Althouse: At the Ice Dog Café...

January 20, 2013

At the Ice Dog Café...

... do you know what you're doing?

64 comments:

Unknown said...: I'm surprised at how tense that made me.; 1/20/13, 1:35 PM
Sorun said...: I'd be nervous too. If he did fall through, or ran off the edge of the ice, how does he climb back on?; 1/20/13, 1:50 PM
chickelit said...: Careful there Meade. The video reminds me of a day long ago at Lake Mendota's Marshall Park and also of a youthful George Bailey.

My brother, my dad and I were there with our dog Sam. She ran all around on the ice sniffing at ice fishing holes and such when suddenly she broke through and bobbed up immediately. She tried to get herself out several times but each time the ice edge would break and she fell back into the water. I was transfixed and horrified. She tried getting out several times struggled for what seemed like an eternity but couldn't make it on her own, all the while weakening.

Luckily, my dad had some rope in the car and he tied it around the waist of my older brother and had him inch out on his belly towards her, slowly so as not to fall through himself. The water was deep there because it was a dredged lagoon. He finally got to her in time and was able to pull the dog up and out to safety without falling through himself.; 1/20/13, 1:54 PM
kentuckyliz said...: Me too. People have died trying to rescue dogs who have fallen through the ice.; 1/20/13, 1:54 PM
NitneLiun said...: I'd be nervous too. If he did fall through, or ran off the edge of the ice, how does he climb back on?

He doesn't. It was irresponsible to let him go out on the ice.; 1/20/13, 2:06 PM
Meade said...: Just in case, always carry these.; 1/20/13, 2:09 PM
Palladian said...: I am still advocating that Zeus get his own tag!; 1/20/13, 2:15 PM
rhhardin said...: I don't see how you rescue him.; 1/20/13, 2:31 PM
Rosalyn C. said...: So would Meade have gone into the water to rescue Zeus? And then claw your way out with the ice picks? How would you lift a dog that size over your head while you are treading water? Or sent Ann out with a rope tied around her waist? Glad we didn't have to find out.; 1/20/13, 2:54 PM
rehajm said...: That's a rented dog, you know...; 1/20/13, 2:56 PM
edutcher said...: Get that poor pup a towel and a blanket.

And a Saint Barnyard and some brandy.

You guys are awfully philosophical with somebody else's dog.; 1/20/13, 3:02 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: So....when the dog falls through the ice and begins to drown from hypothermia...which one of you is planning to try to sacrifice your own life? Or do you just plan to stand there and squeal, wring your hands and continue to film Zeus' last feeble struggles to survive.

I can't believe how incredibly stupid and irresponsible it was to allow him to go out on the ice.

I have seen hunting dogs drown and nearly drown in similar circumstances through their owner's irresponsible actions. I have known people who have died trying to rescue their dog from dangerous situations that THEY either put the dog into or didn't have enough discipline over the dog to prevent. Watching a dog struggle and die while you are helpless to stop it is horrific. It is something you will NEVER forget.; 1/20/13, 3:02 PM
Meade said...: R. Chatt, yes, yes, carefully, no, and yes.; 1/20/13, 3:03 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: Just in case, always carry these.

AAAAAAND.....just like some sick carnival barker Meade hawks some useless piece of crap on the internet so they can scrabble up some more pennies.

Sick and disgusting; 1/20/13, 3:04 PM
alan markus said...: Another good thing to carry would be a cellphone and the hope that the locals do animal rescues:

Dog Falls Through Ice, Owners Say Sheriff Should Have Sent Deputy; 1/20/13, 3:05 PM
Freeman Hunt said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 1/20/13, 3:07 PM
Freeman Hunt said...: People are really into dogs around here. I'm not knocking it. Just making note of it.; 1/20/13, 3:08 PM
Freeman Hunt said...: This comment has been removed by the author.; 1/20/13, 3:09 PM
Wince said...: It was irresponsible to let him go out on the ice.

"I have only five words for you: From my cold dead paws!"; 1/20/13, 3:10 PM
Wince said...: Freeman Hunt said...
People are really into dogs around here. I'm not knocking it. Just making note of it.

Read some of the comments at this HuffPo article:

Dog Frozen In Block Of Ice Found On Man's Lawn In Canada (GRAPHIC PHOTO); 1/20/13, 3:13 PM
SayAahh said...: Do you know what you are doing?

Answer: Absolutely NOT!

We live on the lake. We have had many great black labs. We DO NOT LET OUR LABS OUT ON THE ICE!

Irresponsible behavior at the minimum.

I am surprised and dismayed to see this video. You should be embarrassed to display your poor judgment.

And then throw a ball to put the retriever instinct above common sense and safety?

Whoa!; 1/20/13, 3:27 PM
vza said...: Sorry folks, that was irresponsible!

"Last night a spokesman for the Royal Society for the Prevention of Accidents said pet owners should never try to rescue them from frozen rivers."

"He said: ‘Our advice is to put a dog on a lead if it will be going near frozen water, and not to throw things like sticks or balls."

‘If a dog does end up in the water, then however hard it may be, do not go onto the ice after it, as you will be putting your life at risk as well as the dog.’

"Earlier this month, a 49-year-old father-of-two, Philip Smith,from Lancaster, died after slipping into the icy River Lune at Halton while trying to rescue his cocker spaniel."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1336450/Dog-owner-nearly-died-trying-save-Labrador-frozen-lake-Lancashire.html; 1/20/13, 3:28 PM
Chip Ahoy said...: I wonder what he was smelling out there on the ice surface. Too bad he's not a retriever, you could tell him to bring it to you.

And those swans worry me too. Some Canadian geese became stuck in ice when it froze through their feet. They were stuck there, sitting ducks, as it were, for any roaming k-9 or predator like adolescent boy. But then impossible to help out. I forget how they resolved it, if they even did. That was on a small pond associated with a condominium.; 1/20/13, 3:30 PM
Meade said...: The edit makes it look dicey when it really wasn't. The ice was thick, I walked where Zeus walked, and there were people ice fishing much farther from shore. I wasn't reckless or careless. Thanks for your concern.; 1/20/13, 3:31 PM
Rosalyn C. said...: Meade, what concerned me but I didn't want to say, was that the risk of hypothermia might have made the rescue highly risky. So I feel better knowing that the ice was actually solid in that area. Despite your good intentions and abilities, if you did have to get into the water the cold would quickly diminish your capacities.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothermia:
Heat is lost more quickly in water[18] than on land. Water temperatures that would be quite reasonable as outdoor air temperatures can lead to hypothermia. A water temperature of 10 °C (50 °F) often leads to death in one hour, and water temperatures hovering at freezing can lead to death in as little as 15 minutes.[32] A notable example of this occurred during the sinking of the Titanic, in which most people who entered the −2 °C (28 °F) water died within 15–30 minutes.[33]; 1/20/13, 4:44 PM
rhhardin said...: You can make spaghetti in a rice cooker, I just discovered.; 1/20/13, 4:53 PM
chickelit said...: I don't think Meade is a risk taker and so Zeus was never in any real danger.; 1/20/13, 4:54 PM
Ned said...: Dumb ass...; 1/20/13, 5:11 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: I don't think Meade is a risk taker and so Zeus was never in any real danger.

.....of being rescued.

The voice over reminded me of those nutless metro sexual dads and equally ineffectual moms trying to wheedle, reason and cajole their monstrous little kiddies instead of having some control and discipline. Trying to be analytical and to rationalize with a child or a dog. (Don't even bother trying to do that with a cat. Even more of a waste of time than with the dog)

"Come on Bobby, don't set the cat on fire [again]. That isn't nice and we do want to be nice don't we?" You can hear the pleading in their voices.

"Susie, big girls don't scream and throw things in the restaurant. Wouldn't you like to eat these? Oh no, please don't throw them on the floor." while the rest of us in the restaurant want to not only strangle your brat but beat the living shit out of you for not having any control and spoiling the evening for everyone else. Man UP. Grow some nads. Stop being such a wimpy parent. Take control... DAMN IT.

"Do you know what you are doing?" as little Jimmy is breaking things, running out into traffic, pulling on the dogs ears....or any multitude of rude or dangerous activities.

Then they wonder just why no one listens to them. Why their kids turn out to be such fuck ups and end up shooting people in the school or movie theatre.; 1/20/13, 5:12 PM
Penny said...: So for Sunday fun, Meade likes to PUNK his dog-loving commenters while Althouse goes along for the ride.

That's sick, man.; 1/20/13, 5:28 PM
Ann Althouse said...: I guess my editing and narration were a little too exciting. Seriously, get a grip people!; 1/20/13, 5:30 PM
test said...: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/17/kathy-mabry-murder-steven-hayne-michael-west_n_2456970.html

Unbelievably compelling article by Radley Balko. It's disappointing to see even a small part of America fail so completely. So many people and institutions have to fail concurrently for this to happen. I wish I could believe it won't happen again. But it will, because institutions protect themselves.; 1/20/13, 5:32 PM
Clare said...: Q - "Should we be letting him do that?"
A - Only if you're willing to rescue him when he falls through.; 1/20/13, 5:34 PM
Tim said...: Niners.

Wow.; 1/20/13, 5:49 PM
Anonymous said...: Ha! And they said I was a scold.; 1/20/13, 5:49 PM
AHL said...: Althouse said: "... do you know what you're doing?"

I need to read a chapter from "Richard Strauss: Die Sinfonishcen Dichtungen." I haven't had a German class in five years. I hope I know what I am doing.; 1/20/13, 5:56 PM
Meade said...: Who said you were a scold, Inga?; 1/20/13, 6:07 PM
Anonymous said...: Meade, some commenters, I'm not naming names.; 1/20/13, 6:08 PM
Anonymous said...: I'm not a tattletail.; 1/20/13, 6:10 PM
Anonymous said...: Tattletale,lol.; 1/20/13, 6:10 PM
edutcher said...: Ann Althouse said...

I guess my editing and narration were a little too exciting. Seriously, get a grip people!

We take you at your word, Madame.

But everybody gets spanked at Althouse, no?; 1/20/13, 6:11 PM
Meade said...: Tim, quite a comeback! Thrilling ending with the stop and then almost losing control of the clock. Here's hoping the coach brothers face off in the big one.; 1/20/13, 6:19 PM
Ann Althouse said...: Let's talk about football and not this morbid fear of ice!; 1/20/13, 6:40 PM
David said...: It's very dangerous.

I had a dog that drowned after falling through the ice on Lake Michigan.; 1/20/13, 6:41 PM
David said...: It's very dangerous.

I had a dog that drowned after falling through the ice on Lake Michigan.

Meade, you are a great guy but I think you are wrong on this one. There can be unanticipated areas of weakness in lake ice.; 1/20/13, 6:46 PM
Meade said...: David, the feeling is mutual and I'm sorry you lost your dog. I do appreciate everyone's concerns and advice. I will continue to check the thickness and stability of ice before allowing dogs in my care to go onto to it.; 1/20/13, 6:51 PM
Unknown said...: Sorry if I got the comments off on the wrong foot.; 1/20/13, 7:17 PM
Penny said...: Cool, now we need to be reminded that it's OUR overreaction to Althouse's "superior skills" in helping her man set the scene to PUNK us.

Assuming it was Meade's idea?

Anyway, the only thing I know for sure is that Zeus isn't the "Ice Dog" in this cafe.

Looks like Zeus will have to wait a little longer for his tag, Palladian.; 1/20/13, 7:17 PM
chickelit said...: There can be unanticipated areas of weakness in lake ice.

Ice can be unpredictable, especially in unpredictable weather.

Years ago, my dad and his buddies went ice diving in the dead of winter when everything was pretty much frozen solid. They could always find open water over by the MG&E plant near their water effluent outlet--at least in those days.

Here is a photo of him and friend in the 1960's:link.

Obviously that ice edge could support the weight of two grown men. But this was an unnatural phenomenon: flowing warm water melting an enormous shelf in thermal contact with much thicker ice. In dangerous ice conditions, the whole mass of ice has thawed, not just an edge.; 1/20/13, 7:31 PM
Ned said...: Typical lib reaction: I F'ed up! UR FAULT...you are over reacting! I tested the ice...LIAR!!! So typical; 1/20/13, 7:44 PM
Anonymous said...: Meade became a liberal?! When did that happen?; 1/20/13, 7:46 PM
Petunia said...: Up until about twenty-four hours ago it had been well above freezing in Madison for several days. Just because some of the ice APPEARS to be safe doesn't mean it IS safe, or that ice nearby is. Just because other people are farther out on the ice than you are doesn't mean that ice, or the ice where you are, is safe.; 1/20/13, 8:11 PM
chickelit said...: Inga said...
Meade became a liberal?! When did that happen?

I do recall he walked back his vote for McCain and regretted something about Obama, though it's hard to believe he would have voted for him in 2012.; 1/20/13, 8:11 PM
chickelit said...: Michael Haz just tweeted that it's supposed to be a wind of -25F near him. Hard to believe it will be warmer in Madison. If I were in Madison, I would get skates on.; 1/20/13, 8:14 PM
Anonymous said...: Yes, deep freeze. I'm making soup out of a goose carcass from Christmas dinner, it makes the best stock I've had.; 1/20/13, 8:19 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: I will continue to check the thickness and stability of ice before allowing dogs in my care to go onto to it.

Cool.....throw some balls out and have Althouse retrieve them to check the safety of the ice before you send an innocent animal out to play ball :-P I suggest a radiating pattern of 180 degrees divided into 5 to 10 degree increments.

Last winter a dog was trying to retrieve geese in the bend of the river below us. In almost every area it was thick enough to bear not only his weight but also that of one of the other hunters. Unfortunately, there was a weak spot in one area covered with snow and the dog fell through. He kept trying to simultaneously get out of the ice AND still retrieve the goose, even though we could hear his owner yelling "leave it!!!". After many attempts to reach him and several times the hunters crawling flat over the ice and falling through into the river in the ever widening weak spot, finally after about an hour, both the dog and the owner were retrieved.

It was harrowing to watch. Accidents happen. No need to court them.; 1/20/13, 9:31 PM
traditionalguy said...: I suspect Zeus is from Labrador. I would trust him to know what ice was safe.; 1/20/13, 9:34 PM
traditionalguy said...: Inga...You sound like a good cook. Stay warm.; 1/20/13, 9:42 PM
Anonymous said...: Thanks Trad Guy, well no one's complained yet :) Nothing better than homemade stock, I freeze it in quart size containers.

I have the wood stove going in the family room, it's quite wrm and cozy.; 1/20/13, 9:57 PM
Greybeard said...: Yeah, what most of the others are saying!
Another Standard Poodle story:
The old coal mine strip cut was frozen, and I was throwing his ball out on it, laughing as he skated around trying to grab it. Then he fell in.
I watched anxiously, hoping he'd climb out on his own. When he didn't/couldn't, I realized I couldn't easily get to the ice from my position, then rushed to where I could start a rescue attempt. When I could once again see the hole he had fallen into, he was no longer there. I figured I'd have to dive down, grab his carcass, and attempt CPR.
I started breaking my way toward the hole... break, move forward, break, move forward.
The extreme cold quickly EXHAUSTS you.
When I reached the hole and started to dive, I caught a glimpse of black from the opposite bank...
He was standing there looking at me, puzzled, with the tennis ball in his mouth.

Never again.; 1/20/13, 9:59 PM
Meade said...: Petunia said...
"Up until about twenty-four hours ago it had been well above freezing in Madison for several days. "

That's not quite accurate, Petunia. So far, this month, there has been one overnight temperature reaching above freezing, 34°, on January 11. Since then, overnight temps have continually dipped into the teens and even minuses. The temps since Jan. 12 have made it above freezing on 3 separate days but each night dipped back into the teens or colder.

The ice where you see Zeus walking in the video was clear and a minimum of 5" - safe enough for a snowmobile or an ATV - except for the small pool at the edge into which you see him splash.

We were having fun and staying safe and that includes Zeus. And, Penny, we were not trying to punk anyone with this video.

People get emotional about dogs and pets - I get that. I appreciate everyone's safety concerns and I regret that the video caused some viewers to become alarmed by what they saw.; 1/20/13, 10:16 PM
Dust Bunny Queen said...: Another stupid dog owner story:

We have hot springs up in our area from volcanic activity. All over the place. Despite the signs warning of the activity in the area and to beware, this guy decides to throw a ball in what looks like a placid pond, but is really an upwelling hot spring. It was summer, so no tell tale warnings of steam in the air. Throws a ball in for his dog...dog does a heroic leap to retrieve the ball......and the rest is history. Poached dog and poached human who tried to rescue his poor dog.

Sorry for both of them. BUT.....given the choice, I'm more sorry about the dog, because DOGS CAN'T READ.; 1/20/13, 10:17 PM
Petunia said...: Temperatures in Madison for the past several days:

January 16: low 10, high 34
January 17: low 13, high 34
January 18: low 11, high 42
January 19: low 37, high 41

Yeah, it got below freezing at night. It also got above freezing during the day. Is the ice safe? Who knows? Is it worth risking someone else's life to find out? IDK.

Somebody died on Lake Winnebago this weekend when his ATV went through the ice. Yeah, an ATV's heavier than a dog, but still...; 1/21/13, 12:54 AM
Meade said...: Petunia,
You've got that low for the 19th off by 21 degrees. But thanks, your point is well-taken and I will give serious thought to the question of whether or not I have the level of judgement it takes to have pets.; 1/21/13, 9:41 AM

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