Althouse: "You can't legislate against human stupidity... This is a tragedy but it was avoidable... "

May 30, 2016

"You can't legislate against human stupidity... This is a tragedy but it was avoidable... "

"You can only get there by ferry, and there are signs there saying watch out for the bloody crocodiles. If you go in swimming at 10 o'clock at night, you're going to get consumed.... Let's not start vendettas [against crocodiles]. People have to have some level of responsibility for their own actions."

Said an Australian member of Parliament about a woman who was killed by a crocodile.

56 comments:

Michael K said...: It sounds like the hysteria about the gorilla and the child in Cincinnati. The parents were not responsible.

There is another child and gorilla story, though. In 1996, a female gorilla carried a child to safety in the Brookfield Zoo after it fell into the enclosure.

It may be that the male gorilla is more aggressive or less willing to take care of a child in danger.; 5/30/16, 2:40 PM
Owen said...: More and more of us spend less and less time confronting Nature as it is. Our competence degrades in a nonlinear way, as we forget (or never learn) how to protect ourselves and negotiate safe outcomes, and as we fill our brains with memes based on Bambi and the Lion King.

Not much to be done about it, I think, but I give the honorable MP credit for trying to defend common sense.; 5/30/16, 2:54 PM
buwaya said...: I can understand the crocodiles point of view of course.
And the crocs are the main draw of the place.; 5/30/16, 2:56 PM
Tyrone Slothrop said...: Lenny Leonard pegs it; 5/30/16, 2:59 PM
Constitutional Insurgent said...: Amazing that an Australian can grasp the idea of personal accountability; in this country, we'd have a slew of new regulations, warning stickers and the closure of the the beach, in about 24 hours.; 5/30/16, 3:03 PM
fivewheels said...: What reprehensible victim-blaming! How dare this neanderthal tell women what they can do, where they can do it and when! How about teaching those filthy animals to stop attacking women, huh? Did you think of that, you misogynist?

Wait, am I in the right thread? Eh, one size fits all.; 5/30/16, 3:05 PM
Anonymous said...: The one truly guilty is the 47 y/o local woman who was with the dead visitor; 5/30/16, 3:08 PM
MB said...: "Blaming the victim" is one of those PC mortal sins. She may be the victim, but what about common sense? If the river was a bar and the croc had raped her, and one pointed out that she was stupid for going in, all hell would break loose about what an awful person one is for even thinking, let alone saying it.; 5/30/16, 3:16 PM
JAORE said...: Another victim of the crockiarchy.

Will it never end?; 5/30/16, 3:19 PM
Michael K said...: A few years ago am Australian tourist boat operator was prosecuted for taking two women for a swim in croc infested waters.

It was even in the same area.; 5/30/16, 3:41 PM
n.n said...: A natural abortion provided by one of Nature's planners. However, it was her choice.; 5/30/16, 4:05 PM
Gahrie said...: People have to have some level of responsibility for their own actions.

Says who?; 5/30/16, 4:16 PM
gspencer said...: Given this woman's inability to exercise good judgment and common sense, I'd say she was pretty lucky to have made it to her mid-40s.

Then her luck ran out.

Though I live in the Northeast, and have never been to Australia, I know about salties and their extremely disagreeable attitudes.; 5/30/16, 4:21 PM
PuertoRicoSpaceport.com said...: Jean Paget needs to restart her shoe factory. Making shoes out of crocodile skin for export to England.

(Is that reference obscure enough for everyone here?)

Seriously, did everybody notice the last sentence?

"Crocodile numbers have increased since the introduction of protection laws in 1971, with estimates putting the Northern Territory's population in the wild at about 100,000."

Maybe there is a connection?

John Henry; 5/30/16, 4:25 PM
Earnest Prole said...: Nature works its darwinian magic; 5/30/16, 4:26 PM
Anonymous said...: This goes back to the idea that when traveling to unfamiliar areas, it is smart to learn about the area to which one is going, particularly any dangers that might not be familiar to tourists. This goes double if it is going to involve coming into contact with wild nature outside of a controlled setting like a zoo.

Contrary to any feelings we may have, animals are NOT moral entities and should not be expected to treat people as anything other than another piece of meat in the wild.; 5/30/16, 4:27 PM
MadisonMan said...: Was she vegan?; 5/30/16, 4:40 PM
Tommy Duncan said...: Amazing that an Australian can grasp the idea of personal accountability; in this country, we'd have a slew of new regulations, warning stickers and the closure of the the beach, in about 24 hours.

And then the law suits would be filed.; 5/30/16, 4:44 PM
I'm Full of Soup said...: The victim's alleged stupidity aside, why do we not rid our environments of deadly predators like crocs and alligators and sharks?; 5/30/16, 4:52 PM
lgv said...: "The victim's alleged stupidity aside, why do we not rid our environments of deadly predators like crocs and alligators and sharks? "

Seriously?

We already have decimated the shark population as we kill as many as a million sharks a year for fins and as by-catch. They may be predators, but humans aren't their primary prey. Eliminating a species typically has some unintended consequences that are worse than losing a few humans per year. Second, their is a cost of eliminating these animals. Why bother? Cheaper to post signs.; 5/30/16, 5:00 PM
Otto said...: Low IQ is the big elephant in the room of victimization and income inequality. Not so before we entered into the age of meritocracy.; 5/30/16, 5:05 PM
Big Mike said...: @Michael K, regarding the gorilla, the video I saw -- and today there is confirmation -- the gorilla was protecting the kid. They killed him anyway.

Regarding Australia, I can't get over how many creatures down there kill humans for fun or food. Salt water crocodiles. Cone shells. The only known species of venomous octopus in the world. The Box Jellyfish. Several of the most venomous species of snakes in the world, including the Inland Taipan, current holder of the world record for most toxic venom in a land snake, and the Brown Snake, which is ranked #2. The Sydney funnel web spider. The Redback spider, which is Australia's version of the Black Widow with the added attraction of tending to lurk under toilet seats. Great white sharks. Bull sharks.

Just stay home.; 5/30/16, 5:06 PM
PuertoRicoSpaceport.com said...: Big Mike,

One comment I read years ago was that if going to Australia, never get in any body of water bigger than a bathtub. Check that carefully before entering.

John Henry; 5/30/16, 5:11 PM
bagoh20 said...: "the gorilla was protecting the kid."

Being that he was not a carnivore and a closely related primate, the odds were overwhelmingly in favor of him protecting rather than harming the child. Not sure the average human is as safe a bet. I would have opted for having a sniper keep a bead on his melon while they attempted less aggressive methods, like baiting, and distracting, but I'm not as fond of children as the average silverback.; 5/30/16, 5:20 PM
Owen said...: For insight into how (not) to get run over by Nature, try the excellent "Deep Survival: Who Lives, Who Dies, And Why," by Laurence Gonzales.; 5/30/16, 5:23 PM
Quaestor said...: The devoured woman, Cindy Waldron, was from New South Wales, which in Oz is the equivalent of being a Nooyawkah in this country, i.e. an arrogant urban "sophisticate" who considers all others to be mere yokels — like the idiots we discussed recently who "rescued" a bison calf and wound up causing its destruction. So ignoring the signs and the councils of common sense is only to be expected.

What I find inexplicable is the fact that she was accompanied by an unnamed friend who is a resident of the Daintree River area and could not have not known better than to venture onto the beach at night, let alone into the the surf. Big crocs are very tolerant of seawater and routinely haunt the shallows off Thornton Beach. At night they have been seen hauled out on the sand where they lie in wait for morning shore birds. You'd have to be really, really stupid to walk that beach after sunset without at least a powerful light. Wading in the water? Unthinkable. Thornton Beach is also posted for sharks! Jesus H. Christ, with a friend like that who needs enemies?; 5/30/16, 5:36 PM
The Cracker Emcee Refulgent said...: "Low IQ is the big elephant in the room of victimization and income inequality. Not so before we entered into the age of meritocracy."

For the most part, the stupid people I've come across chug along quite nicely, if not spectacularly, in this world. It's the odd and the hysterical who inevitably end up being someone else's burden.; 5/30/16, 5:52 PM
Lydia said...: Both women are from New Zealand. Maybe why the Aussie member of parliament was so quick to use the word "stupidity". Aussies and Kiwis don't exactly love each other.; 5/30/16, 6:06 PM
Clyde said...: It's the same reason you don't go swimming in lakes in Florida after dark, only it's mostly alligators rather than crocodiles here. If you must swim after dark, stay in the pool.; 5/30/16, 6:25 PM
Laslo Spatula said...: The Cracker Emcee said...
"For the most part, the stupid people I've come across chug along quite nicely, if not spectacularly, in this world. It's the odd and the hysterical who inevitably end up being someone else's burden."

Best smile I've had all day.

"The Odd and the Hysterical" is perfectly between 50's Soap Opera and Tolstoy.

I am Laslo.; 5/30/16, 6:29 PM
traditionalguy said...: War on Women Australian style. Is his last name Trump?; 5/30/16, 7:09 PM
Static Ping said...: John Henry: "Crocodile numbers have increased since the introduction of protection laws in 1971, with estimates putting the Northern Territory's population in the wild at about 100,000."

Maybe there is a connection?

Well, yeah. This is not a bad thing. The Northern Territory has a population of 243 thousand people and a population density less than Alaska by a good margin. This is pretty much the middle of nowhere. It's like complaining about too many gators in the Everglades.; 5/30/16, 7:22 PM
JPS said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 5/30/16, 7:25 PM
JPS said...: Big Mike, 5:06 -

Bill Bryson put it well in "In a Sunburned Country":

"This I learned by perusing a fat volume titled, if memory serves, 'Things That Will Kill You Horridly in Australia - Volume 19."; 5/30/16, 7:30 PM
Char Char Binks, Esq. said...: A few Kiwis are salty.; 5/30/16, 7:41 PM
JCCamp said...: @ Clyde -

Nile crocodiles recently have turned up in South Florida, presumably turned loose by reptile collectors when they got too big. Nile crocs are notorious man-eaters and would probably thrive in the Everglades, much like the python has.

http://www.newsweek.com/nile-crocodile-florida-study-463598

Joy.; 5/30/16, 7:41 PM
I'm Full of Soup said...: IGV:

You may have noticed, in America, money is no object, to the govt, when they have a govt program to fund.

So yes, I'd support the eradication of alligators to take back the lakes for safer recreation. And think of all the alligator hunter jobs we'd create.; 5/30/16, 7:44 PM
JCCamp said...: Although this happened a few months back...a burglar running from the cops jumped in a brackish lake at dusk and hid. The resident alligators ate him during the night, because, as Clyde says, you don't swim with the gators after dark.

But, in this case, a storybook ending.

http://wtvr.com/2015/12/08/alleged-florida-burglar-eaten-by-alligator-while-hiding-from-police/; 5/30/16, 7:44 PM
Unknown said...: "Although this happened a few months back...a burglar running from the cops jumped in a brackish lake at dusk and hid. The resident alligators ate him during the night, because, as Clyde says, you don't swim with the gators after dark."

It's an established fact that alligators don't prey on humans. Maybe some of them (the'gators) haven't been informed.; 5/30/16, 8:11 PM
Oso Negro said...: #gorillalivesmatter

CNN today reported the gorilla was "disoriented" and "acting irrationally". The author of the book on gorilla etiquette when unexpected guests drop in was unavailable for comment.; 5/30/16, 8:20 PM
JCCamp said...: "It's an established fact that alligators don't prey on humans.Maybe some of them (the'gators) haven't been informed."

While alligators don't normally prey on humans, anyone who doesn't treat them with some respect, especially the larger specimen, is foolish. An alligator will eat whatever will fit in the rather capacious maw, and males during season are very aggressive.

Alligator hunters every season come back with chewed up boats, gnawed on outboards, etc, that will attest to the irritability of the species when pressured. When they describe the salt water croc or the Nile croc as more aggressive, I'm impressed. To think a woman went swimming in the dark with an aggressive, known man-eating version of a giant lizard with teeth beggars conceit. I wonder if this was a kind of "I climbed Everest, swam with sharks" kind of thing or she was just oblivious.; 5/30/16, 8:46 PM
Paul Snively said...: Think of this as just a friendly reminder that there are, in fact, levels of ignorance that are fatal. Plan accordingly.; 5/30/16, 9:15 PM
Owen said...: JCCamp: "...To think a woman went swimming in the dark with an aggressive, known man-eating version of a giant lizard with teeth beggars conceit. I wonder if this was a kind of "I climbed Everest, swam with sharks" kind of thing or she was just oblivious."

Was alcohol involved?

Look for the drunken croc!; 5/30/16, 9:46 PM
Lem Vibe Bandit said...: What could possibly go wrong?

Link; 5/30/16, 11:00 PM
Petunia said...: John Henry, "A Town Like Alice" is one of my favorite books...love Nevil Shute. Also loved the mini-series with Bryan Brown.; 5/30/16, 11:54 PM
Morsie said...: Recently went on a night walk in a national park in Sarawak.We came across a green viper sitting on a bench.The guide described it as dangerous and with a venom that causes internal bleeding.The Aussies took a step back.A Dutch tourist leaned in to get a better pic before the guide pushed her backwards gently.
Really surprised any aussies would go swimming at such a beach unless lots of alcohol involved.; 5/31/16, 12:21 AM
J. Farmer said...: @Michael K:

"It sounds like the hysteria about the gorilla and the child in Cincinnati."

My two cents on FB about the Cincinnati Zoo incident:

"I am an animal rights supporter generally and am broadly ambivalent on the question of zoos writ large. But this is just absurd. Were the parents likely negligent in supervising their child? Sure. What parent of a toddler hasn't? But what does that have to do with anything? The zoo's response was thoughtful and measured. The child had been in the enclosure for 10 minutes before the shot was fired. The closest alternative was tranquilizer, but they tend to agitate animals initially and take an extended period of time to take effect. An animal that size can inflict deadly injuries on a small child even unintentionally. Mourning the loss of an endangered animal, especially a close relative like the gorilla, is a perfectly legitimate reaction. But I wonder how many of those mourners would be willing to sacrifice the life of their child or loved one to save a gorilla."; 5/31/16, 1:34 AM
Guildofcannonballs said...: You can, and it has been done repeatedly, and will continue to be done so foreseeably, argue for laws allowing your crony money THEIR damn money.

Doesn't matter the words as only to the extent the People get paid are laws now written.

And baked in that cake is payment with absolute certainty.; 5/31/16, 3:04 AM
Rusty said...: Stupid people die in stupid ways.; 5/31/16, 6:02 AM
Rick said...: I'm not seeing the reaction pushing for croc control, most people seem to accept that tragedies happen if you're not aware. On the other hand the gorilla story is about to turn great. Of course the outraged enviros are simply assuming everything would have worked out fine had they not shot the gorilla. This is the MO for all radical political analysis. But it turns out the kid is black so we're about to see this ratchet up into charges of racism for being so cavalier with the life of a black child.

I don't think most even knew the kid's race when expressing their outrage but of course that won't matter. It'll be fun watching shocked and self righteous left wingers react to being called racist. They're too indoctrinated to learn from the experience but the show will be excellent. Get the salt ready.; 5/31/16, 7:44 AM
Larry J said...: A friend of mine had a bumper sticker that read, "Stupidity should be painful." In this case, it was. One can only hope that the pain didn't last too long.; 5/31/16, 7:55 AM
Roughcoat said...: Jack Hannah said that the gorilla would have killed the child and that killing the animal was the right thing to do:

http://womanista.com/2016/05/30/famed-animal-expert-jack-hanna-says-gorilla-would-have-killed-bo/; 5/31/16, 8:33 AM
Roughcoat said...: Re the rivalry between Aussies & Kiwis:

My wife and I honeymooned in Fiji (a long time ago!). Not many Americans, just us and a few others, most of the other travelers were Aussies and Kiwis. It was wonderfully entertaining watching and listening to the Aussies and Kiwis go at each other. They were relentless with their slagging, it went on 24/7. Nobody paid attention to the Americans, which was just fine with us. For once we weren't the object of scorn or anger or anything else. It was all between the Aussies and the Kiwis, all the time. They were relentless. It was all very funny, hilarious even. If I were asked to score the confrontations, I'd say the Aussies generally had the best of it. They could be brutal and they had no restraint, no filters. You don't what laughter is until you've heard a group of robust Aussie men laughing ("har har har har!") raucously after making some really cruel joke about a Kiwi (with the Kiwi butt of the joke standing there, haplessly).; 5/31/16, 8:49 AM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: why do we not rid our environments of deadly predators like crocs and alligators and sharks?

Because predators serve a purpose in nature, eliminating other animals and maintaining a balance. In addition, unless you go where there are crocs, alligators and sharks, you are in zero danger of attack. Unlike in Saturday Night Live, there is no such thing as a land shark. Don't go swimming where there are sharks or crocodiles. Duh!

We have predators here in our area and generally, they stay away. When they do get near, we discourage them with trapping and releasing in a more remote area. The fish and game guys to this all the time with mountain lions. We personally shoot with a pellet gun that stings but doesn't kill and keep our animals safe at night inside or in sturdy barns and hen houses.

Now.....mosquitoes and ground squirrels, on the other hand. They can all die!!!; 5/31/16, 9:42 AM
Char Char Binks, Esq. said...: Rick said...

"But it turns out the kid is black so we're about to see this ratchet up into charges of racism for being so cavalier with the life of a black child."

I saw headlines that said the gorilla was shot because of the kid's white privilege. Oh well, the always spin again till they get the answer they're looking for.; 5/31/16, 6:06 PM
JCCamp said...: Just because we've been on the subject, a really large alligator wandering a golf course near Sarasota, FL. This from the weekend. This is supposedly about 14 or 15 feet long, which is probably big enough to eat a cow.

http://www.wptv.com/news/national/goliath-gator-spotted-at-palmetto-golf-course; 5/31/16, 6:47 PM