July 24, 2014

"Yes, it is important for girls to present themselves in ways that don't spotlight their sexuality..."

"... but from a feminist perspective, it is equally important for young ladies to not see overt displays of sexuality as a sign of a deviant personality."

Interestingly the same and simultaneously different, from the same article: "Women can't get ahead no matter what they do, and this is a society where women who are sexual (or present themselves sexually) are judged. But on the flip side, women who don't take enough care in their appearance, who dress sloppily, who don't fit the required metric of how women should look, are also criticized."

I think this idea of not judging is overstated. It seems to me that anyone — male or female — who tries to look sexy in social media photographs is going to get mocked. Males, perhaps, even more than females.

If this mockery were somehow silenced — and, really, how could that happen? — I can't imagine how idiotic the photographs would get.

37 comments:

Gahrie said...

this is a society where women who are sexual (or present themselves sexually) are judged. But on the flip side, women who don't take enough care in their appearance, who dress sloppily, who don't fit the required metric of how women should look, are also criticized."

Correct as far as it goes, but somehow the last three words of the quote got cut off. The quote should end with the four words mainly by other women.

Moose said...

What's amusing about this, is that the more our society "evolves" (ie more socially conscious - which I find to be PC BS) the idea of existing outside of what you appear to be in other people's eyes - take Ann's constant "men in shorts" watch, seems to be harder. This seems to take on toxic overtones in particular with women who cannot seem to exist outside of the how other's perceive them. That has not seemingly been such a male trait in the past, but is becoming moreso now.

Anglelyne said...

"...it is equally important for young ladies to not see overt displays of sexuality as a sign of a deviant personality".

One man's overt is another man's pervert.


I don't think all overt "displays of sexuality" in inappropriate venues are deviant. Sometimes they're just tacky.

MRG said...

Oregon State University researchers asked 118 young women to judge...

Nonapod said...

We are a heavily visually oriented species. As such, a large part of our interactions amongst each other are governed by and/or influenced by appearance. Its so hard coded into us that it seems like a near impossible task to force people to not at least partially judge their fellow humans based on outer appearance initially.

Lyssa said...

on the flip side, women who don't take enough care in their appearance, who dress sloppily, who don't fit the required metric of how women should look, are also criticized."

Is this really the flip side of presenting yourself sexually? I would say that the appearance that I adopt for work, that most women with any professionalism adopt for work and most other things, is neither of these. How is sexual the opposite of sloppy?

Also, for gods, sake, why are feminists so concerned about being judged? I am woman, hear me roar, but only if others approve?

gerry said...

The quote should end with the four words mainly by other women.

Bingo.

Ralph Hyatt said...

That was some weapons grade stupid.

"There's a larger issue at play here that goes beyond bullying and unkind judgements, she contends. "Women and girls are being judged on how they look, not who they are."

Everyone is judged by how they look, especially if that is all you know about someone.

Additionally, how you choose to present yourself is a function of who you are and of how you want people to perceive you.

The problem is that before social media you could present the version of yourself that you wished to present depending on the situation.

Now, if you use social media, that is not so straight forward. If you choose to post a picture of yourself acting or dressing in a way that would be inappropriate at work, your boss or coworkers may see it and it is going to color their perception of you.

Human beings are like that. Since we can't read minds we pretty much have to use your actions and appearance to form judgments concerning you.

And by the way, how you act and appear is the real you. I don't really care about your deep thoughts and feelings. As far as I'm concerned, your actions define you.

Witness said...

This just in: researchers asked women to judge some images. Those in the images were judged.

The Elder said...

Nothing seems to to be more fun for females than to pass judgment on how other females present themselves.

robinintn said...

"Women can't get ahead no matter what they do,..." Is the author writing from Mosul?

Alex said...

They want to have it both ways.

They say to men - "Don't judge me on my looks, but when I dress up all sexy don't you dare whistle or look at me either".

Is it any wonder new marriages are at an all time low?

Men - steer FAR and WIDE of today's "emancipated" woman.

mccullough said...

The feminists have already silenced the mockers. There would be no feminism if they hadn't. It's now just white dim it's mocking each other

Matthew Sablan said...

Men are also judged on how they look. I can guarantee you I got orders of magnitude better service when I walk into a store right after work still wearing my jacket and tie than if I've untucked and unbuttoned my work shirt and taken off my tie and jacket.

If I know I'm going to be stopping at my leasing office or a store where I have to deal with sales people, I make sure to leave my jacket and tie on, because I know I'll be treated differently.

rhhardin said...

Girls don't have sexuality alone.

It takes guys wired to be attracted before it's anything but gross biology on the part of the girls.

Matthew Sablan said...

As for the judging women: I think, for the most part, women who dress professional don't really register as sexual/asexual. Honestly, for the most part, women where I work are dressed professionally and in ways that don't stand out as looking for attention. I know I've heard people being very critical of some outfits, but they tend to be of women that the judger already didn't like.

rhhardin said...

The Ohio State University band director was fired for creating a hostile work environment, breaking news.

The band schedule will continue unaffected.

Apparently there was hanky panky within the band.

Title IX is involved.

I'd guess the flute section was the problem.

Unknown said...

There is a "normal" and there is deviation from the norm. That' snot a judgment, that' just a fact. If your behavior places you in a category outside normal behavior, you are acting abnormally.

What's the objection? All behavior ought to be accepted without reservation or disregarded when deciding to interact, hire, or get acquainted with someone?

What's the alternative? Everybody ought to act however at all times without regard to what is normal behavior?

I am puzzled.

Anthony said...

This just in: feminists unable to conceive of any options other than dressing like a ho and dressing like a slob.

Anonymous said...

Imagine a judgment-free world. No autonomy. Absolute equality. Harmony between the earth mother and the pure democratic People's coalitions.

It's easy if you try.

CatherineM said...

Like an Anthony Weiner pic? Flexing his...muscles?

n.n said...

The Goldie Locks paradox. They need to simultaneously appeal to both dignified and slutty women. The pornography industry has demonstrated you can have your cake and eat it too, but only when there are overlapping or convergent interests. Progressive morality is not a generational phenomenon, but of a rebellious minority with deviant personalities.

David said...

Women are judged on how they look mainly because nature made it that way. Nobody has to teach a man to respond to an attractive woman. How and when that response should be expressed are learned social skills, but the response is biologically innate.

Since men are "born that way" they should not be criticized for this, right?

In any event while women (just like men!) are judged on their sexual appeal, that is not all they are judged upon. No doubt sexual appeal can be a boost, but staged displays of that appeal in the wrong context can result in negative judgments for men or women.

I spent six hours today in a business meeting with several women, none of whom would rank very high on the sexual attractiveness scale (at least conventionally. Your results may vary.) Most of them I already knew well. Two are respected leaders in our organization, two less senior.) All four were judged by me and I judged them very highly. They were great, and I told their boss that after the meeting.

I do tend to judge people who are prone to complaint, whiny, self centered or unrealistic in their expectations. It does seem to me that women (and men) who put sexy photos of themselves on Facebook are seeking to be judged based on sex. If they think they will not be judged that way they are unrealistic. If they whine and complain about it (or about someone else being so judged) I do indeed find them less competent.

Mountain Maven said...

Parents: Raise your daughters to be dignified women. Raise your sons to be dignified men.

Peter said...


OK so you do something, then you display what you've done on social media. And then others view it, and you don't like their reactions.

Even though you totally control what you show and how you show it, you find you just can't control how others react to what you've chosen to show them? Why, that's totally unfair!

Freedom for me but not for thee, that's the ticket! I should have the right to act publicly in any way that pleases me, and you should have only the right to STFU.

Now do you understand? (Spoken loudly if petulantly, while stomping foot).

Carol said...

Raise your sons to be dignified men.

No, "dignity" is something the government gives you.

Lucien said...

So the study that this was based on supports the proposition that people apparently lacking the self-awareness and introspection needed to consider that posting overtly sexualized images of themselves on social media might reflect poorly on them are judged less competent than those who do possess such self-awareness.

How is that news?

buwaya said...

This is another front for the liberation war !
All social norms have been trumped, none can any longer be defended. If they have not yet been shamed out of existence, its just a matter of time.

Since no social standards apply, any objection to or judgement of anyone on grounds of appearance is just a pathetic holdover from childhood miseducation. As most things are.

Gahrie said...

What's the alternative? Everybody ought to act however at all times without regard to what is normal behavior?

The whole point is destroy the idea of "normal" and replace it with "anything goes".

buwaya said...

There is no such thing as dignity anymore. Its an obsolete concept.
Ask Titus. He has been a prophet in this respect, as in so many others.

bgates said...

this is a society where women who are sexual (or present themselves sexually) are judged

Ah, it's one of those societies with human beings in it, eh?

The pornography industry has demonstrated you can have your cake and eat it too

That's generally referred to as pie.

I Have Misplaced My Pants said...

I live in a smallish town where everyone knows everyone.

A young woman who graduated college this last spring began teaching at the local Christian elementary school.

Her Facebook page--which she has set on totally public--has tons of pictures of her partying at the Frio with floating coolers of beer in a teeny tiny bikini showing off all her "lovely" tattoos.

I have no objection to any of those activities (they're not for me but different strokes for different folks) but you'd think that someone hired to teach second grade at a Baptist school would have a little more discretion than that. Most teachers I know have two Facebook accounts.

Zach said...

A new study found that people with sexy photos on their social media profiles are often judged as less competent than those who post more conservative snapshots of themselves.

Helpful tip: whenever a news story says "a new study finds", substitute "a new study pretends to but did not actually find". You will very seldom be wrong.

A second tip: be very, very skeptical of any study that is only publishable if they get a positive result. If the "new study" did not find this result, would you ever read about it?

The whole genre of "give five minute quizzes to undergraduates"should be viewed with deep suspicion. The sample sizes aren't big, the effects aren't big, and only positive results are publishable.

Well constructed scientific papers are supposed to resolve an issue, not generate headlines.

Paul said...

"Women and girls are being judged on how they look, not who they are."

Oh feminists you so crazy!

And stupid.

How they look determines their value in the sexual marketplace, which is a huge chunk of who they are, like it or not. A beautiful, feminine woman has power that a homely woman does not. A woman's looks are her most valuable attribute!

This goes straight to our biological core, and all the juvenile ranting of the feminist crowd, the vast majority of which are disgruntled because they are NOT beautiful and feminine will never change this fact.

Fernandinande said...

Nigerian schoolgirls still missing, amidst fears of sexual abuse - One hundred days have passed since Boko Haram kidnapped the Chibok schoolgirls, and now some fear that they may have been raped while under the custody of the northern Nigerian militants.

"The perils of sexy Facebook pictures", no doubt.

The Crack Emcee said...

"I can't imagine how idiotic the photographs would get"

As idiotic as the people,...

ken in sc said...

The admonition to not judge a book by it's cover is supposed to discourage you from thinking a good cover means a good book. However, no one has ever claimed that a crappy cover means a good book. Try to look good.