Said Hillary Clinton, in her Super Tuesday victory speech, clearly aimed at Donald Trump, answering his "Make America great again." America is always already great. Nothing to do there. The problem is that everyone isn't equally included in the greatness. We need to stitch us all together and fill in the hollowed-out gaps. It's a concise summary of the difference between the progressive enterprise and capitalism.
Trump has pushed back:
Hillary cannot make America great. She was talking about something yesterday, making America whole, whole. No, no, I don’t want whole. I want great again. I think I’ll use that as a commercial. We’ll make a split screen. She’ll be saying "we’re going to make America whole," whatever that means — I don’t think she knows what it means. We’re going to make America whole, and I’ll be saying, "we’re going to make America great again."What does "whole" even mean? He just says he doesn't know, perhaps nudging us to think it's jibberish, flim-flam, con artistry, but perhaps nudging lewd/sexist minds to hear "hole." But "whole" — I think, to be accurate — envisions the people as a single body, an ailing body, needing healing and restoration to full health, wholeness.
The idea that the people form a single body has phenomenal historic resonance. I'm picturing "Leviathan":
Think of the "body politic" — all the people in a particular country considered as a single group."
The analogy is typically continued by reference to the top of government as the head of state, but may be extended to other anatomical parts, as in political readings of the Aesop's fable, "The Belly and the Members."... The metaphor developed in Renaissance times, as the medical knowledge based upon the classical work of Galen was being challenged by new thinkers such as William Harvey. Analogies were made between the supposed causes of disease and disorder and their equivalents in the political field which were considered to be plagues or infections which might be remedied by purges and nostrums....And Jean Jacques-Rousseau wrote of "General Will":
As long as several men assembled together consider themselves as a single body, they have only one will which is directed towards their common preservation and general well-being. Then, all the animating forces of the state are vigorous and simple, and its principles are clear and luminous; it has no incompatible or conflicting interests; the common good makes itself so manifestly evident that only common sense is needed to discern it. Peace, unity and equality are the enemies of political sophistication. Upright and simple men are difficult to deceive precisely because of their simplicity; stratagems and clever arguments do not prevail upon them, they are not indeed subtle enough to be dupes....
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173 comments:
when i think of hole i think of place to put my cock.
The Black Lives Matter and Social Justice brigades on the left are just the people to bring back kindness and wholeness and love.
Great coalition you've got there, Hillary.
Maybe a part of America has broken off. So, that part has to be put back, to make America whole again.
No, I didn't hear whole as hole in any sexual way?? I heard whole as hole, as in a void that we will fall into.
Titus said...
"when i think of hole i think of place to put my cock."
So does Hillary.
If someone had written a movie about a campaign like this--two blowhards arguing about whether to make this country "great" or "whole" and really getting into the weeds on it--we'd have laughed it off as too outlandish. No one would have believed it.
Whole means Nothing Missing. What's missing is the sold off of American industrial base transfer that was planned and executed by the Bush and Clinton Administrations in exchange for Cash. The story was that We Americans needed retraining in High Tech and University jobs where we excelled, but all we got was Military Combat Training for protection of the Saudi oil fields.
That was a lie they quit telling when the Racial Black President Charade arrived and took center stage. That lie is also being called out now. The unemployment rate is 30 % and everybody knows it. Sanders is taking advantage of that truth.
The Jobs are not going to be replaced unless Trump is elected and Speaker Ryan quits pretending he is noble.
Hillary sublimates the Feminine Mystique.
Of course, in an entirely holistic way.
I no longer think it's possible to make America 1) whole 2) great again.
After 2008, manufacturing left the USA and will never return. As goes manufacturing, so goes the proletariat (1) and then the bourgeois (2) about 10 years later. All that is left is the peasants and the landowners (government and their proxies).
If I was 20, and wanting a good life, I'd be heading for someplace in China where the middle class is growing.
Therapeutic vs. inspirational.
Appeal to the passive, promising to make the slough they're in comfortable and equal, vs. appeal to the active, demoralized and frustrated by forced inactivity, who want out of the slough.
I think, to be accurate — envisions the people as a single body, an ailing body, needing healing and restoration to full health, wholeness.
Ha! Surprised she is so open with her corporatism! Mussolini could easily have spoken those words.
Are they really going with the "love and kindness" routine for Hillary? Has there ever been a bigger mismatch between theme and and the person.
The only thing I kinda respect about Hillary us she's a tough old bitch.
The problem is that she supports Obama. He had 8 years to make us whole and according to Hillary we are less whole than 8 years ago. And you add her six years in the Senate and on the walmart board. Did she fight for higher salaries? How did she vote on the board on other employer/employee disputes?
Instead of building walls we’re going to break down barriers
Maybe she intends to break down the barriers that we have built along the US-Mexico border. That way, the foreigners do not have to go around the barriers. They will be able to simply walk across at any point of the border.
"If I was 20, and wanting a good life, I'd be heading for someplace in China where the middle class is growing."
Don't worry. China will come to you.
Hillary means "hola."
So will she order the helicopters to play "The Battle Hymn of the Republic" as she orders them to overthrow another stable government in the middle east? I am just curious!
When's Hillary's press conference?
We have to fill in what’s been hollowed out.
Empty platitudes designed to foster everyone's belief he's for whatever policy they think will improve America. I wonder where he got the idea he could ride this nonsense to the Presidency?
While Hillary has always turned my stomach, that harpy daring to speak of "love and kindness" is really, really sickening. She doesn't know the meaning of the words.
coupe said...
I no longer think it's possible to make America 1) whole 2) great again.
Agree.
Her first words here are a lie. America was great. Now we are the most bankrupt country that ever existed, with vast divisions among "diverse" groups which cannot be reconciled.
She is already going "Ming the Merciless" in her dress, she should just own it and go with it.
The spelling with wh-, introduced in the 15th century, was for disambiguation with hole.
film at 11...
A grifter will restore "the bonds of trust and respect across our country"? WTF!
It's an appeal for the health of the nation vs. the psychosis of a nation following the most prominent of the insane.
"when i think of hole i think of place to put my cock."
Hillary!'s entire campaign proposition seems to have amounted to, "I am distaff, therefore elect me!", so to the extent voters hear "hole" in her statement, she's the one who's made it an issue.
Plus, there's no end to the ironic humor in Hillary and Bernie both braying wildly about how crappy things are now, and how much "change!" is needed, after two terms of their party in the WH, a quarter of which was with a sympatico supermajority in the Congress.
Trump was quick (and wise) to make that point yesterday evening. Hillary!'s not getting away with the "candidate of change" schtick after spending the past several years actually *in* the Obama cabinet. Look for him to call her out on that quickly and harshly (as he did with the War on Women bs earlier), and her campaign's likely retreat to another angle. If she runs against Trump and wins, at least he will have made her earn the victory by forcing her to substantively set forth something other than "I have a vagina!", "Hope and Change!", "Trump is evil and dumb!" to sell.
If all she's got left ends up being going negative against Trump, expect thermonuclear levels of negative campaigning that leave her essentially unable to govern for her single term which will likely be spent in an economic downturn.
Don Henley say, "How bad do you want it?"
Whole?
It's just her version of Ein Reich, Ein Volk, Ein Fuerher.
I'm sure they focus-tested "Whole" to death.
I think Trump means "Let's make America grate again." He's being mistranscribed.
coupe: I no longer think it's possible to make America 1) whole 2) great again.
Plan for glorious USA future:
1. Push Humpty off the wall.
2. Stomp all over the pieces.
3. Put Humpty back together again.
Henry @8:46 AM:
Good one.
"We need to make America whole."
Hole was a band with Courtney Love.
Courtney Love was married to Kurt Cobain.
Kurt Cobain put a hole in his head.
Hillary Clinton is Courtney Love.
I am Laslo.
We still manufacture a lot of stuff in the USofA. Lot of manufacturing done now is automated. We would have more manufacturing in this country, if politicians would stop telling the country that the manufacturers are not paying their fair share, and need to be taxed greater. Nothing prompts business to flee this country than hearing about the government wanting to take more of their profit. We could be greater if we had someone in the White House who understands that. Someone like a businessman, not someone from a life in government.
Make us whole again is another way to say she is a uniter.
Hillary is the new Nixon.
The basis of English political traditions is a compromise between an absolute Monarch and the Oligarchy of simple minded Lords that controls Parliament and with it the Prime Minister's government.
It was the basis of an Empire to end all Empires that killed and stole its way across the earth after disposing of Napoleon's France in 1815. The Industrial Revolution required a friendly government, and it got one.
But the British Empire is not working out anymore. Thank God. They have been our deadliest enemy always seeking to reacquire North America.
Hillary is simply blowing smoke.
I think both candidates would agree that there is a sickness in America.
Defining the nature of the sickness is the only way in which a cure can be acheived.
Hillary believes the ailment to be one of insufficient distribution of resources. A problem that only government can cure.
I'm finding it much more difficult to pin down what Trump thinks the problem/solution is. Perhaps it's an insufficient creation of resources.
We are going to make the Clinton bank account whole again.
It's just a phrase that came out of a focus group and that poll-tested well. Don't expect it to actually mean anything.
"...build ladders of opportunity and empowerment..."
Build?
It's cheaper to just buy the ladders from China.
I am Laslo.
"We need to make America whole."
Sounds like Hillary sees herself an attorney seeking damages.
Angelyne wrote: Therapeutic vs. inspirational.
I think that's a really brilliant summation, worthy of more elaboration.
Clinton fell into the same trap in her primary loss to Obama -- choosing the therapeutic and losing to the inspirational. Without going into details, I personally don't find Trump inspirational, but he at least offers himself as a totem for those seeking inspiration (as Obama did as well).
Whole means healthy. That's a common enough use of the term. And I think "hollowed out" will resonate too among the middle class, which is being hollowed out by the new economy. Still, ridiculing Hillary as someone who mindlessly spouts focus-grouped phrases without knowing or caring what they mean will also resonate.
For instance, the wall. The wall is not just a physical object, it is a symbol for the need to exercise control over who comes here. That is not just an economic question, but a national security question. Most people understand that we cannot help the middle or lower classes without controlling unemployment, which we cannot do without controlling immigration. Most people understand that we cannot fight terrorism at home without a realistic way of stopping the terrorists at the border.
" manufacturing left the USA and will never return."
I disagree but we have to stop the war on making things. The government has, with tax policy and regulations, made manufacturing very difficult and expensive. Have you noticed that the Japanese car makers built plants in southern states with "right to work" laws ?
A small example of everything takes longer.
I can find other examples with more time.
"Hole" actually might be spot on. Hillary and her Democrat Party want to make the hole in the pockets of the producers larger so that the takers, the core constituency of the Democrats (which includes all the usual welfare types PLUS all those government workers who get a paycheck for making the administrative state's wheels turn), can get even more from the producers.
The only time America was truly made Whole was the Civil War.
We might need another one of Those.
I am Laslo.
Hillary and her Left-wing ilk don't want to make America whole or great.
They believe America is flawed. Too many White men in corporate and Government power; too much capitalism, poor people are left out; too much Christianity, aetheists and Wiccans and Muslims are left out; too much heterosexual marriage, gays and single Moms are left out.
The problem with the Left is that they are utopians; they would do to America what they have done to health care; hone in on the flaws of an otherwise good workable system, and destroy it under the guise of correcting those flaws.
The leftist vision is Detroit economics with San Francisco cultural values.
And, of course, in the process to "make us whole", don't forget Hillary's quest to make millions and Bill's quest to get laid.
The Clintons are ugly, but seductive. We should not be fooled.
America never stopped being great? I would say that America stopped being great when we lost a war that was already won in Iraq, and when we took down a country for no good reason with no plan to transition it to democracy. I'd say that America stopped being great when it put an ambassador in harm's way with insufficient security and then left him to die, burned to death in the American embassy, with absolutely no consequences for the perpetrators.
Who was Secretary of State when all this happened?
There's Hillary's
Ein Reich ein Volk ein Führer.
On the other hand there's Martin Luther
Er ist auf Erden kommen arm,
Daß er unser sich erbarm,
Und in dem Himmel mache reich,
Und seinen lieben Engeln gleich.
more in the Trump camp. Reich as an adjective.
This post, and I mean this respectfully, is why Trump is succeeding.
The average person isn't reminded of Rousseau when he hears Hillary Clinton talking about making America whole again. What we unschooled folk think she's talking about is making America whole again by taking even more from "us" and giving it to "them", that's what that is, it's the whole inequality, everybody's got to have some of everything, it's got to be evened out and the way that's done, we take more from those of you who don't have the money or the power or influence to keep what you have and we give it to someone else. That's how Hillary's going to fill in the circle.
The hollowing out of the middle class was CAUSED by Leviathan State.
Incidentally Rousseau is the seducer who gave men permission to destroy everything we want to destroy because we feel like doing it. He was the first Marxist thinker, but he did it in French and was followed immediately in German by Nietzsche's will to power.
Hillary is still blowing smoke.
It was a transcription error.
What Hillary said was "to make America Hos".
"Hos" being the plural of "Ho."
As in we will all be pimped out by the Government.
Government loves you baby, but sometimes Government gets so mad...
I am Laslo.
If this is a campaign of Hillary Clinton versus Donald Trump, I am going to need a new hobby.
Fascism's theory of economic corporatism involved management of sectors of the economy by government or privately controlled organizations (corporations). Each trade union or employer corporation would, theoretically, represent its professional concerns, especially by negotiation of labour contracts and the like. This method, it was theorized, could result in harmony amongst social classes.[32] Authors have noted, however, that de facto economic corporatism was also used to reduce opposition and reward political loyalty. - Wikipedia
Wikipedia nails Hillary's philosophy in one try!
What is funny about Wikipedia is that they mix "corporatism" with "corporations" when really it is about the nation functioning as one body with its parts working together in utter dependence on the head, or the state.
We have to make strong the broken places, re-stitch the bonds of trust and respect across our country.... [W]hat we need in America today is more love and kindness..
Democrats are bipolar. Today it's heal and bring together. Tomorrow when the discussion turns to gun control or climate change policy or inequality or_____ lives matter they'll be ready to slash and burn anyone who gets in their way.
Then it's love and kindness Friday!
Ein mädchen oder weibchen.
What is missing is leadership that tells the truth. When the Trump Train rolls into UNION Station, we will be whole again because we will have gotten rid of the Clinton, Inc train over at Finland Station.
Whole means assimilated and integrated.
Whole means conserved value of capital and labor.
Whole means individual diversity, not class diversity.
Whole means equal rights, not "=".
Whole means a baby, not her head, arms, organs, or clump of cells.
Clinton cannot make America whole because she places her faith in emanations from a penumbra and discovers her religion in its darkest fringes.
With proper regulation, indoctrination, and supervision, America has nothing to fear from straight, white men. Look at how Bill Clnton has prospered under her tutelage. With Hillary's guidance all American men can reach that pinnacle.
I'm finding it much more difficult to pin down what Trump thinks the problem/solution is. Perhaps it's an insufficient creation of resources.
Back in the 60's (1966) Alan Greenspan wrote "Gold and Economic Freedom".
Still interesting today. Greenspan concludes:
"This is the shabby secret of the welfare statists' tirades against gold. Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights."
Some of the Clintons' dear friends and close associates left behind along Hillary!'s path to wealth and power could have used some of that tender, loving care.
The McDougals, Webb Hubble, Vince Foster, Mike Espy, the Rose Law Firm, etc., etc.
Holman Jenkins, writing for the Wall Street Journal Editorial Page, has a breathtakingly brilliant column on Trump supporters. Sorry, subscription is required:
http://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-voters-need-a-mirror-1456874770
In closing the column, Jenkins observes that "Make America Great Again" is a slogan that lacks an acting noun. Who is going to make America great again? Jenkins writes, "Apparently the Chinese and Mexicans can bestow concessions that will make us great again—or something. Until Mr. Trump and his fans show otherwise, he seems but the latest vessel of denial for voters who don’t want responsibility, they want mommy and daddy."
"To be honest and impolitic, the Trump voter smacks of a child who unleashes recriminations against mommy and daddy because the world is imperfect.
"The blaming of elites has gone too far. The American voter has a big hand in his own disappointments. His retirement system has been a conspicuous demographic Ponzi scheme for at least two generations, yet he keeps voting for unfunded benefits. The Obama administration complains in its latest economic report about declining state and local investment because all the money is going to the unfunded pension promises negotiated by public-sector employees (i.e., voters) without also negotiating the taxes to make good on them.
"Yet voters have welcomed being gulled with talk of lockboxes and trust funds while their payroll taxes are diverted to unrelated, voter-pleasing spending and the alleged trust funds are filled with IOUs by the government to itself."
Wholeness really does mean "Nothing Missing and Nothing Broken." And since all is accomplished we can then enter rest and say Shabbat Shalom at sundown Friday. Ben Carson would like that very much.Shalom translates as Peace, and Dr.Carson has great peace.
But that peace only follows a Friday when you have to work your ass off like The Donald does.
"Indeed, the Nazis actually did a pretty good job increasing economic growth and improving standards of living (they were, many think, the first Keynesians, adopting the strategy even before Keynes had come up with it), pushing Germany out of a depression and back into expansion. Unfortunately, they also set out to conquer Europe and exterminate the Jews. People shouldn’t do that.” - Ezra Klein.
No doubt a lot of these ideas were bandied about on whatever has replaced Journ-o-list these days, which is why Klein was thinking about economic fascism.
Imagine my surprise!! She spelled it with a 'w'.
But everybody remember, Hilter was a creature of the Right!
Hillary has to put Bernie on her ticket, right?
1) She has to shore up her base
2) Bernie is indictment and impeachment insurance for her
But of course the problem of putting Bernie on your ticket is that he is a socialist monster, every bit as scary as Donald Trump.
This could be a very scary, very partisan race indeed! With no moderates in sight.
Imagine Trump/Cruz vs. Hillary/Bernie
I am not a fan of those tickets, or those options. But we might be heading there. People anywhere in the middle-left or middle-right seem to be out of power in 2016. It might be the Socialist Duo vs. the National Front. "We will seize the banks" vs. "Islam will be illegal!"
Hillary won a bunch of red states that she would never carry in November and people are making a big deal about it! Kinda show how off the media is.
America can only be made whole by eliminating all dissent. The surest way to eliminate all dissent by eliminating all dissenters.
Republicans believe in individuals, Democrats believe in group identity
"[W]hat we need in America today is more love and kindness."
The government does not and cannot love you. It cannot be kind to anything.
To the government, like a business, you are a resource.
Hillary lost Colorado! wooo hooo!
"Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights."
Yes and that is why the left and the political class call it "archaic."
""To be honest and impolitic, the Trump voter smacks of a child who unleashes recriminations against mommy and daddy because the world is imperfect."
The WSJ, which I read mostly for the editorial page, is determined on open borders. Once you understand that, you can ignore what follows from that determination.
"Republicans believe in individuals, Democrats believe in group identity"
Bingo !
sunsong,
The only person most of my friends will admit to considering voting for, Democrat or Republican, is Bernie. I wish I could vote for him in the primary (I live in Vermont only part of the year, don't vote there) because I feel like you ought to vote for a person you can at least live with as president. I could live with Bernie just on the basis if basic human decency.
You're taking this to a whole 'nother level.
I've paid little attention to the Democrat race -- did Bernie over-perform yesterday or were those state wins expected? I know Rubio would have been thrilled to win half of Bernie's total yesterday! lol
Levi Starks said...
****
I'm finding it much more difficult to pin down what Trump thinks the problem/solution is. Perhaps it's an insufficient creation of resources.
A couple of things he talked about last night were: lower corporate taxes to entice corps and their money back to the US; renegotiating trade deals with other countries so that we are not always the suckers; the wall; related to the wall, stopping the influx of heroin into New Hampshire by building ... the wall; making Mexico pay for the wall; keeping "refugees" in the Middle East and making rich Middle East countries pay for their safekeeping.
Are these bad ideas?
How the hell did it get hollowed out, anyway?
I'm lookin' at you, Barack...and your adulation of your "son" Trayvon. I'm lookin' at you, Barack, picking at racial scabs that were healing, with the intent of re-opening and infecting those wounds. I'm lookin' at you, Barack, who is succeeding in creating a chasm between those who want to peaceably live the American dream, and those who want to burn it down, with fire, not with words. I'm lookin' at you, Barack, and all the cozying up to these destroyers that you have done, with the intent of breaking the foundations of this country. I'm afraid you might even succeed.
And I'm lookin' at you, Hillz, who opened a can but forgot the whupass in the Middle East, and now it's coming for Europe, and for us. I'm lookin' at you, Hillz, who actually, truly, went to bed when the 3 am phone call came. I'm lookin' at you, Hillz, and thinking about what we are in for if you win gives me nightmares.
I had a friend who asked me whether I could vote for Trump in the general election.
Imagine that I intensely dislike raspberry. Someone offers me a choice of a raspberry popsicle or a turd on a stick.
Not a hard choice for me.
Anglelyne wrote -
"Plan for glorious USA future:
1. Push Humpty off the wall.
2. Stomp all over the pieces.
3. Put Humpty back together again."
Future?!?
1. Describes Dems during Bush Administration.
2. Describes Obama Administration.
3. Blame Republicans for one and two, and claim three would have already been accomplished if not for Republican "obstructionism."
Trump was talking to the middle class during his press conference. He told them he has not forgotten them, and he will bring opportunity back to them. Hillary can only offer more warmed over redistribution of the country's fading wealth. Trump's policies will allow America to once again build wealth, and the middle class will share in the wealth. Americans are just asking for some opportunity.
"But "whole" — I think, to be accurate — envisions the people as a single body, an ailing body, needing healing and restoration to full health, wholeness."
I don't think people will see Hillary as someone who could do that or that she really wants to given her history, they will see it as just another self-serving lie.
Hillary is trying to coopt Trump's slogan. Shows how weak she and her campaign are. Trump's setting the terms and Hillary is trying to catch up. Trump is running against the last 25 years. Hillary doesn't know what she's doing. She can't run against Obama or her husband. Running against W is desperate. She has to run a stay the course things are improving and will get better campaign on the positive side. She's flailing. Trump has an optimistic slogan that also criticizes. Hillary's is wishy washy nonsense. She either needs to embrace Obama or run from him.
There's the theory of the firm, in economics.
Why do firms form, if the free market is so good at allocating stuff? Just subcontract everything out for bids.
Firms form because transaction costs eat up the gains from trade. So some things it makes sense to do in house, so that transaction costs don't eat you up.
On the flip side, the corporist state has the huge opposite problem. Failed endeavors don't fail, they just claim more and more of the economy. That in turn eats up stuff that would have succeeded otherwise.
That's how you wind up in poverty. There are no gains from trade. Everybody is self-sufficient, but at a very low level.
Michael K. Have to agree with you about the Journal. It's as if none of them bothered to read Peggy Noonan last week! Jenkins piece is pretty mushy for him. I am not sure that his heart was in it. He seems to be a pretty pragmatic guy. Bret Stephens went completely off the rails Tuesday. That was something I couldn't fathom because I would guess that Trump would be a lot more friendly to Israel than Obama has been and that is critical to Bret. I think the Journal editorial board has reached the anger phase of the grieving process. If they follow the classic progression it won't be too long before they are touting Trump.
"What's missing is the sold off of American industrial base transfer that was planned and executed by the Bush and Clinton Administrations in exchange for Cash."
None of that was "planned and executed" by Bush and Clinton, merely "facilitated." They did the bidding of the corporations, who wanted (and want) to move their operations anywhere in the world where they can pay the cheapest possible wages. Bush and Clinton helped remove impediments to the corporations from getting and doing just what they wanted. The latest atrocious treaty to further corporate aims, the TPP, looks like its on a fast-track to being passed, as well. Obama put it on the fast-track. He's as much a minion of the corporations as his past several predecessors.
Ann Althouse said...It's a concise summary of the difference between the progressive enterprise and capitalism.
That's not really accurate, Professor. It's true that Progressives value equality (of result) higher than economic growth/opportunity and capitalism values growth/economic opportunity higher than equality, but those are only two aspects of both systems and both contain far too much else to take those relative values alone as a "concise summary."
When Trump says he wants to make America great again a lot of people believe him and based on his private sector accomplishments he has proven that he has the ability to do it. People don't believe Hillary is going to make America whole again because they know it is just self-serving lie to get elected. Liberals don't want to make America whole, they divide by calling those who don't agree with them as racists.
Hitler wanted to make Germany whole again, also. Fill in the hollowed out places and stitch together the fabric of the country. Like digging out the cancer and stitching the incision back together, making the patient whole again.
"The problem is that (Hillary) supports Obama."
Hardly. She and Bill reportedly loathe Obama. However, in politics, one sucks up to and pretends agreement with and loyalty to those one hates and looks down on in service to ambition and the promise of one day capturing the big prize, the Oval Office. This is what Hillary is about, nothing else.
Trump's slogan "Make America Great Again" is perfect. Even at the sub par level we are currently functioning, America is pretty good, but everybody knows we are capable of greatness, if given a chance. Seeing Obama tell us America is still great, falls flat, no one believes him. Hearing Hillary say something as stilted as "Make America Whole", just makes Trump's slogan even more powerful. You want to be whole or Great?
The way Hillary makes America whole again is by shutting up her critics by calling them sexist and racist. She provides safe spaces on college campuses for SJWs. She imprisons college males who should not be believed because a female accused them of sexual assault.
I'm not interested in Hillary making America whole.
@Tank 9:33 No they are not bad ideas. I have been thinking that once Trump has everyones' attention he is going to start "moderating", or at least clarifying, his positions and people are going to begin to understand that he is not nuts. They are going to begin to understand intellectually what so many "undereducated" have grasped viscerally: Trump may actually be in their best interest.
So, the leader of the Party that has spent 50 years pushing Americans to identify themselves first and foremost as members of a racial ethnic group (African-Americans, Latinos, Indian-Americans, Muslim-Americans) wants to "make America whole again?"
Reminds me of the first law of Holes: when you're in a hole stop digging.
Did Hillary say she wanted to make us "ho's" again?
"Republicans believe in individuals, Democrats believe in group identity."
Republicans believe in the prerogatives and privileges of corporations. Period.
If Republicans believed in individuals and not groups they wouldn't have formed a group called Republicans.
Republicans believe in the prerogatives and privileges of corporations. Period
Thanks for telling us Bobby!
BTW, since it is a war crime to follow an illegal order, and the Iraq war was an illegal war, do you support seizing any soldiers involved in the war and putting them on trial at the Hague? Can somebody pardon war criminals? I am just asking on account of I know what a deep thinker you are.
To Hillary and the Left, America will be whole again when everyone is free to agree with them.
I get tired of the condemnation of corporations because they go overseas only for low wages. There is no question that is true but it is a small part of the story. Our corporate taxes are ridiculously high compared to the rest of the world They need to be simplified ( get rid of all the corporate welfare ) and lowered so that corporations based in the USA can compete when manufacturing in the USA. The cost of manufacturing includes taxes. If you are being taxed heavily you have to find savings wherever you can. Labor is a key component so off shore you go.
American corporations also have billions of dollars in overseas profits that they will not repatriate because they will be double taxed on those profits under our current law. If those funds could be brought back with out major penalty a good portion of them would be re-invested in this country creating strong growth.
Robert Cook said...
[businesses] wanted (and want) to move their operations anywhere in the world where they can pay the cheapest possible wages. Bush and Clinton helped remove impediments to the corporations from getting and doing just what they wanted.
Had they not done this new businesses would have started using those cheap wages and the resulting competition would have forced the US businesses to respond or declare bankruptcy. It's amazing people cannot understand even the most basic economic concepts when it conflicts with their utopianism.
Instead of building walls we’re going to break down barriers
That sounds like a great line but I have to think someone in Trump's organization can make a terrific ad contrasting a kind version of Trump's immigration pitch with this (making Hillary's comment specific to immigration, in other words).
"Donald Trump wants to make it more difficult for foreign criminals to sneak into America and get money from the hardworking US taxpayer. Hillary Clinton wants to make it easier. The choice is clear - vote Trump."
Win or lose, seeing Trump take down Hillary! will be one of the benefits of the upcoming campaign.
"They are going to begin to understand intellectually what so many "undereducated" have grasped viscerally: Trump may actually be in their best interest." Because . . .
Robert Cook said...Republicans believe in the prerogatives and privileges of corporations. Period.
Well the standard Lefty attack (regarding Citizens United, etc) has been that Republicans believe corporations are people...so if we take that as true then by substitution you're saying "Republicans believe in the prerogatives and privileges of people" which is functionally equivalent to saying "Republicans believe in individuals" since we can take people to = individuals.
Robert Cook, Gahrie, and Michael K all agree; hooray!
Robert Cook said...
"Republicans believe in individuals, Democrats believe in group identity."
Republicans believe in the prerogatives and privileges of corporations. Period.
To the extent that this is sort of true ... Trump is the reaction.
Ann's quote of Hillary sounds a bit like a Monty Python skit.
The linked Wikipedia article about Body Politic included a link to much more interesting Wikipedia article about the Postpositive adjective.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postpositive_adjective
I had not realized that the English language has so many postpositive adjectives (e.g. the adjective Politic, placed after the noun, in the expression Body Politic).
Postpositive adjectives are common in archaic expressions (e.g. God Almighty, heir apparent), but they also still are being coined in new expressions, especially names of organizations and businesses. Here are some examples:
Alcoholics Anonymous
Amnesty International
ARCHIVE Global
Child United
Church Universal and Triumphant
Generation Next
Japan Airlines Domestic
Jet-Blue
Ruritan National
Verizon Wireless
Virgin Mobile
Weather Underground
Workers United
Postpositive adjectives also are used in a lot of literary titles:
Bad Moon Rising
Body Electric
Brideshead Revisited
Chicken Little
Chronicle of a Death Foretold
A Dream Deferred
Hannibal Rising
Hercules Unchained
Jupiter Ascending
The Life Aquatic
A Love Supreme
The Matrix Reloaded
Monsters Unleashed
Orpheus Descending
Paradise Lost
Paradise Regained
Prometheus Unbound
The Road Not Taken
Tarzan Triumphant
The World Unseen
The Democratic Party purpose is to make everywhere into the current condition of California. This is the result of three decades of patient work, effective even during nominally Republican administrations, as the Democrats have held the legislature the whole time, and most crucially the bureaucracy and the bulk of the judiciary.
CA is a paralyzed, unproductive mess, and the second-best example of divergent economic experience in the US (NY is the best, but for somewhat different reasons). It's gilded enclaves are a dozen miles from a wholesale reversion to the third world.
The best any Democrat can say about relieving this condition is, removing the blather, to propose keeping people as civic pets.
@Sebastian Tim Maguire @ 0855 has a very good example part of Trump's appeal: "For instance, the wall. The wall is not just a physical object, it is a symbol for the need to exercise control over who comes here. That is not just an economic question, but a national security question. Most people understand that we cannot help the middle or lower classes without controlling unemployment, which we cannot do without controlling immigration. Most people understand that we cannot fight terrorism at home without a realistic way of stopping the terrorists at the border."
I grabbed some numbers today from super Tuesday States, Nevada, Iowa and New Hampshire. Just to see what vote totals looked like. I left off a lot of votes because at this point I don't care about Kasich, Bush or Carson.
Total number of votes received so far.
Clinton - 3,648,485. (Doesn't count Iowa because numbers not available)
Trump - 3,118,125
Cruz - 2,594,255
Sanders - 2,438,965
Rubio - 2,594,255
Also, the Democrats had a primary in Colorado while Republicans had a caucus in Alaska, so the numbers aren't completely apples to apples.
Found those numbers interesting.
Robert Cook wrote:
"The problem is that (Hillary) supports Obama."
Hardly. She and Bill reportedly loathe Obama.
That does not mean that Hillary does not support Obama. The Obama's supposedly loathe the Clintons back, yet Obama appointed Hillary SOS and Bill campaigned for Obama x 2.
You need a course in logic and rhetoric, Robert Cook. Also poli-sci and micro and macro economics wouldn't hurt.
"I am not a fan of those tickets, or those options. But we might be heading there. People anywhere in the middle-left or middle-right seem to be out of power in 2016. It might be the Socialist Duo vs. the National Front. "We will seize the banks" vs. "Islam will be illegal!""
I recall when Obama's critics said he was trying to make America more like Europe. In one way, we are a lot more like Europe--our choices this fall are a socialism-lite or a nativism-lite, similar to the two strongest strains in European elections.
"Win or lose, seeing Trump take down Hillary! will be one of the benefits of the upcoming campaign."
For me, the silver lining of Trump beating Hillary (if he actually does) is the look on Bill Clinton's face, knowing he tried talking Trump into running with the belief it would hobble the GOP this year. The idea that Bill--yet again!--sank his wife's political fortunes is almost worth the mess of a Trump presidency.
And who knows--maybe Trump will take the office seriously and mend fences and put some intelligent people in charge of things. I have no reason to believe he will, but anything can happen.
Hillary is a liar. Full stop.
Ergo, pondering the "meaning" of her words is a complete waste of time. Full stop.
Cruz - 2,594,255
Sanders - 2,438,965
Rubio - 2,594,255
It seems unlikely Cruz and Rubio received the exact same number of votes.
"Clinton - 3,648,485. (Doesn't count Iowa because numbers not available)
Trump - 3,118,125
Cruz - 2,594,255
Sanders - 2,438,965
Rubio - 2,594,255"
It makes sense--the GOP has had a real battle this year, while the Dems had a botched coronation. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of Democratic-leaners voted in the more interesting GOP primary in states where that is allowed.
"It seems unlikely Cruz and Rubio received the exact same number of votes. "
Good eye.
Sorry, Rubios total is 1,963,529.
Read from Cruz's line. My bad.
It'd seem Trump has the easier rhetorical task: he can directly attack the Obama Admin and even through in a few jabs against the W Bush Admin and point to various measures of decline over the last decade or so, blaming all of that on Obama (and W Bush) and promising to fix the things those guys broke.
Hillary has to be careful and not be seen as attacking the Obama Admin/her allies & her own record over the last few years while also promising to make improvements. If she runs only on "vote me in to prevent that other guy from making things worse" I can't imagine that message will do much to swing independents or drive turn out...unless the "other guy" is someone like Trump that many people may actually fear! I'm sure the Media will do its best to make any non-Democrat seem extreme and dangerous, so maybe that will be enough.
For Hillary it must be tempting to try and grab some of the enthusiasm Sanders' message of "they're all crooks and they've been screwing you over" has brought forward (especially with young people" but the "they" in that idea definitely includes the Obama Admin and if Hillary wants to run on her experience and accomplishments (sic) I don't think she can really take Bernie's line.
Clinton and Sanders - 6,085,450
Trump, Cruz, Rubio - 8,306,635
"That does not mean that Hillary does not support Obama. The Obama's supposedly loathe the Clintons back, yet Obama appointed Hillary SOS and Bill campaigned for Obama x 2."
I think a more accurate way of looking at it is Hillary and Bill hate Obama (far more than McCain or Romney ever did) and to the extent they have any political persuasion, it is triangulation so they aren't much fond of Obamaism either. But to unite her party she is willing to identify with Obama and his policies and run on a continuation of them, the same way McCain did this with Bush (who he also did not like).
"The problem is that everyone isn't equally included in the greatness."
So let's give every citizen a first place trophy every year. Result: total happiness.
Roy Jacobsen said...
Hillary is a liar. Full stop.
Ergo, pondering the "meaning" of her words is a complete waste of time. Full stop.
Well in fairness, Roy, it sure seems like pondering the meaning of what Donald says in any given speech is a waste of time, as well, since it's very likely his next speech or answer will contradict that first one.
I guess this really is the Age of Obama--empty (hopeful!) slogans and generalities substituting for actual arguments (or, god forbid, ideas!). I dunno, I guess someone could criticize "compassionate conservatism" along similar lines, but that trend certainly seems to be continuing (if not accelerating).
Clinton and Sanders - 6,085,450
Trump, Cruz, Rubio - 7,675909 (corrected per Eric)
Difference - 1,590,459
"It'd seem Trump has the easier rhetorical task: he can directly attack the Obama Admin and even through in a few jabs against the W Bush Admin and point to various measures of decline over the last decade or so, blaming all of that on Obama (and W Bush) and promising to fix the things those guys broke."
That's the direction he's been going. He hasn't yet but can also criticize the Clinton years as ones propped up by a bubble and wasting opportunities to make long term fixes for this country. When tech dollars are floating around, government spent more and ignored foreign threats that seemed far away.
Hillary has the usual challenge of a candidate running for their party's third term--offering change while also some amount of continuation, never an easy thing when the incumbent is in underwater approval ratings (Gore should have been able to do this well, as Bill Clinton was well-approved in 2000, but he messed it up because he's an idiot). McCain had the same challenge in 2008.
Hillary has to capture the same forces pushing Sanders while still keeping the Obamists (blacks chiefly) in the fold, and moderates who often break Democratic. A good politician could do this, but she isn't a good politician.
"I guess this really is the Age of Obama--empty (hopeful!) slogans and generalities substituting for actual arguments (or, god forbid, ideas!). I dunno, I guess someone could criticize "compassionate conservatism" along similar lines, but that trend certainly seems to be continuing (if not accelerating)."
With this trend line I expect the 2028 race to feature two baboons in diapers tossing poop at each other from opposite podiums. In 2032 they'll do away with the diapers.
Robert Cook:
Most businesses are not looking for the cheapest possible wages. They are looking for the lowest possible cost of doing business. In most cases cheapest wages and lowest business cost are not the same thing. Taxes, proximity to markets, access to skilled workers, political stability, protection of property rights, energy cost and availability, transportation, educational systems, fair and stable judicial system, technical support, reasonableness of regulatory burdens and ability to recruit talent are just some of the other factors.
Building and sustaining a profitable and socially productive business is a very difficult thing. If the left took the trouble to understand how business actually works and how difficult it is, rather than dealing with caricatures, it might be more effective in governing.
Blogger Bob Boyd said...
Clinton and Sanders - 6,085,450
Trump, Cruz, Rubio - 7,675909 (corrected per Eric)
Difference - 1,590,459
Remember though, that isn't the real difference. Doesn't count votes for all the other GOP candidates or the other Democrats, not that there is much in either group. But, Kasich has a lot. Carson probably has over 100k.
Brando said...
"Clinton - 3,648,485. (Doesn't count Iowa because numbers not available)
Trump - 3,118,125
Cruz - 2,594,255
Sanders - 2,438,965
Rubio - 2,594,255"
Interesting, Brando.
@ eric
Yeah I was just messing with the numbers you provided. I guess this shows the turn-out gap we've been reading about.
What other Democrats are you referring to?
These numbers don't surprise me. Hillary has 100% name recognition, yet there is ZERO enthusiasm for her. All the energy and enthusiasm is by young people and aged Hippies for Bernie.
The GOP is like a bar-room brawl from the movie, "Roadhouse." There is invective and fisticuffs, and double-crossing, and a whole lotta action. A lot more people are engaged. Uniting the fragments, though, will be challenging. I hope it can be done, to defeat Hillary.
Learnin' to Love Trump
Here is an interesting column on open and closed primaries.
Trump has been doing better in open primaries where Democrats can cross over and vote for him.
Is this a plot? Or is it a preview of the general election ?
Hmmm
"Most businesses are not looking for the cheapest possible wages. They are looking for the lowest possible cost of doing business. "
Don't try to explain this to Cookie. His calculator never matured.
With these rough numbers, it looks like Republicans got 26% more votes than Democrats. Did I figure that right?
We need to invoke the Reagan Rule immediately.
Rubio took the wrong tack with the juvenile personal attacks. There is plenty of ways to point out how electing Trump isn't in the countries best interests (how starting a trade war in a fragile global economy for instance).
Second, this election is about the next Supreme court justice. Period. At best we might get another Alito, with Hillary we will get another Ginsburg or (shudder) Sotomayor. The shift in the balance will fundamentally transform the country given the court's new found fundamental right of empathy-- just think where that future will lead.
After that, this election should be about the looming economic cliff. I know the new progressive economic theory is debt doesn't matter in a closed loop system.
Immigration may be a hot button issue and we have every right as a country to control who we invite into the country-- but even a working illegal is paying into the system, propping up the ponzi like entitlement system. (With the exception of the underground economy).
Priorities.
The ship is sinking. First we need to plug the holes. Blowing up the ship is really not an option.
Blogger Bob Boyd said...
@ eric
Yeah I was just messing with the numbers you provided. I guess this shows the turn-out gap we've been reading about.
What other Democrats are you referring to?
The other Democrats. Literally. There aren't many, granted. But some vote for other.
Blogger Michael K said...
Here is an interesting column on open and closed primaries.
Trump has been doing better in open primaries where Democrats can cross over and vote for him.
Is this a plot? Or is it a preview of the general election ?
Hmmm
It would have to be a non coordinated, grass routes plot. Sanders and Clinton want every supporter they can get. Clinton is not yet guaranteed victory.
But the Donald has genuine cross over appeal. He has some star power in his corner (other than his own) and a lot of minorities speaking out on his behalf, which is exceedingly rare for a Republican.
He has appealed to the black Churches, also, which for some reason Republicans have neglected in the past. There are a lot of social conservatives in the black Churches.
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/03/trump-backlash-super-tuesday-220125
Our Principles PAC, a super pac created by former Mitt Romney aide Katie Packer with the sole intent to throw a roadblock in Trump’s path to Cleveland, held a conference on Tuesday evening with some of the Republican Party’s top donors, including Hewlett Packard President and CEO Meg Whitman, Chicago Cubs co-owner Todd Ricketts, and New York hedge fund manager Paul Singer.
Miller told MSNBC on Wednesday that Trump is unelectable. “Hillary Clinton could get indicted by the FBI, go to jail and she would still win 48 out of 50 states against Donald Trump. He’s getting crushed by her in all the polls,” Miller said.
“We’re gonna be bringing new information to the table, things that people don’t know about Donald Trump — particularly related to his business record,” he said on CNN. “The fact that he enriched himself on the backs of regular people, that he has associations with a lot of scandalous characters. And that’s something that hasn’t been in the discussion over the course of the primary.”
Maybe they're coordinating with the Clintons. If not, she may just as well sit back and let Republicans destroy Trump, or at least try.
Good, let's really vet him. They don't know anything Clinton doesn't know. Let them throw it all. Whatever doesn't kill him makes him stronger.
ALthouse can quote Rousseau on "the general will." I can quote Arrow's Impossibility Theorem.
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/arrows-theorem/
Tim, I agree. Vetting is good and in Trump's case it never really began in earnest. Now it will. I wonder if he will get his feelings hurt and go third party. I think the GOP will not allow him the nomination, but hook or by crook...so to speak.
@ eric
But the Donald has genuine cross over appeal.
I agree with this, and I've seen this. Blue collar, construction, plumber, longshoreman types are conservative people, they just don't read National Review or espouse theoretical conservative ideas. They don't spend hours on the internet. They work hard, and play hard. They also feel a bit shafted by the "system."
Trump appeals to them. And not just on style points -- also on substantive issues, like Trade, Illegal Immigration, the Iraq War and Isis.
I certainly don't want to find out two days before the election that he has a drunk driving conviction.
"...since it is a war crime to follow an illegal order, and the Iraq war was an illegal war, do you support seizing any soldiers involved in the war and putting them on trial at the Hague? Can somebody pardon war criminals?"
That's a dumb question. We would prosecute all the architects of our illegal wars in the Middle East--those in the White House and the Pentagon and their facilitators in Congress who planned the wars, set the policies, told the justifying lies, and launched the invasions. Once we've successfully convicted and sentenced to their punishments the high political officials and military officers, we can turn to the enlisted personnel. Those who carried out torture or who can be proved to have murdered non-combatants should also be tried. The rest are blameless, as most soldiers in most wars are, as they are only hapless and helpless victims of the war machine of which they are a part. The high German commend were prosecuted at Nuremberg, but ordinary German soldiers were not, and were allowed to return to their ordinary pre-war lives.
Contra Rousseau, Spencer:
"Perhaps it will be said that this consent is not a specific, but a general one, and that the citizen is understood to have assented to every thing his representative may do, when he voted for him.
But suppose he did not vote for him; and on the contrary did all in his power to get elected some one holding opposite views — what them? The reply will probably be that, by taking part in such an election, he tacitly agreed to abide by the decision of the majority.
And how if he did not vote at all? Why then he cannot justly complain of any tax, seeing that he made no protest against its imposition.
So, curiously enough, it seems that he gave his consent in whatever way he acted — whether he said yes, whether he said no, or whether he remained neuter! A rather awkward doctrine this.
Here stands an unfortunate citizen who is asked if he will pay money for a certain proffered advantage; and whether he employs the only means of expressing his refusal or does not employ it, we are told that he practically agrees; if only the number of others who agree is greater than the number of those who dissent.
And thus we are introduced to the novel principle that A's consent to a thing is not determined by what A says, but by what B may happen to say!"
"The fact that he enriched himself on the backs of regular people, that he has associations with a lot of scandalous characters."
Good God, I hope they have more than that.
Hillary is just another socialist. What has she accomplished while in the inner circles of the US Government? Absolutely nothing except lie about the night when American citizens were killed in the Middle East. Also illegally having emails from the Government on her private server. This is a really trustworthy person for the highest job in the USA. A real trustworthy person to protect the American citizens. She is not even trustworthy to walk my dog. She proclaims that she is savior for women. Where was she protecting Monica, when her husband was taking advantage of a young lady. We never heard one word from her, now she proclaims to the answer to all that is wrong. If anyone believes that, they must also believe in the tooth fairy. It is time to expose this fake and anyone in the Republicans will be doing so.
Hillary for stitcher-in-chief.
Amanda said...
Tim, I agree. Vetting is good and in Trump's case it never really began in earnest. Now it will. I wonder if he will get his feelings hurt and go third party. I think the GOP will not allow him the nomination, but hook or by crook...so to speak.
3/2/16, 11:40 AM"
I'm sure you will be happy to know that the Director of the FBI is personally involved in the vetting of Hillary Clinton.
"Miller told MSNBC on Wednesday that Trump is unelectable. “Hillary Clinton could get indicted by the FBI, go to jail and she would still win 48 out of 50 states against Donald Trump. He’s getting crushed by her in all the polls,” Miller said.
“We’re gonna be bringing new information to the table, things that people don’t know about Donald Trump — particularly related to his business record,” he said on CNN. “The fact that he enriched himself on the backs of regular people, that he has associations with a lot of scandalous characters. And that’s something that hasn’t been in the discussion over the course of the primary.”
If Miller actually believes this he is a candidate for the nuthouse. No doubt Trump has and has had associations with scandalous characters; he did invite the Clintons to one of his marriages among other unsavory associations. Hillary's problem is absent murder there isn't anything that could be pinned to Trump that is as bad as Hillary has been pinned with.
Yes Cubanbob, I am actually happy to know that they are vetting her. So if the FBI says she did nothing wrong, you'll accept their conclusion?
The rest are blameless, as most soldiers in most wars are, as they are only hapless and helpless victims of the war machine of which they are a part.
Where is that written down in your international law? The German soldiers were engaged in a lawful war. This war was not lawful. Every order American and allied soldiers followed was an illegal order. It almost sounds as if you are coming up with post hoc rationalizations and legal fictions in order to get the result you want just because you want it. Naah!
If one is guilty, all are guilty, and it is not up to you to decide which ones go free based on vague and inapplicable analogies.
So if the FBI says she did nothing wrong, you'll accept their conclusion?
No. This is why we need an independent counsel. Because the justice department is hopelessly corrupt. Using prosecutoral powers to political ends, just as they did against Rick Perry and Gov Walker.
The facts are already out there that she put the names of intelligence operatives onto an unsecured server that almost everybody who is anybody almost certainly hacked. Valerie Plame, though, that was a reason for somebody to go to prison, right? But not Hillary, because Obama won't prosecute.
The strategy is for Hillary to project calm confidence while her surrogates run about carrying out a scorched earth policy. And Hillary trying to copy Obama's Messianic invocations her trudge-along way.
The Messiah
Every valley shall be exalted/ and every mountain and hill made low/ the crooked straight/ and the rough places plain/... And glory of the Lord shall be revealed/ And all flesh shall see it together
Hillary
We have to make America whole, we have to fill in what's been hollowed out. We have to make strong the broken places, restitch the bonds of trust and respect across our country."
And remember this?
''' [T]his was the moment when we began to provide care for the sick and good jobs to the jobless; this was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal ... a light will shine through that window, a beam of light will come down upon you, you will experience an epiphany, and you will suddenly realize that you must go to the polls and vote for Barack Obama [and now for Hillary]
But meanwhile the Messiahness's political operatives are conducting a scorched earth policy. "Republicans are racist, sexist homophobes" (Chelsea); "Sit down and shut up" (Bill to vet asking questions about Benghazi); Republican candidates are "kind of scary" (Bill Clinton in New Hampshire) etc.
So, liar as usual describes Hillary and her "healing power".
I think Comey is straight arrow. I certainly hope so as Mark Felt showed that the 1960s FBI was corrupt.
My daughter is an FBI agent but a leftist politically so we don't talk about politics. If Comey chickens out, I will have a few questions for her.
Well in fairness, Roy, it sure seems like pondering the meaning of what Donald says in any given speech is a waste of time, as well, since it's very likely his next speech or answer will contradict that first one.
True, but I was responding to our hosts attempt to tease something meaningful from Hillary's "make America whole" schtick.
"If one is guilty, all are guilty, and it is not up to you to decide which ones go free based on vague and inapplicable analogies."
Nope, because the soldiers on the ground almost certainly have no idea they are engaging in an illegal war. Most soldiers today still do not know this. By your rhetoric it appears you still do not know this. They are misled by their commanding officers and civilian commanders in Washington just as the American public is, just as you are.
However, soldiers who, of their own accord, or in following orders, commit acts they know to be criminal, such as shooting or killing nonthreatening noncombatants or torturing restrained persons, are aware of and liable for their criminal actions.
Tim,
The only person most of my friends will admit to considering voting for, Democrat or Republican, is Bernie. I wish I could vote for him in the primary (I live in Vermont only part of the year, don't vote there) because I feel like you ought to vote for a person you can at least live with as president. I could live with Bernie just on the basis if basic human decency.
Yeah, he's the best I've seen in a long time for 'basic human decency'. And he's honest as well. I'm glad to hear he's going to keep running through California's primary in June. Who really knows what will happen in this crazy campaign season :-)
@Henry: When I read that about him having associations with a lot of scandalous characters, I thought that 'scandalous characters' must refer to politicians!
So, who here thinks that the pollsters claiming that Hillary holds her own in the general are basing it on 2012 turnout numbers, completely ignoring the massive change in turnout numbers in the primaries?
The only way the current turnout numbers don't render Hillary laughably unelectable is if the vast majority of people voting for Trump are actually leftist frauds deliberately infiltrating the GOP to spoil the primary and still plan to vote for Hillary in the general. And no, it wouldn't surprise me if that is in fact the case.
Thomas Hobbes' Leviathan has never resonated much in the USA, presumably because he argues that a despotic absolutism is necessary as the only alternative is a descent into a war of all against all.
Although if you were to ask a sample of voters (college-educated or not) to identify the themes in Hobbes' Leviathan, I imagine you'd find few who'd recognize that frontspiece, let alone its content.
Would you really want Hillary as Defender of the Realm, and Defender of the Faith? Well, OK, scratch the second, as Americans aren't about to sign up for an established church. But would you even trust her to not put her own interests ahead of any national interests?
Nor would anyone think of Hillary as Rousseau, for where is her idealism? Surely it is easier to think of her as a machine pol, one who can (perhaps) be depended on to return political spoils to her favored constituencies.
I agree completely with your first paragraph, Qwinn. While there may have been some D shenanigans on Super Tuesday, the earlier races also had record R turnout and I don't think the D's would have risked jumping ballots when they had their own fight-for-the-future-of-the-party votes underway.
Robert Cook
"Nope, because the soldiers on the ground almost certainly have no idea they are engaging in an illegal war. "
Are you contending that not knowing something is illegal releases you from culpability?
On so-called “international law:”
A fiction invented by European lefties. There is no international law. Law requires enforcement in order to be relevant or to be significant. Where is the international police force to enforce this international law?
Hint: It’s NOT the UN.
Where are the international jails holding all the international criminals of the past?
International law, with meaningless international courts located in the Hague, is nothing more than a leftwing propaganda arm invented primarily to try to embarrass non-socialist democratic entities. The idea is that any conflict engaged in by whichever country they happen to disapprove of can be condemned with the bogus legitimacy of a body of "“international law” behind it. The Left thinks “international law” is fantastic, most countries simply ignore it with impunity.
"We need to make America whole. . . ." Right, Queens Cacklepants. One folk, one neck, one leash.
Its all fantasy all the time. And women eat this shit up.
I can't make up my mind whether Hillary pretends to not know she's full of shit or she believes it herself. The Left (especially the women) talks this abstract therapeutic bullshit because most of them are suffering from psychiatric disorders and pick up the jargon on their rounds through the grievance culture. They pick up the dime-store psychology from clinical social workers masquerading as self proclaimed "wounded healers." The schools reinforce the fantasies by expounding on such timeless educational themes as "creativity" because everyone's an "artist" and hey what better way to get in touch with your inner child. Even if you're in Pre-K. Its the fantasy circle jerk where touchy-feely delusions are passed around in teaspoons doled out by Ma Clinton so the true believers get a few moments respite from their ravaged psyches.
It would be sad if it weren't so destructive.
"'Nope, because the soldiers on the ground almost certainly have no idea they are engaging in an illegal war.'
"Are you contending that not knowing something is illegal releases you from culpability?"
If it is soldiers of a nation's military going into battle under orders and under the belief they are fighting in defense of their nation, and that they have the legal sanction of the appropriate military and civilian authorities, of course. (This does mean the "legal sanction" is necessarily legitimate; it just means soldiers cannot be assumed to--and largely do not--have the wherewithal to know if they are being ordered to participate in an illegal military action.)
This from Hillary isn't going to last. Better a me too with making America great again. Instead, she is pandering to the BLM crowd. That may help her beat Sanders for the nomination, but will help lose the general election for her. Heck, a lot of Blacks seem to want to hear what Trump is saying. Most everyone knows that most of the sob stories that are the basis of BLM are based on the justified shootings of black thugs trying to commit murder. Most here believe that being killed for trying to kill someone, even if the survivor is not black, is not a bad thing. Deep down, a lot of Blacks know that their communities are better with the deaths of Trayvon Martin and Big Mike Brown, since young men like them are a good part of why it is so much more dangerous to be black these days.
Of course, the other part of this is that Obama has spent the last 7 years trying his mightiest (between golf games) to tear down our greatness. We have the best military? Solution - base promotion on political correctness, put fighting AGW over being able to fight, etc. Best economy? Destroy it from multiple directions, including destroying industries by proving AGW orthodoxy, shoveling large portions of our GDP to non workers, inviting in millions of illegals with minimal education, destroying best healthcare system in the world, etc. telling Americans that she is going to make America whole tells us that she is just going to do more of this, destroying what we had. That inequalit, political correctness, and hurt feelings are more important to her than hard working middle class Americans surviving economically.
Dem. Donkey hole.
Hillary makes America an Dem. Donkey hole.
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