March 8, 2014

"It's not just a city of gay men. It belongs to heterosexual people as well."

Says the gay male city councilman as he votes to take down the rainbow flag over city hall in West Hollywood....
Another flashpoint is the strip of gay bars along Santa Monica Boulevard. Some residents and merchants wanted to officially designate the area — the site of numerous gay rights protests and AIDS vigils — as "Boystown," long a colloquial reference to the nightlife scene there. But city leaders balked at the idea, saying they felt the name was too narrow.

"Boystown failed … because the lesbian community, the female community and people who are not LGBT felt excluded, which is understandable," said Robert Gamboa, co-chair of the city's Lesbian and Gay Advisory Board.

There also has been much debate about the annual L.A. Pride celebration, when Santa Monica Boulevard is taken over by rainbow-colored floats and wild costumes. The parade started as a political statement about gay pride and unity. But these days, there are complaints that the parade has become more about corporate sponsorship and partying than about the civil rights message.
Inclusivity strikes back.

44 comments:

The Crack Emcee said...

"Inclusivity strikes back."


Cool. In a few years, gays will have no place to go again.

Somehow, ignoring history never seems to work out the way you planned,...

Michael K said...

The "gay lifestyle" is about partying. Why deny it ?

Ann Althouse said...

You see the people who are out partying. You don't see all the people who stay home. It's like… maybe my university is a big party school, but what percent of the students are really partying on any given weekend night? I'll bet it's less than half. Most people stay home or do things alone or with one or 2 close friends, I will bet. If you've got a city known for its night life, it's a magnet for a lot of people, but that doesn't mean that they will all go out night after night. Obviously, a lot of gay men will want to live in West Hollywood, if they are choosing where they want to live. It might be the best place in the country for a gay man. That doesn't mean they share a "life style" and that it is partying.

What's the heterosexual male lifestyle? One could purvey a lot of stereotypes about that. But they would be denigrating.

The Cracker Emcee said...

"What's the heterosexual male lifestyle? One could purvey a lot of stereotypes about that. But they would be denigrating."

And, odds are, you wouldn't come close to getting it right.

PB Reader said...

Diversity and inclusion - the modern-day separate but equal. People must align with their group and all groups must be included in everything. God help those who want to pursue an independent path - they must be shamed!

Progress!

The Crack Emcee said...

This Michael K guy is a trip,...

Paul said...

I'm more than happy to be excluded from "Boystown".

As much as Titus is grossed out by the thought of fatties copulating I am doubly grossed out at the thought of two men engaged in sexual activity.

And before you fascists scream homophobe I don't fear fags, and I don't care what consenting adults do in the privacy of their homes, but I find gay sex repulsive.

madAsHell said...

If the gays didn't party, then we'd have to call them something else....like....ummm.....I dunno.... party pooper?

Michael K said...

"That doesn't mean they share a "life style" and that it is partying. "

Reading comprehension again.

"The "gay lifestyle" is about partying. Why deny it ?"

Try again.

I lost quite a few friends to AIDS in the 80s. How do you think they got it ?

I did see one patient, a nuclear engineer, who could not believe he had AIDS when I told him. He said, "That can't be. I've been in a committed relationship for ten years !"

You may not be into partying but partying may be into you, or your partner.

I'm doing a lot of Nietzsche today.

furious_a said...

"Boystown"

That's also the nickname for the whorehouse districts in Mexican border cities.

chickenlittle said...

West Hollywood played host to the parasites who lynched Sarah Palin in effigy, until some civic minded people got together and asked them to take it down.

R. Chatt said...

Lots of people think that democracy means majority rules so all you have to do is create an enclave of like minded people and then you can impose your own rules.

But Isn't the genius of our political system that we always preserve the equal rights of the minority? That American value is being upheld as well in the largely gay neighborhood. They may be gay but they are also Americans.

jr565 said...

Boystown and not Manstown?

jr565 said...

Or mentown? Or BoyztoMen town?

Chuck said...

The immortal, unforgettable story from The Onion on the Gay Pride parade in -- you guessed it -- West Hollywood:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/gaypride-parade-sets-mainstream-acceptance-of-gays,351/

Anonymous said...

I used to live near there. It's changed a lot, but also when I visit now, naked of previous ambition, it's like being able to see only the scaffolding of a set. Creepy.

If I were a gay guy, I wouldn't consider it the best place to live simply because LA at large isn't all that hospitable no matter who you are. You'd have to be crazy to be het and raise kids there.



Anonymous said...

Also a lot of gay male lifestyle is now online - grindr or whatever is the current thing. There isn't as much demand for 3-D community.

somefeller said...

Maybe they can put up billboards with photos of Vladimir Putin wrestling a bear with his shirt off. That might make conservatives feel more welcome in the neighborhood.

chickenlittle said...

Maybe they can put up billboards with photos of Vladimir Putin wrestling a bear with his shirt off. That might make conservatives feel more welcome in the neighborhood.

Not a Putin lover here. But since Putin disputin' emanates most strongly from the usual gaystapo types, I can't help but wonder if it isn't tied to those laws he signed off on several months ago. We saw the scold again during the Syrian crisis, during Sochi, and again now.

It's not all about you, guys.

SGT Ted said...

It just shows that they are now mainstream and normal.

jr565 said...

"Maybe they can put up billboards with photos of Vladimir Putin wrestling a bear with his shirt off. That might make conservatives feel more welcome in the neighborhood."

When you have nothing else to say about Obama's feckless policy I guess theres nowhere to go but attack the opposition.

jr565 said...

It's ok, somefeller, you can be honest about Obamas foreign policy. Worst since Jimmy Carter. One of the first steps in recovery is admitting there's a problem.

Titus said...

I would never live in populated by a huge gay population.

Boston has lots but it has lots more of other people which I like.

I don't like overtly political symbols anywhere including government buildings or statehouses.

The = bumpersticker bums me too but if know one is in the car I know if it is a dyke or fag by the car-suberu-dyke; bmw-fag.

Chick can't get enough of that fucking Palin story...you forgot the link with the pic underemployed.

jacksonjay said...

...photos of Vladimir Putin wrestling a bear with his shirt off.

How about photos of that gay police choir singing the hits!

Titus said...

And there is a Boystown (dreadful name) already in Chicago.

Titus said...

chicks' cracker emcee too. Nice passive/aggressive undermployed chirber

B said...

The straights are appropriating West Hollywood.

Carol said...

from the Onion link: "The parade, organized by the Los Angeles Gay And Lesbian And Bisexual And Transvestite And Transgender Alliance (LAGALABATATA)...'"

Heh.

Stephen said...

Is it okay that because I'm gay I feel the right to say nasty things about "my kind"? I don't know. Maybe Althouse will have something to say about that.

Anyway.....This "boystown" business is such a crock of shit. It really saddens me that my fellow gays have become such fascist assholes that they would ever even dare to claim any part of anywhere "boystown". I always thought the goal was freedom, not exclusivity.

P.S. For what it's worth, visible gay culture is indeed about partying and having sex like it's the last night on earth. But at least half--if not the outright majority--of gays really don't partake in that kind of scene at all. FYI.

Stephen said...

Also, I think trannies are weird. Does that make me a racist?

Scott said...

I prefer automatic trannies to manual. But I wish I had waited for another year to buy my Forester, since they now have CVT.

Marshal said...

somefeller said...
Maybe they can put up billboards with photos of Vladimir Putin wrestling a bear with his shirt off. That might make conservatives feel more welcome in the neighborhood.


Still waiting for somefeller to have an original or intelligent thought. For most people the expectation is both, but for some you have to set goals in stages or the challenge seems insurmountable.

somefeller said...

Marshal haz a sad.

Drago said...

AA: "What's the heterosexual male lifestyle? One could purvey a lot of stereotypes about that. But they would be denigrating."

Well, that's interesting.

In your solution set of heterosexual male lifestyles, you would be unable to conceive of one that would not be denigrating?

n.n said...

SGT Ted:

How old are you? Every behavior is "normal". That's why people invented morality. So we don't abort and rape each other. So that we distinguish between behaviors which must be rejected, can be tolerated, and are suitable for normalization.

While homosexual behavior is "normal", it is also antithetical to evolutionary fitness. Of course, with the normalization of abortion, contraception, promiscuity, etc., the only objective standards are those set through coercion, physical, mandated, or democratic.

This is what people don't seem to understand. Homosexual behavior is "normal". However, so is every other behavior, no matter how dysfunctional. These behaviors were de-"normalized" by decent people, people who appreciated the terms and circumstances of reality, in response to and in an effort to prevent a recurring dysfunctional convergence.

Anyway, just do what feels good.

Anonymous said...

No denigration involved the motto around the gay bar and club district in my town is, "fuck, suck and run amok".

Ann Althouse said...

"In your solution set of heterosexual male lifestyles, you would be unable to conceive of one that would not be denigrating?"

I think stereotyping is denigrating. That's my point. I could do positive or negative stereotypes for any group. It's quite easy to do.

Moneyrunner said...

Demonstrating the Althouse is not on the the cutting edge, the old homosexual vs. hetero sexual dichotomy is so 1990s. I'm surprised that the multiple sexual arrangers in Madison have not set her straight. Wait, did I just say straight?

Drago said...

Ann: "I think stereotyping is denigrating. That's my point. I could do positive or negative stereotypes for any group. It's quite easy to do"

Well, isn't "stereotyping" simply what every marketer and creator of a "message" do every day of the week?

One needs to understand the audience segments and how to reach them effectively with an effective message.

To do that, we have to "stereotype".

To be more precise, "stereotyping" in my mind is acceptable as long as you create a sufficient number of subgroups to "accurately" distinguish those subgroups from others.

If I am sufficiently granular in my "stereotype" why would that be wrong?

What makes a "stereotype" wrong is when it is applied in an overly broad way.

For instance, if I was to assert that all dixiecrats became republicans, that would be an example of wrongheaded stereotyping.

Likewise, if I were to call someone who holds the same position on homosexual marriage ss barack obama did until last year a "bigot", that might easily be characterized as an overly broad stereotype.

Michael K said...

"P.S. For what it's worth, visible gay culture is indeed about partying and having sex like it's the last night on earth. But at least half--if not the outright majority--of gays really don't partake in that kind of scene at all. FYI."

Most of the latter are older and most are at risk only by slips into the party mode. The point of the "gay communities" these days is partying. Nobody cares anymore what you do in your bedroom, except, of course, Obama.

I had two good friends, both excellent docs, who moved to Laguna Beach from LA for the "gay lifestyle." As the second one was dying, blind from Cytomegalovirus retinitis or herpes, he was still bragging about the fun they had had. They even knew "Patient Zero."

RecChief said...

speaking of inclusivity, isn't West Hollywood where that bar that excludes people who vote against gay marriage is located? diversity, but not of thought

SGT Ted said...

How old are you? Every behavior is "normal".

I am 51 years old.

My point is that the gays are clinging to their victim and ghetto mentality, when the rest of the LA area just considers gays normal, thus the corporate sponsorships of the gay pride whatever, leaving the "revolutionaries" behind, griping that it isn't about civil rights anymore, but instead has evolved into just another American party time.

Your "evolutionary fitness" pretense to science idiocy fails to note that, despite possibly millions of years of human evolution, all human societies produce gay offspring and subcultures and you seem to fail to account for that within your own attempt at a logical framework that girds your morality.

"Evolutionary fitness' does NOT necessarily correspond to any human notions of what is logical or moral. That's your fatal error.

What you are objecting to really is the promiscuity that is rampant in ghettoized gay culture, largely in response to their being excluded from mainstream culture, that results in public health problems, such as HIV/AIDS and other sexually transmitted disease vectors running wild in the population.

The "moral" lesson is sexual restraint and monogamy, not anti-homosexuality.

Marshal said...

somefeller said...
Marshal haz a sad.


More accurately I have a disappointment. Not with somefeller or the left generally because disappointment requires an unmet expectation. And no rational person has an expection of intelligence or decency of either.

But I'm disappointed in America. Even our useless castoffs should be better then somefeller. We're letting them drag us down.

jr565 said...

recchief wrote:
speaking of inclusivity, isn't West Hollywood where that bar that excludes people who vote against gay marriage is located? diversity, but not of thought

Tie that back into the issue of the Arizona laws. Are gay people supportive of establishments not serving people who believe a certain way?
The same person who wouldn't bake a cake wouldn't be served in this establishment,no? So then by the same token we should be OUTRAGED at the rampant exclusion taking place.
But my guess is, many gays would welcome this exclusion because, after all, those people hate gays and are mean nasty bigots.