The Republican debate was scheduled first. (And it's an important one, at the Reagan Library, with Rick Perry's first appearance in a debate.) Obama swiftly relocating his personal speech bubble into the media space bubble currently occupied by his GOP challengers. But following the Emily Mills rule of political bocce ball, the GOP media bubble must honor the Obama bubble and bounce out of the way (because the second-arriving bubble has the power to oust the first bubble, especially when the incoming bubble come in from the left).
But the President can't just barge into Congress whenever he wants. (Ever heard of the notion of separate co-equal branches of government?) He's got to ask, and he's got to ask John Boehner, and Boehner says no. But not because of the debate. Oh, no no no. Because the House isn't reconvening until the following day and because it's a lot of work setting up the security for a presidential visit.
I just have 2 more questions:
1. If all the other networks aired the Obama speech, do you think fewer people would watch the debate (assuming MSNBC and CNBC would stick to their plan and show the debate) or do you think more people would watch? That is, if Obama preempted the regular shows people like, they might flip over to the debate. How many of the people who want to watch the debate would pick an Obama speech instead?
2. Should Obama be criticized just for doing a Joint Session of Congress, quite aside from the debate? This proposal isn't going to amount to anything, is it? It's political grandstanding. There's something dreadful about locking all the members of Congress in place where they're supposed to sit silently — God forbid anyone yells "you lie!" or whatever — or cheer and laud the President. Frankly, I don't think it's presidential, because — in America — we have 3 branches of government, and the President's forays into the Capitol should be rare, dignified rituals of a nonpartisan nature.
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1 – 200 of 261 Newer› Newest»Good for Boehner! More cajones than I thought he had.
I think the GOP should schedule their debate a day late to better dissect Obama's speech. At this point, whatever he says is pointess. More spendings to cronies, no jobs for everyone else. It takes some people three years, but they catch on.
The GOP should be gracious. If Obama did his speech a day late, whatever the GOP gained in the debate would be pushed off by his speech.
What a dick.
Maybe there is hope for John Boehner after all.
Lucky for Obama Boehner told him to pick another date!
Imagine Perry's Republican debate walking away with all the news coverage, and them some.
At least we know Obama thinks the GOP is gonna run Perry as their show horse.
Like at a circus.
Where, once, Mark Twain (in Huckleberry Finn), added a scene where "someone from tne audience" jumps up and tries to ride the show horse. And, brings happiness to the crowd, watching the show.)
It's all been done, before.
1)I think most people will be watching something on the Food Network or HGTV. Everyone is tired of Barry's same old pitch and it's still too early for anyone to really care about the Republican debates. Although Perry's lead over the others makes it a bit more interesting.
2) It's inappropriate for Barry to try to announce his non-plan in this way. Good on Boehner for saying no.
So POTUS creates unnecessary conflicts?
Remind me again, which Alinsky Rule is that?
This little "trick" by Obama should be a huge red flag that they are afraid of Rick Perry. Very afraid.
Obama couldn't pick 9/11 because it's gonna fall on a Sunday.
While he "should'a" aimed for December 7th. Which falls on a Wednesday. And, Obama could'a gone looking for "infamy."
Yes, this was a deliberate ploy.
Obama is trying to make Boehner his bitch. He is being a thug for no reason other than to push Boehner and the Republicans around.
And why shouldn't Obama believe that he can get away with it? He did it before when Boehner bowed down again and again eager to cave in on the debt limit.
It is all about humiliation. It is all about belittling Boehner and the Republicans. It is about daring Boehner to be a man.
The best thing about Boehner suggesting that Obama have his teleprompter moment the next day is that that is the opening of NFL season.
Who is going to want to watch Obama?
Obama vs the NFL!! Just try and pre-empt the NFL opening for Obama's speech and watch the shit really hit the fan.
Super Bowl Champion Green Bay Packers and New Orleans Saints.
LOL @ Obama
It's hilarious. Obama is completely and utterly relegated to the sidelines now. Everyone knows this, even Obama.
So what does he do? He goes to what he still believes are his crazily powerful gifts of oratory. I will upstage the Republicans with a speech that will change everything. That's what he is thinking.
It must be hell to be in the Obama camp right now. You thought you were going to change the world, man. You thought you were going to be world historical figures. And you are reduced now to purposefully scheduling a speech to conflict with a fairly meaningless Republican debate, in the hope that somehow it will matter. But you know in your hearts the speech won't do one damn thing to save you.
Carol_Herman wrote: Where, once, Mark Twain (in Huckleberry Finn), added a scene where "someone from tne audience" jumps up and tries to ride the show horse. And, brings happiness to the crowd, watching the show.)
I think it was a circus performer, pretending to be drunk.
And Huck (who represents the Tea Party) saw through the act and couldn't bear to watch it.
Most people won't watch either show.
Do people still watch TV live? I thought Netflicks had taken over.
"Frankly, I don't think it's presidential,..."
It is, however, very Obamadential. That bubble is the King bubble.
Bush (either one) was presidential. This guy has just embarrassingly lowered the bar, and that's the last thing we needed.
So, serious question, if the President forces a joint session of Congress (which I don't think he has the power to do) is it MANDATORY to attend.
What if there were a joint session and half the people just didn't show up?
Could they do that? Wouldn't that be cool.
This is about as subtle as the time late in the primaries Zero was talking about Hillary with a raised middle finger against his cheek.
Too bad Boehner didn't call his bluff.
I'm willing to bet the debate would have gotten more viewers. Everybody's heard what Herbert Obama will say - Stimulus III, but people will want to see Perry and Milton go head to head.
It is a common tactic to demoralize your opponent --
Act as unreasonable as possible, obnoxiously unreasonable, pointlessly unreasonable, unconscionably unreasonable, and insist that your opponent give in and accomodate you. Make your opponent swallow his self-respect and take it.
And what about the Children!? When is he going to give his "first day of school" speech? In 2009, he did it on Sept. 8th & anyone who has been in a school on the first day can confirm that is chaos. In 2010, he did a "beginning of second week of school" speech - Sept. 14th.
Can't find anything for this year (didn't look past 1st page of search results). So, maybe this year he can do a "second day of school" speech instead. It's for the kids!
shared sacrifice, jobs, infrastructure, shared sacrifice, green energy, regulations, blah, shared sacrifice.
There you have it. We decidedly do not need a joint session of congress to hear his bullshit. He should go on The View where they would think these genius ideas will overcome his disdain for business, his contempt for most Americans and their livelihoods and his appallingly transparent electioneering.
DBQ --
Contrary to the belief in the White House, Barack Obama is not king. He is not lord and sovereign. He does not get to snap his fingers and make people, even members of Congress, listen to him.
Too bad Boehner didn't call his bluff.
I think Boehner did call his bluff.
Also, who is really demoralized here? Obama's act strikes me as nearly despair. Honestly: he's just lashing out at this point.
If the speech is moved to Thursday it conflicts w/ the Packers/Saints NFL opener. It's not that big a deal to me..but I assure you non sports fans, it's a big deal to many.
This request is not unlike Obama's scolding of the Supreme Court during the SOU.
He can wait. Why the Joint Session anyway? Is he declaring war on joblessness?
He does not get to snap his fingers and make people, even members of Congress, listen to him.
Or the Supreme Court either. I think that they should all have something better to do for the next State of the Union address. Filing their nails, rearranging the sock drawer...something.
Maybe the Prez should punt. Carol Herman will explain the punt to all you non sports fan
The Worst President...Ever. Not even worth discussing any further. The only thing left was his likability. That's done. He is, to quote Mesquito, a Dick. Classless. Pointless. Clueless. The kind of person you'd just assume slap as listen to. Me? I'll watch the debate. Or...read a book. Or...maybe walk my dog. Something productive.
What a maroon.
Since Obama had his plan after the debate was scheduled, he should do the polite thing and move his plans.
To do otherwise just makes him look petty.
I sure as hell aren't going to sit watching and listening to anything POSUS has to say.
And frankly only when he's invited. He's already demonstrated that he has bad manners--dressing down the Justices of the Supreme Court in a State of the Union address. It's as though his momma never taught him any manners. Would you ever invite a rude house guest back?
I said this earlier in the thread, but it's worth repeating:
What a dick.
So, serious question, if the President forces a joint session of Congress (which I don't think he has the power to do) is it MANDATORY to attend.
No. Michelle Bachmann certainly wont be there.
And no, Obama does not have the power to force a joint session of congress. Only the Speaker of the House can do that. I dont think any speaker has ever turned down a presidential request for a joint session, but then again, presidents dont use joint sessions of congress for purely political reasons. Until this president.
Joint sessions are for State of the Union speeches. Important speeches that all Americans should hear (i.e. Bush's speech after 9/11). Not a speech for a piece of legislation that has no chance in passing.
Just imagine the fury on the left if George W. Bush held a joint session of congress to make a speech on the Patriot Act.
Conflict? Heck The Bamster could be scheduled against "Mr. Rogers" on Saturday morning and Mr. Rogers would outdraw him.
Sorry gang, I'm in a pour it on mood this afternoon.
Seven Machos said...
Too bad Boehner didn't call his bluff.
I think Boehner did call his bluff.
I think Little Zero thought he would upstage the debate. A bluff in terms of ratings.
As I say, I think Perry and Milton would outrate Zero.
Well I am now more inclined than ever to watch that danged debate. I had forgotten there was one next week. Thanks Barack!
Another Obama screw up, actually.
According to the Speaker's office they had no prior notice of the date until the formal letter of request. Working out the date informally before a letter is sent is a long standing practice. The WH ignored this, for whatever reason.
Maybe it was entire intentional on Obamas's part to do this, but now he has created another unnecessary side show that will take attention from his proposals.
Maybe that's best for Obama after all. He's been President for two and a half years and he still needs most of the summer to create jobs proposals?
What a dope.
"A bluff in terms of ratings."
This POV is the only one that doesn't reveal con concern that the POTUS is more popular than the R can.s.
Double booking the date isn't at all stepping on the Rs if you truly believe that most folks will turn of the POTUS, as they decide to watch the POTUS potentials or do whatever.
Y'all talk a good game. But, then you whine about the mean POTUS pissing on your delicate wanabes.
I say, let the viewers vote w/ the remote!
Isn't September 8th the "kickoff" for the NFL?
Exactly how does the "schlemiel" get out of this one?
Does he do a funny walk?
Funny walks always helps this shtick.
"The only thing left was his likability. That's done."
I've never found him (or, his persona) likeable at all. Of course, I also never understood why people think/thought that he's a great orator.
I can see how he'd get really upset about this "slight". After all, the only two things he seems to actually enjoy are being on television and being on vacation.
Maybe it was intentional?
Carney was snickering with derision and laughter in talking about it. There was no attitude of "oops, we didn't realize there was a conflict." Of course it was intentional.
Pure political melodrama on the jug eared fuck's part. Nice to see Boehner tell him to piss of. It's not Obama's Congress.
Not yet, at least. I imagine he'd like a nice little rubber stamp legislature like Cuba and Venezuela.
Separate but co-equal branches of government . . . . ?
Isn't that racist or something?
A dick, but a small dick.
He's becomming Donovan McNabb. Everyone wanted him to do well and then, when he didn't, no one really wanted him at all.
He's such a punk. Even other punks can't stand his shit.
Looking forward to a Castro-nian 8 hour speech with lots of hand waving...
Obama needs a sitcom and a catchphrase.
Since Althouse conjoined "personal space bubble" with a "presidential candidate debate" (and she did so before link), it might fitting to link a photo of Emily Mills approved Prosser/Bradley communication: link.
They should just ignore Obama's request.
Ugh, I actually feel embarrassment for the president. This is so lame!
If he is really this cheap and petty, then what other fun surprises are in store for us?
Obama did the same thing with a speech Cheney gave a year or so ago. He is a petulant twerp who can't stand to lose the spotlight. There is no reason to call a joint session for a political speech. It's an abuse of Congressional courtesy to the office of President and will have repercussions. I doubt very much if the House will be full for this or the SOTU next year.
Of course, maybe he called it to announce he is resigning, like in the movie Dave.
If he is really this cheap and petty, then what other fun surprises are in store for us?
You are just now realizing this?
Joanna said...
"Obama needs a sitcom and a catchphrase."
I think he already has a catchphrase, "Let me be clear", but it isn't terribly funny.
Joanna said...
"Obama needs a sitcom and a catchphrase."
Mosquito gets the royalties for the idea: What a dick.
I'd feel sheepish if I were Bam for doing such a fishy thing. It seems like the kind of thing a pig would do. Or a wolf. Or a snake. Or a worm. Or someone who is bats. I don't know why everybody talks about him as if he were a dog. There are so many other animals.
I suspect his "speech" will be vile.
Straw men galore.
Paint the GOP as destroyers of America.
I wouldn't worry about a "you lie!" moment..
If I were Bammy, I'd worry at what point the republicans can't take it anymore, and get up and walk out.
Flipping him off would be a fitting touch.
He loves berating people right in front of him. I don't think anyone's in the mood anymore.
Professor...You didn't get Obama's message. HE is our ruler.
He wishes he could rule like the ChiComs rule so he could do what he wants to. The crazy House is killing him.
Pelosi agreed that it is having to vote on everything that is ruining the Government of Obama I.
So Obama just appoints czars and issues Envronmental Regs and clamps down without Congressional authorization.
Just wait until the next "unexpected" crisis when Obama I will strike again.
He just messin with ya.
pbAndjFellowRepublican said...
"A bluff in terms of ratings."
This POV is the only one that doesn't reveal con concern that the POTUS is more popular than the R
Yet another candidate for America's Politico.
I think Bender is right. Just Chicago thuggery.
I was at the K-street shindig at the Oval Room. The word was that WH was playing with the GOP about the joint session/debate conflict. They just wanted to rattle the GOP. In that they succeeded spectacularly. The point is to create a tension among other candidates and let Perry win. The WH wants Perry to win, so that they can paint him as: The Ultimate Red-Neck That Ever Lived.
The other thing is that WH is totally ready for the speech (yesterday). They are just creating an impression of not being prepared. The speech will be a home-run and the Speaker, Majority Leader, and all candidates will have raw-egg on their faces.
The GOP is so clueless that it does not know what is about to hit them after Labor Day, the official start of the world's best re-election campaign. The word on K-street is that Putin is asking WH to suggest consultants for his upcoming campaign.
GOP: You are toast, you know it. The question is do you want it burnt (blackened).
The headline over at Huffpo is a screamer.
hehe-
America's Politico is so awesome.
"rare, dignified rituals of a nonpartisan nature."
Or at least productive and transformational. Is there any possibility the President will say something he hasn't said before?
Or at the very, very least not scolding, which is what I very much expect his speech to be about, the ol' poor is me who tries to do all the right things but the evil Congress keeps getting in the way.
And, honestly, I don't think very many people would watch either, so I doubt there's too much spotlight grabbing going on.
Obama is a narcissist who was at the height of life during his own campaign, and I think might come alive again if he had his own primary challenger. He doesn't exist in his own self, he needs a foil to help define him, so he's basically drifting without meaning or purpose these days.
Someone should tell Obama to stop campaigning long enough to govern. He has been at it since he took the oath.
Agree with so many that the President is a small man.
He's in a bit of a bind and is making poor decisions under pressure.
You'll notice that there is little discussion recently about the debt/deficit problem that dominated the news during the debt ceiling fiasco.
That's the reason for the delay in Obama's jobs plan speech. His only option is to propose more stimulus spending in some form. To have done so immediately following the ceiling debate would have been impossible. Thus the delay until after the vacation to allow debt/deficit to fade in the general public's perception.
The scheduling conflict is a drowning man reaching for straws.
I'm sure Americans want to hear another GOP debate about uteruses and returning to the gold standard over job plans.
...and I think might come alive again if he had his own primary challenger.
Maybe Axelrod can arrange a patsy primary challenger for a fixed fight. Somebody who will agree to campaign hard but will also agree to lose. The challenger could get exposure for 2016 or become wealthy.
garage mahal said...
I'm sure Americans want to hear another GOP debate about uteruses...
I won't be following the Sullivan coverage.
Garage -- if that's what the debate will be and it's so dumb why upstage it?
You don't have to thank me for serving you. The pleasure is mine.
Hooray for Boehner!
Presidential politics aside, what is preventing the coalescence of a veto-proof majority in both Houses?
Chicago politics, obviously. But Zero made another mistake: This ain't Chicago. He's gonna lose this one. Watch and see.
I think the correct term is uterii.
Chicken -- great question. I say it's ideologues on both sides. Moderation means disappointment. For them.
garage mahal said... I'm sure Americans want to hear another GOP debate about uteruses ...
We're pro-abortion in certain cases, garage. You, for example.
Garage -- if that's what the debate will be and it's so dumb why upstage it?
Because he can. Like Scott Walker, HE WON! He can do whatever the fuck he wants, whenever the fuck he wants. Suck it losers!
Question 1 Answer-I think more people would be apt to watch the debate because they have now heard about it.
Question 2 Answer-Yes, criticized ruthlessly and continuously for trying to pander politically with an occasion saved for constitutional requirements and special occasions. If he really had a plan he could have told us in Iowa when he claimed he had specifics. Holding off and trying to do it against the Republican debate shows his veneer is wearing thin even on his fan base.
Seven Machos said... I say it's ideologues on both sides. Moderation means disappointment. For them.
Brilliant insight, Seven. Now tell us how you would moderate between speaking on Wednesday and speaking on Thursday.
Browndog:
I wants me one of those major jobs Obama is gonna speechify about [I just looked at Huffpo headline].
But Garage he can't. There will be no Obama speaking to Congress. Certainly Obama is free to speak when Republicans have already scheduled debates. But it looks petty not presidential.
I add that your prose is obviously filled with angry despair. This is because you know you are losing. Huge.
Why is he waiting until next week with presenting his new plan, if in fact it is an actual plan? Why not start it now?
Rhetorical question, garage.
I'm starting to feel kind of sorry for Obama, in a fatherly way.
Were I his dad, I'd suggest that maybe he should join the Navy about now.
wv: ruchro. Scooby sneeze
"What a dick."
"It is a common tactic to demoralize your opponent --
Act as unreasonable as possible, obnoxiously unreasonable, pointlessly unreasonable, unconscionably unreasonable, and insist that your opponent give in and accomodate you. Make your opponent swallow his self-respect and take it."
Those two comments coincide as descriptors of a street/prison domination scenario. Muddy cone presidency. Apparently the number of target-rich environments is to be re-designated to a high and wide number in coming months. A people's desecration by ravishment relished by her so-called chief executive.
"I think Boehner did call his bluff."
Not yet, because the question still hangs who gets their way, or so it seems.
Were I a captain of affairs, I would order retaking the Democratic Party by its civilized and patriotic core and diaspora. I would counsel leaving off the Republican Party, even more so a third party, and bearding the lion in its den, taking back the Democratic Party from its fiendish "cultured despisers," who usurped the Party by force in August 1968.
This would be a doable but dangerous undertaking. Powerful local, state and federal agencies and bureaucrats along with public and private economic combinations support the fiends. And I do not mean DOD. Yet, restoring the Democratic Party should be done and could be done. To selfless service, anything is possible.
I don't believe Obama did this on purpose. Honestly, him and everyone in his administration are just too clueless to plan something like this.
And what does it accomplish anyway? It reeks of desperation.
Peano -- I'm talking about policy. Congress doesn't need a 2/3 majority to invite or not invite Obama to speak.
Ex:
Maybe Obama is not done copying the "jobs plan" pages from his Stimulus Package of 2009.
I add that your prose is obviously filled with angry despair.
Dude, I was laughing typing that. I thought you guys appreciated authoritarian strength? Maybe Obama needs to call out the National Guard, or go have Boehner and the House GOP arrested and frog marched into Congress to get some respect from conservatives.
Jason:
I wondered also if this was just due to plain old incompetence.
Why is this even a debate about this? How is a presidential debate more important than the President having a joint session with Congress?
You talk about grandstanding. What the hell do you think the GOP debate is?
Why not put the two side by side and everyone can be happy? It can be good political theatre and maybe people will tune in. Although, yeah, at the end of the day it's just a bunch of yammering and nothing really getting done.
Yet another candidate for America's Politico.
In the future, everyone will be America's Politico for 15 minutes.
David R. Graham said...
"I think Boehner did call his bluff."
Not yet, because the question still hangs who gets their way, or so it seems.
---
David, what planet are you on? Didn't you receive the memo about the three branches of government?
The chief executive cannot commandeer time and space in the House of Representatives. It takes more than "I am going to speak before a joint session of Congress." The Speaker of the House has to approve that plan.
And on that question, if the Speaker wants his way, the Speaker gets his way.
I think that your number 2 has some merit because, conceivably, the Congress could summon the President to appear. If it did so, most would understand this was rude.
And poor Matt manages to utterly contradict himself with no self awareness whatsoever.
I hope Obama kicks there ass on this one. He wants to talk about jobs and the economy and all the GOP wants to do is have a far right wing debate among themselves to try and prove to their rather small number of voters which one is further to the right.
Matt said... Why is this even a debate about this? How is a presidential debate more important than the President having a joint session with Congress?
--
Because that isn't the question at issue. The president is head of the executive branch. He doesn't have the authority to convene a joint session of Congress -- or any other session of Congress.
If Little Zero insists on speaking Wednesday, he can speak from the White House. If he wants to speak before a joint session of Congress, he needs Boehner's consent.
go have Boehner and the House GOP arrested and frog marched into Congress to get some respect from conservatives.
No, we are at the point that Obama could never get respect from conservatives. The question now is whether he can get any respect from independents. He still has a few butt boys but that's about it.
Matt said... I hope Obama kicks there ass on this one.
Their you go! Written like a real Obama fan.
Matt:
Good idea. Let's televise each at the same time and let viewers choose if they want to watch the train wreck of a presidency or watch the people vying for the job of rebuilding after the train wreck.
This could be a first though when most people actually turn their eyes away from the train wreck.
He's been making stupid mistakes since day one, and people keep looking for the hidden sly tactical angle that he must surely be following, but there never is one. It's just incompetence. If this guy was a Republican he'd be every comedian's entire act. Saturday Night Live would have an entire season dedicated to his stumbling.
Stop looking for the smart Obama. If he was smart he'd be a conservative. Instead of just following a Neocon playbook and screwing everything else up.
Three garage "drive by's". Awesome.
That's what happens when all you believe is swirling in the bowl. Sadly soon America, like Wisconsin, will flush.
I like Ann's space bubble bocce ball analogy. It makes me laugh heartily.
HAHAHAHAHA. ← See?
I'm sure Americans want to hear another GOP debate about uteruses and returning to the gold standard over job plans.
Considering how the previous job plans turned out, surely a true statement.
"How is a presidential debate more important than the President having a joint session with Congress?"
Dude, Because it's Obama. Nothing more to say. We already heard everything he's got. In fact, we heard it 2 years ago. It doesn't work, and he has no ability to think of anything new. He's in over his head.
Someone in the debate may have some workable plans, but we all (including you) know Obama has got nothing. Even you care more about what the next President has to say than what the the current will say again. C'mon, you know you do.
"And on that question, if the Speaker wants his way, the Speaker gets his way."
Look at the Speaker's note to the WH on this and observe its tone. Then think of the force of D.C. tradition and the myriad off-screen negotiations that go on, and the partial-caving of the Speaker on the "debt ceiling" show down. The matter is not settled and I am not ignorant of the Constitution, well, not on large matters, anyhow.
And quit impugning my intelligence. Think things through before you spout. This thing is not done. And if a joint session is, finally, denied, an oval office speech cannot be.
And what in the name of all that's gracious are Republicans doing with an MSNBC feed of their Reagan debate? Have they learned nothing from Sarah Palin? Asking the enemy to supply your logistics is colossal stupidity! I am a registered Republican, have been since the 70s.
He wants to talk about jobs and the economy...
I do get a laugh out of this. It's been two entire days since Obama named his new chief economic advisor and he already can't wait to tell us all about his huge, innovative, probably breathtakingly brilliant new plan.
He's quick, that prez we got. No wonder he's got so much time for golf.
"I'm sure Americans want to hear another GOP debate about uteruses and returning to the gold standard over job plans."
The sad thing is that even if that was what it was about, it would be more important and certainly more entertaining.
It's the douchebag strategy.
Obama's lame duck two months after the election are going to be even more amazing.
Eh. Here's my pointless suggestion: Delay the debate until the President finishes speaking, then turn it into the mother of all Republican responses. (Also, be sure to make the speech available to the debate audience - there's sure to be a lot of crowd reaction that will end up on YouTube.)
When life deals you lemons, make lemonade. (The only problem with that philosophy is that I hate lemonade.)
WV: adinses.
I'm watching the Packers that night.
I hope Obama kicks there ass on this one.
Matt -- Aren't you the guy who tries to come here and pose all reasonable and intellectual? Might want to brush up on some things before the next time.
Also, how is Obama going to kick anything? With what power?
Or is it maybe: kick there, ass? And if so, why are you calling President Obama names? I thought you liked him. If Obama's lost Matt, he's lost America.
(The Uncredentialed, Crypto Jew)
Because he can. Like Scott Walker, HE WON! He can do whatever the fuck he wants, whenever the fuck he wants. Suck it losers
OMG, Garage are you really this unhinged? Boehner won, too! No one can do whatever the f*ck they want, in Republic...Geez, are you really this ignorant of Civics? The POTUS does not “run” the House, the Speaker does.
Considering how the previous job plans turned out, surely a true statement.
Government can't create jobs. Except yours!
I do not think it was intended for Boehner to accept.
The White House also say that they called Boehner's office prior to sending their letter, and the Speaker's office had no objection to the timing. However, Boehner's office say they got the phonecall 15 minutes before the letter arrived.
CBS News did some serious swerving around this this evening.
Krauthammer thinks Boehner should have accepted, but scheduled the President's speech 2 hours before the debate, which would have both deflected the White House charge of non-cooperation and would have given the debaters something to debate.
Does anyone (including liberals who presumably are not hostile to Obama) think that he's got some brilliant new plan to create jobs?
To think that he does, is pretty much to believe that no one else thought of it yet, whatever it is. Is there some important scheme for job creation that is not already part of public conversation?
So why the dramatic unveiling?
What I figure is that Obama has a few things that he can legitimately do that he'll announce, and a few other very expensive things that won't work but that he can blame Congress for failing to fund but in the mean-time can use to show he's really, really, really, serious about the most important thing EVAR which is jobs and recovery.
A big part of proving that he's really, really, really, serious about the most important thing EVAR, is to give his speech in the most important venue EVAR.
If he constructs some greek pillars and hangs some bunting people might forget to ask why it took him three years to finally getting around to making a production out of him being really, really, really serious about the most important thing EVAR.
No, the republican debate isn't likely to be much more interesting or more likely to contain new "content". This is true.
Both events, being "live", have the remote chance of something anomalous, unexpected and therefore interesting happen.
Such as someone shouting "you lie" which everyone knows won't happen again on account of it being so outrageous. But something unexpected might happen at the debate, a slip of the tongue or gaff. Plus it's unscripted.
"What the hell do you think the GOP debate is?"
What democracy looks like.
Government can't create jobs. Except yours!
The government's record on jobs is not what it was in 1983, that's for sure.
I really don't see the win in this for Obama from a strategic standpoint. Clearly, you have to think he's aiming for some result that doesn't seem petty. Yet it seems to me that pettiness is at the end of every outcome.
Maybe Obama just isn't very good at the politics of politics.
Our President has just agreed to deliver his passive-aggresive harangue on September 8.
He's still a dick.
So, Matt, dude: assuming what Mesquito says is true: did Obama kick there ass?
Is this speech going to change the world? How low will the sea levels go? Will there be loaves and fishes?
PETER V. BELLA said...
Someone should tell Obama to stop campaigning long enough to govern. He has been at it since he took the oath.
8/31/11 7:11 PM
For God's sake man don't put ideas in his head. No good can come from that.
Synova said: No, the republican debate isn't likely to be much more interesting or more likely to contain new "content". This is true.
Lots of people have never seen Rick Perry debate in real time. That will be new.
David R. Graham said...Look at the Speaker's note to the WH on this and observe its tone.
--
Oh, you pathetic child. Look at the Speaker's office and observe the power he holds. The "tone" is for public consumption. Out of public view, Washington operates according to power.
Were you president of Student Government Club in high school? You sound like it.
Oh, it's true.
Theirs gonna be an ass-kicking, alright.
washingtonpostThe Washington Post
Obama agrees to move date of address on jobs and economy to joint session of Congress to Sept. 8 rather than Sept. 7. http://wapo.st/n2CylS
It's all over but the voting out of office.
I can't believe people think Obama is a good politician. The guy is a total fool.
Matt?
And Obama bows to yet another political leader.
So there's something he's good at.
No one is going to watch BHO except Rachel and Chris.
wv saudi
Think he'll mention that Canadian shale oil and our own special USA shale oil will help us be less beholden to the Saudis and that is a goooood thing and a short term solution until other super energy solutions get perfected -- and even discovered?
Besides which it will turn our economy around if he polls the plug on his regulators?
Right. Not a chance.
No doubt our petulant President will insist on calling the speech he makes on September 8 "The Seventh Of September Speech."
As an aside, if Obama was serious about this, he would have held his speech at the White House, anyway. Not sure why ye gave in. What was the point of any of this?
What it suggests to me is that Obama and his people are living inside a tight cocoon, not really aware of how bad things are for them.
John Boehner's the Man.
Hu Jintao wants to start lending money directly to Boehner.
Given Obama's quick cave on the issue, and the extremely negative optics, I could be charitable and call it an unforced error rather than some attempt at creating political advantage.
At best it makes Obama and his team look like amateurs. At worst, amateurs in addition to being immature assholes. Take your pick.
Because he can. Like Scott Walker, HE WON! He can do whatever the fuck he wants, whenever the fuck he wants. Suck it losers!
Garage sounds like a Bitter Klinger.
The typo is intentional.
Do you think it's possible that nobody in the Obama camp was aware that there was a Republican debate the night he asked to speak? That this was more or less a totally unforced error?
I find that hard to believe from someone who Evan Thomas called "sort of a god." But I suppose it could be that simple.
If so, it suggests not so much desperation as just detachment, and not caring. Which makes some sense. That's what you do when you give up but still have to keep playing because the game isn't over.
Well played, John Boehner.
The POTUS Obama has "WON" this around. The GOP is beginning to be desperate. The first Congress that denies the POTUS to speak. The GOP is becoming a parody of itself.
The election is in the bag for Obama-Biden, the best and the greatest ticket ever.
The GOP will need to take extra-extra aspirins as their headaches will increase 100-fold starting day after Labor Day.
Do you think it's possible that nobody in the Obama camp was aware that there was a Republican debate the night he asked to speak? That this was more or less a totally unforced error?
Simply? No.
This is not coincidence that Obama tried to do this on the first night Rick Perry is introduced to America in a debate type of setting.
Obama caved, the speech will be Thursday!
But Jason, why the quick cave? That makes no sense.
Further, why not just speak from the White House -- or anywhere in the world except Congress?
The POTUS Obama has "WON" this around. The GOP is beginning to be desperate. The first Congress that denies the POTUS to speak. The GOP is becoming a parody of itself.
They didnt "deny" the POTUS to speak. They just asked him to switch days.
Obama can go in front of a TV camera in any setting and deliver this speech. He doesnt need to do it in front of a joint session of congress. If this jobs bill is so important to him, he would have introduced it already.
Obama tried to play politics, and Boehner told him to fuck off, as Obama is NOT in charge of setting Congress' schedule.
Do you think he still believes that bullshit people write about his oratorical powers?
What was the point of any of this?
Apparently the guy's just as delusional as ever about his own magnificence, and just assumed Boehner would cave, and Obama would have demonstrated that he's powerful and the Republicans are not.
Add it to a long list of misestimations of his own importance. Remember the Olympic fiasco? The climate-change-deal fiasco? People wondered then how he could have been so stupid as to fly to those meetings without a deal in hand.
He's learned nothing.
Obama doesn't have a choice, now.
He's going to give the speech.
Doesn't have to be in Congress. He's got his own home court.
Dueling boring programs.
And, it's possible? The GOP contendahs will tune in to watch the president ... and then they'll let fly with their own solutions.
This was a fight that didn't have to get picked. But that's Obama!
I wonder who set the trap?
It's quite possible that this was just another Obama fuckup:
WASHINGTON (AP) — President Barack Obama has acceded to House Speaker John Boehner's wishes to deliver an address on jobs and the economy to a joint session of Congress on Sept. 8. The president had requested Sept. 7 for the long-anticipated speech.
In agreeing to Boehner's schedule, Obama's address will compete with the opening game of the National Football League season — a conflict the White House wanted to avoid.
But the change now will allow a planned Sept. 7 Republican presidential debate to proceed without Obama upstaging it.
Thursday, September 8th is out of the question!
The NFL is gonna have a "snap off game." With Green Bay and the Saints.
Vince Lombardi planned this! KARMA is a bitch.
Hey! Look who just emailed me!
"mesquito-
Today I asked for a joint session of Congress where I will lay out a clear plan to get Americans back to work. Next week, I will deliver the details of the plan and call on lawmakers to pass it.
Whether they will do the job they were elected to do is ultimately up to them.
But both you and I can pressure them to do the right thing. We can send the message that the American people are playing by the rules and meeting their responsibilities -- and it's time for our leaders in Congress to meet theirs.
And we must hold them accountable if they don't.
So I'm asking you to stand with me in calling on Congress to step up and take action on jobs:
http://my.barackobama.com/Time-To-Act
No matter how things go in the weeks and months ahead, this will be an important challenge for our organization.
It's been a long time since Congress was focused on what the American people need them to be focused on.
I know that you're frustrated by that. I am, too.
That's why I'm putting forward a set of bipartisan proposals to help grow the economy and create jobs -- that means strengthening our small businesses, giving needed breaks to middle-class families, while taking responsible steps to bring down our deficit.
I'm asking lawmakers to look past short-term politics and take action on that plan. But we've got to do this together.
I will deliver this message to Congress next week, but I'm asking you to stand alongside me today:
http://my.barackobama.com/Time-To-Act
More to come,
Barack
See, I follow politics much more closely than the average person and I had no idea about the Republican debate coming up. Now, Obama's churlishness has made me aware of it and interested in watching it. So, basically, I think that's pretty stupid of him.
No upside for Obama to this whatsoever.
He's going to speak from Congress for a reason.
All failure will be the fault of Republicans in Congress.
Remember, Rule 1 in modern American politics is always to blame the other side. Never take responsibility yourself, because IT'S NOT YOUR FAULT.
Jason - America's Politico is sarcasm. Up your game.
It's possible (but very unlikely) the timing wasn't deliberate - as a general rule, narcissists expect everyone else to adjust to what they want.
The House would've been entirely justified to say "No" period. It's going to be another campaign speech with no specifics - think "Paul Ryan speech."
“Certainly Obama is free to speak when Republicans have already scheduled debates. But it looks petty not presidential.”
Yes, that's it exactly. No one should question his privilege to speak when he wants. But treading on the Rpubs debate looks adolescent.
Who-in-the-world is advising him?
He's going to run for reelection against Congress.
Never mind that his party controlled the White House and the Congress for two years.
It's the fault of the Republicans in Congress.
That's why I'm putting forward a set of bipartisan proposals...
Just wondering, how is it that Barack's yet-to-be-revealed master plan qualifies as "bipartisan"?
He's going to run for reelection against Congress.
Well, that's the smart thing to do, isn't it? So let's give some credit there, if that's true.
Just imagine how angry and pissy Obama must be right now.
:-)
It warms the cockles of my heart.
Well, that's the smart thing to do, isn't it?
I thought he was hoping to run against Bush again. If he's given up on that, he must have finally accepted that the economy's still going to be in the shitter next fall.
The jive turkey blinked. Maybe Al Sharpton spoke to him.
I thought it was assumed that America's Politico is Titus's Indian husband. Funny how the occasional commenter comes along and takes him seriously.
I again say...
Is our President on Cocaine???
Is he snort'en again?
I mean this is just WEIRD!
Is that serious, Mesquito? Or is it really subtle satire?
If it's serious, he's already blaming Congress for not funding his breakthrough plans to take care of the most important issue evah. Did I not call it? Did I not?
Synova:
I think the sly Mesquito is on Barackobama.com's email list so I bet it is real.
“I've never found him (or, his persona) likeable at all. Of course, I also never understood why people think/thought that he's a great orator.”
...or that he's all that smart, now that we're finally being honest with each other.
And just now tuning in the news a half-step behind the rest of you, he's made himself appear clownish.
Again, who-in-the-world is advising him?
I had a platoon sergeant that, when he wasn’t sure what he should do, he held a formation. We would quickly assemble wanting to know what new orders or information he had. As soon as all persons were accounted for the platoon sergeant would begin to speak in a manner classified as either rambling or droning. After about 10-20 minutes he would draw the lecture to a close and we would return to our ‘hurry up and wait’ status, probably less intelligent than we were before the formation.
I wonder if he is working in Washington now.
Obama still thinks that talking about all the things he wants to do is the equivalent of doing all the things he wants to do. (I leave aside the wisdom of the actions.)
This seems to be his modus operandi. Suggest the next great idea he has. If it doesn't work, if we are stuck in malaise, just talk some more.
Speeches at this point for Obama do more harm than good. It's gotten to be a bit of a joke at this point. More importantly, either the laws he wants have the votes or they don't. That's the doing part, and it's been obvious from Day One that Obama sucks at the doing.
Who-in-the-world is advising him?
Does it matter? He clearly isn't listening to anyone.
And yes -- he is going to campaign against Congress.
Only we just elected who we want to do our business. And the Senate is probably next. Sir.
wv misti
We are definitely not.
That ... boy ... is just another affirmative action pipsqueak who's been far out of his depth at least since his Columbia days.
He'll continue to huff and puff and bully and bullshit because it's all he's ever known and it's all he's got.
Rather sad, actually, to see someone so lost that all he can do is go out and play as often as possible.
Tremendously interesting nevertheless because he's a fantastic illustration of Peter Principle E^5. Too bad he's messing up the entire country in the process.
How about this, Boehner agrees to the Joint Session, on condition that he, as the head of the House and the top Republican in the Federal Government, gets to speak to the Congress and the President first. Boehner doesn't pre-release his speech (like the President) and just pre-empts Obama's plans and rips the policies of the past two years to shreds while proposing an alternative vision for the country.
I don't think Obama would be able to control himself.
Well, he just realize how stupid politically it is for him to go first. If he had his original way, the Republican debate will be nothing but piñata bashing of his 'job plan'. So, he's 'yielding'.
Peano said... Chicago politics, obviously. But Zero made another mistake: This ain't Chicago. He's gonna lose this one. Watch and see.
Told you so.
Seven Machos said... But Jason, why the quick cave? That makes no sense.
Oh, please. Boehner and Reid talked. Boehner said, essentially, "When hell freezes over." And that was that. Dingy Harry relayed that to Zero, who promptly caved.
Let me see if I actually understand this one?
Obama, to Congress, is going to ask for an obscene amount of money.
To "start" jobs "going again."
So, the first thing he does ... is piss off Boehner?
As if people were gonna watch the TV debates up at the Reagan Library?
HA!
I've actually never heard of anything out of DC quite this funny.
Did someone have to run into Obama's office, first, with this idea?
Did it come with a Power Point presentation?
Is this a "smack on the head" to replace "choke hold?"
Perry, who must have thought he was in the barn ... clearing out piles of manure ... must have found da' pony!
I love the way Picard says schedule.
Peano -- you are merely alleging facts. I'm not interested. What I want to know is why Obama caved. You have to assume a strategy on Obama's part.
Seven Machos said... You have to assume a strategy on Obama's part.
There was a strategy. It blew up in his face, just like many of his other strategies.
If you harbor any doubt, just wait till November 2012. All doubt will be erased.
So the strategy was we will ask and if Boehner says no we look like idiots?
You do yourself no favors by assuming that your opponent is stupid.
You do yourself no favors by assuming that your opponent is stupid.
I'm a firm believer in this dictum when it comes to planning. However, when it comes to looking back on what's happened, sometimes there's no other plausible explanation.
As I said upthread, this reminds me a lot of the time he flew to Copenhagen for that climate conference, failed miserably, and hopped right back onto AF1 to return home. No apparent master strategy there, and none here.
I have said also up thread that it could have been a dumb, unforced error. And I agree that it is of a piece with mistakes Obama has made in the past.
I just find it hard to believe that Team Obama could have been this dumb. Surely, they thought a few steps ahead.
If not, then perhaps they just weren't aware that there was a Republican debate. But that seems silly, too.
And so Obama's master strategy works again!
He really wanted to give his talk on Thursday, so he said Wednesday to force Boehner to say Thursday.
And why Thursday? To screw with the NFL and more importantly with THE PACKERS.
That sore loser still has gotten over the NFC Championship game.
Eat it, Bambi.
But that seems silly, too.
Agreed. It just makes it that much more fun.
Surest sign that there's no way to explain this error away? No libs left in this thread.
Timing is bad past the NFL Opener, the Republican early debate as the new flavor ice cream, Perry...is the rage.
If Obama does a partisan we did everything right we just need more regulators, more lawyers to DC to order things, money tossed out to government workers...the Mandate stays..and everything is Bush's Fault, still...
He needs some real big bones tossed out like a 1-time tax break to allow the 17 trillion parked offshore by the "Jobs Creators" - to be put back into the USA. A currency adjustment tariff on the Chicommies. No COLAs for welfare mommas and a complete reapplication process of SSI.
Otherwise -- He goes to do the 9/11 10th anniversary resumption of the Heroes, the mournathon, the singing cops and Yankees and Rudy & Bernie recycled...Looking like a partisan tool.
It is funny that they absconded, particularly Matt. What happened to you, Matt? You peace-loving ass kicker, you.
Who wants to listen to what Professor Oboring has to say? No one.
The only point of interest in Oboring's speech will be how many teleprompters he'll need.
Let me be clear!
I, for one, think this Obama speech will be the most important Obama speech since the last Obama speech.
Thank god for Obama speeches. Otherwise, I would never have found the time for those 4 seasons of Friday Light Nights on Netflix this summer.
Obama is impressive in his own unique way. He can fuck up anything, even scheduling a speech.
The only things he has not fucked up are the last three elections in which he was a candidate. Win, win and win. So don't get complacent.
This is outrageous.
Thank GOD the weather is decent, otherwise I don't know what I would be do, but likely be much more outraged.
All my outrage is hard to contain because of all the outrageous things taking place. Fortunately, blogs, give me the outlet to be really fucking outraged.
Tits and Clouds.
This is the 2nd time this clown has called for a joint session to give a speech outside of the SOTU. The first, of course, brought about the "You Lie!" moment.
This man has no shame. He will go down in history as the most narcissistic man to ever occupy the office. And that's saying something.
Easy call. Boehner made it. Good for him.
I don't know what the President is thinking here. The move is too un-Presidential. What's the endgame?
Someone should tell Obama to stop campaigning long enough to govern. He has been at it since he took the oath.
Which time?
PS - dinja just kinda know this administration was going to go this way after that whole debacle, for both of them, up on the inauguration stage?
"The only things he has not fucked up are the last three elections in which he was a candidate. Win, win and win. So don't get complacent."
In 1997, he was hand-selected by a communist, Alice Palmer, who he then went on to knock out of politics. In '04 he got a couple candidates thrown out in order to win. In '08, he ran against someone who could barely bring himself to show up. Can he be that lucky all over again?
I'm beginning to think that garage = America's Politico.
"So the strategy was we will ask and if Boehner says no we look like idiots?
You do yourself no favors by assuming that your opponent is stupid."
I do not think Obama is stupid. I think he's incredibly arrogant. Have you ever worked for a narcissist? I am betting there's not one person left in the WH, save Michelle, who will talk back to ole Barry. Everyone is a yes man at this point. He said - "let me be clear, that's the night I want it" and that was the decision.
Not dumb but arrogant and irrational.
Plug the damn hole!!!!111!!11
Oops, a year and change late.
My bad.
Well crap, Obama's speech will prempt Big Brother.
PBJ -- Do you have any serious take on this? I mean, what strategy, if any, was being invoked here?
The essential question to ask in assessing his probability of re-election is: What quality would he have to pull out of his hat in order to convince voters of (the existence of) his leadership? The answer to which is: No such thing exists.
If he had that ability he wouldn't have kept is strategically hidden while his popular support crashed. There is no there there when it comes to leadership with Obama. It was evident in the forging of the healthcare reform legislation, when he refused to stake out a position. Same with the debt limit fandango. What does he (or his advisors, if you like) think this looks like from the cheap seats?
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