October 29, 2014

Althouse, the "big fool"... the "cock-tease"... the "provacateur"... "the intellectual flirt"... the lawprof who reminds men of the "manipulation, deception, or disloyalty in women close to them"...

Last night, I put up a post that started a discussion about why conservatives — or at least the class of conservatives in the Instapundit commentariat — think I'm a big liberal. I joked that these people ought to come to my hometown and workplace, where I am regarded as a big right-winger. I see the consistent theme: I make people feel that I'm not what they are. I trigger the shunning reflex. Or, to put it less self-effacingly: I've hit the contrarian sweet spot.

It was interesting to me to read the comments thread here on my blog, where people tend to write, I think, if they like hanging out, for whatever reason, including the stimulation to disagree with me. But there's one comment I want to single out for separate discussion, because it has 7 itemized ideas, really detailed and insightful ideas that I want to think about and that I thought you might find useful to examine.

This is what Carl Pham wrote in what was the middle of the night here in Madison, Wisconsin:
1. Only some see you as a big liberal, most see you as a big fool, who was conned by Obama and will be conned again, or as a cock-tease who pretends to get the male/conservo-libertarian concerns, but returns privately to predictable female/collectivist tendencies.

2. For a wide swathe of traditional men, the judicial/law professor temperament is distasteful in a woman: it reminds them unpleasantly of manipulation, deception, or disloyalty in women close to them -- one they may have trusted to their regret. Indeed, I would argue it is attractive to a fairly narrow range of men in general (aside from outright betas who agree they need sensitivity training to be aware of when they leave hairs in the bathroom sink and who wouldn't dream of fondling an ass without politely asking permission first). Men don't mind reserve in a woman, but when it starts to seem calculating (which it has to be in the professor/judge role) it tends to trigger unease, ranging to paranoia in some cases.

3. There's tension between your occasional Woman/Womanhood As Victim ruminations and Instapundit's Men/Manhood As Victim ruminations. It's a very unusual person who can be neutral in the ancient battle of the sexes to win the Most Misunderstood And Exploited prize, or even see the merit that there might be in both sides of the endless argument.

4. There's blood in the water. After eight long years of a baffling preference of the majority of their fellow citizens for a smooth-talking prissy sleazebot and mealy-mouthed collectivist nostrums, there's the sense that now the red-blooded God-fearin' straight-shootin' black-coffee-drinkin' American they thought they lived amongst has finally woken up and is about to throw these changelings and cuckoos the hell out -- and the anticipation raises the blood pressure, while the possibility of a slip 'twixt cup and lip jangles the nerves. Result, partisan fervor.

5. Instapundit himself has changed (perhaps partly because of 4 above). There is less moderation and reflection, less non-political stuff, less independent libertarian stuff, and much more reflexive Obama hate.

6. Most bloggers and persistent commentariats tend to fossilize over time (and the comments in that thread are highly stereotyped). I think it's because it's extremely hard after a while for either the principal or the dinner guests to back down from an iffy and misguided thought -- you get savaged. So after time people tend to be less intellectually adventurous and open. This is a well-known effect in business: the larger the meeting, the more fossilized and traditional the positions. You only really get true experimentation and adventure in the ideas people express when the discussion is small, intimate, and private -- three adjectives that cannot possibly describe public blogging and commenting.

7. You also have a streak of provacateur or the intellectual flirt: you say things sometimes just (or mostly just) to provoke reaction and hot discussion. That makes all kinds of sense in your profession, of course. But, again, in a woman it can make many men uneasy -- few like a tease, which is kind of what this is.

176 comments:

Ann Althouse said...

I corrected a typo of Pham's in text that also appears in the post title. He had, in point #2: "it reminds them unpleasantly of manipulation, deception, or disloyalty in a women close to them."

That needed to be either "a woman" or "women" without the "a." I decided the latter was the better choice.

The Drill SGT said...

I trigger the shunning reflex. Or, to put it less self-effacingly: I've hit the contrarian sweet spot.

What ever happened to 'cruel neutrality'?

bearing said...

About what fraction of your regular readers are male, do you think?

(I'm not, and these answers seem mostly to be about men, maybe deliberately.)

tim maguire said...

Funny that that's something we have in common--most liberals think I'm conservative, most conservatives think I'm liberal. I don't fit into either category, each side seems to recognize that I don't fit into theirs and so they assume I fit into the other. (My line is: I have no more use for conservatives than for liberals, but I do have more respect for them.)

I was disappointed when Instapundit opened comments--much as I like to comment, most blogs I read that make that switch suffer for it. The Instapundit has not been an exception. Plus, I hate that a blog I love attracts so few intelligent comments.

tim in vermont said...

What ever happened to 'cruel neutrality'?

Talk about a distinction without a difference!

amielalune said...

He's boring. Oh, I suppose it's interesting to you since he was "analyzing" you, but he really just told us a lot about himself. And who cares?

On to the real topic -- you may be a total rightwinger in Madison, WI, but that just shows what an MSNBC-deluded place Madison is. YOU VOTED TWICE FOR OBAMA, correct? Then how can you possibly think that you are not a mostly-just-not-entirely liberal yourself?

tim in vermont said...

I hate that a blog I love attracts so few intelligent comments.

Bingo!

Ann Althouse said...

"What ever happened to 'cruel neutrality'?"

Reading this post out loud (to Meade), I realized this post should have the "cruel neutrality" tag and added it.

Obviously, I've regarded my own approach as cruel, so I can't complain if people feel hurt, though I've got to say that I regard it as a test of whether I'm interested in talking with you (in the Pham 5 sense). And I realize this tends to mean that my male readers are the 2 types identified in Pham 2.

The type of male who is put off and takes shots at me from the Instapundit bunker merges the 2 types of males and think they are are the type Pham called "beta." They can't picture the alpha Althouse male reader, perhaps because to do so would be to acknowledge something about themselves they don't want to have to see.

pm317 said...

I don't have time to think about all the itemized points but #7 seemed right on its face. I think (I have noticed over the years) you like talking about yourself and like more hearing others talk about you, which is why this post and its parent post getting so much of your blog real estate.

Lyssa said...

tim maguire Plus, I hate that a blog I love attracts so few intelligent comments.

I've had that thought, too. They are almost never thoughtful or challenging, just regurgitating.

I must admit that I'm not sure that I understand why Althouse chose to single out this comment. Carl Pham has made some interesting observations about how blogs change over time, but I'm not sure how they are useful to the discussion at issue. Also, (and I say this as someone who is certainly far to the right of Althouse) he appears to have woman issues. His frequent digressions into what is "distasteful" in women certainly made him come across as distasteful himself, to this woman.

Bob Ellison said...

This is so meta that I hesitate to even type.

You must promote your blog just to keep it alive. That makes sense. Rush Limbaugh often comments that he's in show business, not political business. That's the Jon Stewart argument.

It's not a good argument, unless you want to be a clown.

Henry said...

As a long-time Instapundit reader, I find #3 and #5 to be pretty astute. One way Glenn Reynolds has changed is in his emphasis on sexual politics, so I would say that #5 is predicated on #3.

I have felt, for some time, that the sum of the different ways Reynolds talks about sex is deeply weird. The sex as self-medication push, the sexbot theme, the shout-outs to the pick-up community -- all of these treat sex in a way both mechanical and misogynistic.

As for #7 -- I'm not so sure that men don't like a tease. History and art say otherwise. If you pursue items #1, #2, and #7 to their logical ends, it brings up a question that I have had myself: Why is the commentariat here so male/conservo? And why has it trended that way over many years?

SomeoneHasToSayIt said...

Instapundit himself has changed (perhaps partly because of 4 above). There is less moderation and reflection, less non-political stuff, less independent libertarian stuff, and much more reflexive Obama hate.

Oh, so now principled disagreement is "reflexive Obama hate" ?

Well, fuck you. And you just completely undercut what was otherwise an interesting post.

rhhardin said...

Marge Piercy Strong Women

She didn't write any women with sense of humor, as far as I know. It still separates the sexes.

rhhardin said...

The woman's idea is that the moron means well.

The guy's idea is that he's a moron.

David said...

Me, I love teases. As long as they avoid my major vulnerabilities.

Ron said...

But having a " streak of provacateur or the intellectual flirt" in you isn't contrarian in an academic, it's almost cliched.

If you far more open and vulnerable in what you write (which I suppose fits the genderist tropes mentioned in Pham) that would be more contrarian for someone in your profession.

Plus, I never believe your comments about yourself because they seem to have too much self-flattery in them.

Tank said...

@amielalune

First, get your facts straight.

Then form a opinion.

Henry said...

Lyssa wrote: His frequent digressions into what is "distasteful" in women certainly made him come across as distasteful himself, to this woman.

Well said. The generalizations look disturbingly like projection.

Ann Althouse said...

"About what fraction of your regular readers are male, do you think?"

It's really hard to say, because screen names don't always come across as gendered and one might pose as the other sex, and most readers don't comment.

I think readers of political blogs and the large number of readers who've come here by way of Instapundit tend to be male.

I assume the readership here is majority male, though it probably doesn't skew male as much as most political blogs, not that I see this as mainly a political blog.

I think I've been subjected to criticism for years from the feminist blogs, and I'm sure this means that many potential female readers are lost. I'm very familiar with the way people who lean left get the idea that those who don't signal acceptance of their ideology are toxic.

Bob Ellison said...

Yeah, I agree with Lyssa.

This blog gazes at its navel enough. I don't come here for the navel-gazing or the projection or the misogyny from commenters. I like the cruel misanthropy, uh, I mean, the cruel neutrality.

Your primary tendency, Professor, seems to be to post whatever the hell you want to post, come what may, and that keeps the blog lively.

Now can we get back to crappy art, Wisconsin politics that nobody outside Wisconsin understands, and Dylan references?

rhhardin said...

Degan McDowell on Imus is complaining about hissing and kissing sounds when she walks past construction sites.

That's the lesbians.

Bob Ellison said...

Ann Althouse said, "About what fraction of your regular readers are male, do you think?"

It's really hard to say...


I'd estimate that the commenters are a good 80% male. The readership may well be much less skewed. There's no way to know...at least not a way I'd recommend.

rhhardin said...

I'd be curious what misogyny means these days. It looks like it's like racism, more or less the opposite of what it once meant.

Tank said...

Being a provocateur and an intellectual flirt, isn't that what makes the blog so interesting to so many? Being a law professor is good training for this kind of thing.

For those paying attention, I think it's pretty clear that Althouse is a moderate liberal generally, with some particularly liberal social attitudes - gay stuff, womens' stuff, but not all stuff. She's not a typical liberal on abortion or "free sex."

She may have been conned by the Zero, but she had some good reasons not to vote for McCain who, let's face it, is a dimwit. She published her thinking on it. Lots of people wanted to vote for the first black president.

Unless I'm wrong, she voted for Walker and Romney. So, not a knee jerk big liberal. That person would not have done that.

tim in vermont said...

In my blog reading experience, this blog has a high proportion of female commenters who are not easily dismissed for sheer self interested vapidity. Unlike many blogs that are about identity, like the feminist blogs are by definition.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

You could take a poll on gender and commenting frequency, along the lines of:

o Male, comments never to less then once a month
o Male, comments once a month to once a day
o Male, comments multiple times a day
o Female, comments never to less then once a month
o Female, comments once a month to once a day
o Female, comments multiple times a day

Anonymous said...

I would look to the subjects that you have posted that have drawn -- by far -- the most passionate (and voluminous) comments: 'splooge stooges' and gay marriage.

For many, these two stances (and how they were presented -- forceful, with what some seemed to have taken as disdain for 'the other side') cemented you as a progressive in their minds regardless of any other subject: they positioned you unequivocally on one side of what is perceived as a hard line, and I believe your other posts, and your persona, are filtered through that dynamic.

These two subjects also seemed to have evinced a strong male/female component to the conservative/progressive positions. While 'splooge stooges' is obvious in this context I believe the gay marriage subject fits in it's own way. Many commenters took the arguments for gay marriage as emotion-based, rather than coldly logical -- a female versus male stereotype that, at times, can be correct; please note that I am speaking to reactions more than the source material.

The 'voted for Obama' aspect simply reinforces the belief derived from these two subjects. Indeed, Obama himself can probably be reduced to the female-emotion/male-logic template regarding his supporters and detractors, but that is its own subject...

tim in vermont said...

One other thing I would like to say. The very fact that Althouse is able to accurately recapitulate conservative arguments says something about her.

Try to get the average liberal, or any liberal, to accurately recapitulate a mainstream skeptical argument, for example on global warming, if only to refute it. They can't do it.

Revenant said...

If people in academia think you're right-wing and people in the rest of the world think you're left-wing, you're probably left-wing.

Hillary Clinton is considered right-wing by a lot of the academics I know.

Ann Althouse said...

"I must admit that I'm not sure that I understand why Althouse chose to single out this comment. Carl Pham has made some interesting observations about how blogs change over time, but I'm not sure how they are useful to the discussion at issue. Also, (and I say this as someone who is certainly far to the right of Althouse) he appears to have woman issues. His frequent digressions into what is "distasteful" in women certainly made him come across as distasteful himself, to this woman."

I loved point #2 and decided to frontpage this halfway into reading that point. I think he imagined how other people think in a way that felt right to me and was at least provocative. How other people think is the most interesting subject for contemplation.

To connect this to another topic from yesterday: It is the reason for reading novels. You only really get to see how the novelist thinks about how other people think, but the novelist is good when he can do this in exciting ways, including seeming to get it right or at least to make you think more deeply about whether you are getting anywhere near how it really feels to be someone else.

The reason for writing a novel, to me, is to use your own mind to imagine the minds of other, to inhabit them and play out lives for them.

One of the things I do on this blog is to take some evidence of another person's mind — perhaps something Hillary Clinton said — and to play out my ideas of what is really happen in there and also the effect or the intended effect on other people's minds

I know some readers rankle at that. How can Althouse possibly know? She can't mind read.

Within the law school milieu, some people don't want to have to talk about what's really going on in the minds of judges, even though that's: 1. The most interesting aspect of law, and 2. Understanding the mind you want to persuade is exactly what a lawyer needs to do to make an effective argument.

RecChief said...

Trigger the shunning reflex? I don't think so. I based my comment on the stories you choose to post, the ones you ignore, and your commentary on them.

While I still go to Instapundit, I don't read Reynolds' own commentary that much. Just for the links, although he makes some good points in a broad sense, it's become kind of like a tabloid in some ways.

In any case, this is the only blog where I still comment.

rhhardin said...

Feelings do not know their marching orders. - Lautreamont

Oso Negro said...

If Pham lacks self-awareness of his issues with women, this post should be a good mirror. I think the reason so many of your alpha-male readers are attracted to this blog is that you offer the intellectual stimulation of a really bright girlfriend - original insights about life, well-reasoned arguments, and a couple of forgivable weak points resulting from estrogen-induced sentimentality. To my mind, Meade got lucky.

It would take a good amount of space to catalogue your virtues, the few weak points are nostalgia for both the civil rights movement (the freedom of association tear-up!), ur-feminism (your girlhood!), and gay marriage, where you skip past the unintended consequences (your son!). On the balance, you are a national treasure. I hope you and Meade roll along a good long while.

rhhardin said...

Mind reading is one of the philosophical theories of language.

The other is prophecy.

By way of saying that mind reading isn't unusual.

rhhardin said...

Joke from high school

"I can read minds [pause] You're thinking I can't."

That has a name in magic, forcing I think.

Jane the Actuary said...

Althouse and Instapundit are both social liberals. However, Althouse writes about abortion and gay marriage, and Instapundit only makes periodic comments about the latter. Can't recall anything he's written on the former, and, given his style, there's very little commentary by him, in general. His politics are mostly implied by the sorts of pieces he chooses to link. (I think, in a way, that limits him: he can't link with a "this is an interesting point of view; let's talk about it" because that's too subtle for his approach.)

Instapundit is libertarian, to boot, on economic issues.

On other issues, and in terms of her characterization of partisan politics more generally, Althouse is certainly right-of-center, but her blogging style doesn't really work without a certain contrarianness that engages its readers, and it's more conversational and reflective (even without the comments) than muckraking. She's not spending hours researching the latest scandal.

Not a big mystery.

Bob Boyd said...


Ann said: "I loved point #2"

Carl Pham presented this as a men threatened by powerful women thing and you went after it like a trout after a fly.
Carl knows your weak spot and so does Hillary.

rhhardin said...

Thurber had unresolved issues with horses.

Lyssa said...

Thank you for responding to my post, Professor. I agree that how people think can be a fascinating subject.

rhhardin said...

They have brain scanners for airports that can tell what you're thinking, but they found they don't work on women.

Lyssa said...

Jane the Actuary said: However, Althouse writes about abortion and gay marriage, and Instapundit only makes periodic comments about the latter. Can't recall anything he's written on the former

When I first started reading (around 2007), he commented on those a bit more. He used to frequently state that his idea of liberatarianism involved happily married gay couples with a closet full of assault rifles. He also used to comment in a pro-abortion way on a fairly regular basis, and for a while had a picture up of him humorously wearing one of those "I had an abortion" t-shirts. I found it a bit of a turn-off (though not enough to scare me away, I guess).

Now, I think that he's more interested in the free speech and similar issues, and seems to post more from the anti-abortion side (but from the perspective of having their rights to disagree on that trampled on, not from the perspective of necessarily agreeing with their posts). I've wondered if it has come with having a more conservative readership that he does not want to turn off now.

Moose said...

Well you have a tendency to troll your readers with ambiguous statements not unlike this one. People with poor self control will take that as a invitation for abuse.

rhhardin said...

Guys don't care about strong women. It's sense of humor that you want.

Mark Steyn, responding to a caller who said she loved his sense of humor, "Women always say they're looking for a sense of humor, but they never actually are, Valarie, believe me."

Limbaugh, Apr 1 2011

Typical exchange after a few months

"There has to be more to our relationship than just laughing at jokes."

"There does?"

Anonymous said...

All public writing is, at its core, burlesque. How much the writer wants to show or keep hidden, how much the reader believes he or she has seen versus what was actually shown. There is an art to it.

rhhardin said...

Althouse on gay marriage is dismissive of the other side.

It's the woman's I know what I know feeling.

Ken B said...

1 Cruel neutrality was transparent self-deception.
2 Meade has made things better. Self-deception gets harder with a skeptic beside you.
3 Glenn and his commentariat have gotten more partisan since 2008.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

Just to be clear, my seeing you as a cock-tease had absolutely nothing to do with your political opinions.

rhhardin said...

Burlesque, Derrida on Mallarme

The hesitation, however, to uncover everything of what does not yet exist, weaves, for modesty's sake, out of the general state of surprise, a veil.

CStanley said...

Weighing in as a female reader, I agreed with Carl Pham's comment and don't get the other commenters who feel he was projecting his own misogynist tendencies. I felt he was pretty spot on with the gender stuff.

Ann Althouse said...

"Now can we get back to crappy art, Wisconsin politics that nobody outside Wisconsin understands, and Dylan references?"

Oh, nobody inside Wisconsin understands it either.

MadisonMan said...

Commenting on a comment from a blog post about a blog post commenting on a blog is demanding me to be too meta, I think.

tim in vermont said...

For a wide swathe of traditional men, the judicial/law professor temperament is distasteful in a woman: it reminds them unpleasantly of manipulation, deception, or disloyalty in women close to them

I have to admit that this is true. We all know that we can make all of the logical and dispassionate arguments we can muster to a woman, and she can acknowledge and event understand them, and then she will still do what she wants, based on some rationalization that she will not share because she knows we won't agree with her thinking, which will generally be emotional. Even if we can demonstrate that while her reasoning works in the context of a specific example, it will be harmful in the broader sense.

A perfect example is paying ransoms to terrorists. Logically, it makes no sense to give large quantities of money to groups that saw off peoples heads, but the emotional argument about the individual facing the threat right now wins, even if paying subjects further individuals to that threat in the future, or buys weapons for the kind of massacres as just occurred in Iraq this morning.

The emotional decision is demonstrably wrong. Just don't depend on a woman to let that guide her thinking.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

tim maguire said...

Plus, I hate that a blog I love attracts so few intelligent comments.

Yeah, seeing an open comment section on a blog I like tends to to knock the wind out of the notion that all the assholes are on the other side.

Especially since I don't always resist the urge to be the asshole.

Jonathan Card said...

For myself, I appreciate your thoughtful, informed, frequently deliberate (I assume) contrarianism. :)

Michael said...

HAHAHAHAHA. Carl Pham uses "twixt". What a butthole. What a pompous drunk-in-the-middle-of-the-night academic fraud. Twixt my ass.

Phil 3:14 said...

Slow news day?

FleetUSA said...

I think he nails it in the 4 point and last.

My enjoyment on this site is that you seem to be centrist and questioning. Exactly what I would hope to hear from a first class Con law prof.

I don't see you as a whack-a-mole leftist prof types which unfortunately are too abundant on campuses (campi?) today.

grackle said...

… most see you as a big fool, who was conned by Obama and will be conned again …

If I'm remembering correctly, the vote for Obama in his first term was because McCain was too warlike. Perhaps she is realizing that electing a dove only encourages the hawks around the world. They see weakness and dithering and swoop down for easy prey.

And also the smile-inducing(from me) rationalization of hers that the Right would be better off for awhile without anyone in the Whitehouse. A right-leaning President would have attracted too much hatred from the Left, especially the MSM. But she got back on track the second time around and voted for Romney.

If you get too cutesy and try to second-guess events too much in politics you end up fooling yourself, I think.

Our hostess also fits my definition of an intellectual as someone who cares deeply about ideas and their significance. And from that emerges an interest in subtleties and nuance in politics and other things. Not a stereotypical traditional female characteristic. Maybe that causes heartburn in some circles.

I may be the only commentor who was married to a lawyer. Graduated with honors from law school and aced the Bar the first time around. Men I can tolerate but I cannot be with an unintelligent woman. She never nagged, bless her heart. Her reading comprehension was off the charts so she easily grasped subtleties but did not worship them. Last I heard she was holding hearings for the INS in DC.

Our hostess is neither GOP nor Democrat. She's an independent. Like me. Suffice to say, I do not hold THAT against her.

To my mind, Meade got lucky.

Meade is one lucky dog. He dared and won. If I had not lived a thousand miles away and been too old for her I might have tried the same.

Ann Althouse said...

"Mark Steyn, responding to a caller who said she loved his sense of humor, "Women always say they're looking for a sense of humor, but they never actually are, Valarie, believe me.""

Now, a true novelist could generate an entire book from that seed. What is the backstory of the man who would say that? Or laugh and move on and know that you are not a novelist.

Kevin said...

I'm late to the discussion, but I really think it is as simple as what affects the perception of Mickey Kaus and Peggy Noonan. You talk the talk, but then voted for Obama regardless. This makes people suspicious of the sincerity of the talk. I (and I think a lot of others) just don't see how anyone who shows evidence of life above the shoulders could have been fooled by Obama, so someone who voted for him must have known what they were in for.

Carol said...

in my experience the only way for a woman blogger to please right wingers is to go all malkin or coulter; anything less is too ambiguous, and you will be continually tested.

John Lynch said...

I don't go to blogs to read things I agree with. It's boring.

I never know what Althouse is going to write about. That keeps me coming back.

Political blogs are overwhelmingly white and overwhelmingly male. I think this blog skews older than most other blogs, which are read by 25-35 yo men. I like that. Older people have more diversity in what they believe because they don't care so much about belonging to some in-group. They also have some perspective about how things have changed.

The worst possible blogs have comments sections that are big, conformist circle-jerks. Balkinization is like that. Instapundit is like that. Everyone just poses to show that they are with it and on the right team. There are lots of cute names for the bad people on the other side, and lots of cliche phrases to show that commenters have been reading the right sources for news.

On topic, Pham has an appropriately misanthropic view of blog commenters who have the time and inclination to post on political blogs. Happy, well-adjusted men don't spend a lot of time typing on the internet. There are exceptions, and those exceptions tend to be the best commenters. The rest is a big soup of discontent.

Commenting is a narcissistic activity. Most comments are just "I think this." Few comments are aimed at persuasion. A great many are intended to discourage and intimidate. It's more about group norm enforcement than discussion.

There's no point in checking a block like instapundit to see what Glenn Reynolds thinks about a subject. It's easy to predict. Althouse isn't easy. Also, exactly how she thinks about it is going to be different. That, it seems to me, makes it a better blog.

Ann Althouse said...

"Althouse on gay marriage is dismissive of the other side. It's the woman's I know what I know feeling."

How it feels to me is: We've been talking about this for so long, and your side has been elaborated again and again, and my side seems so obviously right. I'm not that interested in hearing you say it again. I don't want to be rude, but the conversation is boring to me. I've tried to advise you to find a graceful way to move forward, but if you're going to stand there rechewing your old arguments ad infinitum, I've got other places to go.

Paul said...

You voted for Obama Ann.

And you are not in some trailer house but are well educated. Takes a real liberal to vote for such an idiot who was very easy to see through.

So yea, you WERE a liberal. I only hope after having this blog you see the light.

FleetUSA said...

Ah. Understanding the mind of judges brings back a wonderful memory.

I was managing a case (outside lawyers argued the case) with a judge who had been a US naval officer stationed in Japan. Since the case involved overseas shipments to Japan I made a point of getting one of the Italian captains on the stand. The testimony was interesting. We won the case.

Ann Althouse said...

"Yeah, seeing an open comment section on a blog I like tends to to knock the wind out of the notion that all the assholes are on the other side."

LOL (because I'm assuming you remember that "all the assholes are on the other side" is a catchphrase at Meadhouse).

garage mahal said...

As if voting against McCain and Palin is something you should be ashamed of.

Ann Althouse said...

"HAHAHAHAHA. Carl Pham uses "twixt". What a butthole. What a pompous drunk-in-the-middle-of-the-night academic fraud. Twixt my ass."

I assumed it went with the image of drinking in that paragraph and was a reference to the old phrase "There's many a slip twixt the cup and the lip."

DanTheMan said...

>>I may be the only commentor who was married to a lawyer

Nope.

Ann Althouse said...

"If I'm remembering correctly, the vote for Obama in his first term was because McCain was too warlike."

You are remember incorrectly.

Read: "How McCain lost me."

John Lynch said...

Being mad at Althouse for a vote six years ago is a great way to convince her, and everyone else, to be on your side.

How do you think you win elections? You convince people to change their votes. Althouse changed her votes, therefore punish. Makes sense to me.

chickelit said...

I've tried to advise you to find a graceful way to move forward, but if you're going to stand there rechewing your old arguments ad infinitum, I've got other places to go.

That a "settled science" argument. Stare decisis.

Jane the Actuary said...

"in my experience the only way for a woman blogger to please right wingers is to go all malkin or coulter; anything less is too ambiguous, and you will be continually tested."

You know, I've been blogging for a little more than a year myself, and with a tiny readership, but at various points I've poked around looking for blogs to model my own after, with an eye toward women. And there just don't seem to be too many small-time female political bloggers out there, that I know of, anyway.

John Lynch said...

Jane-

Megan McArdle started that way.

Jane the Actuary said...

Oh, and it would probably be too tacky to use this as a seque to ask you all to go read my blog, wouldn't it?

Francisco D said...

I check out this blog fairly often because Ann strikes me as a reasonable liberal, something in short supply these days.

I was a liberal until 1980. Voting for Carter was the cold blast of reality that I needed. I prefer conservative web-sites because I am a generally conservative person with some socially liberal views and increasingly libertarian views. However, I don't want tools touch with what liberals are thinking. Ann strikes me as a thoughtful liberal.

Garage, ARM, the Crackhead ... not so much. Sometimes they are good for comedic relief. Sometimes they are just annoying.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

How it feels to me is: We've been talking about this for so long, and your side has been elaborated again and again, and my side seems so obviously right. I'm not that interested in hearing you say it again. I don't want to be rude, but the conversation is boring to me.

How it feels to me is: You keep throwing the same hanging curveball over the center of the plate, then complain about how boring it is that we keep knocking them out of the park the same way each time.

( Like I said in my previous comment, I don't always resist the urge. )

Kevin said...

I'm pretty conservative, and male, and I'd say that Kathy Shaidle is the female blogger that most closely tracks to my views of things. Otherwise I'm Ace's man all the way (except movie reviews).

I read this blog precisely to be challenged and to see things in a way I didn't expect, as many commenters have noted above. And I learn a lot from the commenters who aren't Garage or Crack.

madAsHell said...

Cock-tease??
provacateur?
the intellectual flirt?


These are compliments....no??

mikeski said...

As if voting against McCain and Palin is something you should be ashamed of.

As if voting for Obama and Biden is something you should be proud of.

FIFY.

tim in vermont said...

No "true right-winger" likes Althouse then, I guess Carol means to say.

I think this has more to do with Carol's inner mental model of what a right-winger looks like.

I are one. I don't read Coulter, though I do think that when her good friend was killed by terrorists on 9-11, a little understanding might have been applied to what she wrote only a couple of days later, while still processing her grief.

I don't read Malkin.

I don't read The Blaze

I rarely get a chance to listen to Rush, but still find him insightful occasionally.

Mark Levin actively disgusts me. Mostly because I don't believe he authentically believes what he says, or said the couple of times I have been exposed to him.

But it is way more fun to imagine that all the people on the other side are assholes, isn't it?

RecChief said...

We all know that we can make all of the logical and dispassionate arguments we can muster to a woman, and she can acknowledge and event understand them, and then she will still do what she wants,

This is a trait of just female law professors? I need to call the wife, she's been holding out on me.

RAH said...

Actually to me your are a thinking liberal. However your post on the recall election seemed that your were sliding into conservative thought. So as you get older you seem to be more conservative except on the gay marriage items.

You also do like to tease or provoke so to keep the air of mystery. It keeps your blog interesting.

tim in vermont said...

Jane, this wasn't a real letter from a real guy was it?

chillblaine said...

I was a casual reader to this blog until a few years ago, when Althouse set the hook. She wrote, "I live in a city where people point me out and announce to the group: 'Ann Althouse is here.' And not in a nice way. It's creepy."

Althouse forces her reader to think. I appreciate that.

CStanley said...

This is how it feels to me as well:
How it feels to me is: You keep throwing the same hanging curveball over the center of the plate, then complain about how boring it is that we keep knocking them out of the park the same way each time.

Maybe the reason you feel that your side is so "obviously right" is that you continually reinforce this feeling by trolling your readers for a certain kind of reaction, while ignoring the more substantive comments and questions that come up. Additionally you ignore bad behavior and bad faith on your own side, creating your own epistemic bubble.

Jane the Actuary said...

Tim in Vermont --

thanks for linking. Is the situation in that "Ask Amy" letter for real? No idea. That's not a world I inhabit. But more believable than the Prudence section of Slate.

EDH said...

Where's Titus when you need him?

mccullough said...

Althouse voted for Dukakis in 1988, from what I remember her writing about her presidential votes over the years.

I'm actually interested in why Dukakis over HW Bush. That's the one presidential election in my memory lifetime (I was a baby in 1972) that I thought and still think is beyond debate. Dukakis has been the least presidential candidate since Wendell Wilkie.

Bob Ellison said...

John Lynch said, "Political blogs are overwhelmingly white and overwhelmingly male."

Amusing. Who has time to blog and comment on blogs? Who talks/writes a lot? Who likes the sound of his/her own talking?

This comment might get me in trouble, but it's late in the comment game around here.

Michael K said...

"One way Glenn Reynolds has changed is in his emphasis on sexual politics, so I would say that #5 is predicated on #3."

I think Glenn has been influenced by his wife's focus on the War on Men. She wrote an interesting book.

I see the frustration in many with the people who voted for Obama the empty suit because he was black (sort of). I could understand that and was not surprised with the results. I was surprised that he got enough votes in 2012 to avoid the reaction to the disasters he has created.

Having seen what the Democrats could do in 2012 with a very sophisticated GOTV system and a modest amount of fraud, I fear that Hillary could overcome all the excellent reasons she should be retired to fund raising.

This is how societies die, or at least atrophy as Japan has atrophied the past 25 years. I fear the 2012 election was a tipping point and that Romney had the skills to get us out of the death spiral and now it will be too late if we ever elect a good president.

Hemingway was asked how someone went bankrupt. He said, "Slowly, then suddenly." I think that is true of nations also.

I do appreciate the comments section, which is absent from left wing blogs that block any dissenting views. This leads the left to think it has all the good ideas. They never debate. I used to read and comment at Washington Monthly when Kevin Drum was the blogger. Then they banned me for reasons that were never explained.

I usually comment only on those things that interest me.

mccullough said...

Nothing is older or whiter than baseball blogs

CStanley said...

I don't think Prof Althouse will vote for Hillary, although the pull to vote for a woman is likely strong. I think her dislike of Hc is strong enough to overcome this.

I think her reasoning for voting for Obama was very strained though, and unconvincing to many of her readers. Therefore it seems like a rationalization rather than a real rationale, and readers who see it that way are likely to extrapolate that she will create a justification to vote for HC as well.

Insufficiently Sensitive said...

Or, to put it less self-effacingly: I've hit the contrarian sweet spot.

Bravo, from the Society of Adriatic Curmudgeons!

Kevin said...

Tim in Vermont is onto something, I think, having to do with the stereotype of the right wing conservative.

I also don't care about Rush, Levin, Coulter, or Malkin, though Twitchy does great things sometimes.

I follow Ace, Instapundit, Jonah Goldberg, Kathy Shaidle, Mark Steyn, Heather MacDonald, Jay Nordlinger, David Kahane, Andrew C. McCarthy, Virginia Postrel, Kevin D. Williamson, Mark Goldblatt, Amity Shlaes, Alicia Colon, New Criterion, and you.

CStanley said...

And I think Prof Althouse is a rare example today of a thinking liberal (and only left of center on some issues) which draws a lot of conservative commenters.

I haven't been around here that long but I imagine that many commenters were drawn here for that reason but then gave strong push back on a number of hot button issues where Althouse leans further left. Which was noted by the blogger, and exploited for effect.

Michael said...

Althouse:

I am familiar with the hackneyed and overused slip of the tongue twixt saying.

From years of observing its use I can say without hesitation that only assholes and pretentious academics use it. They think it is cute and, better, a sign of sophistication. It is a marker for a silly person

Ann Althouse said...

"How it feels to me is: You keep throwing the same hanging curveball over the center of the plate, then complain about how boring it is that we keep knocking them out of the park the same way each time."

So you think it's a home run when people refer to the dictionary definition of marriage?

Anglelyne said...

Henry: I have felt, for some time, that the sum of the different ways Reynolds talks about sex is deeply weird. The sex as self-medication push, the sexbot theme, the shout-outs to the pick-up community...

A bunch of nerdy young guys sitting around on the internet talking about sex the way Reynolds talks about sex would be pretty normal. It's only weird because he's awfully long in the tooth to be stuck in the silly sperg stage. Lot of that going around, though - it's just one manifestation of the infantilization apparent everywhere.

...-- all of these treat sex in a way both mechanical and misogynistic.

I wouldn't say "misogynistic" (even if we disregard that "misogynist", like "racist", is now only a tantrum-marker). I think "retarded" covers it.

CStanley said...

Ha, reading your response to "Ignorance is Bliss" makes me realize I didn't read his comment well before endorsing it.

I don't think people hit your curveballs on gay marriage out of the park. I think mostly you get boring, predictable (and sometimes bigoted) responses which is exactly what you hope for. You don't blog on this issue in way that's conducive to real debate, because you simply want to declare the debate over.

Ann Althouse said...

"I don't think Prof Althouse will vote for Hillary, although the pull to vote for a woman is likely strong."

It's just not true that I feel a pull to vote for the woman, and it's especially not true when it's a woman who is where she is because of a man and not as an independent woman.

I can't think of any time when I voted based on the sex of a candidate or felt any desire to do so. I can think of a number of women I voted against.

Eeyore Rifkin said...

The mind is voracious. Under what conditions will it eat itself?

Gender is a tool. Gender is a vessel. Which is more encompassing of the other? Which is more all-purpose?

Dull knives, cracked bowls. Such is our inheritence. Have you been taught how to sharpen a blade? Throw a pot?

Let the thoughts out of their cages. Because you sympathize with their hunger. Do you expect them to reciprocate?

Does this introspection make me look narcissistic? Ann Coulter is the bomb!

What's for dinner?

CStanley said...

To clarify: my comment about your inclinations to vote for a woman was merely my own inference. I take you at your word that this was incorrect.

RecChief said...

It's just not true that I feel a pull to vote for the woman, and it's especially not true when it's a woman who is where she is because of a man and not as an independent woman.

So what do you make of the "draft Warren" movement? It doesn't appear from here that she got where she is because of a man.

John Lynch said...

I'd be much happier with Elizabeth Warren than Hillary Clinton. I don't agree with her at all, but she's probably more effective.

I wish we'd stop voting for Senators to be President. That's a bad, bad idea.

Ignorance is Bliss said...

So you think it's a home run when people refer to the dictionary definition of marriage?

No, no more so than you think that a charge of homophobia is a 100 mph fastball.

Is the dictionary definition really the best argument that you've heard from the other side?

I will certainly agree that there are plenty of assholes on my side who make stupid arguments ( if you can even call them arguments. ) I can understand your boredom with that.

Anonymous said...

I can suggest one good way of not having to look at the same old arguments against gay marriage over and over again: stop doing end-zone dances on the topic every few days.

rhhardin said...

Now, a true novelist could generate an entire book from that seed. What is the backstory of the man who would say that? Or laugh and move on and know that you are not a novelist.

It's men in general, and women in general.

I think it's related to women in men's jobs doing them well but grimly.

Sex difference are mostly in what men and women enjoy doing.

Guys abstract from everything, which leaves a lot of distance and opportunity for humor.

Women engage in everything at once.

Æthelflæd said...

Instapundit does get tiresome with his porn and sexbots shtick. I am sympathetic to some of the "men's rights" issues, but...

This blog is not an echo chamber - very rare on the internet, or in the real world, for that matter. There is always something of interest, whether it is a blog post or a particular comment.

mjatherton said...

I, for one, read your blog because I find it insightful. I am not expecting you to agree with me at all times.

Gender is gender

Real Clear Politics does an excellent job of demonstrating many sides to the issues of the day.

Jane the Actuary said...

Now that we're talking marriage, by the way, the next stage in the "gaymarriage" discussion is really to address what marriage is about, in the first place. Is it just the ability to "legally" use the terms husband/wife, become legally "next-of-kin" and obtain whatever other benefits the government provides?

It seems that there are plenty of people out there promoting exactly that, a sort of do-it-yourself approach, in which marriage has only as much intention for permanence or sexual fidelity or "union" (that is, combining your lives, including finances, vs. each party being on their own) as they wish to give it, and no more.

http://janetheactuary.blogspot.com/2014/10/what-happens-when-marriage-isnt.html

Meade said...

"I can suggest one good way of not having to look at the same old arguments against gay marriage over and over again: stop doing end-zone dances on the topic every few days."

By "stop doing end-zone dances on the topic" do you mean: "stop mentioning the topic"? I'm not being sarcastic, I truly do not see the "end-zone dances".

http://althouse.blogspot.com/search/label/same-sex%20marriage

NorthOfTheOneOhOne said...

I joked that these people ought to come to my hometown and workplace, where I am regarded as a big right-winger.

Ever thought that maybe if you traveled to their hometowns you'd understand why they think you're practically a communist?

Quaestor said...

I kept well-clear of the "let's label Althouse" thread because it seemed to be a topic that would shred much more heat than light.

American politics are the least ideological of any in the West. The typical vote reflects mood and short-term interest more than philosophy, even assuming that the typical voter's mind even functions in a manner that can be so described. Simple mental inertia more often accounts for "party loyalty" in this country than critical thinking, which is not to say that those "swing voters" are paragons of reason. In my experience these people are just as foggy in their logic as rock-ribbed Republicans or yellow dog Democrats.

Some election years give us a peculiar mix of candidates which encourages non-rational voting. 2008 was such a year. Given John McCain as the nominal conservative a surprising number of habitually conservative voters ticked the Obama box. Why?

The comprehensive answer is TLDR. The short answer is combination of McCain's seemingly erratic political history, and cognitive dissonance.

I chose McCain, not because I liked him. McCain was and remains one of the most maladroit politicians the Republican's have ever nominated. Nevertheless McCain was running for the presidency. Obama was running for deity.

Roger Sweeny said...

"But having a "streak of provacateur or the intellectual flirt" in you isn't contrarian in an academic, it's almost cliched."

I find that most academics pretend to be contrarian, but are actually more herdlike. Professor Althouse is often truly contrarian.

Basil said...

Pham is not representative of anything other than Pham, and I find Pham annoyingly shallow and superficial.

Enjoy the art that is this blog and its commentariate (other than Crack, of course, as I am against racism).

Thank you for providing this venue for conversations I would not otherwise get to experience.

Sigivald said...

or at least the class of conservatives in the Instapundit commentariat

The worst thing about Reynolds' having comments is the sort of commenters PJM attracts, sadly.

Not all of them, of course, but far too many.

(I think it might have affected his style, too; there's a regrettable tendency towards clickbait from PopSci and PopMech any boring conservative-red-meat-ish content anymore.)

Sigivald said...

(On topic, I think amielalune is probably right.

He's boring to not-you people [Not a complaint about the content, since it's your blog, and it's relevant to you].

And realistically in terms of "observation from outside" I don't know how to analyze your demonstrated politics as anything other than what-we-now-call-liberal.

Not deep-blue Progressive or anything, mind you; I can see center-left as perfectly viable.

But not "neutral".

-

As a second aside, I tend to automatically discount anyone - especially any man - who uses the ludicrous "alpha/beta" distinction, especially as a first class distinction or entity.

That model never worked and continues to not work or be useful.

Naturally, it seems to only be used by people who see themselves as the "alphas".

This is often doubly ludicrous; if the paradigm were correct, a true alpha would probably not bother thinking about that model.)

Dan Hossley said...

Funny, I don't read you as conservative or liberal, but rather as "academic".

Roger Sweeny said...

"And also the smile-inducing(from me) rationalization of hers that the Right would be better off for awhile without anyone in the White House."

One of the best things that happened to the Right was Reagan's loss of the Republican presidential nomination to Gerald Ford in 1976, and Ford's loss in the election to Jimmy Carter.

RecChief said...

By "stop doing end-zone dances on the topic" do you mean: "stop mentioning the topic"? I'm not being sarcastic, I truly do not see the "end-zone dances".

Except you live with her every day, talking about wide ranging subjects. We only see the part that gets posted. You really can't see how "It's Over." equals "I Won." to some people?

mikee said...

You voted Obama. Sorry, any claim made to the right wing is not just invalid, but ridiculous, no matter what the obviously not sane Madisonians tell you.

John Lynch said...

Sigivald-

I read Richard Fernandez (picked him up when he was still at blogspot and Den Beste linked to him) but I don't read his comments section.

Meade said...

@RecChief: yes, I can see that. Still, she said 'it's over" what, once? Even accepting that "It's Over." equals "I Won," and granted she blogs about the topic of same-sex marriage frequently, how is it reasonable to claim that she says "it's over" "every few days"?

Roger Sweeny said...

"One of the best things that happened to the Right was Reagan's loss of the Republican presidential nomination to Gerald Ford in 1976, and Ford's loss in the election to Jimmy Carter."

Reminds of the story Reagan liked to tell:

The parents of two brothers — one an incurable pessimist and the other an incurable optimist — took their sons to see a doctor in the hopes of curing the boys of their respective conditions. The physician started with the young pessimist. He took the boy into a room brimming with a mountain of new toys. "These are all yours," the doctor said. Immediately, the young pessimist burst into tears. "What's wrong?" His parents asked. "If I play with the toys, "the boy sobbed, "surely they will all break and be ruined."Next, the doctor tried his hand with the young optimist. Instead of toys, the doctor took his patient into a room filled with a mountain of horse dung. "This is for you." The doctor told him. With that, the boy smiled, so wide he could have eaten a banana sideways. Excited, he raced to the top of the mountain of manure, where, with his bare hands, he began digging into the pungent heap. Baffled, the doctor and the parents looked at one another quizzically, "Son," the father asked." What in heaven's name do you think you're doing?" "Well, the boy replied, with all this horse dung, I figure there's got to be a pony in there somewhere!"

If you close your eyes and listen close enough, you can almost hear Reagan's "Well..."

So I'll just say, Well... with all this manure left by Obama, I figure there's got to be a Ronald Reagan in there somewhere!

Sam L. said...

I'm a #1er.

Anonymous said...

Stopped reading immediately after I saw the term "betas" in the quoted comment.

I have contrarian tendencies and I like Althouse, fwiw. This is not based on any political position, but my perception of a mix of general character traits. How and why those traits translate into various positions I may agree or disagree with is interesting, but secondary.

For example, I'm far more forgiving of women of a certain gen, like Hillary, who were not completely independent in their rise to the top. Men do not make it as 'independently' as that gen were asked to make it. They make allies among other men. Women were in the position of being new and in need of allies/acceptance in unwelcoming circles of power made almost entirely out of the gender they had sex with. Of course you're going to get some Hillary/Bill situations, even from purists; It creates resentment, but was inevitable.



John Lynch said...

SOJO-

OK, but what about Margaret Thatcher?

Geraldine Ferraro?

Etc.

The top job matters too much to make allowances for time and place. We're not hiring an HR director.

Sam L. said...

I'm a #1er.

Anonymous said...

Just because FoxNews lets Alan Holmes talk every now and then doesn't mean it is a far-left network. Is Althouse still being sold to advertisers as one of the top conservative blogs in the nation? Follow the money; it will always point you to the answer.

And when people say that Ann is going to vote for Hillary no matter what, does that mean they think Scott Walker won't be on the ticket in 2016?

Rusty said...

None of the above perfessor. I find you entertaining, intellectually stimulating and not too bad on the eyes.

RecChief said...

@Meade,
So she typed those words once. From here, It looks like the same attitude is in most of the posts about same sex marriage. Dismissive about concerns over consequences, which, by the way, I see a NY court just ruled that an Uncle and Niece can marry. Is that unintended consequence of Gay Marriage? I don't care about the frequency of the posts. You said you couldn't see 'the end zone dances and I wanted to kow if you really couldn't see anything construed in that way. On the other hand, I only know Althouse from what I see written here, whereas you live with her.

Anonymous said...

Althouse wrote;

"It's just not true that I feel a pull to vote for the woman,"

Maybe.

But I don't think it's about voting for a woman, like it would be about voting for Burke.

This would be historical. Like the first black president, she would be the first woman president.

I think that is what gets your vote, but you don't realize it. I think that's why you voted for Obama, even though you have reasons you voted against McCain.

"You are remember incorrectly. "

All your base are belong to us.

CStanley said...

@Meade- she admitted that was her attitude one time, but even as she was doing that she said she'd been making that point for a year. What, we weren't supposed to notice?

hombre said...

I don't think it's accurate to characterize you as a "big liberal." "Reflexive liberal," maybe.

It does seem pretty clear that your opinion of conservatism stems less from an interest in classic conservatism than from observing the commentary on your blog which frequently reflects "reflexive" conservatism or libertarianism, my own included.

The people who vilify you for your conservative leanings, or whatever, are the progressives who expect college professors to tow their line.

Anonymous said...

For the past 8 years, up to an including this very day, she has been actively campaigning for Scott Walker, and yet people STILL insist Althouse is a "liberal"?

Precious, simply precious.

Anonymous said...

oops. for the past 4 years. My bad.

tim in vermont said...

For the past 8 years, up to an including this very day, she has been actively campaigning for Scott Walker - madisonfella

Umm, she has been providing a side of the story that one doesn't get from the mainstream media. She has been pointing out some atrocious behavior on the part of the Wisconsin "deep state" which has it in for Walker.

If getting the truth about the whole Walker situation in Wisconsin = "actively campaigning" then great! What does "actively campaigning" for Burke look like? Not pointing out the prosecutorial abuses against Walker?

tim in vermont said...

Is Althouse still being sold to advertisers as one of the top conservative blogs in the nation? Follow the money; it will always point you to the answer. - Madisonfella

Are there ads her on Althouse? I mean besides the importunings to use her Amazon portal?

Do you even think about what you write? You should take a deep breath after you leave Kos or DemocraticUndergound and ask yourself some simple questions before making yourself look like a fool. After all, I checked for ads before writing this.

tim in vermont said...

Oh, you mean that little blogad? That is the price to buy off Althouse's integrity, the revenue from that ad?


I am sure it is in your fever dreams.

Krumhorn said...

Pham's #1 isn't accurate. Our hostess isn't a "big liberal". Nor is she a cock-tease pretending to a view she doesn't really embrace.

Most boomers were classic liberals at one time and many still are, but sometime later decided that contemporary lefties have agendas that are toxic. Still, habits are hard to break, and this is particularly true when environmental factors such as the faculty lounge and Madison, in general, are nothing more than an ideological hothouse that unquestioningly cultivates an emotional embrace of leftie-ness.

I credit Ann with her willingness to articulate the other guy's point reasonably well. In the process, she has broken with the blinkered conventions that contaminate leftie thought.

However, this much, I think is also true about Ann. All things being equal, she'd vote for someone like Ed Koch, a liberal with sanity. Or Patrick Moynihan.

But then, under the right conditions (but not the same conditions), I would too. However, none of that breed currently exists. Today, what we see is all pretty much insane.

- Krumhorn

Henry said...

Anglelyne wrote: I think "retarded" covers it.

Hahahaha! I'll accept that.

Quaestor said...

I'm really surprised that "cock-tease" remark didn't earn Pham a ban.

Maybe Althouse has a night job at Rooster-Rama

tim in vermont said...

I hope Althouse's scheme to get fabulously wealthy as a purveyor of black and white blog ads for, in my case anyway, 1 TB hard drives, a $50 dollar item is working!

I bet she and Glen Beck share sinister chuckles constantly about how rich they are and how few people are smart enough to "follow the money" like madisonfella is.

tim in vermont said...

Men pay good money to "cock-teases" who are really good at it. I don't see it as an insult.

Krumhorn said...

By "stop doing end-zone dances on the topic" do you mean: "stop mentioning the topic"? I'm not being sarcastic, I truly do not see the "end-zone dances".

How about this?

ADDED: This post is just another post in my year-plus effort to convey the message to you old-not-young conservatives: It's over.

http://althouse.blogspot.com/2014/10/scott-walkers-son-acted-as-witness-in.html

And then there was the post that ultimately led to The Meltdown. That was a beaut.

- Krumhorn

Anonymous said...

Are there ads her on Althouse? I mean besides the importunings to use her Amazon portal?

Yes, there are ads beyond the Amazon conduit. The fact that you repeatedly insist there aren't any speaks volumes.

The Conservative Blog Network states they have "over 120 top conservative blogs, from national voices like Althouse and Powerline to regional and local right wing sites."

http://web.blogads.com/advertise/conservative_blog_advertising_network

Are you saying that advertisers are being lied to when they are told that Althouse is one of the top conservative blogs? Do you believe it is false representation to sell this site as such?

Anonymous said...

@Curious Birkel in Vermont:

I never said that she is being paid off by these ads (Tho, the fact that is how your thought process works speaks volumes), rather it is being pointed out that this blog is being sold to advertisers as one of the top conservative voices in the country, while you are insisting she is a lefty liberal libtard.

Both statements can't be correct. So are you wrong or are advertisers being lied to?

toby said...

What a cunt and both the blogger and her husband are.

toby said...

meade fucks cats and dogs

toby said...

where's the house slave, cracker?

toby said...

this used to be a decent blog until these 2 assholes married. one asshole was tolerable.

tim in vermont said...

So you are standing by your claims about the little blog ad?

Bwa ha ha ha!

Follow the money! You said that, "follow the money" that ad probably produces 1.5 cents a view tops.

Keep going, I couldn't ridicule you any better than you are doing to yourself!

tim in vermont said...

Plus it is pretty funny that you seem to think I am some kind of sock puppet. Your unhinged rants about "follow the money" make that kind of stuff even sweeter.

Anonymous said...

So you are standing by your claims about the little blog ad?

I am standing by my claim that there are actual ads on this blog beyond the amazon conduit, which you disputed.

I also stand by my claim that those ads are sold via the Conservative Blog Network, which sells this site as one of the top conservative blogs in the nation. Are you disputing that as well?

tim in vermont said...

So the "Conservative Blog Network"'s advertising claims are your authority?

Follow the money! You will never go wrong!

How did that turn into "swallow the marketing claims of a small internet business whole"?

Anonymous said...

So the "Conservative Blog Network"'s advertising claims are your authority?

Never said they are an authority on the subject, but rather simply pointing out that they are selling this blog as one of the top conservative blogs in the country.

Is it your claim that they are misrepresenting this blog by labeling it as conservative?

Anonymous said...

I'm pretty sure there have been multiple instances of Althouse triumphalism on gay marriage. I'll admit that, like most intensely annoying things, they probably don't happen as often as I remember them happening.

Anthony said...

It is her cruel neutrality that I find most atractive.

Meade said...

Thanks, Paul. You're one of her best commenters and I appreciate your reply to my question.

tim in vermont said...

Is it your claim that they are misrepresenting this blog by labeling it as conservative?

Yes.

This blog tolerates conservatives in a way that most liberal blogs don't, you may be confusing the blog with the comments. If you think this is a conservative blog, you should get out more.

Smalldeadanimals is a conservative blog, so is blazing cat fur which is so conservative Google gives it a content warning.
Lucianne

I could go on, these are not easy to link by hand so I won't.

The point is that this is not a conservative blog, whatever the "conservative blogging network" ad salesmen say.

Steve in Toronto said...

of course we think your a liberal but we still love you

Rusty said...

eric said...
Althouse wrote;

"It's just not true that I feel a pull to vote for the woman,"

Maybe.

But I don't think it's about voting for a woman, like it would be about voting for Burke.

This would be historical. Like the first black president, she would be the first woman president.

I think that is what gets your vote, but you don't realize it. I think that's why you voted for Obama, even though you have reasons you voted against McCain.


Eric. I'm blamin' the menopause so she gets a pass. My brother on the otherhand gets reams of shit from me every time we talk. "About time we had a black president." my ass.

Brian McKim & Traci Skene said...

So, blog readers (or political blog readers) are mostly white and mostly male. What does that say about blogs? What does that say about the habit of reading and commenting on blogs? And why must it say something negative? (As seems to be the implication whenever any activity is engaged by mostly white males.) And what does that say, if anything, about those who don't engage in such activities? And could it possibly be a negative thing that all those folks who aren't white males don't read political/cultural commentary blogs? Why is the opposite always implied? Are the habitual readers of Jezebel more virtuous? (I think we know the answer to that question.)

Kirk Parker said...


"but she had some good reasons not to vote for McCain..."

Every single person in the country had good reasons not to vote for McCain... but there was one reason to vote FOR him that trumped all the rest: he was running against total-empty-slate-poseur Obama.

Meade said...

You guys need to consider easing up on her.

McCain never once led in Wisconsin polls in 2008 where Obama ended up beating him by 6%. If I had been registered to vote in Wisconsin in 2008, I likely would have voted for Obama over the "lesser evil" McCain.

That was 2008 guys. It hasn't been 2008 for nearly 6 years. Let's move forward, shall we? I mean, would it kill you to scratch up a little charity while eschewing the malice? How about giving her a little credit for striving to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation's wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations?

Really. Would it?

Anthony said...

@Meade -- not really -- I want to her to stick to cruel neutrality.

Meade said...

Now that's the spirit!

Kirk Parker said...

Meade,

I take "it's over" in the same sense that Orwell did here:

"Consequently there was a long period during which nearly every thinking man was in some sense a rebel, and usually a quite irresponsible rebel. Literature was largely the literature of revolt or of disintegration. Gibbon, Voltaire, Rousseau, Shelley, Byron, Dickens, Stendhal, Samuel Butler, Ibsen, Zola, Flaubert, Shaw, Joyce — in one way or another they are all of them destroyers, wreckers, saboteurs. For two hundred years we had sawed and sawed and sawed at the branch we were sitting on. And in the end, much more suddenly than anyone had foreseen, our efforts were rewarded, and down we came. But unfortunately there had been a little mistake. The thing at the bottom was not a bed of roses after all, it was a cesspool full of barbed wire."

From Notes On The Way.

Meade said...

Kirk,

As you appeal to the authority of Orwell's genius, remember that 9 years after writing Notes On The Way, Orwell developed a notebook known as "Orwell's List". It was a contribution of his to the collective effort to push back post-war communism.

Fine with me — push back communism. Particularly Sovietism.

But that List also reflected what seems to have been Orwell's willingness to let first drop into that "cesspool full of barbed wire" — Jews, blacks, and homosexuals.

chickelit said...

But that List also reflected what seems to have been Orwell's willingness to let first drop into that "cesspool full of barbed wire" — Jews, blacks, and homosexuals.

News to me. Cite please!

Meade said...

And I suggest you take "it's over" in the same sense as I think was meant by the blogger — the power to use the law to repress the equal rights of same-sex oriented Americans "is over". Whether you choose to continue fighting that particular culture war or you choose to accept the new national order, you simply do not have numbers.

She wasn't saying your traditional religious values must be abandoned but that American politics have most likely changed permanently and it is now time to move on, to fight — winnable — political battles.

And then, on this blog, all hell broke loose.

Kirk Parker said...

"the power to use the law to repress the equal rights of same-sex oriented Americans 'is over'".

Some of us completely deny that this is what the same-sex marriage fight was about. Surely you know that.

Meade said...

"News to me. Cite please!"

Google "Orwell's List". Knock yourself out.

chickelit said...

Meade, you're quoting/paraphrasing Alexander Cockburn. link

Shame on you and may you too feel a burning sensation.

Meade said...

Shaming is what many lefty/Progs here in Madison engage in. It's part of what Orwell called goodthink. Not unlike your echo chamber over there at Lem's where you have Dolan and Haz, Spinelli and Fox and others serving as your thoughtpol who help keep you free and safe from thoughtcrimes aka, independent thinking.