September 5, 2015

The new puppy.

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Note that the title of this post is "The new puppy" — not "The new puppy!"

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What's going on?

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The agenda:

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50 comments:

gregwithtwogs said...

Are there such things as "old" puppies?

Ann Althouse said...

"Are there such things as "old" puppies?"

1. This is the puppy's first day in her new home.

2. An 8-week-old puppy like this is a lot newer than an 8-month-old puppy.

Bay Area Guy said...

Cute little feller!

BILL BITTINGER said...

Our collage age Granddaughter would style it a fresh puppy.

Michael K said...

newspaper trained yet ? I hope you are using the NY Times so he/she gets a good start in life.

2yellowdogs said...

Bernese?

Original Mike said...

Big head.

Eric the Fruit Bat said...

My guess is that there are people out there who don't think twice about the implications of taking a puppy away from its mother.

Hell, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there are people who don't think about it at all.

But I'm not one of those people, sadly, which is why I see it as a kind of flattery when those college lecturers on the CDs talk about mythology and religion functioning to "mediate" the troubling contradictions in our complex system of rules governing morality.

I have yet to fully grasp that particular use of the word "mediate" but I do think I understand what it means to "Meadiate," at least when it comes to dogs.

And that's good for all concerned.

Fabi said...

Who's a good puppy? You're a good puppy! That's right!

Is there anything more adorable on this Earth? Congratulations!

pm317 said...

Is that your puppy?

Phil 3:14 said...

Please explain "the agenda".

Bill said...

Meadeonna and Child!

Jim said...

I noticed that you said that the puppy was in her new home. She is a cute puppy, and is large for eight weeks old. A puppy is a big responsibility, but can be a very good acquisition.

Laslo Spatula said...

Eight weeks old and already in a collar and chains. Welcome to Earth, pup.

I am Laslo.

rhhardin said...

You don't need the leash for a while, in that a puppy comes to clapping or anything interesting, until she discovers things that are more interesting in a few weeks.

However a dragged line is very handy for stopping the puppy without stepping on it.

First moments of 8wo Julie at home youtube December 2013.

Ann Althouse said...

"Is that your puppy?"

No. We have no pets.

Ann Althouse said...

Breed not yet guessed.

Kevin said...

My guess is that is Abby the St. Bernard's first pup.

Meade said...

10 points to Kevin for getting the breed.

pm317 said...

"Is that your puppy?"

"No. We have no pets."

Oh, I thought that was the 'agenda' you were referring to.. that that is your new puppy.

lemondog said...

How old ? Weight?

PB said...

I thought the breed was obvious (though I've raised a couple of St Bernards).

Meade said...

8 weeks. Felt like about 8 lbs of puppy.

Eric got the agenda which was to introduce new puppy to 8 y.o. yellow lab, Joey, in as smooth a way as possible. And... success!

pm317 said...

But.. but Meade, come on, you were holding it so tenderly as if you wanted it all to yourself and who wouldn't? You didn't have an agenda? ;)

The Cracker Emcee said...

The elderly are instinctively drawn to new life. One reason the pro-abortion forces will never be able to rest.

Ann Althouse said...

"Please explain 'the agenda.'"

You could try to guess from the picture!

Ann Althouse said...

Oh, Meade already explained.

pm317 said...

My guess is that there are people out there who don't think twice about the implications of taking a puppy away from its mother.

People eating veal, for instance? We recently visited a winery in our area and the last time we were there, there was a herd of cows/calves and I even have a picture of a cow that posed for me. And I ask the woman helping us with the wine tasting this time, what happened to the cows because there were none and she says, "oh they were sent to slaughter" -- something died in me thinking about that cow in the picture. People should adopt a cow for a pet.

pm317 said...
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Rusty said...

. People should adopt a cow for a pet.

I did that once. Until it got big enough to turn into steaks.


Delicious!

Big Mike said...

Who needs puppies when you have a classroom full of L1s?

The Cracker Emcee said...

. "People should adopt a cow for a pet. "

Dealing with cows en masse will de-anthropomorphize them in a jiffy.

pm317 said...

Rusty said...

Do that to your dog next time. I hear dog meat is popular in the SE Asia.

mc said...

"God...What love a puppy is"--entered my head seeing that fella.

So I googled the phrase and I guess it was just an honest reaction not some quote.

Now google must somehow own it.

Quaestor said...

My guess is that there are people out there who don't think twice about the implications of taking a puppy away from its mother.

In an earlier thread I commented on dog trainers and their belief systems. One bit of lore that many trainers as well as breeders agree on is the optimal age when that dam/whelp separation should occur.

Eight weeks is much too early. When a large breed bitch gives birth the inclination of many casual breeders is to sell or otherwise dispose the puppies as soon as they can eat solid food, and it's obvious why. A giant breed pup like a Saint Bernard can be expected to reach 80 to 100 pounds within a year. The problem is a puppy receives much more benefit than mere nourishment from its dam. Weaning at 8 weeks interrupts the natural processes through which these other benefits accrue.

Professional trainers do not prefer to work with a dog that was removed from its dam earlier than four months. They believe not without evidence that puppies, being social animals, gain social skills by remaining within the litter and under the domination of the dam until about four months of age. Likewise professional breeders (by professional I mean those who breed for the show ring) do not "let go" until the pups are old enough to accurately assess. Unless there's an obvious conformation flaw its impossible to tell which pup will be "show quality" and which will be "pet quality" until three months, longer in the case of giants. (BTW, this pup has such a conformation flaw.) Conscientious breeders will retain even pet quality pups for at least 12 weeks for the sake of their development.

The Scottish Deerhound has been my breed since college, and in those decades since I have never received a pup that was younger than 4 months.

Quaestor said...

Error alert: In an earlier thread I commented on dog trainers....

Earlier in time only from my point of view. Forgive my confusing temporal displacement.

Jim said...

I can understand what you are saying, but we like to start training a dog into our system at as young an age as possible. We got our Schnauzer at a ridiculously early age of six weeks. That was poor, but it is what happened. We got our Dachshund-Chihuahua female at 8 weeks and did well with her. We got our larger dog at three months (she is an Airdale-mix of some sort). She was on a tear, chewing everything in sight. My wife got her trained and it was a worthwhile effort. Dogs need to have a disciplined life and they seem to like being on a schedule in every aspect. That is true of ours, at least.

Quaestor said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Quaestor said...

...we like to start training a dog into our system at as young an age as possible.

People who train professionally, by that I mean for disciplines like service for the handicapped, schutzhund, search and rescue, and obedience trials, much prefer to work with dogs who were weaned naturally rather than forcibly. Trainers base this policy on experience, i.e. looking back which dogs did better in their allotted tasks, and on theory derived from observations of wild canids.

Conscientious breeders wait until 12 weeks or longer for two reasons: 1) The completely selfish reason that they don't want to loose a superior show ring dog or brood bitch to someone looking for a pet. 2) Concern for the mental and emotional development of the pup.

In my own experience I can say that I have not had nearly as many behavioral problems in dogs weaned at 16 weeks as others weaned earlier. I realize my dogs are hardly a representative sample, however I can say my experience is wider than the average dog owner, though less than most breeders and trainers. I have a collection of silver and crystal trophies won at shows and coursing trials. One of my dogs was featured in Dog Fancy magazine as an example of the Scottish Deerhound. Another dog was photographed for a popular dog-themed wall calendar. These are idle boasts, but true ones.

Eleanor said...

Did Meade sign a pre-nup saying he would go "pet-less"? Not being able to have a dog would have been a deal breaker for me. Fortunately, I didn't have to choose. ;-)

RAH said...

I thought it was a St Bernard. But I got my pure bred Border Collie at 5 months and he was very kennel shy. I would have preferred to have got him by 12 weeks. Easier to socialize and for the pup to accept new surroundings. It took lot to socialize. He could jump the fence by 6 months but he was easy to train Never bothered with a leash much.

Rusty said...

pm317 said...
Rusty said...

Do that to your dog next time. I hear dog meat is popular in the SE Asia.


That's why I have Siberian Husky.
When the supplies run out on the trek north we can always eat the dog.
Plus.
With the pelt.
you can make warm slippers.

JCC said...

@ Quaestor -

Don't want to hijack this thread, but your opinion re: waiting until 12 weeks or longer to remove a puppy from the litter is far from universal, and in fact, directly contrary to mainstream thought. No need to rehash the various theories, but terming your particular POV as "conscientious" is somewhat judgmental, and removing pups at, say, 8 ½ weeks is done by reputable breeders for sound reasons not related to the cost of dog food. That was a cheap shot and beneath you.

Great photos. Who dosen't like a puppy? But then, who doesn't like a dog? I'll never live long enough to have all the dogs that i want.

rhhardin said...

Koehler trains any dog. I doubt the weaning time matters any unless you have some barely functional training method instead.

Basically you get the dog to focus on "must hold sit-stay or earth will swallow me up" and anything else becomes a mere distraction to him.

If he moves, you correct him for not going for the cat two feet from him but for breaking the sit-stay, a correction he knows and understands.

So it answers a question that he's asking. Do I have to hold a sit-stay even if there's a cat.

Yes, you do.

Clarity and setting up clarity so that questions can be asked and can be answered, is what Koehler does.

Once with my first Doberman Susie we were practicing signal recalls. I put her on a sit-stay and go off some distance and hand-signal "come." She's supposed to come.

One day a passerby on the long sidewalk saw her on her sit and hissed at here and then kicked at her. I was a couple hundred feet down the sidewalk.

She broke her sit-stay and trotted down to me.

I didn't correct her but heeled her back to the broken sit-stay.

What did that mean?

She was asking about breaking a sit-stay if she's kicked at. My answer was yes. That is, no correction back to the broken sit-stay. The heel was a new command, not a way of correcting a broken sit-stay.

So she then learned something pretty complicated. She's responsible for her own safety sometimes, in particular.

A squirrel would have gotten a correction instead. She has to hold for squirrels.

If I were training some specialty dog for some task, perhaps holding through a kick would be wanted, and then you'd answer the other way, and correct her back to the spot she should have remained.

It's all question and answer, once you set the method up.

rhhardin said...

See Vicki Hearne "Adam's Task" for a nice introduction to Koehler.

JCC said...

There is a time in young dog development when they are very receptive to learning social skills and behavior...you know, how to be a dog, how to relate to their environment. There are differing views on when to remove a puppy from the litter and replace the bitch and litter mates with humans. I think the weaning is perhaps secondary but related to this process by time. Depending on the breed, the mother will naturally lose interest in nursing puppies in her own, and if you let her, regurgitate to start the weaning. You can't really start serious training - with pressure - until long after weaning but the socialization and learning early on is so important.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. No big deal, but there is reasonable argument for removing puppies at around 8 weeks. Agree or disagree, but doing so isn't a disreputable choice.

robother said...

ROD MCUEN thou shouldest be living at this hour!
Althouse has need of thee.

Quaestor said...

JCC wrote: Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. No big deal, but there is reasonable argument for removing puppies at around 8 weeks. Agree or disagree, but doing so isn't a disreputable choice.

Make it.

JCC said...

@ quaestor -

Start here

http://www.amazon.com/Genetics-Social-Behavior-John-Scott/dp/0226743381/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1441562724&sr=8-1&keywords=Genetics+and+the+Social+Behavior+of+the+Dog

Your turn. Cite an authority (other than yourself).

Rusty said...

Oh.
And a recomendation to anyone considering getting a husky of any sort as a pet.
When you pick up your dog stop off at Costco and get a Dyson as well.