatens actual violence

There was another colorful clump of cells, or perhaps collection of electron circuits, who believes that the old and deplorable should be deemed unworthy and therefore legally eligible for a final solution. A Planned Retirement to complement Planned Parenthood.; 2/25/18, 1:42 PM
Quaestor said...: Except to an educated republic. With a sense of humor.

Has no place for TTR.; 2/25/18, 1:42 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Either way, only guns stop gunmen.

Right.

But laws don't stop the lawless.

Except in almost every other country. They all have lower gun-murder/mass shooting (and most have lower murder) rates than us.

Although at this rate, maybe we could get our gun murder rate up to where Yemen's is. One can hope!

A total model for a peaceful advanced society.; 2/25/18, 1:43 PM
John henry said...: Blogger Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...

Lot of nostalgia here for a time that has passed. We have to deal with reality. Lot's of things have changed. I didn't do shit at school, still got into a good college. Try doing that today. Things change.

Sounds like more bullshit, Squeamish.

Been a while since I've looked but 10-15 years ago the majority of colleges and universities were "open admission". If you had a HS diploma or GED they would accept you. Community Colleges were generally required, by federal law to accept anyone who showed up.

It is still a valid strategy to attend a CC for a couple years after HS then one can transfer, relatively easily, to a selective school for the credential. Assuming demonstrated good performance.

John Henry; 2/25/18, 1:43 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Over run by mudering and raping immigrants who don't shoot children.

Not in the same numbers they happen to ours.

But to you, it's not like every life matters.

Just who did the killing - native or not. That's more important to you.

It's ok to come out of the closet and admit it. My name is langford peel and I don't care if you live or die, just that it wasn't the person I don't like who dun it!; 2/25/18, 1:44 PM
Kevin said...: We need to put an end to Gun Free Zone Soft Targets that have become killing zones for the disarmed and defenseless. The American public is coming around to this point of view.

Washington Post-ABC News Poll Feb 2018

http://www.washingtonpost.com/page/2010-2019/WashingtonPost/2018/02/20/National-Politics/Polling/release_513.xml?tid=a_mcntx

Quote:
Q: (You may have heard about the mass shooting at a high school in Parkland, Florida this week.) Do you think this event could or could not have been prevented by allowing school teachers to carry guns?
A: *** Could have been prevented: 42% ***

--- End quote ---

And teachers have heard the message.

Sheriff offers free CCW class for teachers, 250 sign up in 24 hours
http://www.fox19.com/story/37534330/butler-sheriff-im-going-to-offer-ccw-classes-to-teachers; 2/25/18, 1:45 PM
wwww said...: It seems very likely that of that group, during an event that lasted 6-7 minutes, at least several of them would have been in a position to use a weapon.

Maybe, maybe not. I don't have enough info on this shooting. If the shooter did not enter any classrooms, and if kids were running around the hallways due to the shooter pulling the fire alarms... well, did any teacher have a clear shot? Did any teacher in their classrooms see the gunman? Did the geography teacher that was shot see the gunman?

The coach in the hallway -- he would have needed to be carrying to be effective.

Like I said, I'm not automatically opposed, but I am doubtful of the efficacy.

That's why I'm proposing single point of entry with armed guard with military level training to stand ground under combat fire. Bulletproof windows so the shooter cannot gain entry by shooting out windows like the Sandy Hook shooter.

Other things that can help: Raise age to 21. Schizophrenia onsets between the ages of 18-21.

JV records are often expunged.

A man is a LOT more likely to have a police record by age 21 then age 18. Gives time to acquire a police record if a man acquires schizophrenia or other mental issues that cause violent behaviours.; 2/25/18, 1:47 PM
Big Mike said...: As long as people like Toothless and ARM running around loose, honest people need the right to arm themselves.; 2/25/18, 1:48 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: John said...
Been a while since I've looked but 10-15 years ago the majority of colleges and universities were "open admission".

What planet do you live on?; 2/25/18, 1:49 PM
Dad29 said...: a bad discipline case with a problem with alcohol and suicidal tendencies.

A natural for NYTimes editorial page.; 2/25/18, 1:49 PM
John henry said...: Blogger The Toothless Revolutionary said...

John's vision for America: The uneducated educating the uneducated.

Not my vision "for" America. Just an accurate statement of the current situation. Going back 100 years or more for teacher training.

My vision "for" America would be burning schools of education to the ground. Including my alma mater. An ed degree would be a disqualification for classroom teaching.

How's this for an idea: History majors teaching history, science majors teaching science, English majors teaching English, Spanish speakers teaching Spanish and so on.

It's not pay that keeps this from happening. It's credentialism.

But teacher training's another subject.

You really are in fine fettle today, Squeamish. Just pegging my bullshit meter off the scale.

John Henry; 2/25/18, 1:49 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: As long as people like Toothless and ARM running around loose, honest people need the right to arm themselves.

Yeah. We're shooting our well-informed mouths off and in that sense you're definitely outgunned. And it leaves your outsized sense of dignity too butthurt to do anything about it other than harbor actual gun violence scenarios.

Talk about res ipsa loquitur.

Like I said, these fucks care more about guns than people. Any of you care to deny it?

I doubt that will happen. A more accurate truth has never been spoken.; 2/25/18, 1:52 PM
langford peel said...: If you are looking for a sous chef to prepare a tasty word salad of meaningless gibberish than Ritmo is your man.

He is Michelin quality.; 2/25/18, 1:52 PM
exhelodrvr1 said...: wwww,
You seem to think that people are proposing that the only step be taken is to arm teachers.; 2/25/18, 1:52 PM
Michael K said...: It depends by what you mean by "anti-gun." If you mean raising the age limit of semi-automatics to 21 and better background checks? Then, yep -- I'd say you are mistaken.

Background checks are only as good as the data provided. This school district, and it is not the only one, has chosen to conceal student behavior that might trigger a NICS report and even file false reports.

The age limit is pure PR.; 2/25/18, 1:52 PM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: had Mr. Feis been armed, he would not have been able to draw his weapon (a side arm, presumably) quickly enough to stop the shooter, who with an AR-15 would have had the coach outgunned. Even if the coach had been able to draw his weapon — from where? his athletic shorts? — any shots he managed to fire would have risked being errant, possibly injuring or killing additional students.

Every bit of that is stupid and we are all dumber because we read it.

1) Its entirely possible that the coach could have heard gun fire before the shooter came within site of him and therefore could have drawn the weapon before the shooter reached him. In addition, the shooter is not omniscient. He's jacked on adrenaline and very likely has tunnel vision. Or he might have been focused on someone else. So yes, it is possible that the coach could have drawn his weapon.

2) This idea that an AR-15 somehow trumps a pistol is truly moronic. This isn't a game of rock/paper/scissors. The relative muzzle velocity of the weapons is irrelevant. If the guy with the pistol fires a round and it hits the guy with the AR-15, the guy with the AR-15 is going to be injured or killed. The AR-15 doesn't put up some sort of force field. At the very least, the idea that someone is returning fire is likely to make the guy with the AR-15 start thinking a lot less about shooting people and a lot more about taking cover.

3) And then we get to the last argument, he might have accidentally shot a student. Do I have to explain how dumb that argument is? Yes, he might have. But not having a pistol to defend yourself and others in that situation means that the gunmen will go on killing. So, there is the chance of an accidental shooting of an innocent or the certainty of it.; 2/25/18, 1:53 PM
Dad29 said...: Another thought re: Swofford.

Not that long ago, juvenile delinquents who were in court for their offenses were given a choice by the judge: either 2 years in jail, OR join the Marines, right now.

One of my cousins joined the Marines instead of going directly to jail. I'm sure he's not the only juvie delinquent who did so.

Hmmmmmmmm.....?; 2/25/18, 1:53 PM
bagoh20 said...: ARM said: "I have shot guns and rifles. I have hunted on a family members farm. My son used to shoot semi-regularly at a range. We are both anti-gun by your standards. There is no mystery, they are machines designed to kill."

I wasn't suggesting that people like you do not exist. They clearly do, and I can respect your opinion, becuase you at least are informed by exposure. That does not mean you can't be wrong about it. People can disagree even when they share the same facts.

Of course guns are designed to kill. Has anyone said otherwise? They're deadly capabilities is exactly why you need them when a murderer needs stopped. The question is: are we OK with bad guys doing all the killing until just the right armed person shows up with the proper uniform and under proper government approved protocol leaving us long dead, or do we want the right and ability to protect ourselves when necessary? Bad guys don't follow the rules. They need to be convinced by other means.; 2/25/18, 1:54 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Which Republican here will admit to caring more about people than about guns?

I will hear crickets. And then cheap talk.

Maybe a prayer or two.

You know. Really effective, demonstrative stuff.

Republicans show how much they care by how many of the kids they allow to be massacred.

Care about the guns, that is.; 2/25/18, 1:54 PM
Etienne said...: When America's millionaire football hero's started squatting to the National Anthem, the only sane thing to do was for our police to squat back out of respect.; 2/25/18, 1:55 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: I can hear the right-wingers now: "That school was a communist stronghold! It was Venezuela!"; 2/25/18, 1:57 PM
langford peel said...: I want to be able to defend myself and my loved ones and not to depend on the police. No better illustration can be made than that of the agents of the state cowering in the face of one kid murdering other children.

The main objective of a policeman is to get his pension as Officer Peterson personified.

The only possible defense is self defense.

Ritmo and a Reason Free Man want to take that right away from you and yours. The rest of us do not. It's that simple.; 2/25/18, 1:57 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: When America's millionaire football hero's started squatting to the National Anthem, the only sane thing to do was for our police to squat back out of respect.

I think this comment deserves an award for most convoluted of the thread.

And it had a lot of competition. From the NRA-supporting "Love our guns more than those kids!" crowd.; 2/25/18, 1:58 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: I want to be able to defend myself and my loved ones and not to depend on the police.

Then get your own fucking army. There's no end to this crap now that you've paramilitarized your police forces as a necessary response to the way you militarized the consumer firearms supply chain.

Ritmo and a Reason Free Man want to take that right away from you and yours.

Come here and threaten me, then. We'll see about that.

You don't give a shit about defense. You couldn't defend yourself on this thread if your life depended on it.

You care about guns. That's it.

Not kids. Not defense. Not self-defense.

Guns.; 2/25/18, 2:01 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Yeah, there you go FullMoon. Admit that you have no response to the arguments.

Never go FullMoon. Once you go FullMoon it's like going fully automatic. And not knowing where to aim.

It's like going full retard.; 2/25/18, 2:02 PM
langford peel said...: We love our guns because our guns are the only thing that will protect our kids.

The cops will not.

The only sure defense is self defense.

You can't depend on the state to protect you or defend your rights. In fact they are in the business of taking your rights away bit by bit. Once they succeed in taking all the guns then it is game over.; 2/25/18, 2:02 PM
stan said...: The failure of logic from the NY Times and its followers is scary indeed.

Can't fix stupid.; 2/25/18, 2:04 PM
Jason said...: My son is a cop. He told me that, as terrifying as the prospect of having to enter a school to stop a killer is, he and his colleagues all agree it would be much worse and more dangerous if numerous uncoordinated people in the school were trying to do the same thing.

Your son is a dolt who didn't think this through. Now count the unwarranted, bullshit assumptions in his post.; 2/25/18, 2:04 PM
Ron Winkleheimer said...: Even if the coach had been able to draw his weapon — from where? his athletic shorts?

This is stupid too. How do you know he was wearing athletic shorts? Maybe he was wearing khakis of sweats.; 2/25/18, 2:05 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: bagoh20 said...
Of course guns are designed to kill. Has anyone said otherwise?

You said there was some mystery about guns that could be dissipated by exposure. There is no mystery.

Syringes filled with pentobarbital are designed to kill. I don't want anybody and everybody to have access to pentobarbital-filled syringes either, and these are vastly less effective killing machines than an AR-15.; 2/25/18, 2:05 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: We love our guns because our guns are the only thing that will protect our kids.

When?

This is delusion. Madness. You're getting way more kids killed than those you "defended." You just like living in a society where you can be paranoid that someone must be lurking about waiting to kill you around every corner. You see Afghanistan as a societal ideal.

Here's 25 so far. Just for 2018. Great progress!

Show me how your numbers stack up. How many kids defended themselves from death with guns?

Once they succeed in taking all the guns then it is game over.

Again, delusion. No one's arguing for a total ban. No one. Straw man. Slippery slope.; 2/25/18, 2:06 PM
Jessica said...: This literally makes no sense.; 2/25/18, 2:07 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Republican take: More bullets flying in more directions means less death.

The society exists for the sake of the guns, folks.; 2/25/18, 2:09 PM
Beloved Commenter AReasonableMan said...: Jason said...
"My son is a cop. He told me that, as terrifying as the prospect of having to enter a school to stop a killer is, he and his colleagues all agree it would be much worse and more dangerous if numerous uncoordinated people in the school were trying to do the same thing."

Your son is a dolt

If dolt means sensible fellow. The OK corral is not a good look for a modern country.; 2/25/18, 2:10 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: What gun would want to live in a society designed for the well-being of humans?; 2/25/18, 2:11 PM
Quaestor said...: wwww wrote: Bulletproof windows so the shooter cannot gain entry by shooting out windows like the Sandy Hook shooter.

Many modern school buildings are constructed with one ground-level floor on the theory that windows can be used as emergency exits. If those windows were replaced with the kind of glass often found in banks, which is proof against common handgun calibers such as 9mm Parabellum, but not .308 and similar rifle bullets, then the possibility of children being trapped inside a classroom endangered by smoke or fire arises.

Other things that can help: Raise age to 21. Schizophrenia onsets between the ages of 18-21.

JV records are often expunged.

A man is a LOT more likely to have a police record by age 21 then age 18. Gives time to acquire a police record if a man acquires schizophrenia or other mental issues that cause violent behaviours.

All good points and worthy of consideration.; 2/25/18, 2:12 PM
Jason said...: My son is a cop. He told me that, as terrifying as the prospect of having to enter a school to stop a killer is, he and his colleagues all agree it would be much worse and more dangerous if numerous uncoordinated people in the school were trying to do the same thing.

Your son is a dolt who didn't think this through. Now count the unwarranted, bullshit assumptions in what he said.

First, he's assuming that everyone would be freelancing, and that no one would have assigned areas of responsibility or an assigned sector

He's also assuming none of the armed teachers would have been trained to go to the prone position and drop the weapon as soon as the police are on site... DESPITE this being in the curriculum of any concealed carry licensing program.

Further, he assumes no one would have given any thought to friendly recognition, despite having weeks or months or years to prepare.

He also assumes that a school with a shooter who's dead, wounded or cornered is more dangerous than a school in which the shooter has not encountered any meaningful resistance whatsoever.

Libtards should stop taking counsel of their fears. They keep projecting their own uselessness onto their betters. If teachers are as stupid and pathetic as a group as the libtards keep arguing they are, then we need to have a major purge and replace them with real people who can act as a militia in a crisis, who accept the adult responsibility to defend their own classrooms and themselves, and generally fog a fecking mirror.

Yes, there are some outcomes that may be suboptimal.

ALL of them are better than what we saw in Parkland.; 2/25/18, 2:12 PM
bagoh20 said...: "Like I said, these fucks care more about guns than people. Any of you care to deny it?

I doubt that will happen. A more accurate truth has never been spoken."

Ignorant, arrogant, and demonstrably wrong.

Who is it that refuses to even entertain any possible solution except gun control, even when other solutions have been shown empirically to save lives. The school was under the strictest gun control possible: a gun-free zone. Many cities like Chicago are under strict controls. They fail. I know you imagine a United States without the 2nd amendment, but that is not happening. If you can't accept that fact, then YOUR fantasy about guns is more important than people. That certainly is the case in Chicago and many other places where that fantasy rules the people as they bleed out. Why do these shooters never attack gun-friendly zones? Is it becuase they don't like guns, or they don't want them shooting back.

Even if loosening gun restrictions like ending gun-free zones could be unequivocally proven to save lives, we know that many like you would still be against it, becuase the guns are more important than the people saved. People want to have guns to saves lives, especially those closes to them, who the cops don't even know are in danger until it's too late.; 2/25/18, 2:14 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: We need to make our people-centric society more gun-friendly.

The guns rule us, after all.

Inconveniences will be required. Did you think the people were above the guns? Ha hahah a.

We exist at their pleasure and peril.

An unsold, unfired gun is not a happy gun, folks.

A person not carrying is not entitled to pursue happiness.; 2/25/18, 2:14 PM
Quaestor said...: The OK corral is not a good look for a modern country.

Bad choice, ARM. The OK Corral shootout arose from police enforcing an anti-gun ordinance.; 2/25/18, 2:15 PM
Jason said...: The OK corral is not a good look for a modern country.

If you were smarter, you would have already realized the obvious:

Once Cruz pulled out his AR-15 in the school building, the shootout at the OK Corral was already on.; 2/25/18, 2:16 PM
wwww said...: Final comments on arming teachers.

(1) They aren't armed guards, and they don't have a duty to leave their classrooms, where their students are hiding.

(2) Teachers who are mothers have a duty to stay alive for their minor children at home. They have a maternal duty to not put themselves in increased danger by leaving the classroom and drawing fire from an active shooter.

(3) A coach on security duty who is not carrying would need to take the time to run to wherever his gun is locked, get it out, and run back to where the shooter is. That takes time. It's also confusing for him, as the shooter is moving around, bullets are flying and students are madly rushing about. (

4) In that instance, does the coach have a greater duty to re-direct students away from the shooter, rather then running towards him?

(5) Conclusion: It's not effective unless the coach is carrying the weapon. The weapon can't be in a lock box somewhere else.

"The age limit is pure PR."

PR for whom?

School shooters are boys who will shoot up what they know. They know K-12 schools. WE all know very well that a small percentage of boys will acquire schizophrenia.

An 18 year old doesn't have much time to get a police record. Or go crazy and get put under an involuntary hold for mental illness. A 21-year-old has a couple of years to acquire a police record.

The Sheriff's office messed up BIGLY as Trump would say. His mother died of the flu in November, and the shooter cracked up. The police, the FBI -- nobody stopped him before he did the shooting.

But he was barely of age.

Prior to that point, he was below the age of 18. If arrested before the age of 18, would his record have been expunged? Would he still have been able to acquire a weapon? If he'd been 21 before he could acquire these weapons, chances are he (1) would have a police record by that time or (2) He'd choose something else to shoot up, like his place of work or a movie theatre.

Sure, don't change anything. Don't install bullet proof windows. Don't hire armed guards with military training. Don't raise the age limit to 21 to buy semi-automatics.

But don't be surprised when it happens again.; 2/25/18, 2:16 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Who is it that refuses to even entertain any possible solution except gun control, even when other solutions have been shown empirically to save lives.

One who can actually compare statistics on a country-by-country basis. You dismiss the findings of over 170 other countries and have the nerve to talk about something being "empirically shown."

Bollocks. I have no reason to listen to you any further. The gun nuts are the least rational, most illogical activists there are. They just love the gun. It's a completely emotional thing. For you directed toward the gun.

Just not the kids.

You will use any statistics you want to achieve that love. Gun love. But not lives saved love. Other countries don't exist only in America can we look at numbers.

Again. Fucking bollocks.; 2/25/18, 2:17 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Some people can never change.They may grow older, but never grow up SAD!

You mean, like you? This is the second time you not only failed to respond to the arguments or even come up with anything to say, just to repost the same thing like no one heard you the first time. (Although I'm sure they didn't. You must be used to going unheard).

Like I said, never go FullMoon. It's like going Full Retard.; 2/25/18, 2:19 PM
Quaestor said...: Ergo, we could solve the problem by getting rid of high schools.

Simpler still is getting rid of Etiennes.

Have some Kool-Ade.; 2/25/18, 2:20 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Once Cruz pulled out his AR-15 in the school building, the shootout at the OK Corral was already on.

I think it was on once he received the weapon but that's the part you want to happen as often as possible.; 2/25/18, 2:21 PM
Jim at said...: They don't want fewer kids dying. If more kids have to die for them to get the guns, in their minds that's on the gun owners. - Kevin

Precisely.

It's a power play. And if the left has to step over a few more bodies in order to achieve their goals? So be it.; 2/25/18, 2:22 PM
FullMoon said...: Alex said...

It's a given that as soon as Ritmo shows up the

thread is destroyed. There will be no good

discussions afterwards.
3/2/13, 3:25 PM; 2/25/18, 2:22 PM
Jess said...: I think many ignore the fact the shooter was not trained for combat. I doubt he could have reacted without hesitation when confronted, or have continued to function if hit. More than likely, he would have run, or became so inaccurate, his rounds would have given anyone returning fire time to aim for a good result.

The logic of preventing others from being armed, with the reason their rounds might have hurt others doesn't fly with me. There are too many rounds that will not pass through walls, have good knockdown power, and anyone armed for security in a possible crowd situation would know to use them to remove some of the hesitation for return fire.

I don't quite understand why many students are so willing to demand stricter gun laws. Logic dictates they wouldn't accomplish anything, since laws prevented them from being armed, local law enforcement avoided protecting them, and federal officers ignored the threat. Who do they expect to protect them? What will they use to protect them?; 2/25/18, 2:23 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: ...the cops don't even know are in danger until it's too late.

The cops have an idea of who's in danger of getting a gun until it's too late.

Arm the inmates!; 2/25/18, 2:23 PM
wwww said...: Many cities like Chicago are under strict controls. They fail.

As someone who has lived in Chicago -- I always want to say: "HELLO -- INDIANA IS RIGHT NEXT DOOR!" Gun control laws are gonna fail if someone can drive 20 minutes into Indiana and buy whatever.

But there's a big difference living in Detroit versus living across the bridge in Canada. The difference is you have to go through customs.

That said: I agree school kids in the US are pretty much sitting ducks. I have no hope you'll change anything. Not because of the 2nd Amendment, as much by a paralysis of action by a whole host of people, organizations and politicians.

You don't want to take the security measures of Israel. You don't want to raise the age limit. You don't want to pay taxes to install bullet proof glass. Or buy class room doors that lock from the inside. Or hire the type of guards they'd hire in Israel -- people who are trained for military situations and not mall cops.

So, you know the logical conclusion: It will happen again.

Finis.; 2/25/18, 2:24 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Full Retard Full Moon is quoting "Alex" from 2013.

In 2013. They knew the gun-love thread wouldn't spread the gospel of gun-love any further than among the gun-loving nuts.

Oh no!

What a deep fucking quote. Such an eloquent contribution to pro-massacre Full Moon's little comment collection.

He loves guns, too. People can't stand him.; 2/25/18, 2:25 PM
Quaestor said...: Like I said, never go FullMoon.

And Toothless goes full Pee-Wee as usual.

Will someone please return his bike? The one with the streamers on the grips. Thank you.; 2/25/18, 2:25 PM
FullMoon said...: Some people can never change.They may grow older, but never grow up SAD!
Same old thing for a decade or so.
TOOTHLESS Ritmo Brasileiro said...
It's good to know that the stupidest threads are just ripe for the threadjacking. I'll be sure to leave a trail of turds on every one of the brain droppings here that suit my fancy. Getting you shit-eaters to complain about the taste after opening your mouths wide and saying "Ahhhh..." to every bad idea under the sun is very satisfying, I must admit.

10/16/10, 10:28 AM; 2/25/18, 2:27 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: As someone who has lived in Chicago -- I always want to say: "HELLO -- INDIANA IS RIGHT NEXT DOOR!"

Awwww SHIT! You're trying geography out on these nutters. They're impervious to it; they think it's a jedi mind trick.

Indiana. The land of fireworks, farms and fields of unregulated pharmaceuticals freely flowing with fertilizer into every stream and grain silo. What could possibly go wrong with that scenario?

The land of mutations has a lot of fun to import to the city next door.; 2/25/18, 2:28 PM
FullMoon said...: Always been the same.
Blogger Pogo said...

Plus, I figger that once Ritmo Underpants arrives, the thread is already stick-a-fork-in-it d-e-a-d dead.

10/15/10, 6:27 AM; 2/25/18, 2:30 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Are you trying to say something to me, Full Moon Full Retard?

You keep reposting the same thing over and over again. Like a dog carrying a message someone left in his collar.

I don't speak werewolf. You'll have to rephrase your concern trolling in the form of human language.

Lassie keeps scratching at the door! She's saying something to us!

ROFLMAO.; 2/25/18, 2:30 PM
Michael K said...: Conclusion: It's not effective unless the coach is carrying the weapon. The weapon can't be in a lock box somewhere else.

"The age limit is pure PR."

PR for whom?

For anti-gunners like you.

The point was that teachers who wish to be armed, like those in 18 states already, should be allowed to do so. There could be "common sense" training requirements. Most of those who are interested, already have a record of training.

The result of all this political posturing is that nothing will be done and Democrats who choose to run on an anti-gun issue are welcome to do so.

The real problem here was, as I point out above, the SJW forces that want to stop misbehaving black and brown students from being punished will cause more of this Guns are irrelevant.; 2/25/18, 2:31 PM
FullMoon said...: Does anybody take Toothless seriously? He

immediately comes across as someone who no one

takes seriously on anything. That chip on his

shoulder has the weight of about a hundred

albatrosses. It's fairly obvious that people are used to

giving him the same regard as Ted Kaczynski got.

Just an childish, reclusive, temper-tantrum throwing ugly

bitch who can't conceal his hatred for the world and

couldn't enjoy a sunny day if his life depended on it.

Apparently, someone actually told him this was

endearing once - some time long ago. And he keeps

nursing that little voice.; 2/25/18, 2:33 PM
Etienne said...: "Do you think he would have tried the attack if he thought there might be numerous guns already in the school?"

Do you think B-29 bombers would nuke Japan unless they had air superiority?; 2/25/18, 2:33 PM
bagoh20 said...: "I don't want anybody and everybody to have access to pentobarbital-filled syringes either, and these are vastly less effective killing machines than an AR-15."

You keep lighting up straw men. Nobody wants anybody and every body to have an assualt rifle. Would you ban syringes? How many Phenobarbital-filled ones are used in defense, or for sport even.

"Assault style" weapons of all kinds are the least likely cause of death of any common weapon. They account for an average of 18 deaths in mass shooting per year. Knives kill about 1800 people per year. It's the knife nuts who you should go after. How many knives do you own? I don't fear knives either, or want them banned. They have a useful function too, even if they are designed to cut flesh and and are used to murder a hundred times more often than an AR-15. The facts should matter, and they would if the emotion could just be dialed down.; 2/25/18, 2:33 PM
Fabi said...: "There is no mystery, they are machines designed to kill."

Such insight, Beloved Comrade Armapov! Have you told anyone else about this revelation?; 2/25/18, 2:33 PM
Etienne said...: FullMoon said...Does anybody take Toothless seriously?

It's a blog. Go back to work, and quit goofing off.; 2/25/18, 2:34 PM
n.n said...: And if the left has to step over a few more bodies in order to achieve their goals?

They are infamous for their wicked and selective solutions.; 2/25/18, 2:34 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Nobody wants anybody and every body to have an assualt rifle.

The NRA that owns the Republican Party certainly seems to. Show me what they've done to indicate otherwise.; 2/25/18, 2:35 PM
FullMoon said...: Toothless, I’ve read your many comments over the years

and it’s very clear now that you cannot make an

argument based on the facts of the matter at hand.

You resort to twisting, spindling, projection and

outright lies. Don’t you realize that you rob yourself of

credibility every time you do that?; 2/25/18, 2:35 PM
USAF Service said...: If the trained, regularly recertified teachers/coaches/principals/custodians train with police, are on a list of armed citizens at the school on record with police, and are issued a radio or special number to call during an incident so that they can coordinate with police, and who have specific roles to cover corridors or key areas to deny movement to the shooter that are known to the police, and the “gun free” zone label comes off such schools, then few crazies would dare enter those places. If you substitute “bank” for “school”, don’t police expect to encounter armed guards during an incident, and plan and prepare to coordinate accordingly? The tool - the gun - is not the problem. Lack of seriousness about examining and addressing the real reasons and solutions for these incidents is the problem; 2/25/18, 2:36 PM
wwww said...: State lines. Easy to cross. Not so easy to cross national boarders. Why you don't find lots of Michigan guns in Canada.

South Chicago. Close to Indiana.

In six years, 3,824 guns taken off Chicago gang bangers that were used in crimes came from our next door neighbor: Indiana. It’s why WGN Investigates took undercover cameras over the border to see why.

http://wgntv.com/2014/09/03/indiana-guns-favorite-of-chicago-gangbangers/; 2/25/18, 2:37 PM
buwaya said...: "Then get your own fucking army"

That is the whole point, to facilitate revolt against tyrants, or a government turned tyrranical. It is the designed-in ultimate political sanction. Such "Armies" are a bit different these days though, they will look more like the IRA or MS13 than the minutemen.

This is a unique feature of the US political system. In no small way it is a part of your identity.

You need it too, as unlike most countries, even modern ones, the US lacks a communal culture or sets of communal cultures (as for instance that the Tamils turned against the Sinhalese). There is little to aid the individual against the state, if the cultural powers that be are also aligned with the state. The US has been remarkably atomized and much of it lacks effective tribes that can threaten the state, as powerful entities.

Your cases of "revolt" through protest (Ferguson say) are fakes, that happen only when the MSM and the politicians want to use it. Otherwise you are alone, or nearly so. Its unlikely for instance that Mr. Finicum will get justice, as the powers and the press dont care.

If this escalates, which its very likely to considering the current climate, and given a likely switch in government, the well-armed "deplorables" can expect a much-intensified campaign of demonization, cultural erasure, and suppression of dissent, followed by protest, followed by martyrs. At that point you will get terrorism, followed by suppression, followed by guerilla war. This is almost a formula. Its not inevitable, but its extremely common in history.

The Second Amendment is meant to facilitate, in the modern context, that terrorism and that guerilla war. Its meant to keep a government from going too far, from making even a minority (or a reasonably large one) unhappy enough to resort to a dangerous level of political violence.

Your recent governments have gone way too far as it is. The huge recent increase in weapons sales should be seen as a sign of danger, a signal to back off on economic, political and cultural aggression. That snake on your old flags is rattling its tail.; 2/25/18, 2:40 PM
Quaestor said...: wwww wrote: Or hire the type of guards they'd hire in Israel -- people who are trained for military situations and not mall cops.

Israel has universal conscription. Everyone, with some exceptions, receives basic infantry training and after active duty remains on ready reserve status for several years. The armed guards stationed in Israeli schools are teachers, their protective duty is secondary. Because of conscription and the basic firearms training nearly everyone receives as a consequence, its assumed that most teacher already have a practical firearms background, therefore only periodic refresher training and regular range time is called for. As a rule, they carry service pistols or semi-automatic rifles because assault rifles demand more lengthy training than the education ministry believes is called for.; 2/25/18, 2:40 PM
Etienne said...: OK, you want my opinion, here's a video that discloses the countries insanity in less than 2 minutes:

NUTS!; 2/25/18, 2:40 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: FullMoon is stuck in robot quote mode. Does... not... compute...

Surely... the... perfect... comeback... is... somewhere... in... databanks...; 2/25/18, 2:41 PM
n.n said...: Just as scalpels are dual-use tools, guns are dual-use tools, too. Just as we shouldn't ban scalpels, or doctors, that may be used in an abortion rite, we shouldn't ban the vast majority of guns, and people, that are not active participants in an abortion rite, an abortion field, or to otherwise violate civil or human rights.; 2/25/18, 2:42 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: FullMoon is more interested in me than in his "spicy Latin young wife."

Because she rolls her eyes at him and on the internets no one can roll their eyes at him.; 2/25/18, 2:42 PM
FullMoon said...: Sensible contributor posits:

The Toothless Revolutionary said...

Actually human beings have always tended to settle near major bodies of water, and probably would have never left Africa or even reached the Americas 15,000 years ago had it not been for coastal migration patterns.

American conservatives want to carry out a genocide/democide directed at killing off the majority of humanity that lives at/on the coasts - including the coasts of North America.

9/10/17, 9:11 AM; 2/25/18, 2:43 PM
langford peel said...: "Your recent governments have gone way too far as it is. The huge recent increase in weapons sales should be seen as a sign of danger, a signal to back off on economic, political and cultural aggression. That snake on your old flags is rattling its tail."

This is the most perceptive and on the point things that have ever said on this blog.; 2/25/18, 2:44 PM
bagoh20 said...: "Does anybody take Toothless seriously?"

Let me see. I've been seeing him around these parts for years, and .........

uuuuummmmmm, Nope. Nobody ever did.; 2/25/18, 2:44 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: How's your little wife and real estate investment advisor doing, FullMoom?

Are you capable of financial independence yet or still require her assistance and coaching?

Mommy!!!

LOL; 2/25/18, 2:45 PM
Rusty said...: I'm going with option #2 Muckturttle.
he's angry, he's drunk and he's run out of inflatable companionship.; 2/25/18, 2:46 PM
Michael K said...: The huge recent increase in weapons sales should be seen as a sign of danger, a signal to back off on economic, political and cultural aggression.

They have gotten so arrogant that they don't see it. It was a "tell" when gun sales dropped after Trump's election.

He is a threat to the Deep State but maybe the voters are smart enough to see where this is going and stop it in November,

We'' ll see.; 2/25/18, 2:47 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Nope. Nobody ever did.

That's ok. The whole rest of the civilized world seems to have done away with high mass murder/gun homicide rates but apparently popular opinion only concerns you in the context of this blog. Same thing with your phony appeal to data - just not other countries' data.

It's ok. Keep responding to FullMoon. Someone has to, right? His "questions" are quotes from years ago. He needs the attention and you're about at his intelligence level.; 2/25/18, 2:48 PM
bagoh20 said...: "The NRA that owns the Republican Party certainly seems to."

I was a member already, but let it expire. I just signed up for 5 more years today.

Keep it up lefties. You're doing a bang up job.; 2/25/18, 2:49 PM
walter said...: "The Toothless Revolutionary said..Repubes simply don't give a shit about kids - or any Americans..Repubes truly are the cockroaches of democracy. "

Toothless, aka shit flinging monkey boy is mighty angry today.; 2/25/18, 2:50 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: American conservatives want to carry out a genocide/democide directed at killing off the majority of humanity that lives at/on the coasts - including the coasts of North America.

9/10/17, 9:11 AM

I like this quote. It's actually recent, too.

Very pertinent within the context of their preference for making our schools armed concentration camps run by lunatics with weapons and allowing any kid going to a school any less "enlightened" to be sitting ducks to their weapons proliferation efforts.

Republicans are great weapons proliferators.; 2/25/18, 2:51 PM
wwww said...: "Israel has universal conscription. Everyone, with some exceptions, receives basic infantry training and after active duty remains on ready reserve status for several years."

That's right!

People can make excuses, or people can decide to stop or deter school shootings. I'm saying that they need this type of training to be effective. Mall cop training isn't going to cut it.

There are simple things that would greatly reduce these shootings. Raise age. Military training. Single point of entrance. Strengthen background checks. Close loopholes. Bullet proof glass. Class room doors that lock from inside.

Or, the USA could do nothing and you'll see more school shootings and more dead kids. It's pretty straightforward.

TANSTAAFL.; 2/25/18, 2:52 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: I was a member already, but let it expire. I just signed up for 5 more years today.

Keep it up lefties. You're doing a bang up job.

Not as much as the NRA. Those weapons proliferators are getting way more kids banged up.

For a coastal area, California sure does have a lot of gun nuts. Even the Republicans on the east coast are nowhere near as addicted to their guns or violence. Or road rage. You sunny soul-suckers really have them beat. Does matter where on the political spectrum you lie out in the land of fruits and nuts: You're going to be molesting kids, resorting to violence and wacking your gun. I guess you can take the West coast out of the wild west but you can't take the wild west out of the west coast.; 2/25/18, 2:54 PM
langford peel said...: "Again, delusion. No one's arguing for a total ban. No one. Straw man. Slippery slope"

You and your ilk are in favor of confiscating all guns. You are lying if you claim that is not so.

This is a repeat of the gay marriage debacle. The liberal progressive cabal enforced a social construct that had lost on the ballot time and again. They said who could it hurt? Give us this gay marriage it is only fair. Then they progressed to destroying any business or individual that did not celebrate or participate. Tolerance was not enough. It is never enough for a liberal.

That is why if you give up any of your rights the liberal progressive hive will try to take the rest of the them until you are a slave. A slave to their liberal dogma and politically correct identity politics.

That is why you have Christian bakers having to bake cakes for homos and nuns being forced to provide abortions to their employees.

We have been through this many times before. We don't believe you when you say you do not want to confiscate all of the guns from law abiding Americans. We know that is your end game.

We won't get fooled again.; 2/25/18, 2:55 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Here's some cold water to throw on the gun nuts who see Israel as their new societal ideal.

Best quote came as a response to professional doofus Mike Huckabee from a former diplomat who even served under Sharon:

“We don’t worship guns, we don’t sell assault rifles to people, we don’t have a genius creation like the NRA, we don’t regard every bunch of guys a ‘well regulated militia’ and we’re pretty much done fighting the British."; 2/25/18, 2:56 PM
Drago said...: bagoh20: "I was a member already, but let it expire. I just signed up for 5 more years today"

I just signed up today as well.

Because that would make me part owner of the Republican Party!!

I need to break out my top hat and monocle.

Next up, adding an AR-15 to the mix. I think I'll just go down to walmart and get one in 5 minutes with no background check, cuz the lefties reported you can do that.

I've always wanted a weapon that fires 10 bullets a second, like a sub-machine gun, cuz the lefties reported an AR-15 can do that.

Plus, apparently it fires bullets at 2000 MPH!! Woot! Cuz the lefties reported an AR-15 can do that.

I love learning from the left...

The More You Know...."; 2/25/18, 2:57 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: Leftists: "We hate your fucking guts, wingnuts, and would like you all dead.

Now, hand over your guns."

Uh, no.; 2/25/18, 2:58 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: You and your ilk are in favor of confiscating all guns. You are lying if you claim that is not so.

Ilk. What a word. Is that like an elk?

Your long-winded straw man is like anti-AGW nonsense. So many little artifices to construct something elaborate with which to obscure the obvious, simple truth. Sunspots! Volcanoes! Tree food!

Yawn.; 2/25/18, 2:59 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Still boring, after all these years SAD!

Says the guy who reposted the same quote about five times today as his sole contribution to the thread.

Impressive.; 2/25/18, 2:59 PM
Drago said...: TTR: "Those weapons proliferators are getting way more kids banged up."

I must have missed it. Can you give me the directions to the nearest NRA Gun Store?

Thanks in advance.

I just love gun proliferators.

It's one of the many reasons to respect obama and his minions. They had the "courage" to give literally thousands of military type assault weapons to the Mexican gangs and drug cartels, at least one of which was used to kill an American Agent.

Because obama is a "light-bringer".....; 2/25/18, 3:00 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Nice victimhood fantasy, sexiled.

You'll have to try really hard to compete for sympathy with all those maimed and massacred kids. But I'm sure you're up to the task. Remember, your gun love is more important than their lives. Never forget that. It's sacred.

The kids are not.; 2/25/18, 3:03 PM
Drago said...: I forgot to add that obama and his minions made sure the weapons provided to the mexican drug cartels was untraceable and obama and crew "forgot" to inform the Mexican authorities the program was being run.

Probably because the Mexican govt might have looked askance at the US Govt sending in thousands more military style assault weapons into some of the Mexican's hottest cartel zones.

Which means they might have opposed obama's gun proliferation program.

And you know what that means....

Yep. The Mexican govt is racist.

Obviously.; 2/25/18, 3:03 PM
Drago said...: TTR: " But I'm sure you're up to the task"

I must look like a Broward County Sheriff or something.; 2/25/18, 3:03 PM
Quaestor said...: The Second Amendment is meant to facilitate, in the modern context, that terrorism and that guerilla war.

Scholars of the 2nd Amendment generally agree that armed resistance against the Federal government would emanate from the States rather than disparate groups. When Washington ordered suppression of the Whiskey Rebellion he was on pretty firm Constitutional grounds since the rebels had no backing from their state government. Had the Pennsylvania State House voted to support the rebellion, Washington would likely have never tried to suppress the tax protestors by force. In 1860 the Confederate States had the best part of the argument with the Union, and it wasn't until 12 April 1861, almost four months after secession that Lincoln had any defensible casus belli against South Carolina.; 2/25/18, 3:04 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: I must have missed it. Can you give me the directions to the nearest NRA Gun Store?

The NRA is the domestic weapons industry's lifeblood. It's its lawyer. Its congressman. Its chief benefactor. All wrapped up in one.

The NRA is the George Soros of the domestic weapons industry.; 2/25/18, 3:05 PM
Big Mike said...: Because obama is a "light-bringer".

He followed in the footsteps of the original lightbringer, who was Lucifer, the Fallen Angel.; 2/25/18, 3:05 PM
exiledonmainstreet, green-eyed devil said...: Drago said...

bagoh20: "I was a member already, but let it expire. I just signed up for 5 more years today"

I just signed up today as well."

As did I a few days ago. I wanted to take advantage of their special offer, "Join now and we'll send you not one, but 2 machine guns for $19.99 plus free shipping. But hold on! There's more! Call in the next 20 minutes and we'll throw in a bazooka! Act now, don't wait!"; 2/25/18, 3:06 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: The British are coming!

Americans have a hard time getting over things. And that's coming from an Israeli.; 2/25/18, 3:07 PM
Drago said...: In TTR's and the dem Broward County Sheriff's defense, the Sheriff's only received 45 separate reports on the accused killer as well as one call where the killer himself contacted the police about his guardians taking away his weapons!

On top of that, multiple reports to the FBI were made.

Then, the "amazing leadership" of Sheriff Israel (TTR's newest Model of Personal Leadership and Courage) led to his own deputy bravely guarding the outside wall while kids were being gunned down.

And the most interesting part, the very "lefty-courage example" deputy who was cowering in fright outside the building was the very same individual who refused to share a report from 2016 on this crazy kid with local social services.

So, based on all that, I guess I should just turn myself in.; 2/25/18, 3:07 PM
Drago said...: TTR: "The NRA is the domestic weapons industry's lifeblood."

LOL; 2/25/18, 3:08 PM
Jason said...: Let's take a closer look at what happens in "other countries."

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/04/22/world/muslim-defenders-disarmed-un-says.html

SARAJEVO, Bosnia and Herzegovi na, April 21— After hours of tension that threatened new bloodshed, United Nations officers said late today that they had met a deadline for disarming the defenders of Srebrenica, the battered enclave that is one of the last Muslim footholds in eastern Bosnia.

If the announcement proves correct, Srebrenica will have to depend for its safety on a 145-man United Nations contingent from Canada, a prospect that is causing severe anxiety. The Canadians, who have only machine-guns, assault rifles and sidearms, would be the only buffer between the tens of thousands of civilians and an aggressive force of several thousand Serbian nationalists with tanks and heavy artillery. A Grim Prospect

A cease-fire signed early Sunday by the town's Government defenders and its Serbian attackers required the United Nations to disarm the Muslim forces within 72 hours. This was later extended by six hours.

Just two years later:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre

So, yeah, we don't give a fuck how they do things in other countries.; 2/25/18, 3:09 PM
FullMoon said...: Haha!

Paul said...

Well here comes shitmo and the degradation of the thread. Time to close the window. I'd recommend that the other good faith commenters do the same and leave him to jerk off by himself. Never try to argue with and idiot. He'll drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.
11/1/12, 7:50 PM; 2/25/18, 3:09 PM
Lyle Smith said...: Venezuela is way worse than Colombia... and it is left wing. Democrats will turn America into Venezuela, if left free do as they want.

Colombia's conservatism and their success against Narco/Left-Wing terror is a credit to them.; 2/25/18, 3:10 PM
Drago said...: You know, from fake "hate speech" rules and attacks on the NRA and applauding the spying on domestic political opponents, we are going to have a hard time identifying which Bill of Rights items the left approves of....

.....Joke!!

The left disapproves of the entire constitution!! After all, it's, like, over a hundred years old or something!; 2/25/18, 3:10 PM
Known Unknown said...: "My point was to question the idea that spontaneous individual heroism, which does indeed save lives, can be converted into a nation-wide defense policy for schools without serious downsides"

You'd be surprised at how good people can be when you expect it of them.; 2/25/18, 3:12 PM
Drago said...: I'm just waiting for TTR's first Citizen Arrest of an NRA member.

It should make for some interesting video footage.; 2/25/18, 3:12 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Paul said?

You hear that Paul!? Where da fuck are ya! It's not 2012 any more and we need you to come back and vouch for your 6-year old quote because FullMooned is running out of recycled ammunition! He needs help! Can't take all this incoming fire! Oh no!; 2/25/18, 3:13 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: How's your "well-regulated militia" holding up, Drago?

I wouldn't entrust most of these goons to a driver's license.; 2/25/18, 3:14 PM
Drago said...: You know, it's probably unfair to say the Broward County Sheriff's office was incompetent in this matter.

After all, they only received 45 separate calls/reports on this lunatic.

It's not like they received 46 or 47 or anything.

Because if they had received 46 or 47, well. Things would have been handled quite differently, I assure you!

Now just give up your constitutional rights to the lefties who say they only want whats best for you horrible deplorables who ought to be imprisoned and/or killed.

Hurry up now....; 2/25/18, 3:15 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Once again, the kids are getting in the way of the guns.

Kids, move over! Guns have the right of way!

Bullets are our ballot. We're like Hamas that way.

This will be our new flag.

Great graphics, huh fellow gun nuts?; 2/25/18, 3:16 PM
Drago said...: TTR: "How's your "well-regulated militia" holding up, Drago?"

I don't know anyone in a self-described militia.

I would suppose they must be doing alright because the lefties say they are able to threaten the entire nation 24/7, so they must have some massive numbers.; 2/25/18, 3:16 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: Graphical inspiration for the NRA and its members and supporters.; 2/25/18, 3:17 PM
Drago said...: TTR: "Bullets are our ballot. We're like Hamas that way."

I would like to nominate TTR as the new Co-Chair of the Democrat Party Strategic Messaging Committee, along with ARM.; 2/25/18, 3:17 PM
FullMoon said...: Frightened alarmist surfaces,. hahaha! GLOBAL WARMING
"Your long-winded straw man is like anti-AGW nonsense."; 2/25/18, 3:18 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: I would suppose they must be doing alright because the lefties say they are able to threaten the entire nation 24/7...

Mostly the kids, though. You love it when their economic lifeblood shoot up a school's worth of kids to massacre, don't you?

Makes you feel more free. Don't you feel free when that happens?; 2/25/18, 3:18 PM
Drago said...: TTR: "I wouldn't entrust most of these goons to a driver's license."

If they joined MS-13, not only would you give them driver's licenses and a full scholarship, you would hand the guns to them at the voting booth!; 2/25/18, 3:18 PM
Drago said...: TTR: "Mostly the kids, though"

Interesting.

Do you have any numbers of kids murdered by NRA members?

Do you have any numbers of kids murdered by illegal aliens?

Take your time....; 2/25/18, 3:19 PM
Quaestor said...: I wouldn't entrust most of these goons to a driver's license.

The rotgut is getting to him.; 2/25/18, 3:19 PM
Bleach Drinkers Curing Coronavirus Together said...: So how are the NRA and Hamas different, Drago?

They both solely define their entire political existence through the lens of armed struggle, do they not?; 2/25/18, 3:20 PM
Drago said...: Look, the only reason this kid shot up the place is because of Global Warming.

(why shouldn't he be able to make use of the same excuse lefties give to islamic terrorists?); 2/25/18, 3:20 PM